Superman Adventures - Dying Slowly

[James Harvey]

Why oh why is Neil Vokes still doing art for this book? He'll be doing the art for yet ANOTHER issue next month and the month after! No wonder why this book gets read by less than 8000 people a month! DC is just brutally killing it! Wnhhy not let Cameron Stewart or Aluir Almancio do some more issues? At least Aluir is doing the final issue. With the book ending in Febaury with issue #66 (the rumored date), why do the last few issues have to be Vokes?

Grrr....

[Trent Lane]

Maybe everybody else is busy with other opportunities? I don't know, Vokes art isn't great but I'll live with it. Like I said earlier, I'd kill just to have the chance to do what he does, regardless of what people think...

[TerryMcGuiness]

DC has proven time and again that they simply do not give a damn about the animated series books.

That was evident when they brought Joey "kiss of death" Calveri on as editor of Superman Adventures. I think just about every book he's ever been on has been canceled.

Thus, contuining on in his mission of death, he's doomed the Superman Adventures title to nothing but mad magican stories for nearly the entire rest of the run.

I still think that DC is jealous. Damned jealous of the fact that this little tv cartoon did 10 times a better job of regenerating the DC characters for a modern audience than their oh-so-hip Post Crisis relaunch.

Putting care and talent into the books would be like admiting defeat.

[DisneyBoy]

I know I post the most bitter posts concerning my beloved Batman: Gotham Adventures, but I still love it and Superman Adventures. I am going to cry the day I read the last issue of B: GA because it will truely be the end of an era, and what an amazing era it has been for all of us. I know I would have been greatly turned off by Batman by now if not for The Batman Adventures, which I had been reading years before I ever saw an episode of the animated series. Issue #2 came out just after I had given up on the excessively violent, gruesome and long winded Knightfall storyline and I have been hooked ever since.

Even so, it really kills me to see what B: GA has become. Levin's art really looks so little like the Timm or Templeton style (they are even in my book) and Petersons stories are written without care or patience. It really feels like no one cares about everything that's been acomplished. Remember Freeze's origin? Or the debut of Harley Quinn? It feels like DC has just kept TBA around in order to steal it's ideas and then leave it in less-than qualified hands. As for Supes, I have honestly come to prefer it's art and stories to the child-oriented GA. Though Neil Vokes art is pretty gross and Aluir's new "sketchy" look falls a little short of the style in which he drew his first few issues, and the fact that the stories have been a tad too "magical", this series has done so many amazing things: Supergirl for one (All of her appearances have been well thought out and well drawn)! Plus the fact that every two parter has been wonderful ( I haven't yet read the end of "Kryptonite No More", but all the others were...WOW!), and the fact that they've included Batman's world as well as theirs (#25-that's the stuff that should be in B: GA). I will really miss this series when it is gone and will treasure the stories they gave us. Just please let Lois and Clark/Superman kiss in the final issue! They came so close in #49!

I'm going to stick around to the bitter end, but I pray that Gotham Adventures rises out of the ashes of it's past (Gosh- how many issues have Levins and Peterson been on-too many!) 35-something issues and that Superman Adventures ends with an issue that does it justice.

[Calhoun07]

As much as I like the animated comics and the series, I have to say that I cannot support poor quality. I do hope these animated comics see the light of day again, and Batman Beyond to, with editors, writers and artists who CARE (I get the feeling there are members of these boards who could get together and do a better job than DC did) but I think the books just need some time off. Let JL shine for now, and bring the other animated books back when the bad taste they are leaving now is gone from our mouths.

[DisneyBoy]

I think we all fear that (knock on wood) once these titles leave the shelves....it's over:(

[Calhoun07]

It will never be officially over. These cartoons and characters from the animated universe comprise about ten years of TV and comics. That just won't vanish quietly into the night! I am confident they will resurface some where down the road.

[James Harvey]

It just pains me to see a once great book like Superman Adventures, a few months from cancellation, having these really bad stories about magicians and the like. Issue #41 was definatly the highlight of the series, where they had 22 great stories in 22 pages. A truly innovative and great all around issue. With issue #66 approaching soon, it'll be sad to see this series fall as well.

[Calhoun07]

True. The earlier issues were some of the best Superman stories in comics. I agree that the direction the book has taken is sad. I doubt they would ever collect the latest batches of stories in a trade paper back and put it out with any sense of pride.

[James Harvey]

I don't think it would be possible to collect the final issues in TPB. I heard DC was interested in collecting issues #7-13 in a tpb but those plans were soon abandoned. Shame, too.

[Calhoun07]

Even if it was possible, who would buy it?

[James Harvey]

I would. It collects the 2nd half of the Scott McCloud/Rick Burchett run. I think alot of people would buy it.

[Calhoun07]

I meant collections of the Vokes run.

[James Harvey]

I hope they neevr release a collection of those Vokes issues. Not only are they poorly drawn, they tend to be the worst scripts as well!

[Calhoun07]

I doubt they would if they won't release issues 7-12.

[b3studios]

Well, okay, all of this bad mouthing of Neil Vokes has gotten to me a bit.
I am a big fan of Neil's work, and have since gotten to know him personally.
His art is spectacular, and shows a technical ability hardly seen by todays creators.
Now, having said that, his art my not fit in well with the traditional animated or "Timm" style, on the Superman adventures book, *but* that doesn't mean he is not a great penciler.
If you have never seen any of his other work, i suggest you take a look and check it out.

b3
(whose happy to talk Neil anytime).....

[b3studios]

for a look into vokes work check out: http://www.geocities.com/neilvokes
and in particular:
http://www.geocities.com/neilvokes/wtc-benefit.jpg

b3

(BTW, his batman is incredible. i would have much better liked to have seen him on Gotham Adventures than Supes, but.....)

[James Harvey]

I'm sure he's a great artist. By the look of stuff on that Vokes website, his stuff ain't half bad. He just doesn't belong on Superman Adventures. His style just doesn't fit there.

[Calhoun07]

I am not saying he is a bad artist overall, either, but I just don't like the style he brings to the animated universe Timm started. Not just with Superman Adventures, but the original art he sells on ebay from that same animated universe is just painful to look at. And that's not striking against him personally, just saying maybe he could find another book to work on where he could draw in a way that better suits his style.

[James Harvey]

Bingo! His art just doesn't work with the animated style. Many artists have said it is a difficult style to get ahold of, and I can believe that. Vokes did a good job on that MASK ADVENTURES comic Dark Horse did awhile ago.

Also, the inker or colorist for SUPERMAN ADVENTURES isn't that great either.

[Calhoun07]

Yeah, they chose a pretty crappy team for Superman Adventures final days over all.

What else has Vokes done?

[b3studios]

i have spoken to Neil before about this very subject (his art not fitting the *Timm* animated style).
Neil is a wonderfull and humble guy. he keeps every bad review that his art gets. I once asked him why, and he said because he thought that over-all it made his work better.
His art on superman doesn't fit in well with the Timm design of the character, *BUT* i think his supes is great. It has a more organic and personable feel to it than the static Timm design. (taking nothing away from the Timm design, it's amazing).
Neils take on superman feels more like Superman to me.
It's a lighter aproach to the character.
Take a look at some of the Batman stuff on his site:
http://www.geocities.com/neilvokes
it's pretty darn good. as for him not being able to do the animated style books, or why doesn't he go to another book? well, most editors are too narrow minded to put someone they deem has a "cartoony" art style on anything other than a "cartoon" book.
his animated style stuff is great. i don't know if any of you are familar with the characters of Quantum and Woody by Acclaim Comics, but Neil did a commission of them, and it's one of the best representations of them, ever.
http://www.geocities.com/neilvokes/vokesqw.jpg
That made me want to see an animated Q&W cartoon.
as for what else Neil has done, check out the "Past Works" section on his site:
http://www.geocities.com/neilvokes

peace,

b3

[b3studios]

and you have to admit that the WTC tribute piece is pretty powerfull....

b3

[Calhoun07]

I didn't find his WTC tribute there. Some of the artwork I clicked on wouldn't display in full size either, I'd get a WHOOPS! We can't Find that page warning.

But I do have to say his finished work looks damn fine. Too bad they saddled him with a crappy inker and colorist on Superman Adventures. Maybe if he had full creative freedom on the book, it could have looked alot better.

[b3studios]

The WTC tribute piece can be found here:
http://www.geocities.com/neilvokes/wtc-benefit.jpg
it's just a partial scan of a larger page.
Nice touching stuff if you ask me.

and i agree, the inker on SA made his pencils look much rougher and muddier than they usually are.

The site is still a work-in-progress, and there will be *much* more art listed on there when it's done.
All i'm saying is don't let his Superman Adventures work bias you from checking out any future stuff he may do.

Thanks,
b3

[James Harvey]

None of the links seem to work. I'd like to see some of his stuff sans Terry Austin's bad inking and the poor coloring. Anyone else wish Lee Looughridge did all the animated titles? I know Voke smuch be talented, but I can't see any of his non-animated works. None of the links work.

[James Harvey]

btw, b3studios, how did you find this site and boards? I'm curious to here your comments. And what does your neat sounding handle mean?

[Calhoun07]

I hope you get to see the pics, DG, cuz even his animated work looks good when it's all finished and inked properly. I'd post images up of the pics here, but unfortunately, the geocities page won't allow it!

[b3studios]

>>None of the links seem to work. I'd like to see some of his stuff sans Terry Austin's bad inking and the poor coloring. Anyone else wish Lee Looughridge did all the animated titles? I know Voke smuch be talented, but I can't see any of his non-animated works. None of the links work.<<

hmm... all of the links are working fine for me.
try cutting and pasting, or just go directly to:
http://www.geocities.com/neilvokes

if these don't work, email me at b3studios@aol.com and i will send you some samples of his work, as i have tons....

>>btw, b3studios, how did you find this site and boards? I'm curious to here your comments. And what does your neat sounding handle mean?<<

well, i've been coming to this site and the boards for a pretty long while now, i've just never taken the time to sign up and post before now. i couldn't really tell ou how i first found the site, as it's been a long time. :)
and as for b3studios? well, it's the name of my, um, studio.
I do some graphic design, some web design, some art, mostly inking, and some sculpting. with most of my time lately being devoted to the inkign and the sculpting. as for the "b3" part? it's a play off of my last name, as i am a 3rd. (guess that would make my pops b2?)

>>I hope you get to see the pics, DG, cuz even his animated work looks good when it's all finished and inked properly.<<

Calhound07, what did you like the most on the site? i will pass it along to neil, as he loves to hear opinions about his art (good and bad).
also, if any of you haven't read the iterviews and such on the site, i'd suggest that you do, Neil is a pretty funny guy, and has a vast knowledge on an array of subjects....

b3

[Calhoun07]

Originally posted by b3studios


Calhound07, what did you like the most on the site? i will pass it along to neil, as he loves to hear opinions about his art (good and bad).
also, if any of you haven't read the iterviews and such on the site, i'd suggest that you do, Neil is a pretty funny guy, and has a vast knowledge on an array of subjects....

b3

I liked his finished work the most. All of it. I am not saying his pencils alone are bad...I like them too. It kinda reminds me of early Joe Staton, which is a compliment. But I know Staton isn't everybody's favorite art style.

And I am sorry his art is treated so poorly in Superman Adventures. As an artist myself, I know how frustrating it is to see somebody else ruin a piece I've spent alot of time and effort on.