B:TAS "Robin's Reckoning, Parts 1 & 2" Talkback (Spoilers)

[Bird Boy]

Discuss this classic two-part Batman: The Animated Series episode!


http://worldsfinestonline.com/WF/batman/btas/episodes/robinsreckoningp1/00.jpg (http://worldsfinestonline.com/WF/batman/btas/)
Episode #032 - Robin's Reckoning: Part 1
Original Airdate - February 7th, 1993.
When Batman and Robin bust up an extortion, Batman learns the name of the gang leader. To Robin's surprise, he refuses to let Robin continue the investigating with him, preferring to work alone instead. When Robin discovers the truth, he finds that the case is connected with Tony Zucco, a gangster who was responsible for the death of Robin's parents.

Episode #037 - Robin's Reckoning: Part 2
Original Airdate - February 14th, 1993.
Robin heads off in hot pursuit of Tony Zucco, despite Batman's forbidding him to do it. Some tricky detective work takes him to the crook's hideout at the old amusement pier where Zucco has accidentally trapped Batman.

Comments?

[Caped Crusader]

I always thought this was an excellent episode, and I look forward to watching it again.

[The Penguin]

"It's not right Alfred, he can't take Zucco away from me! I won't let him!" - Robin, Robin's Reckoning, Part 1

If I could describe this episode in three words it would be "excellent, excellent, excellent." You really can't go wrong with this one, you get to see a lot of Dick's past and how he came to live with Bruce and Alfred. This episode also does a lot for the Batman-Robin relationship which we really haven't seen too much of at this point in the series' run.

Dick Grayson has always kept the thought of Tony Zucco in the back of his mind. Unlike Bruce, he knows the identity of the man responsible for the death of his parents and hopes to one day gain revenge on the scum. Imagine his surprise when he finds he doesn't have to search for Zucco—Zucco has come back to him! But he also finds that his friend and partner already knew this and now he has to deal with the reemerging pain of his parents death as well as what he views as a betrayal by the one he trusts the most...

Years ago, Bruce Wayne made it his personal mission to hunt down Tony Zucco, to gain revenge for the sad little boy that was now staying at his house. Now, that sad little boy has become a man, but Batman still sees the fragile boy crying on his shoulder and continues on with his lonely one-man vendetta.


(Sadly I won't be around (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=45082) when Part 2 airs :( but I'll see it, and will no doubt have meaningful quote when I get back! ;) )

[Red]

This definatly needs 5 stars! Great Story!

A Quote From Batman

You don't want to see me grumpy, do you?

NO! Especially How grumpy he was this Episode. :o

[KingKoopa]

There are many episodes of this series I haven't seen yet, and this is one of them. This episode was great on all counts, five stars easily. From a dramatic flashback to Robin wanting revenge, and willing to split up with Batman to do it. I can't find anything negative about this episode, but that goes for plenty of them. I can't wait for part 2!

[Patrick Bateman]

5 stars. Easily one of the top episodes of all time. Everything was done so perfectly. I especially liked the attention to detail in the flashbacks, like Bruce having a different hairstyle, Gordon having hair color, and best of all, the old-school Bat-suit. It's a shame that this wasn't in that top 10 of all time Cartoon Network did a couple of months ago. :(

[BlackCat]

Originally posted by KingKoopa
There are many episodes of this series I haven't seen yet, and this is one of them. This episode was great on all counts, five stars easily. From a dramatic flashback to Robin wanting revenge, and willing to split up with Batman to do it. I can't find anything negative about this episode, but that goes for plenty of them. I can't wait for part 2!

Too bad you will have to wait two weeks to see it. I didn't watch the showing today, but already seen it before. A good episode.

[Nightwing]

Oh my god this takes me back. Five stars easy, and one of my absolute favorite of the BTAS genre, especially being a Dick Grayson fan. Both episodes find themselves at five stars easy, although the first part was better, IMO.

The animation and then the story/writting were the first things you notice. They're just excellent. And what I love the most about all of it, is showing Bruce's better days with Dick. They really truly shared something, because of having been forced to live with that same pain.

[susan123]

This episode really is a character study of Bruce and Dick. Not only you see Bruce as a friend but then he turns into a protective father figure trying to shield Dick from Zucco. Dick also changes as not understanding Bruce's sudden 180 degree turn--one moment they're joking and fighting the bad guys together, the next Batman is laying down the law. It's an interesting dynamic to Batman and Robin's relationship. Easy to see why this episode won the Emmy. It was well deserved.

[JTurner954]

4.25 stars (I'm split between giving it 4 and 4 1/2 stars.).

Ah, what a treat. First, Birds of Prey wins the Delaney poll. Then. Robin wins the Delaney poll. And now, they air a Robin episode. Was this a great two weeks for Batman fans or what (too bad we have to wait two weeks for Part 2 :mad: )??

Anyway, episodes like this are why I like B:TAS a lot more than S:TAS. Instead of having the entire episode an origin story (Not a big fan of origin stories), this one does it in selected flashbacks. Plus, Robin is a favorite character of mine so it makes the episode even better. Great story, great development of characters (don't forget Bullock in the flashback, Batman Year One), and great animation makes this episode ...... great. Here's yet another reason why more Batman DVD's need to be released .

Aw, what the hay. I'm voting 4 1/2 stars.

[TheScarecrow]

This episode ruled pure and simple. Robin/Dick Grayson's origin is explored as is his relationship with Batman/Bruce Wayne, and Biff from Back To The Future was perfect as Tony Zucco. The Grayson parents death scene was very effective and wasn't turned into an excuse to have an action scene like in Batman Forever. No way to go wrong with this episode.

[JTurner954]

To make the week even better, the 60's Batman (which needs to come to DVD) is coming on TV Land right now which means more Robin. :)

[Zoddman]

*****

It doesn't get much better than this. Spectrum studios animation, the dialogue, Batman staying in character the entire episode, (Something, unfortunately, I can't say for some episodes.) A masterpiece. One of the best episodes this series has to offer.

[Brainiac]

I hadn't seen this episode for awhile, and seeing it again was great. Fantastic story, great animation, and a look into Dick's past as well as his relationship with Bruce. I found the tone to be very dark and moody, especially through the use of shading. The actual scene in which Dick's parents die was very well done, and I thought it was very stylized and more effective not to show them fall, but rather, show the shadow of the cut rope. Also, the fade into the police car siren almost gave a haunting image of the blood shed by the two deceased. The scene at the end between Bruce and Dick was wonderful, and some of the dialogue was very moving. A well-deserved 5 stars! And as Penguin said above..."Excellent, excellent, excellent."

-Brainiac

[Batman's Biggest Fan]

One word:


Excellent

[MILatino]

Originally posted by Caped Crusader
Here's the official talkback thread for "Robin's Reckoning, Part 1."
Excellent origin episode. The drama and action worked very well together. The dialog was not kiddie cartoon at all. I especially like Robin's comment at the end of this ep about maybe not listening to Bruce ever again. Loren Lester did a great job. Kudos!

[John6777]

This is one of my favorite Episodes of the Series ,hey has anyone noticed Batman's First Costume looks exactly like the one he uses in Justice League i guess they took the same design with slight differences.

[DKstormyknight]

Great episode!!!!!!!! The only thing I didn't like was that I couldn't see part 2 right then. :p

[Caped Crusader]

Like I said earlier, this was an excellent episode. It's easily one of my all-time favorites. This is one of those times when I wish something higher than 5 stars were an option.

It was great to see some of Dick’s past, and to see deeper into the Batman and Robin relationship.

I thought the animation in this episode was some of the best in the series. The movement was fluid and the shadows were very well done.

Brainiac, I concur, the way they did Dick's parents' death was a lot more effective than actually seeing them fall.

And Batman Year One, I agree, it is a shame this episode wasn't in the top ten. I thought this episode was a lot better than some of the other ones they chose.

[The Penguin]

http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/batman/btas/episodes/robinsreckoningp2/00r.jpg

For those who are really wondering Robin's Reckoning, Part 1 aired Saturday, August 17th. It was production order #32 so it was separated from Part 2—#37. :)

[Bleu Unicorn]

Together with Part One, "Robin's Reckoning" is one of my favorite BTAS episode arc. I always hate commenting on two-part episodes as two different episodes (though by now with JL, I guess I should be used to it) as I tend to view them as one big episode. But anyway....

This episode contains one of my absolute favorite scenes from BTAS -- the fencing scene flashback with Dick as a young boy. Granted it's not an important scene really, I guess, but it really is a sweet scene. As we already found out in the first part, Bruce was kind of neglecting Dick in the beginning, focussing so much on getting Zucco. And this scene really shows that Bruce cares about Dick -- and it's nice to see him genuinely enjoying himself, instead of being the brooding, somber, stoic and dark character we all love.

Dick's inner-turmoil about his loss and how he feels Bruce treats him culminates itself in this episode. He doesn't take no for an answer -- and just as he did as a child, takes off to get his revenge on Zucco. The best example of this drive to get Zucco is shown at the very end. Robin's so consumed with his need to exact his revenge he doesn't even contemplate the idea that Batman's desire for him to sit this one out is because he is actually scared Zucco would kill Dick. Instead he thinks of it as a way to shut him out -- and that it's because Dick's too close to and emotional about this whole ordeal.

Ok, so that's enough critical analysis from me. On a side note, there is one big animation flaw in this episode during the flashback scene with Zucco, where Dick falls in the river -- Batman's insignia is missing it's yellow oval. Tsk, tsk, tsk.

[DKstormyknight]

This is a great episode!!!!! I love Dick and Bruce stories, and this is one of the best! 5 out of 5 stars. :D

:cool:

[JTurner954]

Great night for The Rising Sun block. Both episodes were 4 1/2 stars from me.

It's always nice to see Robin, especially when there is an episode that focuses on him. Great flashbacks, great story, and great action make it a great episode. And even better, my favorite Batman episode (which also has Robin) will be airing VERY soon.

[TheScarecrow]

Originally posted by BleuUnicorn
Ok, so that's enough critical analysis from me. On a side note, there is one big animation flaw in this episode during the flashback scene with Zucco, where Dick falls in the river -- Batman's insignia is missing it's yellow oval. Tsk, tsk, tsk.

That wasn't an animation mistake (unless I'm the one that's mistaken). It was SUPPOSED to be that way. It was the design of the Batman costume in the Year One comic, and the flashback scenes were set in Batman's early years. Part one of this episode had this as well, during the Batcave scene where Alfred says Bruce needed to spend more time with Dick.

Anyway, this was a great follow up to part one. I was "marking out" (wrestling fan term for getting excited) when Robin caught Zucco and was throwing him around and beating him up, as it was YEARS of pain and anger and grief that came out, and Robin/Dick Grayson then showed that he was a bigger man then Zucco and let him live, so the law could determine what punishment he deserved (Bruce taught him well).

Seeing Batman with a twisted knee, fighting off thugs, and just about to get shot by Zucco was a great thing, and just showed how human Batman is. If it weren't for Robin, Batman probably would've been dead.

Those flashback scenes with Bruce teaching Dick how to fence were touching, and added more humanity to Bruce Wayne. Nice.

Just a great episode, which showed how great a character Robin can be. I don't know why a lot of Batman fans hate him and want Batman to be "alone", but different strokes for different folks I guess.

****1/2

[AceOfKnaves]

*****

All I have to say is it was a very enjoyable episode. :D

[Batman's Biggest Fan]

This is probably one of my favorites, the animation isn't as good as it was in part 1, but who cares, it's still a lot of fun to watch.

[BeastBoyWonder]

"Robin's Reckoning" is one of my most favorite B:TAS episodes.

[Batman's Biggest Fan]

Yeah I liked the last line.

[Bleu Unicorn]

Originally posted by TheScarecrow
That wasn't an animation mistake (unless I'm the one that's mistaken). It was SUPPOSED to be that way. It was the design of the Batman costume in the Year One comic, and the flashback scenes were set in Batman's early years. Part one of this episode had this as well, during the Batcave scene where Alfred says Bruce needed to spend more time with Dick.

Hmm, I don't remember it being like that in the first part -- which is why I always mean to mention it. Maybe I missed something, I don't know... and either way it's not a big deal, I just always wondered. <shrugs>

[Nightwing]

You can just slap ditto marks all over Bleu's post cuz that's exactly how I feel about all those topics. Oh, except the Batman costume (the entire costume, not just the symbol) being different than his "current" (well, current at the time anyway) BTAS costume. If you look close enough, you can see that not only the bat emblem was changed, looking more like Batman's JL or TNBSA design, but also the size and shape of the bat ears too.

As said above, it was a Year One type thing, and I thought they played off that beautifully. It was a nice treat. In fact his costume in those flashback scenes remind you a lot of the costume from Batman's very first comic appearance.

Anyways, I liked part one a lot more, but like Bleu I consider both parts one episode. Besides which, I may have liked part one more but I'd give part two five stars! Classic original Dynamic Duo action! Years ago I LIVED off it! (these days, of course, I have other favorites as well)

Now if you'll excuse me I have a bit of hunting to do.

"You're out there somewhere, Zucco, but you can't hide from me. I've been taught by the best!"

[oranthal]

why do they have to sho batman and superman in the wee hours of the morning? i want to see them on a normal time schedule. CN reruns so many things that they could squeeze batman and superman in their scedule.

[The Penguin]

"It wasn't that, Robin. It wasn't that at all. Zucco's taken so much, caused you so much pain. I couldn't stand the thought that he might—take you too." - Batman, Robin's Reckoning, Part 2

A great ending to a great set of episodes! The added flashbacks were really nice, they added even more to history of the Bruce-Dick relationship. I was kind of touched by the ending. :)

You can tell from the first moment you see Tony Zucco in the warehouse the years have not been kind to him. The time since the incident at the circus have obviously been hell for the two-bit mobster. He flies off the handle at the drop of a hat and his face is wrinkled with worry from all the years of looking over his shoulder.

The hate etched on Robin's face when he finally meets up with his parents' killer is almost haunting. As Dick Grayson yells at Batman he really isn't even thinking about his partner—he is totally focused on Zucco. Finally, Robin realizes that if he kills the man who killed his mom and dad he will no better than him, and maybe even worse.

As the sun rises on a new day in Gotham City, Batman tells Robin he didn't try to keep him from Zucco because he still saw him as the little boy he took in, but because he couldn't stand the thought of losing someone else that he cares deeply for.

[John6777]

ok next to part 1 this episode sucked it was kinda disappointing. But if we learned anything from these 2 episodes its that Batman has 3 costumes. The Regular One ,The Bob Kane one in Blue (Justice League one), and the bob kane one in Black (TNBA). For those of you who hated the new design its obvious that Batman already had the suits just because he never used them is a different story. Also for those who say ROTJ can't happen cause Batman doesn't wear that suit anymore well lets say the TNBA suit was the one he chose for the day =)

[The_NewCatwoman]

Originally posted by BleuUnicorn
Robin's so consumed with his need to exact his revenge he doesn't even contemplate the idea that Batman's desire for him to sit this one out is because he is actually scared Zucco would kill Dick.

I always thought it was the other way around, that Dick would kill Zucco. His feelings would get the better of him and cause him to do something that he would regret forever.

[Bleu Unicorn]

Originally posted by The_NewCatwoman
I always thought it was the other way around, that Dick would kill Zucco. His feelings would get the better of him and cause him to do something that he would regret forever.
I think that is what probably would have happened, my point was that Bruce was actually scared for Dick's life, not that Dick would kill Zucco. I think that the entire reasoning behind the way the scene went was to show how consumed Dick's desire for revenge and vengeance was, that he couldn't take the time to think that Bruce actually deeply cared for him. Instead he wrote it off as Batman being "stone cold."

[Caped Crusader]

This was a terrific follow-up to part one. True, the animation wasn’t as good as it was in the first part, but it was still decent. The story, though, was great! Overall, this is one of my favorite B:TAS episodes

[EJill34]

I figured since a lot of old talkbacks have been popping up recently, another wouldn't hurt...so here we go.

Well, "Robin's Reckoning, Part 1" has to got to be one of my all-time favorite episodes ever. In some ways, it's my favorite episode of the original 85-episode run of B:TAS. It's just one of the most emotional episodes ever and probably has the most beautiful animation out of any B:TAS/TNBA episode (except maybe "Over The Edge").

My favorite scene is probably Bruce and Dick's little heart-to-heart talk in one of the flashbacks. I always get a little teary-eyed when I watch it.

This is definitely a ***** episode. I just cannot wait to hear the commentary track on B:TAS Vol. 2.

[Stu]

In recent interviews, the creators have stated thier trouble with the original Robin. With episodes like this, it's not noticeable. It simply doesn't get much better. Arguably the greatest origin story the DCU has ever told. As GMahler said, it'll be interesting to hear more of thier thoughts on Robin on the DVD commentary.

Loren Lester was simply superb in this episode. He perfected displayed the anger his character had to show. Lester is hardly mentioned when it comes to DCU greats such as Conroy and Hamill, but the man is up there. Simply superb.

*****

[Fone Bone]

b.t. didn't originally want Robin on the series? SHAAAAAME!

Really neat episode. I loved when little Dick said goodbye to the elephant. Aaaw!

The animation was cool here. The Graysons death was handled well. Shocking enough to make a huge impact, subtle enough not to freak out the kiddies. A really outstanding episode and one of Robin/Nightwing's most shining moments. *****.

[Harlequinade]

This was a great episode looking into Robin's character for the first time. It was nice to see how they pulled off his parent's death and the hanging rope made it really dramatic. It was nice to see the flashbacks of when Bruce first took Dick in and seeing Dick on his own. Batman's defiance against Robin going was cool and how Alfred kinda let Robin disobey Batman's order to go after Zucco himself.

Oh and lets not forget the animation. Beautiful, superb, it's just stunning and probably the best ever.:D 5stars:D

[Carrieattheprom]

DVD!

I really like both parts to this story. You guys are right about the fencing scene, it's always nice to see Bruce have some fun once and a while. Robin's motorcycle ride was way cool.

[Style]

I always thought it was creepy how in the present, Zuco's face looks so drawn and old, he looks like a talking skull!

[creativerealms]

Very good two part episode. Interesting that they took the person that caused Robin's origin in the comic but totally redesigned him into a different person. This Zuko looks and acts nothing like the Zuko of the original comic who was just a Generic crime boss. This Zuko is a snivaling wimp who is quite pathetic if I must say so.

Anyway I love this telling of Robin's origin. Probably my favorite telling. 4.5 stars.

[Stu]

I always thought it was creepy how in the present, Zuco's face looks so drawn and old, he looks like a talking skull!
I'm guessing that running from The Batman fir so long aged him. I thought vis voice actor (I forget the mans name, but he played Biff in Back To The Future!) portrayed this well.

As for the episode itself, it's one of the show's best. It looked awesome too, if I remember correctly.

[Quagmire]

It was a pleasant surprise to see the 2 parter aired during the boomerang marathon last night. I had been waiting weeks for this episode to air.

Definately a good story diving into Dick Grayson's past and his quest for vengance. I wish we could have seen young Dick in the Robin costume, but watching him trail down Zucco was great.


Thank you Boomerang for getting me acquainted with B:TAS.

[creativerealms]

I think some episodes like this one and "If your so Smart why arn't you rich" were infact held off for this marathon, because for the most part Boomerange has been airing the episodes in order with a few not being aired.

[Batman Fan]

I'll talk about Robin's Reckoning as a whole, since I think part 2 doesn't live up to part 1, for one, the animation is way worse, and two, is doesn't have the emotional impact like part 1 does.

Robin definetly had the best origin episode in B:TAS besides maybe Two-face. It all starts out when Batman doesn't let Robin help him with a case he's working on. This starts a great conflict between the two, and makes for some great dialogue and scenes. These two characters are like father and son, and to have them in an argument like that was great, as Robin feels like he's not being treated fairly. Emotions certainly were flying, and it always makes a story more believable to have a conflict like this between two characters, because it's handled so well and makes the story more life-like so people can relate to how Robin feels.

The animation in part one is beautiful. I think it's regarded as the best in the series, and you won't have any arguments from me, every movement was executed perfectly, and that's why part two is a bit of a let down, the animation goes down by a couple of notches and isn't as fluid or vivid as in part one.

The flashback sequences to Robin's childhood were great. It told us about Robin's past and delievered a tragic and emotional story that effects the viewers (well me anyways.) Some of the greatest scenes were with Bruce and Dick, as Bruce could totally relate to Dick and that made for even more emotion. They really handled Dick well in the flashback scenes, dealing with his parents death, and feeling all alone. In part two, we see Dick going after Zucco, trying to get revenge much like a certain somebody:D and he learns that Bruce is Batman. While, not as emotional as part one, the flashback scenes are still very important in part two as it really shows more similarities between the two.

Part two seemed to get a bit slow and boring with Robin trying to find Zucco and Batman limping around the circus, but the finally was great, with an angry Robin wanting revenge from Zucco. You could really tell Robin was upset and furious, and it was great hearing him comment on Batman's cold heart. The ending is one of the best in series, with Batman saying he didn't want Zucco to hurt Robin cause he cared for him so much, and Robin helps an injured Batman as the sun is rising, truly a beautiful ending to a great two part arc.

Robin's Reckoning overall: ****1/2

[ShadowStar]

I was just looking at this beautiful screenshot, and it makes me wonder how close Gotham is to the sea. Is that the harbour underneath the full moon? Interesting layout the harbour has. OMG the art is amazing. BTW, I just noticed that there are no pans for this episode in the section of the site where it is reviewed with screenshots.

http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/batman/btas/episodes/robinsreckoningp1/01.jpg

[Silly McGooses]

Gotham is right next to anything that needs to be there for a plot device, often including the ocean! :D

There was a boat battle on Shadow of the Bat by the docks, and I think there was a fight by the docks in one of the Blight episodes of Batman Beyond.

I agree, beautiful art, the backgrounds of these shows have just declined since B:TAS. You just can't get what you can out of a painting with computer-rendered BGs. They're always missed, but I think, recently, New Fronteir really could've benefited from them.

[Arkaron]

Isn't Gotham supposed to be next to Blüdhaven, which is supposed to be near the ocean itself?

[James Harvey]

With today's release of the Batman: Under the Red Hood animated feature (Feature Talkback (http://www.toonzone.net/forums/showthread.php?t=271373), DVD Talkback (http://www.toonzone.net/forums/showthread.php?t=271374)), there's no better time than now to bump up this discussion. This acclaimed two-part episode is included on the Batman: Under the Red Hood home video release.


http://worldsfinestonline.com/WF/batman/btas/episodes/robinsreckoningp1/00.jpg (http://worldsfinestonline.com/WF/batman/btas/)
Episode #032 - Robin's Reckoning: Part 1
Original Airdate - February 7th, 1993.
When Batman and Robin bust up an extortion, Batman learns the name of the gang leader. To Robin's surprise, he refuses to let Robin continue the investigating with him, preferring to work alone instead. When Robin discovers the truth, he finds that the case is connected with Tony Zucco, a gangster who was responsible for the death of Robin's parents.

Episode #037 - Robin's Reckoning: Part 2
Original Airdate - February 14th, 1993.
Robin heads off in hot pursuit of Tony Zucco, despite Batman's forbidding him to do it. Some tricky detective work takes him to the crook's hideout at the old amusement pier where Zucco has accidentally trapped Batman.

Comments?

[adoptedBatpuppy]

This episode brings back so many good memories...I cried when I first saw it. I think the flashbcacks to Robin's childhood were very emotional that and no matter what happens with him and Bruce. He still has a lot of love for him!
It was beautifully written and animated. :anime:
I Have not had the same reaction with The Batman's "A Matter of a Family" Perhaps I was a lot older when I first saw it.

[J Knight5]

:anime:
I Have not had the same reaction with The Batman's "A Matter of a Family" Perhaps I was a lot older when I first saw it.
I don't think it was because you were older, it was probably because that episode was nowhere near as good as Robin's Reckoning. Part 1 is easily in my top five favorite episodes. I love the ending where Bruce is comforting Dick, telling him how he lost his parents, and then the scene changes to Robin yelling at Batman for deceiving him. Great stuff.