2012 Presidential Election Thread (Please Read Rules Before Posting)

Discussion in 'Cafe toonzone' started by wonderfly, Jan 10, 2012.

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  1. wonderfly

    wonderfly 30 Years since Vampire Hunter D!

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    This year is an election year here in the U.S.A., which is always an important time for awareness and discussion. We had an election thread four years ago, and today marks the first primary in the 2012 Presidential Election, so it seemed like a good time to bring back the election talk here at toonzone! But before diving into politics, a few things you should be aware of:

    This thread is launched with the permission and coordination of the Cafe mods, and will be closely monitored by myself (for that that don't know me, I'm one of the moderators of the Comic Book Culture forum here at toonzone).

    THE RULES:

    1) Discussion should remain primarily on the 2012 Presidential Election. You can discuss the candidates' stand on issues, but do NOT go off on ideological RANTS. This means you can't just preach about, let's say, abortion, and how terrible it may be or how we need it. You can make a quick point like "I believe this," and have maybe a sentence or two max to back it up, but that's IT. Do not go crazy about spouting your beliefs here. That's not what this thread is for or about.

    2) Keep the focus on news. Link only to official news media sites, do not link to partisan bloggers or partisan editorials.

    3) A discussion should not go more than "Post, Response, Reply to Response" as we don't need ongoing debates between two individuals that overtake the thread. Also, no picking apart someone else's post with a line by line reply over each point made in the other person's post. Pick one or two parts of the post to quote in your response, and that's it. We don't need a drawn out idealogical debate: You can believe what you want, and others can believe what they want, but realize that you probably won't be able to change their minds.

    And the big no-no:

    4). Name calling or belittling other forum members or the candidates will not be allowed. Do not denigrate supporters of a candidate. Do not denigrate a state that supports a candidate in a primary. Do not denigrate the country if a candidate you disagree with wins a primary/caucus/general election. This is TROLLING or flamebait and may result in a warning or being banned. You can express your displeasure with the results of a poll or an election without resulting to name calling.

    5). Do not respond to flamebait or troll posts yourself!! Report the offending posts and let the moderators do their job! This thread will be CLOSED if repeat violations occur, and warnings will be issued for violations as warranted! Just like four years ago, this is an experiment on the Cafe's part, but as long as you keep these rules in mind, then this thread should go smoothly.

    This thread is mainly to raise political awareness and to get all of you over 18 to the polls! Enjoy, but keep things under control.

    Thanks,

    wonderfly
     
  2. Space Cadet

    Space Cadet I'M SWEATING

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    Well, NBC News just said that Mitt Romney will win the NH primary. The question is by how much and who will win second place.
     
  3. Sparticus

    Sparticus Should be drawing right now...

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    My pretend vote (as I am not in New Hampshire) is for Vermin Supreme. His boot hat presents a very compelling argument. Very compelling indeed. *twirls imaginary mustache*
     
  4. Space Cadet

    Space Cadet I'M SWEATING

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    Well, Ron Paul is going to come in second, with Huntsman coming in third. The Huntsman team is suppose to continue on to the South Carolina primary, hoping to build up steam for their campaign.
     
  5. Shawn Hopkins

    Shawn Hopkins TZ Member of the Year 2013

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    Been watching CNN's election center all night. Why do they need 30 guys there? I swear some of them don't even get to talk.

    It gets harder and harder to deny that Romney is going to be the nominee. I think if he pulls the hat trick and wins South Carolina Republicans will just have to hold their nose and accept him, even if he's not exactly what most people want. Might hurt them because it's hard to get enthused about a guy you don't really want, I know here in Kentucky some of the people who were really fired up about Hillary in 2008 went for McCain rather than accept Obama.

    Anyway, a primary is a process in which the challengers helpfully provide the incumbent with everything he needs to win, and that's especially true this year with the other candidates desperate to tar Romney with whatever brushes are handy, including the Bain Capital thing, which might as well have been a Democrat attack, and Newt's South Carolina abortion ad. Honestly, this election might be Newt Gingrich's to lose, because even though there's no chance he'll be the nominee he seems determined to make it impossible for Romney to win just to spite him.
     
  6. wonderfly

    wonderfly 30 Years since Vampire Hunter D!

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    It's starting to look like a repeat of 4 years ago: Replicans are going for the "safe" choice - a Republican who appears to be more of a moderate than a true conservative. And Romney may actually be as conservative as mom and apple pie, but his flip flopping on certain issues since his time as governor sure doesn't help him. I bet you if he's the nominee, then in the general election he doesn't win his home state of Massachusetts.

    Of course, I still don't understand why two states (Iowa and New Hampshire) always get to decide who wins the primaries for the rest of the country. Has there ever been a candidate who DIDN'T win Iowa OR New Hampshire who went on to win the nomination?
     
  7. Shawn Hopkins

    Shawn Hopkins TZ Member of the Year 2013

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    Yep. Bill Clinton, for one, although he kicked ass in South Carolina.

    And they don't technically decide, it's just a question of momentum. By the time it comes around to the later primaries a candidate either already has the momentum to gather enough delegates or they don't. Kentucky's primary, for instance, is on May 22, so late that it's nearly pointless.

    Massachusets went heavily for Obama in 2008 and it'll probably do so again.
     
  8. Wounded_Dragon

    Wounded_Dragon Active Member

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    I was kind of disappointed with New Hampshire after the down-to-the-wire results from Iowa. Now that was fun to watch. Talking heads discussing the obvious, not so much.
     
  9. stephane dumas

    stephane dumas Active Member

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    My imagination taught of this despite then it's only a pipe-dream. It could had been interesting to see a Romney-Paul ticket even if the chances to see that sceneario happening are very thin.

    By curiosity, I checked in an hurry an eye on the Libetarian Party nomination for the running mate and Gary Johnson, the former governor of New Mexico will run as a Libertarian from what I read from an article on MSNBC http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/12/21/9598987-gary-johnson-to-run-as-libertarian
     
  10. Shawn Hopkins

    Shawn Hopkins TZ Member of the Year 2013

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    That'd be like fire and water. They're just too far apart in their ideologies, with Romney being your pre-manufactured establishment Republican and Paul your relatively radical Libertarian Republican. There's room for a "team of rivals" approach sometimes, but not for a ticket that can't even agree on major issues like Israel.
     
  11. defunctzombie

    defunctzombie Cutie Pie

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    It will be interesting to see who gets the VP nom should Romney get the lead. I hope it's not an out-of-left-field pick like last election's McCain Palin ticket. (I really didn't see that coming.) I don't think any of the current candidates would team up, though. They've just got too many clashing values.

    Speaking as a Pennsylvanian, I don't think our Republicans are going to all vote Santorum. If I remember correctly, he left office around the time of a congressional pay scandal we had here, and it's still in people's minds. PA usually goes to the Democrats, but the center of the state is very Republican.
     
  12. The Huntsman

    The Huntsman Friend of Toon Zone

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    I'm pretty sure it'll be Chris Christie. That's the obvious choice, but he has a lot of support among conservatives and was an early supporter of Mitt Romney. He's also known for his vibrant personality, which is seldom said about Mitt Romney himself.
     
  13. MDawg

    MDawg Nerfariously planning

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    I just can't picture Christie taking a veep position after all the hype of him running. If anything, I see him going for a run in 2016 in the event things don't go a certain way. He's in absolutely no condition medically for the strain of a national campaign the way he is now.

    The other problem with Christie as a vice presidential candidate is you then have 2 northeast politicians of similar viewpoints, thus alienating all the extreme right and such voters out there who expect a more "values-based" option in one of the slots.

    If anything, I'm picturing a re-hash of '04, but with Romney in the role of John Kerry. The base just won't be motivated enough to vote for him if and when he's the nominee and Obama will have just enough good will from his voters to keep it going for another term. The problem is just that there's no one out there who is strong enough to unite the party under their banner at this time out and they'll need the time to figure out exactly what they want to be.
     
  14. Jacob

    Jacob Moderator

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    Rumor has it Stephen Colbert will announce his South Carolina candidacy in a few minutes on his show. I bet he beats Perry and/or Huntsman.
     
  15. MDawg

    MDawg Nerfariously planning

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    And now it's official. Ownership of the Colbert Super PAC has transfered to Jon Stewart and it has gained a new name. The Definitely Not Coordinating With Stephen Colbert Super PAC.

    With his polling numbers where they are (currently 5%, so above Huntsman), he should in theory be allowed to enter the state's primary debate as well. Time will tell how this pans out.
     
  16. defunctzombie

    defunctzombie Cutie Pie

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    This ought to be interesting. What are the pundits talking about now that he's trying to divert attention from? Colbert tends to focus on education or the troops.
     
  17. Shawn Hopkins

    Shawn Hopkins TZ Member of the Year 2013

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    So, here are the lengths Newt will go to hurt Romney. Trashing the entire state of Massachusetts and anyone who speaks French. He's completely scorching the earth with every possible accusations, and Barack Obama leans back in his chair and smiles a handsome, confident smile.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyFaWhygzjQ&feature=player_embedded

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-16549624

    The messed up thing is that it's public knowledge that Newt speaks French, too. He picked it up when he was living in France with his family as a teen, in a chateau, and he apparently kept some of it because he wrote a paper on the Congo that used French language sources. Romney on the other hand learned what he knows doing (quelle horreur!) missionary work.

    http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2012/01/13/waitdoesnt_newt_speak_french_too
     
  18. stephane dumas

    stephane dumas Active Member

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    From what I read on an article from Reason magazine http://reason.com/archives/2012/01/13/the-pain-of-bain-falls-mainly-on-romneys Newt's strategy could turn against him, a bit like a boomerang we throw and comeback to hit us from behind.

    Also, the Express, a French newspaper from France have a diapoarama of pictures of Mitt Romney
    http://www.lexpress.fr/diaporama/di...tt-romney-et-si-c-etait-son-tour_1069307.html and they also have an article about Ron Paul. Here the approximate translated article from Google translator
     
  19. The Huntsman

    The Huntsman Friend of Toon Zone

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    As interesting as that would be, he isn't on the ballot and can't legally be on the ballot, as the registration date has passed, so I doubt he'll be allowed into the debates. He'll run a write-in campaign, and since only registered Republicans can vote in the South Carolina primary, I doubt that he'll do extremely well.

    EDIT

    According to ABC News, Colbert can't even get write-in votes in the actual primary. His options are really limited and he's not going to be able to do much of anything.
     
  20. GWOtaku

    GWOtaku Moderator

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    Yep. Colbert knew all of this going in, of course. This is a fresh step of his ongoing lampooning of the "Super PAC" rules. The press coverage can't hurt ratings either. ;)

    Krauthammer wrote a really cogent column talking about how Ron Paul's candidacy is the big story of the election year so far. I haven't much to add, I find this analysis spot-on.

    This Bain Capital stuff is like watching a trainwreck. It's hurting Gingrich more than Romney at this point.
     
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