The problem with KWB and Poke...

[Vin]

After receiving the fall schedule from KWB, I'm pretty annoyed. Of course, there's not much that interests me, but the fact that KWB eliminated the morning timeslot and kept two "Pokemon" half hours astounds me. Then, in an addition, they delay the premeire of "Static Shock!" for another "Pokemon" episode. Now, I'm not a fan of "Static Shock!" at all, but KWB would have been sart to limit their lineup to just one "Pokemon" show on the Saturdays and air it once every weekday. If "Pokemon" aired only 6 times a week, KWB would already be much better. I'm not a fan of "Pokemon" as you guys can see, but I was actually before it hit Kids' WB! three years ago.

When it first began airing on KWB, it was fine, but soon, they're were marathons, double airings on weekends, etc. Just way too much of it. I was happy at first that it was bringing in record ratings because I thought we might get some great new shows due to the fact that it brought KWB alot of money. I was wrong. Very, very wrong.

My other problem with "Pokemon" is that it seems to be the same story over and over. I have to be honest, I haven't watched it on a regular basis, but when I catch an episode, it seems the same thing as they were doing before and I turn it off. The difference between say, "Pokemon" and "Digimon" is that "Digimon" gets new main characters, villians, etc. i.e., "Digimon Tamers" aka "Digimon" season 3, and it also helps that the animation is better than "Pokemon." I'm not a huge fan of "Digimon" either, but it seems alot more interesting than "Pokemon." Basically, if it hasn't been done already in Japan, I think they should end Ash's journey and bring in a fresh new bunch of characters to keep the show fresh. Even though the show's title changes, like "Pokemon: The Johto Journeys," it seems like the same story. I could honestly see why children might go onto something new because "Pokemon" may just not interest them anymore.

What do you guys think? Personally, I'd like it if KWB just revamped it's whole schedule and targeted children and adults but that isn't happening and that's ok with me. At least I have Cartoon Network!

[BourgeoisBuffoon]

YES to all of it!

Pokemon was alright at first,as you said, but it is aired WAY too much now. We had (maybe still, do not watch KWB anymore) 20 eppys a week!
New eppys? Posh. Nearly EVERY eppy is a rerun.

And yes, it pushes out the other shows. It seemed every other show had Pokemon next to it. Ugh. Besides that, I think 'Mon stole ratings from most shows aired next to it...

We needed char development, instead we get more Pikachu. Uhg! They proved they could take chances at first by showing James's, Meowths's, and Brocks's back stories, and having them make some big decisions, but they are past that age now. All they do is just battle, battle, battle. And usually it's just with Ash baaaarrellly holding on, then a miracle happen.

I wonder what will happen to KWB when Jokemon is no longer popular. The games are good; the show is not. I wanted to see the Gold/Silver hero take on Jhoto....but more of the same. The GAMES gave more plot development tha the show!

[The Mad Hatter]

I'm none too fond of Pokemon myself, but I've got to say, scheduling ANY show that often is a bad thing. If they aired, say, Batman Beyond or Pinky and the Brain that often I'd soon get sick of them, too. Whatever happened to variety?

[Sveven Dvorking]

Although I do like the show, I think they air it way too much. They need two Saturday time slots because some weeks have two new episodes. I have watched only one weekday rerun in the last year, and that was because I missed it when it was new.

To simply put it, they should air the show twice a week, both times on Saturday, and keep airing new episodes. If I watched the excessive reruns, I'd be sick of it too!

If a different character replaced Ash, I would stop watching.

[Hollywood53]

If Static Shock and Zeta aired now, they would run out of new episodes. They are saving Static to bring in ratings in 2002, just like how MiB was used as a spring/summer original. They should air new Jackie Chan only on Saturday, that way they could have new episodes just about every week.

The episodes of Pokemon have changed
Indigo/Orange episodes only air at 3:30
Johto episodes will air at 4:00

Pokemon needs extra time slots because it has the most episodes of any KWB show. Even Cardcaptors at one point was given two Saturday timeslots.

[Hollywood53]

if they air two or more new Pokemon episodes each week, they will run out of episodes quickly.

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

It *is* the same story over and over...sort of. Anyone remember Transformers? How many times can Megatron fail? It isn't where the story went, but what they did with the characters along the way. There are episodes that sometimes focus on a single character--that's "development."

Now, as for characters changing, well, they don't do that here. Come to think of it, a lot of shows don't really "change" their characters.

It is repetitive...but it's not a new thing. It's a throwback to the older cartoons like...uh, Road Runner and Wile E. Coyote, expanded to 20 minutes.

I believe that Digimon has more outward appeal, but it IS still a toy show, and I am often left MORE disappointed with Digimon because all the character build up is ALWAYS given the short shrift to sell new Digimon. It tries to be a "meaningful" drama when it can't be; the concept dooms it from the start. I sympathize with the writers who want to try to do something with the show, but they fight a losing battle--it is a toy show that must meet marketing requirements. With Pokemon, I don't have as much expectations because it KNOWS the whole monster concept is actually stupid. Instead, it concentrates on humour and parodies. You'd be surprised how many parodies there are in Pokemon. Of course, people don't look for them, but they are there. And they fly because the show doesn't take itself too seriously.

That's not to say you can't do great things with toy-driven shows (A few of the Gundam shows, for instance), but the writers have to know what kind of concept they are dealing with. Gundam might as well be a war show with mecha standing in for tanks, planes and such.

(Though some of the newer Gundam shows integrate the robots into the war setting more seamlessly. The original Mobile Suit Gundam, groundbreaking as it was, still has some elements that scream "This Gundam is cool! Get this toy! That's why we get the same rockin' music whenever Amuro hops into it...")

Pokemon and Digimon are about pet monsters--and the smarter the monsters, the less focus on human drama. If the Gundams could talk (or were alive), I wouldn't take the drama in Gundam as seriously. "Hello, I am a Gundam, but you may call me K.I.T.T..."

[Psycho Fox]

Pokémon is being aired to much on KWB. I say 6 maybe 7 times a week would be fine and KWB should not cannibalize its other shows just for the sake of Pokémon.

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

On the other hand, I don't watch many of the shows on KWB religiously, and I don't particularly have one that I TRULY enjoy, so I could care less whatever show they decide to favor and promote the heck out of.

[Hollywood53]

What about Monster Rancher? That show is like both Pokemon and Digimon, has both adventures and tournaments.

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Monster Rancher ended months ago on Fox Family. Not cancelled, just finished. Fox Kids doesn't air it anymore, so I consider it yesterday's news.

[BourgeoisBuffoon]

Monster Rancher, to me, was a half-witted attempt to bring attention to the computer game AND to cash off of the monster anime franchise...and the tournament thing I KNOW was a ripoff...
....6 times a week should be all that Pokemon airs; then I would say they are taking a big step to making it a more respectable show. Then all we need is a bit o' char development and I might start watching the show again...

[Anthonynotes]

Well, I'm not a Poke-fan either, and a lot about the show strikes me mostly as an excuse to sell toys (a la He-Man 15-17 years ago)...though still, I don't see the need to play a guaranteed ratings-grabber 2-3 times a day *every* day of the week.

As for me, KWB's new morning-less lineup starts tomorrow, and I'll be watching the Bullwinkle reruns that they're still running at 6:30 AM. Which also seems to be one of the few things left to watch on my WB affiliate in the immediate future...

-B.

[Psycho Fox]

Originally posted by BourgeoisBuffoon
Monster Rancher, to me, was a half-witted attempt to bring attention to the computer game AND to cash off of the monster anime franchise...and the tournament thing I KNOW was a ripoff...I like Monster Rancher more then Pokémon and Digimon.

[Hollywood53]

There are still 25 episodes left of Monster Rancher left, Genki returns in season 3. Fox Family and YTV should be airing these soon, the other countries (i.e. Germany) have already seen this.

[Printo]

We are at war. Little kids make the choices, because the majority of them watch cartoons. This board is the older audience, since older there are less of us to begin with, plus not a lot of our age group are big cartoon fans. If pokemon sould be on the air it should be 6-7 times. This week is a weird week. KWB bought the 5 pm slot & filled that with pokemon, BB & sailor moon. 3 poke, 1 bb, 1 sm. 13 eps, so far, now on saturaday, there are 5 more. 18 pokemon eps in one week. WAY TOO MUCH.
Every1 says im speaking to strong towards Japans cartoon invasion. I speak too weak of it. Its not just the amount of shows but the amount they show it. Sailor Moon, Pokemon, Digimon, DBZ, Yu-Gi-Oh!. They dropped histeria, batman beyond & MIB, those were the only reason for some people to watch KWB. Now western shows about the far east r fine, Jackie Chan & Samuri Jack. Turn off your TV when these shows are on! Turn all your tvs on when a good show is on. Its sad to see MIB, BB & H! go. at least they could replace them with something just as good, not more pokemon.

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Are you still doing your Winston Churchill impression, Printo? Geez.

[BourgeoisBuffoon]

WHOA! Calm down, Printo. I don't like how SOME animes are being crammed into the limelight either, but Jojo really made a good point on the anime invasion on another topic. It's Pokemon here primarily we're here to vent about...
....if I could see it, I'm willing to give DBZ a chance, Digimon I've yet to see, though what I hear on the char development vs. toy marketing is not good for me, and, well, I don't care for Sailor Moon either, but at least that should be temporary...

Actually, I dunno if we are at WAR. Makes it sound nastier than it really is. In one of my few defenses of Pokemon (do not expect anymore soon ;) ...), it certainly takes many western elements...some days to a point where it could be a anime about western stuff. Yet Western shows about the East are fine? I dunno about that reasoning...

[Printo]

Originally posted by Leaping Larry Jojo
Are you still doing your Winston Churchill impression, Printo? Geez.

I will continue to do it until Pokemon is cut down a lot! That whole region of the world hates America, We nuked this, we stopped communism here, blah blah blah. Japan and China are not big friends of ours(this is more about Japan). Leap Larry Jojo, did they get to you. I noticed you changed you avatar, they have gotten to you, poor Jojo...Don't become weak-minded resist the mind washign of Pokemon. Whats even worse is that the supposed Pokemon killer in Japan is another anime :( Yu-Gi-Oh!
You all turning into traitorous Poke-maniacs.......

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Uh...yes...that's it...it's a communist conspiracy to brainwash me to the other side a la THE MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE...


Since I don't know if you are actually serious or not....ahhh...oookay...I think I know what we're dealing with here. I will...slowly yield and step away...

[BourgeoisBuffoon]

Well, Printo, if some nation came in and defeated us in a war, they would not be big friends of ours either. Look at Vietnam.
Though I should think you should not comment about nuclear missles lightly; they killed 70,000 people at Hiroshima alone and we much more powerful ones today. And we should go fighting over a couple of TV shows? Sorry, Printo...can't see the reasoning.

And I am a not a Poke-maniac.

[Printo]

Originally posted by BourgeoisBuffoon
Yet Western shows about the East are fine? I dunno about that reasoning...

They've gotten you Bourgeois. They are okay. They dont have those rediculous facial expressions with the lines under their eyes. They arent about collecting & owning little beasts. Pokemon indirectly promotes animal abuse & slavery. Capture a wild animal in a ball & keep it there for large periods of time(slavery), then us the to battle(cock fighting). I only really mind Digi & Poke MON. DBZ has a better storyline that doesnt repeat itself, & it doesnt have an insane amount of air time.

[Psycho Fox]

Originally posted by Printo
I will continue to do it until Pokemon is cut down a lot! That whole region of the world hates America, We nuked this, we stopped communism here, blah blah blah. Japan and China are not big friends of ours(this is more about Japan). Japan is not the enemy neither is Pokémon. The hype is.

[Printo]

Originally posted by BourgeoisBuffoon
Well, Printo, if some nation came in and defeated us in a war, they would not be big friends of ours either. Look at Vietnam.
Though I should think you should not comment about nuclear missles lightly; they killed 70,000 people at Hiroshima alone and we much more powerful ones today. And we should go fighting over a couple of TV shows? Sorry, Printo...can't see the reasoning.

And I am a not a Poke-maniac.

We are friends with Germany, we defeated them, Britain, we defeated them. We had no choice other than to bomb Japan. The loss of life would have been much greater if the bomb wasnt developed.

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Originally posted by BourgeoisBuffoon
Well, Printo, if some nation came in and defeated us in a war, they would not be big friends of ours either. Look at Vietnam.
Though I should think you should not comment about nuclear missles lightly; they killed 70,000 people at Hiroshima alone and we much more powerful ones today. And we should go fighting over a couple of TV shows? Sorry, Printo...can't see the reasoning.

And I am a not a Poke-maniac.

Ehhh...bringing politics into simple discussions on the cartoon industry--doesn't float my boat, you know? They always erupt into lengthy discussions of national superiority and whatnot.

Here's what I don't get:

Printo's early posts were pretty neutral about Pokemon, DBZ and all that. Then a few days ago, it becomes political. All right, which one of you here has been feeding patriotic signals down the forum, hmmm? :rolleyes:

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Originally posted by Printo


We are friends with Germany, we defeated them, Britain, we defeated them. We had no choice other than to bomb Japan. The loss of life would have been much greater if the bomb wasnt developed.

That does it. I'm outta this here thread. :rolleyes:

[Printo]

Originally posted by Psycho Fox
Japan is not the enemy neither is Pokémon. The hype is.

Exactly. Try and end the hype at home. If it becomes lame in USA it will stay in Japan. The only reasonable explanation is to brain wash little kids to watch what we say. :D

[BourgeoisBuffoon]

Hey, I was only using political things as examples. But still, sorry for bringing politics into my part of the discussion.

I agree with Psycho Fox, the hype is what the problem is; it relates into all the air time and same plots used over and over.

And what is wrong with the way animes are drawn, Printo? I like the style. Very useful for showing emotions.

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Hey, Printo. Guess what? I'm Chinese.

Look out, Printo!! I've invaded your country!!!! Better tell Bush to hurry up with that Missile Defense program...wait! That doesn't stop terrorist attacks!

Graggh!!!

[Anthonynotes]

Originally posted by Leaping Larry Jojo
Hey, Printo. Guess what? I'm Chinese.

Look out, Printo!! I've invaded your country!!!! Better tell Bush to hurry up with that Missile Defense program...wait! That doesn't stop terrorist attacks!

Graggh!!!

If anyone's waiting for *me* to make commentary on this turned-political thread, I'm not going to bother....it sounds, IMO, way too ludicrous & silly (the "invasion of the East by Pokemon" stuff turned into some sort of anti-communist hysteria thingamajig)....plus, it's Labor Day, and none of the *other* websites I like going to are posting anything new today either ;-)

Agree with Jojo's points, though...

-B.

[Vin]

Woah, woah, what the heck is going on here? I was trying to make a simple thread on "Pokemon" and what should be done to make it better and then it becomes something political. Yeesh...

[Sveven Dvorking]

The people of "Goon Zone Forums" (spelling intentional) may hate Pokemon, but at least there were enough good people to keep it going for three years. I don't mind the hype, I simply don't watch weekday reruns. I still collect the cards and watch new episodes. As for the other Kids WB shows that were removed, I never liked them anyway. If I hear one more bashing of Pokemon, I'll be furious. The way the "Goon Zone" members think, I might here one million more bad statements. Maybe I should stop viewing this thread.

[Vin]

Originally posted by Sveven Dvorking
The people of "Goon Zone Forums" (spelling intentional) may hate Pokemon, but at least there were enough good people to keep it going for three years. I don't mind the hype, I simply don't watch weekday reruns. I still collect the cards and watch new episodes. As for the other Kids WB shows that were removed, I never liked them anyway. If I hear one more bashing of Pokemon, I'll be furious. The way the "Goon Zone" members think, I might here one million more bad statements. Maybe I should stop viewing this thread.

"Goon Zone?"

[Vin]

Originally posted by Sveven Dvorking
The people of "Goon Zone Forums" (spelling intentional) may hate Pokemon, but at least there were enough good people to keep it going for three years. I don't mind the hype, I simply don't watch weekday reruns. I still collect the cards and watch new episodes. As for the other Kids WB shows that were removed, I never liked them anyway. If I hear one more bashing of Pokemon, I'll be furious. The way the "Goon Zone" members think, I might here one million more bad statements. Maybe I should stop viewing this thread.

And BTW, I never sad I hated "Pokemon," I just don't like the fact that it is overplayed. Because it's been overplayed alot, I've lost alot of interest in it and no-longer watch. Too much of some of my favorite shows like "Batman Beyond," "The New Batman/Supeman Adventures" etc. would make me end up not wanting to watch them. And I also take offense to your "Goon Zone" remark. That wasn't nice, nor funny.

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Pokemon bashing I don't mind, though it's really old now. I DO mind it when politics are brought into it, and East vs West mentalities.