The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes "This Hostage Earth" Talkback (Spoilers)

[James Harvey]

Discuss this all-new episode of The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes debuting today at 10:00am (ET) on Disney XD!

http://marvel.toonzone.net/avengersemh/talkback.jpg (http://marvel.toonzone.net/avengersemh/)
Click here (http://marvel.toonzone.net/avengersemh/reviews/24hostageearth/) for more details on this episode!The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes "This Hostage Earth"
Episode Premiere Date - June 12th, 2011
The end begins! As Thor and Iron Man work to find a way for Thor to return to Asgard, the Enchantress makes her move. The Masters of Evil mobilize all across the world preparing for an invasion the likes of which Earth has never seen. Because unless the Avengers can stop it… the armies of Asgard are coming to Earth.

Comments?

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[Medinnus]

This is the beginning of the three-part Season One finale, and getting here has been a wild ride!

In other notes:

* The Living Laser, the Grey Gargoyle, and Chemistro have apparently joined the Masters of Evil.

* Was the Enchantress' betrayal of the Grey Gargoyle odered by Baron Zemo? Whether ordered or not, was it fatal? It would seem to me that the Enchantress might well have confined him for her own uses after their victory; he's too useful a tool to casually discard.

* The Grey Gargoyle's turning-to-stone has a twenty-four hour duration, at which point the victim reverts; I wonder if the Enchantress knows this, or if she's going to have a very angry Norn Queen to deal with shortly?

* Hawkeye still gets the best banter, with Wasp as second-best.

* Well, the Hulk manages a clean victory over the Executioner, and likes the axe. Clearly, Hulk is the strongest one there is!

[honorableninja]

when i originally watch this i thought chemistro saying hawkeye punching him in the face was either off camera or a comic refencnce but thanks to the dvds i remember cilnt actually did punch him during the breakout.

[Vampire_King]

The Only Threat Remaining Is Loki
everyone else has been defeated as far as i can tell

[jph139]

Ah, the cocky guy paired off with the vengeful villain... classic trope done as well as ever.

Fantastic episode. Very nice to see the team take on villains individually, though in some cases (like Hulk and Cap) I would have liked to see a bit more of their fights. Wonder Man is being pushed further and further away from the dark side, so hopefully we get him turning hero next season. Oh, and Zemo had that gross spongy worm thing from the episode with the Statue of Liberty! Very cute callback.

Main plot is kind of basic (make magic stuff where there shouldn't be magic stuff) but the payoff I didn't quite see coming. Alright, frost giants and elves cross over into our world, predictable stuff, but the Avengers getting sucked back, too? That'll be interesting to see. Probably some great character development time for Jan and Hank, what with the whole "stuck in cosmic Siberia" thing.

[Medinnus]

The Only Threat Remaining Is Loki
everyone else has been defeated as far as i can tell

Not quite...

The Breakout List:

http://www.medinnus.com/AEMH/breakout_watch.html

Also, the Masters of Evil may have been defeated, but they are not apprehended; since they didn't follow the Avengers into the Asgardian realms at the end, they'll wake up with big headaches but still be at large!

[Capt. Speedbump]

Not quite...

The Breakout List:

http://www.medinnus.com/AEMH/breakout_watch.html


Baron Strucker was captured in "Hail Hydra!".

So was MODOC, who wasn't on your list (he was shown to be in the Vault).

[Medinnus]

Baron Strucker was captured in "Hail Hydra!".

So was MODOC, who wasn't on your list (he was shown to be in the Vault).

Ha! Corrections HOOOOOOO! Thanks!

[RoyalRubble]

Baron Zemo's Masters of Evil lead by the Enchantress continue their plans for world domination, after obtaining the magical Norn Stones from the Norn Queen Karnilla. More villains have joined the Masters of Evil since the last time we saw them, including the Living Laser, Chemistro and the Grey Gargoyle (who according to the Enchantress was lost on the battlefield on Asgard, though that might be only half-true). Their plan is to use these Norn Stones to break the walls between the Nine Realms and bring forth magical Asgardian armies to conquer the Earth. So they all split up and set up a Norn Stone in seven different locations, each spot being a weak spot between Midgard and another one of the Asgardian Nine Realms.

Lots of great continuity nods this episode: Iron Man has found a way to help Thor travel back to Asgard by using a device to generate a wormhole between the two planes (as Thor asked him to do in the episode "Ultron-5"); all they need to find is a suitable weak spot where to set up this machine. Another neat little moment is when Captain America mentions he has seen a machine like this back in his time, where it also worked (see "Meet Captain America"). Thor explains there are supposed to be eight such spots on Midgard, each one leading to one of the Asgardian Nine Realms, and all are connected by Yggdrassil, the Tree of Life (or just "Big Tree", as the Hulk calls it). Seeing there are disturbances at seven of these spots and they are seven Avengers (Ant-Man has left the team, despite Wasp's pleads), they split up and each head out to a different location. Iron Man's "Avengers Disassemble" line was an appropriate and amusing way to start the adventure. But at each location they also find one of the Masters of Evil, protecting the Norn Stones and awaiting them to get their revenge (maybe except Wonder Man, who still doesn't feel like a "true" villain). I wasn't expecting Thor's enemy to be Baron Zemo himself (I was thinking Zemo would rather fight Cap again). But it works out anyway, as Zemo is aided by the Enchantress and Thor has some history with her. Zemo trying to betray Amora was pretty obvious, but his plan failed in the end.

The fight scenes were great as usual. I especially liked Hulk's battle with Skurge the Executioner, that was awesome. It was probably my favorite fight from this episode, even if it was short. And Hulk kept the axe, pretty cool. Wasp versus Abomination was also cool, and I didn't expect Ant-Man to follow her and help her in the fight. Hawkeye continues to get some of the best or funniest lines on the show. His short talk with Chemistro was great; "How can you not remember who I am? You punched me in the face!" (see "Breakout Part One"). Hawkeye also accidentally (or was he doing it on purpose?) calls him Paste-Pot Pete and the Hypno Hustler. I've never heard of the second one, but then again I never knew about Chemistro either before this show. Iron Man's and Captain America's fight scenes were great as well, but compared to the others, weren't really that special. The real "fun" starts as soon as the Asgardian forces (including from Frost Giants, pixies, elves and ghosts) arrive on Earth, and the Avengers have to fight them as well. And then at the end, following Thor's advice to destroy the Norn Stones all at once, all the Avengers are absorbed by the energy of the Stones and disappear from Earth's surface, as Jarvis states. We have no idea what exactly happened, but one thing is for sure: Loki was involved in all of this. Thor awakens back in Asgard, only to see Loki sitting on the Throne...

Seeing as we are approaching the season finale, I hope the next episodes reveal how Loki was somehow involved in pretty much everything the Avengers (and especially Thor) had to go through back on Midgard, while his plans continued to unfold in Asgard. Apparently he has taken control over Asgard, and I have to wonder whatever happened to Odin. Speaking of which, whatever happened to all the other Avengers, other than Thor? Hopefully everything will be revealed soon, as I'm definitely looking forward to the next episodes. This show hasn't disappointed me yet, and I'm sure the next episodes won't either.

[Capt. Speedbump]

Ha! Corrections HOOOOOOO! Thanks!

Nice! Thanks for the update! Haven't read the whole thing yet, but the interview with Josh Fine looks cool too!

UPDATE: I read the Fine interview! Thanks for asking a lot of thorough questions. I wish Fine the best, but I still hope we get a Season 3!

[Medinnus]

UPDATE: I read the Fine interview! Thanks for asking a lot of thorough questions. I wish Fine the best, but I still hope we get a Season 3!

Interviewing is easy; I just went back over our discussions here on the forums for questions for which we didn't have answers. And when I asked them, Mr. Fine answered at length, not the one or two sentences that require interviewers to ask follow-ups! Mr. Fine and Mr. Yost have been nothing but supportive and helpful all the way down the line; we were sure fortunate to have had them!

[Webbed-Wonder]

Lol, Hawkeye thought Chemistro was the Hypno-Hustler! He's an obscure and very lame Spidey villain.

[Mr. Hypocrite]

A good episode. Loved Hawkeye's line about the Elf. That would make anyone uncomfortable.

Also, Zemo knowing the Enchantress couldn't be trusted was a give-in. She probably knew he didn't trust her, but as Thor put it, mortal lives mean nothing to her, so Zemo getting the drop on her makes sense. She never believed he could be a threat, so she never guarded herself against him.

As for the Grey Gargoyle, likely dead. For the above reasons. There's no possible long term considerations to it; once he had served his immediate purpose, there was no reason in her mind to keep a mortal around. Even though killing him accomplished absolutely nothing, and wasn't even necessary in any way, but hey, Enchantress is not a nice person.

Also, Wonder-Man's heel face turn is pretty much hinging on him reconciling with Tony. We know Tony would want to find some way to help him. Convincing Simon that he had Stark all wrong (well he is a jerk, but he is genuine about fixing old mistakes) would be the final thing needed to push him out of villain territory. His grudge against Stark is about the only thing he's got left to keep him in the bad guy zone.

[Avengers]

I wonder if Zemo's successful betrayal on the enchantress makes her more wary of the mortals, im sure it means she is out of the masters, at least it does if Zemo does not control her again

[Medinnus]

As for the Grey Gargoyle, likely dead. For the above reasons. There's no possible long term considerations to it; once he had served his immediate purpose, there was no reason in her mind to keep a mortal around. Even though killing him accomplished absolutely nothing, and wasn't even necessary in any way, but hey, Enchantress is not a nice person.


She may not be a nice person -- well, OK, she's downright evil -- but I find it hard to believe she'd kill the Gray Gargoyle for no reason; after all, he's a useful tool to have at her disposal, and while she's not a nice person, she's not a stupid person either. I don't personally have any compassion for a hammer, and yet they're very selfishly useful to have around when needed!

[Avengers]

She may not be a nice person -- well, OK, she's downright evil -- but I find it hard to believe she'd kill the Gray Gargoyle for no reason; after all, he's a useful tool to have at her disposal, and while she's not a nice person, she's not a stupid person either. I don't personally have any compassion for a hammer, and yet they're very selfishly useful to have around when needed!

She had a reason, she just watched the last episode and realized hank would not be going so she knew someone would have to be cut to even the teams out:D

[Medinnus]

She had a reason, she just watched the last episode and realized hank would not be going so she knew someone would have to be cut to even the teams out:D

SEE? EVIL! Imagine, sneaking a peak at the Australian episodes before they're released in the USA. Pure. Evil!

Oh, the perfidious Asgardian!

[JTMarsh]

Great episode. I loved watching Giant-Man go crazy as he pounded Abomination into the ice. I actually wanted him to yell "GIANT-MAN SMASH!!!!"

"I got an elf giving me a dirty look...." hehe, classic.

[Monte]

As for the Grey Gargoyle, likely dead. For the above reasons. There's no possible long term considerations to it; once he had served his immediate purpose, there was no reason in her mind to keep a mortal around. Even though killing him accomplished absolutely nothing, and wasn't even necessary in any way, but hey, Enchantress is not a nice person.

i think she had a reason... i think she got rid of him because she view ed him as a threat. Frankly, i would hazard a guess that the Norn queen may be on similar footing as the enchantress herself (http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20101229120933/marveldatabase/images/thumb/e/ee/Amora_vs_Karnilla_from_Thor_260.JPG/830px-Amora_vs_Karnilla_from_Thor_260.JPG). Fact is Gray Gargoyle can turn anyone to stone with a simple touch as it did not take him much to take care of Karnilla as far as we could see. All he needs is to either get close to them (via stealth or making them believe he is an ally) or for someone to distract the enemy for him so he cna get close and he could turn encantress into a lawn ornament. Enchantress needed pawns, villains that she could manipulate or handle. Being villains she knew they could not be trusted and thus knew that she had to be prepared for their betrayal. Being an asgardian she is very durable and thus can handle being stabbed in the back by most people; after which she can fight back... but Gargoyle is someone who was too get of a risk; she might be confident in her ability to fight off most of the villains, but not so confident to believe she can be certain to keep them from, literally, laying a single finger on her... hell even if she thought she could keep gargoyle form touching her, his betrayal with the other villains might at least result in her loosing executioner, the only minion she knows is completely loyal to her


And this is how she fell to Zemo... Take one look at zemo and its easy to underestimate him, easy to assume he's one of the least threatening of the masters of evil (something that zemo had to point out as untrue to abomination in the previous episode way back). Enchantress is an Asgardian, she can handle a sword to the back and thus thought she could turn her back on him. But she was proven very wrong...


oh and don't you just love how DisneyXD spoiler Zemo's little betrayal in the commercials... really, Disney has no tact...

[HEATXZ]

Great episode :anime:
I enjoy the Masters Of Evil fights

[Medinnus]

i think she had a reason... i think she got rid of him because she view ed him as a threat.

(A) Not if she controls him.
(B) A mere mortal, a threat?
(C) After being turned to stone, the effect lasts 24 hours. Let the Norn Queen, one of her rivals, recover herself?

More like she has Pierre DuVall in an enchanted state, ready to stone Karnilla again and again as necessary.

[AlgeaX]

More like she has Pierre DuVall in an enchanted state, ready to stone Karnilla again and again as necessary.

If Amora really wants to make sure Karnilla is no longer a threat, there is another option...



http://www.toonzone.net/forums/picture.php?albumid=174&pictureid=2147

[Monte]

(A) Not if she controls him.
(B) A mere mortal, a threat?
(C) After being turned to stone, the effect lasts 24 hours. Let the Norn Queen, one of her rivals, recover herself?


More like she has Pierre DuVall in an enchanted state, ready to stone Karnilla again and again as necessary.
A) she can not control him in front of Zemo and the others; she must manipulate them into working for her willingly. If she goes mind controlling any one of them, the others will grow suspicious of her and become more likely to turn on her, or at the very least not support her plans; and she still had need of them for dealing with the avengers.
B) A mere mortal who had just proven that he can take out an asgardian sorceress with a mere touch... really she has shown before that mortal can cause her a fright when she started panicing for Executioner's help when she alone staring down an angry Hulk.
C) if that's what she did, then why did she hide this fact from Zemo? I think he would understand if she needed to keep someone with Karnilla to guard her and keep her from becoming a threat. No reason to lie about something like that... besides, unless there is more time going on here it looks like Enchantress was planning to have fullfilled Loki's plans before those 24 hrs were up; after which someone like Karnilla may be little more than a nuisance.

[supergirl's pal]

I love how Wasp has a winter coat that matches her standard uniform. The show needs to showcase her fashion design skills more. :anime:
I also loved how she took on the Abomination and stuck her tongue out in the face of danger! :p

[Mr. Hypocrite]

i think she had a reason... i think she got rid of him because she view ed him as a threat. Frankly, i would hazard a guess that the Norn queen may be on similar footing as the enchantress herself (http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20101229120933/marveldatabase/images/thumb/e/ee/Amora_vs_Karnilla_from_Thor_260.JPG/830px-Amora_vs_Karnilla_from_Thor_260.JPG). Fact is Gray Gargoyle can turn anyone to stone with a simple touch as it did not take him much to take care of Karnilla as far as we could see. All he needs is to either get close to them (via stealth or making them believe he is an ally) or for someone to distract the enemy for him so he cna get close and he could turn encantress into a lawn ornament. Enchantress needed pawns, villains that she could manipulate or handle. Being villains she knew they could not be trusted and thus knew that she had to be prepared for their betrayal. Being an asgardian she is very durable and thus can handle being stabbed in the back by most people; after which she can fight back... but Gargoyle is someone who was too get of a risk; she might be confident in her ability to fight off most of the villains, but not so confident to believe she can be certain to keep them from, literally, laying a single finger on her... hell even if she thought she could keep gargoyle form touching her, his betrayal with the other villains might at least result in her loosing executioner, the only minion she knows is completely loyal to her


And this is how she fell to Zemo... Take one look at zemo and its easy to underestimate him, easy to assume he's one of the least threatening of the masters of evil (something that zemo had to point out as untrue to abomination in the previous episode way back). Enchantress is an Asgardian, she can handle a sword to the back and thus thought she could turn her back on him. But she was proven very wrong...


oh and don't you just love how DisneyXD spoiler Zemo's little betrayal in the commercials... really, Disney has no tact...


A) she can not control him in front of Zemo and the others; she must manipulate them into working for her willingly. If she goes mind controlling any one of them, the others will grow suspicious of her and become more likely to turn on her, or at the very least not support her plans; and she still had need of them for dealing with the avengers.
B) A mere mortal who had just proven that he can take out an asgardian sorceress with a mere touch... really she has shown before that mortal can cause her a fright when she started panicing for Executioner's help when she alone staring down an angry Hulk.
C) if that's what she did, then why did she hide this fact from Zemo? I think he would understand if she needed to keep someone with Karnilla to guard her and keep her from becoming a threat. No reason to lie about something like that... besides, unless there is more time going on here it looks like Enchantress was planning to have fullfilled Loki's plans before those 24 hrs were up; after which someone like Karnilla may be little more than a nuisance.

That all makes a lot of sense. Although I still don't think she regards mortals highly enough to even consider that, but it's an equally valid interpretation of her actions.

[Medinnus]

A) she can not control him in front of Zemo and the other.

Hence her lie to Zemo about his having been a casualty; she also knows that Loki's end-game is almost here, and Loki might just sweep all the mortal toys off the board when his ultimate plan is complete.


B) A mere mortal who had just proven that he can take out an asgardian sorceress with a mere touch... really she has shown before that mortal can cause her a fright when she started panicing for Executioner's help when she alone staring down an angry Hulk.

...who she couldn't enchant or manipulate. Amora is called the Enchantress for a reason; she's craftly and full of deceit and guile. I don't think that she'd find Pierre Duvall much of a threat to her when he's under her control; she's also arrogant enough (and probably rightly so) to believe that mere mortals breaking her control is exceedingly rare.


C) if that's what she did, then why did she hide this fact from Zemo?

Because she might need to use him against Zemo soon enough; as they near the end-game, I doubt she has much faith in Zemo or Loki to appropriately reward her or not betray her. Why get rid of a useful weapon she may need, one way or another, before too long. Breaking a useful tool - and Amora is ALL about who she has in her thrall - would seem self-defeatingly counter-productive to her own ends, even if her own ends match Loki's - which is doubtful.


I think he would understand if she needed to keep someone with Karnilla to guard her and keep her from becoming a threat. No reason to lie about something like that... besides, unless there is more time going on here it looks like Enchantress was planning to have fullfilled Loki's plans before those 24 hrs were up; after which someone like Karnilla may be little more than a nuisance.


When presented with a fait accompli of Loki ruling the Nine Realms, Karnilla is smart enough to co-operate with the winning side. That notwithstanding, I think you don't give her capacity for deception and playing her own game enough credit; like Hela, the Enchantress knows that Loki is not to be trusted, and I don't think she'd ever trust Zemo... and rightly so, as things turned out. Smart police have hold-out guns. Smart spies have backup identifications and negotiables as reserves. Smart Enchantresses have minions that "everyone knows" are dead, so they aren't planned for by whoever threatens her.

Besides, in the writing world, they may want to use the Gray Gargoyle again. Killing him off to no plot purpose is a stupid thing for a writer to do, and the last thing the AEMH writers are is stupid By leaving it open, they gain the characterization point, and if they ever need the character, they have a plausible explanation. :D

[Monte]

...who she couldn't enchant or manipulate.

Doesn't change the fact that she felt threatened by a mortal... which was the point. She may believe that mortals are beneath her, but that does not mean that she thinks that its impossible for a motral to have the power to be a risk to her


Because she might need to use him against Zemo soon enough; as they near the end-game, I doubt she has much faith in Zemo or Loki to appropriately reward her or not betray her. Why get rid of a useful weapon she may need, one way or another, before too long. Breaking a useful tool - and Amora is ALL about who she has in her thrall - would seem self-defeatingly counter-productive to her own ends, even if her own ends match Loki's - which is doubtful.
So, Enchantress, who you say would not view a mere mortal as a threat, view's Baron Zemo, a mere mortal, as a threat... also she apparently requires the aid of a mere mortal, who she does not consider a threat to her self, to deal with Zemo's betrayal. Also the villian she thought might betray her and be a threat is the same villain she chose to keep by her side, alone, and turn her back on him leaving herself open to attack... ya i think that if she thought Zemo was a threat and was going to use Grey Gargoyle to deal with him she would have had him with her hiding in the shadows ready to jump Zemo if he tried anything... or she would have had Grey gargoyle go deal with the hulk so that she could keep Executioner by her side to watch her back with Zemo. Really I don't think Enchantress was stupid enough to think Zemo would not betray her, but i think the fact that he so easily bested her and there were many ways she could have prevented him from getting that chance only shows that she underestimated his ability to actually be SUCCESSFUL with his betrayal... she knew his betrayal was possible, but never thought he would be successful in besting her

Also you think she might want to use him against Loki... but you claim she would not view grey gargoyle as a threat. If Gargoyle is not a threat to her they why would he be a threat to Loki? i mean isn't the idea that Gargoyle would be useful in betraying Loki also an admission that Gargoyle would be useful in a betrayal against herself?


Another thing... looking back, i think you may be overestimating Amora's ability to control people. If i recall we have never seen her take control of any of the heroes in the middle of combat. Control requires prep time, like when dealing with the Hulk she had to first implant suggesstions and amnipulate him against the avengers before she could have influence over him. Futharmore, her influence is just that, influence. She can not just enslave someone; her control is much more subtle. It would not be possible for her turn Hulk into her pet that would gladly give her a back rub but after planting the suggestions that the avengers hated him it was possible for her to control him enough to convince him that the avengers were his enemy and get him to attack him. In otherwords, controlling ANYONE into being loyal to her may not be as easy as you make it seem... her enchantments manipulate people, not enslave them




Besides, in the writing world, they may want to use the Gray Gargoyle again. Killing him off to no plot purpose is a stupid thing for a writer to do, and the last thing the AEMH writers are is stupid By leaving it open, they gain the characterization point, and if they ever need the character, they have a plausible explanation. :D
I never claimed he was killed, only that she got rid of him which can mean many things

Though another thing i might mention is that Enchantress told Executioner to give Gargoyle his "reward"... that's villian talk for do something evil to him. If the "evil" in this case was putting him under an echantment, then wouldn't she say "allow ME to give you your reward" with the scene cutting just as her eyes start glowing; or something along those lines. If i had to guess, if Executioner did not kill him, i might think that he either froze him, or sent him to another realm. Something of a symantics thing, but can be important in interpreting subtext

[macattack]

I was kinda hoping that Ultron depowering the Hulk would have left some kind of repercussion, even if Banner would just hulk out eventually in the final arc. Kinda disappointing to see he's just the Hulk again, I wanted some Banner time.

More thoughts soon.

[Medinnus]

Doesn't change the fact that she felt threatened by a mortal... which was the point.

You make her sound like an experience with the Hulk changed her basic arrogance forever. Once instance, from someone who can go toe to toe with Thor, I don't think is going to change her arrogance or personality. You can, of course, believe otherwise. *shrugs*

As for the rest...

Its pretty unfair to use multiple answers to multiple people out of context.

Let me summarize, since you seem confused.

The Enchantress is an arrogant Asgardian who thinks that mortals are little more than toys, for the most part (and she doesn't have a much different opinion of Asgardians, come to that). Most mortals are utterly useless. Some mortals are useful tools. Very few mortals pose any significant threat. She is aware that Zemo is brilliant for a mortal, and treacherous; she does not trust him. She is aware that Loki is, if anything, more treacherous.

She has a chance to remove one of Zemo's minions and make him her own. Of course she'd take the opportunity offered; she's not stupid, and she's also more than a little treacherous herself. It is likely that she had the Executioner throw her new potential minion in a cell in Karnilla's castle, so that she can deal with him at her leisure.



Another thing... looking back, i think you may be overestimating Amora's ability to control people. If i recall we have never seen her take control of any of the heroes in the middle of combat.


Hulk before the fight, when the Avengers break him out of her control; he's utterly her creature. The more prep time, the more solid her control.


It would not be possible for her turn Hulk into her pet that would gladly give her a back rub but after planting the suggestions that the avengers hated him it was possible for her to control him enough to convince him that the avengers were his enemy and get him to attack him. In otherwords, controlling ANYONE into being loyal to her may not be as easy as you make it seem... her enchantments manipulate people, not enslave them

Possible, but just as easily also totally wrong - you're cutting a really wide set of generalizations with little data.


I never claimed he was killed, only that she got rid of him which can mean many things

It can - but you didn't re-define it when we started debating, so my assumption as to what you actually meant may be wrong, but you never corrected it, so its at least a reasonable interpretation. Besides, if she's stashed him for later use rather than killed him or had him killed, then we really don't have an argument, as that's my whole contention - that she's not stupid enough to waste a tool.

[AdamYJ]

Though another thing i might mention is that Enchantress told Executioner to give Gargoyle his "reward"... that's villian talk for do something evil to him. If the "evil" in this case was putting him under an echantment, then wouldn't she say "allow ME to give you your reward" with the scene cutting just as her eyes start glowing; or something along those lines. If i had to guess, if Executioner did not kill him, i might think that he either froze him, or sent him to another realm. Something of a symantics thing, but can be important in interpreting subtext

I hope Grey Gargoyle wasn't killed. I like Grey Gargoyle, though he's a villian who never seems to catch a break in the comics these days. This show gets props for making his power seem scary. Karnilla looked terrified as she was being turned to stone.

[Geodude]

I love how Wasp has a winter coat that matches her standard uniform. The show needs to showcase her fashion design skills more. :anime:
I also loved how she took on the Abomination and stuck her tongue out in the face of danger! :p
Heck yeah. Her cuteness was too much for even the Abomination to take. :p

[Crash]

Man, being out of town when an episode airs really throws you off your commenting game....


Great episode. I loved watching Giant-Man go crazy as he pounded Abomination into the ice. I actually wanted him to yell "GIANT-MAN SMASH!!!!"


That scene amused me for a different reason. Giant-Man being a 'pacifist' was a pretty major plot point for the last two episodes. He went so far as to quit the team because they were too quick to embrase violence. And yet, here he is, embrasing violence so thoroughly.... So its no surprise to me that a robot built off Hank's mind decided the best way to acheive peace was to kill every living thing on Earth.

A comment was made about Wasp's winter outfit. I liked that outfit! It seemed more suiting to heroism than her usual garb. Looked better, too. I mean, seriously, a strapless bell-shaped miniskirt....?

Hearing Abomination compare Wasp to Hawkeye and Cap was neat. To have Abomination show some respect (in the form of backhanded compliments) to some of his adversaries was pretty cool. A nice insight into how the thug 'with military training' thinks.

Speaking of Abomination, remember back in the first Masters of Evil episode, where he challenged Zemo? And remember Zemo's response to that--that Zemo leads "because I am better than you!" Fast forward from there to here... Yeah, Zemo wasn't kidding when he said that...

[Avengers]

That scene amused me for a different reason. Giant-Man being a 'pacifist' was a pretty major plot point for the last two episodes. He went so far as to quit the team because they were too quick to embrase violence. And yet, here he is, embrasing violence so thoroughly.... So its no surprise to me that a robot built off Hank's mind decided the best way to acheive peace was to kill every living thing on Earth.


HE CLEARLY LOVES WASP VERY MUCH AND JUST HER BEING HER HURT IGNITES A SPARK IN HIM THAT SENDS HIM ON A RAMPAGE, IT IS SOMETHING THAT HAS REMAINED CONSISTENT THROUGH THE SEASON SO I doubt it is a character change


by the way capslog was on and by the time I found out I did not want to retype, sorry

[Gold Guy]

Another really good episode. I;ve always liked the episodes in any action show when the heroes split up and each face their own foe. The fights were good and exciting, and you have to give Wasp credit for being brave enough to fight Abomination. I felt though that this could have been a two-parter, and Hulk's fight needed alot more punches, but otherwise really good episode.

[suss2it]

Another good episode. It was fun to see the team split up and fighting solo for a change.

The match up themselves were unexpected and great. How did Living Laser join up with the Masters of Evil? Was that done in the tie-in issues, like Crimson Dynamo?

Hank's continued plot is getting a little annoying though. For 3 episodes in a row we see this guy quitting the team. The guy needs to either **** or get off the pot at this point.

I also didn't like how he rescued Wasp. It was nice, since we got see what makes Hank tick, but I thought it would've been really cool if someone as small as Wasp beat someone as big as the Abomination on her own.

And Thor is again made to look a lot weaker than he actually is. Baron Zemo, a guy with no powers is able to fight one on one with the God of Thunder, as well as stun him by shooting him with his gun. I'm getting tired of this, but honestly I'm not surprised since it's the same guys who made "Hulk vs. Thor", where Thor (and all the other Asgardians really) are made to look like useless pansies next to the Hulk. Not to mention Thor could've escaped from the Enchantress' bind at any time but chose to wait it out for some reason.

Captain America continues to be awesome. Loved how he was able to best Crimson Dynamo on his own. I wonder when he'll eventually lead the team. Black Panther was also pretty cool. Though it was shady of him to talk to Wonder Man like he was trying to help, and then jump and attack him. I thought he'd win the fight without throwing a single fist.

Hawkeye continues to be funny and a badass. He just needs to get rid of that ugly costume of his and he'll be set. Hulk's fight with Executioner was alright. Loved how when Hulk arrives there's no words between them, they just fight. I also loved at the end how Hulk emerges from the water with Executioner's ax and calls him a lightweight. My only problem was the fight itself. The show always cut away when it was getting good, and there wasn't much intensity or impacts throughout the fight. Since they wouldn't even have had show blood or anything since Hulk is Hulk, and Executioner is a God, I was expecting something more intense like Bane vs. Mammoth in "Drop Zone" form Young Justice. Two big brutes just viciously slugging it out.

Glad that Loki's finally back. Love his voice actor. Can't wait to see exactly what he's up to.

[Crash]

HE CLEARLY LOVES WASP VERY MUCH AND JUST HER BEING HER HURT IGNITES A SPARK IN HIM THAT SENDS HIM ON A RAMPAGE, IT IS SOMETHING THAT HAS REMAINED CONSISTENT THROUGH THE SEASON SO I doubt it is a character change


...And that's why I found this scene so amusing! Hank claims to follow a moral code of pacifism, yet abandons that code completely the moment something important is at stake! But then when things calm down, and he doesn't care as much, he reverts back to believing in pacifism. Basically, he clings to one failed philosophy while living by a different--and opposite!--set of rules.

Given that conflicted starting point, it seems very believable that Ultron would jump to the idea of creating peace by killing everything. After all, creating peace is important enough to warrant certain not-quite-peaceful actions, given the precendent shown.

[ktk]

good episode

-It was nice to see Wonder Man wavering about his loyalties

-Paste Pot Pete Hypno Hustler Chemistro was an odd choice, but there's nothing wrong with that. If you've got a thousand characters, we might as well see #973 once or twice.

-Wasp was as entertaining as always, with her snow parka plus hanging with Abomination for a while

-Enchantress has been one of the stars of the season!

-I have an elf giving me a funny look here.

[Medinnus]

-I have an elf giving me a funny look here.

"An elf... and elf with a GUN!"

Who can name that quote (not from AEMH). No fair using Google.

[Venom Melendez]

This is the beginning of the three-part Season One finale, and getting here has been a wild ride!

In other notes:

* The Living Laser, the Grey Gargoyle, and Chemistro have apparently joined the Masters of Evil.

* Was the Enchantress' betrayal of the Grey Gargoyle odered by Baron Zemo? Whether ordered or not, was it fatal? It would seem to me that the Enchantress might well have confined him for her own uses after their victory; he's too useful a tool to casually discard.

* The Grey Gargoyle's turning-to-stone has a twenty-four hour duration, at which point the victim reverts; I wonder if the Enchantress knows this, or if she's going to have a very angry Norn Queen to deal with shortly?

* Hawkeye still gets the best banter, with Wasp as second-best.

* Well, the Hulk manages a clean victory over the Executioner, and likes the axe. Clearly, Hulk is the strongest one there is!

It seemed clear that Zemo didn't order them to betray Grey Gargoyle. He asked afterall .


Amora was just using the Masters for Loki after all. Something Zemo anticipated it seems.

[Capt. Speedbump]

"An elf... and elf with a GUN!"

Who can name that quote (not from AEMH). No fair using Google.

Defenders Vol 1 No. 25 (not that I have the original, but the reprint in Essential Defenders #2).

[Medinnus]

Defenders Vol 1 No. 25 (not that I have the original, but the reprint in Essential Defenders #2).


Close enough!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elf_with_a_Gun

[dmxx116]

The Masters of Evil (now joined by Chemistro, Grey Gargoyle, and Living Laser) prepare for an invasion of Earth and unless the Avengers can stop them, the armies of Asgard are coming to Earth:

http://i.annihil.us/u/prod/marvel/i/mg/5/a0/4e6103c71e3b1.jpg

http://marvel.com/videos/watch/1996/the_avengers_emh_2010_season_1_-_ep_24