The Royal Flush Gang

[Squall]

Didn't Bruce Timm say that The Royal Flush Gang would start appearing in Season 2? And that this would be a younger Royal Flush Gang, with very real and obvious connections to The Royal Flush gang in Batman Beyond?

Based on the Batman Beyond episodes featuring the later generation of The Royal Flush Gang, it doesn't look like they'd be a threat to the entire Justice League. Were they a clear and present danger to the Justice League (JLA, JSA, whatever... I never read the comic books!) in the comic books?

And how could Timm & Co. make them a threat to the Justice League on Justice League?

[Apache Chief]

Good question. I always thought they were pretty goofy villians, flying around on giant playing cards and what not. I'm sure Timm and co. will think of something.

[Wumbo]

agreed. they do seem like goofy villains, especially against
such a formidable team like the JL. however, continuity is
always cool. tying the 2 series together even further is a
nice touch.

--Wumbo-- :D

[Domino]

Remember that Deadshot stood up to all of the League for a little while, and he's just a guy with guns. The Royal Flush Gang could turn out to be tough for them to handle.

[Clayface]

Originally posted by Domino
Remember that Deadshot stood up to all of the League for a little while...


Yeah, but only as a result of poor writing. Supes shoulda used his super-speed to catch Deadpool before he got away from the group - of course, that would have made the episode a whole lot shorter too. ;)

[SimonMoon5]

What made the Royal Flash Gang impressive enough in the comics to challenge the Justice League was that they were more than guys who flew around on cards. They were also more than just guys who flew around on cards and fired guns at people.

Oh, sure, they had all of that. But their extra bonus was the ability to use cards for their symbolic Tarot-like powers. For example, they might throw the three of clubs at you and say, "The three of clubs symbolizes despair" and then you'd sit there, unable to do anything because you'd be too busy feeling full of despair.


Those special cards were probably really hard to make, though, since they quit using them over the years. They later each gained a unique ability (King was immortal, Jack had an eye-laser, etc), but that didn't really make them much more impressive (though they were slightly more interesting).

[SimonMoon5]

Originally posted by Domino
Remember that Deadshot stood up to all of the League for a little while, and he's just a guy with guns. The Royal Flush Gang could turn out to be tough for them to handle.

Don't forget that he also had a van, just like the two guys with guns that gave Flash such a hard time in Brave & the Bold.

To be a match for the Justice League, you need more than just a gun. You also need to have a van.

[Sugar Daddy]

Originally posted by SimonMoon5

To be a match for the Justice League, you need more than just a gun. You also need to have a van.

lol

its true though

[mbaker]

The Royal Flush Gang appeared in the "Super Powers Team" episode,"The Wild Cards" with The Joker. Just thought I'd point that out. It'll be interesting to see how Timm handles them this time around in Justice League. The giant hover cards was good for Batman Beyond's setting, but in the present day, it might be A little tricky in my opinion. We'll see.

[GL2k2]

Simonmoon5 is right, in the comic version they were more impressive, I think Bruce Timm downgraded them a little for Batman Beyond. For one thing there were more members than four. And yes their powers could evoke things, I guess Tarot but I'm not sure. They could do things like that, they weren't just a bunch of crooks on flying cards. But I think they should keep the flying cards thing, and take away the all white costumes and have them look like royalty. Even though they wore all white in the comics too, or maybe just Ace did.

[Anarky]

I'd love to see the history between Bruce Wayne & The Royal Flush Gang, particularly w/ Jack (who eventually became King in BB).

The Joker has to fit in somewhere here. He wouldn't allow a gang w/ a playing-card theme to sail thru his town w/o answering to him!

[Theking]

Originally posted by Anarky
I'd love to see the history between Bruce Wayne & The Royal Flush Gang, particularly w/ Jack (who eventually became King in BB).

The Joker has to fit in somewhere here. He wouldn't allow a gang w/ a playing-card theme to sail thru his town w/o answering to him!

Bringing in Joker, great idea.

TheKing

[Ricochet]

Originally posted by Theking


Bringing in Joker, great idea.

TheKing

In the Superfriends eppy, the Joker was the hidden leader of TRFG. :)

[DerekPowers]

thats true, joker wouldnt have it. remember 'beware the creeper" and "jokers wild". but i dont think itd be necessary to have him in it, id rather an arc w/ jus the royal flush gang and an arc w/ just joker.

but is it confirmed that they will be in season 2, cause if it is, i think its a great idea.

I KNOW THIS PART OF THE POST IS LONG, BUT ANYONE INTERESTED IN CONTINUITY, PLEASE READ:

BUT, here is where i must point out some possible continuity conflicts-

in "dead man's hand" king says he remembers batman from back in the day, so he'd be Jack in JL time. BUT in "king's ransom", its made clear that king actually marries into the gang, replacing queens father (who would have been Jack in JL time???).

now this was obviously a mistake on the bb writer's parts, so its a shame JL has to suffer, but those are the breaks. heres the only way i could think of fixing it:

maybe there are different factions of the royal flush gang, king's original gang's (where hed be Jack in JL time) base of operations was gotham, hence his run ins w/ the bat (as mentioned in "dead man's hand"). queen's father's gang was based in a differnt city (perhapes metropolis??) during JL's time. over the years, king's (or Jack as it would be in JL time) original gang fell apart, forcing him to leave and find a new gang. he eventually works his way into queen's father's gang and for whatever reason (perhaps her father is sick or something) assumes the role of king. then in bb time, after he has kids w/ queen, he relocated their faction back to gotham where he encounters terry mcguinness!!

ARE YOU LISTENING TIMM????? I KNOW ITS A LOT, BUT IF YOU WANT TO AVOID ANY FURTHUR CONTINUITY GLICHES, HERE YEAH GO, THATS ONE POSSIBILITY.

all they really have to do in the JL ep (which SHOULD take place in Gotham), is have the bb King be Jack in JL, then have them mention in passing that there are other factions of royal flush gangs in others cities, and maybe forshadow either Jack's (bb's king) gangs demise OR have it mentioned that jack has some kind of romance w/ another royal flush gang's ten (bb's queen).

and there yeah go. these references could be subtle, although i think itd be kind of cool to play up the multiple factions idea, kind of like a mafia of royalty. i know its alot, but i think they could make it work to their advantage to create a grander and more developed/complex group of villians and underground syndicate. and yes, i am aware i have invested too much time in this. hehe....sigh. :( oh well, im all about this stuff, so whatever. peace.

[Terminatah]

No no, we don't need other factions. It's possible that the future King and Queen were married (or just together) when they held the roles of Jack and 10, and that's how he was brought into the family. He later took over as King. Make sense?

-Terminatah

[Harvey Dent]

I remember the Royal Flush Gang from Super Powers:Galactic Guardians. Joker, disguised as Ace, hired some crooks to play the roles of King, Queen, and Jack. And to top it off, they were supported by Darkseid! Those were good times. :D

[DerekPowers]

Originally posted by Terminatah
No no, we don't need other factions. It's possible that the future King and Queen were married (or just together) when they held the roles of Jack and 10, and that's how he was brought into the family. He later took over as King. Make sense?

-Terminatah

well, thatd be nice if it were that simple BUT if i remember correctly (i may have to consult my dead man's hand video) king makes mention of runing into the bat and INFORMS the others, including queen, about it, indicating they have never encounted him before. he encountered him BEFORE the others joined the gang, but ofcourse, if queen's father was the former king, then shed have been part of the gang all along, not needing king to inform her of the royal flush gang's past encounters w/ batman, since shed have been in the gang too.

i think factions of the royal flush gang would be really cool, different families for different cities. ofcourse this is all wishfull thinking.

but does anyone know if its confirmed that they will appear in season 2? thanks. peace.

[Terminatah]

Originally posted by DerekPowers


well, thatd be nice if it were that simple BUT if i remember correctly (i may have to consult my dead man's hand video) king makes mention of runing into the bat and INFORMS the others, including queen, about it, indicating they have never encounted him before. he encountered him BEFORE the others joined the gang, but ofcourse, if queen's father was the former king, then shed have been part of the gang all along, not needing king to inform her of the royal flush gang's past encounters w/ batman, since shed have been in the gang too.Still, it's not uncommon for a character to reiterate facts solely for the benefit of the audience. It's also not uncommon for parents to repeat things everyone in the room already knows. ;)

-Terminatah

[SimonMoon5]

Originally posted by Ricochet

In the Superfriends eppy, the Joker was the hidden leader of TRFG. :)

In the comics, the Royal Flush Gang has had secret leaders which have included the Joker as well as Amos Fortune.

[Joe Wagner]

I would have to agree with the idea that Jack just marries the daughter of the king and thus becomes king in BB's day. I also think they could be a credible threat to the JL if they were to acquire some Kryptonian tech from a certain foe of the Great Man of Steel (LL - not Lois Lane, or Lana Lang either). :D

-Joe!

[Terminatah]

The entire Justice League doesn't have to do battle with the Royal Flush Gang. What's the problem with devoting an episode to one or two characters? Other ensemble shows such as Tiny Toon Adventures didn't include all the characters in every episode. Concentrate the development, don't spread it out.

-Terminatah

[Joe Wagner]

There is no problem with that - if you want to focus it on one or two characters, how about Batman and Martain Manhunter? It could be really kewl to see how the two of them would interact with each seeing as how Bats is usually very reserved and Martain hasn't really had much contact with him since the season began. It would also work because it's obvious in Batman Beyond Bruce had a history with the Royal Flush gang. It could be really fun to see Martain learn from the Dark Knight but I would still love to see the technology aspect of the Royal Flush gang somehow get linked back to Luthor.

-Joe!

[Toddman]

I have to agree that it makes more sense that the (future) BB King married into the Gang before the BB Queen was queen. He was recounting the Gang's history w/Batman more to Jack and Ace then to her.

Also, it's probably not likely that the BB King would be the present-day Jack in JL. It seemed like King was in his fifties (at the oldest) in BB, which would put him in his teens in JL time. I don't know that the writers of JL would want to portray a married teenage couple.

As for how much trouble the Gang could give the JL in a battle, if Ace is robot in modern times (as he appears to be in BB's time), then he might be able put up a pretty good fight against some of the members.

One final note, Bruce Timm did NOT confirm the RFG would be in season two, but he did say they were a possiblity. We'll have to wait and see.

Toddman

[Joe Wagner]

Originally posted by Toddman
Also, it's probably not likely that the BB King would be the present-day Jack in JL. It seemed like King was in his fifties (at the oldest) in BB, which would put him in his teens in JL time. I don't know that the writers of JL would want to portray a married teenage couple.

Toddman

I'm not saying that they would have to be married when (and if) the Royal Flush Gang appears - but they could always get married later on in their lives. Nothing says that he couldn't serve as Jack and than get married later. After all wouldn't it make sense for king to pick his heir apparent? This would be a good way for him to train Jack for the day he would eventually marry his daughter.

-Joe!

[Cere]

One more possibility: King just said he'd ran into Batman, but he didn't say where (I'm pretty sure, tell me if I'm wrong). Therefore, it could be assumed that King was a part of some other gang, non-RFG related, that got in trouble in Gotham. Later in life, he married Queen and joined the RFG.

[Toddman]

Originally posted by Cere
One more possibility: King just said he'd ran into Batman, but he didn't say where (I'm pretty sure, tell me if I'm wrong). Therefore, it could be assumed that King was a part of some other gang, non-RFG related, that got in trouble in Gotham. Later in life, he married Queen and joined the RFG.

Actually, I think King states that the entire Gang had a feud w/Batman. Isn't that when he mentions that he used to be Jack? Plus, Bruce tells Terry that he has a history with them as well.

I guess the issue is not that King used to be the Jack of the same Gang that once fought Batman, the issue is when did he join? If he marries into the Gang (instead of joining, then marrying), then he will probably not be the Jack we see (if the RFG appears) next season.

Toddman

[JusticeLeagueLegion]

Originally posted by mbaker
The Royal Flush Gang appeared in the "Super Powers Team" episode,"The Wild Cards" with The Joker. Just thought I'd point that out. It'll be interesting to see how Timm handles them this time around in Justice League. The giant hover cards was good for Batman Beyond's setting, but in the present day, it might be A little tricky in my opinion. We'll see.

"The Wild Cards" was my favorite episode of "The Super Powers Team: Galactic Guardians." I remember being shocked when we found out that Ace was actually The Joker!