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Batman Beyond "Lost Soul" Talkback (Spoilers)

Discussion in 'The DC Comics Animation Forum' started by James Harvey, Jul 13, 2002.

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  1. James Harvey

    James Harvey The World's Finest
    Staff Member Administrator Moderator Reporter

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    Batman faces off against his own Bat-suit!

    [​IMG]

    Episode #17 - Lost Soul
    Original Airdate - October 9th, 1999.

    The virtual soul of a deceased communications mogul takes control of Terry's batsuit. When the villain plans to download his virtual brain into his own grandchild, a powerless Terry has to fight his own suit to save the boy.

    Comments?
     
  2. Chris Wood

    Chris Wood Desslar

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    It was a pretty cool story, and raised a couple of interesting points.

    When the suitless Terry declined Bruce's old costumes and put on that mask, was he supposed to be assuming Robin's role?

    What power does Bruce have over Terry? You'd think Terry would sometimes tell him to stop giving him lip. Every time Terry turns around Bruce is issuing some new order. Where does he get off? Even Robin got more respect. Of course, that was a closer relationship.
     
  3. Bleu Unicorn

    Bleu Unicorn \ (^v^) /

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    [color=63B8FF]When I first saw this episode, I thought it absolutely was the coolest. Terry fighting the Batsuit and all was definitely very interesting. And taking Nightwing's mask made me smile. But now having seen it some ten plus times, I really have a gripe... all that repeat animation of them wires was giving me a wicked headache. And I don't know, the plot seems, well, weak to me. Maybe it's because I've seen it so much. But, eh, something bothers me that I can't truly pinpoint.

    4 stars from me.[/color]
     
    #3 Bleu Unicorn, Jul 14, 2002
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 4, 2002
  4. Barb Gordon

    Barb Gordon Nin-Mod

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    Lost Soul-some thoughts

    I happened upon Batman Beyond last night and Lost Soul was the episode airing. One of the more interesting, that for sure, with Terry fighting the Batsuit, but I was looking past that and random, subtle things that probably mean nothing at all! Even so, there were two things in particular with this episode, one that I thought hinted towards something, and another that I found symbolic...don't know what it symbolized, but I found it symbolic nonetheless. The first is when Terry has to manually get out of the Batcave, heck, I'd groan too, and Bruce responds with "None of the Robins ever complained." I'm not sure why, but that line got me thinking about how in the cartoon continuity it stands as there only being two Robins, but of course in the comic continuity it's three. I mean, couldn't he have just said "neither of the Robin's complained?"....the "none of" line just seemed to suggest that there were more then two. But that's just me, and I'm very weird at times. Anyhoo, the other thing was when Bruce stops Terry before Terry runs off to stop, well, the suit. Bruce grabbing Terry by the arm was very reminiscent of Batman grabbing Robin by the arms in Old Wounds, and add to that that of the four costume cases, minus the fifth empty one, they stop and talk in front of Nightwing's. Now I know that Terry had to go to that case anyway because he grabbed the face mask, but still, there seemed to be loads of meaning and symbolism in that area. Thoughts, agreements/disagreements?

    ~Barb
     
  5. Bones Justice

    Bones Justice Bring on the noise!

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    I just saw this episode for the first time after buying the new DVD release. I guess there are a few episodes I hadn't seen before. I don't know most of the episodes by title but I thought I had seen them all. I've since seen "A Touch of Curare" and now "Lost Soul" on the new DVD's. And there's another Curare episode, apparently, so hopefully there will be more DVD releases soon.

    Didn't notice that. I suppose it's possible that there will be another Robin after Tim Drake, though with the events of ROTJ, I doubt it. Or maybe Jason Todd is an untold tale of BTAS. I would imagine that it's something that none of them like to talk about. Though I think ROTJ was actually meant to be a version of the Jason Todd story in some respects.

    I think Bruce thinks of Terry as one of his Robins, maybe he thinks of Batgirl as one, too, in a sense. Afterall, Bruce made it clear that he still thinks of himself as the real Batman. Now that I think about it, so do I. I really like Terry and BB as a series, don't get me wrong, but Bruce will always be the real Batman. Terry is Batman's new partner or maybe an extension of Bruce, doing what Bruce is no longer physically capable of. But Bruce still has all of the know-how and detective skills which is just as much a part of Batman.

    I did notice this. I thought it was symbolic, too. He doesn't take Robin's mask, he takes Nightwing's. Nightwing is a symbol of rebellion for Batman's original partner and now Terry.

    Overall, I enjoyed the episode. It was nice to see Terry pay his dues for real without the suit. I think it was believable that Terry was able to take down the Batsuit like he did, using a combination of old Bat-tech, street smarts, and a little luck. I would imagine that Bruce has been training Terry in acrobatics and martial arts, too. Presumably, Bruce disarmed the security on the bat-belt he gave Terry -- either that, or it was a very old one before he put in the protective zappers!

    I liked the ending. I would like to see at least one suitless-adventure though Batman Beyond should never stray too far from Terry having all that futuristic technology at his disposal.

    The voice acting was top-notch, as usual. I recognized Stacy Keach almost right away as the guest-star. And was it just me or did the automated elevator's voice sound an awful lot like Brainiac from STAS?
     
  6. Fone Bone

    Fone Bone Matt Zimmer

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    Not my favorite episode but not really bad like some other season two eps. I liked Terry fighting the suit. The Batman versus Batsuit battle was a long time coming. Is it the suit or the man inside the suit that matters? Stacey Keach was cool and the computer's skull-like face was freaky. Still for some reason I wasn't loving this episode. Can't place my finger on it. Score: ***.
     
  7. The Caterpillar

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    Overall the episode is rather solid. It was the sort of situation that had to happen though, Terry loosing the Batsuit and having to fight without it. This episode helps to clarify why it has to be Terry who wears the Batsuit, instead of anyone else, given that from first appearences anyone could do his job while sporting such a technically advanced wardrobe.

    On a side note, I always liked how, when it is unpowered, the Batsuit becomes too heavy for Terry to move in. It strikes me as wonderfully metaphoric, like "the mantle of Batman is a heavy weight to bare" or something of that sort. The metaphor gets played around in this episode, as well as in "Rebirth" when Terry first puts on the Batsuit.
     
  8. Bones Justice

    Bones Justice Bring on the noise!

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    Is that right though? I just watched it a couple of days ago and I don't remember it being too heavy when unpowered. I don't have the DVD right here so I'll re-watch it later.

    Doesn't really make sense, either. How could he carry it in his backpack if it was that heavy? I never got the impression that it had anti-gravity built in. Though I guess it would make the boot jets and wings a little more believable. They've just never portrayed it that way that I can recall.
     
  9. The Caterpillar

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    Oops, I think your right. Just re-watched "Rebirth" again and Bruce Wayne refers to the loss of control as a "failsafe," so it isnt just a matter of weight. Still, the notion that Terry doesnt have complete control over the Batsuit is an interesting one.
     
  10. superfreak

    superfreak Tekkaman Blade

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    This episode is one of the better written ones in BB. Overall, I give this episode four stars
     
  11. Pyro

    Pyro Active Member

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    Wow! I just saw this episode for the first time and I was mighty impressed. First of all, the design of Vance's computer head was awesomely creepy and well animated! Second, this episode had some cool music. Third, I loved seeing Terry fight as "Batman" without the suit for the first time. I really liked the scene where Terry loses mobility in the suit while in the water and the waves crash into him. Also, it was really creepy when the suit sat up in the cave, and at the end when Vance died.

    I thought it was pretty cool when I recognized another Boy Meets World actor in Rider Strong as Bobby.

    Robert Vance... With me being a huge fan of "The Office", I instantly thought of Bob Vance of Vance Refrigeration! :p I suppose this Bob Vance came first though.

    Was the voice actress for Summer Gleason the same as the one from BTAS? I don't think it was.
     
  12. Mattashell

    Mattashell Before punk,there were NUGGETS

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    It occurs to me that the face of Robert Vance looks like the face of The Supreme Being from Gilliam's Time Bandits.

    Anyway, I always dig these kind of stories where a rogue bit of software becomes sentient and wreaks havoc on the computer network.

    Lost Soul: **** I really like the playing around with Terry's place in the Bat family. With that domino mask on he resembles Dick, which is why he's so cool.

    I also noted the line "None of the Robins" instead of "Neither", I also wondered when did any of Batman's sidekicks ever have to crank that thing by hand? B:TAS doesn't take place in the middle ages. :confused:
     
  13. FightingDreamer

    FightingDreamer Mutant on the Rise

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    OK, Terry basically stating the theme of the episode at one point is a little on-the-nose, but man is this episode otherwise awesome. It's clearly the best episode of Season 2, which had a few bright spots and a lot of "meh"; this is, obviously, one of the bright spots.
    Laundry List!
    -I like that Terry just chooses a mask instead of donning a whole outfit; it fits his character, plus it avoids possible snickering from me about how well he would fit in an ancient costume ('cause you know it would probably fit perfectly).
    -Vance is quite interesting, from his design to the spooky voice performance by Stacy Keach, as well as the question of his identity. Is he the real Vance, or just an approximate simulation as Terry claims? It's also a neat parallel to the question of Batman: does the suit matter more than the man?
    -The final fight is brutal, one of the best fights in the series, with the boarding crew taking their typical glee in getting to do anything they want to a robotic opponent.
    -The failsafe switch has an ironic undertone to its use: before, Bruce pushed it out of spite for Terry. Now he does it to save him. Neat.
    -Nice visuals whenever the suit deflates, especially at the end.

    Overall, this is a top episode of the series.
     
  14. redwolfbear

    redwolfbear New Member

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    watch lost soul and out of the past back to back folks

    both episodes deal with a dead person using computer technology to transfer their surviving mind and soul into a livin persons body(robert vance and his grandson bobby in lost soul ) ra'ash and talia al ghul in out of the past)

    it was never stated by the end of lost soul who the person was that bought out robert vances computer technology company from his inexpereinced grandson bobby but then you realise while watching out of the past that ra'ash as much as actually says he has recently perfected his computer mind transfers technology so that he can now transfer his mind and soul into the body of a person who is in no way a immeidately related blood relative(a flaw that existed in it originally limiting him to only transferring his mind into talia body originally) therefore i state that this episode effectively serves asa continuation from the end of the lost soul episode for this matter plot point wise
     
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  15. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
    Staff Member Moderator

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    Yeah, I felt the same away about "Untouchable" and the "Curse of the Kobra" two parter. Those 3 isotopes Repeller was hired to steal were for Zander's thermal bomb.
     
  16. the_joker

    the_joker Active Member

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    Terry and Bruce were great in this episode. The suit is controlled by a rogue program, and Terry was able to prove himself as the real deal in the end, though him asking that "question" was not very subtle. At least I know that Terry has always wondered what it means to be Batman and has gotten his answer.

    What's really interesting is that Bruce didn't seem to have much faith in Terry at first. When the suit broke out of the Batcave, Terry decides to go after the suit, but Bruce stops him while noting the raw strength of the Batsuit. I did like Bruce giving him the old utility belt, so this can be seen as a start for Bruce to have deeper faith in Terry. After the final showdown, which was a great fight to boot, Bruce pretty much gave higher praise to Terry than the suit. So after this episode, Terry has directly proven himself to be the real deal to the viewer and Bruce Wayne himself.

    Something I wonder about is Bruce's reason for not wanting to give Terry the old classic Batsuit. But Bruce also makes some seemingly random remarks about not wanting to do so. Maybe he's still holding tightly onto that persona? He does give it up entirely around "Epilogue", but that won't be for a long while.

    Summer Gleeson even shows up at the beginning at the episode, though that part was something of a prologue. But it didn't even look like she aged at all.

    Unfortunately, the villain Vance isn't so great. Why does he want a human body as a host? He was already able to take control of various computers and systems as a digital mind. It looks like he just want to continue running his company, but I'm sure a physical body isn't completely necessary for that. It's also weird that Vance in the batsuit didn't do more exploring around the Batcave. And the episode even brings up an interesting question of whether Vance's digital mind can still be considered as Vance himself, but no answer is given.

    But Vance still was memorable. A white floating face as representation of Vance gave a unsettling vibe with the voice actor's performance helping with that. Apparently, it's the voice of the Phantasm, which is why it sounded so familiar to me. Overall, I'd say the episode is still very good.
     

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