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"Arrow" Season One Talkback (Spoilers)

Discussion in 'DC Live-Action Movies and Television' started by The Penguin, Oct 10, 2012.

  1. The Penguin

    The Penguin All Hail the King!
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    Heroes have returned to The CW with tonight's premiere of Arrow at 8 p.m. ET. You can also see this week's episode on Friday at 8 p.m. ET

    'Like' Arrow on Facebook
    'Follow' Arrow on Twitter

    [​IMG]
    After a violent shipwreck, billionaire playboy Oliver Queen was missing and presumed dead for five years before being discovered alive on a remote island in the Pacific. When he returns home to Starling City, his devoted mother Moira, much-beloved sister Thea, and best friend Tommy welcome him home, but they sense Oliver has been changed by his ordeal on the island. While Oliver hides the truth about the man he's become, he desperately wants to make amends for the actions he took as the boy he was. Most particularly, he seeks reconciliation with his former girlfriend, Laurel Lance. As Oliver reconnects with those closest to him, he secretly creates the persona of Arrow - a vigilante – to right the wrongs of his family, fight the ills of society, and restore Starling City to its former glory. By day, Oliver plays the role of a wealthy, carefree and careless philanderer he used to be - flanked by his devoted chauffeur/bodyguard, John Diggle - while carefully concealing the secret identity he turns to under cover of darkness. However, Laurel's father, Detective Quentin Lance, is determined to arrest the vigilante operating in his city. Meanwhile, Oliver's own mother, Moira, knows much more about the deadly shipwreck than she has let on – and is more ruthless than he could ever imagine.

    The series stars Stephen Amell as Oliver Queen, Colin Donnell as Tommy, Katie Cassidy as Laurel Lance, David Ramsey as John Diggle, Willa Holland as Thea Queen, with Susanna Thompson as Moira Queen and Paul Blackthorne as Detective Quentin Lance.

    Based on characters appearing in comic books and graphic novels published by DC Comics, ARROW is from Bonanza Productions Inc. in association with Berlanti Productions and Warner Bros. Television, with executive producers Greg Berlanti ("Green Lantern," "Brothers & Sisters"), Marc Guggenheim ("FlashForward," "Eli Stone"), Andrew Kreisberg ("Warehouse 13," "The Vampire Diaries") and David Nutter ("Smallville," "Supernatural," "Game of Thrones"). Melissa Kellner Berman ("Eli Stone," "Dirty Sexy Money") is co-executive producer. The pilot was directed by David Nutter from a teleplay by Andrew Kreisberg & Marc Guggenheim, story by Greg Berlanti & Marc Guggenheim.


    Tonight's episode...

    "Pilot" - Series Premiere
    Wednesday, October 10, 2012 @ 8 p.m. ET/7 CT on The CW
    FROM DC COMICS ENTERTAINMENT AND UBER PRODUCERS GREG BERLANTI, MARC GUGGENHEIM AND ANDREW KREISBERG COMES A STORY OF A MAN TRYING NOT ONLY TO SAVE HIS CITY, BUT TO SAVE HIMSELF — After a violent shipwreck, billionaire playboy Oliver Queen (Stephen Amell) was missing and presumed dead for five years before being discovered alive on a remote island in the Pacific. Back in Starling City, Oliver slowly reconnects with those closest to him, his devoted mother Moira (Susanna Thompson), beloved sister Thea (Willa Holland), and best friend Tommy Merlyn (Colin Donnell), but struggles with his ex-girlfriend Dinah "Laurel" Lance (Katie Cassidy), who blames him for her sister's death. Oliver has brought back many new skills from his time on the island and despite the watchful eye of his new bodyguard John Diggle (David Ramsey), Oliver manages to secretly create the persona of Arrow - a vigilante - to right the wrongs of his family and fight the ills of society. As Arrow, Oliver will atone for the past sins of his family while he searches for the personal redemption he needs. Paul Blackthorne also stars. David Nutter directed the episode with story by Greg Berlanti & Marc Guggenheim and teleplay by Andrew Kreisberg & Marc Guggenheim.

    CWTV.com/Arrow
     
  2. The Talon

    The Talon Active Member

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    Jesus, this was the Wonder Woman pilot levels of bad. Arrow learns russian after being completely isolated on a chinese island for 5 years, he barely even hides his identity with a patethic green spraypainted line on his face, there's a cliche clubbing seeing that's now practically mandatory on all CW shows, he outright murders people because "MY INDENTITY MUST BE A SECRET", Speedy's his drug-addled teenage sister, & it ends on the most blatant attempt to be dark & edgy as a network tv show can get.

    I'll be tuning in next week.
     
  3. Jedigreedo

    Jedigreedo Chill. It's only an opinion.

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    It felt like it wanted to be on par with Thomas Jane's Punisher, but instead it fell way below that and ended up as more like The Cape. Oliver is an intolerable tool, which at first seemed as though he was exaggerating it for a dual identity thing but either they didn't intend that, or they got confused, because by the end of the episode it seems as though he prefers to be that way. The thing that gets me the most though is simply that he killed people, and it wasn't really a last resort sort of reasoning, he just planned that he would have to kill people. That, like the Wonder Woman pilot, is an irredeemable error and completely voids the entire point of a superhero.

    This point is more nitpicky, but anyway, it was ridiculous that he already had a trick arrow (the grappling hook one) considering he's only put about a couple days or so into establishing his new endeavor. It would've been understandable if it was simple like an explosive device, but something with deployable legs that can embed into concrete is a bit much.

    The one decent thing is that Dinah is FAR more tolerable than the Birds of Prey version, who still makes me cringe something fierce.
     
  4. darkdetective

    darkdetective Former TZ Reporter/Reviewer

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    I think that's supposed to imply that he wasn't on the island alone.
     
  5. Michael24

    Michael24 Moderator
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    I know nothing about Green Arrow's comic history, so I can't speak toward faithfulness or changes or anything like that. But just as a TV show, I was impressed with the premiere, much more than I expected to be considering it's on the CW. Thought it was a solid first episode and will definitely be tuning in next week. Hopefully it'll fill the small opening left in my week by already dropping off of Vegas.
     
  6. JTMarsh

    JTMarsh Wing Commander

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    It was alright, could use some adjustments like dropping the narration. Whether the obvious similarities to Batman and Iron Man rub general audiences the wrong way remains to be seen.
     
  7. Peter Paltridge

    Peter Paltridge Knows about rock people
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    Tony Stark is arrogant in a loveable way, though. This guy, on the other hand....when he gave the money to all those wronged people I thought he was going to keep it all for himself at first; that's how negatively he'd been portrayed. I don't like him and that's a real problem.

    If you mean his mom turning out to be evil, I liked that. They Scooby Doo'd me with the bald guy; I thought for sure he was the one causing trouble. The real blatant attempt to be edgy was Queen's relaxed atttitude toward his sister's revealed speed use. "Oh, you're doing highly addictive and dangerous drugs that could potentially ruin your life? RAD! I think I'll call you Speedy!"
     
  8. The Talon

    The Talon Active Member

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    Arrow got 4 million viewers which equals out to a 1.3 rating. This makes it the CW's highest rated debut since 2009's The Vampire Diaries.

    The CW itself seems like such an odd channel with that being it's highest rated debut in 3 years.
     
  9. Good Ol' Batmanuel!

    Good Ol' Batmanuel! Dressing for success?

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    Thought it was decent overall, but I think it would improve a lot for me if they got rid of that stupid sex-crazed loser sidekick guy...

    P.S. Hey Penguin, did you watch it, or are you just telling us about its existence? ;)
     
  10. Wonderwall

    Wonderwall Moderator
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    Saw most of the replay last night and I thought it was...okay? Like with all the stuff I heard in the lead up to the premiere there was stuff that irked me and stuff I liked. Anytime it came off like Smallville I gagged or rolled my eyes as I hated that show. But when it did it's own thing for the most part I thought it was decent or even liked it. But overall it was kind of clumsy. We'll see how it goes my night is already packed when it airs new episodes but I can squeeze in the Friday repeat up here since there's nothing on Fridays for me.
     
  11. darkdetective

    darkdetective Former TZ Reporter/Reviewer

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    Merlyn is a Green Arrow villain, so that character's not going anywhere anytime soon. He's going to be our Smallville's Lex equivalent, I think.
     
  12. Dragnatek

    Dragnatek Well-Known Member

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    It was not great but not horrible. I enjoyed it more then nine tenths of Smallville anyway and that somehow lasted ten seasons.
     
  13. The Penguin

    The Penguin All Hail the King!
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    Arrow "Honor Thy Father" Talkback (Spoilers)

    New Arrow, right now on The CW.

    [​IMG]
    "Honor Thy Father"
    Wednesday, October 17, 2012 @ 8 p.m. ET/7 CT on The CW
    KELLY HU GUEST STARS AS DC COMICS VILLAIN CHINA WHITE — Oliver heads to the courthouse to get his death certificate repealed and is pleasantly surprised to run into Laurel, who is there prosecuting Martin Somers (guest star Ty Olsson), a criminal with ties to the Chinese Triad. Oliver recognizes Martin's name from his father's book and sets his sights on taking him down. Martin orders the Triad to "take care of" Laurel so they send their top mercenary – China White (Hu) – after her, an act that culminates in a battle between Arrow and China White. Meanwhile, Moira and Walter (guest star Colin Salmon) ask Oliver to take over the company. Colin Donnell, Willa Holland, David Ramsey and Paul Blackthorne also star. David Barrett directed the episode with story by Greg Berlanti & Marc Guggenheim and written by Andrew Kreisberg & Marc Guggenheim.

    CWTV.com/Arrow
     
  14. mikkej2k

    mikkej2k Member

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    I am trying very hard to give this show a chance. From what I've read the show will not have any "fantastical" characters and it's not in the Smallville universe. If you've ever watched Smallville you get the same feel from this show - it seems like enough hasn't been done to distinguish the two shows.

    As far as this episode goes , the pacing feels forced. I don't know what timeline Arrow is on but to me the story being told doesn't always fit the pace. The hardest part for me to get over is the bodyguard and Oliver. The bodyguard is there because of his credentials and skills yet he keeps getting separated from the man he's supposed to protect? He was even attacked by Oliver in the pilot.

    On the positive side , it became more likable toward the end of the episode and I look forward to next week.
     
  15. Michael24

    Michael24 Moderator
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    Was kind of a breather after last week's action-packed premiere, but pretty good. The final flashback on the island certainly has me intrigued. Was also hoping for more Kelly Hu (because you can never have enough Kelly Hu :D ), but clearly she'll be back.

    He was getting separated because Oliver kept ditching him in order to pursue his Arrow activities. And it wasn't so much an "attack" in the first episode as it was just knocking him out so he could leave the party without the bodyguard shadowing him.
     
  16. Jedigreedo

    Jedigreedo Chill. It's only an opinion.

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    Some of the characterization is better than the pilot, moments with Ollie's emotional struggles felt more deep than they did. But, I'm still really lost with the character and unable to sympathize with him, mostly because he just doesn't come across as a superhero. There's really been nothing to indicate that he cares about the people of the city, but rather just the city and because his father felt guilty because of it. So, it's still just revenge, nothing I would actually call heroic. Even him trying to get Generic Rich Enemy Guy to refund pensions felt more like it was just a means to hurt the guy rather than caring for the people. I don't know.

    But, ultimately, the series just continues to fail with his continued murder spree. Especially as he lacks any indication of actual remorse for killing people who haven't really done anything. Sure, they work for the generic bad guy of the week but these aren't exactly violent thugs since, from what we've seen, these are just shady ethical violations done with finances rather than actual harm against people. Maybe it'll go deeper than that, but as of right now it's just as bad as if someone were to kill his own bodyguard. The Police should be doing extensive hunting for him rather than idly sitting by waiting for that pesky vigilante to show up again.

    Continuing on with the hoodie being his only means of disguise, occasionally with a bit of paint, is just stupid. Hoodies just don't work for superhero costumes, I don't care how modern they look. There is no reason why a generic rich guy he threatens then leaves alive wouldn't be able to recognize him. Especially with his face plastered all over the news.

    Finally, there's the sister. I don't expect them to harp on her addiction like some contrived Lifetime special, but to continue to just treat it as a passive inconvenience for the character with Ollie only acting concerned in a sarcastic manner is ridiculous and irresponsible.
     
  17. Michael24

    Michael24 Moderator
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    Granted, I know pretty much nothing about the comic history of the character, but wasn't Green Arrow always more of an anti-hero type?
     
  18. Wonderwall

    Wonderwall Moderator
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    Nah Green Arrow is usually pretty much in the superhero column rather than anti hero. For along time of his history he was just typical hero with bow and arrow gimmick. In the 70s I think is when they made him more of left leaning, fight for the working man type. He's had his dark moments but I think it's still a stretch to place him in the anti-hero camp.

    As for the episode I liked it a bit better than the pilot but it's still got some issues that it needs clearing up. The revenge plot does undermine him being a hero as its played like he's doing this because he was told to rather than he wants to actually help the people. Also I don't think the show has shown the effects of these "bad men" enough. I don't think I've seen one person be taken advantage by these criminals. Also he kind of came off like a psycho when he first attacked the crime boss. He kills his goons, strings him up, and threatens to kill him but did he even have any proof?

    I don't mind the hood but he needs a mask as that's the way it is in the comics. The paint line just looks dumb and is less practical than a mask when you think about it. Plus when we see Deathstroke have his costume in full why wouldn't Arrow have his mask? And I don't really see why he does the whole playboy thing( badly as well )? Just seems kind of pointless as it doesn't seem to help his crusade in any way. It just feels tacked on.

    I like Kelly Hu though she always seems to have a presence about her. I hope to see more of her in the future the show is going to need rogues that stand out as mob bosses get generic real quick. The bodyguard got a little fleshing out in this one unlike in the pilot where he came off as some goon. I kind of like that he's kind of slowly opening up to his sister when she saw his scars. I don't really care much for the Lance character though. The scene in her apartment was really well done as was the final near the docks. It's always fun seeing Vancouver landmarks it always makes me chuckle for some reason.
     
  19. bigddan11

    bigddan11 Justice must be served!

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    I actually enjoyed the slower pace more than the premiere episode. i like the character development that this episode showed, and I liked how there weren't as many time hops in the episode. It can be very confusing when you jump from your current history to the past the way they are doing> I wish they would stop doing the small flashback moments and instead do 2 or 3 episodes devoted to them. It's even more confusing for some people, like my dad, that have no knowledge of most DC comic heroes not named Batman or Superman.
     
  20. Peter Paltridge

    Peter Paltridge Knows about rock people
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    Doesn't feel the same to me. The camera angles and lethargic acting are the same, but everything else is different; Smallville was way louder on multiple levels.

    This may be the last one I tune into for a while until I hear it's getting better. Nikita was on tonight and you could see everything they're doing wrong with Oliver Queen in comparison. Nikita feels like a real person and Oliver feels like a mannequin robot thing.
     

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