dragonball z (england)

**dbzmarc** · 11-27-2002, 02:40 PM

hi, i know a while back that dbz was moved to CNX with the american voices and music and stuff, but i dont have CNX and i was wondering, will the dragonball z buu eps ever show on cartoon network in england with the uk voices ?

**Space Cadet** · 11-27-2002, 04:01 PM

Originally posted by dbzmarc
hi, i know a while back that dbz was moved to CNX with the american voices and music and stuff, but i dont have CNX and i was wondering, will the dragonball z buu eps ever show on cartoon network in england with the uk voices ?

I don't know if CNX will ever show it again. Right now the Ocean voices are in Canada and Holland. Also....

Brian Drummond's Vegeta and Scott McNeil's Piccolo> Chris Sabat's versions

**Super_Goku64** · 10-03-2005, 01:56 PM

For the record, yes CNX switched straight back to the Ocean dub Fusion and Kid Buu sagas (The UK voices as you call them) and it was leagues better than that awful Funimation dub. Ocean's Animation is far superior to Funi as well, probably cos they digitally remaster their episodes. CNX discarded the Funimation Fusion saga episodes like the rubbish it is.

Damn I hated it when the Fusion saga had the Funi eps shown, even more so than the dub change in the Ginyu saga. Thank God UK fans complained at that atrocious Funi dub and AB saved DBZ in UK by distributing the Ocean dub.

Whoever made the decision to show the Funi dub had it thrown right back at his/her face. Keep that damned Funimation dub away from UK/EU TV.

Marzak Ahmed: Strongly agree with you. That constipated Sabat sounded like he needed to visit the lavatory every time he voiced DBZ, and his voices in GT are even worse, but then again, so were the rest of the Funi voices. (AS if it were possible)

The joys of Ocean (DBZ) and Blue Water(DB/DBGT) are priceless.

**Dark Fact** · 10-03-2005, 02:12 PM

Sorry, but you don't just use the Ocean Group, drop them for the next couple of seasons in favour of different actors then bring them back just because of fan demand. It actually makes the Season 3 and 4 actors look worthless.

**Super_Goku64** · 10-03-2005, 05:30 PM

Originally Posted by Dark Fact

Sorry, but you don't just use the Ocean Group, drop them for the next couple of seasons in favour of different actors then bring them back just because of fan demand. It actually makes the Season 3 and 4 actors look worthless.

They are, at least when it comes to DBZ. That may seem harsh, but you dont watch a dub to sympathise with VAs.

Ocean are the Original English DBZ VAs and in many people's view, undesputibly the best.

**Dark Fact** · 10-04-2005, 12:04 PM

Then why didn't they do Season 3 and 4?

**Conan-san** · 10-04-2005, 12:44 PM

Originally Posted by Dark Fact

Then why didn't they do Season 3 and 4?

THe answer can be found by relising that maybe the absoute mess the licenceing was at that time prevented anything from going foreword.

**CyberCubed** · 10-04-2005, 01:15 PM

The Ocean dub is horrible, especially the early seasons. It's a shame that there are two english dubs to begin with, and the UK and Canada has to be stuck with the worse one.

**Dark Fact** · 10-04-2005, 01:26 PM

For the sake of argument, I tried giving the Ocean Group a chance when they reprised their roles again for the Cell Games to the end of the Buu saga. However, the actors are now nothing more than a shadow of their former selves. Brian Drummond and Scott McNeil don't have that same "oomph" that they utilized in the first two seasons. The supporting characters that the FUNimation cast played out in later seasons were pretty damn good. When the airings went back to the Ocean group, they sounded horrible. Scott McNeil sounded way too constipated as Android 16 and for some strange reason, had to resort to his Dinobot voice for Dabura. Babidi just sounded the same as Krillin and Ian Corlett never bothered being Goku again.

Originally Posted by Conan-san

THe answer can be found by relising that maybe the absoute mess the licenceing was at that time prevented anything from going foreword.

That mess was cleaned up long ago. The means to dub Season 3 and 4 with the Ocean group could've happened already.

Yeah, the FUNimation cast wasn't all that good when they started out, but as the seasons progressed, they really got into their characters (except for Chris Sabat, who was never good as Vegeta and Piccolo). Considering that the same actors are on the DVDs, I don't really need to watch the Ocean Groups abrupt reprisal.

**HellCat** · 10-04-2005, 01:40 PM

Originally Posted by Super_Goku64

For the record, yes CNX switched straight back to the Ocean dub Fusion and Kid Buu sagas (The UK voices as you call them) and it was leagues better than that awful Funimation dub. Ocean's Animation is far superior to Funi as well, probably cos they digitally remaster their episodes. CNX discarded the Funimation Fusion saga episodes like the rubbish it is.

Damn I hated it when the Fusion saga had the Funi eps shown, even more so than the dub change in the Ginyu saga. Thank God UK fans complained at that atrocious Funi dub and AB saved DBZ in UK by distributing the Ocean dub.

Whoever made the decision to show the Funi dub had it thrown right back at his/her face. Keep that damned Funimation dub away from UK/EU TV.

Marzak Ahmed: Strongly agree with you. That constipated Sabat sounded like he needed to visit the lavatory every time he voiced DBZ, and his voices in GT are even worse, but then again, so were the rest of the Funi voices. (AS if it were possible)

The joys of Ocean (DBZ) and Blue Water(DB/DBGT) are priceless.

"Saved" DBZ? In my opinion, the Dragon Ball franchise has got to be the fad with the most wasted potential in the UK in the last few years. Here we have a show which was highly popular with both kids and teenagers but due to airing only on a digital channel, the fact that the voices were constantly changing and the horrible style for continuity airing, it all went out with a whimper rather than a bang. There was a limited push of merchandise here and that didn't help because it was poorly planned- figures of boring characters from the early Buu Saga and mini figures of movie only characters. Most kids didn't know who the heck these characters were or had no interest in the ones available and the line quickly went to discount. If the people with the rights to DB/Z/GT within the UK had played their cards right, they could have earned major money.

**Prowlus** · 10-07-2005, 05:55 PM

Who watched the DBZ Movie today "SUPER BATTLE OF THE GREAT SUPER WARRIORS"? God the bridge dubs must DIE!!!

"Trunk" 's voice sounds like hes been castrated "Veg-eter" is even worse and poor "Big Green"

**chris3116** · 10-08-2005, 10:47 AM

Originally Posted by Dark Fact

Then why didn't they do Season 3 and 4?

Ocean did make season 4. In the early season 4, Peter Kelanis was Goku. Kelanis was Goku in season 2 too. I remember I saw the episode when Goku took his car license test with the Ocean voices.

Kirby Morrow takes the role of Goku when Goku and Gohan finished their training on the hyperbolic time chamber.

YTV had the Funimation version until FUNimation broke the contract. Then YTV bought the Ocean Version which FUNimation sold for the international market.

However, Ocean never dubbed the season 3.

And yeah, Brian Drummond's Vegeta and Scott McNeil's Piccolo is so much better than Chris Sabat. However, Kirby Morrow sucked as Goku. Kelanis was better.

**Super_Goku64** · 10-10-2005, 11:48 AM

Originally Posted by Dark Fact

For the sake of argument, I tried giving the Ocean Group a chance when they reprised their roles again for the Cell Games to the end of the Buu saga. However, the actors are now nothing more than a shadow of their former selves. Brian Drummond and Scott McNeil don't have that same "oomph" that they utilized in the first two seasons. The supporting characters that the FUNimation cast played out in later seasons were pretty damn good. When the airings went back to the Ocean group, they sounded horrible. Scott McNeil sounded way too constipated as Android 16 and for some strange reason, had to resort to his Dinobot voice for Dabura. Babidi just sounded the same as Krillin and Ian Corlett never bothered being Goku again.

Ocean have kept character development in mind. Back in the Saiyan Saga, Vegeta was pure evil, thus needed a sinister, raspy voice. Piccolo was also evil, but he changed during the Freeza saga.

In the Android - Kid Buu sagas, it would've been innappropriate for Drummond and McNeil to have the same style they did in the first 2 sagas. They both have the same voice in the later sagas, just a slightly altered style which fit the respective characters really well. Sabat's voices are crap, plain and simple.

**Crazy Pineapple** · 10-10-2005, 06:44 PM

Originally Posted by Marzak Ahmed

Brian Drummond's Vegeta and Scott McNeil's Piccolo> Chris Sabat's versions

True, but you have to admit that Sabat has gotten better. You tell most anyone that the same guy voices both Piccolo and Vegeta and they won't believe you. Being able to keep two distinctive voices for major characters that interact with one another on a constant basis as well as voicing other characters that they interact with is talent no matter what Chris Psaros and company want you to think.

Originally Posted by Super_Goku64

Ocean's Animation is far superior to Funi as well, probably cos they digitally remaster their episodes.

Uh, the Ocean dubs use essentially the exact same video that FUNimation uses. The only differences are the time cuts and the closing credits. The episode title cards are the exact same. If the video is better it might be because DBZ airs here on CN which is a cable network while it airs over there on Sky which is sattelite. Ocean didn't digitally remaster anything. How exactly did you come to the assumption that the Ocean video is better than FUNimation's anyway?

Keep in mind DBGT and Dragon Ball do not apply to this as they use the French video since Blue Water is in Calgary where masters of an existing French dub likely reside. The video quality of Dragon Ball is actually worse because of the poor history of the French masters. Long ago when a company in France liscensed Dragon Ball they were sent the masters by Toei which were converted from NTSC to PAL. A French Canadian company imported this dub for air in Canada. They had to transfer the French masters back to NTSC (using the original toei ntsc masters would require more time and money for editing) in order to air them. This was all done at a time when the conversions between the two formats weren't as easy and flawless as it can be today. Thus there are artifacts of the conversions in the video. I remember back when the episodes of Dragon Ball premiered on YTV people has screencaps posted which showed atrociously poor video quality. Especially in comparison to FUNimation's release of Dragon Ball which had excellent video quality.

Originally Posted by Prowlus

Who watched the DBZ Movie today "SUPER BATTLE OF THE GREAT SUPER WARRIORS"? God the bridge dubs must DIE!!!

"Trunk" 's voice sounds like hes been castrated "Veg-eter" is even worse and poor "Big Green"

You do have to remember that these dubs were supposedly done by the Dutch and more specifically non native English speakers. I'm sure if most voice actors tried to dub their roles into spanish yoiu'd have to cut them some slack as far as performances go so they could sound natural. Though these dubs aren't that bad because we already have an essentially unedited dub available from FUNi over here in NA and if that doesn't float your boat listen the Japanese. The Bridge dubs do serve a good purpose of giving us all a good laugh. Speaking of which could somebody tape the new Bridge dubs airing over there of the movies and send them to me. I'd like to get a good laugh at them.

Originally Posted by chris3116

Ocean did make season 4.

Ocean did do Season 4, but the never did season 3. I remember a petition a while back to have them dub season 3.

Originally Posted by chris3116

Kelanis was Goku in season 2 too.

Kelamis was indeed in season 2. He took over for Ian Corlett at episode 38.

Originally Posted by chris3116

Kirby Morrow takes the role of Goku when Goku and Gohan finished their training on the hyperbolic time chamber.

Yeah, I believe so. Supposedly Jillian Michaels (Shippo in Inuyasha) also replaced Gohan at some point. Kelamis was because I think he left the industry. Saffron Henderson quit as Gohan likely because the pay was simply too low to justify sacrificing the time to record as it would have been better utilized to record other stuff. It's been known that executive producer Ken Morrison paid the Ocean actors starting from season 4. However, he paid them the bare legal minimum. This is probably why there was such a low number of actors involved there.

Originally Posted by Super_Goku64

In the Android - Kid Buu sagas, it would've been innappropriate for Drummond and McNeil to have the same style they did in the first 2 sagas. They both have the same voice in the later sagas, just a slightly altered style which fit the respective characters really well. Sabat's voices are crap, plain and simple.

I don't really think so. I guarantee you had FUNimation not had DBZ resume dubbing in Ft. Worth and instead continued with Ocean til the end (as well as dubbing DB and GT there too) people would have still been satisfied with Sabat's work on Fruits Basket and Blue Gender not to mention his future work. One of the only reasons Sabat is so hated is because people like Drummond's performance so much and didn't want to hear anyone else do it.

**Super_Goku64** · 10-11-2005, 12:02 PM

Originally Posted by Brent Long

Uh, the Ocean dubs use essentially the exact same video that FUNimation uses. The only differences are the time cuts and the closing credits. The episode title cards are the exact same. If the video is better it might be because DBZ airs here on CN which is a cable network while it airs over there on Sky which is sattelite. Ocean didn't digitally remaster anything. How exactly did you come to the assumption that the Ocean video is better than FUNimation's anyway?

It is, the difference was instantly noticable when the first Ocean Episode: Goku's Special Technique aired in UK. Don't believe me? Take a look at this link: http://web.archive.org/web/200212081...3summary.shtml

3rd paragraph under general has this statement: Another thing I noticed was that the video quality improved drastically between ‘Mystery Revealed’ and ‘Goku’s Special Technique’. I was not sure why exactly, but it seemed like this dub had made the picture clearer and with a sharper colour, which greatly surprised me.

Keep in mind DBGT and Dragon Ball do not apply to this as they use the French video since Blue Water is in Calgary where masters of an existing French dub likely reside. The video quality of Dragon Ball is actually worse because of the poor history of the French masters. Long ago when a company in France liscensed Dragon Ball they were sent the masters by Toei which were converted from NTSC to PAL. A French Canadian company imported this dub for air in Canada. They had to transfer the French masters back to NTSC (using the original toei ntsc masters would require more time and money for editing) in order to air them. This was all done at a time when the conversions between the two formats weren't as easy and flawless as it can be today. Thus there are artifacts of the conversions in the video. I remember back when the episodes of Dragon Ball premiered on YTV people has screencaps posted which showed atrociously poor video quality. Especially in comparison to FUNimation's release of Dragon Ball which had excellent video quality.

Well I cant speak for YTV's NTSC Dragon Ball, but the PAL Dragon Ball by Blue Water looks very good considering its age, probably better than Funi's but since we never got Funi's DB I cant say with as much assurance as I can for DBZ.

Ocean did do Season 4, but the never did season 3. I remember a petition a while back to have them dub season 3.

Which saga are you referring to when you say Season 4?

Yeah, I believe so. Supposedly Jillian Michaels (Shippo in Inuyasha) also replaced Gohan at some point. Kelamis was because I think he left the industry. Saffron Henderson quit as Gohan likely because the pay was simply too low to justify sacrificing the time to record as it would have been better utilized to record other stuff. It's been known that executive producer Ken Morrison paid the Ocean actors starting from season 4. However, he paid them the bare legal minimum. This is probably why there was such a low number of actors involved there.

That bloody Ken Morrison should've considered the Ocean Actor's needs, at least then they would've dubbed DBGT and DB. Not saying Blue Water are bad, in fact they're very good, but Ocean are better.

I don't really think so. I guarantee you had FUNimation not had DBZ resume dubbing in Ft. Worth and instead continued with Ocean til the end (as well as dubbing DB and GT there too) people would have still been satisfied with Sabat's work on Fruits Basket and Blue Gender not to mention his future work. One of the only reasons Sabat is so hated is because people like Drummond's performance so much and didn't want to hear anyone else do it.

Never heard Sabat's work outside of DBZ as of yet. Even if Funi continued using the Ocean Cast, Vegeta and Piccolo would've sounded as they do in the Westwood dub, because of their change of heart.

**Mike JD Silva** · 10-11-2005, 02:18 PM

I'm thinking that someone did meddle with their video, whichever type they got. Going over what I have the Super Saiyan 3 clip scene had some fade in/outs as well that weren't there before.

Which saga are you referring to when you say Season 4?

That would be from when Trunks whows up all the way to the to the end of Cell and Trunks return to the future.

Never heard Sabat's work outside of DBZ as of yet. Even if Funi continued using the Ocean Cast, Vegeta and Piccolo would've sounded as they do in the Westwood dub, because of their change of heart.

Yes and no. Voice actors and their performance styles change over time, even how they approch characters. One of the biggest examples of this is Ronin Warriors, another Ocean show. It would be 7 years until most of the original voice actors were brought back to reprise their roles for the OAVs. The people were the same, but the performance and how they handled their own characters had a difference, even after they had time to relearn their characters. It was the same of DBZ, as they had 2-3 years where they were doing other things and even Scott McNeil at a Transformers convention admitted that he forgot how he voiced Piccolo. Hearing Scott as Piccolo again it was obvious in hearing the difference, as there was more of his Wolverine creeping into his performance.

As for Sabat, he has come a very long way. Even in the redub this has been noticable.

**Dark Fact** · 10-11-2005, 02:42 PM

Originally Posted by SuperGoku64

Ocean have kept character development in mind. Back in the Saiyan Saga, Vegeta was pure evil, thus needed a sinister, raspy voice. Piccolo was also evil, but he changed during the Freeza saga.

In the Android - Kid Buu sagas, it would've been innappropriate for Drummond and McNeil to have the same style they did in the first 2 sagas. They both have the same voice in the later sagas, just a slightly altered style which fit the respective characters really well. Sabat's voices are crap, plain and simple.

Sorry, but I just can't connect with Drummond and McNeil anymore after their long hiatus from the franchise. Besides, the newer voices of the series which weren't previously introduced in the Ocean dub like the Androids and Trunks in the FUNimation version were played out very well. When the dub went back to Ocean, the voices just weren't as good as the FUNimation version. For this change, you gain what you had back but you lose more in the process.

**Super_Goku64** · 10-12-2005, 09:41 AM

Originally Posted by Mike JD Silva

That would be from when Trunks whows up all the way to the to the end of Cell and Trunks return to the future.

If Season 3 is the Freeza saga, Seasson 4 should be the Garlic Jr saga (yes it wasnt in the Manga, but the Manga didnt have "Seasons") Ocean didnt dub the Galic Jr saga, they started with the episode Goku's Speical Technique, the first episode of the Android saga, they didnt dub the Trunks saga either.

Yes and no. Voice actors and their performance styles change over time, even how they approch characters. One of the biggest examples of this is Ronin Warriors, another Ocean show. It would be 7 years until most of the original voice actors were brought back to reprise their roles for the OAVs. The people were the same, but the performance and how they handled their own characters had a difference, even after they had time to relearn their characters. It was the same of DBZ, as they had 2-3 years where they were doing other things and even Scott McNeil at a Transformers convention admitted that he forgot how he voiced Piccolo. Hearing Scott as Piccolo again it was obvious in hearing the difference, as there was more of his Wolverine creeping into his performance.

Nontheless, it wouldnt take long for Actors to remeber how they did the roles aftyer being shown some tapes of their previous work and a little practice. Point is, it would be innapropriate for Vegeta and Piccolo to sound as sinister and evil as they did in the Saiyan saga.

Saffron Henderson's Gohan sounded exactly like the Saiyan and Namek saga voice in the Android-Cell sagas. The same can be said for Yamcha and Tien.

Sorry, but I just can't connect with Drummond and McNeil anymore after their long hiatus from the franchise. Besides, the newer voices of the series which weren't previously introduced in the Ocean dub like the Androids and Trunks in the FUNimation version were played out very well. When the dub went back to Ocean, the voices just weren't as good as the FUNimation version. For this change, you gain what you had back but you lose more in the process.

Most of the people in UK prefer Ocean. Even the UK sites, UKdb.net, UKdragonball, DBZ- UK and Ocean-db preferred Ocean, a lot by far. I still remember thinking that the voices were drastically improved the first time Goku's Special Technique aired, and I didnt even know who voiced what or which company was responsible for voices back then. All I knew was that the new voices had so much more emotion and sounded so much better, after a few lines I recognised them from the Saiyan Saga.

As for Sabat, he has come a very long way. Even in the redub this has been noticable.

I've seen the redub, his Piccolo isnt improved, havent heard his Vegeta but from the people who have, they say he makes Vegeta sound too old. And of course I really doubt he can compare to Drummond.

**Dark Fact** · 10-14-2005, 03:33 PM

Originally Posted by Super_Goku64

Most of the people in UK prefer Ocean. Even the UK sites, UKdb.net, UKdragonball, DBZ- UK and Ocean-db preferred Ocean, a lot by far. I still remember thinking that the voices were drastically improved the first time Goku's Special Technique aired, and I didnt even know who voiced what or which company was responsible for voices back then. All I knew was that the new voices had so much more emotion and sounded so much better, after a few lines I recognised them from the Saiyan Saga.

The opinions of the UK don't always reflect the opinions of Canada.