1. View our list of the Top 10 Characters That Need a DC Animated Film. Click here.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. We are looking for a volunteer to help out with entering the DC and Marvel comics solicitations. If you are interested, please contact Harley.
    Dismiss Notice

Before the Fall: Happiness, the Future, and JLU Batman

Discussion in 'The DC Comics Animation Forum' started by Trevor Balena, Jun 10, 2006.

  1. S.C.B

    S.C.B Too close.

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2005
    Messages:
    1,804
    Likes Received:
    0
    Did you not notice how desperate Batman looked as he ran away from the beams? And the fact that he was knocked unconscious by the blast? Doesn't sound routine to me; it looked quite the opposite to me, in fact.
     
  2. Casey Mack

    Casey Mack Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2005
    Messages:
    1,646
    Likes Received:
    0
    I suppose, but how does that change the fact he dodged Darkseids omega effect? No being has ever dodged it before, not superman hell not any other being Darkseid has faced off against. It was yet another gimmick move, all to hide the fact Batman has been given way to much style and no substance. Whats next he dodges a lightning bolt from he christian god? Or i know he goes to mt.olympus and says some cool one liners and then takes out the greek gods:shrug:
     
  3. S.C.B

    S.C.B Too close.

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2005
    Messages:
    1,804
    Likes Received:
    0
    Superman has dodged the Omega Beam, in 'Twilight'. Darkseid was just misremembering, I guess.

    I think the point was that Batman barely dodged it; he didn't act as though if it were nothing.
     
  4. FireWarrior

    FireWarrior The Ultimate Warrior

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2006
    Messages:
    1,259
    Likes Received:
    0

    I have to go with S.C.B. here. Superman has dodged the Omega beams before he attacked Darkseid. I don't know why people tend to look over this?

    Anyway, normally I would agree with you with Batman doing things that no normal man can do, but in the case of the Omega beam dodging I completely disagree. It was obvious when Darkseid shot the Omega Beams it took everything that Batman physically to dodge that shot. And I mean everything, he had to use all his speed, prowess, and agility just to dodge ONE shot of the Omega beams. Not to mention that when he did dodge it, he flew into a pile of rubble and was knocked out. I dunno about you but that sure wasn't routine at all. Routine would mean he dodged the beams and then land on his feet and probably throw a Batarang back at Darkseid with ease. But obviously that was not the case since he ended up flying into a pile of rubble rendering him unconscious.
     
  5. Casey Mack

    Casey Mack Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2005
    Messages:
    1,646
    Likes Received:
    0
    He shouldn't be able to dodge them period, and Darkseid even commented he was the first being to dodge them. If no other being Darkseid has come against[gods,superheros,aliens, etc] can dodge them, and Batman is "only human" and dodges them [no matter what the effort]. It would seem another way to sell Batman, but forgets the fact Batman should not be able to do such god-like feats.Anyone else were written in that situation, I bet that character would be fried or injured badly. I miss the days when Batman was written as a character, and some way of showing us how "cool" he is. We get it already you know, the producers love Batman, but please don't sacrifice his character for some "cool" loner image. i love batman to, but i dun have a hard on for the character[like i assume they did].
     
  6. jv2k

    jv2k Faster than the fat flash

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2004
    Messages:
    1,812
    Likes Received:
    0
    I don't really get what your saying, how are eating lunch in an organization you work for, giving a friend love advice(this was before Tim Died and he pushed everyone away), giving someone he respects a lot a birthday present, and doing a friend who has not only saved yourself, but the entire world a favor campy. Campy would be if he went to Mc.Donalds with GL, or if he was giving advise to someone on the street as they passed him by, or if he were to have thrown superman a giant birthday party on the watchtowers and we saw him dance.

    As for him standing in public, like they said in "The Clash" being a part of the justice league is more, its being a symbol. Batman's come a long way from being an urban legend. He's a symbol now, and despite his mortality, has more than a few times saved the team. I know what your saying though, I also prefer batman when he's alone working the streets of gotham(which is why when I watch batman:TAS I pretend it's out of continuity) but this isn't Batman:TAS anymore, he's known world wide.

    Oh and Yea he was the only one to dodge the omega beams, but it was difficult and even then the only reason he avoided them was because they hit one of darksied's imps. It's not like he pulled a matrix on us and dodged it.
     
  7. Aldrius

    Aldrius Arrogant Instigator

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2006
    Messages:
    3,875
    Likes Received:
    0
    The Omega Beam-Dodging was fine...Batman had a head-start... Darkseid DID warn him it was coming, too...

    *Shrug* didn't bother me.

    The thing is, JLU and to a lesser extent TNBA is a team-up show. We can't have Batman be constantly sitting on roof-tops brooding. Saying one or two dry comedic lines. Maybe Robin going on about something next to him.

    In TNBA he has a loud-mouth kid who wants constant attention, and a snippy fun-loving batgirl. He can't stay quiet under those circumstances. In JLU things get worse, he's got an entire team to play off of... he can't be silent. He can be a bad-ass, but he can't be the same detective he was in Batman: The Animated Series, there's too many other characters.
     
  8. Wolf Boy2

    Wolf Boy2 Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2006
    Messages:
    3,869
    Likes Received:
    0
    This is getting sad. Your posts stopped being intelligent ages ago, now you are just repeating the same junk.

    THREAD CLOSED.

    Oh, wait. I can't do that. Shoot.:p
     
  9. Batman Fan

    Batman Fan Batarang Attack

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2005
    Messages:
    1,696
    Likes Received:
    0
    I'm not sure I understand why you have such a problem with Batman dodging Darkseid's Omega Beams, would you rather have him incinerated or terribly injured by them and end up dead or in a hospital bed on what could possibly be his last DCAU appearence?

    As for his change in personality from B:TAS to JLU, the show isn't about Batman anymore. We don't have time to see Batman alone on the screen moping around, we already know his story, his motivation, and why he is the way he is, this was explained in B:TAS. In JLU, he's in a completely different environment and his actions and personality must reflect that. Would you rather see Batman sulking in the Watchtower or out their fighting for justice which he vowed to do. In no way does Batman socializing or eating affect his character. We know that Batman swore to devote his life to protect the innocent and uphold justice by taking down the people who try to abolish it, that's what Batman is all about, both in B:TAS and JLU. So, just because he's seems a little cheerier in JLU doesn't mean it diminishes his character, I mean, he is human and has needs and emotions that need to be expressed. So basically, I don't see the problem if he has lunch with his colleagues or says a snappy one-liner every now and then.
     
  10. FireWarrior

    FireWarrior The Ultimate Warrior

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2006
    Messages:
    1,259
    Likes Received:
    0
    You actually believe what Darkseid said? This was the same guy that said in Twilight, that he has beaten and "humbled" Superman many times, when in fact Superman beat him up in Legacy. Let's not also forget that Darkseid claimed that Superman barely managed to hold his own in Twilight, but from what I can see Superman was on the attack and pretty much pummeled Darkseid. So Batman WAS NOT the first one to dodge the Omega Beams, Superman did dodge them in "Twilight".

    Like I said Batman put ALL his effort, and I mean ALL of it. And at least he didn't land on his feet. He got knocked out. And also Darkseid did warn him as well with "Flee".
     
  11. Darknight66

    Darknight66 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2005
    Messages:
    474
    Likes Received:
    0
    Remember, he only survived the omega beam because, he put one of the aliens in the way, if that alien had not been there it would have followed him until he was killed by it
     
  12. Arrakhat

    Arrakhat Trust me, I'm a doctor

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2005
    Messages:
    1,688
    Likes Received:
    0
    And here I thought he wasn't making sense, but it was just me all along. :sweat: That's a relief.

    Anyway, Batman really isn't that different in JL/U. I remember an older episode by the name of Chemistry, in which he was ready to quit for a happier life. Seems to me that Batman can be cheery when the mood hits him. Fickle to the last, that Batman.
     
  13. TheGrayGhost

    TheGrayGhost Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2006
    Messages:
    340
    Likes Received:
    0
    I agree completely. He hasn't changed all that much. Sure, events happened along the timeline which may have made him more driven, but even then, he's been pretty much the same. The same characteristics and personality traits and behavior patterns are there, but it is the environment around him that is changing. I often myself at odds with fans who try to make the mythology needlessly complex just for trying to justify something that doesn't need justification.

    But about Chemistry, although it certainly can be argued, I think it was more of Poison Ivy's pheromone manipulation that caused Batman to rethink his life choices. There might have been a part of him that wanted to accept the lie, but I think it was more of Poison Ivy's work than anything else.
     
  14. Jazzie

    Jazzie Member

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2005
    Messages:
    264
    Likes Received:
    0
    To me if there is one thing Batman should have isa bulletproof costume. At least the cape for goodness sake.
     
  15. Lepard

    Lepard Member

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2006
    Messages:
    34
    Likes Received:
    0
    I was under the impression that Darkseid called him a "flea".
     
  16. Aldrius

    Aldrius Arrogant Instigator

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2006
    Messages:
    3,875
    Likes Received:
    0
    I think the main point is, he's not the main character anymore. We can't show him and Alfred chatting anymore. There's just too many other characters to focus on.

    He has to be the straight-man, we just can't get the range of emotions we got in B:TAS...

    I guess I already made that point. Just wanted to clean it up.
     
  17. Wolf Boy2

    Wolf Boy2 Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2006
    Messages:
    3,869
    Likes Received:
    0
    And Andrea? He almost never became Batman.
     
  18. TheGrayGhost

    TheGrayGhost Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2006
    Messages:
    340
    Likes Received:
    0
    What about Andrea?

    If I remember correctly, the pheromone manipulation was actually addressed within the episode:

    EDIT: "This is all Poison Ivy's work, isn't it? She must have grown you in her lab and coated you with those pheromones she uses."

    The pheromones lured him.
     
  19. Wolf Boy2

    Wolf Boy2 Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2006
    Messages:
    3,869
    Likes Received:
    0
    He almost gave up on becoming Batman so he could marry her. He even commented that never expected to "be happy."

    And when she resurfaced 10 years later, he struggled again with the desire to drop it all and get hitched.

    Bats is a paradox. He is a loner, yet he really does want people in his life. A true loner would've fired Alfred, sent Robin to an orphanage, and told the various women in his life to kiss off. But he didn't. In his own way, Batman wants friends and love. He just wants them on his terms.
     
  20. Casey Mack

    Casey Mack Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2005
    Messages:
    1,646
    Likes Received:
    0
    Idun mind superman dodgeing them, because you know superman is freaking superman. If Flash had dodged them that would make sense, but no way in hell should Batman have dodged them. If you beleive Batman can dodge the omega-effect then thats fine. But i wonder what you would think if Robin dodged them, or Bat-girl even. first him and "superman" are argueing in "Twilight" then the next episode they are drinking coffee in the Batman Mobile?:shrug: subplots are dropped from one episode to the next at times, and Batman fully became just a cool dude in a Bat-suit with a deep voice. I remeber one episode of the early 80s superfriends cartoon, had more character development for Batman then the last 2 seasons of JLU. Batman was nearly in all the episodes of the show, and they still didn't seem to add anything extra to his character. They did add some cool new gadgets like the "Bat-copter":shrug: from "Ultimatum" . If a person who had never seen BTAS, or Batman beyond decided start watching Justice League Unlimited. They would think Batman is a really "cool" character, but they would probbaly be shocked if they watched "Mask of the Phantasm".
     

Share This Page

  • Find Toonzone on Facebook

  • Toonzone News

  • Site Updates

    Upcoming Premieres

  • Toonzone Fan Sites


Tac Anti Spam from Surrey Forum