Poll: Who Framed Bruce/who Killed Vesper?

[FLIPMODE]

My top 5 of Who Framed Bruce Goes like this:

5-Ok it's the most likely Candidate, But I always go against the grain. Lex. This may go Back to Cataclysm. Maybe Back to the White Hose Break in, Dect. Comics #756. Also in that isue, Sasha did not know, Bruce's Secret until the End. And yet, you can clearly see that she suspected him to be Batman. She opened his suitcase, almost as if someone told her where to look. So maybe Lex's Plot runs through her. And Lastly, what almost top's Lex's involvemnt for me is, the New Superman/Batman monthly book coming out. Perhaps just in time after BW:F is over. If Luthor is involved, it will certainly bring Supes into the Picture, and Sart a New book Based off of the conclusion of BW: Fugitive.

4-Going back to Batman the 10 cent issue, The Mad Hatter and Scarecrow, were together on The Bat computer Screen. For both it said, incarcerated. But Maybe it's a Clue. With Scarecrows Gas and Hatters Technology to control Minds, perhaps someone stole their Tech.

3-My third Suspect is Batman. There are numerous Reasons, but perhaps his mind is being Controlled. And Perhaps by this mysterious Lady seen in Robin#100, she claims she has a Scent that makes people loose their minds.

2-I think something with Comissioner Gordon. He may know Batman's secret since, Officer Down #5, which is Nightwing #53. Batman and Alfred openly Talk in front of what hey think is an unconcious Gordon. Alfred openly say's Master Bruce often. And Batman is in Costume. His incentive would be pretty much like the Story "over the Edge".

1-For What ever reason I think, The formerly deceased, then shockingly alive, then Deceased again Matches Malone, May have something to do with it. All this time Bruce used Matches Identity, thinking he was dead. Matches was Alive. Then Bruce gave his secret away, right before he died again. Did'nt macthes have a Brother? Or Maybe he's not dead. And Bruce did feel wrong about using the I.D. Maybe he knows, Matches is out to Kill Bruce's I.D. and Bruces refuses to defend himself Because he's guilty.

Anyone else have a top 5?

[The Guard]

I guess Ra's Al Ghul falls under "other".

[FLIPMODE]

I think I found a Major Clue. Go back to Batman: Gotham Knights #17.

The Issue Includes this Guy Named Matatoa.
What struck me as a Clue was the VERY last lines in the book.
The scene is Matatoa Leaving Gotham After Being defeated By Nightwing and Batman. He's Hitchhiking.

Matatoa:"Im Trying to find a MASTER of MANIPULATION any Thoughts?"
Driver:"You mean Besides our Sainted PRESIDENT...?"

And that's the end of the book. Those words were capitalized in the book.
Now this Guy Matatoa, Killed some sort of a Shaman, who had the abilities to Absorb the Qualities of the person he Kills. So after the Shaman Died, this guy (who I think reminds me of Azreal), has the ability to absorb his victims. He Also say's In order to Stay Alive Forever, He HAS to kill an Innocent life.

The point of the Issue was for Matatoa, to Offer Batman Eternal Protection over Gotham City, If Batman Allowed himself to be killed by Matatoa. But Nightwing took him out.

The possibilites are endless in relation to What's going on now in the books. Why would he all of a Sudden be interested in a Master of manipulation? Is it possible this guy knew Batman's Secrets just by touching him?

[Kathy Kane]

Hmmm...
I like your theory, but knowing DC they'll probably, do a stupid twist to it like it'll be Raul'Agul (sp?) or Lex.
But I think I want to see how it pans out.

[Gotham Knights '68]

I think its Hugo Strange...he can manipulate minds with the best of them, and he is not an over-used character...at least not recently.

The whole thing is really not Rha's m.o., nor Bane's.

Could be Luthor with this whole new Superman / Batman book coming, which will exist in continuity.

I think Jim Gordan is gonna play a big part in snapping Bruce/Batman out of this somehow, along with a big finale involving Azrael #100, the books last issue, which is rumored to be a big part of the fugitive storyline. Remember Knights End and what Batman told Jean-Paul at the very end as he reclaimed the mantle of the Batman? Could all tie together. 2002 is the 10 year anniversary of Knightfall!!!

[Sugar Daddy]

Originally posted by Gotham Knights '68


I think Jim Gordan is gonna play a big part in snapping Bruce/Batman out of this somehow, along with a big finale involving Azrael #100, the books last issue, which is rumored to be a big part of the fugitive storyline

BW:F ends in July. Azrael #100 won't be coming out till 2003, as Azrael #90 and #91 I believe are part of BW:F, which means #100 is about 9-10 months away. So that rumor is incorrect.

[Gotham Knights '68]

Originally posted by Sugar Daddy


BW:F ends in July. Azrael #100 won't be coming out till 2003, as Azrael #90 and #91 I believe are part of BW:F, which means #100 is about 9-10 months away. So that rumor is incorrect.

My Bad :( , I realized that this morning ....it is Azrael 90 & 91. I'm burnt this week :confused:

I knew it was going to tie into the whole fugitive story. I was referring to when Bruce told Jean-Paul that is isn't the suit that makes the person, but the individual that makes the suit (KnightsEnd). I think that is going to play a part somewhere along the way during the conclusion of BW: F.

[The Guard]

The possibilites are endless in relation to What's going on now in the books. Why would he all of a Sudden be interested in a Master of manipulation? Is it possible this guy knew Batman's Secrets just by touching him?

Matatoa had dreams that told him who to kill. People with abilities. He dreamed about a master of manipulation. I don't think he has a thing to do with this.'

Rucka has said that this whole thing started in NML.

There have been no clear cut BIGGEST enemies since then, save one. The man that tried to own Gotham. The man who "kidnapped" Batman's parents' bodies. The man who turned the JL against him. The man who blames Batman for the loss of his most prized possession.

The Demon's Head.

[FLIPMODE]

So does'nt that mean that matatoa should have killed Lex?

[Barb Gordon]

My sources point to Azrael, and I'm going along with my sources. They had pretty good evidence to back it up, and evidence enough that rules out other valid possibilities, like Hugo Strange.

Barb^-^

[FLIPMODE]

Please share the evidence Barb.

Im interested in the theory.

Plus If this dates back to NML, then it might be a Lex, Bane, and Ras Plot. At Least the Lex and Bane part. In the Last Pages of NML, you see Mercy talking with Bane. Mercy=Lex's Bodyguard.

I Can't Omagine Bane having nothing to do with this now, especially If this is Lutor Connected.

But how is this Azreal?

[Trent Lane]

I was reading thru past issues and stumbled across this guy named "The Skeleton", who is apparently someone else. He's got a real hate thing going for Bruce Wayne, so I was thinking he might have been a suspect. Anyone else ever heard of him?...

[Borg4of3]

Hio! Its me, the guy-who-doesn't-read-that-many-comics!

Why is Jim Gordon suspect? I mean, sure he could very well know who Batman is, but what reason would he have to do something as heinous as murder and framing? If anything, Bats and him are closer than ever thanks to NML, and I didn't see any hatred between them during Officer Down

[The Guard]

Not the SKELETON thing again...

:)

[Jade_GL]

At first, and this is something I discussed much at the local comic book shop, I thought it was Azrael. Azrael seems to be losing his grip on reality, so I saw that and his upcoming cancellation as a clue, maybe.

However, I'm beginning to think that while Azrael might be a little kooky, and his comic is going off the shelves, he's still a genuinly good person. I'm sure he wouldn't murder, but perhaps he would. I am still on the fence, but now I am beginning to look at other cadidates.

Hmmm. I think the new Batgirl has a big clue. I don't want to say anything here, but I'd flip through it for info.

Anway, now I'm thinking it's an old foe. Perhaps someone from a while back. Maybe Lady Shiva? Hmmm. It's getting harder to narrow down the choices.

While all of the people on the pole are suspects, I can;'t see any of them actually pulling it off. I think it's someone with a lot of knowledge, a lot of martial arts training, and a lot of hatred. Besides that, I only have the few choices I mentioned above. But it changes everyday with the new comics that come out. Perhaps tomorrow, when I pick up my new ishs for this week, I'll have a new, and better, idea.

[Dub]

Here's a question - I havent been keeping up with the story as much BUT:

A) Is there someone from Bruce's past whom would know his identity and hate him for an action he commited?

And B) is there positive PROFF that vesper Fairchild is dead? I mean...its cliche and out of left field - but wouldnt it be a hoot if Vesper herself did it and is still alive ^^


.....


I'm gonna shut up now ^^

[Domino]

Originally posted by Jon "WB" Gray
Here's a question - I havent been keeping up with the story as much BUT:

A) Is there someone from Bruce's past whom would know his identity and hate him for an action he commited?

And B) is there positive PROFF that vesper Fairchild is dead? I mean...its cliche and out of left field - but wouldnt it be a hoot if Vesper herself did it and is still alive ^^


.....


I'm gonna shut up now ^^

A) Half the people on the poll list, and more who aren't.

B) They found her body. Batgirl even dug up the body and examined it again.

[d4rkkn1ght]

I think it may be Sasha. She didn't like Vesper too much but i'm an idiot! :D

[BatChick]

I've been reading Knightsfall (okay yeah I know I'm majorly behind), anyway some of the things that Jean Paul said to Tim in that storyline got me to thinking. So Azrael gets my vote.

Plus I was talking to someone in my local comic shop and he pointed out that the BW:F story is crossed over in every spin off series but Azrael. Just a thought.