"Justice League" Movie Talkback (Spoilers)

Discussion in 'DC Live-Action Movies and Television' started by James Harvey, Nov 16, 2017.

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Justice League - Rate and Discuss the Live-Action Movie!

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  1. James Harvey

    James Harvey The World's Finest
    Staff Member Administrator Moderator Reporter

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    You can't save the world alone.

    [​IMG]

    Justice League
    Release Date: November 17, 2017, with November 16 advanced screenings
    Home Entertainment Release: February 13, 2018; March 13, 2018
    Studio: Warner Bros. Pictures
    Director: Zack Snyder
    Screenwriters: Chris Terrio, Joss Whedon

    Starring: Ben Affleck, Henry Cavill, Amy Adams, Gal Gadot, Jason Momoa, Ezra Miller, Ray Fisher, Willem Dafoe, Jesse Eisenberg, Jeremy Irons, Diane Lane, Connie Nielsen, J.K. Simmons, Ciaran Hinds, Amber Heard, Kiersey Clemons

    Synopsis: Fueled by his restored faith in humanity and inspired by Superman’s selfless act, Bruce Wayne enlists the help of his newfound ally, Diana Prince, to face an even greater enemy. Together, Batman and Wonder Woman work quickly to find and recruit a team of metahumans to stand against this newly awakened threat. But despite the formation of this unprecedented league of heroes - Batman, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, Cyborg and The Flash - it may already be too late to save the planet from an assault of catastrophic proportions.

    Discuss the big-screen live-action debut of Justice League! Let us know your thoughts right here!

    Related Discussions:

    Wonder Woman Feature Talkback (Spoilers)
    Suicide Squad Feature Talkback (Spoilers)
    Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice Feature Talkback (Spoilers)
    Man Of Steel Feature Talkback (Spoilers)
    Justice League Pre-Release Discussion (Spoilers)

    Justice League "The New 52" Talkback (Spoilers)
    Justice League "Rebirth" Talkback (Spoilers)
    Justice League: War Animated Feature Talkback (Spoilers)
    Justice League Action Season One Talkback (Spoilers)
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    Injustice 2 Video Game Talkback (Spoilers)
     
    #1 James Harvey, Nov 16, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 18, 2018
  2. -batmat-

    -batmat- Active Member

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    Liked it a lot. Definitely DC fans will enjoy it. Much better than Batman v Superman and Wonder Woman.
     
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  3. ObserveCreative11

    ObserveCreative11 New Member

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    Here's my review of the film (through the eyes of the Joker, really):



    I saw JL this Tuesday at a special screening. It was: tiresome, boring and absolutely exhausting. It was unbearable... I couldn't believe that they made a mockery out of these iconic characters (totally misunderstanding certain things that made them work in comics, stupid quips, generic CGI big bad with long speeches, I mean, sure, BvS was bad, but this was just plain dull, you just wanted to get it over with).

    And this is Batman at his absolute worst (unfocused, slow, inept, not invested in anything + if BvS had two memorable fight scenes with him, one in the desert & another at that warehouse, this one had none of it, he's as useless as he was during the Doomsday battle): even Clooney shines as bright as the sun compared to this guy.

    I left the theater somewhat exhausted, broken & confused. It felt so disjointed, joyless that it was very hard to believe that this is supposed to be Batman and other iconic characters assembling together to overcome the impossible odds... so cliche, so predictable, so uneven, and Steppenwolf... the less said about him, the better.
     
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  4. Gold Guy

    Gold Guy Ride On
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    So I had fun with the movie. I didn't love it like I was hoping I would, but it was definitely an entertaining time. It's not gonna be a game changer, and it's not going to be "The best CBM ever!!" But it's a step-up from BvS and Suicide Squad.

    First, the positives: The team has some great chemistry. I don't know if most of that was Snyder or Whedon, but either way, the chemistry really helps make the film. Lots of fun banter here.

    Superman is finally done right!!! His first scene alone feels more like classic Superman to me than MoS and BvS put together (the one problem is that it's hard to imagine BvS Superman acting the way he did in this flashback)

    Wonder Woman is still great, and Flash and Aquaman are fun additions. Batman is mostly good, but Affleck...didn't always look super invested.

    Say what you will about Snyder, he directs some epic action scenes, even if can go overboard with CGI.

    The mid-credits scene is highly amusing, in a good way!

    Negatives: Cyborg is the weak link of the team. Feels more like a plot device than a character at times. He also might have the most glossed over backstory I've seen in a while.

    You can tell that the film was cut for time; the pacing can almost be too fast at times.

    The film, plot-wise, at times feels like it should have come out a few years ago. Ironically (because past DC films tried going for deep messages) this film comes across as the most simple CBM this year. Team forms, fights aliens, the end.

    Some of the cameos were hit or miss; Mera in particular was pretty disappointing.

    Steppenwolf was....OK? Much better than the villains from Squad, and he was cool for action scenes, but he didn't really have any character, and his death scene is shockingly lame. I guess they didn't want the heroes to kill him after the MoS controversy.

    Also, I'm guessing they removed all references to Darkseid after they quietly removed Justice League 2 from the schedule?

    While I loved Superman in this film, the scene where he gets revived wasn't well thought out at all, and even as far as heroes vs heroes go, it was pretty contrived.

    Some of the dialogue (particularly for humor) could be pretty hit-or-miss. Some lines had me laughing; others had me groaning.

    The after-credits scene was cool - but I would have liked it so much more if it featured any villain but Eisenberg Lex. Deathstroke looks very cool, though.

    Over-all, this should be a much bigger crowd-pleaser than past DC films. It's a good old-fashioned fun time. Just don't expect this to be revolutionary or anything.
     
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  5. AdrenalineRush1996

    AdrenalineRush1996 Well-Known Member

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    I saw the film this film and here's my verdict: Aside from Steppenwolf (a very bland villain like Malekith in Thor: The Dark World) and clunky editing in some of the scenes, the League shines out in the fifth DC Movieverse film and though not as good as Wonder Woman, it's miles better than Batman v Superman. I think IMO, this is truly the Rebirth of the DC Movieverse (I've stopped using the DCEU term since it's been proven that it's not the official term).

    Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk
     
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  6. the greenman

    the greenman Well-Known Member

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    Sawvthis earlier today. I will say for my money it was better than Thor Ragnarok. The real issue is most of the funny quips were leaked online or in the trailer. I can see Snyder's opening. I can tell some of Whedon's humor, especially Flash and maybe Aquaman (particularly one scene). I agree this was the best Supes we've had. Still not a fan of Lois, as she just . . . isn't. They basically gave Diana a good lead in the beginning, then left her alone. Cyborg was lame as I expected, but they did their best, by helping him bromance with kidified-Barry Allen Flash. He and Diana helped ground it without getting jokey (except his catch phrase).

    The Stranger Things giant demon spider gets trumped. The cgi was subpar. I don't know what's up with WB. I feel they are often hit or miss with that department. They kinda always do either or going back to Matrix through LOTR and Potter. Yes I will always state WB is a Fantasy producing studio ironically more so than Disney.

    So all in all I liked it. Certainly was great but good enough. Now bring on Legion of Doom. Also, Deathstroke!

    Sent from my LGMS428 using Tapatalk
     
  7. 4Kids4EverFandom

    4Kids4EverFandom Active Member

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    So my friends, brother and i saw this movie and we liked it! In fact here's our review btw. Hope y'all like it! :)
     
  8. -batmat-

    -batmat- Active Member

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    Well, I don't think Steppenwolf died, and he does mention Darkseid once.

    I wrote this review on the blu-ray.com forums if anyone's interested:

    The film's opening scene is a bit weird, I guess they just wanted to have
    Superman in it so audience can see him before his return later in the movie.
    and specially since
    the clip was cut and never shown again, so you don't know what Superman was going to say

    Honestly, most of the first act was just OK, not bad but wasn't necessarily hyping me up, specially with Aquaman, I felt his introduction was a bit rushed, however I really liked him in the movie.

    I was pleasantly surprised by Cyborg, a character I really despise because he was forced into the JL by comics and made it into this movie instead of other characters I wanted to see in the league, like Green Lantern or Martian Manhunter. So having that pre conception of him, I actually really liked his character, the CGI was great, I loved the actor's performance and I enjoyed his arc of
    coming to terms with him being what he is.

    Flash was great too, I honestly expected him to be the funny one as he usually is, and while he was close to being reduced to only the comic relief, thankfully he wasn't, his comedy felt natural and he had a lot of great superhero action moments. The end of the movie has him
    getting a job at the crime lab so, he's getting to where the character is usually depicted as in the comics, same with Cyborg, who we see upgrading his armor in that last scene to an appearance that resembles the comics more
    .

    Wonder Woman was as good as she's always been, and so was Batman, though I have to say his action scenes don't come even close to the warehouse scene in BvS, but he does kick ass a lot and is enjoyable throughout. I'm worried about his comments on how he
    is getting tired, older for crime fighting.
    I think it was a mistake having Batman so old from the start, this universe is just getting started and I love Affleck, I wish we could have him forever in this movies, but I get a feeling Snyder loved TDK Returns so bad and he wanted to do it so bad, that he just couldn't help making him older. I wonder if they'll replace him with another actor in Flashpoint or even if Terry McGinnis will be eventually introduced. Let's see!

    Steppenwolf was cool, nothing to write home about but a solid villain who just did what the story needed to, the CGI was a bit distracting at first but I got used to it as the film went along. Would have definitely helped some real motion capture similar to Thanos or the Avatar characters. I like that he wasn't THAT much powerful,
    the League sans Superman could give him a fight but being defeated in the end, but Superman clearly out matches him. Leaves place for a 3rd JL film with Darkseid to be the real threat and more on par with Superman's power level.
    Parademons were cool.

    Once the league was assembled, I enjoyed this film very much. It was 'fun' but not in the Marvel way which is almost self-parody (I still really enjoy Marvel movies but I like DC that takes the characters a bit more seriously). There was probably 1 or 2 jokes that felt a bit out of place and a bit 'marvelish'
    like for example when Batman is in the floor having been thrown by Superman and says ''yeah, something's definitely broken'', that just felt out of place for Batman.
    but overall I liked the movie's tone and humor.

    The movie didn't went the BvS route of having everything being epic and grander than life and just questioning everything, which on paper isn't necessarily wrong, but it just felt flat to me. JL was definitely more enjoyable. As a long time DC fan, it was a nerd-gasm watching the JL on screen, more so with
    Superman
    in the end of the movie.

    As for the CGI, overall it was really good, I'm fairly easy to please, people complain about CGI a lot these days while it almost always looks awesome to me. But however I must address the Superman moustache thing... specially in the
    intro and 1st after credit
    scenes, it looks so distracting and unnatural, it just takes me off the movie. You can definitely see something's wrong with Henry's face and I like how someone put it as having an allergic bee reaction, haha. Like someone else also said, it also was weird how the yellow in his suit looked almost white. For reference, I loved the CG Tarkin in Rogue One, even if you could tell it was CG.

    About
    evil Superman
    , I thought it was a very cool scene, yet I thought they hyped this moment too much with the nightmare scene in BvS and it just wasn't that big of a deal in the end, plus there's some stuff that makes no sense, because in the nightmare scene, Superman blames Batman for having Lois killed, as somehow that drove him evil, however in JL,
    he seems to be evil because he forgot who he was , even though he remembered Batman and even gave him the 'do you bleed' line back at him, and Lois made him remember everything ('Lois is the key').
    I thought that the nightmare scene was what was going to happen if
    Superman couldn't go back to his true self and stay evil,
    but it all now seems a bit confusing to me.

    Also, there is a bit of a continuity error between this and BvS regarding Superman. He dies in BvS, however the dust from his casket rises, revealing his actually alive. However in JL,
    he truly is dead, and they need to bring him back to life. I actually prefer this to the 'not really dead' route, but it just doesn't match with BvS.

    The score was not bad, but not really something you could remember, it only stood out when they reused old themes, sometimes for good, like MOS theme when they are
    about to bring Superman back to life
    and a more orchestra version of the WW theme, but the original Elfman Batman score , even if it's just the first notes, just took me out of the film. It felt out of place in my opinion.

    I loved the easter eggs for the fans, specially seeing
    a Green Lantern, and also the old gods, I didn't recognize anyone other than what I assume was Zeus, because of the lighting powers. Also, Cyborg's catch phrase was thrown in at the end.

    It just very enjoyable, I liked all 5 leaguers and look forward to some sequels, hopefully the second one with the
    Injustice League, which sounds cool but the thought of having Jesse's Luthor again and potentially Leto's Joker sounds worrying to me.
    and the 3rd one with
    Darkseid
    .

    This is a movie made with the fans in mind more than the regular crowds like Marvel does. I think that's a mistake. Like in BvS UE, Lois mentions that Superman can't see through lead while that never was previously established, I imagine people going , huh? JL has moments like that like then
    Steppenwolf mentions Darkseid or his history is somewhat told, only teasing Apokolips, the fourth world and the new gods, not really explaining them in a way people who don't know about them can really understand what the hell they are talking about.

    Even though Marvel 'did it first' I think having solo movies for everyone before this would have been better. I kinda hate Marvel for that reason, they stole most comic book characters from DC, but they introduced them to the mainstream audience first and it such a perfect way that whatever DC does will either be really difficult to make it work, or just be branded as copycats. Especially if Darkseid ever makes it to a movie.

    It is very different to Batman v Superman, so I can see people who liked that one, not liking this one as much, and the same the other way around like it happened to me. I still think MOS is the best film so far in the DCEU.

    Also, the critic's backlash against this is completely insane. I saw some very stupid reviews, but the most stupid one, in the RT site, claiming JL has Z rated heroes or something like that. I get it for maybe Cyborg, but BATMAN, SUPERMAN, WONDER WOMAN, FLASH?? Critic's are just stupid some times. Go see the film yourself. Make up your own mind.

    8/10

    DCEU

    1. Man of Steel 9/10
    2. Justice League 8/10
    3. Wonder Woman 7/10
    4. Batman v Superman 6/10
    5. Suicide Squad 5/10
     
  9. Dusty

    Dusty Superman.

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    Terrible film that Joss Whedon and WB should have stayed away from. Joss is a great director but he and WB screwed up with the cheesy re-shoots, pacing, and tone and made this film a mess. I loved Snyder’s DC films (because they were solid and fluid and were different than Marvel) now WB is just trying to copy Marvel. This was the one film i was looking forward to the most in many years. WB should have just postponed filming until an adequate time passed for Snyder to want to come back. This was the biggest disappointment ever. The tone was all over the place and the CGI in any scene with Superman sucked (his CGI face was barf) whoever did those SFX should be fired and move into another career. Plus Superman’s dialog when arriving to help was ridiculously cheesy as was everything after he came to life. I really, really wish I could have seen Snyder’s JL.
    *oh and despite Danny Elfens great talent, the music sucked, I really missed Hans Zimmer.
    5.2 out of 10.
    *sad face

    I’m not a big fan of Whedon, but hoped he’d just help out with finishing touches on the film not ruin what Snyder and XL had done.
    I didn’t realize Justice League was like 90% done before Joss Whedon and Danny Elfman came and screwed it up. From one report it sounded like Joss had to do 50% of the film and Danny Elfman was just attached cause Junkie XL LEFT... instead he was fired? I really want to see and hear Snyder’s and XL’s Justice League. I thought Junkie XL had just left the project, but I didn’t know he was replaced after finishing it. Also didn’t realize Zack Snyder had finished 90% of the original film... WTHeck WB?!?
    I really hope we get a Snyder’s Director’s Cut and they burn and then throw this version into a black hole. Man I would’ve loved to hear a cinematic version of Justice League animated’s theme in this. Holy Cow I may have even peed my pants if that would have happened. :(

    https://www.google.com/amp/comicboo...tatement-on-being-replaced-on-justice-league/



    Kallum.
     
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    #9 Dusty, Nov 18, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2017
  10. James Harvey

    James Harvey The World's Finest
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  11. rggkjg1

    rggkjg1 It doesnt make any sense.

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    The second best cinematic DC movie after Wonder Woman. The opening scene had me "sold". I was thinking to myself "Why didn't they do THIS in Man Of Steel?!!!". Superman is approachable. He's smiling. He's confident. He's portrayed as and acting like what I think of when I think of Superman. All of our heroes act like heroes! No major long bickering between our characters. The world stands with our heroes and our heroes stand together. The music is upbeat and triumphant like our heroes! It's more diverse than the same two notes Hans Zimmer uses!

    Now the biggest problem for the film. I go back to these specific lines from one of the trailers:
    "World in mourning." ?
    "World without hope." ?
    "No Kryptonian. This world will fall like all the others." ?
    "Superman was a beacon to the world. He didn't just save people. He made them see all the best parts of themselves." ?

    In a general context of Superman, yes, all that is correct. The problem is the context in which these movies take place. Superman made a poor first impression on the world (Man Of Steel). Everyone has a legitimate reason to be hesitant of super powered beings. Upon rewatching Dawn Of Justice, it appears to me that the world forgave Superman for the events in Man Of Steel. The world becomes hesitant again only because he's framed for killing terrorists (and actually DID kill the one holding Lois hostage) and potential political ramifications of any of his actions. Once Lex Luthor is foiled, obviously the world became aware of his plan and the world goes back to their positive mindset on Superman upon his death.

    I feel it's hard to forgive and forget the previous films themselves and the events in them. I'm thinking the opening cell phone video scene of Superman takes place in between the 2 films. I want to know what happened in between Man Of Steel and Dawn Of Justice for the world to not be hesitant of and embrace Superman.

    Another problem is the loud sound effects. I can barely hear 1989 Batman and John Williams Superman music when it's played. ;)

    Not a masterpiece by no means, but easily way superior to Man Of Steel and Dawn Of Justice. Based on what I've seen in this film, I have reason to finally have some optimism for upcoming cinematic DC movies. I just hope I'm not setting myself up for disappointment in doing so.

    I refreshed a bit by watching some trailers, lots of stuff missing in the final film. Hoping we get an extended cut. We never found out who Alfred was talking to at the end of that one trailer.
     
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  12. Neo Ultra Mike

    Neo Ultra Mike Creeping Shadow of "15000"+ Posts

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    Here's my super long rambly review (spoilers and lots of blathering on ahead).

    You know a lot of "fans" nowadays like pitching why it only took until the last decade to really get the super hero comic boom movie going. Since Super heroes were popular since well... the late 30's and yeah we have seen movies about tons of heroes since then but it's really only been until Iron Man came out where you would not only see a lot of money and time poured behind pretty much every hero possible to make them feel in some sense accurate to they're source material, but that the heroes wouldn't be separated into just their most specific franchise they alone oringate from and we could have multiple heroes from multiple known franchises teaming up. And honestly though it does also come down to in this era of CGI anything we can imagine we can see on screen and thus realms only drawn about can actually be shown, it also comes down to actually having faith in the characters. Because let's face it; though for decades super heroes were really popular they were also seen as something really enjoyed only by either kids or hard core geeks and fanboys and weren't thought to have a lot of super high mainstream appeal. Yeah a couple could reach past that zenith and be seen as beloved by a mass audience but... that was like 1 out of 100, and certainly not a lot of the heroes people are making giant films about now. Honestly until the last 10 years you either had to be in that very small minority or be altered and tailor made to fit a specific studio/actor/director's vision even if it didn't have much to do with the source material. Yeah now that we live in a world where honestly fans matter more then actor that's different but that was certainly not the case years ago.

    I bring this up because I did grow up in that era where yeah super heroes though popular weren't the juggernauts of franchises they were now and only a few were really known and taken seriously. Heck I grew up on Superfriends and for most of my elementary and middle school days saw a lot of the heroes there as goofs especially when other series started seriously mocking them. I didn't really read DC or Marvel so though I watched enough BTAS or STAS to know why people would take the Dark Knight and Man of Steel seriously, not so much characters like Wonder Woman or Aquaman. And honestly that only changed for me when I saw the build up for the Justice League cartoon. It's one of the first series I really remember being pumped up a lot BEFORE it aired online and directors and writers talking about how exited they were to make certain stories or what certain characters could pop up. I remember also seeing ads in TV Guide and other places listing who would be in the league and how would be different from it's original incarnation and how much love this was getting from fans all around the world. I admit since it aired on a late Sunday night slot when it first came out I really wasn't watching it when it started out because back then that was my Simpsons/maybe Animorphs time slot for TV watching but I eventually caught the show and though season one had some clunkers it did still have an epic feeling of quality I wasn't expecting from super hero material. And it was the first time I was not only getting all this history about the DC Universe and what was happening in all of these epic comic storylines but really understanding why people were taking it so seriously. This continued on throughout the show even when it went into Unlimited and introduced so many more members and by the time it aired I felt I really had much more an understanding about DC and it's characters and really felt an attachment to a lot of the characters included. Not enough to really pick up the comics but enough I could really see the appeal and want to see that same love translated on the big screen.

    And of course that eventually came with the DCEU which... well has let's face it been rocky at best since it's inception back in Man of Steel. Which IMHO has a few moments but... is a dull plodding, unamusing and tepid mess that even as someone who doesn't have the most profound understanding of Superman, gets how that severly fracks up the characters and all those involved. Again the DCEU at the time was adamant on how no matter what happened this would be they're starting point and they would make a MoS sequel next no matter what... but Warner Brother demands of fastracking the franchise - I mean "realizing they could do the world's finest right after fighting one another" led to Batman V Superman. Another terrible mess of a film which though had it's moments really did show how desperate DC was to catch up to what Marvel was doing especially in trying to next line up the Justice League. IMHO they really should of fired Snyder at that point and just waited and done a few more solo movies instead of continuing on. Especially since right after BvS we had Suicide Squad another mess of a movie no one can really fully get behind. Even some like me who feels the movie has merit will tell you this could of been done a thousand times better since honestly that really should of just been a scaled down Deadshot and Harley Quinn movie especially as the branding of Suicide Squad isn't that strong and doing the movie as they did makes it obvious they wanted a Guardians of the Galaxy kind of hit except... without really the quality. And yeah a few months back we did get a quality DC movie in the form of Wonder Woman that honestly showed the potential of this franchise that once it stops being overly pretentious and drab or ripping off Marvel (well WW had a Thor/Captain America feel at points but most of the ideas and chariczateriation were still original enough) it could actually make good movies. And the fact we had a really good DC movie gave fans hope of how this would truly be the best year for super hero movies. I mean counting Lego Batman movie there are now 7 Super hero flicks and until now the lowest scored was Guardians of the Galaxy Volume 2 so if JL despite a lot of behind the scene handicaps (getting a new director to re film a bunch of scenes in the movie, still having all that Snyder back lash, trying to make us care about characters really only introduced in cameos previously) could knock it out of the park then maybe stuff like WW wouldn't be seen as a fluke and the DCEU could finally offer the MCU it's strongest competition. Which... yeah isn't going to happen as this movie had to hide some of it's review for awhile before revealing to be overall midding and kind of "okay" according to some fans and not the cinematic hope many were expecting. However now that I've seen it what do I feel about this movie?

    Well I do feel it's decent and the right step for this universe though yeah I can why many are just feeling like it's okay.

    Honestly one of my biggest greviances about this movie is that it's trying to pretend like the other movies in this story were a lot better that lead up to this. I guess that's just a thing of most Cinematic Universes in general that they are trying to sell that the others worked even when many feel they don't but it does get annoying when this movie again is trying to make it seem like Superman was this inspiring heroic incredible figure that gave everyone a push and that even apparently the villain group wouldn't attack if he wasn't around. Which yeah I get that's the feel of Superman in the DC Universe in general, but that certainly was not the feel I got of the previous two movies in this "trilogy" yet this film keeps trying to sell me on that. Especially the first half when all you have is a pretty lame facebook "interview" a bunch of kids took and memories of the previous movies when that wasn't the case. I get why the story is doing it but it does feel like this series is trying to desperately backtrack and give a false image of what the previous movies were like when that wasn't the case. You can also see that with the whole storyline of Batman feeling this great burden to try and live up to Superman's legacy like the two did have this story together but... they really didn't. Also that the Lois/Clark romance was really good because though I can tell they are at least trying more here (even if there are still some odd lines "you smell good?" Really? You saying that to the guy who was in a tomb and then just got electro revived and was busy fighting the others apparently smells good? Man that felt like a Snyder/Man of Steel line if there ever was one) but it just doesn't work when you could feel nothing for them in those other movies so to have it here just feels so lackluster. Like I should really feel the weight of Lois coming and calming down Clark and then him taking her away and saying he spend too much time in a little box or even seeing his mom again but... a lot of the lines aren't connecting and even though filmed well they botched the emotion so much there it's hard to feel that connect as much. I also think the villain of Steppenwolf isn't really threatening and honestly his talk of mother feels like a half hearted attempt to give him a personality he really doesn't have. I mean I guess he looks impressive and at least he doesn't pointlessly philosophy like say Ares did at the end of Wonder Woman as much and feels intimidating (well except with Superman but more on that later) but he doesn't really make an impression or have really any proper build up or motivation. Honestly to me Zod is still the best villain in this DCEU and actually had a story and feel of power behind him while this guy has some decent fights and I geuss the idea of him being eaten by the Parademons is fitting karma but he does feel rather lame. Honestly as much as people don't like Lex Luthor, even the minute of him or heck even Deathstroke (the kids watching this movie BTW just knew him as Slade so... I guess it's cool they know of the original Teen Titans to really connect him since with TTG you really couldn't) I felt much more personality and interest him as yeah I'm much for the idea of an Injustice League coming together then say anything with Darkseid (who had one name drop here) if he's anything like Steppenwolf. Plus really since he's not allowed to really hurt/kill the associates of the heroes he doesn't have any personal vileness that makes you really want to see him taken down. Due to well those guys having to be saved for the heroes other movies so having it here like this doesn't generate much of a threat.

    One thing I'm torn on is that once Superman is revived he... for the first time honestly in any movie really feels like Superman. In terms of performance, of tone, and of strength this really did feel like the honest man of steel. And honestly felt like Henry Cavill was much more committed to actually making you like the guy even when he was out of it with how he man handled the rest of the league and did the whole "do you bleed" back to Bruce. And him showing up with a one liner about Justice and knocking around Steppenwolf and running with Barry to get to the people and carrying this huge thing... yeah honestly this is the superman people respect/love the most that truly does feel like a hero. However that was always a drawback to me personally when he was with the Justice League in some episodes especially super focused ones on him like "hereafter" where you feel like "why does Superman need a league if he can do it on it's own?" IMHO there really should of been a scene really showing that as much as they need Superman, he really needs them since yeah the others still help save the day and do they're part but it does kind of feel like Superman just let them win and kind of could do it on his own. With how he came in and then freezing the hammer that had been knocking around everyone else. Like even a scene showing maybe Wondy being a better fighter or her god charges actually being affective as one of his punches. Because honestly the attitude and feel of this version of Clark Kent does make me like him and want to see more. And I really do like the bit with him and Barry preparing to race since that reminds me of how I was introduced to the not super goofy Flash from Superfriends but actual Flash in the Superman The Animated series episode and seeing them end on that shot was nice. But I still want it to feel like "Justice League" not "Superman and also those other JLers who sort of help". There needs to be a better balance that this movie needed to strike.

    I do have some other things I can nitpick (If Bruce can buy back the bank and Clark's farmhouse why doesn't he just buy to get Barry's dad out of jail or use his world's most famous detective skills to help find the actual killer? They set up arcs for all of them to learn to be more open and to get along and most connected but it felt like they dropped the ball on Aquaman's for a joke with the lasso of truth which nice still felt like we didn't get a proper resolution for it) but there is actually some stuff I did enjoy. For example I complained in Batman v Superman and even Wonder Woman the whole "they don't really set up why Diana exiled herself for an entire century in those movies" so I appreciate this one finally spelling it out: It wasn't just her love for Steve Trevor and feeling he was gone but feeling responsible for his death and realizing those who would lead and go under her would fall and lose their lives and obviously not really having to deal as much with that kind of death thanks to her own actions having the guilt eat her up about it. I'm glad to not only get that but that scene that was yeah jerkish of Bruce Wayne but the kind of tough love that I expect from the head of the Bat Family: Pointing out "you could of been this but let your own guilt get the better of you so you aren't really one to judge when someone else feels bad like that and need to step up to be a leader" and yeah that being Diana's whole arc and her actually stepping up at the end. And going from "just pretending and protecting people on the side" to actually working with Bruce to build the hall of justice (really liked the line about others obviously referencing whoever else will be in this cinematic universe) and chatting with the kids after tying up those guys who were going on about their crimes. It actually did feel like an actual character arc and honest journey with a solid ending point more then in a sense we got in the Wonder Woman and showing her own flaws but overcoming them. And honestly I actually also liked her being nice to the others like shaking hands with Barry and saying Aquaman had a nice earnest speech and even reaching out to Cyborg pointing out she's lost someone as well when she wanted to meet him face to face. Plus it does make it clear to me that we really don't need another wonder Woman set in like the time between the first and this: we need one after this to see her further growth honestly with maybe a few ties to a smaller adventure years back but I want to follow this present Diana more. And honestly her smacking away the parademons or leading the charge to move forward with Bruce and getting some solid hits on Steppenwolf still showed her strength as well. Really loved her using that lightning clash to knock him up after he was triton struck.

    The rest of the cast was also pretty good. Honestly though fairly expostional heavy I do like the set up with Cyborg especially him pointing out to his father he wouldn't even tell anyone else that he was alive after the accident and Victor and Superman pulling apart the Mother boxes at the end together and talking about how happy they are to want to be alive. Heck got a good laugh at the "I can feel my toes how is that possible" and hey they even threw in a Booyah for all the Teen Titans fans since... yeah that was only a thing that started in the original Teen Titans animated series right? And though I didn't feel like he had a proper conclusion I actually did like the start of what they did with Aquaman and though also overly expsotional heavy his scene with Mera especially pointing out knowing his mother (though it does make me wonder how the Aquaman movie will work if a lot of it takes place in water since I guess like Mera and Arthur they'll have air bubbles at points but they can't always do that for the film) and him being the most aggressive/unsure member and how he bounced off everyone else. And though he didn't hit every bit out of the park I do have to say that Barry was not annoying and generally actually pretty funny. I really liked him drawing the glasses on that guy's face with super speed and him psyching himself up to have to help one person at a time or "you know if she kills you none of us are going to say anything" or trying to bond with Victor over both being accidents in how they got they're power and realizing Superman could follow him at super speed (honestly I do wish it wasn't more that super speed wasn't just in a dimension where everyone else just moved fast and it was just them rushing at hyper speeds but eh guess that's harder to really convey honestly) or him trying to say goodbye to that family he saved (I don't think we needed the... two minutes of that family just to want to see them saved. Can't we just be glad that the Justice League actually does care about rescuing civlllian casualties and call it a day?) or getting smacked by Steppenwolf after everyone thought they won. I also liked the stuff with Bruce mostly him actually trying to motivate the others and his interactions with Alfred (like pointing out how he should of just called Diana by now) and the last back and forth he had with Clark was good. Really this is the stuff that's sold me on Justice League and these little more human moments honeslty work better then a lot of the spectacle which honestly doesn't feel up to snuff compared with a lot of previous epic battles and doesn't feel as honest world ending as it should.

    So yeah it's... fairly good and honestly gives me more hope then other DCEU movies have. Thinking about it doesn't have as good or interesting a message as Wonder Woman or as much charm or really the stakes it needs for this kind of story and trying to make the other films that came before this feels... odd. But it's still decent and honestly if this was the level of quality of Man of Steel or BvS people wouldn't hate on the DCEU. Seriously any trace of Snyder and his slow motion or poetic dialogue or drama shots are some of the weakest elements so if we got the tone the ending of this movie gots for the rest of this universe we'd be on the right track as this is decent stuff. I get why it's not getting the highest ratings due to what came before it and feeling honestly not up to snuff in terms of interactions or even interest or threat as the Avengers or the high box office because... well the hugest draw was Batman v Superman if you aren't going to take the time to introduce most of these guys in they're own movies but it still works solid and again feels like it gets the characters more then we have before. So honestly I would hope from more now that we feel a bit more on track (though guess we'll still have to deal with the whole "Save Lois" that BvS teased that this movie didn't answer so that will probably have to be addressed in another movie) that the ship straightens but guess we'll see that in upcoming installments. Still decent and I give props that they actually did kill off Superman but use this movie to actually give a reason to revive him and make that work and make sense and give me a reason to care and want to see more so overall this gets a... decent from me.
     
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  13. hobbyfan

    hobbyfan Well-Known Member

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    My brother & I took in a matinee. What a mess.

    Barry has been de-aged into a college student, and only lands his CCPD job at the end of the movie. I'm sorry, but he's not meant to be a tool and/or DC's answer to Spider-Man. The suit doesn't look right, either.

    Whedon should've completely rewritten the story, and dumped what Snyder & Terrio had written. Whedon knows better. If you want someone to blame for Batman being older than the others, when he shouldn't be, blame Snyder. In his world, there's no room for the likes of Plastic Man, which isn't so bad, but messing with a successful formula that's been around nearly 60 years is just wrong.

    Someone commented on Yahoo that the CGI on Steppenwolf made him look like Tim Curry's villain from "Legend" 32 years ago. It's just the helmet, man.

    On the plus side, JK Simmons nailed it as Gordon. Amy Adams was a welcome presence as Lois one more time. Ray Fisher is also welcome as Cyborg. Too bad we didn't see how Victor ended up as Cyborg. And, yes, Vic lost his mom in that accident, first depicted back in 1980.
     
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  14. Otaku-sempai

    Otaku-sempai Well-Known Member

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    Remember, that was not what Whedon was hired to do. And there was already far too much money sunk into the movie to be able to scrap what Snyder had done and start from scratch. That was never going to happen.
     
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  15. Wonder Woman

    Wonder Woman Well-Known Member

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    One of the biggest disappointments with this movie, beside it being a huge mess, is that this could be Henry Cavill's last go as Superman. He finally got to really shine and act as Superman. That opening cell phone scene was pure Superman and it was great to see. It's a shame that he might be a casualty of this dumpster fire of a movie.
     
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  16. the greenman

    the greenman Well-Known Member

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    I don't think the film was a complete mess. BvS and Avengers AoU are the reigning champions for title (mind you I have never watched Green Lantern or Suicide Squad). JL was just a rush job from the beginning. The marketing was stupid, only because some posters feature Superman some don't. Superman is the most marketable character ever. Really, Snyder's dark pessimism, was cool for solo standalone features, but not a universe. Now we see why Affleck was so disappointed.

    Sent from my LGMS428 using Tapatalk
     
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  17. Otaku-sempai

    Otaku-sempai Well-Known Member

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    Maybe, but Cavill is contracted to play Superman at least one more time.
     
  18. Marvelman02

    Marvelman02 Active Member

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    Saw it yesterday. If you like superheroes then you will probably think this is okay. If not, you may find it tedious. I'd rate this as somewhere between okay and good. Nowhere near as good as it could have been. Props to Joss Whedon for making lemonade out of lemons.
     
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  19. RoryWilliams

    RoryWilliams Well-Known Member

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    If you're going to specifically complain about the movie veering away from the comics and taking liberties, Joss Whedon is the last guy you want to go to as a defense, given he's done the same thing in his Avengers films.

    Anyway, I liked it a lot. This is the Superman we should've gotten from the beginning. In fact, the core idealogical conflict of Batman v. Superman would've made 10 times more sense if they'd used this take on Superman in the first place.
     
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  20. Marvelman02

    Marvelman02 Active Member

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    I wanna put an idea out there... You all know who Millie Bobby Brown is, right? (Eleven on Stranger Things in case you have been living on island somewhere.) Here are some of her funnier moments:



    Millie has a way of being annoying and adorable at the same time.

    I think she would make a great Wonder Girl, Stargirl, or even a very young Zatanna.

    Can anybody else see it? Or, am I the only one? Geoff Johns should draft her for the DCEU.
     

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