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    Young Justice "Before The Dawn" Talkback (Spoilers)

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    After a lengthy hiatus, Young Justice: Invasion has returned! Check out an all-new episode of the acclaimed Young Justice: Invasion today on DC Nation!


    Click here for further details on this episode!

    Young Justice: Invasion
    Saturday, January 5th, 2013 at 10:30am (ET/ PT) - "#36 Before the Dawn"

    On a covert mission to rescue some of its own, The Team, Blue Beetle and Miss Martian uncover shocking secrets… and devastating truths!

    Comments?

    Mod Note: We appreciate and encourage discussion, but please keep your posts civil, relevant and insightful. Feel free to comment as the episode airs, too, providing your own commentary, though avoid successive posting. However, do not post any improper or inflammatory material, as we will issue warnings if we believe it necessary. And please remember to keep the discussion ON-TOPIC!

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    While it hasn't yet broadcast today, I still have my copy from when iTunes released it prematurely (and the Steam Lantern episode of GL as well).

    I guess its another week for me

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    After the (imfamous) "DC Nation Hiatus", we finally reach the halfway mark of Young Justice's 2nd Season/Invasion!

    *Interestingly enough, the episode starts with Jaime skateboarding on the streets in the middle of the night, rather then him being trapped as he was in the previous episode! After assuring his mom he will be home soon, he takes a shortcut through the parking lot of Kord Industries. Ah, I see what they're doing now...

    *Suddenly, Kord Industries blows up! Luckily Jaime isn't hurt and gets his burning hoodie off quickly! He also finds a small blue beetle-shaped item...which immediately attaches itself to his back!

    *Yep, it was just Jaime having a "flashback dream" of when he first got the Scarab (and when Ted Kord died, I presume). The Scarab refreshes Jaime's memory by recapping recent events and also adds that its abilities have been disabled in the pod they are in.

    *Two aliens (both vaguely resembling insects) soon appear to examine the young hero. They are speaking in that strange alien language heard in previous episodes; luckily the Scarab can still translate what they are saying, despite otherwise being disabled.

    *According to the female alien, the Scarab first attached itself to Jaime 8 months ago (also adding that its memory files only cover those 8 months). Since this episode takes place in March, that would mean Jaime became Blue Beetle in July. The male alien says they should reboot the Scarab, but the female alien insists on first finding out why the "crash" occurred in the first place. A familiar voice from Salvage then says he thinks the female alien (who is revealed to be a scientist) just wants to "play with the meat", which she sinisterly confirms. Stepping out of the shadows, the voice is revealed to belong to...Black Beetle!

    *The male alien (who is revealed to be an ambassador) gives Kaldur a tour of the facility and confirms that the alien race of his people is the Reach! Looks like those who theorized that The Light's Partner is The Reach were spot on! I figured we would learn their identity at the halfway mark as it was at Season 1's halfway mark when we learned the identities of the Light members!

    *The Reach Ambassador explains to Kaldur that his species is interested in studying and weaponizing the "Meta-Gene", which Kaldur accurately presumes is what makes "super humans".

    *In the first lab, the Reach Ambassador introduces Kaldur to the Reach Scientist, who explains that Lagoon Boy, Shimmer and the 4 teens from Beneath are test subjects for stimulating the Meta-Gene in "average" humans. Kaldur points out that Lagoon Boy is an Atlantean with powers, to which the Reach Scientist explains that Lagoon Boy's powers comes from magic, meaning that he is, while not human, still an "average" Atlantean.

    *The trio proceed to a second lab, where the Reach Scientist explains that Beast Boy and Impulse are test subjects for how humans with active Meta-Genes react to stress.

    *The Reach Scientist says it was a pleasure to meet Kaldur, before entering a third lab by herself. Kaldur notes that Blue Beetle is unaccounted for and assumes he is in this third lab. The Reach Ambassador firmly (but still politely) tells Kaldur that the third lab has nothing to do with their partnership with the Light, adding that Blue Beetle is, while human, "of the Reach". He then changes topics by asking if more test subjects are coming, to which Kaldur confirms all while being overseen by his "Second-In-Command"...

    *We then see this event happening at a docking bay in Star City. It might just be because I haven't seen Darkest in a long time, but I don't remember Artemis' voice being that deep while speaking as Tigress (though I do remember it being deeper then her "normal voice").

    *Tim, Barbera and (a shrunken) Bumble Bee sneak into the cage of captives from above. Looks like Tim has followed Dick's example by wearing sunglasses, though I'm surprised that Barbra didn't as well. I guess she figured no one in Star City would recognize the daughter of the commissioner of Gotham's police force.

    *Barbera assures the frightened captives that there are here to help, but a blonde girl questions if they can trust them...until she sees Bumble Bee hide in Tim's jacket. According to the credits, this girl's name is "Stephanie Brown", the 4th Robin and 3rd Batgirl in the comics, if I'm not mistaken. I take it there foreshadowing her rise to heroic things in Season 3 (here's hoping it does get green-lit).

    *The Manta Flyer with these captives is being followed by a disguised Bio-Ship with Nightwing relieved that Lagoon Boy is at their destination. When Wonder Girl asks how he knows this, he covers it up as "wishful thinking". When the young Amazon also questions how he knew about the shipment at Star City, he covers it up by saying Aquaman found out while searching for Lagoon Boy. I can only imagine how Nightwing feels about "playing Batman"...

    *Looks like Jaime is having another dream, this time of him and Tye skateboarding. He soon wakes up when Tye speaks in the Reach's language. That was certainly unsettling...

    *After the Reach Scientist expresses disappointment in the Scarab not functioning "on mode", Black Beetle suggests rebooting it. The Reach Scientist reluctantly agrees, adding that they will have to find a new host as rebooting will kill Jaime. Black Beetle replies that that won't be a problem as Earth has plenty of potential hosts...

    *At last, the Bio-Ship has reached the Reach's Ship! Nightwing notes its similarities to the bombs from Alienated and Darkest, Wonder Girl adds that it resembles Blue Beetle's armor. Miss Martian camouflages and density shifts into the Reach ship, all while setting up a telepathic link for all the active team members.

    *Barbera informs the others that she, Tim and Bumble Bee have seen the Reach (though still unaware of their name), as well as Kaldur, who she is especially worried to see. Nightwing assures he he won't be looking for them and to keep a cool head.

    *Miss Martian confirms finding Beast Boy & Impulse and Barbera confirms finding Lagoon Boy & the others (save for Blue Beetle). Both add that they are currently unsupervised, but are no sure if they should proceed with Blue Beetle unaccounted for. Nightwing assures them to continue, saying it's better to do so now before they also need to be helped. With that, the rescue begins!

    *Nice to see Beast Boy back again and hear him speak again, he my favorite team member to have joined in Season 2 and his "sibling-like" moments with Miss Martian are always heart warming and showcase Miss Martian's personality before it became colder. It further reaffirms why I like this version of Beast Boy (both personality and voice) better then his Teen Titans counterpart; he is simply more likable to me.

    *I did get a good laugh out of Beast Boy noticing Miss Martian being shorter because of water density, as well as Impulse's quick "thanks, bye!" comment; it does lighten the mood in an otherwise dark episode. Speaking of Impulse, it looks as though he can phase through walls like his grandpa!

    *Superboy reveals he has disguised himself as a Manta Trooper and proceeds to knock out Tigress and the other soldiers, thus securing the ship's docking bay! Nightwing docks the Bio-Ship and Wonder Girl escorts the escape party to the ship! Tigress soon regains conciseness...

    *As the "Green Siblings" navigate through a hallway, they see Kaldur walking down an intersecting hall! Oh crap...

    *Without a second thought or hesitation of any kind, Miss Martian venomously growls "Murderer!" and proceeds to use "extreme measures" on Kaldur for revenge! I repeat, oh crap...

    *Superboy realizes that the link is down and tries to find her and her "brother"...only to be stopped by Black Beetle, who traps all of them b sealing the ships docking bay!

    *We finally her the name "Black Beetle" used on screen when Wonder Girl tries to warn him that he's out numbered and they'll go easy on him if he surrenders. Black Beetle simply is amused by this and proceeds to give an insane evil laugh! Bumble Bee, you took the words right out of my mouth!

    *Impulse manages to find and rescue Jaime before its too late! I did like the "Matrix-styled effects" they used when showing Impulse's super speed!

    *Miss Martian continues to viciously use "extreme measures" on Kaldur and sees many of his memories...including the truth behind his "betrayal" and Artemis' "death"! She releases him with a regretful look on her face and the realization of Superboy's warnings. But it is too late...Kaldur is now catatonic, just as Psimon was in Image!

    *Considering Miss Martian's regret, I think we can safely say Kaldur wasn't a triple agent. I figured he was still a good guy and Wally was just being too quick to assume the worst about one of his friends.

    *Tigress shortly arrives, horrified at what has happened to Kaldur! Though more in a sad manner then an angry one, Artemis telepathically (and rightfully) calls Miss Martian out on what she just did. The martian can only weakly responded that she thought "he deserved it", knowing full well that reason no longer holds any water.

    *Beast Boy changes into a tiger to defend his sister, but Tigress activates a smoke bomb to retreat, instead. She calls out to the younger shapeshifter that she'll take her fallen comrade and suggests he do the same, adding that he should count himself lucky. If Psimon managed to recover from his catatonic state, then there is hope for Kaldur that he can recover; we'll just have to wait and see, I guess...

    *Beast Boy tries to get Miss Martian out of her funk by praising her for taking down Kaldur, but adding the rest of the group need them still. I get a strong feeling Garfield has no clue what his "sister" does to her opponents.

    *Back at the ship's docking bay, Black Beetle lays down a brutal curb stomping battle towards the rest of heroes! Some might say our heroes are suffering from the "Worf Effect", though it makes sense, as they aren't very coordinated as they usually are due to the telepathic link being down. I guess we could chalk this up as a case of "Worf had the Flu".

    *A boy (who is most likely Virgil Hawkins) tries to help by taking a Manta Trooper gun, but gets taken out by Shimmer, who continues to show what an ungrateful jerk she is by attacking Barbra (though she is a villain, so it shouldn't be too surprising)! Speaking of Shimmer, I wonder if we'll ever get to hear her talk.

    *We then see a glimpse of Impulse's bad future as he narrates that Blue Beetle turns to the Dark Side when the Scarab gets turned on to the Mode! We finally learn Impulse's main reason for coming to the present and just how significant the meaning behind "crash" and "mode" are in his time! This reminds that Impulse's means to the present was one-way, so I wonder how he'll get back to (a hopefully more peaceful version of) his time period, I can't imagine him staying in the present once the season ends. I also find it amusing how the phrase “Big Bad” is being used more and more frequently in shows.

    *Beast Boy (as a gorilla) and Miss Martian arrive to the sealed docking bay doors, where the latter finally restores the telepathic link. Nightwing confirms he's trapped in the Bio-Ship without knowing why and Wonder Girl updates that she and Barbra are the only heroes standing in the fight now!

    *The revelation continues to affect Miss Martian's awareness as she forgets she can density shift until Beast Boy spells it out for her. Unfortunately, her still being "out of it" gives Black Beetle plenty of time to alter the door's density, trapping her! He then proceeds to give Wonder Girl a very brutal beat down! Luckily, Barbra manages to take out Shimmer!

    *Impulse and Blue Beetle catch up to Beast Boy and open the doors again! Barbra tells Nightwing to be ready to fly off once she, Impulse and Beast Boy get everyone on board, while Blue Beetle fights Black Beetle (who refers to the former as "little brother")!

    *After hallucinating an image of his evil future self (Impulse must have been very detailed in his explanation), Jaime allows the Scarab to assume full control of the armor!

    *This at least let’s him put up a better fight against the armored Reach, but Black Beetle still has the upper hand! Shimmer soon regains consciousness and learns of her new powers by accident...she now has fire (or rather) heat powers! This burns a hole in the ship's hull and causes it to flood!

    *Impulse tries to save Blue Beetle, but the flooding water is too strong! Barbra orders that they leave, telling Beast Boy they won't be any good if they drown when he questions not getting Blue Beetle!

    *The flood manages to save Blue Beetle by whisking him out of the ship! Black Beetle saves Shimmer and reseals the hole, all with a displeased growl at the escape...

    *Despite the Reach Ship's attacking, Lagoon Boy manages to get Blue Beetle and bring him to safety! I wonder if this will learn him less resentment from some viewers?

    *Nightwing congratulates the team on a job well done for the rescue mission and offers Miss Martian control of her Bio-Ship. When she doesn't respond, a worried Beast Boy says she is probably "basking in her victory over Kaldur". Yep, I'm certain Garfield doesn't know what his "sister" really does and can only imagine the poor kid's reaction if he ever found out...

    *We don't see Nightwing's reaction to hearing about the confrontation with Kaldur, but Superboy is subtly angry about it...

    *The next day, Nightwing tells Captain Atom about the mission and how they can expose the Reach before its too late. Aquaman, however, says that won't be so easy now...

    *He shows the others a news report showing the Reach Ambassador greeting the United Nations with the false claim of coming in peace. Godfrey praises the Reach for "using the front door" to come to Earth; if they stick to Godfrey's comic origins, then that statement will be ironic in more then one way...

    *Nightwing admits how crafty it was of the Reach to reveal themselves before the heroes outing them (I guess they feel the captured teens as public witnesses would not suffice), though he does say they at least know the opponent they are dealing with.

    *Little do our heroes (or Earth's general public, for that matter) know, however, a fleet of Reach Ships are hiding at the bottom of the Mariana Trench...

    A very eventful episode! The Light's Partners' identity is finally revealed and we learn more about the back-story of both Blue Beetle and Impulse! Although the rescue was a success, Nightwing's plan gets shot right down the drain thanks to Miss Martian's blind rage, who learns too late what kind of monster she is becoming! The Reach has certainly proven themselves to be a dangerous and competent threat! We're finally halfway through Season 2/Invasion, only 10 more episodes of the season to go! Here's hoping we can see the rest of the episodes without any more interruptions!

  5. #5
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    This was fantastic! I got it on my iPad a few months ago, but that doesn't mean I can't talk about it now.

    First off, Noooo! Aqualad! At least he put up a good fight against Miss Martian before being mind-crushed. I hope he comes out of his catatonic state. If his memories are gone (I'm not sure), maybe Miss Martian can restore his memories. She did it once before in "Bereft".


    That's how Jaime bonded with the Scarab in Young Justice? It looked like it simply pinched him. I expected it to burrow deeper in his spine.


    The Reach's cricket-like language reminds me of the Prawns from District 9. I also think that's how Skitter from the current Teen Titans comics would sound like in a sound-based medium like TV.


    The Reach taking teenagers and unlocking their metagene to give them powers reminds me the organization N.O.W.H.E.R.E. doing the same thing in the New 52. In fact, that is how quite a few teen metahumans got their powers in the New 52, including Beast Boy and Terra. N.O.W.H.E.R.E. also created Superboy. Harvest, the leader of N.O.W.H.E.R.E., seems to have a fascination with teen metahumans.


    So that's Black Beetle. Never heard of him before, but he looks cool (I love his voice). I would love to see Blood Beetle as a Reach agent in this show, but he's from the current Blue Beetle comics and Greg Weisman said that the New 52 doesn't affect Young Justice because the show was created before the New 52.


    Black Beetle curbstomping the Team reminds me of the Locust commander, General RAAM, from the Gears of War video game series. Both are big, strong, and practically unstoppable. Whenever General RAAM appears on the battlefield, retreat is a must. In fact, my nickname for Black Beetle is now RAAM Beetle.

    Holy crap, Black Beetle beat the stuffing out of Wonder Girl! He smashed her into the wall for like, ten seconds. That was brutal!

    There were a lot of great fight scenes! We even get to see Shimmer fight! It's about time. My favorite fight was the one between Blue Beetle and Black Beetle. Blue's pretty powerful if he can go toe-to-toe with Black Beetle.


    So Blue Beetle was the one to enslave the Earth in Impulse's time. Man, he got ripped! Jokes aside, it makes me wonder why Jaime's in control and not the Scarab in this show. The reason why Jaime's Scarab isn't in control. In the comics is because it was damaged by a Green Lantern before it landed on Earth centuries ago. Perhaps in Young Justice, Ted Kord experimented with the Scarab, which is why Jaime's in control and not vice-versa.


    Dang, the Reach went to Manhattan to "come in peace?" Yeah that's a bald-faced lie.


    Fantastic episode! I'm pumped for the next one! Things are getting intense!
    Last edited by Gatordragon; 01-06-2013 at 11:07 AM.

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    Feels kind of strange to have this talkback page now, since I think most people on this forum already saw it back in October. Anyway, great episode. Can't wait till things come to a conclusion/climax with this undercover op. "Fix" maybe?

    I had this recorded on my DVR and it cut right as the credits started. Were there any preview shots of "Cornered" during the credits?

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    Skaddix is offline Member
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    A good fight? he put up like zero fight.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Sun View Post
    Feels kind of strange to have this talkback page now, since I think most people on this forum already saw it back in October. Anyway, great episode. Can't wait till things come to a conclusion/climax with this undercover op. "Fix" maybe?

    I had this recorded on my DVR and it cut right as the credits started. Were there any preview shots of "Cornered" during the credits?
    Nope. They played the guy running around the track experiment again.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Sun View Post
    I had this recorded on my DVR and it cut right as the credits started. Were there any preview shots of "Cornered" during the credits?
    Nope. Just the fight between Blue Beetle and Black Beetle that happened in this episode.

    Quote Originally Posted by Skaddix View Post
    A good fight? he put up like zero fight.
    Zero fight my foot. Aqualad was clearly resisting Miss Martian's mental attack for a while. The Kroloteans she mentally assaulted in the previous episodes went down in a second. The only other person to resist Miss Martians mind crush was Psimon, but Aqualad's not even telepathic.

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  10. #10
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    Amazing episode
    Great to see Young Justice again
    The action scenes were awesome
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    Miss Martian meeting Aqualad might be my favorite moment from the entire show. Awesome episode, and absolutely cannot wait for more.

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    for blue beetle and the reach to be powerful enough to cause that apocalypse in the future???

    under the protection of the Justice League???

    Not happening. I can buy Darkseid or Braniac or Amazo even The light besting the League but a mature blue beetle? No way

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    I seriously doubt Blue Beetle did it solo given the fact the reach brought an Armada but its more then doable especially if they can control all those metahumans they are churning out and with a Light assist.

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    There were some totally awesome bits of voice acting in this one. Miss Martian's "You!" when she sees Kaldur, Impulse's "I'm goin back in for him!", Nightwing's "We know what we're up against", and the coolest line was the way Godfrey said "not sneaking in the back...". That totally revealed his true nature, if you ask me.

    Also, gotta say I love Alyson Stoner's Barbara. Probably my favorite Batgirl ever.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Sidious View Post
    for blue beetle and the reach to be powerful enough to cause that apocalypse in the future???

    under the protection of the Justice League???

    Not happening. I can buy Darkseid or Braniac or Amazo even The light besting the League but a mature blue beetle? No way
    First of all, that's not Jaime using the blue scarab in Bart's future. Secondly, he has The Reach on his side. On top of all that, we know the Light's involved with Darkseid and Apokolips, so they could have contributed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Sidious View Post
    for blue beetle and the reach to be powerful enough to cause that apocalypse in the future???

    under the protection of the Justice League???

    Not happening. I can buy Darkseid or Braniac or Amazo even The light besting the League but a mature blue beetle? No way
    Ya i don't think you're factoring in the light.
    Hell, Savage's speech during the season finale episode leads to the idea that he's practically been plotting for humanity to suffer from some kind of apocalyptic scenario. Afterall he seems to believe in survival of the fittest, that advisty rbings about evolutionary superiority and that the league was getting in the way of earth's evolution by protecting them from the worst. Though regardless the light has already proven capable of taking down the league (only reason they are still around is because the light had bigger plans). If they can take out the league, then the earth is ripe picking for the reach.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Sun View Post
    Feels kind of strange to have this talkback page now, since I think most people on this forum already saw it back in October. Anyway, great episode. Can't wait till things come to a conclusion/climax with this undercover op. "Fix" maybe?

    I had this recorded on my DVR and it cut right as the credits started. Were there any preview shots of "Cornered" during the credits?
    funny you mention that. when i was watching the show this morning it felt like i saw this ep already. so i check my itunes folder. and there it was.
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    This was just as thrilling as the first time I watched it. I wonder if the Reach will try to integrate into society, to continue their deception..how will Megan live knowing what she's done?
    This whole wait between episodes made me forget one detail....what was the point of the other alien race who were posing as humans? What was their story?
    Can't wait to see what happens next!


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    Quote Originally Posted by Dudley View Post
    This whole wait between episodes made me forget one detail....what was the point of the other alien race who were posing as humans? What was their story?
    Well the Krolotean's came to Earth looking to profit off it somehow, but were flat out betrayed by the Light. I'd imagine The Light had them exposed to get people riled up about aliens, and then have The Reach come out and "do it right" and get on the Earthling's good side.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Sidious View Post
    for blue beetle and the reach to be powerful enough to cause that apocalypse in the future???

    under the protection of the Justice League???

    Not happening. I can buy Darkseid or Braniac or Amazo even The light besting the League but a mature blue beetle? No way
    You clearly need to read the Blue Beetle comics. The Reach are essentially an alien East India Company and because they present themselves as allies to the world the League can't attack them directly without any evidence since that'd cause an intergalactic incident.

    The Reach don't go all Independence Day on a planet, they have more subtle methods, they are a patient race. They can spend a long time on a planet, ingratiating themselves with the locals, giving them things that'd make them easier to subjugate, then start what looks like a natural disaster and then offer to evacuate. Which gets them a planet population of new slaves and a new planet to plunder for resources. In the comics they were adding a chemical to the water supply that'd make everyone less docile when the time came to start the natural disaster.

    If you can't see them winning against the League in a fight remember that the Scarabs are their infiltrator units and that a fully functioning one, Black Beetle, took out most of The Team. The Reach can send a thousand of them at the League. They don't do that because they don't want to mess with the Green Lantern Corp directly, hence the "faked natural disaster" invasion method. But right now if the League attacks them, and they kill them all, they can claim to be innocent victims of an intergalacticly known criminal organisation.
    The Reaf Debrief My site for my reviews and articles of comics, cartoons, and riffing on nostalgia.
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  20. #20
    Frontier is offline Member
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    Finally Young Justice is back, and with a thrilling episode that was well worth the wait!

    Black Beetle completely trouncing most of the team, including their heavy-hitters, is a good sign that the Reach aren't going to be beaten by an old fashioned Superhero fight.The Justice League could probably take out a decent amount of them, but they'd still eventually fall under a full-scale Reach invasion. The heroes are going to have to think outside box if they want to stop the invasion and prevent the dark future.

    If there's anything good that came out of Impulses future, or at least something karmic, it's that ultimately the Light's plan blew up in their faces. Klarion was probably the only one to escape the fallout.

    I was actually expecting Virigl to take down Black Beetle, discovering his powers and zapping Beetle by surprise, but it looks like Jamie is the only member of the Team with a chance of beating him in a fight. And judging by the fact that Blue actually succeeded in getting Black [angry], an impressive feat, I expect a deadly rematch between these two later in the season.

    Looks like Nightwing's plan has hit its first major hitch, as he, Kaldur, and Artemis learn the consequences of fooling your friends and not expecting them to take things too far. The excuse "we needed to make it believable" works wonders when the plan succeeds and no one gets hurt, but now Kaldur has to suffer the price of becoming a convincing bad guy and the excuse rings even more hollow. I don't know whether Nightwing is at fault for not expecting Miss Martian to go overboard after Artemis' death or Superboy for not being more open with others about Miss Martians penchant for mindwiping people and messing with their heads.

    Mod Note: Watch the Language. There are rules here. Word edited.

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