Transformers Prime - "Con Job" - Talkback [02/25]

[The Huntsman]

Today @ 6:30 PM ET on The Hub

We get another new episodes this evening.

Bulkhead awaits a visit from his buddy Wheeljack, but his arrival does not go as planned.

[sparkykandy]

Disappointed is all I can say. Wheeljack is one of my favorite G1 characters, so when I found out that he would be appearing in Prime, I got all excited. However, this version of Wheeljack turned out to be so different from the Wheeljack that I know and love that I sort of wished that they went ahead and used a different character instead. On the other hand, the fact that he didn't die is a plus. I just sort of wished that this Wheeljack had some sort of scientisty vibes on him instead of the pure warrior we seemed to get instead. The fact that he looked so much like G1 Wheeljack didn't help things at all.

On the hand, I found buttmonkey Starscream hilarious. I'm guessing based on this episode and on "Masters and Students" that this Starscream is character who we shouldn't be taking seriously. Sure he's trying be menacing, but the universe seems be against him. I can't imagine him lasting long as Decepticon leader with the way things are going right now.

[TheVileOne]

Well they are already had their mad-scientist character in the show. But it would've been fun to see some conflict if Wheeljack was also a scientist type.

I was sort of happy to finally just see the first animated version of Wheeljack in like forever. I was never cool with how Wheeljack was unceremoniously written out in the animated movie. Was that Cam Clarke doing his voice?

[HEATXZ]

Great episode :anime:
Wheeljack is awesome in this show :anime: i wish he join the main cast

[Particle_Beam]

My only favorite part of this whole show for now is that Starscream's cunning, as it should be. Sure, for some weird reasons, nobody's taking him serious, even although he's done more for the Decepticon cause than what "grrr, I'm angry"-Megatron has been doing in Transformers Prime. But as long as he comes up with quite ingenious ideas about how to eliminate the Autobots, like sending in imposter agents, I'm fine with it.
I'm already prepared for the lame moment when Megatron wakes up, yells around how angry he is and how every Decepticon will follow him, just because he's more angry than everybody else, and then Starscream will be killed off or something stupid like that.

[RoyalRubble]

Pretty good episode.
Wheeljack was cool and his fight scenes were good. Too bad he didn't join the team but I guess he could still return in a future episode.

[Mandouga]

So we have the old "evil clone" bit this time around, but what disappointed me the most, was the "status quo is god (or in the case of this show "Primus")" trope used in this episode. They make it look like they're adding a new character, but then it's "made you look!". In short, this episode never happened as far as the characters are concerned (unless of course, there's a continuity nod in a later episode, but still).

I'm actually not going to be happy if this show has more "just passing through" episodes...

[Gold Guy]

This wasn't really a bad episode. Wow, Wheeljack is way different than in the G1 cartoon, but in a good way. Overall, okay episode, I just kinda want more.

[TheVileOne]

Kline's position is that they always want the Decepticons to outnumber the Autobots so the Decepticons have the advantage. The problem with that logic is it sort of makes little sense to have Wheeljack "leave" at the end. Why would Wheeljack not want to stay and try and level the playing field with his Autobot brethren?

Also, can we finally get some new Wheeljack toys please.

[Monte]

My only favorite part of this whole show for now is that Starscream's cunning, as it should be. Sure, for some weird reasons, nobody's taking him serious, even although he's done more for the Decepticon cause than what "grrr, I'm angry"-Megatron has been doing in Transformers Prime. But as long as he comes up with quite ingenious ideas about how to eliminate the Autobots, like sending in imposter agents, I'm fine with it.
I'm already prepared for the lame moment when Megatron wakes up, yells around how angry he is and how every Decepticon will follow him, just because he's more angry than everybody else, and then Starscream will be killed off or something stupid like that.

That is true... i am finding this to probably be one of my favorite incarnations of starscream. Sure like in any other series he comes off as an ineffective leader but this is different...

In other series he's basically just an egotistical opportunist coward who is all bark and no bite; as much as he wants to lead there is nothing that says he should. its actually quite baffling why he is second in command; only logical answer I can come up with is that megatron did not want someone competent enough to actually overthrow him

in THIS series Starscream DOES come off as a good tactician... Capturing fowler to find the autobot base; waking up sleeping decepticons to build an effective army; using a spy to find the autobot base... all fine plans, but unfortunately the universe hates him; Decepticons too weak to handle 3 autobot invasion; Skyquake refuses to give him any respect; the ground bridge just-so-happened to be down long enough for the spy to fail... Some of these things were just out of his control; but if it were not for these factors starscream would actually make a fine leader for the decepticons

Kline's position is that they always want the Decepticons to outnumber the Autobots so the Decepticons have the advantage. The problem with that logic is it sort of makes little sense to have Wheeljack "leave" at the end. Why would Wheeljack not want to stay and try and level the playing field with his Autobot brethren?

Actually another problem with that logic is that if we really are counting all the faceless minions, then the Decepticons have the autobots outnumbered 10 to 1 and as such one more autobot won't really even things out... but yes its true wheeljack should not be too hasty to leave when he KNOWS there is an active battle on earth to finish

But I do take issue with kline considering those faceless minions as "outnumbering the autobots and giving the decepticons the advantage". Despite what happened to Cliffjumper its clear that the decepticon minions suffer from the storm trooper effect and as such they are basically useless (or possibly inverse ninja law since 2 were able to give 2 autobots trouble where as many are child's play)... honestly they may outnumber the autobots 10 to 1, but the autobots have the completely and utterly outclassed to the point where the number advantage does not matter. Frankly it feels like the autobots are the ones who have the advantage. Honestly the only thing that makes the decepticons threatening is when NAMED cons join the team since their the only ones who atleast seem like they can pose a threat. the deceptions desperately need more serious troops to even things out. As far as i'm concerned, the minions are not a real threat and are nothing more than something for the autobots to beat up until the REAL decepticons step on to the battlefield


I can't help but think about how the situation was handled in Transformers animated... for like the first half of the series the deceptions remained un-united and the autobots only had to deal with them 1 or 2 at a time; however each individual decepticon was so strong that 1 or 2 took a team effort to take down. It was actually an interesting way to handle the series compared to how it was handled in other incarnations... Maybe, in this show, if starscream was strong enough to take on 3 autobots at once, i wouldn't complain about the lack of NAMED decepticons

[Neo Yi]

Whaaaa-Wheeljack, you're just leaving? Honey, I know you want to explore other galaxies and heck, I get it if you run into other Autobots (flying freely throughout the galaxies has a better shot at finding them than staying in one base hoping they will come here), but there's a war going on. The Decepticons already outnumber them. Having a sixth member won't resolve everything, but it will still add to the growing number of warriors. I saw this coming a mile away regardless, episode eight is too early to be squeezing in a sixth ranger.

That said, better episode then last week's. Though we get some insight into Bulkhead, the episode surprisingly pulled in a lot of spotlight on Wheeljack, to the point of overtaking Bulkhead's. It's not necessary a bad thing and arguably, it makes his introduction all the more better since we got a good look at the guy. Not much to say. The one scene when Bulkhead rats Wheeljack out is very well done - great intensity between him and the imposter.

[Takao]

I was sort of happy to finally just see the first animated version of Wheeljack in like forever.

Uhh...



Wheeljack (Transformers Animated - 2009)



Downshift aka Wheeljack in Japan (Transformers Energon - 2004)



Wheeljack aka Rampage in Japan (Transformers Armada - 2002)

He's not exactly in the niche of Transformers characters.

[TheVileOne]

I never watched any of those cartoons. And looking at some of the images, I'm glad I didn't.

I'm also not counting anything that was released in Japan only.

[Monte]

what exactly ARE the decepticon minions? that's something that's been irking me that this episode reminds me of... When they speak they seem to give off the idea that they have thoughts and personalities suggest that they are not just mindless automatons, but at the same time they are treated like they are nothing more than mindless automatons... So which is it? is their a reason why they all look the same? do they have a spark like other transformers? Was their a time when the autobots also had faceless soldiers?

I mean i guess they may not be any different from cobra soldiers, but these thoughts just bug me... i guess the disconnect is that they are not human and as such i feel a need for somekind of explanation. Hell even the clone troopers and droids from starwars were given a reason why they all look the same.

[Takao]

I never watched any of those cartoons. And looking at some of the images, I'm glad I didn't.

I'm also not counting anything that was released in Japan only.

None of those shows were Japan-only, all received English versions, and aired on Cartoon Network in the US. The only reason Downshift (who looks exactly like Wheeljack - which is to be expected given Energon is the 20th Anniversary Show) was renamed from his Japanese name of Wheeljack is because the show is a sequel to Armada, and in the localization of that show another character (Rampage) was named Wheeljack.

Also, 2 of those three shows (Armada, and Animated) are considerably better than what Prime has shown to be.

[CyclonatorZ]

I haven't watched this episode, but based on reading the tformers wiki, I think "Con Job" confirms that this show is really struggling with its characters. Namely, struggling not to kill off each new transformer they introduce. Seriously, Wheeljack is literally the first non-core member of the cast to survive his debut episode, and the same episode featured a new (and potentially cool) decepticon biting the dust before the credits rolled. I don't know if this is because of poor writing or just a sense of wanting to keep the status quo, but this show is going to have a hard time building up to the "rightfully huge" status the producers promised if the cast doesn't gain any additional recurring members.

Also, 2 of those three shows (Armada, and Animated) are considerably better than what Prime has shown to be.

Depends on who your asking, really. Transformers hasn't gotten its reputation as having one of the most broken fanbases for no reason, you know, and the reaction to Prime is just about as divided as with any previous show.

[TurboMan]

I haven't watched this episode, but based on reading the tformers wiki, I think "Con Job" confirms that this show is really struggling with its characters. Namely, struggling not to kill off each new transformer they introduce. Seriously, Wheeljack is literally the first non-core member of the cast to survive his debut episode, and the same episode featured a new (and potentially cool) decepticon biting the dust before the credits rolled. I don't know if this is because of poor writing or just a sense of wanting to keep the status quo, but this show is going to have a hard time building up to the "rightfully huge" status the producers promised if the cast doesn't gain any additional recurring members.

Problem is, Makeshift HAD to die. He knew too much to stay alive.

Plus this is just episode 8, more characters WILL show up, we already know of two Decepticons who were listed as main characters in the press release material yet didn't show up (Knockout and Breakdown). and we also know of a female Decepticon that is supposed to show up aaand that James Remar will become part of the voice cast. More characters will show up. I mean look at TF Animated, we didn't get new characters joining the main team until... season 3.

Also Armada was in no way better than Prime, too much overexposition, terrible animation and mentally disabled characters. It only got good during the last few Unicron episodes but thats too little to make amends for a 52 episode show.

[Takao]

Also Armada was in no way better than Prime, too much overexposition, terrible animation and mentally disabled characters. It only got good during the last few Unicron episodes but thats too little to make amends for a 52 episode show.

When a character in Armada dies, you felt it. When a character in Beast Wars dies, you felt it. When a character in Prime dies, you shrug it off and laugh. How is Armada worse than Prime? The writing in this show harkens back to the Movieverse style of Monster of the Week that dies and you don't give a damn because it wasn't developed at all.

[Manhunter]

It's been hard for me to take Wheeljack seriously ever since DR. SMOOV's "S.O.S. Wheeljack" fandub. This episode hasn't really changed that.

[CyclonatorZ]

I mean look at TF Animated, we didn't get new characters joining the main team until... season 3.

True, but Animated did establish a fair amount of other transformer characters in the first two seasons that got at least one other appearance. The Dinobots and Constructicons especially got a lot of exposure on the show, and Soundwave and Shockwave became rather important in the final season after being introduced earlier. And of course, who could forget Sentinel Prime and Ultra Magnus, both who were introduced in the show's pilot before getting much bigger roles in season two?

In general, I feel Animated did a lot better job of building up its universe early on than Prime has so far. Just comparing the pilots of the respective series, "Transform and Roll Out" did a ton more in three parts then "Darkness Rising" did in five. And although Animated's refusal to kill off characters until Season 3 might be considered a weakness, I think it's preferable to killing off multiple characters early on before they even have a chance to be developed.