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Gun Control: Political Debate thread (PLEASE READ RULES BEFORE POSTING!)

Discussion in 'Cafe toonzone' started by wonderfly, Dec 17, 2012.

  1. GWOtaku

    GWOtaku Moderator
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    I know they sincerely back background checks, and you may recall that I agree with that position. But when the politicians make with the do-it-for-the-families bit, that's really bad form when the bill is not a response to what you say you're responding to.
     
  2. Shawn Hopkins

    Shawn Hopkins TZ Member of the Year 2013

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    See, that's where I, and apparently some of the Newtown families, disagree with you. Closing some ridiculous background check loopholes is a very sensible response to mass shootings. Maybe it wouldn't have prevented Newtown or past shootings, but it's possible it would prevent some future ones.
     
  3. wonderfly

    wonderfly Shaking things up a bit
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    Guys, rule #1 from the first post in this thread:

    And granted, it's sometimes a guideline more than a hard rule, but with five "back and forths", and with increased tension in your posts, and you still haven't come to a resolution, I'm going to ask that you drop the "back and forth". Give one more post a piece on this aspect of the discussion, if you feel it needed, but then we should move on.
     
  4. Shawn Hopkins

    Shawn Hopkins TZ Member of the Year 2013

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    I don't need to get another shot in, but I will say I'm sorry if what I said was hurtful or too angry. That comment just set me off, after thinking about it I know you probably didn't really mean to say something offensive. You're a cool guy, GW, we just disagree.

    This is, no kidding, on Mitch McConnell's Facebook page. Gives you a good idea of how many f-words he gives for bipartisan solutions.

    [​IMG]
     
  5. Jenk

    Jenk Member

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    Gun control is dead for the time being. This "compromise" was the most likely to pass and it still couldn't make it through. All the alternatives are unacceptable to various groups.

    The Democrats are going to risk ticking off voters in gun states. Mary Landrieu is already locked in a tough race in Louisiana. Any more support for gun grabbing and she can kiss her career goodbye. Same goes for Kay Hagan. And of course there are the open seats in South Dakota, Iowa, and West Virginia that the Democrats are trying desperately not to lose.

    They won't push it.
     
  6. GWOtaku

    GWOtaku Moderator
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    I think we hashed it out and whatever tension there might have been is gone, but fine. Better checks and / or enforcement of existing law might help & reducing gun violence in general is good. What I hope there's common ground on is that (1) we should consider the matter of mass shootings specifically, given how they've been trending in recent years and that (2) to address that requires more. For starters, I worry about the mental health angle being forgotten even though it seems it's probably no less important (though to be fair, it's April. Maybe I'm being too impatient). I'm not sure how much we can do to stop this kind of crime before it starts, & certainly no one says we can stop everything. But I doubt anyone holds that we're doing as well as anyone can reasonably expect right now.
     
  7. Shawn Hopkins

    Shawn Hopkins TZ Member of the Year 2013

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    The mental health situation could get better soon, as Obamacare will extend mental health benefits to millions more people. I know that link says "Deprecated Browser Error," but it's to a press release about it.

    Deprecated Browser Error
     
  8. Shawn Hopkins

    Shawn Hopkins TZ Member of the Year 2013

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    Just in case, with everything else to worry about, we were starting to forget that a crazy mother can easily and randomly shoot us at any time, there's a gunman on the loose right now at MIT, after killing a police officer. MIT just doesn't seem like the place something like that would happen, but it is happening.

    Officer killed on MIT campus near Boston - CNN.com
     
  9. stephane dumas

    stephane dumas Well-Known Member

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    Wasn't that gunman at the MIT campus was related to one of the suspects of the explosions of the Boston Marathon?


    I saw the editorial cartoon made in early April by cartoonist Chip Bok.
    [​IMG]

    A store owner in Chicago defended his store against an armed man with a baseball bat Store Owner Beats Back Robbers With Baseball Bat « CBS Chicago
     
  10. wonderfly

    wonderfly Shaking things up a bit
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    Correct. When that story first broke last night, I don't think any of us realized it was actually related to the two suspects accused of the Boston Marathon bombings, but all news reports say that was them (and the shooting on the MIT campus is what led to the high speed chase through Boston overnight).
     
  11. EroSennin

    EroSennin The Frog Hermit

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    So let me get this straight Republicans want background checks and special IDs for the virtually non existent crime of voter fraud, but want nothing to do with combating the fact that any deranged criminal psychopath can go to a gun show, buy multiple assault weapons on the spot, add 30+ round clips and not even give his name. Really?
     
  12. Shawn Hopkins

    Shawn Hopkins TZ Member of the Year 2013

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    Almost. They also want to make sure that psycho will be able to freely buy one off Craigslist.
     
  13. Oldiesfreak1854

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    Gun control is a classic example of unintended consequences that make the problem worse than it was before. Statistics have consistently shown that areas with stricter gun control laws have significantly higher rates of violent crime, and these rates increase as more restrictions are put into place. The fundamental problem with gun control is that criminals, by definition, break the law. If they want guns, they will try to get guns however they can (including black market.) So if those who do obey the law get rid of their guns in order to obey the law, then the only people who will have guns are criminals. I think it's common sense to expand background checks (and to include mental health checks as well), but we shouldn't target the guns; we should target the criminals who use them.
     
  14. stephane dumas

    stephane dumas Well-Known Member

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    Comment of the day. [​IMG](I founded that little icon on GMInsidenews forums :sweat:)
     
  15. cognitofalcon

    cognitofalcon G'night evry' body!!

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    Absolutely! There needs to be a change in our culture, not just more laws, or less laws. Neither of those will solve the problem.
     
  16. I.R. Shokew

    I.R. Shokew DISGRACED and Rooting ONLY for Underdogs

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    As much as I'd love to see background checks in place for this noise indefinitely - Thank you for pointing out actual common sense - as sad as it is that this won't be approached fast enough by our gov't:sad:, I'm glad I'm not the only one who sees this completely...
     
  17. Shawn Hopkins

    Shawn Hopkins TZ Member of the Year 2013

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  18. stephane dumas

    stephane dumas Well-Known Member

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    One policeman in Prince-George county in Maryland was sentenced for gun sales in the black market. MD Cop Sentenced for Black Market Sales of Seized Guns - Reason 24/7 : Reason.com (the Reason article links to a NBC Washington article)

    Then one thing who should be worried us is what might happen if local police departments (small cities, counties) face some cuts or are cash-strapped? A group of citizens in Josephine County in Southern Oregon organized some patrol to patrol their own streets.
    [video=youtube;8MGeyuWPM-0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MGeyuWPM-0[/video]
     
  19. I.R. Shokew

    I.R. Shokew DISGRACED and Rooting ONLY for Underdogs

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    The police who tell you the truth about how cash-strapped and under-resourced they are ARE the truly honest ones, IMHO. They are the ones concerned about looking out for their community.
    They can't do that without the money or equipment required, especially with those in power who keep short-changing them or worse yet, trying to privatize them (and other vital public services that need to stay open to just that - THE PUBLIC.)!

    In the end, we have to be responsible for ourselves, not just the police - either that, or we need to start actually putting people (via voting) in power who understand why a well-funded police force (and other open public services that need to stay accessible by all walks of life, DAILY!) goes a long way at the local and state levels, people.
     
  20. macattack

    macattack I see you!
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    Dude, you're not getting the full story. How about your read something from the locals for perspective:

    Ayotte's gun vote: 'Disgusting' political bullying | New Hampshire OPINION01

    Media drops the ball on Ayotte coverage « New Hampshire Journal

    And the most recent and damning of all: Organizing for Action uses blood-spattered signs to politicize Boston Marathon tragedy « New Hampshire Journal

    The truth is this, that outside liberal advocacy groups are gunning for Ms. Ayotte's head and they're trying to manufacture a crisis for her when the majority of her constituents support her.
     

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