"Young Justice" News & Discussion Thread, Part 24 (Spoilers)

[Yojimbo]

Was there another trailer/commercial today? There was an image on Tumblr of what looked:

Nope, that was from the most recent trailer. Check on the list of news on page one, the first four-5 lines has links to screengrabs I took. Might be the last one in the list.

[Deshaded]

That's from the 12/19 Facebook trailer, 0:28.

[horrorbusiness]

I don't understand Martian abilities on this show.

Now, I would just assume that they all have the same abilities, however Martian Manhunter has apparently used super strength to some degree, I recall in one episode a car is tossed at him and he swats it down.

I don't recall any certain instances but Miss Martian is likely stronger than an average human but mainly relies on her telekinesis, so, during the first season I had just assumed that perhaps White Martians had telekinetic abilities in place of super strength. Seeing as I have never really seen Martian Manhunter use or even mention having telekinesis......unless I am forgetting something.

Then Green Beetle, who is Martian shows up and obviously has telekinetic abilities, which kind of threw me.

So, either Martian Manhunter is using telekinesis to emulate super strength or Miss Martian doesn't really use her strength at all. I know it just a cartoon but it appears Weisman and his crew put a lot of thought and effort in making this universe more consistent and viable. Just wondering if they ever explained this or maybe it just an oversight

additionally....did they ever explain in the tie in comics or anything why Miss Martian is the only Martian that has a personal, organic and emotionally connected spacecraft??

[DocLandru]

ummm what is this about DIck leaving Wally out of the loop?? From what I can see of Depths Dick has told Wally everything, hence Wally's quote "what are you talking about things only get harder from here"
what do you mean wally doesn't know everything, and I Bart is filling him in on whats going on with the team anyways

No, this isn't about Dick leaving Wally out of the loop - M'Gann clearly never debriefed Dick or anyone about her encounter with Kaldur until Connor imposed himself on her in J'onn's Checago apartment. For his part, Connor obviously didn't say anything to anyone about his talk with M'Gann, but was just as clearly not surprised with Dick's revelation in La'gaan's hospital room; so Dick himself WAS surprised by Connor's revelation of Kaldur's mental injuries in the hallway outside La'gaan's room. Bart, on the other hand, would not be filling Wally in on anything: his whole focus is upon Blue and preventing Blue going over to The Reach.

At this point, I find myself incredibly impressed with SB's psycholoigical maturity: he's in control of his anger (compare it to how he reacted in 'Alpha Male' to overhearing Aqualad and Batman); he knows the importance of supporting established command, and only challenging command decisions privately with the commander; and he lives by the importance of protecting another's feelings and information given to him in confidence (his talk with M'Gann). Given this, it is no wonder to me why he has an outstanding invitation to join the League.

EDIT: Hey all,

Now that I've broken the ice, I've had some thoughts about the situation forming against our young heroes since seeing 'Before the Dawn' online after the Unexpected Hiatus, and the episodes since then have only fed those thoughts until I can't keep 'em down any more. {So last week, before seeing 'Fix', I wrote them down...and already, there are some things that are not quite so, so I hope you'll forgive those errors.}

Hopefully, how I sectionalize these thoughts will become clear as I go along...

1. The Reach
'Before the Dawn' gave us our first real glimpse of the Competitor - and Black Beetle. Now, I'm about as ignorant of DC Universe lore as GregX is, but as a veteran of Heinlein, and 'Doc' Smith's Lensmen, and Burroughs' 'Barsoom', and David Eddings, and Katherine Kurtz, and J. Michael Straczynski, as well as being a member of the Star Trek and Star Wars generation, I believe I can make a few 'wild' guesses about how the puzzle pieces might go together, and even have a reasonable chance of being right. It looked to me back on March 30th (Young Justice time) that The Reach have repeatedly pursued their plan with the goal of harvesting each world's resources for themselves and are well-versed in how to take cultural and political advantage of their 'hosts.' Their own society, I believe, is part biological (that is, 'meat' people) and significantly AI - perhaps even dominantly AI, from how disparagingly Black Beetle always talks about biologicals. Still, real compassion is not a significant part of the female Reach scientist's (or the ambassador's) makeup. But then, we knew it was going to be a hard fight, both physically and politically, for the heroes to beat back The Reach; and that brings me to...

2. The Light
You have to admit that The Light's planning in support of Savage's philosophical motivation has been worthy of the Rihannsu's greatest plots, or the long term manipulations of the Vorlons and Shadows; and the execution of their plans has almost gone unchallenged - and when those plans have been challenged, The Light's withdrawal positions (already built into their plans) have been nearly perfect and perfectly executed. Nightwing and Kaldur were right to go sub-sub-subterranean with their plan, but it's unfortunate that they felt that they could not at least bring M'Gann and Connor in on it, and now it looks like Kaldur and Artemis may pay the price for that choice, because neither Kaldur nor Artemis is safe now from Psimon's probe. But to get back to The Light, note now that even their defeat on New Year's Eve five years ago served their greater purpose. Recall what drove Savage to organize The Light: his perception that the founding and operation of the Justice League (about two years prior to Starro-teching the League) was inhibiting humanity's evolution into a galactic power. Therefore, all of the activity and conflict with the League prior to the New Year's Eve battle had the ultimate goal of doing what was accomplished - gaining control of the League long enough to make the rest of the galaxy fearful of the League and aware of the potentialities of Earth. But we also know that The Light intends to come out on top in the end - if they were chess players, they'd be as potent (an as tough to beat) as Bobby Fischer was in his heyday. They take advantage of every opening any opponent gives them. I'm not sure if The Reach knows just how much information The Light is stealing from them (just like the boom-tube tech they got from DeSaad and Apokolips), but I'm convinced that The Light is betting on the League and the Team to win the conflict with The Reach, regardless of the outcome on Rimbor (just review what Vandal says to convince Klarion to withdraw the both of them from The Watchtower on New Year's Eve five years ago).

The Light expected Alpha Squad to get a sample of the additive; so the youth group that Vandal and Lex want to put together in mimicry of the Team is just another adjunct to their plans, like converting a pawn to another rook or queen on the chessboard. The Light really has accomplished almost everything it has set out to do...all using a code of ethics or honor not too dissimilar from that of the Mafia or yakuza. But that's not surprising, considering the criminal culture Ra's al Ghul brings to The Light's table. Sportsmaster and Cheshire know it well, and clearly used it during Sportsmaster's confrontation with his masters during 'True Colors.' Cheshire and Sportsmaster are definitely wildcards in this game now; though we can't be that surprised about Savage hiring Deathstroke to replace Sportsmaster (btw - did anyone else notice how Deathstroke's mask is reminiscent of Slade from the Teen Titans animated series?), for it is common knowledge that Artemis is Sportsmaster's daughter. We'll just see how this plays out, leading us now to...

3. Unanswered questions
Back in 'Satisfaction,' GregX noted that the rebellion of Sportsmaster might just be the Achilles' heel of The Light...well, maybe, but The Light have proved capable of redirecting almost anything thrown against it. A wildcard or two won't inconvenience The Light very much, unless they have a real plan. That's what allowed the Team to win against Lex & Queen Bee on Santa Prisca and to retake The Watchtower the next day, and that's what's allowed Kaldur to get as far as he has within The Light. But that's all in jeopardy now after M'Gann's attack. How can Artemis protect Kaldur or even herself from the results of Psimon's probe...unless Connor and M'Gann have come up with a plan to take Psimon out and insinuate M'Gann into his place in the week (YJ time) since Connor went to see her 'to talk'? [Eww, what a soap-opera worthy idea that is...] {Now we know that the plan to replace Psimon with M'Gann wasn't Connon & M'Gann's, it was Artemis' improvised plan, using a mind-quelling drug Sportsmaster had developed. Better and better; this shows a potential for success that Sportsmaster and Cheshire will have against The Light...Perhaps it'll even be an attack by Sportsmaster and/or Cheshire on Black Manta that will allow M'Gann to escape...} M'Gann knows the truth about Kaldur and Artemis, and she may have shared it with Connor...but maybe not as well. {Turns out she did...} After the events of 'Failsafe,' M'Gann had Black Canary for counseling; but now? With so many secrets no one knows about? Who knows?

For that matter, even assuming everyone involved with Nightwing and Kaldur's Xanatos Gambit somehow survives, the fallout could expel Nightwing et al. from the Team and the League permanently. How did Dick end up at the sacrifice-everything point he said never wanted to go to in 'Disordered'? We know the death of Tula was a cusp for Kaldur; was it also one for Dick? for Wally and Artemis as well, leading them to try to leave the life? (Perhaps the answer to that was in one of the comics...)

'True Colors' also kicked out big questions regarding both the Scarabs and Arsenal: Arsenal's clearly getting used to his LexCorp created toy, but he's definitely still got issues with Luthor that may get him and his teammates killed. I suspect that he may also have been a victim of some Cadmus programming as well, considering his reaction to denial of access to The Watchtower (reminds you of Speedy's reaction, doesn't it?)

The appearance of the Green Beetle of Mars opens another whole can of worms - can he help Blue to adjust to his scarab, even to find a working relationship that puts the full powers of his Scarab at his command? {Maybe so...Blue thinks so...} More importantly, assuming Green has control of his Scarab because of his Martian physical and mental makeup, just how in hell did Ted Kord (assumed to be a normal, if genius, human being) manage to control his Scarab before The Light killed him? Or was it The Reach that killed him in an attempt to take the Scarab back under its control? I must admit Green's appearance gave me the same Last-Stand mentality Tim was feeling...until Green attacked Black, leaving my jaw on the carpet. Since Black Beetle knows about the failues of both Green's and Blue's Scarabs to control their hosts, I wonder if that's going to cause some consternation - and countermeasures - from The Reach's camp. I also wonder, given Green's physical conformation at rest in Jonathan Kent's barn, if Green Beetle isn't biologically a white Martian...{I guess not, given his shape shift progression to a human appearance; however, M'Gann doesn't go through a 'White Martian' step to shift into her Megan persona, so that's no proof...}

Well, I hope I haven't been too boring in my ruminations. I will say that I have been thoroughly enjoying this series, and would like to throw a 'Bravo!' or three to Brandon, Sam, and Greg for the creative effort they've put into the show. I find I prefer a series with a little meat in it - and something that allows one to try to unscrew the inscrutable as an integral part of the show is as good as television gets. Let me make one more comment about Vandal's philosophical platform: his thought is that protecting people from danger or interfering with evolutionary development makes a race ripe for being conquered or destroyed, preventing the race from reaching its potential; thus, to maximize the race's development, evolution must be allowed to have full play in all aspects of life. While I agree that evolution does allow or even promote increases in the physical and intellectual potential over time, I do not agree that it is the fastest way to bring it about. History has many examples where one man (or woman) has changed the world through having a clear vision of what he or she wished to accomplish, and then applied all of his or her being to the accomplishment of that goal, achieving it through persistence and focus, and it always resulted in a much shorter time for success and overall human advancement than would have occurred if it were left up to evolution alone. Evolution is then the way of minimum intelligence applied to the solution of problems, whereas the more one can bring active intelligence into focus on problems, the more rapidly those problems can be solved (which is what the League members support, by serving others as they do).

See you on the forums!

Mod Note: Double Post Merged, Use the Edit button instead of posting multiple times in a row.

[Gatordragon24]

I don't understand Martian abilities on this show.

Now, I would just assume that they all have the same abilities, however Martian Manhunter has apparently used super strength to some degree, I recall in one episode a car is tossed at him and he swats it down.

I don't recall any certain instances but Miss Martian is likely stronger than an average human but mainly relies on her telekinesis, so, during the first season I had just assumed that perhaps White Martians had telekinetic abilities in place of super strength. Seeing as I have never really seen Martian Manhunter use or even mention having telekinesis......unless I am forgetting something.

Then Green Beetle, who is Martian shows up and obviously has telekinetic abilities, which kind of threw me.

So, either Martian Manhunter is using telekinesis to emulate super strength or Miss Martian doesn't really use her strength at all. I know it just a cartoon but it appears Weisman and his crew put a lot of thought and effort in making this universe more consistent and viable. Just wondering if they ever explained this or maybe it just an oversight

additionally....did they ever explain in the tie in comics or anything why Miss Martian is the only Martian that has a personal, organic and emotionally connected spacecraft??

In the episode "Terrors"' Martian Manhunter phased through the car; Superman was the one who swat the car thrown at him. In "Coldhearted" however, Manhunter did lift a turret with ease. I believe he telekinetically lifted a couple of crates in "Misplaced", so he has TK.

Greg Weisman said on Ask Greg a while back that all Martians have super strength, telekinesis and telepathy, so there you go. He also said that there are more Bio-ships like Miss Martian's on Mars, but they not commonplace.

Here are the links to Greg's answers:
Search Ask Greg : Gargoyles : Station Eight

Search Ask Greg : Gargoyles : Station Eight

[Guy Gardner]

If you pay close attention to the end of "True Colors", you can see B'arrz O'oom's personal bioship as well. It's hovering near where Miss Martian's/Martian Manhunter's bioship is.

[Geodude]

Anyone else wondering why Greg is "swamped with work" when production on YJ is supposed to be long over? ;-)

[horrorbusiness]

If you pay close attention to the end of "True Colors", you can see B'arrz O'oom's personal bioship as well. It's hovering near where Miss Martian's/Martian Manhunter's bioship is.

I will definitely be checking that out....thanks.

In the episode "Terrors"' Martian Manhunter phased through the car; Superman was the one who swat the car thrown at him. In "Coldhearted" however, Manhunter did lift a turret with ease. I believe he telekinetically lifted a couple of crates in "Misplaced", so he has TK.

Greg Weisman said on Ask Greg a while back that all Martians have super strength, telekinesis and telepathy, so there you go. He also said that there are more Bio-ships like Miss Martian's on Mars, but they not commonplace.

Here are the links to Greg's answers:
Search Ask Greg : Gargoyles : Station Eight

Search Ask Greg : Gargoyles : Station Eight

Aha. Thanks. I was wondering because she never seems to use it. I mean normally Manhunter is up there strength wise with the like of Superman, so you would figure that Miss Martian, although younger, would be up there. Yet, there has never been any instances where I can remember her getting physical. You would figure it would of come in handy on some of the missions they went on, I guess its more creative to have her use her other abilities then to have her just fly around punching stuff

[Santino]

2. The Light
You have to admit that The Light's planning in support of Savage's philosophical motivation has been worthy of the Rihannsu's greatest plots, or the long term manipulations of the Vorlons and Shadows; and the execution of their plans has almost gone unchallenged - and when those plans have been challenged, The Light's withdrawal positions (already built into their plans) have been nearly perfect and perfectly executed. Nightwing and Kaldur were right to go sub-sub-subterranean with their plan, but it's unfortunate that they felt that they could not at least bring M'Gann and Connor in on it, and now it looks like Kaldur and Artemis may pay the price for that choice, because neither Kaldur nor Artemis is safe now from Psimon's probe. But to get back to The Light, note now that even their defeat on New Year's Eve five years ago served their greater purpose. Recall what drove Savage to organize The Light: his perception that the founding and operation of the Justice League (about two years prior to Starro-teching the League) was inhibiting humanity's evolution into a galactic power. Therefore, all of the activity and conflict with the League prior to the New Year's Eve battle had the ultimate goal of doing what was accomplished - gaining control of the League long enough to make the rest of the galaxy fearful of the League and aware of the potentialities of Earth. But we also know that The Light intends to come out on top in the end - if they were chess players, they'd be as potent (an as tough to beat) as Bobby Fischer was in his heyday. They take advantage of every opening any opponent gives them. I'm not sure if The Reach knows just how much information The Light is stealing from them (just like the boom-tube tech they got from DeSaad and Apokolips), but I'm convinced that The Light is betting on the League and the Team to win the conflict with The Reach, regardless of the outcome on Rimbor (just review what Vandal says to convince Klarion to withdraw the both of them from The Watchtower on New Year's Eve five years ago).

I hope all this gets answered. I really want to know how The Light even knew about The Reach, or Rimbor.

[ShadowStar]

Any guesses as to which locations the Team will be forced to defend when the Reach begin their attack? I wonder if Atlantis will be attacked, for example? (Could be one of the reasons why the Reach had a large fleet in the ocean at the end of "Before the Dawn".)

If episode 19 is called "Summit" as has been rumoured, I wonder if the Reach's attack on the Earth takes place in the episodes before that, with negotiations for peace underway in "Summit" after their forces are defeated. (And then Apokolips invades... )

I hope all this gets answered. I really want to know how The Light even knew about The Reach, or Rimbor.

Maybe in this continuity, the meteor that gave Vandal Savage immortality fell to Earth from Apokolips or New Genesis via boom tube...

[CyberCubed]

Anyone else wondering why Greg is "swamped with work" when production on YJ is supposed to be long over? ;-)

He's probably moved on to a new series, hence being swamped with work.

Young Justice is most likely over, it's best not to cling to false hope like we did with past shows that got canceled too early.

[Leradomi]

couple of errors/problems I noticed after re-watching True Colors. One is that where Roy's arm was amputated was way up higher and his robotic arm connects just varely above his elbow joint.
Also there are height problems, in the episode Darkest when they are all in the grotto together Tim/Robin is quite easily taller than Bart/Impulse yet lately they appear to be the same height, I mean its true Bart is a growing boy but Tm would grow too right?
Is anyone here able to differentiate or list their heights from tallest to shortest or heck even list their ages from oldest to youngest??


As I'm watching Before the Dawn again now I really realized how badly they missed an opportunity for Nightwing to get in on the action I mean we RARELY see him in action I mean Depths and a couple of seconds of training or something and Before the Dawn would have been a great opportunity for him to get in more action time but no he gets stuck behind the bay door? As leader he should be in there fighting with his team for his team, just a really big missed opportunity.

[DocLandru]

Any guesses as to which locations the Team will be forced to defend when the Reach begin their attack? I wonder if Atlantis will be attacked, for example? (Could be one of the reasons why the Reach had a large fleet in the ocean at the end of "Before the Dawn".)

I'd guess Poseidonis would likely be as likely to attacked as any other major power-and-population center; but I rather think that the Marianas Trench was more likely the best place to hide on the planet's surface, since it would be most hidden from any orbiting sensors (either satellite- or Watchtower-based).

[PretenderNX01]

Anyone else wondering why Greg is "swamped with work" when production on YJ is supposed to be long over? ;-)

I'm hoping it's because he's swamped with production of a new season of YJ having started up and whatever else he's working on.

As he stated in an Ask Greg, production of a new season and an announcement of a new season happen on their own timeframes.
Search Ask Greg : Gargoyles : Station Eight

But I believe the actual cutoff is the upfronts in March.
With Thundercats, we found it missing from the schedule at the upfronts and still hoped- that didn't work out.
We know production ended but that happens at the end of every season

We know Jason Marsden, at the time he was asked, seemed over but maybe Impulse is out at the end of season 2.

But if we don't see it in March on the announced schedule, it's done for sure. Right now though, there's no announced schedule for YJ to be on or not on.

[Northern Sun]

But I believe the actual cutoff is the upfronts in March.
…
But if we don't see it in March on the announced schedule, it's done for sure. Right now though, there's no announced schedule for YJ to be on or not on.

When does the announcement schedule for this "Upfront" event typically come out? And how far in advance would they announce a new season, since I figure if there is one, the first episodes wouldn't be till fall 2013-spring 2014.

[Yojimbo]

When does the announcement schedule for this "Upfront" event typically come out? And how far in advance would they announce a new season, since I figure if there is one, the first episodes wouldn't be till fall 2013-spring 2014.

Young Justice was in development starting March 2009. It was announced at CN Upfront on around April 21, 2010. The pilot premiered November 26, 2010. Formally started airing in January 7, 2011.

Young Justice: Invasion was in development starting March 18, 2011 (but informal brainstorming and planning was done since 2009). It was announced at CN Upfront March 23, 2011. It premiered on April 28, 2012.

[James Harvey]

According to a Cartoon Network Upfronts Overview press release issued by the network today, Young Justice is currently not listed in the programs set to return to the 2013-2014 season on the network. The complete press release is available at The World's Finest.

Just note there is no official confirmation on the program's fate.

[Gold Guy]

According to a Cartoon Network Upfronts Overview press release issued by the network today, Young Justice is not listed in the programs set to return to the 2013-2014 season on the network. The complete press release is available at The World's Finest.

Well....that stinks.

[Gatordragon24]

According to a Cartoon Network Upfronts Overview press release issued by the network today, Young Justice is not listed in the programs set to return to the 2013-2014 season on the network. The complete press release is available at The World's Finest.

Huh. It also looks like Green Lantern: The Animated Series is not listed as well. Perhaps for 2013-2014, DC Nation will be airing Beware the Batman and Teen Titans Go in their place. Producing a show can take a while.

But James Harvey is right, the fate of the two shows are still in the air, so who knows what will happen?

[Jacob T. Paschal]

Can't say I am surprised. CN seems to only want to focus on two shows at a time, two of which they have in the works already.