For crying out loud why can't they make good Bible cartoons?

[I.R Joey]

*Note this isn't meant to be a religion bashing thread*


So I was flipping through the channels Saturday Morning looking for something good in the vast wasteland of kidvid that use to sustain me every weekend. Anyhow, I stumble across this Bible cartoon on TBN and decide to watch it (it's the story of Jonah.) First off it had an interesting segment about Jonah's village being sacked by the Assyrian's and him hating them for that. Anyway, onward it goes and so far I'm pretty optomistic Jonah's voice (done by the guy who did Duo Maxwell and Wolvie in Evolution) is really doin okay for himself. Then it zooms over to the badie Assyrian's and I get a glimpse of what is to come (read semi-sentient animal.) I shrug it off and go on. Then Jonah gets his big messege from God. Then comes the point that ruins it for me, the host (who did the voice of Gohan on DBZ) starts singing...badly I might add. So while I'm groaning on the ground Jonah goes to flee from God at a sea port. At this point among many people, I began to notice how truly ugly the charecter designs are. The dialouge gets cornier and cornier, and more songs ensure (I count four variations of the same song in about 20 minutes.) Needless to say it was just bad.

Now as a strong Christian I can't help but wonder why those of my faith can't make possibly the most influential book in the history of the Western Hemisphere interesting. Seriously, I watched this adventures Mythica thing on the Spanish Channel, and it was actually good ya know? I mean its like they find all the things they can to make the cartoons bad and then execute them flawlessly. Perhaps Veggitales is the only one that pulled it off okay.

Any theory's on why Christian and religious cartoons seem to be bad, and please no religioun bashing.

[moldorm]

Low budget, I guess.

[batboy2001]

Originally posted by moldorm
Low budget, I guess.

Heh, well said. Really that's the only thing I can think of myself. As for the singing, I dunno, it's like an unwritten law "all Christian cartoons must be lame". I don't question the unwritten laws.

[Howard]

Probably because it is harder to get funding or sponsors for religious themed programming. Most TV outlets would rather run non-religious cartoons, because they feel that they will have a bigger audience. Also, most animation companies would rather not create Biblical cartoons, as they would have a more limited appeal than more non-denominational 'toons, like Scooby Doo or Spongebob Squarepants.

[mosszonedotcom]

In the early 90s, Hanna Barbara produced some straight to video Bible stories that were quite good. James Earl Jones played Pharaoh. Tim Curry played the serphant. Dan Acroyd acted the voice of Jesus Christ. There were many more great voice actors too, Stephanie Zimbalist for one.

I haven't seen them in a long time, but I still have some on video. The title was The Greatest Story Ever Told. I tried to find them on IMDB one day and they weren't there.

There not perfect, but I think kids and adults could get some enjoyment out of them.

[Auggie Doggie]

Originally posted by mosszonedotcom
In the early 90s, Hanna Barbara produced some straight to video Bible stories that were quite good. James Earl Jones played Pharaoh. Tim Curry played the serphant. Dan Acroyd acted the voice of Jesus Christ. There were many more great voice actors too, Stephanie Zimbalist for one.

I haven't seen them in a long time, but I still have some on video. The title was The Greatest Story Ever Told. I tried to find them on IMDB one day and they weren't there.

There not perfect, but I think kids and adults could get some enjoyment out of them.

AMEN!

I even still have some VHS copies from the very beginning.

[Lucky Bob]

Veggietales is pretty good. As for the rest, well, we need some good Christian cartoons out there. What we have right now is embarrasing.

[Obi]

Yes, Veggietales is great.

*tosses around his Larry Boy plushie*

I thought the Prince of Egypt was pretty good, too.

[mbaker]

What about "Davey and Goliath"?

[Sharklady]

How about 'Prince of Egypt'?

[mbaker]

Would "Superbook", or "The Flying House" count?

[Mynd Hed]

Yeah, you've got to figure that even though Christianity is still the majority in the United States, an animation studio is still cutting out a good portion of their potential audience when they make a Christian or Biblical themed cartoon as opposed to something with a broader appeal.

Of course, if you go Old Testament, then you've got a common ground between Christianity, Judaism, and Islam, so that's probably more the way to go if you're going to make a Biblical themed cartoon. Even then, you can run into trouble if one or more denominations feel that you've unfairly portrayed something or other and they get offended. Overall it's just kind of a touchy subject whether you're for or against it, so many animation studios just like to keep their hands clean of it I think.

[Evil Dr. Reef]

I've found that most "Religious" cartoons focus more on being incredibly preachy instead of having a decent story or acting, and damn themselves to the bowels of Suckdom. There are exceptions to the rule (Veggie Tales, The Prince of Egypt) that are very good (funny, in Veggie Tales' case) while still getting their point across, but most of the others just aren't that good.

[Chosen Raven]

Originally posted by I.R Joey
Any theory's on why Christian and religious cartoons seem to be bad

The answer is simple, my fellow Christians believe that all cartoons are for kids. Personally, I would like to see a Christian cartoon that is not based on a Bible story. We do good books and comics( check out the Archangels if you can find it), but animation, movies, and videogames*shiver* we suck at.

[Anubis C. Soundwave]

What about the story of David?

Now, we HAD anime(that is, Superbook and Flying House), but it's older than Dragonball. :b

It's not fair. We(that is, Christians) command parents not to let their kids watch Pokemon, yet--aside from the Prince of Egypt(created in part by Jew Spielberg) and VeggieTales(the CG looks good, chara designs nice)--our alternatives make Rescue Heroes look like Cowboy Bebop. Then we wonder why the kids run to Pokemon in droves.

Furthermore, they focus the animation ONLY on the kids. Aren't the adult sinners the ones who need to be saved the most?

My number one goal, when I obtain my own animation conglomerate, is to rectify this situation at ONCE. The story of Jesus alone would make great animation.

At the very least, I'd buy Superbook and Flying House, update it with fresher animation and new storylines, and send that out as a mild example of how to represent God properly.

[rant mode ON.]

Jesus walked on water.

We can animate people walking on water. Lady Kayura, Ryoko, Flash, Superman(okay, the two superheroes were running), and I probably missed a few.

Jesus went SSJ. Okay, slight exaggeration of the Transfiguration. Jesus wouldn't spend ten minutes grunting as he awakens his awesome power before Peter, James, and John with a generic light aura around him.

The Parting of the Red Sea should be a spectacular moment, and thankfully it's impossible to screw up that moment. Even parodies of it look cool.[thinks of Tiny Toons]

Countless other moments in the Bible[especially the OT] where animation would show HOW POWERFUL GOD REALLY IS. Yet Christians will not use this tool properly, thus it makes the kingdom of heaven no money(which would be used to spread the gospel and help others), and any biblical cartoons end up on TBN, preaching to the converted. [and defeating the purpose]

[I mean, it takes years to get a character named Him, and they got the wrong guy. ]

==

One reason, most likely, is the whole "people will be offended" bit. It takes a great deal to offend me.

But who would be offended?

1. Christians. Reason being the all-pervasive idea that cartoons are just for kids. With that in mind, we may fear that a "cartoon" film, even a serious one, would trivialize and dilute the gospel. Even by that reasoning, that's no reason why a show promoting the absloute awesomeness of God should have an animation, art, and acting budget worse than Transformers: Armada. The show should entertain, and make the youth MORE curious about the inner workings of the kingdom. We're talking about a being with the power to create an entire UNIVERSE.

2. Atheists, because they don't want "religion" crammed down their throats. Which is also one of the reasons why anime as tame as Big O has "Cast in the Name of God" edited. [erroneously, I might add. Big O has little to do with religion at all.] (that, and Christians would be offended.) I don't think anyone's rights can be infringed upon by a TV show. You have the power of Remote Control. Use it.

I think those are the two main ones. That, combined with "cartoons are just for kids" ingrained in the mind of the general public, makes it currently difficult to make an entertaining, provocative animated project based on the Bible that carries the pure, unadulterated message the gospel preaches...to the UNCONVERTED. [the people who ostensibly need to hear the message, not John Hagee.]

Let's be brutally honest. Most Americans don't watch TBN. I don't watch TBN that often. I might glance at Bishop Jakes, wonder why the Crouches are seemingly trying to embarrass the faith(they're not--the whole purpose of the channel is to spread the gospel worldwide, and despite all these shortcomings, they are succeeding), wish that Pastor Hagee would quit inserting his biased political vitriol into his thunderous super sermons, and watch Superbook/Flying House if I get up early enough on Saturday Morning.

If I, a Christian, find TBN's TV offerings--let alone the cartoons--about as fun to watch as a marathon of Survivor/Fear Factor/The Chamber/The Chair/Big Brother, what hope does the unsaved have?

What would Jesus do?

I honestly believe he'd reiterate this statement: "...for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance."

Jesus drew many people to him. We drive people away from us in droves. And whether we give any genuine credence to the evils of Pokemon or if we recognize it's just a way to get parents to say no to the expensive merchandise(Christians said the same thing about the TMNTs, and probably about Transformers), we must admit that something's not right; as Christians, we should emulate Jesus. Believe me, if Jesus--and later the early church(Peter, James, John, Jude, and especially Paul, but not Crouch)--had such tools as TV and the Internet at their command, Christians would have taken this entire planet by now. [in a spiritual sense, we are aliens.] (historically, I understand that Rome "helped out" in order to root out the Jews. :b (ancient romans tend to be jerks.) but the fact remains that Christianity went from being a minor-league cult to a major-league, respected, and unfortunately fractured faith.)

To relate this to the topic, I think if we want to wean our children away from the "sour serpent's milk" of Pikachu, then it's time we worked on making an entertaining alternative to the "yellow, red-cheeked rat demon". While we're at it, draw the adults as well with something good, like Prince of Egypt. No more movies with limited release, like Left Behind and the Omega Code.

The reason why animation's a great medium? You'd be amazed at how much scriptural message can be conveyed(unintentionally) by...Dragon Ball Z.

Perhaps if we created engaging characters--we already have the most compelling text in the history of mankind, so plot should be a no-brainer(if Sailor Moon could become the Messiah.... )--and had a functional animation budget(the worst I would accept is [new] He-Man's animation team); we'd get better results, and would no longer have to cringe like Cringer due to the poor quality of our offerings.

[this not only applies to animation, but every function we use to spread the Word.]

We can do this.

There is only the Word. And the Word is the Name. And the Name is Jesus!!!(taking a jab at Daemon Rising. ReBoot's a great show. )

[NovaSaber]

Reasons why there are very few good Bible cartoons:

1. By definition, they're based on a book that was not written with such adaptations in mind.

2. They want to make them for kids, and the Bible isn't kid-friendly.

3. They make them preachy instead of entertaining.

4. Yeah, there's the low budget thing.

5. They never actually just tell the story; they think they have to promote the religion that goes with it. And all propoganda sucks by definition.

That, combined with "cartoons are just for kids" ingrained in the mind of the general public, makes it currently difficult to make an entertaining, provocative animated project based on the Bible that carries the pure, unadulterated message the gospel preaches...to the UNCONVERTED.

So you want non-Christians to watch Christian cartoons? Okay, but first all you Christians have to watch some Jewish cartoons (The Prince of Egypt and the Rugrats Passover special are all I can think of)...and some Buddhist cartoons (if there are any)...and some Pagan cartoons (maybe those myth-based cartoons would count). And I don't think it's even possible to make an atheist cartoon, but if it was, I'd ask you to watch that too.
You have just pinpointed why Bible cartoons suck! They try to convert people. Cartoons should not be used to influence what people believe; not in the way you mean, anyway. Having a message is okay, but while some individual Bible stories have good messages like tolerance, brains over brawn, forgiveness, love, etc., those messages won't do anything to convert people to Christianity either, because they're universal. The messages that would theoretically convert people would be more likely to offend them.

The reason why animation's a great medium? You'd be amazed at how much scriptural message can be conveyed(unintentionally) by...Dragon Ball Z.

Let's see. In Dragon Ball Z:
There's a good guy name Mr. Satan
Resurrection is child's play
The heroes that are stronger than the gods
Goku clearly doesn't have any real respect for any god, and he's considered pure good
Sacrificing yourself never works
A person's fate in the afterlife is determine by whether or not they were good, not by what they believe
Non-violent solutions only work if an even worse villain is coming soon (I know the Bible is full of violence, but Jesus advocated non-violence...except when he was telling people to cut of their own body parts)

I've seen Biblical "messages" in a lot of anime, but DBZ isn't one of them.

[Feslmogh]

Originally posted by Mynd Hed

Of course, if you go Old Testament, then you've got a common ground between Christianity, Judaism, and Islam, so that's probably more the way to go if you're going to make a Biblical themed cartoon.

Ummm... side note... Islam is not part of the Old Testiment... now back to the original post...

[Mynd Hed]

Big O has little to do with religion at all.

Well, it has more to do with the evils of the capitalist corporation-state, but it has a lot to do with religion as well, especially in the last episode. "The power of the Creator wielded by the hand of man"... sounds pretty religious to me.

But that's just a side topic. Very good, very interesting points of view all around here.

And no, the Islam doesn't accept the Old Testament as a holy text, but they do accept some of the historical occurences that are described in the Old Testament, that's all I meant to say there, sorry if I was vague.

[Chris Wood]

This is a joke, right? By definition, any Biblical cartoon would be ridiculous.

I suppose if they had Jesus transform into "battle mode", form a BLAZING SWORD and hack Satan's demonic superbeasts in half then you might have the start of something interesting. Nah.

[RockItShipper]

I'd love to see something approached as thoughtfully and not sugar-coated as PBS' Liberty's Kids is... but the fact is that I consider the more vocal Christian voices in today's media to be Pharisees in of themselves.