The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes "Everything is Wonderful" Talkback (Spoilers)

[James Harvey]

Discuss the all-new episode of The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes debuting tonight at 8:30pm (ET) on Disney XD!

http://marvel.toonzone.net/avengersemh/talkback.jpg (http://marvel.toonzone.net/avengersemh/)The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes "Everything is Wonderful"
Episode Premiere Date: November 10th, 2010
A business decision by Tony Stark leads rival Simon Williams to go to extreme measures for revenge… he seeks help from the Grim Reaper and AIM. Now transformed into the ionic powered Wonder Man, Simon takes the fight back to Tony Stark! But the only one there to defend Tony is the one Avenger who dislikes him the most… Ant-Man. Has Tony Stark changed? PLUS! Wasp and Thor versus MODOC!

Comments?

Note: Please keep discussion on-topic, please. Thank you.

[CyclonatorZ]

Sounds like this episode will have a great plot. I'm curious as to how the Wasp/Thor and Modok fight will be incorporated into the main story - perhaps the latter will be a diversion that will keep the former two busy while Wonder Man takes on Tony Stark. That would leave only Captain America to "conviniently" distract with some ordeal, narrowing down Tony's allies to just Ant-man like it was described in the summary. ;)

[trance2009]

This is why I somewhat dig Marvel a little more than DC. Many of their heroes were former villains until they realized what they were doing kinda sucked.

[Venom Melendez]

Poor Wonderman.

Also, i freaking love how they did MODOK.

[Azrayel]

I'm such an idiot, I didn't even figure out Simon was Wonderman :p

Well Wonderman wasn't the greatest villian in the show, but I liked how he was a villian and I kinda felt sorry for him after all that trouble he went through for nothing real.

[AdamYJ]

Yay, Wonder Man! (He's my favorite Avenger).

It's so unfortunate what happened to him, with his company being bought out and becoming an ionic being and all. And he still didn't get to learn that Tony was really trying to help him.

I'm glad it turned out that Simon wasn't gone in the end. Usually, when Wonder Man "dies" (he's done it twice in the comics) it takes a few years for him to come back. Guess the timetable is moved up for this show. :D

Also, for the first time in a long time (if not ever) we get MODOK as something other than a henchman.

[M.O.D.O.K.]

Also, for the first time in a long time (if not ever) we get MODOK as something other than a henchman.

MODOK quickly rebelled and took over AIM the moment he woke up in Iron Man: Armored Adventures.

[AdamYJ]

MODOK quickly rebelled and took over AIM the moment he woke up in Iron Man: Armored Adventures.

I don't have Nicktoons Network, so I never saw it.

I mainly know MODOK from his roles in the '90s Iron Man series and Superhero Squad.

[M.O.D.O.K.]

I don't have Nicktoons Network, so I never saw it.

I mainly know MODOK from his roles in the '90s Iron Man series and Superhero Squad.

You didn't miss much. After that appearance I mentioned, he got punked by the Controller, of all people.

[Venom Melendez]

Yay, Wonder Man! (He's my favorite Avenger).

It's so unfortunate what happened to him, with his company being bought out and becoming an ionic being and all. And he still didn't get to learn that Tony was really trying to help him.

I'm glad it turned out that Simon wasn't gone in the end. Usually, when Wonder Man "dies" (he's done it twice in the comics) it takes a few years for him to come back. Guess the timetable is moved up for this show. :D

Also, for the first time in a long time (if not ever) we get MODOK as something other than a henchman.

Nah, Iron Man Armored Adventures had him running AIM too. But yeah, it's great cartoons are using him as head of AIM.

I also liked that he prepared his based as a get away ship. The guy is prepared.

[.c.h.r.i.s.]

it's great cartoons are using him as head of AIM.

literally.

[Mad Hatter]

"You're able to expand to ions? That's incredible!"

That line finally made me realize something. This series is a serious competitor greatest Marvel series ever. It's surpassed the 90's Spider-Man series in my opinion, and it's close to the 90's X-Men series. It's tied with X-Man: Evolution, and it passed Wolverine and the X-Men tonight (and for the record, I loved that series). It still has to catch up to Spectacular Spider-Man, but it might get there by the end of the season. This is awesome. That line, Wasp's lines, the interactions between the various characters, MODOK, Wonder Man (and the comic geek fact that he and Grim Reaper are brothers), and pretty much everything in this series is entirely awesome!

By the way, has anyone else realized that only two of 74 villains have been caught? I mean, so far we've seen:

Baron Zemo
Arnim Zola
Baron Strucker
Grim Reaper
MODOK
Technovore
Wendigo
Purple Man
Crimson Dynamo
Blizzard
Chemistro
Whiplash
Living Laser
Leader
Abomination
Absorbing Man
Zzzax
Wrecker
Piledriver
Thunderball
Bulldozer
Red Ghost
Cobra
Griffin
Radioactive Man
Vector
Vapor
X-Ray
Ironclad
Madman
Bi-Beast
Whirlwind
Grey Gargoyle
Mandrill
and Graviton

YEAH. That's a lot. To count, that's 35. That means there are still 39 more villains to see and 72 villains to catch. And STILL, we haven't even considered Man-Ape, Klaw, Doughboy, Red Skull, Lucia von Bardas, Ymir, Doctor Doom, Enchantress, Executioner, and, of course, Loki. And those are just the VILLAINS. I'm not counting the heroes or the non-powered allies.

This. Show. Will. Be. Awesome.

[Venom Melendez]

"You're able to expand to ions? That's incredible!"

That line finally made me realize something. This series is a serious competitor greatest Marvel series ever. It's surpassed the 90's Spider-Man series in my opinion, and it's close to the 90's X-Men series. It's tied with X-Man: Evolution, and it passed Wolverine and the X-Men tonight (and for the record, I loved that series). It still has to catch up to Spectacular Spider-Man, but it might get there by the end of the season. This is awesome. That line, Wasp's lines, the interactions between the various characters, MODOK, Wonder Man (and the comic geek fact that he and Grim Reaper are brothers), and pretty much everything in this series is entirely awesome!

By the way, has anyone else realized that only two of 74 villains have been caught? I mean, so far we've seen:

Baron Zemo
Arnim Zola
Baron Strucker
Grim Reaper
MODOK
Technovore
Wendigo
Purple Man
Crimson Dynamo
Blizzard
Chemistro
Whiplash
Living Laser
Leader
Abomination
Absorbing Man
Zzzax
Wrecker
Piledriver
Thunderball
Bulldozer
Red Ghost
Cobra
Griffin
Radioactive Man
Vector
Vapor
X-Ray
Ironclad
Madman
Bi-Beast
Whirlwind
Grey Gargoyle
Mandrill
and Graviton

YEAH. That's a lot. To count, that's 35. That means there are still 39 more villains to see and 72 villains to catch. And STILL, we haven't even considered Man-Ape, Klaw, Doughboy, Red Skull, Lucia von Bardas, Ymir, Doctor Doom, Enchantress, Executioner, and, of course, Loki. And those are just the VILLAINS. I'm not counting the heroes or the non-powered allies.

This. Show. Will. Be. Awesome.

You forgot Mad Thinker.

But yeah, i am loving this series.

[Marvin Tikvah]

Is there any reason the closed captions typed his name out as MODOC as opposed tot he traditional K ending?

The episode itself was okay. It had some good fights, and it looks like the writers are starting to dabble with sub-plots and intersecting stories now. I've been pretty patient with the series and it seems to be paying off. The ending with Enchantress reviving and drafting Wonder Man seems to be building toward something big. Can't wait to see what comes of this.

Black Panther next week. Hopefully it doesn't suffer from slow pacing like Cap's episode did.

[Monte]

Another good ep overall, i'm really loving Jan in episodes and i do like some of the small jokes... Modok really does look silly

But really, Stark has got to work on his people skills... might help to talk to people BEFORE you save their company by taking it over and making it a part of your own. Though we did get to learn what Hank's problem with Tony is. Also I guess Hank and Janet may not be an item just yet... And it seems team Evil has got there Anti-Iron man... now we need the Anti-Antman, the Anti-Wasp, and the Anti-hulk... and also the Anti-Hawkman and Anti-Black Panter if they plan on joining anytime soon.


Is there any reason the closed captions typed his name out as MODOC as opposed tot he traditional K ending?


I didn't see the closed captions, but I can think of one possible reason
MODOK (Mental Organism Designed Only for Killing)
Which word there do you think might not be DisneyXD friendly? :shrug:

Y'know though, It is actually a little bit odd how quickly some of these super villains are getting back in business... you'd think it would take month's to set up a lab, hire minions and start designing and selling weapons.

[MetroSparkster]

I see the closed captions, but I can think of one possible reason
MODOK (Mental Organism Designed Only for Killing)
Which word there do you think might not be DisneyXD friendly? :shrug:

Actually, he was called "Mobile Organism Designed Only for Computing" before he obtained the K...

[Webbed-Wonder]

Great episode, I loved seeing AIM along with an awesome MODOK. I know I saw the Cosmic Cube behind MODOK in one shot.:D

[TheVileOne]

He's called MODOC now because the K has been changed to a C for CONQUEST. MODOC even says "DESIGNED ONLY FOR CONQUEST!" in this episode.

[RoyalRubble]

Great episode. I especially liked Thor's lines in this episode.

"I tire of these geeks."
"That is a giant head. It's like a frost giant's head on an infant's body."

I only knew about Wonder Man from the 90s Avengers series (so I guess I could say I didn't know anything about him). He looked cooler here anyway. And had some pretty cool powers as well. So now he joins the Enchantress group, and I see Zemo also accepted her proposal from the last episode (would have been interesting to see if Zemo turned out to be against Loki).

Other than that we got another reference to Ultron, who I hope we'll get to see soon. And then the Vision. And so on. :D

[Maniaxe]

I loved Thor's lines in this ep. but what I thought this ep really did well was show just what hurdles this team has to overcome to be a real team.

TONY: Good intentions, but he goes about them in ways that make him look cold hearted.
HANK: Naive. He's spent so much time in the lab that he's forgotten how reality works, and that people aren't ants.
THOR: For all his talk about the "purity" of Midgard, it's obvious he doesn't understand it very well yet, Plus his growing dislike of scientists.
JANET: Too gung-ho. Still may see this as something of a game.
CAP: Still getting used to the era he's foun himself in, not sure if this si the right path.

I can see a possible schism growing between Hank and his teammates, but I also see a big bullet fromr eality coming at him (this bullet is named Ultron). Thor will probablt get help with his problem from Jane Foster, as a paramedic, she works with medical devices all the time.

[Baron Zemo]

Well, from one of the earlier TV spots we know who at least two more of the Masters are:
http://img600.imageshack.us/img600/8786/masterso.jpg
Between those four, Enchantress and Executioner that's a pretty powerful group.

[Rick Jones]

Well, from one of the earlier TV spots we know who at least two more of the Masters are:
http://img600.imageshack.us/img600/8786/masterso.jpg
Between those four, Enchantress and Executioner that's a pretty powerful group.According to Chris Yost, Radioactive Man might also be involved.

[Blackstar]

Good episode this week. I felt, not only for Simon Williams (Wonder Man), but for Tony as well. having a bad reputation that follows him wherever he goes. Even when he tries to help people, they still assume that he's being a jerk. I can definitely relate to that.

MODOK, or should it be MODOC (Mobile Organism Designed Only for Conquest) here, was hilarious, especially how Wasp and Thor couldn't stop ripping on his giant head.

I wonder if this "pure ionic energy" look is how Wonder Man is going to be depicted here, or is he going to regain his human form with his trademark sunglasses later on in the series?

[Venom Melendez]

He's called MODOC now because the K has been changed to a C for CONQUEST. MODOC even says "DESIGNED ONLY FOR CONQUEST!" in this episode.


Which is odd, since they have used they words "die" and "kill". Though Conques does make more sense in a way.

Still, i do love what they did with him and his Psionic blaster seems like it packs a punch.

[Triant]

I'm surprised at how much I'm getting into this show. It's really slick, and I got pulled in right away.

It's been following the original issues of Avengers (from the 60s) with a modern spin on them.

Issue 1: Avengers form with IM, Thor, Ant-Man, Wasp, and Hulk
Issue 2: Hank goes Giant-Man, Hulk leaves team
Issue 3-4, They find Cap, he joins, ect.

I don't think it will be a strictly 1:1 ratio from comics to episodes, and Black Panther is coming in a little earlier than he does in comic-Avengers history, but it's close.

And last night's episode set a lot of things up. I'm putting speculative spoilers behind the hidden box.

In last night's episode:

Hank, to Tony: (paraphrased) "Ultron was my experiment to map the human brain to a computer."

This sets up Ultron for later, and Ultron's first plan.

Simon Williams/Wonder Man got the upgrade from human right to his 90s-era Ionic Energy form. Interesting take, and he was saved from dissolution by Enchantress' magic. And I think I know how it's going to play out.

The Masters of Evil attack (Enchantress, Executioner, Abomination, Crimson Dynamo, Wonder Man, maybe some others). Simon will have a change of heart, but defying the Enchantress will break her spell, and it'll become a Heroic Sacrifice. Somehow, Tony/Hank will be able to save/store Simon's energy/engrams.

Then, Ultron gains sentience/independence/becomes evil, and his first plot is to create an android to kill the Avengers. Thing is, Ultron maps a human mind to the android, and since it probably has access to Stark and Pym's database, he'll use Simon's.

Which is sort-of how it happens in the comic, which ends up creating The Vision.

All we're missing at this point is Quicksilver and the Scarlet Witch (who in the comics, join with Hawkeye as 'Cap's Kooky Quartet'.)

[capfan1]

I enjoyed this show but it was'nt as good as the first 4 episodes.Am I the only one who don't really care for the Wasp?I don't like her design or her child like behavior.I would much rather see Ms.Marvel,but soon I hope.We will see a few new heroes according to wikipedia,I'm excited about that.I'm hoping Cap will play a bigger part in the upcoming episodes as he was only a small part of this episode.

[Venom Melendez]

I'm surprised at how much I'm getting into this show. It's really slick, and I got pulled in right away.

It's been following the original issues of Avengers (from the 60s) with a modern spin on them.




Actually, it has been using Avengers elements from all periods. From the old stuff to the recent stories.

The show is also doing it's own thing(In this show it seems Hulk eventually does rejoin the team).


I enjoyed this show but it was'nt as good as the first 4 episodes.Am I the only one who don't really care for the Wasp?I

Well, alot of people think she's one of the best things about the Show. Also, She's a founding member, so of course she's going to show up before Ms.Marvel(Who'll show up eventually anyway). The costume isn't bad either.

Also, she is the youngest one on the team. Relly, i think she's pretty awesome.



Well, from one of the earlier TV spots we know who at least two more of the Masters are:
http://img600.imageshack.us/img600/8786/masterso.jpg
Between those four, Enchantress and Executioner that's a pretty powerful group.



With Dynamo and Wonder Man, you have two guys gunning for Stark.With Abomination with them, Hulk probably has returned by that point.
That also seems to be Zola's lair.

[Video Beagle]

Is there any reason the closed captions typed his name out as MODOC as opposed tot he traditional K ending?
.

This, as are most "kid friendly" versions is MODOC, not MODOK. He mentioned it during his rant "Designed Only for Conquest"

EDIT: Which I see was covered.

With Simon's growing powers and such, it's setting up, or at least referencing Atlas/Goliath/Eric Josten who is ionic based and has growth powers.

As for people not likeing the Wasp. Frankly, I'd like them just to have a Hank & Janet show, where he just science geeks on everything while she snarks about it..


I'm glad it turned out that Simon wasn't gone in the end. Usually, when Wonder Man "dies" (he's done it twice in the comics) it takes a few years for him to come back.

Well, it's frankly what he does in his intro story. His shtick.


. Also I guess Hank and Janet may not be an item just yet...

I took it more as Tony playing on Hank's insecurities "You know, I'm freakin' Tony Stark and I can take your girl if I wanted to." He's kind of a jerk like that.

[Venom Melendez]

With Simon's growing powers and such, it's setting up, or at least referencing Atlas/Goliath/Eric Josten who is ionic based and has growth powers.

.



Not really, because Wonder Man can do that too.


So they aren't referencing Goliath, they are just doing Wonder Man. Heck, Goliath's spot in the Masters seems to be filled by someone else.

[Video Beagle]

Not really, because Wonder Man can do that too.


Ah. Never seen Simon grow. Ok.


on MODOK vs MODOC from last nite's livechat:


Josh Fine: Simply put, he's not really designed for Killing in this series. He's dangerous to be sure, but his main purpose is to lead AIM to world dominance by way of science!


Josh Fine: In reality he's designed mostly for Science, but MODOS sounds kind of lame...

[maczero]

Well, alot of people think she's one of the best things about the Show. Also, She's a founding member, so of course she's going to show up before Ms.Marvel(Who'll show up eventually anyway). The costume isn't bad either.I like Wasp but I would recommend a costume change. Isn't she known for numerous costume changes over her career? Anyway, the skirt bugs me (no pun intended).


Ah. Never seen Simon grow. Ok.
Me neither. If he has done it before then it's probably an ability that he has lost because I can't remember seeing him doing it. And I've been reading Marvel for nearly 20 years.

[Video Beagle]

I like Wasp but I would recommend a costume change. Isn't she known for numerous costume changes over her career? .

They said at the insta-chat that she (and everyone) would have some costume changes, but economics make her being the clothes horse she is in the comics impossible.

[TheVileOne]

You can't change costumes in animation every week in animation due to the character models and animation budgets.

Anyone know who voices MODOC in this series?

I forget was Hank Pym's brain mapped for Ultron originally in the comics? Or is different in this series? Whose brain do you think Stark and Pym mapped for the Ultron project?

[RoyalRubble]

Anyone know who voices MODOC in this series?
Wally Wingert, who's also the voice of Ant-Man.

[Wonderwall]

Wasn't really thrilled with this one. It felt really rushed and disjointed. I liked aspects of it but together it didn't feel like a cohesive episode.

I liked Thor and Jan taking on AIM and MODOC( as he is designed for conquest than killing which makes more sense ) was fun but they had almost nothing to do with the Wonderman plot and didn't help in the fight. Cap and Fury was also nice as it continued Cap struggle with being around but that didn't seem to get enough time and really felt out of place in this one too as he just shows up to block a laser.

As for the main plot I thought the beginning was again rushed, with Tony buying a company from a guy that the audience hasn't met yet but comes off like there's some history there. Tony also came off kind of dumb, was it too hard to get up and try to stop the guy from leaving or make a call? I know it's too make him look like he has poor people skills but that seemed extreme that he couldn't stop playing with that sphere.

Also Simon seemed to resort to super powers a little too quickly before trying..well anything else. If it had been done against his will it would have made more sense but here he hadn't even thought about getting powers( because who would ) but goes along with it. He didn't seem angry enough not to think logically "How would super powers get my company back?"

I did like his design. I'm used to seeing Wonderman like he did in the 90s series and like a Christmas tree when Perez did the Avengers book. The action was good and I liked Jan's interactions with Thor( she takes it all in stride which is funny ), and I'm also for the first time really liking Ant-Man. I like his design for one because how simple it is, his power effect is cool, his attitude towards things, trying to find solutions before using violence and being a thorn in Tony's side( who really is coming off as annoying ) with his different outlook on situations.

Also it seems Fury uses the same guy that Lex used in JLU to design secret barber shop hideouts:p

[Apache Chief]

I dug it.

Wonder Man was just the sort of lame character that made me pass Avengers comics by for X-Men comics back in the day, but this was handled well. Glad he never actually went by 'Wonder Man', and I'm also glad he burned through that awful red and green get-up for a pure purple energy form.

Speaking of awful green and red get-ups, I wonder if we'll see the Vision on this.

All you wanted to do was help Tony? Then say so initially. 'Hey Simon - you've got some great ideas, so I'm going to keep your company afloat.' Easy.

I know they have many characters to juggle, but I could have used more Cap - can't get enough of him.

'Villain, prepare your giant head for my wrath!' - Classic

[Venom Melendez]

I like Wasp but I would recommend a costume change. Isn't she known for numerous costume changes over her career? Anyway, the skirt bugs me (no pun intended).

Yeah, but she doesn't seem to be a fashionista in this show.



Me neither. If he has done it before then it's probably an ability that he has lost because I can't remember seeing him doing it. And I've been reading Marvel for nearly 20 years.

He does have the ability to grow though.


I know they have many characters to juggle, but I could have used more Cap - can't get enough of him.

This isn't a Cap show though, this is an Avengers show. They all share the spolight.




Also Simon seemed to resort to super powers a little too quickly before trying..well anything else. If it had been done against his will it would have made more sense but here he hadn't even thought about getting powers( because who would ) but goes along with it. He didn't seem angry enough not to think logically "How would super powers get my company back?"



He was being manipulated by his brother and he was angry at Stark.



I forget was Hank Pym's brain mapped for Ultron originally in the comics? Or is different in this series? Whose brain do you think Stark and Pym mapped for the Ultron project?

I has always been Pym and it will probably be him here too.

[HEATXZ]

Great episode :anime:
XD Thor making fun of MODOK
This episode has good action scenes :anime:

[M.O.D.O.K.]

Today, the focus is placed mainly on Iron Man and Ant-Man as they deal with Simon Williams, a well-intentioned but vengeful scientist and CEO who wants revenge on Tony for buying his company. He turns to his criminal brother, the Grim Reaper, who in turn directs him to AIM, headed by MODOC. The freak of science offers to turn him into a super warrior with ion energy powers, but when Thor and Wasp crash the party, an accident turns him into Wonder Man, who then turns against Tony. A battle ensues between Wonder Man, Tony, and Ant-Man, with Hank trying to reason to the good side of Simon, while Thor and Wasp defeat MODOC. However, it may be too late for Simon, as his ionic form proves to be unstable, and degenerates before they could get him to a reactor. Tony tragically explains his true intentions in helping him, as we later see Enchantress reviving him, making him an offer.

This episode was good, but not as entertaining. Once again, this felt a bit rushed just like last week's, with a lot going on. Personally, the Captain America sub-plot was mostly unnecessary, aside from the suspicious response of Nick Fury near the end. What I did like about this one is the interactions between Tony and Hank, and how both of them clashed. I also felt bad for the whole ordeal with Wonder Man, and how he and Stark both handled their situations badly.

On one last note: Sharp-eyed viewers probably caught the Infinity Cube in MODOC's base, along with Grim Reaper hinting at HYDRA wanting it. Hmmm...

5/5

NEXT WEEK:For a while, Black Panther has been tracking down the progress of the Avengers, hiding in the shadows. Now, he asks for their help in overthrowing Man-Ape, the tyrant that challenged and killed his father, and took over Wakanda.

[AlgeaX]

I really liked this ep, they've done a good job of balancing so many ongoing plots. Wonder Man's a great character once you get past his horrific fashion sense and they really captured him well here. Special props to Phil LeMarr, I would never have guessed it was him.

Tony not letting Simon in on his plan to save Willaims Innovation is pretty idiotic, but it's idiotic in a way that's totally in character. In all his incarnations, Stark's always been rather arrogant even when he means well, assuming he knows what's best for everybody else. I could totally see the Tony Stark from season 2 of the Marvel Action Hour doing the exact same thing.

M.O.D.O.C. was awesome as always. I can't really take issue with toning down the name slightly, it's not like he really did that much killing in the comics either.

Lot of pipe laying for future stories here. We got foreshadows of the Cosmic Cube, Ultron and the MOE. We got lots to look forward to.

[Rick Jones]

The action was good and I liked Jan's interactions with Thor( she takes it all in stride which is funny ), and I'm also for the first time really liking Ant-Man. I like his design for one because how simple it is, his power effect is cool, his attitude towards things, trying to find solutions before using violence and being a thorn in Tony's side( who really is coming off as annoying ) with his different outlook on situations.

Also it seems Fury uses the same guy that Lex used in JLU to design secret barber shop hideouts:p

I guess it should be a given since it's his original costume and all but Hank really does come across as having the most Silver Age character design, right down to the trunks. From the moment I saw him in Man In The Ant Hill, I kept thinking that they could throw this guy into something like Justice League: New Frontier and he wouldn't seem out of place at all.

In regards to the barber shop hideout, I'd say that Lex borrowed Nick's guy. Just another one of those Marvel homages they threw into the DCAU shows.

[Wonderwall]

He was being manipulated by his brother and he was angry at Stark.

I got that part but I felt it was handled awkwardly.

[Crash]

I liked it, but I couldn't help but feel it was a step down from some previous episodes. I blame the mood of the episode. Mostly the reactions of Tony and Hank. When the characters were meant to sound defensive they instead sounded...whiny. That, and I guess it still grates on me to hear self-made super-heroes complain about weapons. Just so hypocritical. Espeically from a guy who gave his girlfiend energy-blasts...

...That complaint aside, most of the rest of the episode rocked! A.I.M., Modoc, more of the Grim Reaper--who sounds so incredibly grim! Casually brushing off the idea of his brother dying... That'll make you shiver.

I really liked that Cap recognized the name Fury! It just makes sense. If you're going to have a new, modern, black Nick Fury, fine. Then at least use the original Nick Fury in his original role: WWII. But they really should have let the WWII Fury keep the name Nick. Its really wouldn't be unusual for father & son (or grandfather and grandson--they could have gone that route with Fury being aged by Strucker in the mini-eps) to share a first name. I rather think it would have added a bit the the character...

And to address the guy who asked about Ant-Man and Ultron: Yes, mapping Hanks mind into Ultron's circuits is from the comics. Though it was a somewhat-recent revelation. That was the big revelation in the Ultron Unlimited storyline in the Busiek/Perez run.

[Dudley]

Yeah I didn't find this episode as good as the others either. The lack of communication between Tony and Simon was not handled well, and made Tony seem like a complete careless jerk with no people skills, and Simon slightly insane by so easily turning into Wonder Man.
MODOC was the highlight. It's so darn hard to take someone who looks ridiculous seriously. He's so funny, and he doesn't mean to be!

[macattack]

Yeah, didn't like this episode that much. The MODOK/MODOC subplot was more entertaining than the main plot with Wonder Man. It just made everyone look like a bunch of idiots. At least MODOK is intended to be a bit of an idiot.

[Ultra8]

I'm surprised at how much I'm getting into this show. It's really slick, and I got pulled in right away.

It's been following the original issues of Avengers (from the 60s) with a modern spin on them.

Issue 1: Avengers form with IM, Thor, Ant-Man, Wasp, and Hulk
Issue 2: Hank goes Giant-Man, Hulk leaves team
Issue 3-4, They find Cap, he joins, ect.

I don't think it will be a strictly 1:1 ratio from comics to episodes, and Black Panther is coming in a little earlier than he does in comic-Avengers history, but it's close.

And last night's episode set a lot of things up. I'm putting speculative spoilers behind the hidden box.

In last night's episode:

Hank, to Tony: (paraphrased) "Ultron was my experiment to map the human brain to a computer."

This sets up Ultron for later, and Ultron's first plan.

Simon Williams/Wonder Man got the upgrade from human right to his 90s-era Ionic Energy form. Interesting take, and he was saved from dissolution by Enchantress' magic. And I think I know how it's going to play out.

The Masters of Evil attack (Enchantress, Executioner, Abomination, Crimson Dynamo, Wonder Man, maybe some others). Simon will have a change of heart, but defying the Enchantress will break her spell, and it'll become a Heroic Sacrifice. Somehow, Tony/Hank will be able to save/store Simon's energy/engrams.

Then, Ultron gains sentience/independence/becomes evil, and his first plot is to create an android to kill the Avengers. Thing is, Ultron maps a human mind to the android, and since it probably has access to Stark and Pym's database, he'll use Simon's.

Which is sort-of how it happens in the comic, which ends up creating The Vision.

All we're missing at this point is Quicksilver and the Scarlet Witch (who in the comics, join with Hawkeye as 'Cap's Kooky Quartet'.)


We may not get those 2, though a commercial for the show did show Mocking Bird fighting alongside Hawkeye and Black Panther against some Hydra agents.

I'm enjoying this mix of Avengers history old and new. I'd honestly forgotten that Wonderman was once a villian and MoE.
Have to feel sorry for both Simon and Tony, one huge mis-understanding that wound up as one epic trainwreck.
Cap and Nick and the secret Barbershop was good but nothing tops Thor and Wasp's first encounter with Modoc.:D

Also liking how the roster in the intro changes depending on who's currently a member.

[M.O.D.O.K.]

Yeah I didn't find this episode as good as the others either. The lack of communication between Tony and Simon was not handled well, and made Tony seem like a complete careless jerk with no people skills, and Simon slightly insane by so easily turning into Wonder Man.


Wasn't that the whole point, though?

[AdamYJ]

This, as are most "kid friendly" versions is MODOC, not MODOK. He mentioned it during his rant "Designed Only for Conquest"

That's what he was in the Marvel Adventures Avengers and there are certainly worse comics to borrow from.


As for people not likeing the Wasp. Frankly, I'd like them just to have a Hank & Janet show, where he just science geeks on everything while she snarks about it.

Jan's my favorite on this show. She's the most relatable one of the bunch.


Well, it's frankly what he does in his intro story. His shtick.

I know. It just took years for him to come back the first time. It took years for him to come back after he was killed in Force Works too. Even in the old Avengers cartoon, it took until the show's finale.

Wonder Man's ability to come back from seeming death makes sense when you consider that he's essentially made of energy. You can't destroy energy, just convert it to different forms. However, it also reflects the irony and appeal of Simon's character. He's one of the most powerful beings on Earth and functionally immortal, but he's just a regular guy underneath. He's not richer (he ran his father's company into the ground in the comics) or wiser or more special than most normal people beyond the power he was given. He even has a tendency of royally screwing up some stuff.

I wonder if we'll ever see Count Nefaria on this show. He was ionic powered too.

Oh, and next time Simon shows up, Hank should get a recording of his brain engrams. You know, for . . . synthezoid-related purposes. :D

[US_Agent74]

In last night's episode:

Hank, to Tony: (paraphrased) "Ultron was my experiment to map the human brain to a computer."

This sets up Ultron for later, and Ultron's first plan.

I have to say, these small blurps in the show really do it for me. However the scene where nick tells cap that "his dad" remembered him from the war, that sucked.

Why can't we stick with Nick and his Howling Commandos and Dum Dum Dugan and Aging agent that slows his age, Cap is my all time fav so I my be zealot

[JTMarsh]

I loved Thor's lines in this ep. but what I thought this ep really did well was show just what hurdles this team has to overcome to be a real team.

TONY: Good intentions, but he goes about them in ways that make him look cold hearted.
HANK: Naive. He's spent so much time in the lab that he's forgotten how reality works, and that people aren't ants.
THOR: For all his talk about the "purity" of Midgard, it's obvious he doesn't understand it very well yet, Plus his growing dislike of scientists.
JANET: Too gung-ho. Still may see this as something of a game.
CAP: Still getting used to the era he's foun himself in, not sure if this si the right path.

I can see a possible schism growing between Hank and his teammates, but I also see a big bullet fromr eality coming at him (this bullet is named Ultron). Thor will probablt get help with his problem from Jane Foster, as a paramedic, she works with medical devices all the time.
Agreed. Very well put.

[Apache Chief]

Why can't we stick with Nick and his Howling Commandos and Dum Dum Dugan and Aging agent that slows his age, Cap is my all time fav so I my be zealot

Maybe they're not showing Nick in WW2 because the army wasn't integrated then. I know, I know - who needs realism when you've got frost giants and super-soldier serum? Granted.

Still, Ultimate Nick Fury (more or less the official one these days) differs from Original Nick in that regard.

[Gold Guy]

So Wonder Man will be an antagonist in this series? Thats an interesting development.

MODOK escaped like in all the shows that he appears in. For some reason, he's lucky that way.

[Video Beagle]

Why can't we stick with Nick and his Howling Commandos and Dum Dum Dugan and Aging agent that slows his age, Cap is my all time fav so I my be zealot

I agree with you, but Yost gave an argument that's hard to disagree with.

Paraphrasing, there's a lot of WW2 characters running around, Cap, Zemo, Strucker, Zola, the Red Skull eventually..likely Bucky/Winter Soldier....it gets to be a bit silly...and for Cap's story, his "man out of time/all of his friends and family are gone storyline really doesn't work well if Fury and the Howlers are running around, too.

[Monte]

Paraphrasing, there's a lot of WW2 characters running around, Cap, Zemo, Strucker, Zola, the Red Skull eventually..likely Bucky/Winter Soldier....it gets to be a bit silly...and for Cap's story, his "man out of time/all of his friends and family are gone storyline really doesn't work well if Fury and the Howlers are running around, too.

Let's not forget Wolverine who's running around somewhere... obvious excuse of an X-man cameo

[CyclonatorZ]

This was unfortunately the first episode that managed to greatly disapoint me. I was looking foward to see how they handled this potentiall interesting plotline, and unfortunately I felt they really dropped the ball on the creation of Wonder Man. If they had just spent a few more mintues establishing Simon William's character, as well as taken some time to tweak the heavy-handed dialouge betweeny Tony Stark and Hank Aaron, then this probably would have been a far better episode. As it stands, I'll remember it far more for Modok's enjoyable introduction and Wasp and Thor's great teamup. Okay, the Captain America/Nick Fury scenes and the continuing role of Loki's comrades were good too, but still... it's hard to like an episodes smaller parts if the main plot falls flat. :shrug:

Of course, this disapointment might also have something to do with the fact that I was rewatching the second season of The Spectacular Spiderman around the same time. As much as I like this Avengers show, Greg Weisman's effort has it beat in the characterization and dialogue departments. There's always hope that Earth's Mightiest Heroes improves later down the road, though, so I'll continue watching it through at least the entire first season. ;)

[JTMarsh]

So far this series is doing a better job of giving both the heroes and the villains space to breathe and shine, something 'Wolverine & the X-Men' never quite mastered. Here's hoping they keep it up.

[Jordacar]

I think this was the weakest episode so far. Don't get me wrong, I loved MODOK, I loved the action scenes, I loved the Tony/Hank stuff. But what killed it for me was Simon. His fall from grace felt forced and contrived. Going from "Stark stole my company" to "I'm willing to subject myself to untested supervillain experiments that in all likelihood will turn me into a pile of radioactive slop" just didn't work.

I'm willing to give the writers a pass, because Wonder Man has a pretty strange origin, so adapting it was likely to be hit-or-miss.

[AlgeaX]

Let's not forget Wolverine who's running around somewhere... obvious excuse of an X-man cameo

STEVE: Everyone I've ever know is dead and gone, except for Baron Zemo, Logan, Nick Fury, the Red Skull, Armin Zola, Namor, Dum Dum Dugan, Baron Strucker, Gabriel Jones, Jim Hammond, Spitfire, Baron Blood, even Bucky's a cyborg assassin now and don't get me started on that clone with Hitler's brain in it, I'm not even sure if he counts or not.

[Antiyonder]

Useless, but related trivia: Don't have the issue number in mind right now, but renaming MODOK as MODOC was done before in Marvel Adventures The Avengers. And for the same reason.


I'm surprised at how much I'm getting into this show. It's really slick, and I got pulled in right away.

It's been following the original issues of Avengers (from the 60s) with a modern spin on them.

Issue 1: Avengers form with IM, Thor, Ant-Man, Wasp, and Hulk
Issue 2: Hank goes Giant-Man, Hulk leaves team
Issue 3-4, They find Cap, he joins, ect.

I don't think it will be a strictly 1:1 ratio from comics to episodes, and Black Panther is coming in a little earlier than he does in comic-Avengers history, but it's close.

Though they did make a major omission by leaving out Namor, but no problem. Otherwise why watch you can read the book


I dug it.

Wonder Man was just the sort of lame character that made me pass Avengers comics by for X-Men comics back in the day, but this was handled well. Glad he never actually went by 'Wonder Man', and I'm also glad he burned through that awful red and green get-up for a pure purple energy form.

Sure if you go by name and design alone, but I thought his sacrifice at the end of his first appearance was a noteworthy moment.


STEVE: Everyone I've ever know is dead and gone, except for Baron Zemo, Logan, Nick Fury, the Red Skull, Armin Zola, Namor, Dum Dum Dugan, Baron Strucker, Gabriel Jones, Jim Hammond, Spitfire, Baron Blood, even Bucky's a cyborg assassin now and don't get me started on that clone with Hitler's brain in it, I'm not even sure if he counts or not.

Yeah, he should be grateful that his enemies have survived in one form or another. Wait a minute....:p

[AlgeaX]

Though they did make a major omission by leaving out Namor, but no problem. Otherwise why watch you can read the book

I wouldn't be suprised if Namor shows up later in the season, he'd make an interesting antagonist given his history with Cap.


Yeah, he should be grateful that his enemies have survived in one form or another. Wait a minute....:p

LOL! Too true, I was just poking a little fun at the crazy number of WWII era Marvel characters who seem permanently frozen in their mid thirties. Speaking of which, Howard Stark and Jack Fury must have had kids real late in life considering Tony and Nick* can't be much past the big three-oh themselves.


*Remember, Nick's Grey temples are due to Strucker sucking out his youth with the Satan Claw.

[BigEclipse]

*Remember, Nick's Grey temples are due to Strucker sucking out his youth with the Satan Claw.

True, but I know from first hand experience that black don't crack...;)

[Crash]

STEVE: Everyone I've ever know is dead and gone, except for Baron Zemo, Logan, Nick Fury, the Red Skull, Armin Zola, Namor, Dum Dum Dugan, Baron Strucker, Gabriel Jones, Jim Hammond, Spitfire, Baron Blood, even Bucky's a cyborg assassin now and don't get me started on that clone with Hitler's brain in it, I'm not even sure if he counts or not.

And don't forget that the Vision is kinda/sorta/maybe a reconstruction of the cybernetic original Human Torch also from the WWII era!

[90'sCartoonMan]

Although Simon fighting Tony and Hank for so long was a little weak (especially when Iron Man comes back with the armor to prolong the fight), I thought this episode did a pretty good job of juggling the plots. We get good tension between Tony and Hank, maybe that'll come to a head when we find out more about Ultron.

My favorite was probably the Thor/Wasp stuff, it's great she can be of use in battle when he's there. The Cap/Fury stuff was interesting. On the surface, Fury does seem like a fanboy and he does respect Captain America, but I can't help but feel he may use the motorcycle as a bargaining chip later if he ever wants to turn Cap against Tony.

I liked seeing that Wonder Man costume on Simon, and the continuing Masters of Evil plot is cool.


Usually, when Wonder Man "dies" (he's done it twice in the comics) it takes a few years for him to come back. Guess the timetable is moved up for this show. :D

Force Works and Heroes Reborn (when only Wanda could summon him back), right? I could've sworn he died another time, but I can't remember.



That line finally made me realize something. This series is a serious competitor greatest Marvel series ever. It's surpassed the 90's Spider-Man series in my opinion, and it's close to the 90's X-Men series. It's tied with X-Man: Evolution, and it passed Wolverine and the X-Men tonight (and for the record, I loved that series). It still has to catch up to Spectacular Spider-Man, but it might get there by the end of the season.

It definitely has the potential. There's a depth with the character's histories and backgrounds, so on top of the fighting against foes no one hero can face thing, they're all going through individual arcs. That's something a lot of team shows (like the awesome 90's X-Men series) struggles with. And there's a certain scale and consistent tone (and hopefully variety in plot) to it that gives it the potential to be more entertaining than the Spider-Man cartoons.



And it seems team Evil has got there Anti-Iron man... now we need the Anti-Antman, the Anti-Wasp, and the Anti-hulk... and also the Anti-Hawkman and Anti-Black Panter if they plan on joining anytime soon.

That makes me wonder if Swordsman is going to show up as Clint's counterpart.


If they had just spent a few more mintues establishing Simon William's character, as well as taken some time to tweak the heavy-handed dialouge betweeny Tony Stark and Hank Aaron, then this probably would have been a far better episode.

Must be hard to write dialogue between a superhero and an ex-baseball player. Although if they had Captain America there, maybe they could reveal they knew each other back in the day. ;)

[AlgeaX]

Force Works and Heroes Reborn (when only Wanda could summon him back), right? I could've sworn he died another time, but I can't remember.

Simon "died" for the first time at the end of his first appearance in Avengers #9 (http://www.supermegamonkey.net/chronocomic/entries/avengers_9.shtml), he later got resurrected by a Voodoo priest in issue 151 (http://www.supermegamonkey.net/chronocomic/entries/avengers_150151.shtml). No, seriously.

[NightwingAngelo]

Wonderful episode!

This episode was brutal for Tony (in a good way when it comes to the imperfections of his character), and Simon was pretty cool. My favourite part was definitely the interaction between him and his brother.

Loved it! Thor and Wasp were AWESOME by the way.

Thor: "I tire of these 'geeks'".

Next week's should be entertaining, like all of these episodes are.

[90'sCartoonMan]

Simon "died" for the first time at the end of his first appearance in Avengers #9 (http://www.supermegamonkey.net/chronocomic/entries/avengers_9.shtml), he later got resurrected by a Voodoo priest in issue 151 (http://www.supermegamonkey.net/chronocomic/entries/avengers_150151.shtml). No, seriously.

Death really is just a vacation for that guy.

[Monte]

Death really is just a vacation for that guy.

Isn't that how it is for almost every character in superhero comics? :sweat:

[90'sCartoonMan]

Isn't that how it is for almost every character in superhero comics? :sweat:

Whenever a non-A List character goes into limbo, very often they'll just take a break from the team, go away to school, focus on work or family, etc. When Wonder Man goes into limbo, they just kill him off until they want to use him again. The only other character off the top of my head I can think of who is in a similar situation is Jean Grey.

[Venom Melendez]

After watching the episode again, it seems MODOK and AIM are building the Cosmic Cube for HYDRA.

More than likely The Red Skull will get his hands on it.

[dmxx116]

After he lost his company to Tony Stark, Simon Williams seeks help from brother the Grim Reaper and A.I.M. then transformed him into ionic powered Wonder Man,Simon takes the fight back to Tony Stark! during his body is becoming unstable Iron Man and The Avengers must save him before he dies.

http://i.annihil.us/u/prod/marvel/i/mg/8/f0/4d06ef113f4a5.jpg

http://marvel.com/videos/watch/1673/the_avengers_emh_2010_season_1-_ep_10

[ShadowStar]

Great to see Wonder Man. I don't recall him being originally a villain in the comics, but he was one of the better Avengers if memory serves so watching his character arc unfold on this show should be fun. If Enchantress is calling the shots now, since she's the only one (at the moment) who can keep him alive, then I guess he'll remain a villain for the foreseeable future. Not that that's a bad thing, since the team roster will be crowded enough before too long, but I hope he finds some redemption later on, say in season 2. Now, when will he take the name Wonder Man?

I was quite impressed with the way Phil LaMarr voiced Wonder Man. Normally LaMarr uses a distinctive voice, whether it's his John Stewart voice or his Static voice, but here he was almost unrecognisable. Aside from a monotone 'scream' at the beginning of the episode, he did a fine job.

Needless to say, I was pleased to see further developments like the introduction of A.I.M. and MODOC, plus the return of the Grim Reaper, who's proving to be a really cool villain. While the different plots didn't intersect until near the end, I still enjoyed much of what was transpiring, from the tension between Tony and Hank to Thor and Wasp hurling insults at MODOC. It's a bit strange that the Black Panther sub-plot wasn't advanced but I can surmise that Tony and Cap decided to just wait and see if "the one in the black catsuit" will come calling again.

The only thing I didn't really like was Hank accusing Tony of being insensitive, only to later remark to Simon, distractedly, that he'd like to study him... when he should've been fixated on talking him down. But I guess nobody's perfect, and Hank was just thrilled to see this 'wonder of scientific achievement' (or whatever MODOC referred to Simon as).

[King_of_doom]

Great to see Wonder Man. I don't recall him being originally a villain in the comics, but he was one of the better Avengers if memory serves so watching his character arc unfold on this show should be fun. If Enchantress is calling the shots now, since she's the only one (at the moment) who can keep him alive, then I guess he'll remain a villain for the foreseeable future. Not that that's a bad thing, since the team roster will be crowded enough before too long, but I hope he finds some redemption later on, say in season 2. Now, when will he take the name Wonder Man?

I was quite impressed with the way Phil LaMarr voiced Wonder Man. Normally LaMarr uses a distinctive voice, whether it's his John Stewart voice or his Static voice, but here he was almost unrecognisable. Aside from a monotone 'scream' at the beginning of the episode, he did a fine job.

Actually Wonder Man was suppose to be a traitor when he join the Avengers, in the comics it was Baron Zemo who turn Simon into a powered being and blackmails him on giving him a serum that he needs to survive, there are a few changes but the episode shows exactly on the origin of Wonder Man.

You should give Phil LaMarr some credit since he voice characters that actually surprise you like Samurai Jack, Hector from Hector con Carne and Wilt from Foster's Home.

[ShadowStar]

You should give Phil LaMarr some credit since he voice characters that actually surprise you like Samurai Jack, Hector from Hector con Carne and Wilt from Foster's Home.

I am giving him some credit - I'm saying that I thought I'd heard all the different voices he could do by now, but I was wrong! I'd forgotten about Samurai Jack and Wilt - yeah, it does show how versatile he is.