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"Ant-Man" Talkback (Spoilers)

Discussion in 'Marvel Live-Action Movies and Television' started by Yojimbo, Jul 16, 2015.

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How did you like this movie?

  1. *

    0 vote(s)
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  2. **

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  3. ***

    4 vote(s)
    28.6%
  4. ****

    5 vote(s)
    35.7%
  5. *****

    5 vote(s)
    35.7%
  1. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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    [​IMG]

    Ant-Man
    Release date: July 17, 2015
    Studio: Walt Disney Pictures, Marvel Studios
    Director: Peyton Reed
    Screenwriters: Adam McKay, Paul Rudd, Edgar Wright, Joe Cornish
    Starring: Paul Rudd, Michael Douglas, Michael Pena, Evangeline Lilly, Corey Stoll, David Dastmalchian, T.I. , Judy Greer, Bobby Cannavale, Martin Donovan, Wood Harris, John Slattery, Gregg Turkington, Abby Ryder Fortson, David Dastmalchian

    Plot Summary: A founding member of Marvel's The Avengers is brought to the screen for the first time in Ant-Man. Armed with the astonishing ability to shrink in scale but increase in strength, master thief Scott Lang must embrace his inner hero and help his mentor, Dr. Hank Pym, protect the secret behind his spectacular Ant-Man suit from a new generation of towering threats. Against seemingly insurmountable obstacles, Pym and Lang must plan and pull off a heist that will save the world. Ant-Man stars Paul Rudd as Scott Lang, AKA Ant-Man, Evangeline Lilly as Hope Van Dyne, Corey Stoll as Darren Cross aka Yellowjacket, Bobby Cannavale as Paxton, Michael Peña as Luis, Judy Greer as Maggie, Tip "Ti" Harris as Dave, David Dastmalchian as Kurt, Wood Harris as Gale, Jordi Mollà as Castillo and Michael Douglas as Hank Pym. Directed by Peyton Reed and produced by Kevin Feige, Marvel’s Ant-Man delivers a high-stakes, tension-filled adventure on July 17, 2015.

    Comments?

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  2. Neo Ultra Mike

    Neo Ultra Mike Creeping Shadow of "15000"+ Posts

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    Here are my thoughts on the movie.

     
  3. Gold Guy

    Gold Guy Ride On
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    Wow. Ant-Man was sooooo much better than I thought it would be. Best origin film since Iron Man 1? Possibly!

    People who were overwhelmed by Age of Ultron will probable much prefer this film. Smaller scale, which makes for more intimate story-telling.

    All the actors are very good, expected from a Marvel Studios film. Paul Rudd is likable as Lang, partly because he comes across as an ordinary guy, not a movie star acting. Douglas, of course, does some good work as Pym (love when he slams that one guy's head into the desk after mentioning his wife). Evangeline Lilly as Hope had some good moments; can't wait for a larger role in the sequels.

    Anyway, the best part about this film, for me, is that not only is it hillarious, but it does have tons of heart, something some people claimed AoU lacked. There is some genuine emotional stuff here, from Lang wanting to spend more time with his daughter, to Pym and his daughter dealing with the death of Pym's wife in different ways, etc.

    But man, is it FUN. This film gave me Spider-Man 1 (Raimi) vibes. Remember how Peter had to learn how to web-swing, painstakingly? The first half of the film is like that. Some of the best scenes are part of the training montage. Somehow, Marvel made a scene with a superhero learning to ride an ant really cool!

    Meanwhile, while I had doubts about the Bring it On director, he delivers. The film may have the best visuals to any MCU film; every single scene where Lang gets shrunk down is a treat, and suddenly, any place can be an epic action set-piece (even a briefcase!). The climax is now one of my favorite CBM final battles ever. So, so inventive, cannot stress that enough.

    Ant-Man, while I can't say it beats AOU for me, is a shockingly good film that could have easily been a trainwreck. Completely recommended.

    BTW, there are two after credits scene, so stick around for both. The second in particular is pretty cool.
     
  4. the greenman

    the greenman Well-Known Member

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    I can't say I was overly impressed with this one.

    Cons- It kinda really does feel a little bit like someone adapting someone elses film, and the tone doesn't seem to match. I'm not getting into the whole Wright vs. Marvel thing, but it's pretty obvious where he ends and where Marvel begins. First off the dialogue for some characters felt forced and delivery was off, particularly Rudd (who I'm not a fan of), T.I., and sometimes Pena. I think we can all agree the Falcon thing is more than likely what made Wright leave. It was pretty forced in. There was very little emotional connection to Cassie, and speaking of. The drama/tension between Hank and Hope felt emotionless as well, no matter how hard they tried.

    As usual for a Marvel film, the villain had a bland obligatory explanation for his motivations. Also, not that I needed much, but the writing dropped the ball on explaining the ability of the suit. Will they even do Giant Man, or will they save that for the Mark 2 suit in a sequel? Mind you, sci-fi comedy is one of my favorite subgenres, but this doesn't gel with me. Honestly, seeing Rudd, I don't like his humor but I think this was sorely lacking. I know this is PG family friendly, but this felt a little too safe and plain. That play on genre tropes is what makes a good scifi comedy, like Back to the Future, Memoirs of the Invisible Man, Galaxy Quest, Bill & Ted, Groundhog Day, etc. Innerspace did a better job.

    Pros- When it comes to shrinking movies, this one kinda rates high, but not really high enough. I think Wright said he was going to play with practical effects, which I do miss.

    As for aforementioned emotion, I felt more of it out of the step father than any other character. I liked Lilly as Hope, the only one I could seemingly connect to. She impressed me in Real Steel too, so I got respect for her. I didn't buy Hank waiting all these years to up and decide to explain the Janet disappearance, poor writing there. Sadly, I feel like alot of fault was on Wright, looking at the time period this was written.

    I enjoyed the opening of the film, leading into Lang. Also, I will say, the final climatic battle was fun. That whole 20 minutes was worth the time and money.
     
    #4 the greenman, Jul 17, 2015
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2015
  5. Stu

    Stu Marvel Animation Age Webmaster
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    Fantastic film. Funny, heart, story, this one had the lot with some very innovative effects and use of the leads abilities.

    Solid casting too. I was worried about Rudd playing a superhero as Rudd tends to play Rudd in every film he makes except for his sensational turn as Brian Fantana but he went deeper than he normally does, while still retaining his exceptional wit.

    And that post credits scene!

    I have a theory what leads to Iron Man fighting Cap

    There was a cool couple of nods to the universe in the film (Spider-Man!) and its always delightful to see Hayley Atwell as Agent Carter. I thought this might be the weak entry into the universe, but it's not, a fantastic effort from all.[/spoiler]
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. hobbyfan

    hobbyfan Well-Known Member

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    It's fine for what it was. I think Wright wanted to make this even more of an action comedy, veering too far away from the vision Feige and his stooges wanted.

    I had to do some research on Hope. She was introduced as a villain in the MC2 line several years back, MC2 being an alternate-future line, which is why Tom DeFalco got some screen credit at the end of the movie.

    Luis wasn't imitating anyone. Stan and others simply spoke their lines, but Luis dubbed over them. Big difference.

    It'll be interesting to see what the box office numbers are, and if Ant-Man beats Trainwreck (which would make the Cena haters happy) come tomorrow.
     
  7. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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    I really loved this one - it's been a long wait but it's been well worth it. A very fun movie that properly utilizes comedy like Guardian of the Galaxy did with detracting from the story. The pacing and editing was well done - didn't even feel like about 2 hours went by.

    It was rad seeing the Triskelion back again - well most of it, Slattery back as Howard, and Atwell as Carter. It is ironic, if Pym stayed with S.H.I.E.L.D., HYDRA might have gotten their hands on the tech and formula. So I guess that Mitchell Carson was another HYDRA plant all along like Pierce.

    Baskin-Robbins - OMG, that was a great, great gag.

    Luis and the band of ex-cons were pretty hilarious. Nice little addition. Glad they didn't inflate the screen like I feared. "Wombats." lmao.

    Loved the story of the two families, the Pyms and Langs and the legacy theme. Cassie was adorable. Douglas and Lilly killed it in the 'healing' scene after the Janet flashback and Lang ruining it. Really dug how old school hip Pym was with his Victorian house, his clothing (heavily contrasting the modern stuff everyone else was wearing), his car - he's got swagger. The tie in comic barely satiated my interest - but they could totally do more pre-1987 Ant-Man and Wasp stories.

    Liked the nods to Sokovia, that soda from Hulk, and so forth. The preheist at upstate New York was pure awesome. "He sees me." Great linking in with the MCU. It's a solo movie but still not ignoring everything else for the sake of it being a solo movie. Probably something Wright wasn't keen on. Stan Lee's cameo at the bar. lmao. Loved he got a big focus on the screen rather than being in a crowd of others.

    "It's not just a key chain" was so awesome. And what happened to Pym Tech - damn! I was loving the shrinking and enlarging effects. And the various uses of the species of ants. Dug the raft. Thomas the Tank. Cassie's pet at the end. lol. The quantum realm part was so psychedelic...

    The one weakness was again the villain. I didn't really think it worked that they later told Cross that exposure to the particles was making him crazy. They definitely showed him gradually being unstable but it was hard to believe -- I don't know. Yeah, he was the prodigal son spurred by his mentor/surrogate father and willing to bend ethics to sell out to HYDRA and kill but it just lacked enough back story on Cross - like where did he come from, what did he grow up and go through before meeting Pym? It felt superficial he was just out to prove to Pym he was better.

    Teasers: First one was a "YES!" - can't wait to see her pop up in Phase 3. Second one was a "Ohhh." Though the theme of secrets and hypocrisy continues among the Avengers.
     
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  8. the greenman

    the greenman Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure on the pacing, it could have been shorter. Some scenes kinda dragged, but to each his own. I think the quantum realm was specifically setting up Dr. Strange, which deals with the same stuff. He is a doctor who channels into the science that he already knows, with a new-found adoration when he comes to terms with the spiritual aspect of the science. At least the comics dealt with that, who knows how the film will.

    Cross = Stane. Wright did say he was inspired by Iron Man 1, and I can totally see it. Though at least Stane had a better motivation.
     
  9. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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    Tried a crack at making a list of easter eggs and references. Since it's a couple pages long, I'm putting it spoiler tags. But if you're quoting parts of it, no need for the tags.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  10. hobbyfan

    hobbyfan Well-Known Member

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    I neglected to note this earlier, but it bears mentioning.

    In Guardians of the Galaxy last year, Star Lord & Gamora didn't get along all that much, but there were some moments of flirting in the middle, but no payoff. In Ant-Man, Hope & Scott aren't getting along right away, either, but by the end of the movie, Hank opens the door after they've kissed.

    Since Janet was killed off in the books, I'm guessing that they'll continue the Scott-Hope romance in the sequel, since Ant-Man & Wasp were a team from the go, and in the books, Hank adopting his late wife's former alias just, ah, bugs me.
     
  11. Troy Troodon

    Troy Troodon Well-Known Member

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    I still preferred if they stuck with Hank Pym as Ant-Man with Janet Van Dyne as Wasp. I don't understand why they went with Scott and made a new character (Hope) and made Hank elderly while the rest of the Avengers are still up to date.
     
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  12. Mister Mayhem

    Mister Mayhem Banned

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    Crewmates,

    I'm not the the biggest fan of the MCU, and Edgar Wrights release pissed me off royally, but I got to admit this film wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. The great comedy elevated it from just being another merely okay action flick. I have to wonder which jokes were kept from Wright's original script and which ones weren't.
     
  13. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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    Not sure about why an old Hank but since Wright's Ant-Man draft was around since 2006 and as far back as Thor already implied old Hank, the decision was settled a LONG time ago. I'm sure that question will reach Reed and/or Feige soon.
    Interestingly enough, a part of the ending that was cut was Ant-Man taking back the Cross Particles stolen by Mitchell Carson. But Reed decided it might be more interesting if Carson got away.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
    #13 Yojimbo, Jul 20, 2015
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2015
  14. kid rabbit

    kid rabbit Active Member

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    I think Scott Lang has the overall deeper origin story
    with him being an ex thief trying to redeem himself and be with his daughter
     
  15. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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    Peyton Reed talked about the excised opener of Hank on a mission to 60's Cube (then changed to 80's Panama) to steal a microfilm in a James Bond-ian sequence. Jordi Malla was cast as one point to be the general whose compound he infiltrated. The good news - the sequence was shot. So who knows, could show up as a One Shot.
     
  16. Freddy

    Freddy Active Member

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    I was one of those guys who got worried when Edgar Wright left the project. Not only did the movie lose one of the greatest directors working today, but he was replaced with some nobody who has only directed some dime-a-dozen-comedies and they didn't even move the release date, giving him very little time to get an idea what to do with the movie. The trailers looked pretty promising, but they didn't increase (or decrease) my expectations. I went to see the movie with completely neutral feelings and I'm happy to say that Ant-Man is another win for Marvel.

    I haven't seen many heist movies (I haven't tried to avoid them or anything), so this movie felt really fresh spin on the superhero origin story. The overall smaller scale (pun not intended) also helped to make the movie feel refreshing after all the gigantic "we must save the world" stories. The action scenes were still a lot of fun and they took full advantage of Ant-Man's abilities. The climax of this movie made Thor: The Dark World's climax look mundane.

    The shrinking - effects were generally really well-done. Sure, sometimes CGI was pretty obvious (for example, the bathtub - scene), but most of the time I really believed that I was seeing a man shrinking and interacting with ants.

    The standout aspects of the movie are characters and the humor. Paul Rudd might not be as good as the previous Marvel starring men (at least not as good as Chris - trio and RDjr.), but he still made the role his own and pulled the weight of the movie. Michael Douglas brought the gravitas needed for the Pym's mentor role and he was really beliable as tired old superhero. Scott's posse might be little bothersome to some people, but the movie never sinks to Michael Bay or Adam Sandler level of racism and the characters are genuinely funny. Michael Peña as Luis steals every scene he is in. Overall, the humor works thanks to the chemistry between characters and aforementioned super-powers. I also must add that Anthony the Ant was much more loveable and sympathetic than Chris Pratt's raptor-squad in Jurassic World :)

    The weak links of the movie are the main villain Cross and Scott's daughter Cassie. Cross is on paper very boring villain, but at least Corey Stoll clearly has fun with the role and hams it up to the eleven. When compared to the other weak MCU-villains, Cross is better than Killian and Malekith, but little bit weaker than Ronan. The girl playing Cassie was fine by the standards child actors, but the character was written to be nothing but "precious and cute little-girl", so her dialogue wasn't natural. She did her part as a plot device, but she never felt like a real girl.

    Despite of its minor flaws, Ant-Man is tons of fun. Not my personal favorite MCU movie, but definitely above the average. If we don't get Ant-Man 2, I hope that Paul Rudd has his place in Phase 3 in addition to Captain America: Civil War.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  17. Magmaster12

    Magmaster12 Well-Known Member

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    Just wondering, would anyone like to see Abby Ryder Fortson as Stature?
     
  18. Yojimbo

    Yojimbo Yes, have some.
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  19. Magmaster12

    Magmaster12 Well-Known Member

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    Hank Pym did a good job training Scott maybe Douglas could return to train more maybe younger heroes in a school type setting, an Avengers Academy you could say.
     
  20. the greenman

    the greenman Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, but I can't picture that. While Pym isn't as much a curmudgeon as Bruce in Batman Beyond, he still came off as not a team player. While it would be cool to see him with the 'science bros.', I didn't see much good writing on scientific jargon as I would've liked.
     

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