Questions about the 65 episode rule.

[Antiyonder]

1. It's done because it's cheaper to produce more new shows? How can it be expensive to renew current shows than starting a new show?

2. Disney shows have been extended before, so isn't there a chance of Kim Possible following them?

3. How Weekenders get an extentsion considering that Disney didn't air the show in a good time slot?

[One Radical Dude]

1. It's done because it's cheaper to produce more new shows? How can it be expensive to renew current shows than starting a new show?

2. Disney shows have been extended before, so isn't there a chance of Kim Possible following them?

3. How Weekenders get an extentsion considering that Disney didn't air the show in a good time slot?Okay....here we go....

1. That's a good question, Antiyonder. Maybe, tc knows how to answer that question better than I do.

2. There's always a chance...especially if the 65 rule is killed. Even if the rule is never killed, there are a few (I DO mean few exceptions). If KP does go past 65 under the stupid rule, I don't think it'll go past the 65 mark by much...maybe around 70 at best. Either way, I'm so sick of hit shows killed by a stupid policy.

3. The show got an extension? How many episodes does that show have now?

[loyalheart]

1. It's done because it's cheaper to produce more new shows? How can it be expensive to renew current shows than starting a new show?

2. Disney shows have been extended before, so isn't there a chance of Kim Possible following them?

3. How Weekenders get an extentsion considering that Disney didn't air the show in a good time slot?
1) Because they only need 65 episodes. they can keep airing them and still have a following. for the live-action shows it's a good thing because they can move on if they had enough

2)If they are picked up by ABC. im almost positive

3)weekenders was an ABC kids show. we're talking disney channel with 65 episodes. (or less)

[BigKPFan76]

Another big question is this, and think about this carefully:

Why in the world would Disney kill it's number 1 show? In my opinion, thats tan-amount to suicide! And if they did, I can tell you it would be one mistake Disney wont be able to recover from, lots of angry fans to join those of past cancelled shows.

[tucsoncoyote]

1. It's done because it's cheaper to produce more new shows? How can it be expensive to renew current shows than starting a new show?

2. Disney shows have been extended before, so isn't there a chance of Kim Possible following them?

3. How Weekenders get an extentsion considering that Disney didn't air the show in a good time slot?
Tucsoncoyote here:coyote:

very good questions.. so let's get to them...:D

The answer for question 1 is actually a rather sticky one.. but it's indeeed all money driven... and in fact Eisner would rather (on Disney Channel) Crank out a new show every 12 months rather then renew an old show..(either live action or animated)

Remember Lizzie McGuire and why that show was terminated after 65 Episodes? It's because Hillary asked for just a little increase in her pay, and Eisner showed Miss Duff the door. and this was right after the fact that Hillary had finished up The Lizzie McGuire Movie..) So was Hillary Duff Greedy? No not really. all she wanted was a Little Increase..

So in a sense Eisner is trying to bring in fresh talent here..(he Replaced Hillary Duff with Raven Symone aka Raven, in her New show.. That's so Raven...) :(

But in terms of Animation the 65 Episode rule isn't hard and fast... but still you have a little hidden clause by Eisner known as the "3 Season /Year" Rule... which means that whether or not a show has done 65 shows or not, is usually terminated after 3 Seasons (years) by Eisner and is replaced by a new one.. The logic here is of course partially due to the show becoming stale..(but there's where Question 2 comes in..)

Now Question 2 States that if other shows have had extended seasons why not Kim Possible? Well it's a Rather interesting point here.. After all some shows (like Recess and The Weekenders have been extended (but the Majority of shows that were produced, most notably the "Series" shows (such as Aladdin, Hercules, and Tarzan, not to Mention Buzz Lighyear of Star Command) usually don't go beyond 65... why you may ask.. it's because of the fact that Eisner's already taken these ideas and has milked them for all they are worth..(for example, the Tarzan Series (The Legend of Tarzan) never went beyond 41 episodes.. and less then 2 seasons.. and a lot of people ask why it didn't run the 65 Episode run.. the answer was simple.. Eisner was gearing up for "other Cash cows" that he was willing to milk.. and of course some of them fall on Disney channel (one of them being of course Kim Possible..

However Not all shows went to just 65 episodes.. Take Aladdin for example it went on for 86 episodes and 3 seasons due to the fact that Eisner also manipulated the 3 season rule for that particular case..(even violating the 22 episodes per season clause..) the reason behind this was so that he could Milk Aladdin for all it was worth.. then when was all said and done just throw it away.. and put it out to pasture..

But then BigKPFan76.. brings up a rather interesting Counterpoint here.. if a show is so popular why Kill it? (Case in Point Kim Possible..) Kim is making money Hand over foot and yet we all know that when episode 65 rolls around that's it.. end of story.. (Eisner thinks sometimes that a show can only be milked so far then disposes of the idea.) but sometimes Eisner's Quirky "Insanity" as I like to call it, is dependent on the mood he's in.. and in fact Kim Possible could be extended just like Recess (which ran 132 episodes or 66 shows..(depending on how you look at it.) but the point is that Recess is the ONLY show that violates this 65/3 rule as I call it.. (65 Episodes or 3 Seasons...) and this of course brings us to Question 3....

Question 3 states about The Weekenders and how they got an extra season.. but here is where Eisner's "Double" Speak gets the better of him.." it seems.. if you do the research at TVtome.. and take a look at The Weekenders... the show does have a 4th season.. and in fact comes out to around 76 episodes.. so you wonder.. why haven't I seen some of these shows? The answer is simple.. Some of them haven't been produced. nor will they likely be ever produced...

why you may ask?

The answer is simple.. Eisner still is living in 1984... when The Walt Disney Company was is in Trouble.. he's thinking that any additional episodes being produced will cut into the company's budget.. and will thus destroy the company... yet, the company has been doing economically very well, for it's case, and yet Eisner is afraid to produce these extra shows..(probably due to budget constraints..) so he's probably Shelved The Weekenders, and they probably won't get finished, or they might and then be released as Direct to DVD Sales issues..

but then again we go back to BigKPFan76's Question.. why Kill off a #1 show? the answer is simple.. Money.. Money talks and not Ratings at Disney, and if a show starts to show a slump in sales, well then you can imagine Disney wanting to kill off a show real quick.. but then again.. has any show before Kim Possible had a merchandising franchise behind it? (Recess, The Weekenders, Gargoyles?) Nope..

so you see this is a very tough question to really answer.. and in fact, We can't really get answers unless we go and ask these questions to the only person who can answer them... and that is of course Michael Eisner.. the only problem is Eisner's a very shifty character..and sometimes tend to skirt the issue.. (Just read his January 5th Speech at the Smith Barney Conference. He Only Gives his show base a short blurb.. ) Eisner's main goal in life is to be a tyrannical CEO Making money hand over foot, and in fact, the only way he's going to get deposed from this is if we catch him in his own lies.. (and believe me if Eisner was Pinnochio... his Nose would be over 2 miles long!:eek:) so what we have to do is ask him the questions.. and see what he gives us as the answers..

After all there isn't a stone on Eisner's desk that says.. if it's 65 Retire it.. now is there?

[loyalheart]

guys, the 65 episode limit is ONLY for disney channel series. ABC kid shows don't count. i believe everything I said are very close to the right awnsers.

[tucsoncoyote]

guys, the 65 episode limit is ONLY for disney channel series. ABC kid shows don't count. i believe everything I said are very close to the right awnsers.
Tucsoncoyote here:coyote:

Good point KimPossibleFan, but there's a bit of Flaw to the logic..

This comes back to the question here with Kim Possible.. since Kim is seen both on Disney Channel and ABC Kids (which is ABC Broadcasting) would a show like this be considered just 65 episodes? or would it have a longer run since it's shown on ABC Kids (ABC Broadcasting..)

Also I have noted other inconsistencies in shows..

Let's start off with Teacher's Pet... 47 Episodes running from Sep 09, 2000 to May 10th, 2002 yet you have The Weekenders that have 70 episodes and running from February 26th 2000 to December 1 2001 and February 7th 2003 to April 3, 2003.. (Sounds Crazy doesn't it... ) but the truth be known what is the difference between these two shows?

The answer is simple.. The Weekenders was synidicated (on Disney's One Too) while Teacher's Pet wasn't...

Add to that more inconsistencies.. Like Recess and you can see where the whole logic of Disney Channel =65 Episodes.. falls apart.. (Cause Recess was originally on Syndication and later moved to Disney Channel.. )

But in the Kim Possible Question the show is being shown on both Disney and ABC Kids.. so where does this show lie? (it's a Disney Original and on Disney channel so according to it's rules... KP Dies at 65... yet.. it's on ABC Kids and has been pulling in moderate ratings (even though the ABC Kids schedulers have put it against some stiff Competition.. it still has been dooning good..) so then Kim should go past 65..

The problem is that we have here is the Syndication factor.. and that some shows that were syndicated needed a minimum of just 65 eps.. beyond that and anything else is just "Eye Candy.."

So the logic may be sound, but I think that the key factor is that the person you really need to ask is again.. Eisner.. after all his quirkiness has had shows extended and yet others Like Tarzan (which was syndicated ) end at just 41 eps...

That's the thing that is the problem here.. no real consistencies..(I mean do a Check at TV Tome for shows Running between say Ducktales and Kim Possible and you can see there are some discrepencies here.. Like shows Running an odd number of Episodes (Teacher's Pet at 47, Tarzan at 41..) or running partially through a season (like The Weekenders who have 6 episodes that have never been shown.. or 3 episodes on Recess that have never been shown.. or shows running less then 3 seasons.. (Buzz Lightyear and Teacher's pet.. or shows running more then 65.. Gargoyles, Recess, Aladdin, Ducktales.. )

When you get down to it.. the whole thing of 65 eps is really a fallacy. or as baby Herman from Who Framed Roger Rabbit said, "it stinks Like Yesterday's Diapers!" and he's not kidding. When you get down to it.. you have to come back to the initial person you have to ask.. Namely Michael Eisner.. After all he's the one sitting with the board pf Directors, making the decisions on what lives or dies at Disney.. Once he answers that question maybe we all can sleep better at night..

[loyalheart]

i remember, Christy saying Even Stevens WAS considered to be picked up by ABC. and it was on both ABC's saturday morning and disney channel. and then we all know lizzie was considered until cast problems came up.

but maybe KP cant be considered if the crew/cast set something in stone to end comepletly at 65. 100% even on other disney networks.

now with TP and Weekenders, alot of ABC kids (and one saturday morning) shows have been re-aired on disney channel a season after it ends on ABC. so basicly those shows go by whatever logic ABC has it seems.
the 65 episode limit & disney channel seems to be created in 1998 when the zoog crap started. so that explains why past disney CHANNEL shows aired longer or shorter than 65. except "in a heart beat" (a zoog show) only lasted 20 some episodes for ratings or whatever.

65 probably is a budget thing also like stated, but you have to consider that they can re-air it for another couple of years and make tons of ratings/money off the series

[tucsoncoyote]

i remember, Christy saying Even Stevens WAS considered to be picked up by ABC. and it was on both ABC's saturday morning and disney channel. and then we all know lizzie was considered until cast problems came up.

but maybe KP cant be considered if the crew/cast set something in stone to end comepletly at 65. 100% even on other disney networks.

now with TP and Weekenders, alot of ABC kids (and one saturday morning) shows have been re-aired on disney channel a season after it ends on ABC. so basicly those shows go by whatever logic ABC has it seems.
the 65 episode limit & disney channel seems to be created in 1998 when the zoog crap started. so that explains why past disney CHANNEL shows aired longer or shorter than 65. except "in a heart beat" (a zoog show) only lasted 20 some episodes for ratings or whatever.

65 probably is a budget thing also like stated, but you have to consider that they can re-air it for another couple of years and make tons of ratings/money off the series
Tucsoncoyote here :coyote:

You're again right KimPossibleFan, but then I found Disney's Ultimate bomb... and this was probably why there are now shows being released on a pattern that is even more inconsistent..

Remember a Show Called The Mighty Ducks? If not, Let me refresh some folks Memories..

This show was about 6 Hockey Playing Ducks that came from a Planet Called Puckworld and they landed at the Pond (in Anaheim California not too far from Disneyland) .. they were supposed to save the world from some evil dinosaurs bent on taking over the galaxy...

now i did some real heavy research and i found one interesting thing..

1. Mighty Ducks was syndicated.. and it was on the One Too Block Initally
2. The show however was a MAJOR bomb... because..
3. The show ran from September 1996 to January 1997...and only ran a measley 18 episodes..

That's a Key thing that perhaps has got some of these shows in an Uproar.. now as far as I know there was no disputes with cast and Crew, and in fact this show got Canned for one reason.. Low ratings...

In short this was Eisner's Mistake.. and it was a Big one.. Perhaps bigger then an Magnitude 8 on the San Andreas Fault..

What was Eisner drinking the day that he gave the Green light on this show? we'll never know.. but the idea was perhaps the most "Quacked Up Idea" ever devised...

And I guess this is where your comment comes back.. Maybe Eisner's seeing something along the lines of 'I don't want another Mighty Ducks" in my midst.. so he's saying to the folks.. get the job done in 65 eps.. or 3 seasons or years.. but again we're going to have to ask Eisner why he even ran a show like The Mighty Ducks in a Syndicated series.. and then why there is such set policies in place..(if there are any..)

Cause perhaps this is the key thing.. how could a show run from September of 1996 to January 1997 and get canned after just 18 shows? It's perhaps the fact that maybe the animators were the problem here..(or maybe the writers..(wasn't there talks about a Writer Guild's Strike at that time?)

But the thing is now we know that the 65 ep thing might apply to Disney Channel, but still they shouldn't kill a show just because it's good..after all if we look at Kim Possible, She has a Fan base, she has Merchandising, and she's doing quite well for her time slot.. don't you think that Kim could be making up for The Mighty Ducks?

After all when you think about it.. what exactly was Michael thinking when he Hatched that idea?.. probably about Having Crow..and eating it too..