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Gargoyles #1 - 12 "Clan Building" Talkback (Spoilers)

Discussion in 'Comic Book Culture' started by Wonder Woman, Jun 21, 2006.

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Rate and Comment on "Gargoyles"

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  1. Ian

    Ian ¡Mierda santa! ¡Ninjas!

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    Finally got this, some random comments. Spoilers ahead, obviously.

    "Rock of Ages"

    * I was a tad confused by one particular detail: the time-stamp for the moment when the Stone first begins speaking to Arthur is marked "November 15, 1:06 P.M. GMT"--isn't it supposed to read 1:06 A.M. instead? At least that's what I take from the next King Arthur panel. Given that the time stamps are more or less essential to understanding the story, I find the discrepancy very dissapointing.

    * I'm also not entirely sure what happened in that last scene. Did Xanatos get to keep a piece of The Rock, or didn't he? I'm not sure its made clear, and time-stamp discrepancy non-withstanding, it's the only particularly confusing bit about the story.

    * As a guy who appreciates stories about articles of clothing that are not what they seem, I was a tad bit disappointed to see that Fox's new Manolos are just new Manolos. Not enough to make me like the story less but still...

    * The most interesting part of the story, to me the new insights on The Illuminati. Unsurprising, since that was my favorite part about the Halloween story as well. Okay, so the other #2, Duval, is a cyborg; we have an unammed blonde as the first established #3; and we Peredur Fab Ragnal, whose rank isn't stated but seems to act as their superior--plus, we have "The Upper Echelons", which sounds like it could be someone either higher up the chain or, alternatively, the upper tier of the Illuminati as we know it--say, everyone ranked #5 and up.

    The 997 arc

    * From what I remember of the original plan for Time-Dancer, Brooklyn was supposed to dissapear, reappear, and the series would be told as a series of flashbacks. Here we get to see Brooklyn's first adventure before his return instead. While I can see why this was done--it allows for a tidier, more definitive conclusion to "Clan-Building" if we have all the new additions to the clan appear at once, instead of having one group appear before the other--that, to me, is the problem: it feels too pat. Not only that, it makes the abrupt non-ending to the story seem even more obvious. I think the whole thing would have felt more natural if they had indeed gone with "story as flashback" bit, and then have the story stop due to Elisa's interruption.

    * Although I had reservations about the timing of the storyline--I feel its focus is too narrow when you're still trying to reintroduce the central Gargoyles concept--the story itself is neat-o. It's nice to see some concrete linkage between the Scottish political situation as the Gargoyles knew it and the situation in Macbeth's time.

    * I'm not terribly sure what to make of the revelation that the hunter line--or at least the hunter motif--didn't actually begin with Gilcomgaine. While one can argue that the mask and the identity are separate things I feel that seeing it used for something outside a vendetta dilutes the concept a bit (even if Gilcomgaine didn't strictly use it for that purpose either). Plus, it seems like a sort of Pandora's box--it makes me imagine that we'll eventually a story revealing that Constantine didn't actually create the look either, and so on, until we find out that it was actually the result of another stable time loop.

    General thoughts

    * Last I'd heard, part of the reason why the comic books were late were because of Hedgecock's slowness. And yet he only pencils one of the "new" issues. Given that each of the final three episodes have three different artists, I have no idea what to think any more. Care to shed some light, Greg X?
     
  2. Antiyonder

    Antiyonder Amalgam Universe Overlord
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    Here's what GargWiki states:
    I'm pretty sure the story was always meant to be this way. Any further adventures would be told should Timedancer gets a spinoff.
     
  3. Ian

    Ian ¡Mierda santa! ¡Ninjas!

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    Thank you. That's pretty much what I'd though happened, except that I didn't believe that Xanatos would be the type to listen to a stone. Unless it suddenly ocurred to him that the Illumaniti would expect the stone to talk to them, why not take a chance and try keeping it?


    That's not the impression I'd gotten from the initial master plan. To wit:

    Granted, the sentence could be interpreted in a variety of ways, but regardless what the original plan was I still feel the story would have flowed more naturally if it had been told as a flashback.
     
  4. Antiyonder

    Antiyonder Amalgam Universe Overlord
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    For all we know he did keep his stone, but if I can find more I'll post it here and provide a PM.

    Perhaps, but the description you gave wouldn't be enough to fill in an episode, so I imagine he wanted to give one of the adventures. Even then, Timedancer wouldn't cover all of his trips as his stay in the future would be covered in Gargoyles 2198.


    Anyway, did you pick up the Bad Guys trade?
     
  5. Ian

    Ian ¡Mierda santa! ¡Ninjas!

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    I'm not saying that we couldn't have seen the story we did; in my scenario, it goes something like:

    1) Brooklyn disappears.
    2) Brooklyn & company appear.
    3) Brooklyn begins telling the clan of his adventures, beginning with 997 A.D. This would be unchanged.
    4) Right at the part where the Phoenix reappears to take Brooklyn to his next destination, Elisa interrups the narration in order to announce the Pack's attack.

    As for "Bad Guys", I didn't get a chance to buy it. I'd pre-ordered "Clan-Building", so I'd been called in when it arrived and since I'd been in a hurry I had no time to check around the shop; I had no idea "Bad Guys" had also arrived until I'd returned home and saw this thread.

    More random thoughts:

    * My sense of humor doesn't usually intersect with Weisman's so I was a bit surprised that I actually liked most of the jokes in here...with one exception. Brooklyn's facing-the-audience appeal, was abysmal in almost every possible way. Yes, Greg, we get that you're pro-literacy--chances are, most of the people reading the book are too. Stopping the book for a moment to give an un-natural sounding micro-PSA--all it was missing was "and knowing is half the battle" (which ironically, would have helped make the joke gone back around to being funny again)--is not at all appreciated.

    * I very much liked Brooklyn's reference to Quantum Leap, because it's such a 1996 reference. A less careful author would have used Lost, despite the fact that the show wouldn't have aired yet in the series timeline, and it would have annoyed the hell out of me.
     
  6. Antiyonder

    Antiyonder Amalgam Universe Overlord
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    Perhaps, but for a moment, the story as published gives us the impression that Mary and Finella would arrive with Brooklyn in 1997. The flashback bit would remove that bit of suspense.

    The Star Trek reference was alos a good one, considering the show's usage of voice actors/actresses.
     
  7. Rembrant

    Rembrant Member

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    I seriously have to get this soon, don't want to risk them running out before I get my hands on it. Though I guess it's mainly to see how the current storyline ends, as I am not interested at all in Brooklyn's time-traveling adventure. I did hear he apparently broke the 4th Wall in a way, and that just sounds so lame and, well, un-Gargoyles-ish. :p
     
  8. Antiyonder

    Antiyonder Amalgam Universe Overlord
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    An explanation I heard about that:

     
  9. Antiyonder

    Antiyonder Amalgam Universe Overlord
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    I ended up typing a short review for each story/storyarc for GameFAQS and decided to post it here too:

    #1-2: Adaptation of The Journey- Just about the same as the episode. As far as the story goes, a nice little aftermath of Hunter's Moon and Vinnie growing from being the comic relief bystander that he appeared as in the episode Vendettas. As far as the comic goes, made more sense for the statue at the Quarryman meeting to look more monsterous.

    #3-5: Halloween Double Date- As the first new storyarc in since 9 years, the continuity is just as tight as the original episodes (with little details being remember and reintroduced such as Officer Morgan's partner from Temptation, Judge Ian Roebling who married Xanatos & Fox and a mention of Fang's associate from Kingdom). John Castaway while appearing briefly gets unexpected, but welcomed characterization. And even though the outcome of Goliath and Elisa's seperation was revealed a long time prior to this story, other elements such as info pertaining to the Illuminati and Thailog's parts in the story give enough twist and turns.

    #6: Coldstone in the Himalayas- I was looking forward to this one after hearing of the Lost Avalon World Tour episode. Found the character Master Dawa to be entertaining. We even get canon confirmation that Gabriel is the son of Coldstone, and it clears up why Angela didn't seem unfamiliar with him in Possessions. And as far as the present day portion goes, Thailog gets owned by his "Executive Assisstant".

    #7-9: The Stone of Destiny- I was looking forward to this arc. Mainly because we've only seen fanfics portraying the post-Hunter's Moon Xanatos, so it was nice to see him still carrying out his objectives. Also it was nice to see more on Macbeth since he never even had a Goliath Chronicles appearance, and more on his continued interaction with Arthur. Plus it was interesting to see Hudson and Lex getting jetlag. Even more intriging is Lexington's sexuality being alluded to after hearing about it in more details from Weisman.

    #10-12: Timedancer- Hopefully this won't be the final story, but regardless gives a nice ending which doesn't fail to provide closure. To begin with, sending Brooklyn to Scotland of 997 gives a nice bookend since the animated series began in Scotland 994. While I expected to see Brooklyn aiding Finella and Mary against Constantine and the introduction of King Kenneth III, it was a nice surprise to see younger versions of Findlaech, Bodhe (just as cowardly as ever) and Gillcomegain. Good moment of growth where Brooklyn puts aside his hostility with the present day Demona to team up with her younger self. And if you're a fan of Brooklyn, one who is disappointed that he got the short of the deal in the dating pool, then you must pick up Clan Building Volume 2.
     
  10. AlgeaX

    AlgeaX Oh, hello?

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    I disagree, I think the reveal of Brook's new family works better if it's saved for a suprise ending. Plus telling the story in flash back would have hurt the suspense.

    I think that bit is a pretty obvious spoof of 80s style PSAs, unless you believe Mr. Weisman was seriously trying to educated kids about the dangers of giant flaming magical time traveling-birds.

    Anyway I just got my copy today, arc reviews are pending.
     
    #330 AlgeaX, Oct 21, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 21, 2009

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