The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes "The Ultron Imperative" Talkback (Spoilers)

[James Harvey]

Discuss this all-new episode of The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes debuting today at 10:00am (ET) on Disney XD!

http://marvel.toonzone.net/avengersemh/talkback.jpg (http://marvel.toonzone.net/avengersemh/)
Click here (http://marvel.toonzone.net/avengersemh/reviews/23ultronimperative/) for more details on this episode!The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes "The Ultron Imperative"
Episode Premiere Date - June 5th, 2011
As the devastated team struggles with a loss, Ant-Man and Iron Man go about destroying all remnants of Ultron. But they don’t realize that Ultron has transcended his body, and has infiltrated the world’s computer systems. Because the only way to bring peace to Earth is to eliminate those who would cause chaos… and that’s all of humanity. Ultron has begun the end of the world.

Comments?

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[trance2009]

Ultron don't mess around, man. Able to extract codes from Maria Hill AND transform Hulk back into Banner with that ray. I did like how Hulk was like, "This is for Thor!" when he punched him.

[Vampire_King]

am i the only one that got the sense of dormammu due to the fire place at the end?

[Crash]

"Ultron, we would have words with thee."

You'd think, given Avengers history (See: Ultron Unlimited), that the above line would be the most baddass thing that could be said in an Avengers cartoon. But frankly, I felt Ultron himself had the most intimidating line of the episode. The chilling self-assurance in his voice when he told Hulk:

"No. You won't."


....And even here, Hawkeye is still good for a laugh.

"Wait, we had a plan?"

[Medinnus]

This is the second part of the Ultron story finale, continued from "Ultron-5".

The one disappointment to me was the way in which Ultron was defeated. I mean, when you have to leverage old classic Star Trek episodes (Star Trek Epsiode 37, Season 2: "The Changeling") to defeat the robot villain... still and all, a minor disappointment, as they did it exceedingly well.

Besides, Ultron taking control of the Iron Man armors was so cool, I'd forgive them a darn sight more than that...

In other notes:

* Thor shows true heroism in forsaking Amora's company so that he can help to save Earth; it takes a rare form of hero to say "No thanks" to the Enchantress!

* Ultron-5 was designated that as his production number, not his version number, but apparently the self-described Ultron-6 doesn't care; now they are version numbers.

* The Ultron armor clearly isn't made from adamantium yet, so Thor and Hulk can still damage it physically, if they do sufficient damage to make its self-repair inert.

* So far Ultron shows no signs of his Oedipus Complex, which was Ultron's dominant characteristics in the storylines in MU 616 continuity.

* Iron Man armor suits seen in this episode:
-- Heavy-duty Iron Man armor
-- Iron Man "Stealth" armor
-- Iron Man "Grey 60's" armor - this suit is grey like the Mark I, but has the appearance of the Iron Armor from the early 1960's, with the raised facemask. If the first grey armor was the Mark I, and a gold version of the Mark I the Mark II, I'm going to call this the Mark III armor.
-- The "Silver Centurion" armor.
-- The "1970's" armor.
-- The Mark VI armor

* Presumably the Ultron "cure" for the Hulk isn't permanent. It would be interesting if Iron Man can take that technology and construct a Hulk failsafe device in his own armor (or as a stand-alone device).

[Avengers]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_Gd8NBIma-zo/THFdmrQNGZI/AAAAAAAAOiI/Tmz-Dtnq8nA/s640/Avengers+-+iwouldhavewordswiththee.JPG

thank you for being pure awesome

[RoyalRubble]

Ultron returns this episode, and now he's even more dangerous than before. While his body was destroyed in the previous episode, he managed to upload his artificial intelligence into another body, unbeknownst to the Avengers. Now, he has taken control over satellites and missile launching bases around the world, with his final stop being the SHIELD helicarrier, where he declares that the end of the world has begun. His goal has remained the same, bringing peace to the world by eliminating all of humankind. Once again, he keeps the Avengers busy by infiltrating the mansion's computer systems, and activating and controlling all of Iron Man's armors that were available. He also builds himself a new body, now calling himself Ultron-6. Once he arrives aboard the SHIELD helicarrier, he scans Director Hill's mind and learns the access codes to the entire SHIELD arsenal. He launches all the nuclear missiles at once, claiming that all life on the planet would cease to exist. The Avengers try to stop him, but he is more than a match for them this time. Ultron's speech about him ending all life on Earth and his replies to each of the Avengers were definitely the highlight of this episode for me.

The way the characters were presented this episode was great. All of them are still shocked they lost Thor in their previous battle. Captain America is missing from this episode, as a consequence to the first Ultron attack. Ant-Man blames himself for all that has happened because Ultron was his creation. Tony mentions that he is also guilty, as he was the one who wanted to use Ultron units as weapons, and they both realize that all this happened after they used Ultron to defeat Kang (see "The Kang Dynasty"). Hank reveals that his own brain patterns were the basis for Ultron's artificial intelligence, and devises a plan to stop him once and for all. Tony once again uses his old-school armor to fight with, and together with the Hulk and Wasp arrive on the SHIELD helicarrier to fight Ultron. Hulk is ready to fight Ultron, claiming that if he smashed him once, he can do it again (and I loved that when Hulk first punches Ultron, he mentions that it was for what he did to Thor). Unfortunately Ultron has perfected a new weapon, that allows him to absorb the Gamma radiation from the Hulk, and turn him back into Bruce Banner, who is unable to fight him.

It is revealed what exactly happened to Thor at the end of the previous episode. He was actually saved from Ultron's blast by the Enchantress, who wished they could spend the rest of their lives together. Of course she uses her magic to help convince Thor to stay with her, but Thor realizes he still has to protect Midgard and forces her to send him back. Angered, Amora sends him back to Midgard, claiming that it would be a fate worse than death for him. It would appear that this was not part of Loki's plans and Amora was actually acting on her own. Once Thor is back, he defeats the controlled Iron Man armors and together with the others attacks Ultron on the helicarrier. While his hammer is able to damage the robot, it would seem that Ultron now can repair himself instantly. Another one of Ultron's upgrades is the ability to actually hurt Wasp (as the previous version wasn't allowed). That is when Ant-Man arrives and enters the robot's head, trying to upload a program inside. Ultron mentions that no virus can defeat him; but Ant-man isn't using a virus, he's using logic. Soon after Ultron shuts down, and Hank explains what happened. Since Ultron was based on the human mind, he himself is flawed and not perfect, and cannot exist in his own imperative. And I loved the way Wasp congratulates Hank for how he stopped Ultron, "You saved the world. With science, even!". :D

Lots of great moments mixed between all the fighting and drama featured in this episode. It was cool seeing all the various Iron Man armors in this episode, and Hawkeye gets a great line after Ultron is defeated, "Wait, we had a plan?". Overall, this was a great episode and an amazing way to finish the Ultron arc, which was present throughout most of the series. There is obviously a chance that Ultron will return in future episode, though. The way this episode ended with Thor mentioning that something worse than Ultron is about to happen, most likely foreshadows Loki's plans coming together. Looking forward to that.

[Gold Guy]

Okay, this episode was awesome. Just plain awesome. An episode of Avengers hasn't been this exciting and action-packed since maybe the two-parter with Graviton. Ultron, wow, he's hardcore. He was destroying the whole team, SHIELD, and the world all at the same time. Awesome. The fight scene was cool, and Ultron can really take a beating.

The end cliffhanger wasn't as good as usual, but this episode was so amazing that I don't even mind.

[Munkiman]

I really liked how Tony admitted that Ultron was his fault as much as Hank's - everyone was so ready to blame Hank last week, it's nice to see Tony trying to make Hank feel better.

The idea that Kang's technology may have corrupted Ultron is interesting, though the time of Kang's invasion was also when Hank programmed violence into Ultron's system - more likely it was the contradiction between the imperative to create peace and the capacity to destroy that made Ultron go crazy.

The attack of the Iron Man armors was awesome. It was really cool to see all the different armors in the show's style. I liked how they added little details to the original red and gold armor so it didn't just look like it had big gold sleeves.

It is inexplicably awesome whenever Tony puts on the Mark I armor. Even kicking ass in analog!

Ultron's mind-scan tentacles are incredibly freaky. Hill's bugged-out eyes and screaming did not help.

"THIS IS FOR THOR!" :D

The energy shield and hand-beams suggest that Ultron's been stealing from Iron Man's tech, which isn't a good thing...

And Ultron has a gamma-draining ray. Also not good!

"Not a missile. All of them." That is pretty crazy, not to mention that Ultron doesn't just threaten to do this, he actually launches the missiles. I had no idea how the Avengers were going to win this one, crazy suspenseful. Kind of an "I did it thirty-five ago" moment: "This is not a threat. There is nothing you can do to stop it. The process has already begun. "

Thor's back! :D

Ultron is like the most dangerous enemy the Avengers have faced. He even regenerates! How the hell did he do that? Damned invincible robot with control of all technology on Earth.

"That's what the Avengers do. We save the world." Imminent nuclear holocaust? No problem for Earth's Mightiest Heroes! This is why I love this show.

Hank's logic thing was pretty awesome. Saving the world with science! He even seemed a little sad when he said goodbye to Ultron, which is interesting. Is it that Hank was more sad than angry that his creation had gone bad, or did he feel that even Ultron deserved better than death?

Fantastic episode, even better than "Ultron-5."

[macattack]

Wow, Ultron was able to turn Hulk back into Bruce Banner. This has repercussions especially if this reversion turns out to be permanent for the time being. Considering what's coming next, how can Bruce Banner assist the Avengers? In different ways than the Hulk can, I'm sure.

This was one heck of a battle there, and you can see that Maria's skepticism and hostility towards the Avengers has some merit. After all, Ultron is Hank Pym's (and to a lesser extent, Tony Stark's) responsibility. Ultron nearly blew up the world, so the Avengers were doing nothing but cleaning up the mess they made in Hill's eyes, and you can see why she would think that.

Ultron is a really good villain in the right hands, and Tom Kane has the Ultron voice perfected. This utterly obliterates the previous Avengers series' interpretation of Ultron which just did not work at all.

[ShadowStar]

The end cliffhanger wasn't as good as usual, but this episode was so amazing that I don't even mind.
What cliffhanger?

[King_of_doom]

Wow, Ultron was able to turn Hulk back into Bruce Banner. This has repercussions especially if this reversion turns out to be permanent for the time being. Considering what's coming next, how can Bruce Banner assist the Avengers? In different ways than the Hulk can, I'm sure. .

I doubt the effects will last, Ultron use that so it can give him time since the Hulk's threat to his plan he somehow come with ray that will turn the Hulk into Bruce Banner temporary.

[Mr. Hypocrite]

I really liked how Tony admitted that Ultron was his fault as much as Hank's - everyone was so ready to blame Hank last week, it's nice to see Tony trying to make Hank feel better.

Yeah. That was a nice move by Tony. I think he's well aware that this may be partially his fault as well. Or at least he did once things cooled down.


The idea that Kang's technology may have corrupted Ultron is interesting, though the time of Kang's invasion was also when Hank programmed violence into Ultron's system - more likely it was the contradiction between the imperative to create peace and the capacity to destroy that made Ultron go crazy.

This makes a lot of sense, especially when you consider that Hank is going through the same thing. he can't deal with the contradiction of wanting to do things peacefully, but having to use violence to accomplish anything. It no wonder Ultron went crazy. His creator is dealing with the same problem.



"Not a missile. All of them." That is pretty crazy, not to mention that Ultron doesn't just threaten to do this, he actually launches the missiles. I had no idea how the Avengers were going to win this one, crazy suspenseful. Kind of an "I did it thirty-five ago" moment: "This is not a threat. There is nothing you can do to stop it. The process has already begun. "

Yeah. With Ultron, there is only one ending. Everyone dies. No threats. He's well past that point.



This was one heck of a battle there, and you can see that Maria's skepticism and hostility towards the Avengers has some merit. After all, Ultron is Hank Pym's (and to a lesser extent, Tony Stark's) responsibility. Ultron nearly blew up the world, so the Avengers were doing nothing but cleaning up the mess they made in Hill's eyes, and you can see why she would think that.

Yeah. As much as we were all ripping on her during Hail Hydra, it's easy to see where she's coming from with her distrust of the Avengers. Even Hank couldn't ignore the reprecussions of what he did.

[HEATXZ]

Great episode :anime:
It had great action scenes,Good to see Thor is back :anime:

[jph139]

I dunno, I felt this one was a little formulaic compared to last week - down to the "make the logical being destroy itself via logic" and "giant map of the world with missiles slowly moving and a countdown clock." Definitely a bit cliché - not that I mind. The Iron Man suits attacking was a pretty cool fight, though I think that happened in the Fantastic Four cartoon, too... even so, always nice to see, and I REALLY liked the Hulkbuster design here (assuming it was the Hulkbuster). Hopefully they get to use that again somewhere down the line.

Looking forward to next week; Ultron was fun, but I think I preferred Kang and the Leader as far as multi-part baddies go. Only a few episodes left, so, I'm betting things will come to a boil next week!

[Webbed-Wonder]

"Ultron, we would have words with thee."

'Nuff said. :D

[redlion]

I just love this show. Sooo awesome! I really felt sorry for Hank when he began to consider that his own brain pattern could've been the reason for Ultron's betrayal. You could really hear the pain and doubt in his voice.

The attack of the Ironman armors!! That fight in Avengers mansion was off the charts. It's always cool to see Tony in the Mark 1 armor. Hawkeye and Panther were hilarious and fun to watch. Loved it when Hawkeye tells Tony that he and Panther can handle the armors by themselves. The look Panther gives Clint and he says, "Yeah, I know.....I'm dumb." Great!!

The fight on the Helicarrier, so intense. Hulk getting changed back to Banner. Tony showing courage in the face of inevitable death after Ultron rips the Mark 1 armor off. He looks at Ultron as if to say, Okay.....get it over with but I'm not begging. Thor saving the day at first but then getting totally owned by Ultron....WITH ONE ARM!! "Ultron....We would have words with thee!" The dialogue was killer in this episode. So many quotables:D Hank saving the day by downloading Logic in Ultron's CPU...fantastic!! Great action this episode without a doubt.

Ultron has always been one of my most favorite Avengers' villians. This has been the best animated version of Ultron yet, imo. This has been the best multiparter of the whole season so far as far as I'm concerned.

[ktk]

Another outstanding episode!

The scenes of all of the IM armors attacking was great. Now if only we'd get to see Tony actually wear those in an episode or two. :p So much for any question over the old "only 3 suits of armor" line.

The big battle with Ultron (again) was great, as was Thor's return. Definitely gotta rank Ultron above Gravitron and the Leader. he's right up there with Kang.

The ending tease wasn't much this episode, though I'll agree it wasn't needed after such an action packed episode. The one thing that threw me off was the part where the shot focused on the fire. Was that perhaps a hint that its not Loki, or its more than just Loki? Perhaps Surtur or Mephisto? That'd be a twist.

[supergirl's pal]

A very awesome episode overall.
Even though its a Hollywood cliche, pulling the pin out of a grenade with your teeth will actually cause serious dental damage. However, Maria Hill cemented her image as a bad ass character when she did that while fighting Ultron.

[JTMarsh]

Another great episode. Finally, some Thor Vs. Ultron action! I've been waiting for that since 'Next Avengers' gave Thor the SR treatment.

Jan's "You saved the world! With science even!" was another favorite moment.

[Manhunter]

Jan's "You saved the world! With science even!" was another favorite moment.

Which Hill ruined. She may have been right, but, to paraphrase Tony Stark, she was being a real jerk about it.

Thor/Enchantress: Guess Thor never heard the old saying "Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned."

"This is for Thor!" A new favorite Hulk quote.

[Medinnus]

Thor/Enchantress: Guess Thor never heard the old saying "Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned."


He probably thought it was "Hela hath no fury like a woman scorned", shrugged, and commented "Been there. Seen that. Not worried."

[JTMarsh]

Which Hill ruined. She may have been right, but, to paraphrase Tony Stark, she was being a real jerk about it.

Hill ruins everything. Hopefully if we all ignore her maybe she'll go away. ;)

[Mr. Hypocrite]

In Everything is wonderful, Hank calls out Tony on his actions.

Tony: Everything I do is to help people!
Hank: Everything you do is to clean up a mess you made!

Now look on the events of the Ultron two parter.

Hank saves the world, but it was only in danger because of him. Kind of funny.

[TheVileOne]

It was really only in danger because Jan convinced him to use the Ultron robots to fight against Kang . . . but they were on the ropes so I guess it was the only option at the time ;) . Oh well, I still want to blame The Wasp anyway :) .

[Rick Jones]

It was really only in danger because Jan convinced him to use the Ultron robots to fight against Kang . . . but they were on the ropes so I guess it was the only option at the time ;) . Oh well, I still want to blame The Wasp anyway :) .Couldn't Hank reset the original programming after that crisis was over just to play it safe ?

[Medinnus]

Couldn't Hank reset the original programming after that crisis was over just to play it safe ?

I'd have thought that resetting the surviving Ultrons to pacifist mode would have been his first thought, yeah.

[jph139]

I'd have thought that resetting the surviving Ultrons to pacifist mode would have been his first thought, yeah.

Well, they're thinking robots - I don't think it's like a computer you can just reboot. It has a human brain, and you can't "unteach" something as fundamental as the concept of violence.

[Medinnus]

Well, they're thinking robots - I don't think it's like a computer you can just reboot. It has a human brain, and you can't "unteach" something as fundamental as the concept of violence.

Sure you can - replace the hardware with one loaded with the original programming set.

[suss2it]

Ultron is a badass villain. I can't wait to see more of this guy in the future. I do feel bad for Hank knowing that this monster is based on his own brain. So now that he's officially off the team, I wonder if they'll bring in another Giant-Man like Scott Lang.

The Iron Men vs. the Avengers was a pretty cool fight. It was cool to see other Iron Man armours.

Thor's return was also great. I thought he'd be dead longer, but I'm not complaining. That guy is epic. Hopefully he doesn't die again anytime in the future.

Maria Hill wasn't annoyingly stupid in this episode. I hope she remains that way. She's no replacement for Nick Fury, but in this more reasonable state of mind, I can at least tolerate her.


It was really only in danger because Jan convinced him to use the Ultron robots to fight against Kang . . . but they were on the ropes so I guess it was the only option at the time ;) . Oh well, I still want to blame The Wasp anyway :) .

Why, what do you have against the Wasp?

[Medinnus]

Ultron is a badass villain. I can't wait to see more of this guy in the future. I do feel bad for Hank knowing that this monster is based on his own brain.

Well, depending on how much they follow the "Hank Pym Story (tm)"....


Hank Pym has to leave the Avengers so that he can have his nervous breakdown, and become the costumed devil-may-care hero known far and wide (or at least to the MU616) as Yellowjacket (which Wally Wingert has already told us will happen). So, Scott Lang or Bill Foster joining the team would be cut short, and besides, with Janet able to go queen-size ("Does this outfit make me look fat?"), they'd also be redundant. I'd rather see some other heroes rather than Hank Pym re-treads).



Thor's return was also great. I thought he'd be dead longer, but I'm not complaining.

Well, he didn't die this time; he was taken by the Enchantress, we now know.


Maria Hill wasn't annoyingly stupid in this episode. I hope she remains that way. She's no replacement for Nick Fury, but in this more reasonable state of mind, I can at least tolerate her.

Nah, I want her to precipitate Civil War with the Avengers, without Iron Man being the bad guy. Maybe we can even have Sentinels on-loan from the MRD. Maybe its a perfect wedge issue to justify more mutant guest-stars.


Why, what do you have against the Wasp?

I can think of several things I'd like to have against her... /rimshot

[suss2it]

Well, he didn't die this time; he was taken by the Enchantress, we now know.True he didn't die, but I meant I thought he'd be gone from the show longer.


Nah, I want her to precipitate Civil War with the Avengers, without Iron Man being the bad guy. Maybe we can even have Sentinels on-loan from the MRD. Maybe its a perfect wedge issue to justify more mutant guest-stars.The whole point of "Civil War" was that it was Iron Man vs. Captain America, heroes vs. heroes. Hill doesn't meet either criteria.

[Medinnus]

True he didn't die, but I meant I thought he'd be gone from the show longer.

The whole point of "Civil War" was that it was Iron Man vs. Captain America, heroes vs. heroes. Hill doesn't meet either criteria.

According to who? BENDIS? Marvel Editorial? Cite your source, and if its just your opinion, I have a divergent one.

The central point of "Civil War" was that it was an excuse to do fanboy hero vs. hero battles; it held just enough logic for that purpose, and one has to not look at the plotline really deeply or the cracks become apparent.

For our purposes, lets see look at some of the possibilities... SHIELD asks Congress to pass the SHRA, which is the equivalent to the Mutant Registration Act. There are a lot of heroes SHIELD can co-opt at that point:

* It allows the establishment of the Thunderbolts without needing the X-Men or Onslaught (et al). Villains adopt new personas to avoid a public relations nightmare while earning pardons by beating down the Avengers.

* It allows SHIELD to recruit more heroes for their SHIELD Super Agent program, and allows some romantic tension between SHIELD Agent Mockingbird and Avenger Hawkeye. At this stage in the game, the AEMH universe is really small; think how many people who eventually became Avengers could be introduced this way!

* It allows SHIELD to re-empower Thunderbolt Ross and his Hulkbusters.

* It allows SHIELD to introduce either/both Roxxon/Brand or the Hammer Corporation, and all the Iron Man villains that Justin Hammer enabled.

* It allows Nick Fury to come back and recind the SHRA because "they don't have time for this, Hill! We have an alien invasion to deal with! Stand down!*"

The possibilities are endless, without having to make any of the Avengers defacto villains.

* Am I the only one sick to death of "Stand down!" being the only way SHIELD seems to be able to communicate? Talk about over-used phrases!

[dmxx116]

The team is devastated by the loss of Thor. Iron Man and Ant-Man go about destroying all remnants of Ultron unaware that Ultron has transcended his body, and has taken over the world's technology systems. So it up to The Avengers to stop Ultron before he destroy the whole planet:

http://i.annihil.us/u/prod/marvel/i/mg/6/a0/4e5821ef2b476.jpg

http://marvel.com/videos/watch/1988/the_avengers_emh_2010_season_1-_ep_23