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"Marvel on Netflix" General News & Discussion, Part Two (Spoilers)

Discussion in 'Marvel Live-Action Movies and Television' started by Rick Jones, Apr 9, 2015.

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  1. RoryWilliams

    RoryWilliams Well-Known Member

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    And Batman's whole thing isn't dressing up in Asian garb and using kung-fu.


    Once again, no, because Batman's entire concept doesn't revolve around a martial arts theme and Eastern mysticism. If he dressed up in silk robes and called himself Kung-Fu Man that might be one thing, but he doesn't.
     
  2. TheVileOne

    TheVileOne Peace Loving Shinobi
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    Except he uses kung-fu and martial arts all the time. Rory Williams, care to enlighten me how this is Asian garb.

    [​IMG]

    Now even if it is Asian. How is wearing Asian garb racist?

    Iron Fist's entire concept doesn't revolve around that either. Also, that's not what Mighty Whitey means either.

    You do realize that a lot the whole Jedi mythology in Star Wars is based around samurais and eastern philosophy right? The lightsaber fighting style is even inspired by kendo. The Jedi wear samurai like robes. Even Darth Vader's look was inspired by samurai armor.

    All the prominent main Jedi characters in the Star Wars franchise are white characters. Other than Mace Windu.

    http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=14313449

    The only Asian actors in The Force Awakens were the gangsters who try to take out Han Solo.
     
  3. RoryWilliams

    RoryWilliams Well-Known Member

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    I literally just explained to you why they're different, LOL. Batman uses martial arts but his entire character is not about that. Iron Fist's is.



    Yes it does. He's a martial artist who learns it from K'un Lun. His arch enemy is another martial artist from K'un Lun. His girlfriend is a martial artist private detective and a good portion of his villains are based around similar concepts. His costume is stylized kung-fu gear.

    The martial arts and Eastern aspects are far more prominent in Iron Fist than they are in Batman so knock off that nonsense.

    LMAO you've shown consistently you either don't get what Asians were actually annoyed about or you don't care or are just talking to hear yourself talk at this point.

    Literally nobody said dressing up in Asian garb is racist. They said the character is a mighty whitey and for some reason that seems to have hurt your feelings.
     
    #463 RoryWilliams, Mar 5, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2016
  4. TheVileOne

    TheVileOne Peace Loving Shinobi
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    Batman's a martial artist who learns how to fight in Asia too. Batman Begins has multiple scenes of Batman training in Asia training in martial arts and Ninjitsu. He even wears Japanese armor and garb and practices with katanas.

    Iron Fist's girlfriend is actually an African American detective, and it was one of the first major interracial relationships in a superhero comic.

    How is his costume stylized kung fu gear? What Kung-Fu artists dress like that?

    I won't. Because the Mighty Whitey trope still applies to Batman. It's not my fault you are in denial that it does.

    If Iron Fist is then Batman is also Mighty Whitey which you continue to ignore. Look at this scene from Batman Begins, which was heavily centered on Batman's TRAINING IN ASIA IN ASIAN GARB!



    But if all this goes back to Asians are annoyed or offended because a white man with a black girlfriend know martial arts, they don't have a leg to stand on. Asia does not own or copyright martial arts or even Eastern philosophy. It can be used and practiced by others.
     
  5. RoryWilliams

    RoryWilliams Well-Known Member

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    And nowhere did I say she wasn't. I said she was a martial artist private detective, which she is. Her creator even based her off the movie Blackbelt Jones.

    http://56.media.tumblr.com/351c75e3b891b59aa9b4122fa1223c74/tumblr_nqn5fbSfRU1tf70vho1_540.png




    Except I'm not. I'm saying Batman's martial arts and Asian training background is not as prominent to the character as it is to Iron Fist. Which it isn't. Batman's whole premise isn't about martial arts. Iron Fist's is, hence why Iron Fist drawn this level of attention from the Asian-American community.

    It's also just not that relevant to the discussion, which is the same reason I didn't respond to your Star Wars post. And? So Iron Fist isn't the only piece in pop culture to have Mighty Whitey elements. Congrats. That's why it's a trope to begin with. What does that mean in this context of the discussion you're replying to? That Asians are picking on Iron Fist unfairly but not Batman or Star Wars? If that is your assertion it's already been answered multiple times. The explicit Asian elements aren't as strong in either Batman or Star Wars. The Jedi are based on Samurai but live in a whacky space universe with starships and laser guns. Batman's Asian influences are limited to him having ninja and martial arts training.

    Neither franchise is built around the level of Asian influence to the extent that Iron Fist is, which again, is why Asians were singling out Iron Fist in the first place.
     
  6. TheVileOne

    TheVileOne Peace Loving Shinobi
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    That's not what Mighty Whitey means though. It doesn't matter that his whole premise isn't about martial arts.

    You can't single out one character as being guilty of the trope while propping up and exempting others. That simple. By this logic, Batman and Star Wars are also racist and evoke the Mighty Whitey trope.
     
  7. RoryWilliams

    RoryWilliams Well-Known Member

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    You just keep reiterating that point but not actually paying attention to the context. If Batman's whole thing was about practicing kung-fu and fighting kung-fu villains and his ties to a mysterious Asian land of martial artists then sure, Batman probably would have drawn the ire of the Asian community to. It doesn't so it didn't. Same for Star Wars.


    Iron Fist was singled out for the reason I've already mentioned above and multiple other times in this thread, and the fact that he was suddenly the topic of discussion because it was announced he was getting a show. It's really not a difficult concept to grasp.
     
  8. TheVileOne

    TheVileOne Peace Loving Shinobi
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    Isn't it though? A big part of Batman's origin and background is his training to fight criminals, and he becomes a master of martial arts in Asia under multiple martial arts masters who are also Asian.

    A whole DLC campaign was released for Batman: Arkham Origins about his training Japan. He goes to a mysterious martial arts dojo and trains with ninjas and other martial arts masters. This was also a major part of the PREMISE OF BATMAN BEGINS. Half of the movie was dedicated to his training in Asia. And it never drew the ire of the Asian community. But quite frankly, neither has Iron Fist besides a scant minority of vocal writers, including ones that aren't Asian American.

    Singling out Iron Fist is nonsense.

    When you get right down to it, at the heart of this whole thing, there is no valid reason an Asian American cannot play Batman either. There isn't a single good or valid reason that a minority is not cast as Batman a big name character who has always been portrayed as a white American male.

    And if Iron Fist is guilty of the Mighty Whitey Trope, then so is Batman and Batman is even worse since he's been around longer and is an even bigger more popular character who has been perpetuating a racist trope for decades.
     
  9. RoryWilliams

    RoryWilliams Well-Known Member

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    To the extent that it is with Iron Fist? No.


    As long as the actor was good? I wouldn't mind that.
     
    #469 RoryWilliams, Mar 5, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2016
  10. the greenman

    the greenman Well-Known Member

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    I think you guys need to relent and watch Iron Fist first feature film.
    [​IMG]

    Sent from my LGMS323 using Tapatalk
     
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  11. RoryWilliams

    RoryWilliams Well-Known Member

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    • Like Like x 2
    #471 RoryWilliams, Mar 5, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2016
  12. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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    I'm intrigued with what this easter egg is going to be. Hmm. Maybe Castle served in the Middle East and encountered the Ten Rings?
     
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  13. RoryWilliams

    RoryWilliams Well-Known Member

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    That would be awesome. I'm wondering if the fallout from Age of Ultron might also play into it as well if people are starting to turn against superheroes.
     
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  14. the greenman

    the greenman Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, but isn't interesting the greatest true comicbook vigilante comes out of the shadows before CA Civil War.

    Sent from my LGMS323 using Tapatalk
     
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  15. Frontier

    Frontier Moderator
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    I think this might also play into why the general public in the MCU will view Spider-Man as a menace, instead of just embracing him like they did The Avengers after the Battle of New York, because by the time he debuts public opinion seems to be swaying against Superheroes because of the collateral damage and lack of accountability tied to them.

    A masked vigilante hiding his identity who takes the law into his own hands while swinging freely around New York would probably, on-paper, cause a lot of alarm. Especially when he represents a lot of the issues people are criticizing The Avengers for.
     
  16. RoryWilliams

    RoryWilliams Well-Known Member

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    That's a very good point too. Daredevil is also very brutal to his enemies (even if he doesn't kill them), so that may come into play too.
     
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  17. Troy Troodon

    Troy Troodon Well-Known Member

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    If there's one thing I hope not to see in the Luke Cage series, it's using Luke Cage's deceased wife. If this is to take place in the past I don't want to see the show revolve around his relation with a character who we already know died a horrible death. It's just gonna make it all the more gut wrenching. So I just hope it's gonna be flashbacks, while the show takes place in modern times.

    Actually going back, that scene already bothered me in Jessica Jones. It's basically a set up for "The Liar Reveal" trope, which I don't usually hate but it does get on my nerves for what comes out of tis; the main character reveals the truth to another character he/she bonded, the other character denounces him/her, then comes more of the mopey angsty stuff... and even then I don't understand why they had to give Luke a wife in the show just to have her die. I mean yeah, it's to build more tension and drama for our lead, but from a meta perspective (Particularly regarding the character's origin in the comics) it wasn't really necessary in my point of view at least.
     
  18. RoryWilliams

    RoryWilliams Well-Known Member

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    Didn't Colter say it takes place after Jessica Jones but with flashbacks to his origin?
     
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  19. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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    • Agree Agree x 1
  20. RoryWilliams

    RoryWilliams Well-Known Member

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