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  1. #11
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    In Your Satin Tights, Fighting For Your Rights

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Liu View Post
    The other doctor you're thinking of might be Dr. Psycho, who I think would be a good major nemesis for Wonder Woman if you cast him as the darker, uglier side of Diana's Lasso of Truth. There is a powerful element of compulsion to the Lasso of Truth, tempered mostly by Diana's compassion and the way it's really intended as an infallible lie detector. Dr. Psycho has mind-control powers that you could play as the forced compulsion without the compassion and in the service of lies rather than the Truth. You could play Queen Bee in the same role, but I like the male/female opposition that Dr. Psycho sets up with Wonder Woman. Plus, he has more history as a Wonder Woman-specific villain. I think you could probably even escalate him to a Ra's al-Ghul-scaled villain, with an army of mind-addled drones doing his evil bidding behind a season-long Sinister Plot (mwah-hah-hah-hah!). The scale of his operation and his ambitions would also set up another dichotomy with his incredibly short stature.

    I looked up Dr. Psycho. He's a mysogynist, cannibal- can't see why he's never been on TV before. To make him more palatable, tone down the mysogyny and make him a love-hater. Scorned by all women, he now hates love and romance. Have him working with the Duke Of Deception and Ares to bring about a more spartan world. They feel like the world has gotten too soft, too politically correct, too peaceful, too easy. They want a more war torn, coarse, tough civilization- survival of the fittest. Yet every top tier villainess (Catwoman, Poison Ivy, Harley Quinn), who works with him vow never to again

    Queen Bee & Dr.Psycho would be an interesting duo- both control people. When they meet who would be in charge? Who's using their powers against whom? Is anyone safe around them? Dr. Psycho would hate being around QB but not be able to resist her. Queen Bee would loathe him, but not know why she keeps lending him large sums of money.

    Hades just wants more bodies in his underworld.

    Zeus- King Of the Gods (separated from Hera, but still married) is only slightly more level headed than the rest of the gods- is still vengeful, every time we see him he's in a different form; swan, golden rain, bull, disguised human, should be managing the affairs of the gods- is instead skirt chasing.

    Aphrodite- Goddess of Love- exists to throw curve balls at Wonder Woman and distract her. She'll be the one to get Clark Kent, Arthur Curry, and Bruce Wayne to cross paths with Diana Prince just when she's trying to get serious with Steve Trevor. Wonder Woman might still be bound to the idea that if she marries or falls in love she'll lose all her powers.

    Hera- Queen of the Gods- not just sitting around letting Zeus do whatever- she's actively working with Diana and causing many disasters to befall any woman who catches Zeus' eye.

    Athena- Goddess of Wisdom- patron saint of Wonder Woman also working with WW.

    Poseidon- God of the Ocean- disapproves of Man's World's handling of the 7 seas (how much does Poseidon have to do with Aquaman and Atlantis? I can't believe there's not more of a connection between Paradise Island and Atlantis).

    Ultimately, all the gods would want the same thing, to be openly worshipped again. The Greek pantheon is still bitter over falling out of public favor a little over 2,000 years ago. With Wonder Woman out in Man's World as their most powerful, heroic,beautiful, and inspiring believer- they're hoping to use her as their prophet heralding their second coming. They want temples, offerings, prayers, and adoring masses- even the more level headed amongst the gods want in on a new world order. Each wants to remake the world in their own image. But does Wonder Woman want this? Is this the reason she went to Man's World? Would she really want Man's World under the total influence of the seamier aspects of the Greek pantheon? Her having to fight the gods would be getting into Xena/Kratos territory.



    And, as has been pointed out, Wonder Woman has Greek gods in her supporting cast and Ares has served as her Darkseid. I don't think you're hurting for candidates for a Big Bad Bigger than the Hero.

    I would leave out the other heroes, though, at least at first. Batman's first superhero team-up was with Zatanna (and the way that episode plays, you could be forgiven for not even realizing Zee's a superhero) and then he didn't get any more until much later. Superman didn't get team-ups until season 2. I'd rather not send the message, however inadvertently or unintentionally, that Wonder Woman can't stand on her own without assists from other female superheroes. I would also skip out on the "powerless" phase at first -- let that play out after this hypothetical series has been established, make the "losing her powers" a season finale cliffhanger, and then spend a bunch of episodes early in the next season showing how she's still compelled to be a hero even without them. The way she acts will ultimately be how she earns those powers back in a big triumphant moment halfway through the season.
    Aquaman- King Of The Seas- ends up working with Wonder Woman against the Greek Gods quite a bit. Why not have a bit of a ship tease between them? AM is a big enough name that he can guest star without over shadowing WW. He could be in a quadrangle with Mera/Diana/Steve.

    Captain Marvel & Mary Marvel- having gotten at least some of their powers from the Greek pantheon means they could guest star and yet not over shadow WW.

    If she does lose her powers, it could be time for another Paradise Island tournament to see who takes over the tiara of Wonder Woman with Nubia, Donna Troy, etc going at it again while Diana has to retrain and learn to do without.




    Why do you say that? The Perez retake was pretty much lifted wholesale for the DTV movie and is still active today. I think the core of her character as a warrior for peace is inherently complex -- more so than the relatively straightforward takes for Superman or Batman. I think Greg Rucka got a lot of it right in his run on the comics (even if the stories were horribly decompressed and I detected a certain amount of editorial mandate that forced a lot of things). Gail Simone not only doesn't avoid that contradiction, but runs forward top speed and embraces it, and I find her take on Diana to be one of of my favorites in the modern era (even if some of the stories get kind of messy). Kurt Busiek also had some interesting insights into her and how she stands in opposition to Superman and Batman in Trinity, and again, he doesn't shy away from her many contradictions.

    Yes, I realize this series has a snowball's chance of being made, but that's not the point. I'd sure love to see it (or even a sequel to the DTV).
    We wouldn't see WW kill in WW:TAS, but she wouldn't be opposed to it and certainly threatens villains with it. I don't think we've ever truly gotten a good episode or movie about WW, Bats, and Supes and how they differ in the way they handle crime fighting.

  2. #12
    Ed Liu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigFatHairyDeal View Post
    Don't get me wrong. I read a lot of Perez's run, and I think it's as good as any take on the character. I think I'm just a bit conflicted about the Greek pantheon.
    < S N I P >
    Ah. I think that's a different criticism than saying Wonder Woman is too optimistic, but I can see that point a bit better. I think that'd be as good a reason as any to separate a Wonder Woman series from the rest of the DCU (just I don't have a problem with any other heroes appearing on GLTAS). That said, it's never really bothered me that Wonder Woman works in such wildly different circles as the others. I like steak and I like lobster, but every now and then it's nice to have a surf-and-turf, and I see most superhero stuff that way, too. I don't mind big-scale superheroics vs. gritty urban crime drama vs. semi-divine epics vs. cosmic-scale heroing vs. magic, and the existence of one doesn't make any of the others less valid or more problematic because they're really different things, and I'm OK with mixing them up every now and then in a Justice League or a similar show. It's a thought I'm cribbing from Kurt Busiek, but I can't find it quickly searching through his blog at the moment.

    In any event, incorporating the gods into the show as Bonnie suggests above might make for a good season(s)-long conflict, with the only real issue being the paganism that might be unpalatable to TV network execs. There's a reason why most of the "gods" who show up in superhero comics are always couched as extremely powerful beings that were worshipped by earlier humans who didn't know better, and in a world where Superman, Apokalips, the Green Lantern Corps, and War World exist, that's a perfectly rational explanation for them.

    Quote Originally Posted by BonnieB21:-) View Post
    I looked up Dr. Psycho. He's a mysogynist, cannibal- can't see why he's never been on TV before. To make him more palatable, tone down the mysogyny and make him a love-hater. Scorned by all women, he now hates love and romance. Have him working with the Duke Of Deception and Ares to bring about a more spartan world. They feel like the world has gotten too soft, too politically correct, too peaceful, too easy. They want a more war torn, coarse, tough civilization- survival of the fittest. Yet every top tier villainess (Catwoman, Poison Ivy, Harley Quinn), who works with him vow never to again
    I can totally live without the cannibalism angle, but the misogyny? Why not? He's the bad guy. I'm OK with him being a massive negative role model, and his brand of domination (vs. William Moulton Marston's concepts of submission built into Wonder Woman from the start) fits nicely with the idea that he's a misogynist as well. The other stuff you're talking about works, too, but I'm totally OK with making Dr. Psycho one of those guys you just love to hate.

    As for the rest, as I said -- I'd rather leave as many of the other DC heroes out of the picture as possible, at least initially. Wonder Woman is interesting enough on her own that she doesn't need them. If there is to be shipping going on, I think the Steve Trevor/Etta Candy/Wonder Woman triangle is complicated enough without throwing Aquaman in there. If you're going to do anything else, I'd throw in the Department of Meta-Human Affairs and add in Amanda Waller, Sarge Steel, and Thomas Tresser/Nemesis for that.

    This does mean that your proposed episode about Superman/Batman/Wonder Woman comparisons also falls by the wayside, but I'm not sure that a TV show is the best place for that.

    If she does lose her powers, it could be time for another Paradise Island tournament to see who takes over the tiara of Wonder Woman with Nubia, Donna Troy, etc going at it again while Diana has to retrain and learn to do without.
    ...assuming there's a Paradise Island to have a tournament on. (Cue dramatic music!)
    Edward Liu | Disney Forum moderator | Toon Zone News Interviews Editor

    "It ain't so much the things we don't know that get us into trouble. It's the things we know that just ain't so."
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  3. #13
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    I think the one thing holding back a Wonder Woman series from being made is an unfortunate and woeful lack of faith in both animation and woman-centric animation. Ignoring Disney's little empire of girl-centric animation--which is rather strictly aimed at younger girls--it really isn't common to see animation about women aimed at older women or even audiences in general. Is a Wonder Woman series that tries even the slightest to skewer older than the 3-6 crowd really a likely or even smart business venture? There's very little in the way of statistics to show numbers would be good, not unless the princess played second fiddle to a man in her own show...which, y'know, would incite a whole heck of a lot of deserved criticism.

    Artistically, I think a Wonder Woman series could work just dandy. With Hades as her Darkseid and fifty-plus episodes of people getting stabbed and beheaded...it sounds like a lot of fun. Of course, with the way Green Lantern: The Animated Series and Young Justice went, I suppose fifty is too much to ask for.

    Ah, if only I were rich...
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  4. #14
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    the greenman is offline Senior Member
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    Sure seems MLP: fim geared toward a certain women.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by the greenman View Post
    Sure seems MLP: fim geared toward a certain women.
    If my three year old niece's singing unicorn toy is anything to go by, it's toddlers.
    TCG | Let's Sakuga: Discussing animation and the people who make it!

  6. #16
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    I'd love to see a Wonder Woman series. It'd satisfy my love of strong female characters and Greek mythology. As Paschal said however, I'm not sure if there's much business in something with a female lead in an action. You see it in video games to. Just recently there was an article about the new Gears of War game where the devs discussed being interested in a female lead, but were too worried about a negative sales impact to invest in it.

    Still, Legend of Korra seemed to do well(though I've never seen any ratings), so maybe if it's next 14 episodes are successful it could make CN executives take a serious look at the idea.

  7. #17
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    I don't know, I don't think most people will find her villains as interesting as Batman and Superman's villains. And look at how the animated 2009 movie turned out, not sure if a solo animated series would be good for her.

  8. #18
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    Wonderwall is offline Moderator
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    Whether people find her villains as interesting as those two would be up to the hypothetical creative team's work. Superman's villains on paper I would say are about on par with WW rogue gallery. What do you mean about your comment about the movie. A lot of people really liked that movie and it's usually on the tops for people's list of the DC movie line. What didn't you like about it?

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Sun View Post
    I'd love to see a Wonder Woman series. It'd satisfy my love of strong female characters and Greek mythology. As Paschal said however, I'm not sure if there's much business in something with a female lead in an action. You see it in video games to. Just recently there was an article about the new Gears of War game where the devs discussed being interested in a female lead, but were too worried about a negative sales impact to invest in it.

    Still, Legend of Korra seemed to do well(though I've never seen any ratings), so maybe if it's next 14 episodes are successful it could make CN executives take a serious look at the idea.
    Legend of Korra was a massive ratings success, which is no doubt one reason why Nick renewed it for 3 more seasons. On top of that, last year saw Katniss Everdeen conquer the box office as an action hero, alongside Snow White and the Huntsman and Merida in Brave. Last year was the year of the female action hero, and all those dollar signs that those 3 movies produced plus the success of Korra should be all the justification anybody should need to do another one. But old habits die hard and I don't expect the average executive to take the lesson if they don't want to.
    Edward Liu | Disney Forum moderator | Toon Zone News Interviews Editor

    "It ain't so much the things we don't know that get us into trouble. It's the things we know that just ain't so."
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  10. #20
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    An animated series done in the following style,using the characters depicted (minus Superman) would be awesome!! Go with her new demi-god origin since it's so much more interesting than her original clay one. Use the Greek gods and all her new found brothers and sisters plus her rogues gallery (ie Cheetah, Circe, Psycho, Ares..etc).

    http://25.media.tumblr.com/07c5b4572...lpwo1_1280.png
    Last edited by Yojimbo; 02-17-2013 at 12:37 AM. Reason: use a thumbnail or smaller version next time

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