The Spectacular Spider-Man "Gangland" Talkback (Spoilers)

[James Harvey]

Catch an all-new episode of The Spectacular Spider-Man tonight at 9:00pm (ET) on Disney XD!

The Spectacular Spider-Man
Episode #23: Gangland
Original Airdate: October 21st, 2009

On Valentine’s Day, Peter Parker jeopardizes his relationship with girlfriend Liz Allan, when Tombstone, Doctor Octopus and Silvermane call a Valentine’s Day Summit. But when Hammerhead betrays them all in an attempt to become the new Big Man, the summit erupts into a gang war – one only Spider-Man can stop!

Comments?

More details on this episode are available here!

[Pepperidge]

If I'm not mistaken, this will be the international debut of the widescreen version of the episode. For some reason this is the only episode that aired fullscreen in Australia and the UK.

Should look fantastic. Don't miss it.

[ToonFaithful]

Man, why does Peter have to ditch Liz everytime there's trouble?! He's just going to ruin their relationship. I can see a break-up sooner or later.

[jph139]

OOH that was fantastic. Valentine's Day - wasn't quite as fun as Halloween, but man was it sweet.

We finally get to see Silvermane in action, and honestly, I wasn't feeling him at first. The super suit seemed... gaudy, to be honest. In hindsight it DOES make sense, though - Silver Sable had the same type of outfit, and he IS an old man. I would have liked something a tad more subdued, though. Maybe have it under his suit? I dunno. He's definitely an interesting character, though, and I hope we get to see him and his daughter again in Season 3; Sable in particular. That scene where she pulls out the gun? Man, that was cool.

Doc Ock is equally interesting as a character - it's very interesting to see him grow from the mild-mannered assistant to the slightly-psychopathic criminal to the mastermind to the gang lord; seeing him in his fancy suit with Vulture as his side was a real distinct take on the character, I think, and one I'd like to see done again in other media. Octavius DOES strike me as a man of ambition, after all. Speaking of Vulture, though, he hasn't gotten, like, ANY lines in this arc. Seeing him giving Doc some advice, or having him put up an actual fight... missed opportunity, I think.

But Tombstone - man, is he the standout of this series or what? I want to know his backstory, but you really don't need one. He's just... it. Everything you need in a Big Bad. He's cool, he's collected, he's one step ahead of the curve - the fact he's in an all-out BRAWL with two other mob bosses for control of a criminal empire and still thinking about his public appearance... impressive, to say the least. And on top of that he's a legitimate threat to Spidey, as that final fight DEFINITELY proved. Tombstone's certainly a "filler" for Kingpin, but I think it worked out for the best overall.

Speaking of that big fight - loved the opera. Gave it a very, I dunno... classy feel. Everyone's in a suit, no pulled punches, high stakes, all that. Feels like a real gang war, only with supervillains. Silvermane squeezing out Spidey - the line felt clunky, but it was still awesome. And the knockout of Doc Ock, when he's swinging from his tentacles? It's one of those tiny little details that just works BEAUTIFULLY.

So many awesome lines, too, during the whole scene! "Welcome to the Valentine's Day Massa- err, Summit." "Expect you severance package soon." Felt very mobsterish.

And the actual romance was pretty good, too. Gwen looks much nicer than her, y'know, usual geekishness, I suppose, but it's Peter's obvious attention to her that's interesting to watch. I mean, you want them to end up together, but at the same time, you can't help feel bad for Liz. And that scene at the end with her brother chewing out Peter - definitely well placed, I think.

And it seems Gobby's been behind it all... quite interesting. So we take a break next week and then it's time to enter the final arc of the season. Hyped hyped hyped... if it's half as good as the Green Goblin Arc from the first season I'll be MORE than content.

[Rick Jones]

Poor Dumb Pete. Did he really not know what he was doing when he decided to apologize to Gwen ?

I love this episode. Things that this show never fails at are showdowns or reveals, imho. It was insanely good fun watching the bosses try to take each other's heads off while battling Spidey as well. Anytime Tombstone and Dock Ock are involved, things are highly entertaining.Relentless action, classy settings, teenage heartbreak: what's not to love ?


I'm a little surprised that Hobie Brown is an opera fan. Doesn't seem like something you'd see any of M Cubed's other jocks being insterested in.

[GregX]

"Gangland"

It's Valentine's Day, and, well... to everyone like me who hates Valentine's Day, this episode is a treat.

We've got a trio of villains this time. Tombstone, Dr. Octopus and Silvermane call a summit at the opera at, what looks like, Lincoln Center for the Performing Arts. Ock, Silvermane, and the Tombster all decked in fancy tuxedos. Silvermane nearly toasting to a Valentine's Day Massacre made me choke... awesome Al Capone reference there. This was fun to watch. Tombstone, Silvermane and the good doctor all think they're in control, but not at all realizing they're being played.

After Norman Osborn's little speech in the previous episode, Hammerhead has gotten very ambitious, and has trapped these three right where he wants them. Playing them all... but, who is actually playing who?

Hammerhead is receiving notes from someone else. Now, who'd want these gangsters and supervillains to destroy each other? I have to say, I loved seeing Tombstone flustered.

Meanwhile, across town, Peter, Liz, Gwen, Harry, Mary Jane, and Mark are dating as a group over at a hotel Liz owns, so, free food... very sweet deal.

But, as usual, Peter and Gwen would obviously rather be with each other, which Liz notices, as does Mark. They are joined by Flash, Sha Shan, Rand, and Sally... and hilarity ensues. Gotta love Flash demanding that Peter prevent him from saying something stupid.

I have to say, I loved Mark and MJ's statements on just what a sham Valentine's Day actually is. Sums up how I've always felt about it.

I loved the battle scenes in this episode, with an opera soundtrack in the background. Tuxedos and opera... and carnage. Classy. Very classy. Of course, Peter is forced to take off so Spidey can arrive, and, at long last, take these three down. He takes down Silvermane, then Doc Ock, and finally, the re-match we've been waiting for... Spider-Man versus Tombstone.

Throughout the battle, Tombstone calls Blackie Gaxton for help... there is interference. Octopus calls Kraven... again, interference. At this point, it's become clear, this is bigger than a stooge like Hammerhead. Another hand is at work here.

Can I say again how much I love the opera soundtrack? Opera. Gangsters. Supervillains. It's "The Godfather" in spandex.

Tombstone is taken down, and L. Thompson Lincoln is exposed as the Big Man of Crime, and hauled off in handcuffs. Of course he fires Hammerhead, and tells him to "expect his severance package soon." Nice!

While I know some people are complaining about it, what I like about this show is the shifting status quo. Tombstone doesn't remain the unknown crime lord. It avoids the problems of the 1990's Kingpin in that particular cartoon... nothing ever changed there, same old same old, and every villain worked for him. Here, on the other hand, Tombstone's situation is allowed to change. And that's one of the reasons why this show is so rich.

Of course, Tombstone makes bail. Nothing to convict him on, but that doesn't mean his life isn't about to get a whole lot more difficult...

... Especially at the end, where we learn who the true mastermind behind all this was. With Tombstone knocked out, there is a power vacuum in the criminal underworld. And, being no slouch, Tombstone figured it out. In the words of Michael Corleone, "our true enemy has yet to reveal himself," well, he finally does

"Guilty, guilty and oh so very guilty of being the new Big Man of Crime?" And with a maniacal laugh worthy of so many others, the Green Goblin ushers in his new dark reign which looks to close out this season.

But, I once again need to mention the soundtrack. I like opera a lot. Rigoletto is a favorite of mine, so it was a pleasant surprise to hear it here. The series utilizes music really well, I think.

This episode was just brilliant, and I think may be my favorite of the series run so far. But, we've got three more to go.

[jph139]

Oh, one other thing I noticed - Spidey and Captain Stacy are almost developing a Batman-Gordon relationship, where the hero is being supported "under the table," so to speak, by a certain police officer. Very cool to see Spidey bounce off of another good guy.

[Mr. Anime]

Best episode of Season 2 by far.

[GregX]

Oh, one other thing I noticed - Spidey and Captain Stacy are almost developing a Batman-Gordon relationship, where the hero is being supported "under the table," so to speak, by a certain police officer. Very cool to see Spidey bounce off of another good guy.

Agreed, though Captain Stacy seems to a new father figure to Spidey. A dynamic that Batman and Gordon didn't have.

[Mistah K88]

Now that was a GREAT episode. The fight was very intense, plus the opera music acctually went with it well. Tombstone was holding his own against Ock and Silvermane despite the only one without some sort of mechanical assistance. Also, when he fought Spider-Man he dished out some awesome pipe pwnage. This was only the start of the Gang War; since this portion was only to knock the Big Man down a peg. Now every small time hood will try to become New York's top crimelord.

As for Spider-Man, he did quite the job when tarzanning Doc Ock.
The ending with the one pulling the strings was GREAT. Gobby accomplished what even the original comic interpretation didn't really get to do; becoming the head of organized crime in New York City...

Poor Liz, Peter paying attention to Gwen more than her must have struck her pretty hard. Her and Harry both sense that Peter and Gwen have something going on between them.

[marvelfan101]

this I must say was really good I was surprised to see the Goblin be the big man in this episode I have to wonder who is the Goblin now Harry or Osborn I lean t words Osborn as Harry was on a date

[Azrayel]

Man this episode was full of action for a Valentine's day episode and I like it. Goblin coming in end didn't really suprise me, and I doubt that this time the Goblin is Harry I think its Norman.

But heres my question what happened to Vulture? Silver Sable got back up and HammerHead was akready up so what happened to Vultutre?

@johnny139: I like that point you had brought up with Spiderman and Capt. Stacey being similar to Batman's and Gordons team up. With that being said I can wait to see how spidey and stacey are used together throughout the show.

And damn Peter you screwed up to much last night by paying attention to your gwen and not your girlfriend.

[W.C.Reaf]

this I must say was really good I was surprised to see the Goblin be the big man in this episode I have to wonder who is the Goblin now Harry or Osborn I lean t words Osborn as Harry was on a date

Ah yes but Goblin didn't need to be there in order to make things work. He just needed to set up the "flowers" for Hammerhead and the communication jamming device (which a goon could have operated) both of which he didn't need to be on hand for.

If we saw the Goblin there then that would be different, but we didn't so we can easily conclude that Gobby was so confident in his plan that he didn't need to witness it play out.

[saherrin]

One thing this season has done is parallel action with something (Flash's birthday video greetings, Shakespeare audition and now the opera.) I have an old CD with opera used during movies and when I bought it, I didn't realize how much the genre was used. It did add a nice touch.

The clichés were just that and incurred a bit of eye rolling - Spider-Man says the fat lady is about to sing and, ta-da, there she is. MJ says Valentine's Day isn't romantic and, ta-da, some guy proposes to his girlfriend. Other than that, the dialogue was great (I loved when Tombstone realized that he was outside in public before he realized this could end badly for him and attacked Doc Ock.) Hammerhead set up his Tombstone brilliantly by firing the gun at Silvermane and Doc Ock and threw gun to Linc to finish the job. For the record, Spidey's line about public safety was hilarious.

As noted, Capt. Stacy has taken a fatherly role to Parker/Spidey.

So now, we have the go-home portion finished and we approach the main event and (hopefully not) final event of the show. A friend of mine pointed out that each little set can be used as a mini-movie (Spidey gets started and deals with life, Villain of the Week and intro to Linc, Goblin/Osborn issues and intro to the symbiote, the alien symbiote, sinister six, gangs of NY and now the conclusion of Osborn.) Despite great ratings, we are dangling by a web to see if it's picked up (BTW, if season three is go for launch, the symbiote is still wandering the sewers of NY, that can't be good.) I can't wait to see the finish of the show. I think Norman gets to be Goblin, this time - seeing what the Green did to Harry; it would be easy to duplicate the results. Of course, I've been wrong before.

[GWOtaku]

I finally jumped into this show via reruns for the last couple of weeks, and I'm enjoying it. However out of the ones that I've seen, this just might be my favorite episode. The second one would be Intervention, where inner Uncle Ben helps Peter get rid of the alien symbiote. That was a very satisfying character piece for Peter and Spider-Man. The three villain showdown was fun to watch, Spidey got to show his stuff, and like everyone else I enjoyed the classy music that scored the entire thing. It all comes together to make this an excellent action episode.

Small picture stuff:

• I'm still missing a few episodes so I have to ask, does Captain Stacy know Peter is Spider-Man from the very early episodes or something? Because it seems obvious that he knows. They get along well, and it seems that in nearly every episode he's either covering for Peter or making knowing comments to him. Remarking that he's sure Spidey would rather be someplace else for Valentine's Day is just the latest case. There are so many offhand comments from him that mean more than they say.
• Mark was right on about Peter and Liz, but Mark went a bit far in seemingly trying to end the relationship on Liz's behalf. Let her speak for herself, eh?
• Green Goblin is a better manipulator than he was in Spider-Man TAS, where he was a bit too crazy to be this subtle most of the time.
• Old news to long time fans, but I really like the takes on Flash and Mary Jane. Flash is actually likable in spite of his flaws, and Mary Jane is currently the nice girl that is everybody's friend. SSM is doing its own thing while still keeping them respectable characters.
• My best guess is that Green Goblin is still Harry. Probable Cause ended on a pretty clear indication that Harry was about to juice himself up again, and they even indulged in drawing the Green Goblin's shadow.

Marvel should just greenlight season 3 already. This show can pretty obviously support itself for a long while yet.

[Anwar]

I have to wonder if the Goblin had the place where the summit was occurring bugged or if he was somehow observing it, otherwise things went a little too precisely. How did he know this would get all the mob bosses taken out or exposed? Or was this just one scheme and he had others in the wing if this one didn't work?

I think the "older" characters in this show are younger than they usually are portrayed. May seems to be in her early 50s and not in her 70s or so (which is nice, her being a walking cadaver was kind of irritating after a few years). Captain Stacy doesn't seem to be that old either, which makes some sense. I mean really, there's no reason he shouldn't be much older than Norman (who doesn't look old at all).

Silvermane is definately younger than he was in TAS and the comics, I'm guessing mid-50s.

[Mistah K88]

I have to wonder if the Goblin had the place where the summit was occurring bugged or if he was somehow observing it, otherwise things went a little too precisely. How did he know this would get all the mob bosses taken out or exposed? Or was this just one scheme and he had others in the wing if this one didn't work?

I think the "older" characters in this show are younger than they usually are portrayed. May seems to be in her early 50s and not in her 70s or so (which is nice, her being a walking cadaver was kind of irritating after a few years). Captain Stacy doesn't seem to be that old either, which makes some sense. I mean really, there's no reason he shouldn't be much older than Norman (who doesn't look old at all).

Silvermane is definately younger than he was in TAS and the comics, I'm guessing mid-50s.

I thought there was some type of device set in the flowers that were sent to Hammerhead. I've also heard that Foswell set the communication jammer once he used the phone to call Robbie (since his call actually went through). However, that is pure spectulation. I don't think that Gobby had all of the mob bosses being defeated planned out THAT well. He probably knew that at least the Big Man was going to fall somehow.

I agree with you about the older people being younger than they normally are portrayed in the comics. Silvermane is probably in his late 50's early 60's. I'm guessing that he just takes good care of his body (he's a crime lord after all).

Also, is Dr Bromwell trying to hit on Aunt May in this episode? Her husband has only been dead for a few months!

[russttrombone]

some guy proposes to his girlfriend.

That was actually an easter egg. That couple is the same pair that spiderman saved from the lizard in the third episode

[Wonderwall]

That was actually an easter egg. That couple is the same pair that spiderman saved from the lizard in the third episode

Actually I think it was from the car chase at the beginning of the first Doc Ock episode.

[Rud]

I have to wonder if the Goblin had the place where the summit was occurring bugged or if he was somehow observing it, otherwise things went a little too precisely. How did he know this would get all the mob bosses taken out or exposed?

I don't think it matters, whatever the result was one or all of them had a good chance of going down (and Tombstone would look bad no matter what), after HammerHead starts their fight it would've ended up favorable to Goblins goals no matter what happened... probably.