"Wolverine and The X-Men - The Complete Series" Blu-ray/DVD Talkback (Spoilers)

[James Harvey]

Lionsgate Home Entertainment collects the entire Wolverine and The X-Men animated series in this special Blu-ray/DVD collection!


http://marvel.toonzone.net/wolverinexmen/reviews/releases/completeseries/t-cover.jpg (http://marvel.toonzone.net/wolverinexmen/reviews/releases/completeseries/) http://marvel.toonzone.net/wolverinexmen/reviews/releases/completeseries/t-dvdcover.jpg (http://marvel.toonzone.net/wolverinexmen/reviews/releases/completeseries/)
Wolverine and The X-Men - The Complete Series
Studio: Lionsgate Home Entertainment
Release Date: October 12th, 2010

Synopsis: After a mysterious explosion at the Xavier mansion, and the resulting disappearances of Professor Xavier and Jean Grey, the distraught X-Men disband. But soon Wolverine, Storm, Beast and the others must join together again to not only battle the increasingly powerful Mutant Response Division, but also to prevent a catastrophic future that Xavier has warned Wolverine must never come to pass. With help from their allies, the heroic X-Men wage war against formidable foes as the present and future collide. But who will win? Discover for yourself as this extraordinary series is presented together in one complete collection like never before.

Bonus Features:
-29 audio commentaries with Show Creators
-“The Making of Wolverine and the X-Men” featurette
-“The Inner Circle: Reflections on Wolverine and the X-Men” featurette

Note: Please post only comments about the DVD/Blu-ray release in this thread, as this thread is only for discussion of the actual DVD/Blu-ray release. Please use the proper talkback and discussion threads to discuss the included episodes.

Episodes Included:
#26. Foresight, Part Three (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=260859), #25. Foresight, Part Two (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=260859), #24. Foresight, Part One (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=260859), #23. Shades of Grey (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=260452), #22. Aces & Eights (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=236154), #21. Rover (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=235847), #20. Breakdown (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=235524), #19. Guardian Angel (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=235196), #18. Backlash (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=235038), #17. Code of Conduct (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=234447), #16. Badlands (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=234081), #15. Hunting Grounds (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=233727), #14. Stolen Lives (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=233378), #13. Battle Lines (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=231290), #12. eXcessive Force (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=230981), #11. Past Discretions (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=230628), #10. Greetings from Genosha (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=230271), #9. Future X (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=229953), #8. Time Bomb (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=225867), #7. Wolverine Versus Hulk (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=225475), #6. X-Calibre (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=225205), #5. Thieves' Gambit (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=224894), #4. Overflow (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=224467), #3. Hindsight, Part Three (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=223944), #2. Hindsight, Part Two (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=223944), #1. Hindsight, Part One (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=223944)

Discuss This DVD/Blu-ray!

Related Threads:
-Wolverine and The X-Men - The Complete Series Blu-ray/DVD Review (Spoilers) (http://marvel.toonzone.net/wolverinexmen/reviews/releases/completeseries/)
-Wolverine and The X-Men - The Complete First Season DVD Talkback (Spoilers) (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=235697)
-Wolverine and The X-Men - Volume Six: Final Crisis Trilogy DVD Talkback (Spoilers) (http://www.toonzone.net/forums/showthread.php?t=272194)
-Wolverine and The X-Men - Volume Five: Revelation DVD Talkback (Spoilers) (http://www.toonzone.net/forums/showthread.php?t=267694)
-Wolverine and The X-Men - Volume Four: Fate of the Future DVD Talkback (Spoilers) (http://www.toonzone.net/forums/showthread.php?t=263493)
-Wolverine and The X-Men - Volume Three: Beginning of the End DVD Talkback (Spoilers) (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=238095)
-Wolverine and The X-Men - Volume Two: Deadly Enemies DVD Talkback (Spoilers) (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=232842)
-Wolverine and The X-Men - Volume One: Heroes Return Trilogy DVD Talkback (Spoilers) (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=228513)
-X-Men Origins: Wolverine Blu-ray/DVD Talkback (Spoilers) (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=235700)
-X-Men Trilogy Blu-ray Talkback (Spoilers) (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=228512)

We appreciate and encourage discussion, but please keep your posts civil, relevant and insightful. Please do not post any improper or inflammatory material, as we will issue warnings if we believe it necessary. And remember to keep the discussion ON-TOPIC!

[FireWarrior]

I have to wait for my next paycheck for this but man I cannot wait to get my hands on this! :D

[Kaveh77]

Wolverine and the X-men got a full series blu-ray set but still no Spectacular Spider-Man :sad:

[TheVileOne]

That's because Lionsgate got the DVD rights for the series and Lionsgate always does a great job with Marvel animation. Disney's DVD releases for Marvel animation are generally always bad, shoddy, and/or disappointing.

Just saying if it was SHOUT! or BCI, we'd have gotten complete series or complete season sets.

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

I'm still on the fence on whether I need to own this or not. There are few select episodes I really liked, but overall I wasn't too thrilled with the series, especially since it ended without Cyclops being redeemed as team leader.

[TheVileOne]

Does that mean you didn't want Cyclops to be redeemed at the end? :D

Bat-Fan Beyond, I'd maybe look at the individual volumes if you are only wanting some select episodes. That said, there's like 29 audio commentary in this set. The extras are fantastic.

Plus there's . . . that ;)

[LazyReaper]

Wait... wasn't there already a Season 1 release of this show? Am I missing something? I thought that was the only season made. Are there extra episodes in this, or is it just the difference of special features?

[suss2it]

Wait... wasn't there already a Season 1 release of this show? Am I missing something? I thought that was the only season made. Are there extra episodes in this, or is it just the difference of special features?

In Canada there was, but this is the American release, plus it's also on Blu-ray. The Canadian release was pretty bare-bone it had I think one behind the scenes feature and I believe 1 commentary.

[LazyReaper]

Ah, okay. Thanks for clearing that up.

Another thing I don't understand is why the first Canadian release is 5 discs, where as this one is only 3? Seems to me it should be the other way around considering the 29 commentaries, features, etc. I'm wondering if it's simply a matter of them using a different disc format vs the compression rate in quality.

[FlawedCoil82]

I haven't gotten the chance to watch any of these yet, but I saw it at Meijer earlier today for only $18.99 and I just couldn't pass up that great price for the full set (since I never bought any of the single sets). So I look forward to giving this series a fair chance now that I finally got my beloved 90's X-Men series complete on dvd already.
Jack

[suss2it]

Ah, okay. Thanks for clearing that up.

Another thing I don't understand is why the first Canadian release is 5 discs, where as this one is only 3? Seems to me it should be the other way around considering the 29 commentaries, features, etc. I'm wondering if it's simply a matter of them using a different disc format vs the compression rate in quality.

Well the Blu-ray can hold a lot content than DVDs. Not sure if the DVD release is also 3 disc but if it that must mean that they compressed the video to make it all fit.

[JTMarsh]

I'm still on the fence on whether I need to own this or not. There are few select episodes I really liked, but overall I wasn't too thrilled with the series, especially since it ended without Cyclops being redeemed as team leader.
Pretty much how I feel here. The only episodes I really liked were the Nightcrawler ones, as he was the only X-Man not grossly emasculated so as to make Wolverine look better, and that alone is not enough to make me want to purchase the series in either a complete box set or in single DVDs.

I really don't know what the writers were going for with Cyclops over season 1. Frankly I'm not sure if the writers themselves knew what they wanted to do with him over season 1. Was his character arc supposed to be him eventually getting back to his normal fearless leader self? Apparently that was not the case because if he did, well, he'd take back leadership. There's no way Cyclops would just stand by and let Wolverine run things if his mind was clear enough to function as a leader, and I guess the writers felt they couldn't let that happen because if Wolvie gave up leadership there'd be no reason to give him top billing. Heck, the writers even went out of their way to make sure that none of his flashbacks in 'Breakdown' even showed him being a remotely competent hero, let alone a leader, and I doubt that would have ever changed, not when the primary goal of the show was to drool all over Wolverine, a character so overrated and overexposed it's not even funny.



Does that mean you didn't want Cyclops to be redeemed at the end? http://www.toonzone.net/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

Vile, redemption would require something like Cyclops getting his act together and winning one for the X-Men, which did not happen. Given that the show cheerfully embraced and relished virtually every negative stereotype against the character it's unlikely this would have ever changed, as I stated above.

And I'd much rather pretend 'Code of Conduct' didn't exist. Ninjas? The X-Men with all their power, the X-Men who fight Magneto, Mr. Sinister, Sentinels, occasionally aliens and have to thwart bad futures, can't handle a few ninjas? That's pathetic.

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

Pretty much how I feel here. The only episodes I really liked were the Nightcrawler ones, as he was the only X-Man not grossly emasculated so as to make Wolverine look better, and that alone is not enough to make me want to purchase the series in either a complete box set or in single DVDs.

I really don't know what the writers were going for with Cyclops over season 1. Frankly I'm not sure if the writers themselves knew what they wanted to do with him over season 1. Was his character arc supposed to be him eventually getting back to his normal fearless leader self? Apparently that was not the case because if he did, well, he'd take back leadership. There's no way Cyclops would just stand by and let Wolverine run things if his mind was clear enough to function as a leader, and I guess the writers felt they couldn't let that happen because if Wolvie gave up leadership there'd be no reason to give him top billing. Heck, the writers even went out of their way to make sure that none of his flashbacks in 'Breakdown' even showed him being a remotely competent hero, let alone a leader, and I doubt that would have ever changed, not when the primary goal of the show was to drool all over Wolverine, a character so overrated and overexposed it's not even funny.


Vile, redemption would require something like Cyclops getting his act together and winning one for the X-Men, which did not happen. Given that the show cheerfully embraced and relished virtually every negative stereotype against the character it's unlikely this would have ever changed, as I stated above.

And I'd much rather pretend 'Code of Conduct' didn't exist. Ninjas? The X-Men with all their power, the X-Men who fight Magneto, Mr. Sinister, Sentinels, occasionally aliens and have to thwart bad futures, can't handle a few ninjas? That's pathetic.

Agreed on all counts.

Don't get me wrong, Wolverine is and will always be one of my favorite characters (my son's middle name is Logan actually), but over the years (especially since the 90's) Wolverine has become so popular and overused that he's lost a bit of the mystique (for lack of a better word) that made him cool to me.

At one time, Wolverine was kind of like Boba Fett and Snake Eyes -- He used to be the mysterious character that everyone favored and wanted to see more of, but because you didn't get a lot of him, he retained that coolness factor. But now he's become so popular that Marvel has oversaturated the market with the character, putting him more and more in the status of Batman, which has kind of made him less interesting to me, especially when Cyclops has been made to look so much less important than he should be.

The thing is, I kind of always looked at Wolverine as actually being like Batman in a sense, as opposed to Cyclops who was like Superman to me. I don't necessarily mean their level of popularity or their characterizations are the same (Cyclops is obviously not of the same caliber as Superman, but..), I'm just talking about how the Batman/Superman dynamic and the Wolverine/Cyclops dynamic complement each other through contrasting characterizations. Each pair of characters has a common goal and mutual respect, but their methods and personalities are completely different and often lead to conflicts between them. That's what I love most about those characters.

But unlike Batman and Superman, who work equally great from a story standpoint as solo characters and/or members of the same team (as history has proven), I feel that Wolverine and Cyclops for the most part really work best strictly as members of the same team; That's not to say that there hasn't been any great Wolverine solo stories, because there has, but I think I prefer him a lot more as a member of the X-Men than by himself. Unfortunately, Cyclops hasn't had a great run of solo stories, but I don't think he needs them, since he is the lynchpin of the team and works best that way. I just wish someone would give Cyclops his due. Writers should be treating him more respectfully like Captain America (Steve Rogers) is when he's with the Avengers.

Anyway, Wolverine and The X-Men had an interesting concept of switching the roles of Logan and Scott (even if it was really just to put Wolverine at the forefront and in the title's name), but unfortunately the series failed to bring it back around and justify the premise with a satisfying resolution of not only why Wolverine should not be leader of the X-Men, but why Cyclops should!

[Storm Eagle]

Well the Blu-ray can hold a lot content than DVDs. Not sure if the DVD release is also 3 disc but if it that must mean that they compressed the video to make it all fit.
The DVD release also has three discs.

[SKDarkDragon]

Yeah, I probably won't get the whole season set. I bought the first few single DVD releases (and never actually even watched the 3rd one I bought! I should do that...) and saw a sprinkling of other episodes on Disney XD, but this show just really didn't do it for me.

The first two X-men movies are among my favorites, and X-men: Evolution is probably my favorite cartoon, for starters, and this one just wasn't nearly as good. :\ It wasn't just the bad Cyclops characterization and the weirdness of having Wolverine as the leader (I feel like he's a much better as a loner, reluctantly working with the team). I felt like the show was rushed, and had too many characters with (from what I saw) hardly any character development. It probably didn't help that I watched some of the episodes out-of-order, but I felt like there were characters appearing and disappearing all over the place. Even my favorite characters just didn't appeal to me that much.

I'm not sad that it's been cancelled, but I would love a better X-men show. Maybe something to coincide with the new movie? (Or maybe just release X-men: Evolution season 4 on DVD??)

[Barbossa]

I don't live in the US but I am so getting this dvd set,amazing how a 26 episode show can be a lot better than a 70 plus ep show (90s x men )
Oh and I prefer badass Cyclops over boring, predictable,boyscout Cyclops

[Andrew T. Hingson]

The DVD release also has three discs.

26 episodes on 3 discs? Yeah that's gonna cause compression issues I'm sure. Should have been 4 or they could have just rereleased the individual 6 discs as one box set in one case rather than do a new transfer.

I also don't partciulary like the season set box art personally. I guess I'll stick with my singles, I only need the last 3 episode disc anyway.

[JTMarsh]

Oh and I prefer badass Cyclops over boring, predictable,boyscout Cyclops
To each their own. I prefer competent Cyclops to incompetent Cyclops.

[Juu-kuchi]

This is a pass for me. After getting reacquainted with the X-Men, I checked out the first three episodes of this...

...And man it's awful. It's just godawful. The action feels castrated, everything is so subdued, the characters are so... off in personality and performance, and worst of all: it feels sterile. I can't find myself really engaging with these characters, and even worse when I have to convince myself that Logan is supposed to be the leader. I'm sorry, but I can't see it. ><

[FlawedCoil82]

I don't live in the US but I am so getting this dvd set,amazing how a 26 episode show can be a lot better than a 70 plus ep show (90s x men )
Oh and I prefer badass Cyclops over boring, predictable,boyscout Cyclops

That is why I don't really post here anymore. I can't stand the complete 100% turnaround by X-Men fans who once recognized how amazing the 90's series was, and now all of a sudden it is looked at as garbage. God Himself could not convince me that this series or X-Men: Evolution was even in the same zipcode of pure awesomeness that the 90's series was. The one and only way Marvel could ever hope to top the 90's series in my lifetime is by bringing back the exact same voice actors, the exact same uniforms and the exact same characters/team line-ups from the 90's series and make a brand new series of episodes based on the 90's X-Men, but just featuring the more advanced modern animation techniques.

What I have seen of "Wolverine & The X-Men" is better than "X-Men: Evolution". Beyond that, I can not get my hopes or expectations any higher. I've seen all but 4 episodes of this series (granted not all in order) and I doubt those four episodes will be able to send it up any higher. In fact, IF the 90's series hadn't been released already on dvd, I would have refused to buy this set out of spite (just as I did with XME) that an inferior series was getting a dvd release before the original series that added so much fascination in my childhood/teen years and won over my complete undying loyalty and love for the 90's show and comics. So Lionsgate has Disney to thank for selling me this copy of W&TXM since I can watch it with the full knowledge that I have my beloved 90's show on my dvd shelf, just in case this show doesn't do it for me and I need to pull out the 90's show to remind/reassure myself of why I fell in love with the X-Men in the first place.
Jack

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

Oh and I prefer badass Cyclops over boring, predictable,boyscout Cyclops.


To each their own. I prefer competent Cyclops to incompetent Cyclops.

I agree.

Plus, Cyclops could still be a badass, not be boring and still be a competent leader.

Unfortunately what we got on this show was only a partially badass Cyclops that was still boring and not only incompetent as a leader, but pretty incompetent as a character.

Like I've said before, Cyclops' depression and bad attitude over the loss of Jean, as well as Wolverine becoming the reluctant and barely competent leader of the team, were actually interesting premises for the series -- But none of that was ever properly dealt with, it was hardly the focus of the writing and direction of the show or was ever satisfyingly resolved. We should have seen a turn around with Cyclops' character with him displaying why exactly he was the perfect leader of The X-Men.

Sorry to go off on another long rant about this, but it's funny how much was set up under this Wolverine/Cyclops switch concept, and yet how many missed opportunities the producers had with the idea. I recall this one scene in the beginning of the series where Professor X tells Wolverine that he must lead the X-Men right in front of Cyclops, with Cyclops walking out of the room as if he had his feelings hurt or was at least annoyed by it. At first, I thought that it was just Charles punishing, yet testing Scott, knowing that Logan was not right for the position and that it would eventually push Scott to redeem himself --But in the end, it seems like Charles was really serious about Wolverine leading the team, because he actually saw how Cyclops was no longer capable or worthy. When it comes down to it, Cyclops failed, Professor X was disappointed, Wolverine got the spotlight (again), the premise was wasted, the series was just mediocre never meeting its potential, and the fans got cheated.

[James Harvey]

To promote this new Wolverine and The X-Men: The Complete Series Blu-ray/DVD release, Marvel Animation Age (http://marvel.toonzone.net/news.php?action=fullnews&id=581) recently held a brief Q & A with Series Head Writer Greg Johnson looking back at the fan-favorite series. Click here (http://marvel.toonzone.net/news.php?action=fullnews&id=581) to check it out and stay tuned for a closer look at the Blu-ray/DVD release, including exclusive images and content.

Further thoughts on this Blu-ray/DVD release?

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

Greg Johnson: I’ve been an animation writer on Marvel projects for a number of years, and when they were contemplating a Wolverine-centric series, they asked a handful of people to pitch their take. I came in with a version of ‘Days of Future Past” with Xavier in the future, effectively removing him from the X-Men and allowing someone else to come in as leader. So by design, the concept lent itself to a series where Wolverine could feasibly be forced into a leadership role. That was enough to get me the job. So I developed it further with Craig Kyle, and then I served as Head Writer on the 26 episode season.


Ugh! By effectively removing Professor X from the X-Men, that lead to Wolverine being the leader?

No, no, no! There's still Cyclops!

If they wanted a Wolverine-centric series, they should have just made a Wolverine solo series instead of compromising the X-Men as a team show.



Greg Johnson: The “Age of Apocalypse” books were their own universe. But in our series, we needed the AoA to have logically developed from our modern day storyline. For example, Cyclops had to go from where he was in our series, to working for Apocalypse in the future, and that transition had to be plausible. We had many of those types of hoops to jump through, and the rules were slowly falling into place with nearly every script.


So the unresolved Cyclops as leader (or non-leader) issue connects with the unresolved Age of Apocalypse cliffhanger?

I'm not so sure I would have liked that either then, simply because again we're not seeing Cyclops as he really should be portrayed, as a heroic and capable leader. Instead we would have gotten just another corrupted version of the character.

There were definitely some more missed opportunities, especially when it came to Cyclops, than what Mr. Johnson addressed or was willing to admit. I don't hold him alone accountable, of course, but I'm still quite disappointed that with all the great talent involved on this series, no one could see how unjust Scott Summers was being treated as a character and how important he really is to the X-Men.

In the end, X-Men: Evolution, regardless of how different the interpretations were, at least depicted the characters reverently with respect -- especially when it came to Cyclops as a leader.

[spyke]

I'm not so sure I would have liked that either then, simply because again we're not seeing Cyclops as he really should be portrayed, as a heroic and capable leader. Instead we would have gotten just another corrupted version of the character.



Welcome to the modern age of superhero comics and cartoons, where the heroic leader with high morals is either (a) turned into a dark and brooding hero who has no problem with killing or creating a black ops/wetworks team to specifically kill the bad guys or (b) is replaced as the leader by a more popular and "KEWL" character who has no problem with killing or who recently had a huge hit movie made about them (like Iron Man).

[TheVileOne]

LOL, you guys really need to let go of this vision you have of this perfect amazing revered leader that is Cyclops.

You are citing recent things that happened in the comics. Well not so recently Cyclops has been a complete and utter jerk before too. After Jean supposedly died he left the X-men. He married a woman that looked just like Jean and had an infant son. As soon as he finds out Jean's alive, he dumps his family to be with Jean again. Oh and he decides not to tell Jean that he got married and had a son.

So just saying, all these things you are complaining about in the show there is precedence for happening in the classic comic storylines.

I wanted to see what was going to happen in season 2, but since its not happening we really don't know how it was ultimately going to end.

I also recently did an interview with Greg Johnson on the DVD release and we talked about Thor: Tales of Asgard as well. Here is the link:

http://www.411mania.com/movies/columns/157362/411mania-Interviews:--Greg-Johnson.htm

[Venom Melendez]

That's because Lionsgate got the DVD rights for the series and Lionsgate always does a great job with Marvel animation. Disney's DVD releases for Marvel animation are generally always bad, shoddy, and/or disappointing.

Just saying if it was SHOUT! or BCI, we'd have gotten complete series or complete season sets.

Granted, isn't it sony that has to release a spectacular Spider-Man DVD? Also, they do have the first season on DVD.


This is a pass for me. After getting reacquainted with the X-Men, I checked out the first three episodes of this...

...And man it's awful. It's just godawful. The action feels castrated, everything is so subdued, the characters are so... off in personality and performance, and worst of all: it feels sterile. I can't find myself really engaging with these characters, and even worse when I have to convince myself that Logan is supposed to be the leader. I'm sorry, but I can't see it. ><

Except he has lead teams before.

And honestly, Storm will always be a better Leader than Cyclops.


LOL, you guys really need to let go of this vision you have of this perfect amazing revered leader that is Cyclops.

You are citing recent things that happened in the comics. Well not so recently Cyclops has been a complete and utter jerk before too. After Jean supposedly died he left the X-men. He married a woman that looked just like Jean and had an infant son. As soon as he finds out Jean's alive, he dumps his family to be with Jean again. Oh and he decides not to tell Jean that he got married and had a son.

So just saying, all these things you are complaining about in the show there is precedence for happening in the classic comic storylines.



Exactly, but i guess Cyclops fans like to think he's perfect and that can do no wrong, forgetting that he can be a Jerk and make moraly questionable decisions(No offence to anyone btw).

In all honesty, this was a great show.


or who recently had a huge hit movie made about them (like Iron Man).

If you mean the upcoming Avengers Cartoon, Iron Man was the original Leader and he has lead the team on other occasions.

[TheVileOne]

So its actually being faithful to the comics with having Cyclops leave the X-men after he believed Jean died. :D

Venom, I think Disney does have the DVD rights for the 90's Spider-man series though. And I think that basically means we will never see quality season releases for that show. They also released 90's Fantastic Four and Iron Man.

[SKDarkDragon]

Eh, comics change characters over time. But usually new adaptations of characters utilize their most popular and well-known attributes, because that's what people like and what they are expecting. Characters become known for certain features.

It's fine to take liberties and change things up, but it's not always going to work. For me, and for others, I see being a leader as being part of Cyclop's personality, and being a loner as being part of Wolverine's. It's fine to mix it up for a new take on the characters, but I feel like you have to give justice to the character. From what I saw, Cyclops' character was not really likable at all, and frankly, I thought Wolverine was far too "nice-guy."

It's like turning Rogue into a prissy valley girl, Iceman into an emo kid, or Beast into an irresponsible drug addict. It's just ... not them. XD; I think people would be unhappy with those portrayals because those are not even close to their "accepted" personalities. So I think that's the main point here.

And if you guys don't like Cyclops anyway, then obviously you're not going to care if it's a poor adaptation. XD

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

If anyone has actually read any of my posts about Cyclops, you can see that I was totally open to the idea of him being changed to a depressed moody brooding loner -- What my problem is is that he stayed that way throughout the whole series and we never got to see him as a leader either before or after it was all said and done. He basically had no real story arc, no moment of redemption as a character. Yeah, he kicked a little ass here and there, but for the most part, he was still just depicted as a pathetic shell of his former self (a self we never really got to see in this series) -- All while Wolverine got the spotlight!

I absolutely love when characters do something one wouldn't expect from them, but there should always be a reason and if it's a total departure from the way the character has always been portrayed, then you need to show an evolution or a progression as to why the character has changed.

That's what a character arc is!

It's not a matter of being a Cyclops fan versus being a Wolverine fan -- it's a matter of being an X-Men fan! Or, even better, it's a matter of being a fan of good writing and doing justice to the characters!

[Monte]

So far, i think i still like the old 90's x-men the best with it's only fault being its dated 90's art style. X-men Evolution was enjoyable for the most part, but the high school setting got kind of all old after a while and would have much preferred to see them move on from that (like with what we saw in the very last episode when we got a glimps into the future)

Wolverine and the X-men was good but i really did get sick of all the focus on Wolverine. Honestly, it feels like the only reason they did this was because of Executive meddling; "Wolverine is the most popular X-men so let's give him as much screen time as humanly possible". Really when Professor X tells Wolverine that he has to lead and has to find a way to make it work, i can't help but feel that's what the producers basically told the writers. I mean, even if Cyclops was too damaged to lead, wouldn't maybe Storm generally be a better leader than the lone wolf who even while leading STILL goes off to pursue personal agendas? Honestly one thing that doesn't help is when one episode you have wolverine yelling at someone for going lone wolf on them and then the next episode he does pretty much the same damn thing... If anything though, i think I would have preferred seeing Cyclops slowly grow out of his depression and take over the reigns of leadership; though this is something i do not think is really possible when the show is called "WOLVERINE and the X-men"...

Really one thing i prefer about the 90's x-men and evolution is that they never showed such favoritism. For the most part it was about the team not the individuals... And when it wasn't,each of the x-men generally did get their chance to shine, occasionally getting whole episodes to focus on themselves. I mean maybe some members got a little more attention then others but it wasn't so painfully obvious as it is with WatXM...



If they wanted a Wolverine-centric series, they should have just made a Wolverine solo series instead of compromising the X-Men as a team show.

Indeed. Instead of making X-men series they should have made something more like a spin-off an X-men series... Perhaps a series that's focused on showing us his life BEFORE the X-men; Like making a series that just focus's on Wolverine's days as weapon X or something like that... granted not sure if there is enough material for more than one season, but that's part of why it's a spin-off; this series would take place in the same universe as one of the X-men animated series

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

Right on, Monte!

And, if I may, another missed opportunity on the part of the writers/directors/producers, minor as it may be, was the inability to fully utilize the cool new look they gave Cyclops...

The trenchcoat should have been used more affectively as a visual metaphor. He wore it over his X-Men uniform while mourning Jean, almost symbolically representing how he did not want to be seen. He covered up as if to cloak himself and hide even in plain sight from the others. The trenchcoat also served him mentally as a form of protection, while emotionally inside he felt weak and vulnerable.

And what we should have seen happen at some point in the series was Cyclops stripping himself of that trenchcoat. There were quite a few moments where it would have been great, but, at the very least, it should have happened at the end of the last episode during or after Jean's rescue. At that moment, it would have been perfect to see Cyclops throw off the coat and basically say, "I'm back!" With Wolverine giving the nod of acceptance and stepping down from his temporary position as leader.

That's what I think should have happened anyway.

[Spider-Man]

Amazon got my Blu-ray copy of Wolverine and The X-Men: The Complete Series to me today and I went through the featurettes and some of the episodes so far. The commentaries seem to be the same ones from the single-disc releases but having all these episodes on Blu-ray is great but I can't say for sure since I haven't listened to the commentaries on those other DVDs for some time. The video quality looks really good definitely better than the DVDs and it just looks so good. I really hope this is the first of many Marvel TV Blu-rays...

[JTMarsh]

Cyclops is not perfect, mostly because he's pretty much the poster child for character derailment (Marvel's efforts to "fix" poor storytelling by making the woman he married an evil clone of Jean who used her powers to mess with his head can only do so much), but his storyline in W&TXM went NOWHERE, and that is simply not acceptable from guys who are supposed to be seasoned pros.

But I guess that doesn't matter to the fans who just want to drool over Wolverine and his shiny metal claws and conveniently ignore all the innocent lives Wolvie ruined before he decided to become a superhero and ignore all the broken homes Wolvie left in his wake and never bothered looking back at the casualties.

[TheVileOne]

Actually if you guys read one of the earlier interviews I did with Greg Johnson for this site, he did mention that this idea started as a solo Wolverine series before it was expanded into an X-men series as well.

I felt the Cyclops storyline went there. For starters, Cyclops as a person attracted Emma Frost who actually not only liked him for who he was but truly felt guilty of all the suffering she directly caused him. And it is because of her relationship with Scott that she sacrificed herself in order to stop the Phoenix force. Cyclops did get his blood up and he found and saved Jean and he was clearly in a much better place at the end of the season than he was at the start of it. Ultimately we didn't really get to see the whole story come to fruition though since the show didn't continue. And we don't really know what would've happened or what was really planned. All we can do is speculate.

I don't think the show was obligated at all to show Cyclops as a leader. Two other animated shows had already done that with the X-men. And the point of the show was that Cyclops USED to be that guy but he was a lost and broken man. Fans simply don't like the status quo to be altered it has to be as how they best remember it. People don't want to remember that after one of the biggest and most significant stories ever in the comics, Cyclops abandoned the X-men. He turned his back on them. He *left*. Ultimately he came back to lead the team again, but I mean why deny everything else that happened and only remember what you feel is appropriate?

Its like people actually worked up anger in that the new Avenger show, Iron Man is being recognized as the leader despite Iron Man having been a leader of the Avengers and the essential founder. Captain America is known as the leader but he was not part of the original group. But why does a new show automatically have to set it up that way with having Cap as the leader? I don't see the point. People can be annoyed that Hulk actually talks like he's had a high school level education but then how can you deny those instances in the comics where Hulk could you know talk in complete sentences and having a vocabulary beyond HULK SMASH.

I think fans would be better off accepting that Cyclops is a human being and he's not infallible and he makes mistakes. He's a hero and sometimes heroes stumble.

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

Actually if you guys read one of the earlier interviews I did with Greg Johnson for this site, he did mention that this idea started as a solo Wolverine series before it was expanded into an X-men series as well.

I felt the Cyclops storyline went there. For starters, Cyclops as a person attracted Emma Frost who actually not only liked him for who he was but truly felt guilty of all the suffering she directly caused him. And it is because of her relationship with Scott that she sacrificed herself in order to stop the Phoenix force. Cyclops did get his blood up and he found and saved Jean and he was clearly in a much better place at the end of the season than he was at the start of it. Ultimately we didn't really get to see the whole story come to fruition though since the show didn't continue. And we don't really know what would've happened or what was really planned. All we can do is speculate.

I don't think the show was obligated at all to show Cyclops as a leader. Two other animated shows had already done that with the X-men. And the point of the show was that Cyclops USED to be that guy but he was a lost and broken man. Fans simply don't like the status quo to be altered it has to be as how they best remember it. People don't want to remember that after one of the biggest and most significant stories ever in the comics, Cyclops abandoned the X-men. He turned his back on them. He *left*. Ultimately he came back to lead the team again, but I mean why deny everything else that happened and only remember what you feel is appropriate?

Its like people actually worked up anger in that the new Avenger show, Iron Man is being recognized as the leader despite Iron Man having been a leader of the Avengers and the essential founder. Captain America is known as the leader but he was not part of the original group. But why does a new show automatically have to set it up that way with having Cap as the leader? I don't see the point. People can be annoyed that Hulk actually talks like he's had a high school level education but then how can you deny those instances in the comics where Hulk could you know talk in complete sentences and having a vocabulary beyond HULK SMASH.

I think fans would be better off accepting that Cyclops is a human being and he's not infallible and he makes mistakes. He's a hero and sometimes heroes stumble.


All very solid points actually. Again, I didn't mind the premise at all with Cyclops being so flawed and being replaced by Wolverine as leader, I just felt we never got to see that full character arc properly realized.

I suppose what it all comes down to is the fact that with this being its own series and having no continuity with the two previous series, X-Men (The Animated 90's series) and X-Men: Evolution, I personally would have preferred seeing a respectful iconic interpretation of Scott first and then have him get deconstructed along the course of the show -- or the opposite approach of having him deconstructed from the beginning and then built back up into a redeeming character. I suppose the latter was attempted, but just not entirely executed well. Had this series actually been a continuation of X-Men: Evolution, I probably would have accepted what was done to Cyclops a lot more, because in Evo we at least got to see how he originally was and how capable a leader he became, along with how much he loved Jean, so all that would have made his decline in WatX a lot more dramatic, believable, and acceptable -- but because WatX pretty much stands alone as a series, we only see this one broken side of Cyclops, and if you're someone who is just being introduced to his character and the X-Men as a whole through this series, you're going to have a false view of it all and most likely a bad opinion of Cyclops. And after the terrible way his character was dealt with in X-Men 3: The Last Stand, I've really just had enough of how mistreated the character has become. Obviously WatX is nowhere near as bad as X3 was, but I still feel it missed the mark quite a bit.

Regardless of my criticisms, I've decided to go ahead and order the DVD set anyway. Hopefully we'll see some sort of continuation of the series someday, and I'm even more hopeful that Cyclops will be treated more respectfully the next time around.

[BigEclipse]

I am a long time X-Men fan and Cyclops has always been my favorite character. I really enjoyed this series and have purchased the series set. I didn't have a hard time accepting the fact that Scott wasn't the leader at all. I looked at all the circumstances that surrounded his leaving of the X-Men and can fully understand why he wouldn't be in any shape to lead, despite being the "boy scott" or "rock" everyone made him out to be.

In one day, Scott lost the love of his life and first true friend, as well as the closest thing he had to a father. Couple that with his tragic upbringing, and the curse of his powers and you can see how broken he could get. Actually, I was more surprised that Storm wasn't even considered for leadership, and had such a tiny role in the series as a whole. It was as if she were background, despite being one of the most powerful, and interesting mutant characters in the Marvel universe.

I think you should give this series a shot. It does start out slow, and I was very dissapointed after the first 5 episodes when they aired on Nicktoons, but once the show hit mid-season stride, it was everything I could have hoped for in an X-Men series. You have to give the producers credit for taking basically everything you know about the X-Men and turning it upside down, but still managing to steep the series in its roots. I even enjoyed "Code of Conduct" as it had some of the best fight sequences I've seen in Marvel animation.

[Barbossa]

Thanks Big Eclipse for being open minded and understanding the show.I agree when Wolverine and Rogue fought the ninjas,that was cool

[JTMarsh]

I found it kind of hard to feel any sincerity in Cycke's mourning since his relationship with Jean was very poorly defined; he might as well have been mourning the loss of his favorite running shoes. The few times we see her she's either scolding him like a bad puppy for attacking Logan, an amnesiac who doesn't know what in the name of Jack Kirby's going on, or being hijacked by the Hellfire Club. Instead of anything suggesting an actual romance we just see her saving him being crushed by a bus or pinning Emma to the wall and binding her with pipes for kissing an unconcious Scott, and that's just not enough to convince me she had a legitimate relationship with him. Superman saves people from similar life threatening perils all the time, but he doesn't fall in love with them (unless of course they're Lois Lane).

I wonder if the idea was to make the audience feel that Jean was not truly right for Scott and that he would be better off with Emma, seeing as how most of the writing staff preferred Emma. "Breakdown" you've got Emma being all sympathetic and "aw you poor schmuck" in contrast to Jean being cold and basically an inch away from dumping him. I'm guessing the only reason Jean lived while Emma died was because they had plans to do AoA and felt they needed Jean to make that work, or they just wanted to show her acting jealous in reaction to Scott [possibly] pining for the dead Emma.

About the Storm issue - they could have had Storm be a victim of the "cure" early in the series to at least give a reason for her being less involved in fights. Naturally the cure wouldn't be permanent - being in prototype phase - and slowly over the course of the season her powers would start to come back to her. Who knows, it might have given her an actual subplot.

[BigEclipse]

Watching the episode commentaries on the DVD you can see the producers really loved working on this show. I wouldn't be surprised if they tried sneaking this version of the X-Men (or one very, very similar) into A:EMH somewhere down the line. The core vocal cast is already on board.

[Monte]

When it comes to Cyclops, I can be fine with him not being a leader, but what really gets me is his seriously lack of growth... i mean he doesn't really seem to grow much over the course of the series; That's 26 epsidoes where he probably should have had a reasonable amount of focus considering how Jean(and the phoenix) was one of driving forces of this season. Sure he's better off at the end than he was at the beginning but that's mainly because he got Jean back; that's not really growth so much as just seeing another side of his character... true growth would be him willing to move on without Jean. Afterall if he doesn't learn to move on, then if were to loose Jean again he would likely fall to pieces all over again...

Furtharmore the series did not show much hope for him with growth... the next season was to focus on the age of apocalypse, and seeing how Cyclops was supposed to end up joining him, that would mean that the next season would likely focus more on him going even further downward so that he can reach "might become a villain" levels. Honestly Cyclops would have to work just maintain his current low point...

really it makes me think it would have been better to start with him at his high point (Jean would have to be around for this to happen). Then at the end of the season we can see him fall apart when Jean disappears... in the second season, Being at an all time low helps make way for him to have the dangerous potential to be a villain, and this is when we are dealing with AoA future... Scott must learn to move on and remember what's truly important to pick himself back up and thus avoid joining Apocalypse and the season ends with AoA being avoided... Season 3 then could actually be the one that focuses primarily on the Phoenix force.

but that would be how a general X-men series might have gone, one that shares it's focus on each of the X-men... WatXM however had Wolverine as it's primary focus and thus the rest of the X-men were more like side characters to him. And That leads me to the source of my beef with this series... while overall it was a good series, the writing feels compromised due to the need to make sure Wolverine was in every episode and had a big role to play it most of episodes as well as every plot and sub-plot. The rest of the cast just doesn't get to shine as much as they usually do in the other X-men series

I might also add that i didn't much care for this incarnation of wolverine. For the sake of making him into the leader it seems the writers really turn up his more kind and understanding side. Granted in retrospect the 90's wolverine was not my favorite either; he was so rough that the compassionate moments he had felt jarring and out of character. My favorite would have to be the X-men evolution take... you could tell that he did care, but at the same time you could tell that he preferred to downplay it (often sounding really annoyed when he had to deal with people) and thus making him seem like the rough lone wolf with a good heart... it's a nice blend between the two.


I found it kind of hard to feel any sincerity in Cycke's mourning since his relationship with Jean was very poorly defined; he might as well have been mourning the loss of his favorite running shoes. The few times we see her she's either scolding him like a bad puppy for attacking Logan, an amnesiac who doesn't know what in the name of Jack Kirby's going on, or being hijacked by the Hellfire Club. Instead of anything suggesting an actual romance we just see her saving him being crushed by a bus or pinning Emma to the wall and binding her with pipes for kissing an unconcious Scott, and that's just not enough to convince me she had a legitimate relationship with him. Superman saves people from similar life threatening perils all the time, but he doesn't fall in love with them (unless of course they're Lois Lane).

That is true, I suppose the real problem could be that the series was not self-contained; it relies on the audience have pre-existing knowledge of the X-men and their relationships. If you have seen any of the previous X-men series or movies, then you know that Cyclops and Jean were in love and had a strong relationship. Further evidence for this might be the relationship between Wolverine and rouge; Why did those two seem so close to the point that Rouge felt like he was the only family she had? I don't recall any explanation in the series itself; only thing i can conclude is if you consider the first Movie. Unless i am forgeting something since it's been a while since i saw the whole series, another thing i might ask is where the phoenix force came from in the first place; it's there inside Jean but we don't know why... Frankly i'm actually reminded of the confusion I originally had with Domino... I had no idea who she was or what her powers were and i think it took a while for the series to actually make it clear... It's like the writers were familiar with the comics and previous incarnations, but did not take into account that for some kids this series would be their FIRST real x-men experience

We may even be seeing this in the avengers series; atleast as far as i can judge by the mirco series... (which others have mentioned, have the same writers)
Ant-man, Wasp, Thor, Captain America, and Black Panther have not had a recent incarnation in other media in a long time, and the micro series has given us enough information on them for us to know who they are and where they are coming from... but not so much Iron man; I mean for an episode called "Ironman is born" it was not much of an origin story at all; they mentioned his hatred for people using his tech but they didn't really go much into his personal physical condition; we didn't even get to see war machine and only got a brief reference... i'd also might add that the scenes of us seeing Tony Stark inside the mask look A LOT like what we saw in the movies... it makes me think that unlike some other avengers, the writer do not feel the need to really go into detail with Iron man since most viewers are familiar with the movies... Hulk might be another one, though i myself never saw the last movie

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

When it comes to Cyclops, I can be fine with him not being a leader, but what really gets me is his seriously lack of growth...

Yep.


Furtharmore the series did not show much hope for him with growth... the next season was to focus on the age of apocalypse, and seeing how Cyclops was supposed to end up joining him, that would mean that the next season would likely focus more on him going even further downward so that he can reach "might become a villain" levels.

Uh-huh.


...I suppose the real problem could be that the series was not self-contained; it relies on the audience have pre-existing knowledge of the X-men and their relationships.


Right.


These are exactly some of the problems I saw with the series and tried to illustrate in my earlier posts here.

[JTMarsh]

When it comes to Cyclops, I can be fine with him not being a leader, but what really gets me is his seriously lack of growth... i mean he doesn't really seem to grow much over the course of the series; That's 26 epsidoes where he probably should have had a reasonable amount of focus considering how Jean(and the phoenix) was one of driving forces of this season. Sure he's better off at the end than he was at the beginning but that's mainly because he got Jean back; that's not really growth so much as just seeing another side of his character... true growth would be him willing to move on without Jean. Afterall if he doesn't learn to move on, then if were to loose Jean again he would likely fall to pieces all over again...

Yeah, the lack of growth on his part is what's most annoying about it. He never really overcame his problems, he just waited until things changed in his favor. He didn't really even save Jean in the end, Emma Frost had to save Jean for him, and got blown up for her troubles. Why either woman would be interested him isn't clear either since he's never shown having any positive qualities, unless you consider height a positive quality. 'Breakdown' pretty much establishes that he was never really a leader or even a passable hero, but a puppet who needed someone to pull his strings; this is most apparent when Jean has to bail him out from Magneto and we hear her telepathically reach into his head & say the cringe worthy line: "We'll do this together." So instead of Cyclops overcoming his cowardice by himself, he waits for his alleged girlfriend to rescue him, which is pathetic while also suggesting she only tolerated him because she enjoyed keeping the hapless numbskull under her thumb. And where is it written in the comics that he was the laughingstock of the original 5 before Jean came along and [supposedly] fixed his life?

Not seeing Cyclops as a leader before his downfall hurt the integrity of his arc since we don't see a grace period for him. How can we believe this is some terrible descent for him when there is no high point of his life to contrast it with? The high point was crucial to making this work since this wasn't a continuation of either the 90s series or Evolution's and this Cyclops is clearly not the same guy from those incarnations, so you can't plug in his work from those shows here and say "that's where he fell from" because it's not the same version of the character. Instead we get an unsympathetic bum whose just not worthy. Maybe he did have a crummy life, but so did Magneto, and I found myself feeling more sympathy for Magneto at the end than I did for Cyclops. At least Magneto became a rallying anti-hero on his own gumption.

The lack of a team dynamic for the X-Men as a whole was also frustrating. The Hellfire Club showed more chemistry in 3 episodes than the X-Men did in 26. The Brotherhood was more engaging and fun to watch than the X-Men themselves were. That makes it hard to root for the 'heroes' when they're fighting for their lives and the future of the Earth against giant man killing robots and then facing that great big bird the Phoenix. I honestly felt worse for Quicksilver getting banished along with his dad from what was left of Genosha than I did for the X-Men getting spanked [albeit off camera] by the Phoenix, which is sad considering they got second billing.

[joltman]

Sorry to be 'that guy', but can't all of this Cyclops talk be moved to it's own thread, so this can actually focus on the DVD/BD? When I see a thread has new posts, I like to think they will be on topic :)

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

Sorry to be 'that guy', but can't all of this Cyclops talk be moved to it's own thread, so this can actually focus on the DVD/BD? When I see a thread has new posts, I like to think they will be on topic :)

That's true, but the funny thing is that aside from all the "Cyclops talk" there hasn't been much in the way of posts about this DVD/BD collection.

I guess most folks don't deem it worthy of conversation anymore even if they did like the show. ;)

[Wonderwall]

I liked the show well enough but had a lot of criticisms that you can find on the talkbacks like missed storyline opportunities, poor action and storyboarding at times, boring Wolverine and his lame episodes, and poor development of the X men ( Instrestingly I didn't really have a big problem with Cyclops like a few people here did ) so this DVD set isn't a must buy with just the episodes.

I am interested in the 29 commentaries however. I'd like to know if it's really informative and might have some knowledge of the show I wasn't aware of or is just back patting that this crew has done a few times in the past.

[Barbossa]

The thing with Cyclops isn't a big deal to most people.Its just a few people pretending like it is when the majority have no problem with it

I have never seen so much respect given to a superhero toon dvd release,that tells you something.Can't wait to get mine:D

[suss2it]

The thing with Cyclops isn't a big deal to most people.Its just a few people pretending like it is when the majority have no problem with itPeople aren't saying that it isn't a problem with most people, they're saying it's a problem with them. And just because something is okay with the majority of people it doesn't always mean that it's good/right.


I have never seen so much respect given to a superhero toon dvd release,that tells you something.Can't wait to get mine:DI agree, and I hope that Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes gets an equally good release.

[Venom Melendez]

If anyone has actually read any of my posts about Cyclops, you can see that I was totally open to the idea of him being changed to a depressed moody brooding loner -- What my problem is is that he stayed that way throughout the whole series and we never got to see him as a leader either before or after it was all said and done.

Because there wasn't a second season. Consideriong they were plannin on a second season, it's not hard to belive we would have development then.



It's not a matter of being a Cyclops fan versus being a Wolverine fan.!


No offence, but that's kinda how it comes off as.

[JTMarsh]

I am interested in the 29 commentaries however. I'd like to know if it's really informative and might have some knowledge of the show I wasn't aware of or is just back patting that this crew has done a few times in the past.
I never found the Yost/Kyle/Johnson commentaries to be all that interesting or informative. It's mostly just them making laughing at their own jokes as they riff on the show MST3K style.

I was also bummed that Colossus wasn't in the show. Is he really that hard to write for? Was coming up with a decent reintroduction episode really that difficult? Seriously, watching Colossus fight the Hulk would have been a lot more fun than a lame, watered down rehash of Hulk Vs. Wolverine. The only silver lining was that at least he wasn't there to get punked by ninjas in 'Code of Conduct'.

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

I received the DVD set today, and I will say it's done with quality. There are three discs in a solid plastic amaray case with a cardboard o-sleeve. The discs are all one sided (no flippers), but despite the amount of material they hold, the picture and sound quality is great. I don't have blu-ray, but I can only imagine how awesome it must look in that format.

[suss2it]

Because there wasn't a second season. Consideriong they were plannin on a second season, it's not hard to belive we would have development then.I think he may have gotten even more angst seeing as how he becomes a villain in the future.

[Rick Jones]

I received the DVD set today, and I will say it's done with quality. There are three discs in a solid plastic amaray case with a cardboard o-sleeve. The discs are all one sided (no flippers), but despite the amount of material they hold, the picture and sound quality is great. I don't have blu-ray, but I can only imagine how awesome it must look in that format.
Cool to hear. I'm still not a member of the blu-ray nation either but I have to wait until my next check before I pick this up. I haven't rewatched any episodes since the season finale so it will be nice to revisit and it will make a cool addition next to all of the other Lionsgate/Marvel dvds.

[TheVileOne]

My full review of the DVD version of this release is now up:

http://www.411mania.com/movies/dvd_reviews/158020/Wolverine-and-The-X-men:--The-Complete-Series-DVD-Review.htm

As far as compression goes, everything looked pretty good on my flatscreen. The colors and animation looks really fresh, clean, and bright.

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

My full review of the DVD version of this release is now up:

http://www.411mania.com/movies/dvd_reviews/158020/Wolverine-and-The-X-men:--The-Complete-Series-DVD-Review.htm

As far as compression goes, everything looked pretty good on my flatscreen. The colors and animation looks really fresh, clean, and bright.


Good review, VileOne. Your appreciation of the series is obviously greater than mine, but your review doesn't come off as bias, and, unlike a lot of other reviews, I'm glad to see you've acknowledged the questionable direction of Cyclops and the overexposure of Wolverine (I'm not taking credit, but I actually feel as if you've read my posts and considered my own personal opinions :D). Anyway, despite my own problems with the series, there is still much to admire about it, as your review fairly points out.

[James Harvey]

Marvel Animation Age has a look at the DVD menu systems and package artwork from the recent Wolverine and The X-Men - The Complete Series DVD and Blu-ray releases from Lionsgate Home Entertainment and Marvel Animation, now available to own. Click here (http://marvel.toonzone.net/news.php?action=fullnews&id=584) or on the image below for more.

http://marvel.toonzone.net/wolverinexmen/reviews/releases/completeseries/t-dvdmenu18.jpg (http://marvel.toonzone.net/news.php?action=fullnews&id=584)

[thecollektor]

I'm still on the fence about buying this release. I don't like the package artwork. Why didn't they go with the cartoon art??? Where's Storm in the interior DVD menu???:( Colossus should have been a member through out the show. Now no season 2.:sad:

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

I'm still on the fence about buying this release. I don't like the package artwork. Why didn't they go with the cartoon art???

Sure it doesn't reflect the actual animated style, but I actually love that Adi Granov cover. It's still the same characters and costumes, it's just a different artist's interpretation.


Where's Storm in the interior DVD menu???:(

Where's Storm in the show? is a better question. She was hardly in it.

I would have much rather seen more of Storm than that terrible version of Forge.

[NBM05]

I picked this up on Blu-ray the day it came out, but I've only had the chance to watch the first episode so far (it was a busy week). Anyway, I have to say it looks great in high def. The picture is very sharp and vibrant. I also like the art style of the show as well, so the presentation is really nice.

I watched the whole series when it originally aired, and think it was well done overall. There were some great, action packed and well animated episodes, and the writing was generally well done. While I was hoping to see Cyclops snap out of his funk, I don't really hold it against the series because they were planning a second season and I respect (and often hope for) long form story telling in these shows. The show touchd on a lot of the mutant world and characters, and stayed true to their comic interpretations and comics (which was nice).

Of the recent Marvel shows, I think Specatacular Spider-Man was the best, but Wolverine and the X-men wasn't far behind, and both were quite a bit ahead of Iron Man Armoured Adventures. It's Ironic that Iron Man is the only one of the three that didn't get cancelled. Based on rating and quality, both SSM and WXM should have continued, but unfortunuately the behind the scenes stuff ended both shows too early. I would have loved another season of each.

[Barbossa]

Both SSM and WXM should have continued but I am more than happy with what we got ,both shows are a lot better than their 90s counterpart,and IMO
has made Marvel catch up with DC when it comes to animated shows

[James Harvey]

To provide an example, below are four images from the Blu-ray release of Wolverine and The X-Men: The Complete Series. Images are courtesy of Adam Tyner. Click on the thumbnails for a closer look at each respective image.

http://marvel.toonzone.net/wolverinexmen/reviews/releases/completeseries/t-image1.jpg (http://marvel.toonzone.net/wolverinexmen/reviews/releases/completeseries/image1.jpg)

http://marvel.toonzone.net/wolverinexmen/reviews/releases/completeseries/t-image2.jpg (http://marvel.toonzone.net/wolverinexmen/reviews/releases/completeseries/image2.jpg)

http://marvel.toonzone.net/wolverinexmen/reviews/releases/completeseries/t-image3.jpg (http://marvel.toonzone.net/wolverinexmen/reviews/releases/completeseries/image3.jpg)

http://marvel.toonzone.net/wolverinexmen/reviews/releases/completeseries/t-image4.jpg (http://marvel.toonzone.net/wolverinexmen/reviews/releases/completeseries/image4.jpg)

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

Earlier today I watched "eXcessive Force" -- the so-called badass Cyclops episode -- with the commentary track. It's actually the first episode I watched with the commentary on.

It's funny because producer Craig Kyle pretty much confirms what I said in an earlier post about how the series presents the characters as if the viewers have already had previous knowledge of them, and although this series is not a continuation of X-Men: Evolution, it almost demands the assumption that the characters are still the same people, regardless of their shift in personality and change in look.

I understand that they wanted to give you a different side to Cyclops in this series, and, as I said before, I agree with the premise, but I still find that the presentation of his character arc lacked displaying that contrasting leadership side which would have helped viewers (regardless of whether they were already familiar with the character or not) to greater appreciate the change he underwent after the loss of Jean.

Listening to the commentary, especially from writer Chris Yost who obviously loves Cyclops, certainly makes me believe that the creators had the best intentions, even though they might have been a bit flawed in their delivery. Still, I do have to admit to gaining a better appreciation for the series now that I can watch it on DVD and skip over some of the weaker episodes. Strangely enough, regardless of my criticisms, I find the episodes with Scott, and later with Jean, to be the better ones. And it's not just because I'm a "Cyclops fan."

In the end, I don't regret buying the Wolverine and The X-Men collection, but I still feel X-Men: Evolution is the superior show. Now if only Marvel would release Evo's fourth season on DVD...

[Andrew T. Hingson]

Is the retrospective feature on the set exclusive? It doesn't seem to be on volume 6.

[Spider-Man]

Is the retrospective feature on the set exclusive? It doesn't seem to be on volume 6.I believe it is exclusive. The only volume to have any featurettes was the first DVD and the rest had just commentaries and trailers. It's a good featurette too. I can't believe how great this show looks in Blu-ray. DVD Talk has a review of the Blu-ray:

http://www.dvdtalk.com/reviews/45004/wolverine-and-the-x-men-the-complete-series/

[Trevor]

The DVD release also has three discs.

Only 3 DVD's for the entire series. Plus the 29 commentaries that were released on the 6 individual volumes---wow, either Lionsgate used DVD-18's (the dual-sided discs), or had the compression cranked up to where the video-quality is probably worst than the individual volumes (even on those LIonsgate was compressing the show quite a bit when you compared it to the Liberation Canadian DVD's that had no commentaries, except in the Full Season release). If the DVD's are just 3-single-sided-dual-layer discs, then I'd suggest just getting the 6 volume set rather than the Complete series set.

That review on dvdtalk was interesting...but it also interesting how the reviewer mentions that the show is presented in 1.78:1 as its broadcast aspect ratio. I haven't watched the show on Teletoon recently, but I seem to recall that back in 2008 and 2009, when the show was on the air, it was being aired in 4:3 by YTV and Teletoon and a few people on this forum who live in the US also mentioned that Cartoon Network was also airing it in 4:3 down there. I would've used the description that Warner Brothers tends to use when they are describing a TV show that was originally aired in 4:3 but is on DVD (or Blu-Ray) in 16:9.

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

Only 3 DVD's for the entire series. Plus the 29 commentaries that were released on the 6 individual volumes---wow, either Lionsgate used DVD-18's (the dual-sided discs), or had the compression cranked up to where the video-quality is probably worst than the individual volumes (even on those LIonsgate was compressing the show quite a bit when you compared it to the Liberation Canadian DVD's that had no commentaries, except in the Full Season release). If the DVD's are just 3-single-sided-dual-layer discs, then I'd suggest just getting the 6 volume set rather than the Complete series set.


Trust me, the quality is extraordinarily great considering how much you get on these 3 single-sided DVDs.

[Adam Tyner]

That review on dvdtalk was interesting...but it also interesting how the reviewer mentions that the show is presented in 1.78:1 as its broadcast aspect ratio.Aargh. It's force of habit. I didn't really think before writing that -- I guess in the back of my mind, I incorrectly assumed it aired somewhere in HD. I don't think I've ever come across a TV-on-BD set of a series that didn't air in high-def*, so it was a reflexive thing. I'm sorry about the mistake. It looks like the UK airings were in 16x9, but that's obviously not representative of how it was generally presented.

* There are exceptions like The Twilight Zone, The Prisoner, and Justice League that predate HD broadcasts, but those are still presented in the same aspect ratio in which they originally aired.

[Aaron]

...................
In the end, I don't regret buying the Wolverine and The X-Men collection, but I still feel X-Men: Evolution is the superior show. Now if only Marvel would release Evo's fourth season on DVD...

I wish they'd release S4 of that show... AND re-release S1 and S2 as 2-disc sets like the way they released S3.

Friggin' ticks me off.
That show was good stuff.
And the ONLY part I own is S3. So not fair.


Agreed on all counts.

...................
At one time, Wolverine was kind of like Boba Fett and Snake Eyes -- He used to be the mysterious character that everyone favored and wanted to see more of, but because you didn't get a lot of him, he retained that coolness factor. But now he's become so popular that Marvel has oversaturated the market with the character, putting him more and more in the status of Batman, which has kind of made him less interesting to me, especially when Cyclops has been made to look so much less important than he should be.
.....................


I TOTALLY agree. While I enjoyed this show a lot.
The whole coolness about Wolverine was the mystery.
But with the advent of the first live-action movie, and the Origin comic, and EVERYTHING that has come since then.... He's gotten really really overdone.
And I'm annoyed that ever since the late 90s, people see Cyclops as this sort of loser.

[Trevor]

I wish they'd release S4 of that show... AND re-release S1 and S2 as 2-disc sets like the way they released S3.

Friggin' ticks me off.
That show was good stuff.
And the ONLY part I own is S3. So not fair.





Considering that Warner Brother's rights to Season 1 Volume 4 and Season 3 expire within the next 8 months, we might see the complete series out by next Christmas from Disney, and Disney would only have to release it in 2 volumes of 3-discs each.

[Aaron]

Considering that Warner Brother's rights to Season 1 Volume 4 and Season 3 expire within the next 8 months, we might see the complete series out by next Christmas from Disney, and Disney would only have to release it in 2 volumes of 3-discs each.

Yeah, but studios love to milk it for all it's worth.
I don't see them re-releasing a show.
And if they do, I don't see them releasing it in 2 volumes.
Considering the 5 volume release of the 90s X-Men.
Which makes me sad.

I hope they do though. I'd love to get it all. I've got the 90s X-Men, and WatX.

I really enjoyed X-Men Evolution. S3 and S4 had the over-arching plot-lines which made them a bit better than S1 and S2, IMO. But S1 and S2 were really cool, and I LOVED Wolverine's orange costume in that series. And he pretty much stuck to the black outfit for S3 & S4.

I'd love to own them all. And I'd love to have the chance for a marathon of all 3 shows.

Mod Note: Let's remember to stay on topic as much as possible, please.

And on that note.

I've been watching the heck out of the episode commentaries from Greg, Craig, and Chris. They're rather informative at times, but mostly awesome and hilarious.
I'm having as much fun listening to them make fun of eachother and their own show as I would watching riff-trax from Mystery Science Theater 3000.
This is great stuff.

[tedcassidy]

I bought this complete series 3 disc set and finished watching it last night. It had some pretty good moments although I also really disliked several things about this series. I won't spoil things for anyone, but I absolutely HATED what they did with the Wendigo. And, I loathed their treatment of the Unstoppable Juggernaut.:mad:

[suss2it]

I bought this complete series 3 disc set and finished watching it last night. It had some pretty good moments although I also really disliked several things about this series. I won't spoil things for anyone, but I absolutely HATED what they did with the Wendigo. And, I loathed their treatment of the Unstoppable Juggernaut.:mad:I don't even think poor Juggernaut had a single line in all his appearances.

[Aaron]

I bought this complete series 3 disc set and finished watching it last night. It had some pretty good moments although I also really disliked several things about this series. I won't spoil things for anyone, but I absolutely HATED what they did with the Wendigo. And, I loathed their treatment of the Unstoppable Juggernaut.:mad:

My response is sorta spoilerish so for others that may not want to see it, I'll put it in the appropriate tabs.


I can see how you didn't like the Wendigo part.
But look at it this way (the way I did) and maybe it'll sit better with you.
Considering that SHIELD never told Logan what it was, and he and Bruce seemed to know what it was called, led me to this assumption. Wendigo already existed before this episode, and the reason SHIELD had all that data was because they were trying unsuccessfully to recreate a version for themselves. This could account for any discrepancies, I think.
From what I can find, a Wendigo was placed into SHIELD custody after 'She-Hulk' Vol. 4 #16.
So, it would make sense that they would run tests and experiments and whatnot with the creature


But I rather agree with your opinion on Juggernaut.

[Spider-Man]

There is no contest when comparing the Liberation Wolverine and The X-Men: The Complete First Season release to this Wolverine and The X-Men: The Complete Series. Even disregarding the fact that one is DVD and the other is Blu-ray (since that is an unfair comparison) I find that this collection seems more professionally done than the Liberation release.

I am still really impressed with the video and audio quality of the Blu-ray. There are some video glitches like some color banding and maybe some of that macroblocking/compression (I think that is what it is called) but it just seems so slight when comparing it to the quality of the Blu-ray. I have been skipping through different episodes in this collection and it is really great to see these episodes in such high quality. I love this collection.

[Rick Jones]

Just got my set today and I'm ecstatic . I sure hope Marvel continues making releases of this quality or higher in the future, whether it's with Buena Vista, Lionsgate, Shout Factory or whoever. I'm a special features addict, so I always look forward to sets like this rather than barebone releases with just the episodes or movie.

[Choppasmith]

So, wow, I must be the only one that had a problem with the Blu-ray? Weird. I ordered it from Amazon. Watched the first two discs just fine, but when I got to the third disc it just wouldn't play at all. I freaked thinking maybe my PS3 finally busted. But I looked at the disc and found a strange oblong ring near the center of the disc. The other two discs were fine.

I sent it back to Amazon for a new copy and both discs 2 and 3 had the strange scratch on it and wouldn't play. I sent it back to Amazon and they basically said "Oh well, looks like a problem with the manufacturer, we'll give you as a refund." Considering my sister wants a DVD copy I might just buy one and maybe re-buy the Blu-ray version for myself eventually.

[Ioz]

So, wow, I must be the only one that had a problem with the Blu-ray? Weird. I ordered it from Amazon. Watched the first two discs just fine, but when I got to the third disc it just wouldn't play at all. I freaked thinking maybe my PS3 finally busted. But I looked at the disc and found a strange oblong ring near the center of the disc. The other two discs were fine.

I sent it back to Amazon for a new copy and both discs 2 and 3 had the strange scratch on it and wouldn't play. I sent it back to Amazon and they basically said "Oh well, looks like a problem with the manufacturer, we'll give you as a refund." Considering my sister wants a DVD copy I might just buy one and maybe re-buy the Blu-ray version for myself eventually.Eek, I ordered the Blu-Ray set from Amazon a couple days ago. Hopefully, mine doesn't have the same problem.

[Trevor]

I just ordered the Blu-ray version from Amazon.ca a few days ago, so hopefully it won't have any problems.

[kid rabbit]

didnt this come out already?

[Trevor]

There is no contest when comparing the Liberation Wolverine and The X-Men: The Complete First Season release to this Wolverine and The X-Men: The Complete Series. Even disregarding the fact that one is DVD and the other is Blu-ray (since that is an unfair comparison) I find that this collection seems more professionally done than the Liberation release.



I think that there is quite the contest between the Liberation DVD complete release and the Lionsgate release. I just got the Lionsgate Blu-Ray today and, boy is there ever a ton of shimmering in the episodes that I've gone through so far (and that's mostly just fast forwarding to see if the discs work). The one episode that I watched completely (Future Sight 1) had shimmering about every 30 seconds. It seemed like someone was trying to make the 1080p picture look embossed. All the black outlines for everything and the accent lines (such as dimple lines, mouth-corner creases, etc) were just shimmering like crazy in a gray color, and it was very distracting and annoying. And I was watching it on a 1080p 120hz TV (and I did change the TV to 60hz to check but nothing changed) via HDMI. I had also received the Lionsgate Volume 6 DVD today, and I popped that in and Future Sight 1 had zero shimmering on the episode, just like the Liberation release. (All three were tested on the same Blu-Ray player, that was set to output at 1080p, and TV.)

The Blu-ray discs play fine, but there seems to be a major compression problem with the video.

[Bat-Fan Beyond]

I think that there is quite the contest between the Liberation DVD complete release and the Lionsgate release. I just got the Lionsgate Blu-Ray today and, boy is there ever a ton of shimmering in the episodes that I've gone through so far (and that's mostly just fast forwarding to see if the discs work). The one episode that I watched completely (Future Sight 1) had shimmering about every 30 seconds. It seemed like someone was trying to make the 1080p picture look embossed. All the black outlines for everything and the accent lines (such as dimple lines, mouth-corner creases, etc) were just shimmering like crazy in a gray color, and it was very distracting and annoying. And I was watching it on a 1080p 120hz TV (and I did change the TV to 60hz to check but nothing changed) via HDMI. I had also received the Lionsgate Volume 6 DVD today, and I popped that in and Future Sight 1 had zero shimmering on the episode, just like the Liberation release. (All three were tested on the same Blu-Ray player, that was set to output at 1080p, and TV.)

The Blu-ray discs play fine, but there seems to be a major compression problem with the video.

Maybe it's just the Blu-ray, I have the Complete Series set on regular DVD and I haven't noticed any shimmering or compression problems.

[Trevor]

Maybe it's just the Blu-ray, I have the Complete Series set on regular DVD and I haven't noticed any shimmering or compression problems.


Well whatever's causing it on the Blu-ray it is very annoying, since the lines will turn from black when the characters are still to a silver-gray when someone turns their head or there is some sort of action. Its odd how the DVD's have a better picture-quality than the Blu-Ray.

[Spider-Man]

I haven't noticed any issues watching this Blu-ray. Every episode plays just fine on my Playstation 3. I watched "Stolen Lives," "Battlelines," and Past Discretions" last night and all played without a problem. I remember watching "Foresight" a few months back and not noticing a single issue. The Blu-ray looks pretty amazing I think. Not perfect but just about.