Discussion on Wrestling As a Sport

[mr.happy]

Another wrestler who fails to make it to 40. How many is it going to take before you people stop supporting this sick freak show, which has a higher mortality rate than your average action movie bomb disposal unit? Every time one of these guys die, we get the usual "aaaw, it's so sad, he was so great... say, who do you guys think is going to take his place in the First-Blood-Electrified-Steel-Cage-Bring-Your-Own-Sledge-hammer match at Steroid Bash XXVI?"

Even Russia has had the good sense to ban their cruel and barbaric dancing bear shows, but Vince McMahon still gets to exploit and ruin the lives of these people in the name of entertainment. I myself have been too generous towards wrestling fans' fascination with this pseudo sport in the past, but the reality is that it's absolutely unconscionable, and quite frankly a bit sick for people to continue supporting this, and to make matters worse, defend it with the argument that "they really do get hurt, you know", which makes you wonder how sincere the commiserations really are, when one of them bites the dust.

There's only one way to put a stop to this, and it's a total boycott. The only question is, how many deaths is it going to take before you guys say enough is enough?

[LinkG07]

Um, Andrew Martin was a "former" wrestler who retired a few years ago. His death thus would have nothing to do with the sport unless proven otherwise. It might have been another drug overdose, like recent young deaths have been going. Finally: Boycotting wrestling is and will be a waste of time, unless you can get the millions and millions around the world to stop watching and support against the sport they love. Its not gonna happen dude.

[mr.happy]

Um, Andrew Martin was a "former" wrestler who retired a few years ago. His death thus would have nothing to do with the sport unless proven otherwise.

Come on? You can't be serious? You think the completely abnormal fatality rate among wrestlers, retired or otherwise, is a coincidence? You're right, pumping themselves full of drugs while being forced to do a job and live a life style that makes their bodies ticking time bombs probably has nothing to do with the business at all.

It might have been another drug overdose, like recent young deaths have been going. Finally: Boycotting wrestling is and will be a waste of time, unless you can get the millions and millions around the world to stop watching and support against the sport they love. Its not gonna happen dude.

No, not with that sort of attitude. And it's not a sport.

[xokxtrunks]

Come on? You can't be serious? You think the completely abnormal fatality rate among wrestlers, retired or otherwise, is a coincidence? You're right, pumping themselves full of drugs while being forced to do a job and live a life style that makes their bodies ticking time bombs probably has nothing to do with the business at all.

No, not with that sort of attitude. And it's not a sport.

Forced? Is someone putting a gun to their head and saying "Be a wrestler or die?" I doubt it. Every job has its effects, mental or physical.

[mr.happy]

Forced? Is someone putting a gun to their head and saying "Be a wrestler or die?" I doubt it. Every job has its effects, mental or physical.

It's disturbing to me that you "fans" would have so little regard for the people who essentially give their lives to entertain you. Vince McMahon's sadistic brand of wrestling is exploitation of the worst kind.

[Mesousa]

Another wrestler who fails to make it to 40. How many is it going to take before you people stop supporting this sick freak show, which has a higher mortality rate than your average action movie bomb disposal unit? Every time one of these guys die, we get the usual "aaaw, it's so sad, he was so great... say, who do you guys think is going to take his place in the First-Blood-Electrified-Steel-Cage-Bring-Your-Own-Sledge-hammer match at Steroid Bash XXVI?"

Even Russia has had the good sense to ban their cruel and barbaric dancing bear shows, but Vince McMahon still gets to exploit and ruin the lives of these people in the name of entertainment. I myself have been too generous towards wrestling fans' fascination with this pseudo sport in the past, but the reality is that it's absolutely unconscionable, and quite frankly a bit sick for people to continue supporting this, and to make matters worse, defend it with the argument that "they really do get hurt, you know", which makes you wonder how sincere the commiserations really are, when one of them bites the dust.

There's only one way to put a stop to this, and it's a total boycott. The only question is, how many deaths is it going to take before you guys say enough is enough?

(sigh)

I get it, it's like if every wrestler dies to you, you get all "Chris Benoit case" on us.

[mr.happy]

(sigh)

I get it, it's like if every wrestler dies to you, you get all "Chris Benoit case" on us.

Evidently you don't get it. The Benoit case was by all accounts an abnormality, but RIP threads for wrestlers who die at this age has become an all too frequent occurrence.

[dendawg]

It's disturbing to me that you "fans" would have so little regard for the people who essentially give their lives to entertain you. Vince McMahon's sadistic brand of wrestling is exploitation of the worst kind.

And your point is?? The same could be said of any sport.

[mr.happy]

And your point is?? The same could be said of any sport.

It's still not a sport, and no, the mortality rate of wrestling is unparalleled.

[Hobbes829]

as sad as it is it's because wrestlers aren't the most mature bunch. It is a job that pain is the norm and guys find it very easy to use that as a crutch for their addictions. It's not vince's fault and it's not wrestling's fault. If these guys took the blame and we pointed the finger at those individuals the wrestling world would be a lot better off.

Mr. Happy, stop stirring up trouble. You don't even like pro wrestling and are ignorant of the facts.

[xokxtrunks]

It's disturbing to me that you "fans" would have so little regard for the people who essentially give their lives to entertain you. Vince McMahon's sadistic brand of wrestling is exploitation of the worst kind.

I'm not a fan of wrestling these days, first of all. Second, while I appreciate his ringwork and all the memories back in the attitude days, he didn't wrestle for me, so should I be bawling my eyes out?

Just curious, what do you think of MMA/Boxing?

[dendawg]

It's still not a sport.

From freedictionary.com:

1. a. Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively.
b. A particular form of this activity.

2. An activity involving physical exertion and skill that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often undertaken competitively.
3. An active pastime; recreation.

By this definition it is a sport. True, the outcome is pre-determined, but it is governed by a set of rules, ie the script. Therefore, according to the definitions above, it is a sport.

True also, is the high mortality rate, but why does McMahon get all the blame? It's not like he or any other high-ranking WWE staff go and shove the steroids/pain killers, etc down their throats. The ultimate responsibility for the death of the wrestlers lies with them, themselves. WWE has established a wellness policy in an attempt to stop this drug abuse.

As far as being sadistic, I suggest you turn your attention to other independent promotions, some of which feature barb wire wrapped baseball bats, barbed wire for ring ropes, and busting flourescent light tubes over each others heads. Of these things listed above, with the exception of the barb wire bats, not one has been seen in a WWE ring. Ever.

[Hobbes829]

It's not a sport. It's a form of entertainment. a very physical one, but entertainment none the less.

The blame isn't on vince. he gives his wrestlers contracts that state what he expects of them. His only responsibility to his workers is to honor the deal and give them a safe place to work (i.e. a safe ring)

[mr.happy]

as sad as it is it's because wrestlers aren't the most mature bunch.

That's exactly what makes it exploitation. Like I've said before, many of these guys have very little prospects, so when someone will pay you virtually by the pound and build you up like a superstar and stroke your ego, never mind the backstage shenanigans that go on to break people down and build them back up as loyal minions of the business, it's no wonder these guys end up like this. It's an incredibly destructive environment, even before you get into the physical aspect of it all.

Mr. Happy, stop stirring up trouble.

Calling attention to a problem that has now claimed the life of another young man is "stirring up trouble"?

You don't even like pro wrestling

Of course I don't. And I've just explained why you probably shouldn't either.

and are ignorant of the facts.

You've got people calling wrestling a sport and suggesting that the mortality rate is normal, and I'm ignorant of the facts?

Look, in principle, I have no problem with wrestling fans enjoying this particular form of entertainment, that's not the issue. The issue is that under the McMahon regime, this has become a brutally exploitive business that is killing people in alarming numbers, and until the business can be cleaned up, and the necessary steps to protect these guys can be taken, you're essentially watching the television equivalent of Russian dancing bears, and that makes you part of the problem.

From freedictionary.com:

That's a different kind of wrestling. WWE is not a sport.

I'm not a fan of wrestling these days, first of all. Second, while I appreciate his ringwork and all the memories back in the attitude days, he didn't wrestle for me, so should I be bawling my eyes out?

No, that wasn't my point at all.

Just curious, what do you think of MMA/Boxing?

It's not something I have any interest in watching, but it doesn't seem to be as destructive as wrestling, certainly not in terms of mortality rates. This could have something to do with the fact that those guys don't fight 300 days a year, or whatever the average wrestler's schedule is, and there hasn't been the same focus on comic book physiques that required them to pump themselves full of illegal drugs. This is something that has happened under Vince McMahon.

[Hanshotfirst113]

Another wrestler who fails to make it to 40. How many is it going to take before you people stop supporting this sick freak show, which has a higher mortality rate than your average action movie bomb disposal unit? Every time one of these guys die, we get the usual "aaaw, it's so sad, he was so great... say, who do you guys think is going to take his place in the First-Blood-Electrified-Steel-Cage-Bring-Your-Own-Sledge-hammer match at Steroid Bash XXVI?"

Even Russia has had the good sense to ban their cruel and barbaric dancing bear shows, but Vince McMahon still gets to exploit and ruin the lives of these people in the name of entertainment. I myself have been too generous towards wrestling fans' fascination with this pseudo sport in the past, but the reality is that it's absolutely unconscionable, and quite frankly a bit sick for people to continue supporting this, and to make matters worse, defend it with the argument that "they really do get hurt, you know", which makes you wonder how sincere the commiserations really are, when one of them bites the dust.

There's only one way to put a stop to this, and it's a total boycott. The only question is, how many deaths is it going to take before you guys say enough is enough?

I've never watched WWF and such have no particular desire to, but my uncle was a champion on his wrestling team in high school and the sport has also found its way into the Olympics, so I have to ask, do you hold this judgment towards all wrestling or just this particular brand?

[mr.happy]

I've never watched WWF and such have no particular desire to, but my uncle was a champion on his wrestling team in high school and the sport has also found its way into the Olympics, so I have to ask, do you hold this judgment towards all wrestling or just this particular brand?

The sport of wrestling is an entirely different thing. Like I've already said, I have no issue with the idea of WWE style "wrestling" as entertainment, it's the exploitive and damaging aspect of the business I have a problem with.

[LinkG07]

The sport of wrestling is an entirely different thing. Like I've already said, I have no issue with the idea of WWE style "wrestling" as entertainment, it's the exploitive and damaging aspect of the business I have a problem with.

Please explain "In Paragraphs." As well, why not start your little boycott yourself? Write up a little petition or something or other to ban the brand if you feel so strongly to fight against a world wide industry. See where it gets you. Go ahead? What's stopping you?

Plus there are other industries out there that have done MUCH MUCH worse than WWE. As stated before, "The Independent Division." There have been people who died "In ring" in those events. Blame them too for exploit.

[Bird Boy]

I've split this into it's own thread as it was completely off-topic and had little to do with a RIP thread for a wrestler.

If you guys want to continue discussion on it, then keep it civil.

And Mr. Happy, could you kind of...you know, quit being so confrontational? You make valid points, but you don't have to get up in everyone's face quite so much. It's very unappealing.

-BB

[Hobbes829]

mr. happy please define exploitation. I suppose you think child labor is also exploitation.

[Marvin Tikvah]

Ugh, my point from the other topic didn't migrate here so I'll restate it.

So the fact that house show numbers have decreased, TV matches being prerecorded on single nights, fewer wrestlers being flown out to shows where they won't be used, and drug policies that are being heavily enforced is completely lost on you, isn't it mr. happy?

You probably will choose to ignore this anyways, since you are convinced wrestling is an inhumane circus show.