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"The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes" News & Discussion Thread, Part 3 (Spoilers)

Discussion in 'The Marvel Animation Forum' started by James Harvey, Jan 15, 2011.

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  1. AlgeaX

    AlgeaX Oh, hello?

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    Love the new Iron Man and Coipel style Thor, but I got to say I'm not feeling Ultimate style Cap. Steve looks naked with no wings on his head.
     
  2. Eivion

    Eivion Member

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    I like the new designs for Stark and Thor. Not a fan of Cap's though.
     
  3. jph139

    jph139 Immortal

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    Yeah, I'm not a big fan of the modern wingless Cap. Otherwise, no objections to the character designs; no big issue either way. I like that they're switching things up a bit, though; it's nice to give the main players a bit of an aesthetic shakeup instead of letting them stagnate for 52 episodes.
     
  4. Medinnus

    Medinnus Moderator
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    "Yeah, mah bruthahs, dere is a reason dey call the man Winghead, you know what I'ze saying? You picking up what I'ze puttin' down?"
     
  5. TheVileOne

    TheVileOne Peace Loving Shinobi
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    Don't know that reference.

    Cap's costume -- I HATE IT HATE IT HATE! :mad::mad::mad:

    Burn it and toss the ashes into a volcano!

    You can't improve on perfection which is what Cap's costume already was. I like that when he was unthawed he still basically had the same costume from WWII just with tweaked gloves and boots (in the animation).

    At least they didn't go with Ultimate Iron Man's design. Still believe that's one of the ugliest Iron Man armor designs ever. What I don't get is why go with modern 616 looks for Iron Man and Thor (including the movies) but in the animation go with the Ultimate design for Cap?
     
  6. JLU Dude

    JLU Dude Active Member

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    The answer is right in your own question: the movies. The Cap movie is using a look similar to Ultimate Cap.
     
  7. TheVileOne

    TheVileOne Peace Loving Shinobi
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    But with the Iron Man and Thor movies costumes were based off modern 616 takes, NOT ultimate.
     
  8. Rick Jones

    Rick Jones Hero Fan
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    Personally, I'll take the Ultimate look over Bucky's shiny and black suit, which might have been the next likely candidate as an update. I generally don't like most Ultimate Avenger redesigns but Cap's are all right by me. I think it looks nice next to these other redesigns.
     
  9. Taskmaster

    Taskmaster Member

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    The list goes on and on but aside of that obvious Ultron debacle "Gamma World" didn't do Cap any favors in several ways. AND of course it's 2 parts so that's DOUBLE the screw for Cap like Ultron.

    First you have that preposterous opening where UNenhanced human Hawkeye suddenly has Quicksilver's speed where a MAXIMUM human potential speed and agility Cap somehow needs a fricken cycle to keep up with him. Chris Yost (the writer) even rubs it in and has Cap go "This Jokers fast I'll give him that!". This implys that Hawkeye is now faster than Cap AND Black Panther which any novice knows couldn't be further from the truth. So is it HAWKEYE that has the super soldier serum or Cap in this continuity? To a Cap zealot this is just as bad as getting knocked out/down.

    Then in "Gamma World" has Cap has his usual stand around and shield around with almost no significant moments other than some tedious shield pivots/rams. His big banner moment (no pun intended) was saying "Leaders LEAD" to Tony being a wuss. Other than that he's turned into an irrelevant Gamma-beast (and a sloppy Gamma-beast at that) for the rest of the saga with no impact whatsoever. So in TWO separate 2 parters he's completely obsolete.

    "Panther's Quest" is no consolation either and a very derivative (see FF seas2 "Prey of the Black Panther" and ULT AVENGERS2) uneven as well as disappointing ep to me overall and Cap wise. SHOULD have been a kinetic showcase for him, INSTEAD was this badly edited, written, animated and choreographed BP lovefest. The only redeeming was it IMPLIED (of course we don't actually see it because that would be giving Cap an actual extended action sequence) Cap could keep up with T'Challa in HIS domain when he drops in rt behind him in Wakanda deep jungle to taking Tony's orders SO serious he's willing to fight BP one on one to follow them.

    Another love/hate scene was the 2 fighting the Wakandan Guard The Dora Milaje broads guards where Cap saves BP from getting stabbed in the face BUT is somehow knocked 15 feet back WITH an unbreakable shield by a 105 lb girl. THEN of course the remaining fight (because it's Cap) is completely OFF-screen with no closure whatsoever except of course for BP kinetic battle with Man-Ape which SUPER extended.

    Even the opening where the whole team fights T'Challa. All Cap does is ram BP then hesitate and throw his shield at the guy he "owes his life to" right at his head and now he suddenly has no problem deCapitating BP. BP ducks and stage-frightened Cap just stares in amazement like a rank amateur without following the shield up with hand to hand as he usually does. Cheated out of what could have been an epic Cap vs BP one on one (and WHO among us wouldn't want that?). Because seemingly the writers room rule on this show is "CAP GETS KNOCKED OUT AND DOES NOT GET EXTENDED ACTION SCENES (see "Widow's Sting")!"

    You brought up that slop fight choreography against Zemo in "Living Legend" and a lot of nothing but flat footed shield pivot knockdowns and melodrama in "Kang Saga" but I can go on and on. And I will but let me let this post marinate because I have to run for a bit as I still have to respond to other sharp and observant posters on here.


    With you brother, more naked than Mr. Skin!!! I cannot stand the way everyone (writers, fans) have just let Marvel crowbar and brainwash them with this overrated ULTIMATE slop on everything. It's infiltrated 616 too much and now I'm fuming.

    And now we're supposed to believe Cap's trademark "Wing-head" is somehow impractical and corny??? Nope....HELL NO....not buying it, I think it's the coolest trademark mask in comics and I'll go to grave not cow-towing to ULTIMATES! Somehow Flash's wings (same motiff as Cap) fine, Batman's fine, Hawkman's fine, Ant-man's fine, Hawkeye's fine, Thor's fine, Black Bolt's fine, Yellow Jacket fine but CAP'S......omigod we have to alter it it'll make him "cool".

    Cap's ALWAYS been super cool Marvel you just never knew how to promote him. Don't blame the wings it's your inept executives that need to be clipped. I actually would rather Steve just go to Steve Rogers Super Soldier NO MASK motiff than resort to this ULTIMATE ultimatum from Marvel's Films. And really Steve Rogers is actually the LEAST uptight about his identity anyway in comics so in my book NO MASK really is vastly superior to the UA mask.

    Mod Note: Inappropriate content edited
     
    #469 Taskmaster, Apr 20, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 20, 2011
  10. Wonderwall

    Wonderwall Moderator
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    I disagree, I love his look on the show. It's actually why I'm a little worried they'll mess around with it too much but I was thinking they might give him the cape too.
     
  11. Monte

    Monte Active Member

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    You brought up a grand total of 4 episodes out of 26... yeah Capt geting screwed over in four episodes out 26 in a show that's not about him but about the whole team its nothing to raise a fit about... i mean really maybe we should look at the treatment that wasp has been getting; how many times does she get KO'd and how many times does her stingers do little more than annoy enemies. honestly now that's something that seems worth complaining about when it comes to superhero treatment; honestly i really do feel like she's the one who is in most need of some real power up to keep up with the others

    Yes Capt got turned into a mindless gamma beast and did not do anything all that spectacular... The same can be pretty much be said for EVERYONE except Thor, Hawkeye, and Hulk.

    So you complaign about Capt getting knocked back but not BP nearly being killed by no named guards? Honestly if they can nearly kill BP then i think that speaks more about their skill and ability, than Cap's strength... and omg Capt didn't get an epic battle against Black Panther, during the same scene where BP made the EVERYONE else in that fight look like amateurs; god forbid we mention how badly everyone else was treated in the same fight. Heh, atleast Capt got to be in that episode unlike Thor and Hulk



    One thing you seem to forget is the simple fact that this is "AVENGERS: ehm" not "CAPTAIN AMERICA and the avengers". This is an avengers show first and foremost, which means that the spotlight is shared evenly amongst the team and that can even mean loosing some spotlight for the sake of the other heroes.

    Every episode you mentioned above were NOT about captain america and have their focus on other particular characters. Gamma world was an episode was mostly for Hawkeye and Hulk; this was the ep for Hawkeye to join the team, and Hulk to rejoin. And Thor got to be thrown in aswell to mix things up some more... Panther's quest, was about Black Panther first and foremost; its obvious that we are gonna focus more on the fight between him and manape as oppose to a fight against extras; though they also put in a subplot with vibranium that the others had to deal with.

    Hell another thing, you point out how unfair it was for BP to one up Capt when he was fighting the whole team, And you complain about Hawkeye outrunning capt the rest of the team, but you find nothing wrong with Capt basically taking on the avengers team when he first broke out of the ice? Ya seems like writers just wanted to take a moment to make them all look good by making them take on the whole team... frankly if they didn't get moments like that some viewers might think they were weak compared to heroes like Hulk, Thor, and Ironman.

    This happens with ALL of the avengers... In the battle against Kang, BP was sent off to fight off screen in wakanada for 2 epsiodes. Thor in the mean time was KO'd for the entire last ep of that 3 parter. In "window's sting", except for a cameo from iron man the whole team goes unseen for Hawkeye, Capt, and BP. Hulk is taken off the team for several eps before coming back. Thor aswell was missing for a few eps here and there. Part of balancing a show that has 8 main characters is pushing some characters aside so that other characters can get more screen time... With each character you can find moments when they fail or have little role in an ep and also eps where they get to shine.
     
    #471 Monte, Apr 20, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 20, 2011
  12. Aquaman OS

    Aquaman OS Member

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    I'd also like to point out Cap puts up a great showing against Kang in the final battle against him, while Antman, and Hawkeye get one shotted by him, and Kang takes down the HULK. And yet you think the show always makes him look bad? Pretty much everyone in the show has had their ups and downs.

    And that's how its always been in Marvel. No one character has been a super unbeatable badass all the time. Even Cap in the comics has had his losses.
     
  13. suss2it

    suss2it Active Member

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    Which is why the show is using their modern 616 versions. Cap's movie's outfit is more Ultimate, hence EMH using that one.

    Nobody is brainwashed. Some people just prefer some Ultimate stuff over 616.
    So what? What's wrong with that? These cartoons could use more diversity. Besides Ultimate Nick Fury is awesome, so I'm glad these cartoons are using him.

    Batman has ears not wings. And IMO Thor's helmet is a lot cooler than Cap's wings. Hawkeye however looks really goofy, and I would prefer his Ultimate look. In regards to Flash, it must be the colour schemes or something because I think the wings look fine on him.

    I agree with you. I think his current Commander Rogers outfit that he's sporting is the best outfit he's had, including the Ultimate version. Plus it makes sense to have America's embodiment of their ideals not wear a mask.
     
  14. AlgeaX

    AlgeaX Oh, hello?

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    Wait, your complaining that T'Challa got more focus then Steve in T'Challa's own intro ep? Who exactly did you think an episode titled Panther's Quest would showcase?

    Again, the whole episode is basically Panther's origin story, so of course there'll be more focus on T'Challa's climactic duel with the man who murdered his father then Cap keeping some of Man Apes minions busy.

    The more I read your comments the more it seems like your real problem is with the show's fight cheoreography in general. It's seems to me you could level similiar arguments against most of the shows cast. "All Hawkeye does is fire exploding arrows at people, all Wasp does is sting", ect, ect.

    I can't judge, fight cheorography isn't something I really notice unless it's really good or really bad. I'm more interested in things like story and characterisation, and on that front I think the show has been very good to Cap

    I don't really think making Nick Fury black is really any bigger a deal then casting Will Smith as Agent Jay*. Changing a comic characters ethinticty for adaptation isn't as radical a concept as some internet dweebs make it out to be. They were doing it as far back as the 60s with Eartha Kitt's Catwoman.

    *Jay was a white blond guy in the original MIB comics from Malibu. Now you know...
     
  15. RoryWilliams

    RoryWilliams Well-Known Member

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    Right, but the movie Cap costume is based off his Ultimate design, because the filmmaker thought Cap's "classic" outfit looked stupid in live action. You sorta just answered your own question.

    It's not really forced. Fury is black in the movies, way more people have seen the movies than have ever read a comic book. It makes sense to make Fury black in the cartoons if that's what people who have seen the movies expect. I'd suspect that it has little to do with "racial harmony" and more to do with the fact that black Nick Fury is now the dominant pop culture image of the character. Nobody knows who the heck Gabe Jones is, while plenty of kids now know who Fury is (albeit Ultimate Fury). So cool it, 'kay? I find all this "NAACP Lovefest" talk to be pandering and a bit disgusting.
     
  16. AlgeaX

    AlgeaX Oh, hello?

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    Yeah, it's probably the same reason this version of Iron Man is basically animated Robert Downey Jnr.
     
  17. Medinnus

    Medinnus Moderator
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    Or perhaps more well-known (as most people - even Marvel fans - didn't know MIB from shinola until the movie), casting Will Smith as Agent James West in the remake of "Wild, Wild, West".

    Did you know Nick Fury is actually a Kenyan Socialist Muslim?

    /flee
     
  18. ShadowStar

    ShadowStar Member

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    I despise the new design for Captain America. :( I hate it.

    Thor's new design doesn't bother me really. I'll have to wait and see how I feel about it as the series unfolds.

    Hulk's new design looks silly with the stretchy pants.

    Iron Man's new design has the blue triangle, which is distracting and an ugly addition to it. :sad:
     
  19. Rick Jones

    Rick Jones Hero Fan
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    Mod Note: Guys, let's try to keep all discussion here on topic and civil without veering into any inappropriate territory.
     
  20. James Harvey

    James Harvey The World's Finest
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    Copied from Marvel Animation Blu-ray/DVD News & Discussion Thread, Part 12 (Spoilers), Marvel Animation Age has a first look at the menu system and package artwork for the forthcoming The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes DVD home video releases from Walt Disney Studios Home Entertainment. Click here or on the image below for more.
    [​IMG]
    Stay tuned for further coverage right here at Marvel Animation Age. Released through Walt Disney Studios Home Entertainment, The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes - Volume One: Heroes Assemble and The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes - Volume Two: Captain America Reborn hit shelves Tuesday, April 26th, 2011.

    Oh, and just to note, Captain America is now featured on the spine for The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes - Volume Two: Captain America Reborn while Thor remains on the spine for The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes - Volume One: Heroes Assemble.
     
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