South Park Season 21 Talkback

Discussion in 'The toonzone - General Animation Discussion' started by Neo Ultra Mike, Sep 13, 2017.

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What Are Your Thoughts On This Season?

  1. ***** Stars

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  3. **** Stars

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  5. *** Stars

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  6. **.5 Stars

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  7. ** Stars

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  8. *.5 Stars

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  9. * Star

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  10. 0 Stars

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  1. Radical

    Radical The Face of Evil & Epicness!!!!!

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    Franchise Prequel was great/enjoyable,

    Jimmy being Fastman like the Flash who's a new member, sweet.
    Cool seeing The Coon and Friends.
    The Coon and the superhero boys wanting Neflix for their franchise was great/funny.
    Cool seeing Professor Chaos(Butters), best silly supervillain, his evil plan using Facebook to bash on the boys was awesome, cool he bees competent/smarter on spreading chaos and is not a chew toy joke anymore:D.
    Poor General Disarray not there, rats.
    Professor Chaos' evil lair was pretty sweet.
    Mark Zuckerberg, my favorite great funny celebrity villain, his dubbed voice gag was funny.
    Heidi's funny little scene, she needed to join them for funny moments.
    Mark the annoyance on the people was so funny, hehehe:p.
    Professor Chaos hiring Mark was great.
    The Coon and friends beating Mark was great/funny.
    Poor Professor Chaos(Butters) and the Russian president being grounded was funny:p.
    The superhero boys' argument over it at the end was funny, hehehehe.
     
  2. fsaenz0125

    fsaenz0125 Active Member

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    Another good Coon plot, even though I didn't liked how Heidi was shoehorned in one scene just to remind you that she exists. Subplot was okay, could've done it without Zuckerberg who just had a weird voice and personality.
     
  3. Neo Ultra Mike

    Neo Ultra Mike Creeping Shadow of "15000"+ Posts

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    "Hummels and Heroin" - You know it's weird but this actually feels more like an old school sort of South Park episode where the focus instead of story of trying to stick it to a particular group or aspect of society is more focused on just the characters getting deeper and deeper into a kind of out there scenario and managing to get out of it. I guess there's a crackdown of the pharmasusitcal industry for not caring about how they properly perscribe their drugs and people unnecessarily overdosing on them or on how old folks home can feel like prison but this feels more like an excuse just for this story to happen then just a take that. Maybe it helps that not only are the boys majorly involved in not just a crazy Cartman scheme but Stan just wanting to help out his Grandfather, or because the introduced character Marcus isn't made to be a bad guy but rather someone hurting looking to take proper vengance. And the threat of McGilliguddy is just one of those sort of old weird threats that makes more sense then say Mark Zuckerberg. The joke with her farts wasn't that funny but having actual menance and threats with how she treats the other elderly in the nursing home was the point more of her scenes and it building to her getting beat up and then given Solitare felt like a worthy conclusion. Plus I do like how the other guys are invested since usually it's sometimes painted as Cartman trying to be the most jerkish for not wanting to get involved but it's clear though they are friends a lot of the time the others have to be more cocered into helping one who gets in over their head. Which has honestly been a thing from the beginning and I like how they only get around to helping due to Cartman having an idea to distract the old people and otherwise wouldn't of gotten involved.

    And there were solid jokes in here to how seriously Marcus was taking the death of Chuck E Cheese, Swiper and Peppa Pig (characters yeah still oddly relevent with at least toddlers I believe), the old folks feeling like prison rap song numbers, Butters causing everyone else to freeze in the middle of their talk and everyone wanting Stan to just rat out his grandfather, Randy admitting he thinks the old folks home is depressing and doesn't want to visit his father in there at all, "Don't worry Peppa, you're with chuck e cheese now", the boys singing my humps and nirvana songs as old time melodies and the old people calling them terrible, Cartman actually complimenting Marvin beating up Mrs McGilliguddy and Marcus appearing at the pharmasuidcal party at the end. So honestly kind of nice old school episode not pushing as much a message but still having a solid enough plot and jokes. These honestly feel more like classic lark SP episodes then we've gotten in the last few years and I appreciate getting stuff like this especially stuff focusing back on Stan and even his grandfather.
     
  4. zoombie

    zoombie Well-Known Member

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    Did not expect a Shimmer and Shine, they are a bigger deal than I thought.
     
  5. Radical

    Radical The Face of Evil & Epicness!!!!!

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    Season 21 episode 5 was pretty sweet/enjoyable,

    Nice seeing Dougie/Kevin.
    Chuck E. Cheese, cool, but the poor Chuck E. Cheese entertainer on drug overdose.
    Marcus's scream was funny though.
    The poor birthday entertainers' stupidities on destroying themselves, happens in real life:ack:.
    Cool seeing Grandpa Marsh, best funny grandpa.
    Beatrice the horrible old lady scumbag, a great funny horrible villainess.
    The poor female Swiper Fox entertainer, but love Swiper Fox though.
    The poor Spider-Man/Shimmer & Shine entertainers, Shimmer & Shine being popular is awesome:D.
    Marcus, the best awesome new hero on stopping the horrible monsters.
    The boys' silence with Butters entering, hahahahahaha.
    The way Butters uses the urinal, so funny, hahahahahaha:p.
    Randy Marsh the piece of crap to not care for his dad, but I enjoy him though.
    The poor Peppa Pig entertainer.
    Terrible/out-of-character of Kyle on not helping poor Stan, but I'm glad that Kyle got crushed the previous seasons.
    The boys being entertainers was funny.
    Stan reasoning with Marcus was great.
    Grandpa Marsh crushing the old scumbags was awesome/satisfying, go Grandpa Marsh:D!!!!
    Marcus to take down the horrible scumbags, go Marcus, best well-deserved ending.
     
  6. Neo Ultra Mike

    Neo Ultra Mike Creeping Shadow of "15000"+ Posts

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    "Sons A Witches" - Okay though I don't think I've hit burn out on the whole Cartman/Heidi relationship as I can at least get some of the jokes from it, this is a clear case of "this is only still a thing because the writers still think it's funny, it's not something that makes sense from a character perspective." Maybe from Heidi's perspective this makes sense because maybe she still doesn't get/doesn't want to believe Eric is a horrible person and still thinks he's good but this doesn't really make sense from Cartman's perspective. I mean let's face it if Cartman honestly really wanted to get rid of someone, he would. I get the sense he either deep down likes his friends or does actually get something being in a relationship from them thus why they aren't like eating their parents ground up as chilli. At this point it's clear Cartman has moved from being disallusioned and annoyed with Heidi to finding her insufferable and... it's honestly hard to tell at points if we're suppose to feel that as well. Since it's made clear to other characters Heidi is terrible at time management and overly getting ready thus at the end but as also said in this episode, if Cartman doesn't like Heidi he should just break up with her. Maybe he still deeps down likes the idea of someone actually caring about him to give that up so can't just break it off I don't know but this is one of those stories that feels like it's running it's course if it's hard to get the character's motivation and honestly these "oh I'm sick of this person I want to get rid of them" works like for an episode story but... again this is a continuing relationship. This shouldn't be a Roadrunner/Coyote set up of Eric constanly trying to get rid of Heidi and failing at it and then still having them as a couple in the next one. We either need to see a different dimension to this like more of Heidi's perspective or something to actually break them up because it just feels forced having them together now and is kind of hurting the episode. Even when the jokes of Cartman being impatient or tricking Heidi into dressing as Gretel or it being pointed out to him to just break off with her are sort of funny it's not really worth them having this sort of story still attached to the series.

    I think partialy the main story of this episode also had the "don't know how seriously we should take this" problem but at least it was it's own story and again fit the tone more of this being a Halloween episode. Yeah for the first time in 5 years SP has a Halloween episode and... honestly not one of the stronger ones. Besides the stuff with Heidi/Cartman, it was hard to understand how serious we were suppose to take the "witch pursuit" that was constantly cast on Randy and the others. Honestly if this was suppose to be more like "Holiday Special" and be a push back against people who were trying to actually PCify Halloween and have kids only celebrate "Trick or Treat Day" and make Halloween more for the "pagans" (yeah that is seriously a thing look it up) that would make sense but... that really isn't the cae. As it seems to be a "we feel we're being misrepresented by this one extreme even though we're more extreme then we want to admit" which feels kind of like a done concept. There were some solid jokes like Kyle calling out his dad and the others to stop this crap or the witch who was possessed being called a d-bag or actually getting to see Garrison Trump Star Wars laser the witch and hang out with the others (yeah if we're seeing him clear the staff is actually fine with using him which they said they would try not to before which... I guess couldn't last the season) and do like the boys actually being the ones to piece together what was happening but felt like one of those episodes that didn't press it's point well enough so came out weaker as a result.

    So yeah one of the lesser Halloween episodes. Not bad but the main plot could of been better structured and again getting sick of what we're seeing with Cartman/Heidi now and hope they do something better with that in the coming weeks.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. jaylop97

    jaylop97 Well-Known Member

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    Cartman and Heidi's relationship continues to be a very dull story, if it wasn't for this in the episode it would have been better. I kind of liked more of the witch material but it really felt way too unnatural for me, sure this show can have its moments with the paranormal or anything out of the ordinary but having a real witch take kids and put them in a bag is really weird, I found it funny when Garrison blew him up.

    Still, Cartman just annoys me at this point that he isn't doing much neither is Heidi they are just way too cliche, I liked Kyle telling of Cartman as well.
     
  8. Radical

    Radical The Face of Evil & Epicness!!!!!

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    Season 21 episode 6 was great/funny,

    Randy's stupid Guys' Night Out, I'll enjoy seeing Gerald get destroyed though.
    The Cartman/Heidi relationship, still enjoyable for me.
    Chip the Evil Witch, my favorite great new minor villain.
    Sharon the best, but poor Sharon.
    Randy Marsh still an unsympathetic piece of trash, but he makes me laugh, hahahahaha:p.
    Butters' great moments.
    Cartman's Evil look was funny/scary, hehehe.
    Cartman wanting to kill Heidi, it's gonna fail, hehehe:p.
    Cartman/Heidi as Hansel & Gretel was funny.
    The boys wanting President Garrison's help on the witch problem.
    President Garrison was great/funny there.
    Stephen's satisfying just desserts, love it.
    Chip's evil plan was great/evil.
    The airplane being called a witch was funny, hahahahahaha.
    President Garrison to kill off Chip was awesome/funny:D.
    Heidi taking awhile was so funny, hahahahaha.
    The Cartman/Heidi relationship will improve/get better though.
     
  9. Whimsical Crank

    Whimsical Crank Sensible to a Slight Degree

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    While I agree something needs to be done about the bolded aspect, I thought it was handled pretty funnily in the latest episode, especially with Cartman's scene at the police station and Heidi being told that she's finally free, yet still holding everything up.

    Honestly, despite a fairly dull first episode, Season 21 has been a HUGE step up from Season 20 so far. The only problem though (as mentioned) is the Cartman/Heidi relationship problems still dragging on. At least Cartman's character hasn't been ruined by this (as the latest episode has shown), but him moaning and groaning whenever Heidi appears has gotten old very fast and only drags the scenes down.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. dumbfoolkid5

    dumbfoolkid5 Active Member

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    Somethings gotta give eventually when it comes to those two.

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. Neo Ultra Mike

    Neo Ultra Mike Creeping Shadow of "15000"+ Posts

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    "Doubling Down" - Hmmm what did I say in the last episode review about the Cartman/Heidi relationship?

    Well even if someone didn't take what I said through specifically seeing it, they took it in spirit. Yes this is an episode whose focus is the Cartman/Heidi relationship but it's actually good because they actually do something different with it, expanding it honestly from both perspectives and actually making it interesting again. Especially since there are manipulation and selfish desire and goals going on from all ends of the spectrum. Obviously from Cartman wanting to keep Heidi around then tricking her into KFC by convicining her it's of the Vegan variety. Now see stuff like this actually makes sense for Cartman's character and actually makes they're relationship make way more sense from his perspective as he's in it not only for some actual emotion but to secretly rip and mess with her in ways he can't with anyone else. In fact in the last episode I was wondering if the Cartman/Heidi relationship from Cartman's perspective at least was suppose to parallel the Cartman/Butters previous relationship of Cartman mentally and emotionally screwing with the nice person in various more and more out there ways. Since sometimes Butters would wind up getting a win or annoyance over Eric but that usually wasn't the case and nowadays Butters has evolved past that kind of character. However Heidi hasn't and stuff like this to me shows more why Cartman "sticks" with her: because of moments pulling out a drum to mock her walking around being supposedly fat that he caused, or convincing her that Kyle's a sneaky jew who was manipulating her. I guess you can also see this as Cartman not wanting to be blamed and pinning things on others to make himself feel better but again I just appreciate this being an episode focused on the two and Cartman just isn't in annoyed "ugh go away" mode as that would get old every episode with them so glad this one showed why he's in this relationship. As well as Heidi and I'm also glad that they did actually connect this back with the last season of Heidi admitting she was in a vulernable state and being with Cartman feel better. And you know unlike most everyone else in the show she was actually getting to him and changing him on a level he wasn't actually fighting against but like so many others just couldn't stick the landing due to events careening out of her control. And trying to believe it's possible he can still be reached even though at this point that obviously isn't the case but not wanting to be told off by others or feel she made the wrong choice. Thus why she went with Cartman at the end? Hmmm you know what would be interesting: what if Heidi now realizing how easy it is not only to shift the blame to other people to make herself feel better, winds up actually in a way becoming a better user and manipulator then Cartman as Eric winds up turning someone to the dark side whose darker then he is. And in a sense creates his own Cartman. That would be interesting to play with if they went down that route. But I am also glad we actually do get something with Kyle as well actually trying to be there for Heidi due to his own feelings (since no one else is going to get involved because well... I guess they realized what's the point in involving yourself with Cartman's issues with all the crap that comes with them) and them actually becoming a couple for awhile. I do kind of wish it was pointed out though that maybe in a sense Kyle also feels guiltfy for what happened to Cartman last season that led him to HIeid due to that being his dad's cheme he didn't tell anyone about and the consequences are still there. Even if he didn't say anything would of made for another interesting level of emotional manipulation and lies smacking on top of one another with these guys.

    Honestly again besides the actual interesting relationship/character stuff there were good laughs. The subplot had some good bits with the quick memberberries reference, acting like the guards are in an abusive relationsihp with Garirsion and one squealing so easily and how easy Garrison turns the polls against him and raping the guy at the end. I still have a feeling Matt and Trey wanted not to do a bunch of trump jokes this season but couldn't help thsmselves and again if the stuff is solid I'm fine with that. There were also good bits with Cartman yelling at his life trying to claim she ruined his life, the girls realizing Kyle is crushing on Heidi, the use of Rihanna's Unfaithful song, Cartman thinking Token's family starts riot, the take on the Pink Elphenats song, "did she just call me a sneaky jew" and Cartman's look to Kyle pointing out he won this conflict of theirs. Again getting some from all parties and doing something different with the relationship then just Cartmnn's annoyment made this one stand out and again if they are building someting to this whole reionathip this is working more then the last episode so more of that less just scheme of the week from Cartman like "Sons of Witches" was.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. Radical

    Radical The Face of Evil & Epicness!!!!!

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    Doubling Down was pretty great/enjoyable,

    The Cartman/Heidi relationship improving begins, sweet.
    Cartman hates/loves Heidi, complicating though.
    Kyle involved with Cartman/Heidi, interesting.
    Heidi to see the good in Cartman was sweet.
    President Garrison and his gross nature, so hilarious, hahahahaha:p.
    Nice seeing the Memberberries, hehehe.
    The guards wanting to take him down, go Matt/Trey with the Donald Trump jokes, hahahahaha.
    The girls on Kyle/Heidi, hehehe.
    Poor Cartman/Heidi broke up.
    The Unfaithful song, sweet.
    Butters' funny moments.
    Cartman on Token's family rioting, hahahahahaha.
    Cartman's dark Kyle fantasy and the Pink Elephants parody, hahahahahaha:lol:.
    A Kyle/Heidi relationship was interesting.
    Heidi owning Kyle was awesome/funny, Kyle will learn to stay out of it.
    Cartman/Heidi together which it'll improve, sweet, Cartman beats Kyle, hehehe, if Heidi bees a manipulator, that would be awesome/interesting:D.
    The guards lost to President Garrison, hehehe.
     
    #32 Radical, Nov 9, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2017 at 11:06 PM
  13. Dudley

    Dudley Moderator
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    Kyle should’ve learned a valuable lesson in staying out of Cartman’s business. He made the situation worse.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  14. jaylop97

    jaylop97 Well-Known Member

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    That was pretty predictable, It was pretty obvious that Heidi was going to leave Cartman only to go back to him, and I really wasn't a fan of the part of how all of the girls were to Heidi, that part was really forced, most of the girls do hate Cartman to no end but seriously the levels they took it with Heidi was also really unfortunate as well.
     
  15. SkanksGetShankedd

    SkanksGetShankedd New Member

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    Well, he has used Cthulhu to banish his friends away in that Coon and friends episode, fully intending that all of them die.
    I truly think Cartman is a sociopath, and that he just doesn't genuinely care about his friends. He's probably only spared them because he still knows he can use them, as tools to further his goals via manipulation.
    Why Kyle isn't dead, is because he finds their rivalry pleasurable (shown by Smug Alert, and how he says he "isn't doing this for Kyle"), sort of like a joker batman dynamic. Since he's a sociopath, he's very prone to boredom and needs a rivalry to sort of keep him entertained. And knowing Go God Go episodes, he goes to great lengths to avoid boredom so it isn't out of character.
     
  16. Neo Ultra Mike

    Neo Ultra Mike Creeping Shadow of "15000"+ Posts

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    It does make sense though since remember the original mission statement of South Park was to show how kids aren't innocent and bubbly but can be little a-holes, and that applies to the girls as well. You don't see it as often due to them not getting the spotlight as much but it does pop up like how easy they turned on Bebe when she was getting more attention in "Bebe's Boobs Destroy Society" or the whole secret conspiracy just to get new shoes in "The List". So this isn't the most terribly off especially since you have to remember at this point Eric and Heidi have probably broken up and got back together at least 3 times so it's probably gone past the "oh we'll be understanding if this doesn't go well" point by then.

    Well yeah that's my point: Cartman will go to those extremes to get rid of someone. Just dressing up to be caught by a witch IMHO isn't him at his most extreme. Not to mention that in "The Coon Vs Coon And Friends" Cartman was convinced they were villains in the middle of his heroic let's play and was going about changing the world because of the power he had with control of Cthululu. He doesn't normally go to those extremes which I'll get into a bit later.


    Well again that's also my point: it didn't make sense for him to keep Heidi around him for no reason as he does hang out with the others for a reason. And yeah it may be a sociopathic reason but it's still a reason and IMHO there are times when Cartman can generally just hang with the others without needing to get some peverse thrill from it (such as episodes like "Faith Hilling") but there is usually something behind it. Though this time around his whole manipulation kind of caught up with him since yeah

    "Moss Piglets" - Again what did I say In the last episode review?


    So yup called that too. Probably not the most out there call but again I appreciate them really changing up the feel of the relationship from the lameness that "Eric just finds Heidi annoying and tries to get rid of her" was getting to "Cartman literally has created another Cartman and has to deal with it." Though honestly Macky and PC Principal were wrong to call her a "Cartman with more follow through" as Cartman when he's at his worst does have follow through. But you have to remember that not only is Heidi a Cartman who actually did start off a nice and sweet and caring but had that turned on her so is properly less prone to being that way, but she's also a much more aggressive version of Cartman. Honestly Eric deep down despite being such a manuplative monstorous socoipath is also kind of a cowardly weakling who except on very rare occassions if things spiral out of his control against someone he can't just use he'll instantly try and tap out and weasel his way out of the situation if only to avoid himself getting into trouble. Heidi actually has more gumption thus why she actually just took the sea bears away despite having a gun pulled on her and drinking them because she is that more aggressive and angry. And honestly the idea of Cartman now being the one forced with her and having to put up with her insults and sour attitude is honestly some much needed just desserts. You know what I really hope happens next time: Cartman tries weaseling his way out of breaking up with Heidi but she pulls one of his old tricks against him and threatens that if he does, she'll make him eat his own mother or something like that. Just to set up "you created something worse then you usually are" which again I'm all for. But honestly I do like what we got here seeing Heidi now as the Cartman of the girls group and they're take on a bus stop scene and Heidi either being bored or dragging Cartman around amiss his complaints and Heidi's rants about being treated unfairly because of previous obligiations or saying the special eds shouldn't get anything because everyone should be special and again twisted Cartman logic that ultimately bites Cartman the most in the end. It's stuff like this that makes the relationship worth continuing because yeah either Cartman needs to confront her or himself if he wants to get out of this one and that should be interesting to see.

    Honestly the other plot kind of fizziled out midway through this episode. I mean I actually liked the beginning. Even Matt and Trey have admitted that Nathan and Mimsy are characters they really like that a lot of other people don't but I actually enjoy they're antics and the idea this time around Nathan was trying to score and be seen as the best but Jimmy and Timmy again just being naturally better and having a much more interesting science experiment that they're cheating couldn't even take out and Nathan trying to cover up his decit and Mimsy constantly blurting things out are again amusing stuff. I really wish we stuck with that though instead of bringing the NFL in. As yeah the shot of the sear bears in the audoritium was good but... honestly the sea bears in general dancing or just showing small signs of intelligence was funny enough. You didn't really need this NFL satire of "no one is watching foot ball so we need to bring in new sentient life to watch us if we're going to continue on." That just felt honestly really tacked on and just something that we got because... the SP team are big foot ball fans and wanted to mention that but didn't have anything to do with the story. There are plenty of other ways you could of had Heidi eat the sea bears then just bringing in the NFL. Hell just keep it again to Nathan and Mimsy antics against Heidi. That would of been different enough instead of having this whole entirely unneeded third element there. Honestly without them the episode is actually really solidly great and works really well with the rest of the season. With them in it... it does take away some from that so it's more just a good. A could of been great but... seriously more with the kids and characters we know less with random NFL politics some fans couldn't get a crap about.
     
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  17. GershonB

    GershonB New Member

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    Well, it looks like Heidi has just turned into a female Cartman that even he's afraid of. All I can say to him now is "Doctor Frankenstein, say hello to your monster.
     
  18. SaneMan

    SaneMan Well-Known Member

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    Loved this episode

    Heidi went from being the Jerry to Cartman's Beth, into being his Beth's Rick
     

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