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Bruce Wayne's age in the DC Animated Universe

Discussion in 'The DC Comics Animation Forum' started by Hawk Wing, Mar 7, 2009.

  1. Hawk Wing

    Hawk Wing Member

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    This may seem like a dumb question and you mighte ven wonder why i would even make this thread or even care about this but i think ive come across Bruce waynes complete ages in the DC animated universe using common sense etc. In the Episode robins recoking, Robin was about 8 years old so that would be about 9 years before batman TAS would place that episode in 1983 which would make bruce roughly 23-24.

    Bruce Wayne in 1983-1984 approximately 23-24
    http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/batman/btas/episodes/robinsreckoningp1/18.jpg

    So then that would make Bruce roughly 33-34 in Batman TAS in 1992
    Bruce Wayne in Batman TAS 1992 approximately 33-34
    http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/batman/btas/episodes/featofclayp1/14.jpg

    So in The TNBA years bruce must of been in his later 30s
    Bruce Wayne in TNBA 1999 approximately 40 years old
    http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/batman/tnba/episodes/03coldcomfort/11.jpg

    Heres where it gets tricky, 1999-2019, we know bruce was around 60 in batman beyond rebirth but we have no images of him from 2000-2009 right? Wrong. In The Batman Beyond episode "Out of the past" we see a semi young Bruce Wayne in fighting condition. In all common sense he would have to of been in his late 40s-early 50s. So taht would palce his out of the past look in around 2009
    Bruce Wayne 2009 approximately 50.
    http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/beyond/episodes/outofthepast/60.jpg

    Bruce Wayne in 2019 approximately 60
    http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/beyond/episodes/rebirthpt1/09.jpg
    So there you have it. Bruce Waynes ages in the dc aniamted univserse from 1984-2019
     
  2. Gonzales

    Gonzales Active Member

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    I'm not sure about numbers, but during BTAS I always figured Bruce to be in his mid-30s.
     
  3. Dayspring

    Dayspring Active Member

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    I find it's easiest to use "Peanuts Time" to figure out his age, so that we don't get bogged in particulars.

    Phantasm = 10 years before Now = Mid 20s
    BTAS = Now = Mid 30s
    TNAB = 3-5 years from Now = Late 30s
    JL/U = Current Now = 5-10 years from Now = 40s
    2009 = less than 10 years from Current Now = 50s
    BB = 40-50 years from Current Now = 80s to 90s
    Epilogue = 65 years from Current Now = Over 100
     
  4. Hawk Wing

    Hawk Wing Member

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  5. Dayspring

    Dayspring Active Member

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    That's why I said Peanuts Time. Batman Beyond is 40-50 years after whatever the hell "now" is. At the time the batmanbeyond.com profile was made, "now" was only TNAB.
     
  6. ABrown

    ABrown Active Member

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    Batman:MOTP Flashback: 22 ish
    Batman:TAS episodes: 32-35 ish/Early 30's
    The New Batman Adventures: 37-39 ish/Late 30's
    Justice League/JLU: 42-45 ish/Early 40's
    Batman Beyond: 84-87 ish/Mid 80's
    Epilogue: 100 ish
     
    #6 ABrown, Mar 8, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 19, 2009
  7. Hawk Wing

    Hawk Wing Member

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    Thanks for all the replies. I guess we all have different opinions on this. So by your reasoning Bruce Wayne was "84-87ish" on Batman Beyond so taht would of made him 64-67ish on rebirth and taht would make him 44-47 on TNAB? That simply doesnt make sense. Batman Beyond was suspoed to be 40 years after 1999 when it came out. Even in the commercials it said the year 2039.
     
  8. ABrown

    ABrown Active Member

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    But I usally go by Batman Beyond being 50 years from now. Epilogue's beginning said that it was 65 years from now. And that was supposed to be 15 years after the Batman Beyond episodes.
     
  9. Naninou

    Naninou Member

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    Well here's how i see it:

    Beyond the suggested ages in TNBA, the characters in the 'NOW' can't age.

    B.T. said right here on this forum that Bruce Wayne is always early to mid 30's in the 'present day', whether that be TNBA or JLU, and that in the present day Batman Beyond is always 50 years into the future.

    For me this is the word from the master. If b.t. says BB is 50 years in the future, then i'm not gonna argue that it really was 40. Rule nr. 1: The DM is ALWAYS right. Rule nr. 2: If the DM is wrong, see rule nr. 1.

    Present day age rules are:

    Bruce Wayne = always early to mid 30's

    Barbara Gordon and Dick Grayson = always early 20's

    Tim Drake = always mid teens.

    They all only age after the "present day" in the DCAU, because otherwise they would get older and older and older and thus more and more out of place with their ages in the '50 years from now' future. If Batman was 45 as some here suggest in JLU he'd be 95 in BB and 110 in the last episode...

    If BB is always 50 years from now as b.t. says, then that means TNBA and JLU are both the same NOW, even though one chronologically takes place after the other.

    So why did Supergirl go from mid to late teens between STAS and JLU?

    Here's my explination: Both Dick and Barbara have gone from late teens to early 20's between BTAS and TNBA. STAS however, had no part in this time jump, and ran in between the two series, wich means that the 3 in wich Supergirl aged can be seen as the same 3 years Dick and Barbara aged.

    As b.t. also said that their DCAU timline isn't carved in stone, i think you could stretch it. When Kara was discovered in STAS, it jumped straight forward to a point in time where she's already living on the farm and is already bored with farmlife. That's one undetermined timeframe to start, and i think it's about a year or at least several months. Then you could stretch the time between her appearences in STAS and her appearence in TNBA with Batgirl as also being a few more years when the 3 lost years are transported into the superman timeline. Making Batgirl and Supergirl more similair in age.
    Watching Girls Nite Out actually makes more sense for Kara and Barbara to be a late teen and an early 20's, since they don't look that much appart age-wise.
    There is even some confirmation that Kara isn't 16 anymore in TNBA, because when penguin suggests Supergirl and Batgirl aren't old enough to be in his club, Supergirl says "wanna see my ID?" wich implies she's about 18 or 19 already in that episode, and not 16 when she first appeared in STAS.

    I'd say that putting earthly years such as "This happend in 1992 and that happend in 1986" is silly. Nothing about the DCAU is taking place in our reality, so trying to fit it into a historical context doesn't make sense.

    1997 came and went without terminators taking over the world... 2003, still no Judgment Day. In a few years it's gonna be 2015, wich slowly wakes me up to the fact that i'm probably never going get my beloved hoverboard.:sweat:

    Did Batman begin in 1985 or 2005? Is Barbara Gordon/Batgirl in the 'present time' about 23 years old like the Timmverse implies? or is she the little 8 year-old daughter of Gordon in The Dark Knight, or is she infact the crippled ageless comics Barbara Gordon/Oracle?
     
  10. ABrown

    ABrown Active Member

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    Well here's the thing: The Batman Beyond episodes took place 50 years from when the New Batman Adventures ended, not when the Justice League episodes ended. You have to figure at least five years or so went by during that period. If you figure that Bruce was between 35 and 40 years old when the Justice League episodes ended, then that would've meant that he was only about 26 when the Batman:The Animated Series episodes began. I've always figured that Dick was somewhere around 19-20 when the Batman:TAS episodes began. And there's no way that Bruce and Dick are only 7 years apart. They're a good 13 years or so apart in age. Just look at the flashback in "Robin's Reckoning." Dick was somewhere around 12, and Bruce was probably about 25. Fast forward about 7 years or so to when Batman:TAS episodes begin, and that makes Bruce around 32.
     
  11. Naninou

    Naninou Member

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    Wrong. JLU DOES take place 50 years before BB, and Bruce is in his early to mid 30's. Didn't you read b.t.'s replies on this forum?
    He stated that BB always takes place 50 years from all series that takes place in the "NOW" timeframe, whether that's TNBA or JLU, and that age-wise in the "NOW" Batman is always in his early to mid 30's.
    Bruce Timm stated several times that BB definately IS 50 years from JLU, when people suggested otherwise.

    It's pretty clear that there's no point in continuing trying to work out or rationalize the DCAU timeline through 'real time' or 'real world' logic, specially when the creator is so clear about how these things work.

    The DCAU timeline is sorta like driving in the Flintstones. Fred's car drives forward, you know that they are on their way to something, yet they keep passing the same homes and trees over and over...
     
  12. Dayspring

    Dayspring Active Member

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    But that wasn't always the case. Paul Dini and Bruce Timm originally used "nearly 40 years later" when Batman Beyond was "NOW". Granted they could still have used the "always after whatever NOW is" motif, but adding over 10 years to the gap messes things up, as approximately 40 years is referenced on-camera at least twice. Personally I would have prefered it if if Batman Beyond took place 50 years after (either the start or end of) TNAB and "over 40 years after NOW." That would solve the dillemma and give us an idea of how much (relative) time passed between TNAB and Justice League.

    Where can we go to see Bruce Timm's posts on the forum? All I ever knew about the 50 years comment was from the JLU DVD commentaries. I'd be interested in (cough post-stalking cough) seeing Timm's posts.
     
  13. ABrown

    ABrown Active Member

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    I think that we should just compromise and say that the Batman Beyond episodes took place around 50 years from "now" at the end of the New Batman Adventures Episodes. And since about 7 years went by after JLU ended, one could say that the Batman Beyond episodes were closer to 40 years from "now."
     
  14. Naninou

    Naninou Member

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    http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?p=1572476#post1572476


    I do realize the continuity problems some people have here, but i settle for anything that Bruce Timm says, regardless of any continuity issues...

    Wich i'll adress now:

    Bruce Wayne's age isn't as akward when you add 10 extra years to 40 years if he's 35 now, but even if Barbara Gordon is as young as 20 in the JLU that would make her 70 in BB, and still being in-office in your early 70's is not impossible, but it is pretty impressive to say the least. Germany's greatest Crimi 'Derrick' was finished because Horst Tappert had set himself the limit of 75.
    I was under the impression that Babs was like in her early 60's in BB, but that would make her 10 to 13 in the JLU, so... :sweat:
     
    #14 Naninou, Mar 20, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 20, 2009
  15. Naninou

    Naninou Member

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    Uhmm... I'm not going to make compromises to the idea's fans have on the subject, when Bruce Timm's statements are clear.

    Again... You keep trying to force a realworld timeline in a cartoon about wich the creator clearly states that this is not the case.

    Also, continuity wise, the Joker is still alive in JLU. As long as the Joker is alive, there is a time wall. Watch ROTJ and you can see that Tim Drake was TNBA age when the Joker was 'terminated'.
    I think what Bruce Timm tried to explain is that it's basically 'groundhog day' in the DCAU. The Joker's death, Nightwing leaving Gotham, always in the near future. BB is always 50 years from now, and Bruce is always early to mid 30's, Babs and Dick early 20's, and Tim mid teens.

    There is no room for a compromise there. Going against what Bruce Timm says just because you think it doesn't make sense, is a useless argument, and you're always on the short end of the rope, because you're the fan, and he's the creator...
    Even if Timm decides that BB is actually 350 years in the future, that Dick and Barbara are actually twins, and that Bruce Wayne started calling himself "Ben K. Wayne" long before they were born... That's his choice, and we have to accept that.
     
  16. ABrown

    ABrown Active Member

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    Ok ok, Bruce (Batman) is in his 30's from the beginning of the Batman:TAS episodes through the end of the JLU episodes. It's almost the same as what I had said anyway. It's not worth fighting about or getting upset about. As Bruce (Timm) said: "IT'S ONLY A FRICKEN CARTOON!"

     
    #16 ABrown, Mar 20, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 20, 2009
  17. Naninou

    Naninou Member

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    Well, i'm not upset about anything, it's just that i find it a bit silly that people are spending so much time trying to correct Bruce Timm, as if his comments and statements on the subject are just another fan's opinion.

    Even the Nolan films are gonna have to deal with this at some point.
    Right now, Gordon's daughter is about 8 years old in TDK. It's gonna take almost 8 to 10 before she'd become Batgirl chronologically, and by that time Christian Bale is 45...
    Though that probably will never happen since Nolan and Bale both suffer from a serious case of Batgirl-o-phobia.
     
  18. Dayspring

    Dayspring Active Member

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    I think you're exaggerating a bit here. That's not at all what we're doing. The point that I and many others are making is that Bruce Timm is the one who created the "almost 40" rule in the first place, referenced it on-camera, and then later retconned it to exactly 50 only off-camera. Meanwhile, the only thing the needless retcon offers is a continuity problem.

    Another thing to note is that it's possible 50 years from JLU's "NOW" could take us into Batman Beyond's "NOW" -meaning where we last left off with Terry- as opposed to just the first episode of Batman Beyond.

    In other words:
    1) "NOW + nearly 40" = Terry becomes Batman
    2) "NOW + over 40" = after "The Call"
    3) "NOW + 50" = "Once and Future Thing Part II"
    4) "NOW + 65" = "Epilogue"

    So Batman Beyond's THEN = first episode of BB = JLU + nearly 40, while Batman Beyond's NOW = "Once and Future Thing Part 2" = JLU + 50.
     
  19. Dayspring

    Dayspring Active Member

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    Back on-topic, here's how I see Bruce's age:

    MOTP: 20-22 = 10 years prior to "early to mid-thirties"
    BTAS: 30-32 = "early to mid-thirties"
    TNAB: 33-35 = BTAS + 3 years, while still "early to mid-thirties"
    JL: 35 = end of whatever TNAB age-range is
    JLU: 36 = 1-2 years after the Imperium are defeated
    BB: 75 = 40 years after JL, "nearly 40" years after JLU
    Future Shock: 77-80 = 0-3 years after "The Call"
    ROTJ: 80 = end of whatever Future Shock age-range is
    Once and Future Thing Part II: 86 = 50 years after JLU
    Epilogue: 101 = 15 years after previous entry
     
  20. Naninou

    Naninou Member

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    Uhhmm... actuallly, the 50 years thing WAS confirmed on-screen. JLU's Epilogue says it's 65 years from "now". Terry says he and Dana have been dating for 15 years, and that he was 16 back when he started as Batman. 15 minus 65 = 50.

    I'll won't deny that when TNBA ended and BB began official consensus was that it was 39/40 years.
    The old Tim Drake claims the death of the Joker was "almost 40 years ago", wich implies not only that it was 40 years, but that the Joker was killed right after TNBA... Making the Joker's existence in the JLU another slight continuity scratcher, if you'd insist that JLU takes place years after TNBA.... ROTJ creates a time wall that prevents the characters from aging, wich could only resolved by some sort of Terminator-esque alteration of the timeline in the present, to change the course of history/future.

    In short, any Batman series that chronologically takes place more then a year after TNBA has to live with the facts from ROTJ, that Robin is fired, and Batman's greatest enemy, The Joker, is terminated.
    I seriously doubt that Bruce Timm and Paul Dini would ever be interested in a present day Batman series without Robin, and The Joker and Harley Quinn.
    Batman without the Joker is something nobody would like, and so we have to accept a time wall/peanuts time.

    There you go again with that realworld realtime rational over-analyzing of something that can't be rationally explained because it isn't real...

    The whole concept you're thinking up here is simply going waaay to far trying to force the real-time concept into a cartoon that clearly doesn't want it, in a continuing attempt to make a point. Yes, i get your point, and your conclusions, but why continue arguing about it when, regardless of what the fans think, the creator doesn't change his mind about it either way.

    Barbara is 23 in TNBA from the first to the last episode. She isn't "Only just 23" in the 1st episode, and "almost 24" in the last episode, she's 23 PERIOD. BB is not 50 years from now in season 1 and 49 in season 2. It's 50 PERIOD.

    I mean, if you think that 10 extra years upon 40 is causing a continuity error, try watching The Simpsons, and figure out how old they REALLY are, and why history tells us Marge and Homer started dating in the 60's according to the first seasons, and in the 70's in the later ones... Or better yet, the fact that Bart is ten, and has been so for over 3 presidents, George Bush Senior, Bill Clinton, George Bush Jr. ... hehehe!:p
     
    #20 Naninou, Mar 21, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 21, 2009

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