The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes "A Day Unlike Any Other" Talkback (Spoilers) [Archive]

James Harvey

06-26-2011, 09:00 AM

The all-new season finale of The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes has arrived! Check it out today at 11:00am (ET) on Disney XD!

http://marvel.toonzone.net/avengersemh/talkback.jpg (http://marvel.toonzone.net/avengersemh/)
Click here (http://marvel.toonzone.net/avengersemh/reviews/26dayunlikeother/) for more details on this episode!The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes "A Day Unlike Any Other"
Episode Premiere Date - June 26th, 2011
Eight realms have fallen, and only Midgard remains. The Avengers are nothing against his power. Loki has won. Every moment has lead to this.

Comments?

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Avengers

06-26-2011, 10:05 AM

Now that is how you send off a season, by far my favorite episode of it with loki having awesome fight scenes and actually posing a real threaght, plus captain America's beautiful character scenes and him at last really stepping into a leading role, all Avengers get their moment and Iron man's armor is just to cool, hopefully he will get to use it again.

Cap's shield breaking was sad but I think I know how he is ganna get it back:
In Ultron 5 he scans cap's shield so my thought is he will come back with a body made of that material and (assuming cap's is back) will have tony make him a new shield from his body

BigEclipse

06-26-2011, 10:21 AM

So any reason why they're not showing the finale? This is very strange...

Oh, wait, they're showing all three episodes like a movie. Silly me! Just woke up and still groggy.

Rick Jones

06-26-2011, 10:47 AM

It's strange that they didn't show the two previous episodes at 9 instead of 10. I can imagine a few more people waking up disappointed today.

Medinnus

06-26-2011, 10:55 AM

All Avengers get their moment and Iron man's armor is just to cool, hopefully he will get to use it again.

That's always one of the problems with tech armor - once you develop something extraordinary, its hard to justify the need for going back to old armor. Of course, the Uru armor is just armor - it doesn't have all the high-tech that Stark's normal armor has.

This episode is the end of the three-part Season One finale, and getting here has been an extraordinary journey!

In other notes:

* Loki has a sizable group of Asgardian guardsmen supporting his coup - one has to wonder if they defected before or after Loki stole the Odin Force.

* Nice Defenders moment, with the Hulk saving Valkyrie, his "sword-girl" companion.

* I like the Asgardian Armor Giant-Man and Wasp. I wonder if we'll get to see it stay in Season Two, as it looks like some of the variant Silver Age stuff they wore in early episodes.

* Giant-Man and Hulk perform a "fastball special"; Colossus and Wolverine file a lawsuit for trademark infringement!

* Is it wrong to think Hela is really hawt?

* Once more Captain America takes tactical command in the field, inspiring and enabling victory for the Avengers!

* The Uru Iron Man armor is way beyond cool in design. I wonder if he'll get to keep it, or at least portions of it?

* While it may seem harsh punishment for Loki is actually his mythological punishment for slaying Balder and precipitating Ragnarok in Norse myth.

* You'd think the least Odin could do would be to restore Captain America's shield, but nooooo...

* Since Captain America didn't fall in battle with Loki, why is Hela still around (as reflected by her reflection)? Her deal with Cap was for the battle against Loki, not a dirty stinking skrull Maybe she has a crush of Captain America? Or maybe she's a sore loser? Maybe she is intrigued by him, and wants to protect Steve Rogers until she can collect his mortal spirit herself?

* One Hela-va *rimshot* cliffhanger for Season Two!

* I better start getting Kree and Skrull templates together for Season Two!

Dragnatek

06-26-2011, 11:24 AM

They did air some ads that they were going to show Avengers as a movie event but well you would have to watch Disney XD to know that and who watches Disney XD?

Crash

06-26-2011, 11:40 AM

Huh. Giant Man's Asguardian armor had some shoulder flares not unlike his Yellowjacket costume......

...And yeah, that's one heck of cliffhanger for the next season.

Venom Melendez

06-26-2011, 03:26 PM

* Since Captain America didn't fall in battle with Loki, why is Hela still around (as reflected by her reflection)? Her deal with Cap was for the battle against Loki, not a dirty stinking skrull Maybe she has a crush of Captain America? Or maybe she's a sore loser? Maybe she is intrigued by him, and wants to protect Steve Rogers until she can collect his mortal spirit herself?

She's still the goddess of Death though, but i don't think the Skrull killed Cap. I also don't think she wants to protect him. I'm also thinking that "Cap's betrayal" that Kang mentioned is really this Skrull.

I also liked that Iron Man's Uru armor looked like his Thor Buster armor from the comics.

Great season finale and i can't wait for the next season. I'm hoping K'lrt, The Super-Skrull shows up.

Huh. Giant Man's Asguardian armor had some shoulder flares not unlike his Yellowjacket costume......

.

Wasp's armor looked like her classic costume too.

HEATXZ

06-26-2011, 04:58 PM

Awesome episode :anime:
Great to see that the Avengers defeated Loki
I can't wait for Season 2

RoyalRubble

06-26-2011, 05:17 PM

This was another excellent episode, and it worked great as a season finale. Most of the Avengers have reunited and joined other Asgardian "rebels" in their fight against Loki. But before confronting Loki himself, they have to get past the Aagardian traitors that have sided with Loki, and Hoarfin, the giant ice wolf. With a little help from Captain America (who once again demonstrates he is a born leader, giving the others orders on how to win the fight), the Avengers defeat the creature and finally come face to face with Loki. I thought the fight with Hoarfin was a little more brutal than the other fight scenes we have seen on the show before, but it was still pretty awesome. Loki, now having access to the Odin Force proves to be more than a match for the Avengers, at least until Iron Man returns, with his new Uru armor. It was so cool seeing this new armor in action. And speaking of armors, Wasp's and Ant-Man's Asgardian armors looked pretty cool as well. I wonder if any of them will keep using these armors in the future.

Lots of great moments the episode as well, apart from all the fighting. First we have some more scenes with Captain America still in Nifflehein, the Asgardian realm of the dead, confronting its ruler Hela (who is revealed to be Loki's daughter). Cap insists that his mission isn't done yet, and wants to leave to help Thor and the others. Hela accepts to let Cap leave her realm, but with one condition: if he will die in the upcoming battle against her father, his soul will belong to her forever. Then we get a short scene where Thor tells Loki that they both underestimated mortals; Thor has seen what humans are capable throughout the series and has learned to respect them. Another neat moment is when Black Panther confirms that he can "see" magic thanks to Thor lending his hammer to the scientists and shamans of Wakanda for studying. This also explains how he was able to find a portal between realms in the previous episode. I just love the continuity between episodes on this show.

During the battle, Loki breaks Cap's shield just to prove how powerful he is now. Iron Man using his Uru armor (meaning the same metal Thor's hammer is made of) seems to be the only one who can stand a chance against him, until the other Avengers free Thor. Trying to "repair" the flow of the Odin Force through Yggdrasil (the Tree of Life, which was explained in more detail back in the episode "This Hostage Earth"), and re0direct it back to Odin before Loki brings upon Ragnarok, the end of the world. Once Odin regains his rightful powers, he punishes Loki with a fate worse than death. The entire fight between the Avengers and Loki was amazing; Loki was also the biggest and most powerful villain they have faced so far. The punishment Odin gave him was pretty creepy, but you can't really say it wasn't well deserved. I really liked the ending in Asgard, with Odin admitting that the Avengers, the "mere mortals" as he called them have proven themselves to be the mightiest heroes in the Nine Realms and it was great seeing all the Asgardians start acclaiming the Avengers as their heroes.

Really impressed by this first season, and this episode was no exception. And this cliffhanger ending was pretty awesome, as it continues the on-going sub-plot of a Skrull invasion of Earth (which was first addressed back in the episode "The Widow's Sting" and mentioned again in various other episodes). Or at least it was a sub-plot until now, as it seems it will become one of the main themes of the next season. Having a Skrull agent impersonating Captain America will probably lead to some interesting situations. I wouldn't be surprised if this "Cap" was the one responsible for the end of the world Kang mentioned back during his story arc. Besides that, Hela's reflection in a fragment of Cap's shield is another mystery for now. Hopefully the next season will resolve many of the "problems" this season left unsolved, and also feature many other Avenger stories as great (or maybe even better) than the ones we got so far.

Gold Guy

06-26-2011, 05:18 PM

CyclonatorZ

06-26-2011, 05:22 PM

Okay, I'll be honest: I found this three part season finale extremely underwhelming, and a far cry from the high standard episodes like the Kang trilogy or Widow's sting have set. The biggest reasons:

1: The fights were underwhelming. As opposed to so many of the show's high-octane brawls, where hero and villian alike suffered crushing blows, Loki's minions in this finale were basically target practice for the Avengers. In some scenes, they pratically stood still as Thor or someone else plowed through them.

2: The Casket of Ancient Winters, which was the central plot point and cliffhanger of an entire episode, ended up being nothing more than a minor obstacle that failed to even halt the Avengers for more than a few seconds. I had hoped that it would have some huge role to play in Loki's ultimate plan, but no. Speaking of which....

3: It completely negates Hank Hill's supposed character development in the last two episodes. Who wants to bet that, now that he's back on the team, we won't have his pacifism play a crucial role again until Ultron returns?

4, and most importantly: The final epsiode basically undid everything that entire season (and especially episode 25) had done to establish Loki as both a serious threat and the master of the Xanatos gambit. Heck, it even destroys his motive. No longer a scheming would-be conquer, Loki is now just a wacko, who couldn't care less if the entire nine realms was destroyed. Worse, after spending so much time incorporating the Avengers and Thor into his master plan, he falls for a far simpler diversion and blows everything. Seriously?

Yeah, so I'm not happy at all. Even the thrill of the awesome cliffhanger and the nightmare fuel of Loki's fate couldn't make up for how poorly written the finale was in my mind. I haven't been disappointed by this show since it's premier, but now I'm really quite worried about the future of the show.

Dudley

06-26-2011, 06:18 PM

I agree with the above poster. As far as episodes go, this wasn't nearly as epic, and them fighting Ultron, Graviton, or the fight over the Cosmic Cube.
In fact, the best episode of this three-parter was the first part.
Still, I can't wait for the next season, with more characters, more adventures, and more story arcs. Regardless of the less than stellar finale, this is one of my favorite action cartoons on the air.

Did anyone see the animation mistake of Captain America with his shield unbroken?

Capt. Speedbump

06-26-2011, 07:14 PM

3: It completely negates Hank Hill's supposed character development in the last two episodes. Who wants to bet that, now that he's back on the team, we won't have his pacifism play a crucial role again until Ultron returns?

Hank Hill? The propane and propane accessories salesman?!?! When did he become an Avenger?

"Boy that Ultron ain't right, I tell you what."

Seriously, we know that in Season 2, Hank Pym will become Yellowjacket, so let's see how his character develops from here.

Mr. Hypocrite

06-26-2011, 07:37 PM

This episode was exciting, but it wasn't my number one favorite episode. I guess its just that I don't like how they didn't really beat Loki, they just bought time while the others un-rooted a tree. Cool cliffhanger, though.

That's all they could do. He was hopped up on the freaking Odin Force. This is the power that makes Odin the ruler of Asgard, and something even Thor would be unable to match.

Okay, I'll be honest: I found this three part season finale extremely underwhelming, and a far cry from the high standard episodes like the Kang trilogy or Widow's sting have set. The biggest reasons:

3: It completely negates Hank Pym's supposed character development in the last two episodes. Who wants to bet that, now that he's back on the team, we won't have his pacifism play a crucial role again until Ultron returns?

How so. I don't recall anyone saying that Hank would stay with the Team. True we know he's going to become YellowJacket, but who's to say he won't leave to find another way to do things first.

4, and most importantly: The final epsiode basically undid everything that entire season (and especially episode 25) had done to establish Loki as both a serious threat and the master of the Xanatos gambit. Heck, it even destroys his motive. No longer a scheming would-be conquer, Loki is now just a wacko, who couldn't care less if the entire nine realms was destroyed. Worse, after spending so much time incorporating the Avengers and Thor into his master plan, he falls for a far simpler diversion and blows everything. Seriously?

Loki is pretty shortsighted, and in that moment, he was probably just mad with power. I mean really, how many times have we seen Master Schemers in fiction fail because of one tiny thing they didn't expect. Plus remember, he doesn't think Mortals can be a threat(the same reason Enchantress got bushwacked by Zemo), and with the Odin Force, he's stronger than even Thor. Him being brought down by a simple diversion is hardly a shock. It never dawned on him that anyone besides Thor (who he already caught, and now surpasses in power) could be a threat to him.

Also, Uru Man's new armor is nifty. how did he create the computer system for it though (we see the interface reflected on his face during some scenes), and more to the point, will he be keeping it? It would be useful, and he was the one who built it, but it does belong to the Dwarves (the metal that is.)

And hey, Skrull cap. That's not cool. That's not classy. Dude was mourning his lost shield, and your all like "I be shooting you now Ha ha!"

Jerk move Evil Skrull Cap. Jerk move.

Wonderwall

06-26-2011, 08:12 PM

3: It completely negates Hank Hill's supposed character development in the last two episodes. Who wants to bet that, now that he's back on the team, we won't have his pacifism play a crucial role again until Ultron returns?

Wait a minute? When did this guy become part of the Avengers

http://blogs.glam.com/glambuzz/files/2009/02/hank2.jpg

I wonder if he's convinced Tony to use propane and propane accessories;)

Anyway I think the season finale had a bit of a feeling like they just wanted to hit certain beats that a season finale should. But I think it was still fun and the cliffhanger was definitely not the type I would have expected, I was actually thinking the Kree or Kang would do something before the Skrulls.

Medinnus

06-26-2011, 08:51 PM

2: The Casket of Ancient Winters, which was the central plot point and cliffhanger of an entire episode, ended up being nothing more than a minor obstacle that failed to even halt the Avengers for more than a few seconds. I had hoped that it would have some huge role to play in Loki's ultimate plan, but no. Speaking of which....

Wasn't that the bribe that Loki used to recruit the Frost Giants? If so, it was a rather important part.

3: It completely negates Hank Hill's supposed character development in the last two episodes. Who wants to bet that, now that he's back on the team, we won't have his pacifism play a crucial role again until Ultron returns?

I assume that Pym was just along for the ride, and has not changed his mind. I assume that his decision to leave the team - and hence, Jan - when she's always putting herself in the line of fire, will contribute greatly to the stress that eventually produces the identity of Yellowjacket.

The final epsiode basically undid everything that entire season (and especially episode 25) had done to establish Loki as both a serious threat and the master of the Xanatos gambit. Heck, it even destroys his motive. No longer a scheming would-be conquer, Loki is now just a wacko, who couldn't care less if the entire nine realms was destroyed.

Clearly, you've never been power-drunk on the Odin-Force...

..of course, neither have I, but as may be...

Originally, Loki had arranged for the Avengers to be on Midgard, safely out of the way, or at the very least fighting his mortal minions.

By the time the Avengers were knock-knock-knocking on Asgard's door, his plan had already gone south, but he didn't care; by then he had eight of the Nine Realms locked down, and was seething with the Odin-Force. His battle with the Avengers was a little light recreation for him, a moment of enjoyable punishment for the new Lord of the Realms to deal out with these arrogant human gnats whose sting could irritate, but naught more.

As always, he underestimated the 'mere mortals', like all the Asgardians tend to do (except Goldilocks). He was probably just starting to get bored when Uru Man showed up in his armor, and he probably never did figure out how those humans managed to unhook Yggdrasil from him and back to the All-Father.

Sucks to be him, but by the time he'd channeled that much power, he clearly was "under the influence". Friends don't let friends steal the Odin Force and drive, man!

Of course, Loki has no friends, but that's because he's a lying, conniving little weasel!

...now I'm really quite worried about the future of the show.

I think you're in the distinct minority there, bro. :D

jph139

06-26-2011, 10:57 PM

Loki's descent into madness I bought. In fact, I liked it; the whole season we see him calmly and coolly manipulating things, three steps ahead of the Allfather himself, but he ends up so power-drunk he's ready and willing to destroy the universe itself. I mean, I just read the Infinity Gauntlet, and it definitely felt like the same sort of thing - which makes me kind of worried that a Thanos story might be a retread!

I do agree that it felt relatively underwhelming. I mean, it was a huge three-parter, but it still felt really rushed. Compared to Ultron and Gamma World and Kang, there really wasn't any room for character; the team felt as much like props and anything else. Which would be fine if the action was amazing, but it was just par for the course. Not bad, mind you, but not enough to warrant the somewhat loose characterization.

Man, I really, really love Black Panther, though. He's so... minor. You don't even realize he's there most of the time until he jumps out of a portal and saves the day or something. It feels very Panther to me; I think he's the one character they've done best.

And man what a cliffhanger. Cap's minus a shield and on top of that the Skrulls are moving in... very exciting.

Rick Jones

06-26-2011, 11:46 PM

I think the three-parter was incredibly enjoyable but the eventual Loki confrontation felt really quick which makes it seem as though it didn't take as much team effort as the battles with Kang and Ultron did and it didn't seem as physically taxing as the Graviton fight. Still, it was a great conclusion to, in my humble opinion, a very well done first season.

Venom Melendez

06-27-2011, 04:53 PM

This episode was exciting, but it wasn't my number one favorite episode. I guess its just that I don't like how they didn't really beat Loki, they just bought time while the others un-rooted a tree.

Except he was all powerful at that point, the only way to beat him was by giving the odinforce back to Odin.

And they did beat him. You don't always have to beat up the bad guy to defeat him.

3: It completely negates Hank Hill's supposed character development in the last two episodes.

Hank Hill from King of the Hill?

4, and most importantly: The final epsiode basically undid everything that entire season (and especially episode 25) had done to establish Loki as both a serious threat and the master of the Xanatos gambit. Heck, it even destroys his motive. No longer a scheming would-be conquer, Loki is now just a wacko, who couldn't care less if the entire nine realms was destroyed.

Except that's Textbook Loki. This all fit very well with Loki's character.

It was pretty obvious he couldn't handle the Odinforce and was mad with power, which again is vintage Loki. So no, it didn't "undo" anything that was established. After all, don't forget he still hates his brother Thor more than anything.

CyclonatorZ

06-28-2011, 12:14 PM

Wait a minute? When did this guy become part of the Avengers

http://blogs.glam.com/glambuzz/files/2009/02/hank2.jpg

Man, I think that is the single most embarrasing typo I've ever made on any forum. :sweat:

Anyway, I understand the reasons you guys gave for why Loki just went off the deep end, but I still feel it could have been explained a lot better. People who aren't incredibly familiar with the effects of the Odin force or the intricacies of Loki's classic character aren't going to understand that scene as well as hardcore comic book geeks, and since this show is aimed at a wide audience, I think the writers should have made it more clear.

I think my biggest problem with the final arc was that (at least in the first two parts) it felt like just an excuse to string together seven different combat scenes with little to no character development. Apart from Captain America's part, we really didn't learn anything significant about the Avengers or especially the Masters of Evil. I think the most obvious example of that is when Black Panther is talking to Wonder Man, and you think the latter might actually start to have some doubts about his villiany, but then when they cut back a few minutes later he's back to fighting Tchalla without regret. But in general, I thought the first two episodes were especially lacking.

Medinnus

06-28-2011, 12:42 PM

Man, I think that is the single most embarrasing typo I've ever made on any forum. :sweat:

I did my best to ignore it out of "Been there, done that" sympathy :D

Anyway, I understand the reasons you guys gave for why Loki just went off the deep end, but I still feel it could have been explained a lot better.

Hmmm....

I'm not sure I'm one of those who understands the Odin Force that well as such; for example, I was surprised about Yggdrasil's role in it, and as a unifying force as presented for the Nine Realms (I know a ton about actual Norse myth, and so when I was younger tended to avoid Marvel's versions).

What I do know far better than perhaps I should like *grins* are the conventions of comic book storytelling - the way Loki was dealt with reminded me of the way Captain Mar-Vell dealt with Thanos and the Cosmic Cube in CM #33 - distract the villain, destroy the source of his Unlimited Power (tm). The Bad Guy obtaining limitless power which drives him Nutz is a well-known trope, almost as well-used as "Feed the Bad Guy too much power and burn him out!"

That said, you're probably right in that it probably could have been better explained, but there is rarely a plot that can't be said of, really. I think they did enough, given the three episodes.

I think my biggest problem with the final arc was that (at least in the first two parts) it felt like just an excuse to string together seven different combat scenes with little to no character development.

Also a well-used and time-honored Comic Storytelling mechanism, although it has always been more prevalent in the JLA comics than the Avengers; "divide up the team to handle the divided villain threat".

Would I have liked more character exposition, especially as regards the new members of the Masters of Evil, like "Don't you CALL me the Hypno-Hustler!" Chemistro and the Living Laser (and the Gray Gargoyle, come to that!)? Am I patiently (HA!) waiting for signs of Simon's redemption? You betcha, Red Ryder! But, given the established run-time, what would I have cut to include those moments? You can't add something without subtracting something, given fixed run-times, right? So... again, I am well-content.

I do understand and don't really disagree with what you're saying, though. Could it have been better? Maaaaaaybe.... but as it was, it was pretty darned strong as a finale, for me.

Venom Melendez

06-28-2011, 01:13 PM

Man, I think that is the single most embarrasing typo I've ever made on any forum. :sweat:

Anyway, I understand the reasons you guys gave for why Loki just went off the deep end, but I still feel it could have been explained a lot better. People who aren't incredibly familiar with the effects of the Odin force or the intricacies of Loki's classic character aren't going to understand that scene as well as hardcore comic book geeks, and since this show is aimed at a wide audience, I think the writers should have made it more clear.

Loki is motivated by his hatred of Thor and that part was pretty clear. Everything he does is motivated by that hatred.

I think the most obvious example of that is when Black Panther is talking to Wonder Man, and you think the latter might actually start to have some doubts about his villiany, but then when they cut back a few minutes later he's back to fighting Tchalla without regret.

Just because he was starting to have doubts, doesn't mean he was going to change side right there though. Panther was even getting ready to attack as he was talking to him. It's clear he wants no part of the Master, but he still think he needs to be with them to live.

Crash

06-28-2011, 11:08 PM

"His betrayal is just the beginning."

...Okay, remember back when we were all trying to piece together Kang's motives for targetting Captian America? And how at the end of his trilogy he made some cryptic remarks from his prison cell?

Well, in light of this end-of-season cliffhanger, maybe Kang knew more than we were giving him credit for....

macattack

06-29-2011, 01:14 AM

The ending of the finale puts Kang's comments about Captain America in a whole new light, that's for sure. Now THAT is how you end a season. Not only is there a new threat, but a subtle callback to previous episodes, implying that the full story hasn't been told yet. I think Kang has already been confirmed for season 2 but even if he hasn't I think it's a near certainty now.

I don't know if Loki will be back though. :sweat: Looks like Odin has him wrapped up more securely this time . . . though I don't envy Loki's punishment one bit.

I enjoyed the finale overall but I think the show isn't quite in "special" status yet. The show's fun but it's merely that. It's missing that "it" that makes the show special that Spectacular Spider-Man had, that Justice League Unlimited had, that Avatar: The Last Airbender had.

A type of ambition told from the heart is what the above cartoons had that this show doesn't. Oh, EMH isn't lacking in ambition, but there's a calculation to it. The storytelling just does not feel natural.

But this was a fun season. I look forward to season 2 and more fun and new characters. I just wish there were some layers underneath the fun, that only a few episodes like "Hulk vs the World" and "459" hinted at.

Capt. Speedbump

06-29-2011, 10:36 AM

Man, I think that is the single most embarrasing typo I've ever made on any forum. :sweat:

Hey, Hank Pym, Maria Hill... Hank Hill. It happens.;)

But it was entertaining!

I enjoyed the finale overall but I think the show isn't quite in "special" status yet. The show's fun but it's merely that. It's missing that "it" that makes the show special that Spectacular Spider-Man had, that Justice League Unlimited had, that Avatar: The Last Airbender had.

A type of ambition told from the heart is what the above cartoons had that this show doesn't. Oh, EMH isn't lacking in ambition, but there's a calculation to it. The storytelling just does not feel natural.

I guess this is a case of different strokes for different folks, because A:EMH is my favorite animated show of all time now. I like it even better than Spectacular Spider-Man and Justice League Unlimited, two shows I already held in justly high regard (I haven't seen Avatar: TLA). I think the "it" you're refering to may just be a matter of personal taste and opinion.

Venom Melendez

06-29-2011, 12:19 PM

JTMarsh

06-29-2011, 06:37 PM

A thrilling finale to Avengers: EMH season 1. And Clancy Brown as Odin was awesome.

But did anyone notice that after Cap's shield is broken, it appears intact on his arm in a group shot later when the Avengers start ganging up on Loki after Loki loses the Odinforce, only to reappear broken again?

ktk

06-30-2011, 01:21 AM

Great episode, and a great 3-part ending to the season. And I should've know that they'd put a cliffhanger in there. They put them in so many episodes this season that I should've known they'd do it for the season finale too.

I liked the fact that Loki really was all-powerful. There was no way the Avengers were going to beat him in a straight up fight. That really added to the gravity of the situation.

I really liked the explanation from Black Panther about how he was able to see Asgardian magic. Though you'd think that if the folks in Wakanda studied something like that, a guy like Tony Stark would be interested in studying it too. Though now that he built his own Asgardian armor, he probably knows a lot more about Asgardian magics.

Early prediction: I don't think we'll see Loki in season 2. Villains always come back, whether they're dead or alive, and Loki no doubt will come back too, but I don't think it would be as early as season 2. This show will need to be renewed for another season or two for us to see Loki. Though I wouldn't mind in the least if I'm wrong!

Medinnus

06-30-2011, 10:59 AM

This show will need to be renewed for another season or two for us to see Loki. Though I wouldn't mind in the least if I'm wrong!

You should be right, though, especially if they use Fine's notes for Season Three (the "Magic" season).

Although, the according to the Eddas, when Loki escapes from the snake venom punishment, its supposed to be a sign of.... Ragnarok!

suss2it

07-03-2011, 09:55 PM

It was a good episode, not great. It did leave me feeling a bit underwhelmed. The action wasn't that good in this episode, which is a shame since they done good action pieces before such as the fight against Graviton and the Kang trilogy. Maybe I'm just spoiled by the recent DC and Marvel animated movies and Young Justice and Spectacular Spider-Man, but when I watch action cartoons I expect the action to be great.

Loki was great in this episode. I love the guy who does his voice, makes him feel swarmy and sinister. Though I do hope he doesn't show up in season 2, so that they can spotlight the many other Marvel villains out there. Definitely looking forward to Dr. Doom.

I'm pretty sure it was Clancy Brown who voiced Odin, and he did a great job. I love when Brown shows up, he has the perfect booming voice for a God of Gods.

Something I didn't like was Thor getting sidelined again. He's suppose to be the most powerful of the Avengers and yet he spent most of this episode doing nothing. And when he was freed he didn't even have the honour of delivering the final blow to his arch-nemesis. Overall he's had a very poor showing this entire season, and I'm not at all surprised since it's the same guys who wrote "Hulk vs. Thor" where Thor and all of Asgard gets their ass kicked by Hulk and Next Avengers where Thor happily abandons the Earth to Ultron.

One thing I really did love about the episode though was the music. This episode was scored perfectly.

Like you guys, I also wonder if Iron Man, Giant-Man, Wasp and Hawkeye are gonna keep their Asgardian upgrades. For Hawkeye especially that bow would definitely put him on the same level as his fellow Avengers.

Did anyone see the animation mistake of Captain America with his shield unbroken?

But did anyone notice that after Cap's shield is broken, it appears intact on his arm in a group shot later when the Avengers start ganging up on Loki after Loki loses the Odinforce, only to reappear broken again?

I noticed that too.

Here is with his unbroken shield:

http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm302/suss2it/th_30ba706b.png (http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm302/suss2it/30ba706b.png)

And a few seconds later he's back to the Asgardian one:

http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm302/suss2it/th_4487c7bf.png (http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm302/suss2it/4487c7bf.png)

TheVileOne

07-04-2011, 12:38 AM

Yeah I thought it was a little odd. Nice little animation error there.

Capt. Speedbump

07-04-2011, 03:27 PM

Loki was great in this episode. I love the guy who does his voice, makes him feel swarmy and sinister. Though I do hope he doesn't show up in season 2, so that they can spotlight the many other Marvel villains out there. Definitely looking forward to Dr. Doom.

Since the two seasons were written together (as 52 episodes were approved from the start), there was an overall plan for the series up until that 52nd episode. Based on that, I'm pretty sure Loki has played his part.

We've been told that Ultron, Kang, AIM and the Masters of Evil will all return in Season 2. I can't say it's impossible that more villains from Season 1 will return, but I really doubt it because pretty much the rest of the villains in Season 1 have been recaptured and presumably are incarcerated in the Negative Zone prison. I really can't see them A. having another mass breakout or B. allowing one or two villains to break out, which would still require an explanation as to how they escaped, and why not more.

I guess since AIM will return, there's a possibility HYDRA could as well (they both certianly were doing stuff while MODOC and Baron Strucker were incarcerated), but I'm guessing (and hoping) that there will be plenty of other Avengers villains to be introduced in the next 26.

But as you've said, if the show goes beyond that, the rules and restrictions may get a little looser...

Venom Melendez

07-05-2011, 06:30 PM

Something I didn't like was Thor getting sidelined again. He's suppose to be the most powerful of the Avengers and yet he spent most of this episode doing nothing. And when he was freed he didn't even have the honour of delivering the final blow to his arch-nemesis.

Loki was all powerful. The only way they could defeat him is by giving the Odin force back to Odin. Like i said, you don't always have to beat up the villain to win. Some times you have to use you brain instead of your brawn.

Overall he's had a very poor showing this entire season, and I'm not at all surprised since it's the same guys who wrote "Hulk vs. Thor" where Thor and all of Asgard gets their ass kicked by Hulk and Next Avengers where Thor happily abandons the Earth to Ultron.

I disagree. I think they did well with him and he even had a few episodes focused on him.

I guess since AIM will return, there's a possibility HYDRA could as well (they both certianly were doing stuff while MODOC and Baron Strucker were incarcerated), but I'm guessing (and hoping) that there will be plenty of other Avengers villains to be introduced in the next 26.

...

If HYDRA returns, it would probably be under Red Skull's leadership.

suss2it

07-05-2011, 07:32 PM

Loki was all powerful. The only way they could defeat him is by giving the Odin force back to Odin. Like i said, you don't always have to beat up the villain to win. Some times you have to use you brain instead of your brawn.I'm not disagreeing with that, however I would've preferred if Thor got in some good hits on Loki but instead Iron Man got the best hits and came off as the best during that fight. He even had that big damn heroes moment when he first showed up in the new armour. I feel as though since Loki is primarily Thor's enemy Thor shoud've had a moment like that as well.

I disagree. I think they did well with him and he even had a few episodes focused on him.Which episodes are you talking about? Further more which episodes in battle was Thor shown not to be a chump? The only one I can recall is his battle against the Wrecking Crew and the Frost Giants in "Thor the Mighty".

If HYDRA returns, it would probably be under Red Skull's leadership.Forgot all about Red Skull. Can't wait til that sick puppy shows up. Since season 2 is also the cosmic season, who wants to bet that Red Skull'll be getting his hands on a certain cube.

Avengers

07-05-2011, 11:21 PM

I'm not disagreeing with that, however I would've preferred if Thor got in some good hits on Loki but instead Iron Man got the best hits and came off as the best during that fight. He even had that big damn heroes moment when he first showed up in the new armour. I feel as though since Loki is primarily Thor's enemy Thor shoud've had a moment like that as well.

For me it makes me much happier when it mixes up like that, like when cap fought dynamo, he could be fighting zemo but wheres the fun in that, I think Thors immediate capture was to give off exposition cause if iron man was the one to be where thor was he would be dead so while it would have been nice for Thor to beat his way to Loki we would have never got the explanation to his plan, it is a necessary evil in my opinion

Forgot all about Red Skull. Can't wait til that sick puppy shows up. Since season 2 is also the cosmic season, who wants to bet that Red Skull'll be getting his hands on a certain cube.

Thought about that the second I heard them call the second season the cosmic season, crossing my fingers he gets an episode before the series' fate is placed in limbo

suss2it

07-05-2011, 11:33 PM

For me it makes me much happier when it mixes up like that, while when cap fought dynamo, he could be fighting zemo but wheres the fun in that, I think Thor;s immediate capture was to give off exposition cause it iron man was the one to be where thor was he would be dead, it is a necessary evil in my opinion
Don't get me wrong, I do like mixes like that too. But at the same time for a hero's major villain, I'd like to see said hero at least play an instrumental part in taking him down. Especially since Thor never gets to one-up his own arch-nemesis. That's like Red Skull manipulating the Avengers and then when it comes to the final battle Iron Man swoops in and takes him down, even though all the emotional resonance would be between Red Skull and Cap.

Avengers

07-06-2011, 02:30 AM

Don't get me wrong, I do like mixes like that too. But at the same time for a hero's major villain, I'd like to see said hero at least play an instrumental part in taking him down. Especially since Thor never gets to one-up his own arch-nemesis. That's like Red Skull manipulating the Avengers and then when it comes to the final battle Iron Man swoops in and takes him down, even though all the emotional resonance would be between Red Skull and Cap.

I actually completely understand, its funny coase my favorite superhero is cap so thinking of him not getting to beat skull would be infuriating, I guess I just was not that big a thor fan to care, I am a huge Loki fan though so it all evened out, so I totally get it but I still do think it was in some way necessary but mabe not to that extent

Capt. Speedbump

07-06-2011, 01:55 PM

Thought about that the second I heard them call the second season the cosmic season, crossing my fingers he gets an episode before the series' fate is placed in limbo

In an interview, Fine or Yost said "You'll see Ultron before the Red Skull." So I'm pretty sure he'll show up. Just because Season 2 is the "Cosmic Season", I can't imagine that means nothing bout Cosmic stuff for 26 episodes.

We know Dr. Doom, AIM, Kang, Ultron, the Masters of Evil, and the Kree and Skrull will show up. Personally, I hope we also get at least Thanos, Count Nefaria, and Korvac. I'd also have loved to see Taskmaster, but I'll have to file that wish under "Let's hope they make more than 52 episodes".

Venom Melendez

07-06-2011, 06:46 PM

I'm not disagreeing with that, however I would've preferred if Thor got in some good hits on Loki but instead Iron Man got the best hits and came off as the best during that fight. He even had that big damn heroes moment when he first showed up in the new armour. I feel as though since Loki is primarily Thor's enemy Thor shoud've had a moment like that as well.

Though in this show, he's an Avengers villain. So he's kinda threatening all of them. It was Odin

Which episodes are you talking about? Further more which episodes in battle was Thor shown not to be a chump? The only one I can recall is his battle against the Wrecking Crew and the Frost Giants in "Thor the Mighty".

Gamma World for one. In his fight with Absobing man.

[COLOR=#222222]Forgot all about Red Skull. Can't wait til that sick puppy shows up. Since season 2 is also the cosmic season, who wants to bet that Red Skull'll be getting his hands on a certain cube.

I hope he shows up with the Skeleton Crew

[FONT=Times New Roman]
In an interview, Fine or Yost said "You'll see Ultron before the Red Skull." So I'm pretty sure he'll show up. Just because Season 2 is the "Cosmic Season", I can't imagine that means nothing bout Cosmic stuff for 26 episodes.

We know Dr. Doom, AIM, Kang, Ultron, the Masters of Evil, and the Kree and Skrull will show up. Personally, I hope we also get at least Thanos, Count Nefaria, and Korvac. I'd also have loved to see Taskmaster, but I'll have to file that wish under "Let's hope they make more than 52 episodes".

I don't think we'll see Thanos or Korvac, not in season 2 anyway. It's probably too soon for Thanos.

suss2it

07-06-2011, 07:01 PM

Though in this show, he's an Avengers villain. So he's kinda threatening all of them. It was Odin The only reason he's an Avengers villain is because he wants to torment Thor though, he couldn't careless about the Avengers. And I'm not saying that the Avengers should just sit idly by while Thor does all the heavy lifting, I'm just saying that Thor should've been a major factor in their win over Loki, but instead he did next to nothing while Iron Man and the rest of the Avengers saved the day.

Gamma World for one. In his fight with Absobing man.You mean the fight where Abomination beats his helmet off him, than continues to smack him around like a ragdoll? And then when Absorbing Man gets involved they just tag team beat Thor? And then Absorbing Man beats him out the building, continues to beat him with Thor getting almost no hits in, only for him to eventually take control of Absorbing Man? Because if that's the fight you're talking about, it proves my point more than it does yours.

Venom Melendez

07-06-2011, 07:53 PM

The only reason he's an Avengers villain is because he wants to torment Thor though, he couldn't careless about the Avengers. And I'm not saying that the Avengers should just sit idly by while Thor does all the heavy lifting, I'm just saying that Thor should've been a major factor in their win over Loki, but instead he did next to nothing while Iron Man and the rest of the Avengers saved the day.

You have to remember though that this isn't the "Thor show".

You mean the fight where Abomination beats his helmet off him, than continues to smack him around like a ragdoll? And then when Absorbing Man gets involved they just tag team beat Thor? And then Absorbing Man beats him out the building, continues to beat him with Thor getting almost no hits in, only for him to eventually take control of Absorbing Man? Because if that's the fight you're talking about, it proves my point more than it does yours.

They don't Tag team on him.

Once Thor gets his Hammer, he quickly takes care of Abomination, Then Abomination goes on to fight Hulk, while Thor takes care of Absorbing Man, easily too. If you saw the episode, then you'd know he was concentrating on controling him since he had Mjolnir's essence at the time.

He also did good agaisnt the U-Foes and the Gamma mutated SHEILD agents.

If what you want Thor's fights to be one sided, that would be boring as Hell and kinda misses the point of this being a Team show.

suss2it

07-06-2011, 08:55 PM

You have to remember though that this isn't the "Thor show".I'm not arguing that it should be. I'm just saying I'd like Thor to not always get punked in fights, and to you know face off against his arch-nemesis.

They don't Tag team on him. They very much do. Absorbing Man smashes Thor into Abomination who then bear hugs him and then starts smashing him against the ground like a ragdoll. And then the Leader talks a bit about the dome, and then Absorbing Man and Abomination smack up Thor together.

Once Thor gets his Hammer, he quickly takes care of Abomination, Then Abomination goes on to fight Hulk, while Thor takes care of Absorbing Man, easily too.He doesn't quickly take care of the Abomination, he gives him one hit, then the Absorbing Man rushes Thor out the building and the Abomination gets up, completely fine and walks forward about to enter the fray, only for Hawkeye and Hulk bust in from the ground.

If you saw the episode, then you'd know he was concentrating on controling him since he had Mjolnir's essence at the time.I have seen the episode, and in fact I just watched again to refresh my memory. And I'm well aware that Thor was concentrating to control the Absorbing Man, but that doesn't excuse him getting his kicked prior to that by both AM and the Abomination. And why does Thor the Mighty have to resort to "trickery" to win a brawl? It actually makes him look worse since he was just criticizing the leader for depending on "trickery", so now not only does he come across as a pansy, but a hypocrite as well. However, I don't mind if he uses his wits during battle, but I don't wanna see the guy get used as a punching bag for an entire fight and then suddenly decide to do something he could've done much earlier to win the fight.

If what you want Thor's fights to be one sided, that would be boring as Hell and kinda misses the point of this being a Team show.I never once said I want Thor's fights to be one-sided. In fact I want the opposite of that. Right now their one-sided against him, I want more stuff like the Frost Giant fights were both combatants got in good hits on each other.

Crash

07-06-2011, 11:04 PM

Regarding Thor in Gamma World...

So, Thor invades his way through the cube, fighting off both villains and mutated allies alike. Immediately afterwards, every other Avenger and SHIELD agent are mutated, and Thor is beaten unconsious by the sheer mass of his mutated friends. Dragged to the villain's lair, he is tossed onto the floor and forced to do battle with the 'military training' Abomination. While at the same time trying to outwit 'as smart as the Hulk is strong' The Leader. He then gets to fight an asgardian-enhanced Absorbing Man.

...And apparently, running this gauntlet--where he spent most of part 2 as the only hero still standing--and not getting clean wins over everyone...makes Thor a chump.

Yeah, its really not worth getting into this conversation...

Medinnus

07-07-2011, 09:55 AM

Regarding Thor in Gamma World...

Wrong thread by about a half-season.

Yeah, its really not worth getting into this conversation...

Then why bother posting it in the first place.... /shrug

Sockie

07-07-2011, 12:45 PM

Wrong thread by about a half-season.

Several people above you were already talking about it. =/

Capt. Speedbump

07-07-2011, 01:05 PM

I don't think we'll see Thanos or Korvac, not in season 2 anyway. It's probably too soon for Thanos.

Ummm... why not? Thanos and Korvac are cosmic villains, and I'm pretty sure there has been a hint dropped or two that cosmic stuff may happen in Season 2...

Why is it "too soon" for Thanos? What does that even mean?

Avengers

07-07-2011, 02:27 PM

Ummm... why not? Thanos and Korvac are cosmic villains, and I'm pretty sure there has been a hint dropped or two that cosmic stuff may happen in Season 2...

Why is it "too soon" for Thanos? What does that even mean?

Thanos is more of a series ender

Sockie

07-07-2011, 02:28 PM

Thanos is more of a series ender

Who says he has to be?

Avengers

07-07-2011, 03:09 PM

Who says he has to be?

He does not, the creators might decide he will be in the second season but the fact is he is like Darkseid for DC and he was the series ender (yes he had an appearance before but not at full strength so maybe he will get an introduction I don't know)

suss2it

07-07-2011, 03:41 PM

He does not, the creators might decide he will be in the second season but the fact is he is like Darkseid for DC and he was the series ender (yes he had an appearance before but not at full strength so maybe he will get an introduction I don't know)Darkseid was at a full strength in season 2 opener of Justice League. Him and Superman even had a great fight near the end. Darkseid was also in S:TAS, both the series finale and episodes before that.

Avengers

07-07-2011, 04:20 PM

Darkseid was at a full strength in season 2 opener of Justice League. Him and Superman even had a great fight near the end. Darkseid was also in S:TAS, both the series finale and episodes before that.

alright mabe that was a bad example but I do not see thanos as being used already in the second season, could be wrong but I see him as a series closer, just an opinion does not mean thats how it will happen

Capt. Speedbump

07-07-2011, 07:47 PM

alright mabe that was a bad example but I do not see thanos as being used already in the second season, could be wrong but I see him as a series closer, just an opinion does not mean thats how it will happen

Well, I admire your optimism.

There's nothing wrong with your opinion, but... who's to say when the series will close?

Believe me when I say I hope that this series goes on as long as possible, but I'm sober enough to realize that 52 episodes may be it. If that's the case, Thanos could very well be a "series closer".

But just because they may use Thanos, I really don't think that means that nothing they do afterward could be as exciting or entertaining. Of course, that's also just an opinion.
:)

90'sCartoonMan

07-07-2011, 09:12 PM

That was a pretty awesome conclusion. Sure, the build-up may've been more suspenseful, but it was cool seeing all the heroes get together to overcome Loki's forces. I love how Captain America was portrayed, but I was pleasantly surprised to see Iron Man had a big role in helping out, especially since he's usually out of his element with stuff like this.

I dug Odin's ultimate punishment for Loki and how it was close to the myths, and the ending made for a nice cliffhanger. I'm wondering if Kang's warnings about Captain America are because of Bucky or because of a Skrull...maybe it's not even one or the other.

* Since Captain America didn't fall in battle with Loki, why is Hela still around (as reflected by her reflection)? Her deal with Cap was for the battle against Loki, not a dirty stinking skrull Maybe she has a crush of Captain America? Or maybe she's a sore loser? Maybe she is intrigued by him, and wants to protect Steve Rogers until she can collect his mortal spirit herself?

How exactly did Hela word that deal anyway? Was it for the battle against Loki or just if Cap lost his life that night? Hela's certainly intrigued by him, whatever the case, it looks like she's going to try and make a play for him.

But just because they may use Thanos, I really don't think that means that nothing they do afterward could be as exciting or entertaining. Of course, that's also just an opinion.
:)

I'm hoping they avoid using Thanos altogether. Super Hero Squad already did a cosmic second season with him as the Big Bad. Not that either show is similar in the least (aside from using the same characters) and the plots wouldn't be recycled or anything, but the Cosmic Marvel Universe is big enough that they can fit in some non-Thanos threats.

Medinnus

07-07-2011, 10:05 PM

How exactly did Hela word that deal anyway? Was it for the battle against Loki or just if Cap lost his life that night? Hela's certainly intrigued by him, whatever the case, it looks like she's going to try and make a play for him.

I believe the wording was "If I fall in battle against Loki"... but I will go and get it again ) have I mentioned how convenient it is to have the iTunes HDTV collection? )

Transcript time!

CA: If Thor is in trouble, I have to help him. You need to send him to me right now.

Hela: You wish to return to battle, Captain? Then you must offer me something in return.

CA: What do you want?

Hela: If I send you to confront Loki, and death should claim you in the battle, then your mortal spirit belongs to me... forever.

So, presumably the bargain is over, but on the downside Cap has himself an Asgardian stalker! )