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Why no Season Three for Spectacular Spider-Man

Discussion in 'The Marvel Animation Forum' started by GL Zeeguy, Dec 22, 2011.

  1. GL Zeeguy

    GL Zeeguy Member

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    This isn't really a discussion thread, but I guess we could make it one if we want, but its more so just something I've always wondered. So...why was Spectacular Spider-Man cancelled? I LOVED that show. It was honestly the best Spider-Man series ever, WAY better than the 90s series. It had a fresh and interesting take on the character and his villains that I hadn't seen in a long time. And Josh Keaton was perfect in the role of Spidey.

    They had planned a third season, but for some reason, it was cancelled before production could begin. That really annoys me cuz it feels like it was left unfinished. They never resolved the Peter/Gwen relationship. And although, I was never a fan of Peter/Gwen pairing, I still wanted it to run its course. But, I would have eventually wanted it to follow the comics and have Mary Jane become his primary love interest. Well, without Gwen dying, that is, lol. I would also have liked to have seen so many more of Spidey's villains come into the series, like Hydro-Man, Scorpion, Swarm, Vermin, and, of course, Jackal. They did after all introduce Miles Warren, but he never realized his fully villainous potential.

    I guess it was for the best. If Spectacular Spider-Man wasn't cancelled, then we wouldn't have gotten Young Justice, which is just as good, if not better. But I still miss it. And Greg Weisman could have multitasked. At least, that's what I think. Anyway, what do you guys think? Did you want a third season out of Spectacular? And more importantly, why was it cancelled in the first place???
     
  2. Aldrius

    Aldrius Arrogant Instigator

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    As far as I understand it: Rights issues. In order to get more time with the movie license, Sony gave up the television rights to spider-man to Marvel.

    Unfortunately, while Spider-man's television rights were now the property of marvel once again, SPECTACULAR spider-man and all related art and such belonged to Sony still. Therefore it was impossible for either Marvel or Sony to make anymore spectacular spider-man. Plus I think Marvel just wanted to make it's own show, without having to deal with continuity/assets from Spectacular.
     
  3. W.C.Reaf

    W.C.Reaf Active Member

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    That's pretty much the short version of it.

    It's all corporate politics that got the show cancelled.
     
  4. Dragnatek

    Dragnatek Well-Known Member

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    Bad Timing

    I blame it simply on bad timing Spectacular Spider-man probably suffered from the worst timing of any show ever, you might even say it suffered the "Parker Luck" but that would be dumb.

    Anyways the show ending up on Kids WB six months (or was it three) before the block died was the first problem. This was really the start of the show having no perminate home in america until it was too late. No one knew where the show was going to end up for a while while season two was already airing everywere else in the world. The second season was completed and most of the crew had moved on to new things before the show even had a new home on Disney XD.

    The Disney buy out of Marvel did not make things better since one thing Disney wanted to go was to take everying over unify the animated shows in house and stuff like that. For them making a new Spider-man series was probably easier then continuing Spectacular Spider-man, and honestly that was probably for the best. I mean what if Disney continued Spiectaular Spider-man but did not bring back most of the original crew. The end result could have been like Goliath Chronically

    So really I blame bad timing and bad luck for why Spectacular Spider-man ended so soon, ended before it's time.

    But ah I guess the stuff with Sony had a lot to do with it to if not more.
     
  5. Capt. Speedbump

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    I would have liked to see the show reach 65 episodes, which is what the creators had intended to do.

    But yes, the cancellation had nothing to do with ratings, or opinions of the show, or decisions by the creators (after Greg Weisman finished work on episode 26, no one ever contacted him again, even to say the show was cancelled). If anything, the decision was forced by people who had no stake or opinion about the show itself.

    It's also like Wolverine and the X-Men: cancelled after 26 episodes for reasons way outside the reach of the creators or fans.

    Hmmmm.... the more I think about it, the more I realize that I really should be grateful Avengers: Earths Mightiest Heroes will have another 26 episodes, but that's a topic for another forum.

    So yes, Spectacular Spider-Man was robbed. But, as you said, at least Young Justice seems to be thriving.
     
  6. Venom Melendez

    Venom Melendez Active Member

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    Google search is your friend, slick. The answer to that is easy to find.

    But Basically,it was a Sony produced show and Sony lost the tv rights for Spider-Man related media. Mainly because Sony wanted to keep the movie rights.

    And it's been 2 or 3 years now, let it go bro.

    Besides, all of those last Kids WB show didn't survive Kids WB ending. Except for Johnny Test anyway.
     
  7. Pepperidge

    Pepperidge Active Member

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    On the contrary, I'm quite disappointed with how subdued the show's fanbase has been as time has gone on. I mean, it's still massively popular, and there are a couple of lame "season 3" petitions floating around, but you don't see an incredible amount of resilience or community participation. It logically should have the same kind of following that X-Men Evolution had, but it just didn't come together that way for some reason.

    Conversely, if Young Justice were to meet the same fate TSSM did, all of tumblr would be up in arms. I guess TSSM just doesn't have the same kind of ship-tease potential that you need to drive an active fandom these days. Or hell, maybe it really all did just come down to the character designs in the end.
     
  8. Venom Melendez

    Venom Melendez Active Member

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    Why?

    They've moved on. Tv shows get cancelled all the time and most people probably have more important things in their life to worry about. Bills to pay, mouths to feed, etc.

    It's sad when a good show ends, but at a certain point you remember that it's not the end of the world and move on to something else.
     
  9. Pepperidge

    Pepperidge Active Member

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    There's more to an active fanbase than simply demanding that your favourite show be brought back. If fan participation is cut off and everyone just writes the show off as an aborted project, how is it going to leave a legacy of any kind? That's the type of organized fan response Spectacular is continuing to lack, and at the current rate I fear that in a few years it will be nothing more than an obscure might-have-been remembered only by a handful of people.

    That's certainly what Marvel and DXD are banking on with Ultimate. Even if the show winds up being a mess, they're going to ensure that it overshadows TSSM both currently and historically through sheer overexposure alone.
     
  10. macattack

    macattack I see you!
    Staff Member Reporter

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    I have the feeling that Spectacular Spider-Man will become the modern-day equivalent to the 1981 Spider-Man solo series, overshadowed by a campier and far more exposed interpretation of the web-slinger released right on its heels. Spider-Man and His Amazing Friends has far eclipsed its fellow 80's toon in popularity and Disney will make sure that USM does the same thing.

    I love Spectacular but that truly seems to be its fate.
     
  11. Kumori MC

    Kumori MC Member

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    A short input of mine regarding the subject.

    I, for one, did not like Spectacular Spider-man. Granted, it had Weisman and a cast & crew that shined in nearly everything they did, it's the designs that drew me away.

    Despite all that, I disagree that it will become "a forgotten would-have-been-great project, an aborted series" or whatever else was posted. The fanbase behind it is humongous and ever-growing, much like it is regarding Gargoyles, EVEN AFTER the Goliath Chronicles [my apologies for the caps lock].

    And I also disagree with the TSSM/USM - '81 Spidey/SMAF analogy. Ultimate Spidey is yet to be aired, ergo it is pointless to assume that it will play the aforementioned role of the overshadower.

    To finish this off, TSSM got cancelled. It's a fate lots of shows go through. Arrested Development and Firefly are perfect examples of this. Oh, and Clone High, of course. A true fan petitions for a comeback, yes. But a true fan also appreciates the show regardless of length or promotion.

    More to come soon.
     
  12. GL Zeeguy

    GL Zeeguy Member

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    eh, I know. I was just re-watching a few episodes recently and found myself asking the question. Actually, I didn't discover the show until a while AFTER it was cancelled. Like, a really long time, as in only a few months ago. I found a few episodes completely by accident and I really liked it. So, I just wondered why it was cancelled.
     
  13. W.C.Reaf

    W.C.Reaf Active Member

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    Generally I've found the fanbase rather vocal in their support in the show, it even got #2 of IGN's "Top 25 Comic TV Series" list right behind BTAS, but they're not very active. I haven't found much fan art around, especially compared to other fandom's, and the animosity with the 90s fans certainly didn't help.

    I think the art style is what kept some people away. If the show had more detailed art and the same level of animation we might've seen a more active fanbase. I like the artsyle and don't see what's wrong with it other than a few design quirks, but every style has it's own quirks.

    I think it's a bit premature to say what's going to happen with USM. Marvel and DXD are probably hoping to have it overshadow the critical acclaim of SSM, but that doesn't mean it'll happen. We'll see what happens.
     
  14. M.O.D.O.K.

    M.O.D.O.K. Scientist Supreme
    Staff Member Moderator

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    That's what I'm suspecting is happening. After all, doesn't anyone else find it suspicious that SSM is the ONLY Spidey show that Disney has the rights to, but hasn't been rerun at all since premiering the final episode?
     
  15. W.C.Reaf

    W.C.Reaf Active Member

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    From what I understand Disney XD's schedule for SSM was weird when they first got the airing rights to it anyway. They decided to air reruns of season 1 on a weekly basis instead of airing season 2 right away or going through season 1 in two weeks then putting out season 2. Then they aired season 2 on and off so no one knew when new episodes were going to air. And let’s not forget them fudging the final episode by somehow airing it without dialogue for most of it. That's quite an achievement since I'm fairly sure that shouldn't have been possible.

    SSM just has some of the worst TV scheduling luck.
     
  16. Sketch

    Sketch not like those other old guys

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    This thread is like salt in the wound.

    Disney wont even reair the show late nights on DXD like the other Marvel series.

    What kind of world do we live in when Spider-Man Unlimited which didn't even have a proper season conclusion much less a series conclusion and less than 26 episodes gets rerun constantly and Spectacular Spider-Man with a neat little package of 26 episodes that at least had a semi-conclusion doesn't get re-aired at all and half the series still isn't on Netflix IIRC but all the entirety of the other Spider-Man series that are on Netflix are as complete as they'll ever be.

    I'm glad it at least got DVDs and that I happen to own those DVDs but man, Spectacular Spider-Man deserves better than to be shoved under the rug like this. Especially since Ultimate keeps getting delayed and when it shows up I'm sure they'll have no qualms with airing their usual trio of Spider-Man series late nights on DXD while Ultimate gets the daytime slots.

    At least give it a few more runs before Ultimate finally airs. That's not that much to ask for people who don't have the DVDs.

    Spectacular Spider-Man was victim to a series of unfortunate events and ultimately was shelved so Disney could produce their own Spider-Man cartoon. Really it just sucks but the show just couldn't catch a break.
     
  17. DonkeyKongSong

    DonkeyKongSong Active Member

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    Don't forget Magi-Nation. That got a second season on the This TV network and Netflix.

    Anyway, I'm surprised and disappointed that it's not airing latenights on XD like the '90s Spider-Man as well as His Amazing Friends.
     
  18. ToonEGuy

    ToonEGuy Member

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    I personally don't mind if there isn't any more Spectacular Spider-Man. I could never really get into it since, as someone else mentioned, I didn't care too much for the art style. And that's very hard for me to say knowing that this came from the guy who created Gargoyles, which is still something that's difficult to believe when the former show is so obviously better looking and the difference in how the two look is so night & day to me. Ultimate Spider-Man is looking to be more like something I would watch, so Spectacular Spider-Man probably could have grabbed my interest better if it had that same amount of effort and Venom didn't seem so ridiculously simplistic looking.

    And I'll admit, I'm probably only saying that I don't mind if the show is gone cause I was never that into it from the start. I would occasionally see "peeks" of it on Disney XD, but I guess I must have been too busy watching 90's Spider-Man and wishing that I had Toon Disney back.
     
  19. W.C.Reaf

    W.C.Reaf Active Member

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    Greg Weisman is a writer not an artist. He did not create the designs for either show and only really had a hand in approve the style and designs for the shows.

    Furthermore Gargoyles had a larger budget than SSM and what they wanted to do with SSM, animation wise, was a lot different than what they did with Gargoyles. Greg Weisman and Vic Cook decided that for SSM they really wanted to showcase Spidey's agility, that he would be jumping all over the place essentially, and in order to do that with the budget they had to get a really simplified and stylised art style. The animation in SSM is very fluid and does what they set out to do.

    Gargoyles and SSM both used design principles from Bruce Timm's Batman TAS. Simplified designs equals better animation.

    Effort had nothing to with it. A tremendous amount of effort was put into the animation to make it as smooth and as lively as possible. The fight scenes were amazing, Spidey doing anything looked stunning. None of the animation I've seen so far from USM looks half as good as SSMs animation (imo). The designs for USM look nice but there hasn't been enough footage released for me to think the animation is going to be better than SSM.

    I'm also not sure why you singled out Venom when he looked like Venom normally does and no different or didn't have more simplistic design than anyone else.
     
  20. ToonEGuy

    ToonEGuy Member

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    I've heard that reasoning before, and as important as fluid animation is for me to have in cartoons, I can't help it if I think that being too overly-simplistic in the designs is the sort of thing that's been taking the quality out of cartoons, and cheapening the budget of shows more and more seems to be one of the reasons for it. So in that sense, I guess it's not Greg's fault if his show looks the way it does. He was just being held back.

    Funny thing is, if it had been Bruce Timm who made this show and it was done in his style, I probably would have been won over in a heartbeat. You could say that Bruce's style is simplistic, but to me there's something special about his particular art style where no matter which of the DCAU shows he's done, the designs always seem to grab me and feel appealing to watch. His style is very unique and has that certain quality and skill to it that I really like. For some reason watching Spectacular Spider-Man just felt like the wrong kind of simplicity.

    And having that kind of effort in that area is very much appreciated, but for me if a cartoon doesn't look appealing then you're not going to enjoy watching it as much and will have a hard time wanting to come back to it (and I do believe there's such a thing as making things too simplistic to be appealing). And when I was watching the footage of Ultimate, my response was kind of different: I felt like the designs were good and they moved good. It was like having what the 90's cartoon lacked and what Spectacular lacked rolled into one (the best of both worlds).

    Spectacular's version of Venom looked like he came from those kiddy-styled toylines of the Marvel heroes you see in the stores to be honest.
     

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