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"Captain America: Civil War" Talkback (Spoilers)

Discussion in 'Marvel Live-Action Movies and Television' started by Yojimbo, May 5, 2016.

?

Whose side are you on?

  1. Team Cap

    3 vote(s)
    33.3%
  2. Team Iron Man

    3 vote(s)
    33.3%
  3. Team Underoos

    3 vote(s)
    33.3%
  4. Team Zemo

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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    5/13: Russos comment on decision not to kill Captain America. They also confirm the dropping of the shield was "a rejection of the Captain America identity and a choice to embrace the Steve Rogers identity" and now he's a "full-blown insurgent."

    Working list of trivia

    5/20: Effects supervisor Dan DeLeeuw talks about de-aging Tony for the MIT scene.
     
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  2. Neo Yi

    Neo Yi The Apparition
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    No lie, I legitimately thought they just got a young actor to play Young Tony, I had no idea they used special effects to essentially de-age the actor. Just proves how much technology has improved!
     
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  3. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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    Yup, pretty wicked stuff. So far I think they did it with just RDJ in Civil War and Douglas in Ant-Man.
     
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  4. Neo Yi

    Neo Yi The Apparition
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    Remember when TRON: Legacy did the same with Jeff Bridges? Even back then, the mouth movement kept it from being super convincing and that movie still looks amazing. A mere six years later, we get stuff like these (also, forgot about the Douglas thing, too.) Unreal, man.
     
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  5. Rick Jones

    Rick Jones Hero Fan
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    In my mental canon, I'll just keep Stan's delivery man character locked in as Willie Lumpkin.

    Sent from my HTC One M9 using Tapatalk.
     
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  6. HellCat

    HellCat Lesser spotted Brit
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    Finally had time to see it yesterday. Now while I think it was pretty solid, I don't understand why I saw so many acting like it was this amazing thing they've now seen several times. Then again, once was enough for me with Force Awakens too.



    I'm partly mixed because obviously this film hinges on being a response to the MCU thus far and in particular Age of Ultron. In a way it's nice to see these films be so concerned with how these titans effect the world around them but at the same time coming off the back of AoU it felt a bit samey, much like how I hated how the Raimi Spidey movies constantly went for the 'being Spider-Man sucks' over the jokey side of the character. Saying that though, I liked Zemo. I know very little about his comic self but I thought it was actually one of the best MCU villains given he didn't have some plan for world domination but was a guy out for simple revenge who was prepared to make it look like he was to get what he really wanted. I just wish they hadn't done this so close to 'Stark/The Avengers took my family' being Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver's drive a year prior.



    Big points for how much better this handled the actual central conflict then the comic series did. I think the whole ethical debate at the heart of that deserved much better handling than the mess of an event gave it so glad to see it here. They even reworked one of the moments I've had issues with for a while- "No. You move.". I get what Cap was saying with that speech but the way its worded in the comics is kind of dangerous because it basically encourages and excuses any kind of nut who thinks what they're doing is right. Here they cut out some of the more troublesome wording and use it to give Steve some resolve. I often see the comic page posted but for me it's always been one where intent is lost in bad execution.



    Also big points for having so many heroes in this and balancing them all. My only real issue is that after AoU ushered in the second generation of Avengers they're now on the run. Much like AOU itself it's obvious a lot of this stuff is lead in to Infinity War (I think we all know they'll be a healing scene where Tony gives back a repaired/improved shield).



    Spidey was a treat. I know some have said he was too young but I think this is how you capture the spirit of the comics era the MCU is founding itself on without the crap the character has gone through in the comics. I skipped both of the 'Amazing' movies but I'm looking forward to Homecoming from this and it does make me wish Marvel could get their other characters back.
     
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  7. Frontier

    Frontier Moderator
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    I'm not sure what I can say that hasn't already been said other then as a big fan of Captain America and the Cap movies, I was really happy to see the Russo's deliver on an amazing closing chapter to the Captain America trilogy with Civil War. A movie that, while tackling tough and greyer issues, still has plenty of heroism, fun, and idealism, never losing sight of how integral those elements are to the Superhero genre and the title character. Great character moments, incredible action sequences, strong story progression, and a perfect finish. I just really loved this movie and I think it's one of the best MCU films to date :D.

    One of the best things this movie accomplished was not making the actual conflict of Civil War just black and white and nonsensical like the comic did. I think each side made sensible and fair points without one having to be demonized over the other, and thankfully Tony wasn't turned into the fascist villain he became in the original Civil War. I think it's fair to believe The Avengers should at least have some oversight and accountability for their actions, especially after Ultron and Sokovia, and that it's risky giving them absolute authority over themselves and the world, but ultimately I think I side more with Cap in that coming under the government means politics and agendas will likely hurt their effectiveness and potentially turn the group into something it's not meant to be. It feels like a lot of these issues could have been avoided if The Avengers had at least some government liaison and communication with the governments and weren't just operating on their own, which I'm honestly surprised seems to be the case o_O.

    It's all the more hard to support the Accords when they put good ol' Thunderbolt Ross in charge, the guy who completely botched trying to hunt down The Hulk numerous time and arguably endangered civilians more callously then The Avengers ever have. Most of the team should've rejected the Accords on that alone if Bruce has given them any idea on what Ross is like. And even if that heart attack had given him "perspective," he ultimately seemed more concerned with killing Bucky then the possibility he had been framed. Not someone I would trust with a Superhero Team, personally :rolleyes:.

    The action in this movie was simply phenomenal, with some great choreography and effects work. Everything from the hand-to-hand fighting and the more out of this world Superhero slugfests looked awesome, and the Russo's brothers did a good job of giving every character a cool showcase of their powers, abilities, and strengths in the movie while also letting them carry their own identity and style to differentiate themselves. I think with this the Russo's proved themselves very capable of directing an Avengers movie, and I'm definitely excited to see what they bring to Infinity War :cool:.

    I'm starting to really wish the MCU used codenames more. Maybe it's because I'm spoiled by the Arrowverse who generally (at least now) give out and use codenames on a daily basis, embracing that aspect, but when you have credits listing every character with their codenames and most are hardly even used in the movie, it's kinda jarring. Especially when no one, at any point, calls Rumlo Crossbones or Wanda Scarlet Witch and yet those names are in the credits. At least they now have more of an excuse to do so with Spider-Man :sweat:.

    I'm glad that in-spite of all the co-stars and scene stealers, that this was still ultimately Steve's story and a Captain America movie at heart. From seeing Steve deal with losing Peggy (RIP Agent Carter :crying:) to the possibility of losing Bucky and The Avengers, and the lengths he'll go to protect them while still always trying to do the right thing, there was just a lot of good stuff with Steve in this movie as he tries to balance all that :).

    It's always interesting to see idealistic and heroic characters be put into more morally grey situations to see how they react, and I think Steve handled himself fairly well. He was never against bringing in Bucky, he just wanted to ensure he was brought in alive, and only went rogue when they figured out what Zemo was really up to and had to move faster then the Accords would likely let them. He was even willing to work with Tony on the Accords up until he learned the government had locked up Wanda in the Avengers Compound without her permission, which is the kind of treatment and attitude that Steve was against signing the Accords for :mad:.

    Of course, the movie doesn't ignore Steve's own personal flaws, such as how far he's willing to go just to protect Bucky. He risks himself and several of his friends to help clear Bucky's name, even if it's ultimately for a bigger cause of stopping Zemo, and then we get the reveal that Steve never told Tony about Hydra's killing of his parents and Winter Soldier's possible involvement. While I get why Steve would not want to saddle Tony with that burden of information and because he doesn't hold Bucky responsible for what happened, it was still selfish of him to not share that with Tony just to protect Bucky. And it's making that kind of compromise that leads Steve to drop his shield and essentially give up being Captain America, though somehow I doubt we won't be seeing him back in-costume and swinging the shield come Infinity War ;).

    Man, Tony was really put through a ringer in this movie. First we get the setup with his issues and regrets regarding his parents and their deaths, then we learn that even after all the effort Tony went through in Iron Man 3 to improve their relationship, he and Pepper are on the outs as a couple and that's shaking him up to a degree, then he's hit with a massive dose of guilt from a mother who blames him for her son's death in Sokovia (which admittedly he kinda is responsible for even if Wanda also shares at least some of the blame) :ack:.

    Then with all that in mind he goes into supporting the Accords and getting the rest of The Avengers to fall in line, both out of his own guilt over what he's done and to make sure his friends don't become hunted by the government, and then things go immediately off the rails. First an international incident, then Cap going rogue with other Avengers in tow, then Tony brings in a kid to help them stop the rogue Avengers without hurting any of them which eventually puts that kid in some serious danger, then his best friend is harshly wounded, and to top it all off he finds that his other friend has been keeping it a secret that his best friend murdered Tony's parents as he watched their deaths with his own eyes. Is it any wonder Tony completely broke and went straight for killing Bucky :eek:?

    It was weird seeing Maria as a blonde, but it was nice to finally get to meet her in the flesh and get an inkling of the dynamic of the Stark family. Obviously there was still some contention between Tony and Howard, but they were still a family and it was evident Maria was a very loving and sweet mother/spouse. Which probably explains why Tony only mentioned her while trying to kill Bucky...

    But that scene of their deaths was really brutal and tragic, especially given how we've seen Howard developed over the course of the MCU and after he had recognized Bucky :(.

    That flashback VR simulation is probably the closest we'll ever get to seeing Teen Tony in the MCU. Pretty good job by the effects department in de-aging Robert Downey Jr.

    I really liked how the film used Bucky, first establishing that he didn't want to be a killer or the Winter Soldier anymore and then progressing to where he finally became Bucky again and was back-to-back with Steve like the good old days. It was just nice seeing those two together again, as friends and partners, and Bucky back as a good guy. And they kept a major element of Bucky's restoration where he's still haunted by all the death and destruction he's caused, the memories of what Hydra made him do, which was very compelling to see. And in a movie about responsibility and accountability, having Bucky choose to put himself on ice so the Wakandan scientists could finally rid him of the Hydra brainwashing, was really heroic. I'm eager to see what's next for Bucky in the future, hopefully with a new Vibranium arm in tow :anime:.

    Speaking of Wakanda and Vibranium...Black Panther. Wow. Chadwick Boseman and the Russo's really knocked it out of the park and nailed the character. Boseman really captured the suave, charming, and amiable royal T'Challa as well as the determined, fierce, and overpowering presence that is the Black Panther. That suit looked amazing in action, and we got some really cool action sequences from Panther that left quite an impression (both on me and the heroes).

    He was a really strong presence in the movie despite how his lack of screentime compared to other members of the cast, and I liked Boseman's accent even if his voice was a tad lighter then what I expected from T'Challa, and I was really itching to see more of him and Wakanda then what we were given (which I guess was the point). I also wish he interacted more with the other Avengers, especially Cap and Iron Man, but his interaction with Widow and that stare down between Natasha and the Dora was fun. Seems like T'Challa enjoys a good catfight every now and then :p.

    I also liked that he had his own, strong, arc in the movie, going from the prince unconcerned with politics who has the mantle of king foisted upon him by tragedy that leaves him with an almost single-minded determination to avenge his father, only to in the end realize he'd been tricked and that he had almost let vengeance consume him. In the end T'Challa did the heroic thing and chose justice over vengeance by bringing in Zemo to face his crimes, and in doing so I think he truly started his journey towards becoming a genuine Superhero. I'm looking forward to seeing how that journey unfolds and how Panther may eventually end up joining The Avengers :cool:.

    I wasn't expecting T'Chaka's appearance, but he was definitely a nice surprise and in-spite of John Kani looking older then I expected, he did a great job in the role for what little time he had. You really got the sense that T'Chaka was a strong, fair, ruler who respected The Avengers in-spite of his call for the Accords. I hope we get to see more of him in flashbacks in the Black Panther solo and more insight into the new distinction between the role of Black Panther and King of Wakanda and how interrelated they might be (was T'Chaka ever the Black Panther?) as well as T'Chaka's opening up Wakanda to the outside world and how that will play into T'Challa's reign. I'm also wondering what they're going to do with Klaw in the MCU now that he no longer has the "honor" of killing T'Chaka :confused:?

    Spider-Man was definitely a highlight, and I was generally pleased with how they handled him (especially as a major Spidey fan). Did he absolutely need to be in the movie? No, but he was a really fun addition and brought a distinctly new element and feel to the film. Obviously Marvel is going for a young, rookie, Spider-Man and trying to be as accurate as possible in that regard, and I think they did fairly well with that even if it's not my personal preference for the character. I was iffy on Holland for a while now but I have to say that he did a good job of proving himself in this movie, capturing Peter as this smart, awkward, brave, and resourceful kid who wants to do the right thing while holding his own against MCU veterans like RDJ, Evans, etc. I really hope the MCU lets Holland grow into the role of being Spider-Man and ages the character, and letting Holland really own it going forward :proud:.

    I liked what little we saw of Peter and his world in in the movie. We got to see the Parkers living in a cheap apartment, and Peter having to make do with outdated tech like that old computer, implying their money problems. It was well established that Peter is a smart and inventive kid, and there's even an illusion to his origin and what happened to Uncle Ben in his explanation to Tony as to why he became Spider-Man. As far as the connection with Tony and his contribution...while I'm not crazy about it, as I think Spidey works best as a solo act/loner and doesn't need a mentor figure, I could see what they were going for with the relationship by involving Peter with someone who he would obviously idolize and feature a kind of passing of the torch as it were. And at least the web-shooters, costume-design, and initial exploits were all his own. But I don't want to see Tony or The Avengers get too involved in Peter's life and hero career going forward o_O.

    Spider-Man looked amazing (heh) in action in this movie. I just loved how expressive he was and how he moved and swung around everywhere. I even liked the nod to his Spider-Sense when his eyes opened up wide when something was coming in behind him. And they did a great job of showcasing Spidey in the film, and it's to his credit that, even as a 15 year old kid with less experience then anyone else there, he's able to go toe-to-toe with Falcon, Winter Soldier, and even Captain America and actually hold his own. That's just awesome, and just like Panther I already really want to see more of this Spider-Man. Also like with Panther, I wish he had interacted with the other Avengers more, but I liked what we saw between him and Tony and especially the one scene he had with Cap where Steve compliments him :D.

    I do have my issues, however. I didn't really feel like he was being very quippy in this movie, and that Ant-Man was actually doing more quips then Spider-Man was, which felt off. It's not that he wasn't funny or didn't have any humorous moments, but It felt like he was just babbling and geeking out more then he was delivering one-liners which isn't really Spider-Man in my opinion (even if I could see the situation effecting him). And while I previously praised Holland's performance before, and stand by that, I do think it's a little jarring hearing Spidey sound so young and it being obvious how old he is, almost to the point where him calling himself Spider-Man feels more ironic and like a joke then it should. He wasn't as confident or cocky as I'm used to hearing him as when he's actually Spider-Man. Garfield's voice, attitude, and knack for the quips felt more like Spider-Man then what we got from Holland here, but that's just me. I'm definitely interested to see what Peter is like as Spider-Man when more in his own element and not next to other Avengers :).

    And Marisa Tomei as Aunt May...I don't want to say she's too young, because she's in her 50's, and I don't want to say she has to be an old crone like Ditko/comic Aunt May, but from what little we saw of her here she didn't really look or feel like Aunt May that much. Especially when we have Tony Stark, of all people, flirting with her (not that I didn't expect it). Personally I thought Sally Field felt more appropriate as a younger Aunt May then what we have seen from Tomei so far, but we'll see how she is in Homecoming :shrug:.

    Falcon was awesome in this movie, both in terms of Anthony Mackie's performance and the great job the movie does of depicting him in action. I love how Sam always has Cap's back and is a strong voice on his team, and the way he used his wings in the movie were just really cool. He and Bucky together was also really fun, as Cap's two buddies/sidekicks bounced off each other :anime:.

    I just loved that he could manipulate his wings and even turn him into a shield. Redwing was also really cool, and while the comic book fan in me would've loved if they had played straight something as goofy as Redwing, I like drone Redwing and how it was used and it was nice that Sam seemed to treat it like an actual partner like the real Redwing ;).

    I'm glad Sharon was able to get an expanded role in the movie, or at least more screentime compared to Winter Soldier, even if it's not that much overall. But more then enough time to establish her relationship to Peggy, that she has the same spunk, charm, and dedication to doing the right thing as her aunt Peggie did (the same things Cap fell for) establish some chemistry with Steve, and even get in on the action by fighting Bucky. I wish we had gotten to see more of her, and spent more time developing her romantic arc with Cap, but I was just as satisfied as Bucky and Sam when they finally kissed. Seeing the Steve/Sam/Sharon trio together at least once was also really great. I really hope we get to see Sharon again soon, and with Steve :).

    I was wondering whether Martin Freeman would keep his British accent as Ross #2 or if he would use an American one, but I'm happy he used an American one because he sounded a lot more like Ross with it. We didn't get much with him here, but he does seem to be the stick in the mud who thinks he's bigger and more in control then he actually is that his comic counterpart was. Looking forward to seeing more of him in Black Panther (presumably without pants :p).

    Black Widow was her usual awesome self in this movie, being practical and snarky while still caring in her own way for her friends and teammates. Heck, a major reason for her supporting the Accords was so the team didn't end up divided, even if she also found some of the reasoning for it sound. We also got plenty of action scenes demonstrating once again why Black Widow is not to be underestimated, whether it's from her amazing hand-to-hand skills or how you never know what to expect from her. Case in point, her eventual betrayal of Team Iron Man to help Steve, which, while expected, was still nice to see as it showed just how much trust and faith she had in Steve and in doing the right thing that she helped him and Bucky escape. It'll be interesting to see what's next for Widow now that she's on the run, though honesty I would expect her to hook up with Cap and his group.

    It was great to see Hawkeye again, and it's no surprise that he couldn't stay in retirement, especially when Cap needed help. Seeing him try and take on Vision and Black Panther, even when he's clearly outmatched, was cool as was his double-teaming with Wanda to take on Iron Man. I also liked his new bow/staff weapon, even if it didn't do him much good against T'Challa. His calling out Tony on selling out his friends and treating them like criminals was a good scene, even if Tony had a good point that Clint willingly broke the law and jeopardized his family by helping Cap :ack:.

    I really loved Wanda in this movie. She's young and has a lot of insecurities about who she is, what she can do, and the mistakes she's made in the past, mistakes she still beats herself up over, and the government and the world views her as potential threat rather then a human being with rights. But in-spite of all that she doesn't let it hold her back from accepting who she is and using her powers for good. And as a hero, she looked pretty great in that costume and flinging members of Team Iron Man left and right. It's just tragic that it all eventually culminates in her being locked up in a straightjacket like a crazy person :(.

    Vision was interesting in this movie as he approached all the conflict as logically and practically as possible, while at the same time his relationship with Wanda is slowly but surely making him act more and more human. Even when he's holding her under house arrest under orders from the UN, he feels he's doing it for her sake and to protect her, rather then just rationalizing it through pure logic. Some of their interaction in this movie, from their talking about him not just phasing into her room and Viz trying to cook for her, even made me think of them as a couple living the domestic life. They just seemed really cute together, and as a fan of the couple in the comics, I'm excited to see where they go in the MCU :anime:.

    It's interesting that with Vision continually trying to understand himself and who he is, which I guess Thor never got the chance to really discuss with him that much, that he was unaware of how much his affection for Wanda effected him. To such a degree that, distracted by her injuries, he misjudges his blast and tragically hits Rhodey. Actually making a mistake like that, and such an illogical one, seems to have really shaken him by the end of the movie :eek:.

    It was good to finally get more screentime for War Machine/Rhodey after so long of being either absent or minimally used like in Age of Ultron. He was really the only Avenger who seemed to genuinely believe in the Accords wholeheartedly, and had sensible reasons for doing so even to the end, which makes sense for a military man like Rhodey. It was also nice to see more of him and Tony together because that friendship is always fun to see. I also liked all the neat additions to War Machine's arsenal like the sword and sonic blast. While it's terrible what happened to Rhodey at the end, it seems he's on the road to recovery and I expect we'll see War Machine in action again by the time Infinity War hits ;).

    It was nice to see Ant-Man again, and Scott's always fun to have around, and I thought he made a pretty good showing here. You could tell how genuinely enthusiastic he was to actually be helping Captain American and The Avengers, which was neat. The movie gave Scott some impressive feats, from getting Cap's shield back from Spidey, to damaging Tony's Armor from the inside thanks to the iconic Hawkweye shot, and the best of all...Giant-Man. That was really awesome to see, and totally changed the tide of the battle. Equally awesome was Spidey pulling an Empire Strikes Back (heh, really old movie :p) and Iron Man and War Machine needing to do a combined punch to take him down :cool:.

    It was nice to get a reference to Hank as Scott mentions his distrust of the Stark's, even if Tony had absolutely no idea who poor Scott is. I really have to wonder what Scott's going to do now that he's a fugitive from the law again with the other Avengers, and how that'll impact his relationship with his family, Hank, and especially Hope. Stuff that I guess did not go through his head when he joined Team Cap, but now I'm even more eager to see Ant-Man and The Wasp to see what's going on with Scott and potentially the other Avengers on the run with him. I guess he's basically an Avenger now...kinda :sweat:.

    So now we finally have an official Enhanced/Superhuman prison in the MCU (at least movie-wise) in The Raft. I'm really curious to see if it'll get anymore use past this movie and if it might be the impetus for the MCU to start keeping more villains around rather then killing them off now that there's a place to keep them contained. Obviously Spider-Man might need a place to contain his Rogues Gallery, depending on how many we see in the MCU o_O.

    Crossbones was good for what little screentime he had, and the suit actually looked better in action then I was expecting, and he at least gave Cap a bit of a challenge in their initial fight (even if it wasn't much). I liked how they touched on how much he hates Cap after the Hellicarrier dropped on him. I did think it was a bit of a shame that they killed him off so quickly, besides the fact that it's so common for them to do that in the MCU, especially since it would've been cool to see him work with Zemo. But given how MCU Zemo is and that he seems to have no love for Hydra, that probably wouldn't work out anyways :shrug:.

    Speaking of Zemo....I'm a little conflicted. On the one hand, he has Zemo's cold and calculating personality as well as his superb tactical skills, an obsession with Captain America (though probably the entire Avengers by extension), and his style of speech was also very Zemo, and without even having to fight them he legitimately came the closest to breaking The Avengers then any other MCU villain has, a trait shared by his comic counterpart :eek:.

    On the other hand, he obviously wasn't a Baron (I wonder if Mordo in Dr. Strange will actually be one), didn't have the master sword skills his comic incarnation is known for, nor Zemo's iconic purple mask, and his motivations were obviously very different from comic Helmut. I can understand wanting the villain to be more sympathetic to audiences, hence his new Sokovia origin and tragic backstory, but I think a major part of Zemo is his obsession with his father's legacy and how that conflicts with his own ideals, and the kind of Machiavellian uber-Supervillain he is because of it, so it's weird that all that's pretty much gone in this version. I guess he still had daddy issues given how many times he mentioned his father when reminiscing about what happened, but that was conflated with the fate of the rest of his family.

    I was at least hoping we could get more scenes between him and Cap, and an actual fight between the two, so that was a little disappointing, even if the chances of this Zemo giving Cap an actual challenge physically were fairly low. I was also expecting his face to end up being scarred somehow, to eventually justify his comic mask, but I guess that would just be a retread of what they did with Crossbones. It'll be interesting to see what they do with Zemo now, given he (Gasp) actually survived by the end of the movie and was taken into custody, and if there are plans for him to eventually develop into a more proper Baron Zemo :evil:.

    In a way, Zemo did achieve his goal. He turned The Avengers against one another and split the team apart, not to mention breaking Steve and Tony's friendship by using Bucky as an impetus. I mean, look at the current state of the team...there are only two officially recognized active Avengers left with Iron Man and Vision, while the rest of the team are now wanted fugitives :sad:.

    Heck, I'd say Steve's group feels more like The Avengers since he has a proper team, and they're probably going to be doing what they've always been doing, protecting the world and saving lives, just now as the vigilante's that people were all to quick to claim they were. I wonder if now they're all going to have to get actual secret identities now that they're on the run? Which would be kind of funny after introducing the first major MCU movie hero with an actual secret identity :p.

    What prevented Zemo from truly winning, though, was Cap. From his showing restraint and not killing Tony in the heat of the moment during their final fight (as Zemo intended for them to kill each other), to breaking the rest of The Avengers out of The Raft and actually attempting to make peace with Tony after everything that happened. As long as Steve is around and still believes in doing the right thing and moving past our mistakes and failures, there will always be an Avengers, which sets the team up for a possible reconciliation and reassembling in the future. I'm definitely eager to see what's next for the whole team and the Avengers as a whole :).
     
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    #27 Frontier, May 28, 2016
    Last edited: May 28, 2016
  8. blak89

    blak89 Member

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    So, it looks like Captain America's movies became my favorite ones in the MCU (and apparently, the fandom's favorites). I would have never expected that. To me, as an Italian (and being not from the US in general), Steve Roger's "hero name" and concept always sounded really silly (no offense anyone); but hey, I guess I was wrong, as both The Winter Solider and this one are pretty solid action movies, whether they're based on a comic book or not.

    And, well, I have never read a single Marvel comic book so, in a way, I guess I'm easier to please, when it comes to Marvel films of the last 8 years or so. I'm a causal fan, but I do really enjoy those movies and their characters.

    Civil War is basically the anti-Avengers movie to me and also much better than the Ultron flick nevertheless.
    It stars most of the original team/cast but, you know, instead of fighting against god-like villains, they fight each other.
    I wouldn't go into detail into the film's plot; it seems unnecessary as we're all nerds here, we know exactly what the plot is.
    In any case, it all worked great for me. Despite the ensemble cast, It was easy follow and it had some nice twists and turns here and there.

    The new (and old) heroes are great.
    Each character had its chance to shine, which was basically what the entire airport battle was about, in a mixture of fantastic action and truly hilarious sequences. They saved drama (like, actual drama) for the real, dark climax of the film, which was really emotionally compelling. It would have been really easy to make all of this look ridiculous, with those guys in a suit fighting and all, but Marvel, and this movie particularly -the Russo Brothers, more precisely, has done a great job into making me take those people seriously. It helps that those films, no matter how serious they become, never seem to take themselves seriously in that annoying, Nolan-wannabe way that got really annoying.

    So yeah, it's a great movie for me.

    Now, since, as I said, I've never read the comic books, I can't really judge whether the film is faithful or not to its source material.
    I've seen some people making fun of this movie because "It's just a couple nerds throwing punch at each other while in the comic they had hundreds of heroes at war!". Well, honestly, whether the MCU could afford all these heroes or not, I actually think that having less characters on screen, characters that you actually know and learned to love/hate, understand and care for from the previous movies, is just much more interesting than having entire armies of super dudes and dudettes you barely know something about having a brawl. The risk was a Star Wars: Attack Of The Clones syndrome: two (mostly CG) armies we know nothing about (and so we don't care) fighting each other for reasons we don't really understand. So yeah, less is more I guess.

    I also like how Zemo, another character I've seen being criticized, is in the end just a human.
    And the fact that, in an Universe where Gods and all-powerful aliens are a thing, it was a human who ultimately defeated the Avengers, felt really strong from an emotional point of view and it also helped, quite ironically, to humanize the super heroes even more, as if it was some kind of "wake-up" call for them, that in the end, even with their powers, they're all humans, with their weaknesses, feelings and emotions.

    As one last thing, I loved the new Spider Man. The actor is awkward and a dork; I love his suit.
    Looking forward for the new spidey movie. And also the Black Panther one, obviously.
     
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    #28 blak89, Jun 3, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2016
  9. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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    Pretty dope Hawkeye conceprt art, imo. I can imagine him in that tactical gear back in the day on black ops S.H.I.E.L.D. missions.
     
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  10. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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    <hands in the air>

    [​IMG]

    But seriously... I'm thinking they must have all had Ultimate concept looks at some point then.
     
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  11. Frontier

    Frontier Moderator
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    I do have to admit that it would've been nice to see the novelty of Hawkeye wearing a mask (if not his comic mask) and Wanda her iconic headband in the movies at least once ;).
     
  12. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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    Yeah, the only time I could think Hawkeye would wear that was infiltrating the upstate base -- but that in itself would be too indulgent I guess.
     
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  13. Rick Jones

    Rick Jones Hero Fan
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    They both look like cool takes to me.

    Sent from my HTC6500LVW using Tapatalk
     
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  14. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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    6/29: Collector's Editions cover posted and special features are reportedly
    September 2 digital, September 13 DVD/Blu.

    7/8: There will be a screening and Q&A on July 22 1-2 pm in the Grand Horton Theatre. Markus & McFeely will be in attendance.
     
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  15. reflection01

    reflection01 Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if it will debut on Netflix in September when the Disney deal is supposed to kick in.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  16. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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  17. Frontier

    Frontier Moderator
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    I can definitely see why they would not want to include Red Hulk.

    On-top of everything else the movie was balancing, adding in Ross becoming a Hulk would have probably shook things up a little too much, not to mention an easy excuse for the team's to team-up once Rulk inevitably goes out-of-control, which would've defeated the point of the Civil War :ack:.

    When you think about it, given the Spidey suit in Civil War was made by Tony and had some mechanical touches that you don't usually see in a Spider-Man suit, it was basically equivalent to the Iron Spider suit. It just didn't have the design or arachnid appendages :sweat:.
     
  18. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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    8/25: Russos considered using the Madbomb in the third act before RDJ signed on. Good thing since Carter season 1 already did something similar.

    11/10: There's an unused version of the Spidey-Signal from the Spider-Man end credits teaser. Tony left a message in the signal screen, "Swing by the tower. Got some new upgrades you should see."
     
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  19. Frontier

    Frontier Moderator
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    I wonder how they're going to use the Spidey-Signal going forward? The way they've got it setup, it seems to be Spider-Man's own Superhero phone :sweat:.
     

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