It seems Archie will be going out with someone, and it's neither Betty nor Veronica

[Jave]

Honest, truthful raise of hands if you actually saw this one happening:

http://www.img.archiecomics.com/press/a608.500.jpg

Two of the greatest bands in comic book history hook up like never before when Josie and the Pussycats come to town to tour with The Archies. However, more than music is made on one starry night outside Archie’s home, when there’s a kiss that could change Riverdale forever. Is it possible that the pure-hearted, red-haired lead of The Archies is really falling in love with Valerie, the beautiful bassist/songwriter of Josie and the Pussycats? What will happen to Betty and Veronica? “It Starts with a Kiss” is the beginning of a tale to be continued. Don’t miss out while the world watches to see if Archie and Valerie have what it takes to make their love survive. Look for part one in Archie #608, hitting stores this April!

From Archiefans.com (http://www.archiefans.com/news-and-new-releases/whats-new-pussycats/)**Looks around, crickets chirp** Yeah, I thought so.

I gotta say that I'm quite curious to read this. At least, I have to wonder how it will be handled.

[Peter Paltridge]

Archie has gone outside the love triangle many times already. This is no shock.

[stephane dumas]

I didn't saw that one coming, I taught of someone else:

Cheryl Blossom

[Temple Fugate]

...Didn't he JUST get engaged?

[Jave]

Archie has gone outside the love triangle many times already. This is no shock.I know, but most of the times that happened it was with a girl that appeared only for that comic or Cheryl Blossom, who was pretty much created to mess up with the love triangle. There were a few instances where Archie dated Midge, but they were mostly for comedic purposes.

It's not the fact that Archie is going out with someone else, but who he's going out with. A character that has been established for around 40 years and neither have showed romantic interest in each other whatsoever, specially considering the two series didn't cross too often.


...Didn't he JUST get engaged? Yeah, but it was a "What if..." type of story.

[Rick Jones]

I guess my favorite pussycat is dating the world's luckiest ginger kid.

[Shawn Hopkins]

Awesome. I'm surprised it hasn't happened before because the Archies and the Pussycats interacting is an obvious thing, they must run in the same circles in their bands. Maybe Reggie will try to date Josie or Melody. Or better yet Alexandra.

Although I suppose the interracial nature of this pairing would have caused difficulties for Archie comics in the past. It's good to see that things are advancing beyond those prejudices and hangups.

[wonderfly]

Although I suppose the interracial nature of this pairing would have caused difficulties for Archie comics in the past. It's good to see that things are advancing beyond those prejudices and hangups.

Hmm...hadn't thought about that till you mentioned it, but I wonder if Archie comics specifically paired them up BECAUSE it's interracial. If this is some sort of PC "Public Service Announcement" about tolerance, then that kind of ruins it for me. Not that there's anything wrong with them being a couple, I just don't need preaching from Archie.

[Icthyosura]

I thought he was married to Edith.

[Shawn Hopkins]

Hmm...hadn't thought about that till you mentioned it, but I wonder if Archie comics specifically paired them up BECAUSE it's interracial. If this is some sort of PC "Public Service Announcement" about tolerance, then that kind of ruins it for me. Not that there's anything wrong with them being a couple, I just don't need preaching from Archie.

I'll have to read the story, but there's no reason to think that at this point. Maybe it's just that they've moved past that kind of hangup. I doubt there will be an explicit "after-school special" tolerance message in it, at any rate.

Besides, of the Pussycats Valerie is the best choice for Archie. He likes smarter girls so that puts Melody out and with Josie he'd have to deal with the Alan M. situation.

Oh, and if you want to see real preaching from Archie, you should read some of those Spire Christian Comics. And I mean actual preaching about Jesus, with Al Hartley's characters looking especially glassy-eyed.

[wonderfly]

I'll have to read the story, but there's no reason to think that at this point. Maybe it's just that they've moved past that kind of hangup. I doubt there will be an explicit "after-school special" tolerance message in it, at any rate.

Besides, of the Pussycats Valerie is the best choice for Archie. He likes smarter girls so that puts Melody out and with Josie he'd have to deal with the Alan M. situation.

Oh, and if you want to see real preaching from Archie, you should read some of those Spire Christian Comics. And I mean actual preaching about Jesus, with Al Hartley's characters looking especially glassy-eyed.

*does some quick research on Spire Christian Comics*

:eek:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/44/HartleyArchie.jpg

:sweat:...yeah, that's not much better than the "tolerance" message I described above.

[stephane dumas]

Awesome. I'm surprised it hasn't happened before because the Archies and the Pussycats interacting is an obvious thing, they must run in the same circles in their bands. Maybe Reggie will try to date Josie or Melody. Or better yet Alexandra.

It reminds me of an early 1970s story drawed by Dan DeCarlo where Alex Cabot III tried to impress Veronica by singing a serenade and tell how big and rich are the Cabot and Veronica give him some cents. Alex was so frustrated and humiliated.

[Startrekman700]

ooohh ohhh Now it's interracial. Archie and Josie. Wonder what the kids will look like :sweat:


Other subject. There are theories about the archie universe. One is that this is actually a Total Recall program at Rekall industries and that this is actually a lonely or disabled man who is strapped to a recall machine and has payed to have memories of a 50's teenager implanted into him. He is making this universe up as they go from memory tapes...

...thats just what I think...

[Adam Tyner]

Did the penciller start drawing a guitar and then remember when he was almost done that...oops!...she's supposed to be playing a bass? The number of strings changes 3 times.

[Peter Paltridge]

I'm gonna step in and defend the Spire Archies. They're well-drawn, and they do what they're supposed to decently and nonjudgmentally (spread the Word). They weren't sold anywhere but Christian stores either.

Hartley was a great artist; don't let your personal beliefs cloud that fact.

[Jave]

Hartley was a great artist; don't let your personal beliefs cloud that fact.I'm a Christian and I didn't like the Spire comics. Not because of Hartley's art (which I'm not much of a fan of), but because of how badly out of character everyone in those comics was. Not that it matters that much, since the Archie crew doesn't even acknowledge those comics.

Hartley was VERY hit or miss, Spire or not. When he took the time on his art and actually polished it, it looked great, but several of his comics look horribly rushed, with ridiculously exaggerated poses and ugly faces. In fact, I'd say that Hartley at his worst, did the UGLIEST Archie comics ever.

[Zyzzybalubah]

I thought he was married to Edith.

No no, you have it all wrong... Edith passed away a couple years back then Archie opened up his own bar for a short while. :D

In all seriousness I thought it was Cheryl Blossom or Sabrina. LOL, only reason I know of some of those characters are because of the ads in the Sonic comics. :)

[Shawn Hopkins]

I think Hartley is certainly one of the better Archie artists, except for that glassy eyes thing that kicks in especially hard when the characters start proselytizing. And I think his intentions with the Spire Archie comics were good. But that doesn't mean they were necessarily a good idea or good comics, they come off very strange and there's no way to reconcile the personalities of the aggressive witnessing Archies with the fun-loving teens. Betty is especially hardcore for some reason. At one point they seem to imply that Reggie is a date rapist.

Also, I think Archie is such an everyteen that his appeal should be universal, so nailing the characters down to such specific beliefs wasn't something I could get behind. Still, most of these problems are avoided by doing exactly what Archie comics have done for years, pretending the Spire comics don't exist. I guess they're more along the lines of forgotten licensed Archie merchandise than official Archie stories.

[Rick Jones]

I'm gonna step in and defend the Spire Archies. They're well-drawn, and they do what they're supposed to decently and nonjudgmentally (spread the Word). They weren't sold anywhere but Christian stores either.

Hartley was a great artist; don't let your personal beliefs cloud that fact.
As a kid, I loved them. They always gave me something to do during the parts of church where I would normally be asleep. I had one friend that loved Archie stuff as much as I loved Marvel and he always had copies for me to look at. When I was 7, they were pretty fun and no where near as scary or odd as Jack Chick stuff my uncle would have. So many odd things have happened in Archie's publication history that I think there's enough room for the Spire comics to be an accepted part of it. Anyways...

I hope that this Archie/Valerie pairing is treated as something natural and that news outlets don't pump it up to something like "Archie Crosses The Color Barrier". I'm sure Archie Comics wouldn't mind a sales boost from that kind of press though.

[Ed Liu]

ooohh ohhh Now it's interracial. Archie and Josie. Wonder what the kids will look like :sweat:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/imagecache/admin_official_thumb/administration-official/ao_image/President_Official_Portrait_HiRes.jpg (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/administration-official/ao_image/President_Official_Portrait_HiRes.jpg)

I think they could do worse.

[Zorak Masaki]

The only problem I had with the Spire Archie's was the dog-in-headlights looks some of the characters had, and the fact that Hartley would draw non-regulars in a more "realistic" style. Why not draw all the characters, regular or not, in the Archie style? It doesnt help that the "realistic" art seems rotoscoped (or whatever the comic version of rotoscoping would be called).

[Shawn Hopkins]

The only problem I had with the Spire Archie's was the dog-in-headlights looks some of the characters had, and the fact that Hartley would draw non-regulars in a more "realistic" style. Why not draw all the characters, regular or not, in the Archie style? It doesnt help that the "realistic" art seems rotoscoped (or whatever the comic version of rotoscoping would be called).

There's one of these comics where, and I am not making this up, the Archie's decide to interact with black kids, besides Chuck, for some reason. So they go to a room where apparently all the black kids in Riverdale High, besides Chuck, have been hanging out all along. All the black kids in the room are drawn in a more realistic style and are 70s-stylin' and sporting afros and stuff. The story is clearly sincerely well-intended as a protolerance message and there seems to be no awareness of the silliness and slight offensiveness of the context or the implications of the Archies stumbling upon the hidden lair of black kids for just this one story.

Anyway, if we've really gone from that to a story where Archie snogs Valerie on the cover and no big deal is made of it, then I think we've really made progress.

Edit:

Another thing that bugs me about cover, maybe it's just because of the guitars but the pose is kind of awkward. Archie's guitar has to be under her armpit. And does anyone here generally put their forearm between a girl's breasts when they kiss her? Because that seems to be a little forward for a first date.

[Jave]

and the fact that Hartley would draw non-regulars in a more "realistic" style. Why not draw all the characters, regular or not, in the Archie style? It doesnt help that the "realistic" art seems rotoscoped (or whatever the comic version of rotoscoping would be called).That's not limited to Hartley and the Spire comics, though. Harry Lucey did it too. In the 60s/70s period, every now and then Archie would do a serious story, and Lucey would almost always draw the non-regulars in a "rotoscoped" style.

One story (by Frank Doyle and Harry Lucey) had Archie complaining that taking Spanish courses at school is a big waste of time, but later he runs into the scene of an accident where a little kid got run over. The problem is that the kid needs blood and the father doesn't speak English, so the paramedics can't determine the type of blood the kid needs. So Archie, being the only one around who can speak Spanish, acts as an interpreter so they can attend the kid, and thanks to Archie, the kid's life is saved. In that story, all the regulars are drawn normally, but the father, the kid, the medics and the cops are all drawn "rotoscoped".

[stephane dumas]

One story (by Frank Doyle and Harry Lucey) had Archie complaining that taking Spanish courses at school is a big waste of time, but later he runs into the scene of an accident where a little kid got run over. The problem is that the kid needs blood and the father doesn't speak English, so the paramedics can't determine the type of blood the kid needs. So Archie, being the only one around who can speak Spanish, acts as an interpreter so they can attend the kid, and thanks to Archie, the kid's life is saved. In that story, all the regulars are drawn normally, but the father, the kid, the medics and the cops are all drawn "rotoscoped".

I saw a story with a plotline more or less similar penned by John D'Agostino. Archie taked some Spanish courses, one difference, he said it was useful for him but Betty & Veronica taught it was a waste of time until a kid got injured.

[Jaime_Weinman]

That's not limited to Hartley and the Spire comics, though. Harry Lucey did it too. In the 60s/70s period, every now and then Archie would do a serious story, and Lucey would almost always draw the non-regulars in a "rotoscoped" style.

Others who did that were Bob White, who drew most of the Archie adventure stories for "Life With Archie" in the early '60s (with scripts mostly by Sy Reit). When he brought in adult characters who were authority figures, like ship's captains or doctors, he would draw them realistically.

And Bob Bolling (Little Archie), a protege of White, did the same thing in his adventure stories; he even re-designed the parents to make them look less cartoony than they usually did, so the only cartoony characters were the kids. (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_jrOCxwrEVhg/Sq-r_0Mwo5I/AAAAAAAAC2U/amHn9JP3GtQ/s1600-h/019.jpg)

That's why, when they made all the fuss about the "new look" Archie, those who remembered the company's "good" years didn't find it that surprising. They'd had realistic art before; those stories just went one extra step and drew the kids that way too.


I'm gonna step in and defend the Spire Archies. They're well-drawn, and they do what they're supposed to decently and nonjudgmentally (spread the Word). They weren't sold anywhere but Christian stores either.

Hartley was a great artist; don't let your personal beliefs cloud that fact.

As Jave said, Hartley was a talented artist but his work ranged from good to awful, at least on Archie. I think he was much better at his Marvel characters, like Patsy and Hedy. He was one of the great underrated Marvel artists (underrated because non-superhero artists get no respect), but his Archie stuff is middle of the pack at best.

I don't agree that the Spires are non-judgmental. But since I didn't read the Spires as a kid, what bothered me more was the stories he wrote and drew for the "regular" Archie comics, where he put in as much religious preaching as he could without violating the rules. Some of these stories were kind of sweet, but others were disturbingly over-the-top, and Hartley openly said in public that he was trying to use mainstream comics as a vehicle for teaching his religion to kids. (His speeches about this may have been one of the reasons why his editors made him stop and he took this kind of story to Spire instead.) But more importantly, Hartley turned Betty into a preachy, smug a-hole, and this interpretation of her as a religious perfect goody-goody has invaded her characterization ever since. So he may be partly responsible for Betty becoming boring.

[Kenny E. McCall]

Smart move on the part of Archie Comics there to pair Archie up with a fine-ass sista like Valerie Brown. It's gonna get interesting in the Archie Universe in 2010.

Now let's see Chuck try to hang with Sabrina. I can't wait for the interesting dynamic between an African-American mortal and a Caucasian witch!

Kenny ;)

[Jave]

Now let's see Chuck try to hang with Sabrina. I can't wait for the interesting dynamic between an African-American mortal and a Caucasian witch!

Kenny ;)Oh, Sabrina is returning... in what's possibly the issue "everybody will be talking about".

http://www.img.archiecomics.com/covers/j200.650.jpg
http://www.img.archiecomics.com/covers/j200.650-variant.jpg
JUGHEAD #200
THE MILESTONE 200th ISSUE OF JUGHEAD FEATURING AN ISSUE-LENGTH EPIC WRITTEN BY ROBOT CHICKEN’S CO-HEAD WRITER AND CO-PRODUCER TOM ROOT!
“Something Ventured, Something Gained”: Riverdale High’s fabled teens embark on their wildest ride ever, as Jughead trades his metabolism to a witch in exchange for a mega cheeseburger… and all goes bonkers from there with a chain reaction of cataclysmic proportions! Before you know it, Archie is offering his pure heart to get Juggy’s metabolism back, and Betty and Veronica make offers of their own to get the old Archie back! Meanwhile, Jughead’s waistline is growing larger than Lodge Mansion! Needless to say, the kids are plenty disenchanted with being enchanted. Can they go from status woe to status quo? Tom Root, co-head writer and co-producer of the Emmy Award-winning Robot Chicken on Cartoon Network’s Adult Swim—and co-creator/executive producer of the network’s upcoming Titan Maximum—brings his patented irreverent humor to the milestone 200th issue of JUGHEAD!
SCRIPT: Tom Root
ART: Rex Lindsey
COVER: Dan Parent
Shipping Date: March 10th, 2010
On Sale at Comic Shops: March 17th, 2010
Newsstands: March 30th, 2010
32-page, full color comic
$2.50 US

Also from Archiefans.com (http://www.archiefans.com/news-and-new-releases/archie-comics-shipping-march-2010/)

[MonkeyFunk]

There's one of these comics where, and I am not making this up, the Archie's decide to interact with black kids, besides Chuck, for some reason. So they go to a room where apparently all the black kids in Riverdale High, besides Chuck, have been hanging out all along. All the black kids in the room are drawn in a more realistic style and are 70s-stylin' and sporting afros and stuff. The story is clearly sincerely well-intended as a protolerance message and there seems to be no awareness of the silliness and slight offensiveness of the context or the implications of the Archies stumbling upon the hidden lair of black kids for just this one story.

Anyway, if we've really gone from that to a story where Archie snogs Valerie on the cover and no big deal is made of it, then I think we've really made progress.

And lest we forget:

http://www.comics.org/issue/173935/cover/4/

[Shawn Hopkins]

And lest we forget:

http://www.comics.org/issue/173935/cover/4/

I knew which one you were posting before I even clicked on it. :)

[RayChuang]

By the way, the Archie-Valerie relationship may last longer than people think.

Based on what I've read about Valerie, she's smart and well-adjusted, and doesn't have the character faults that plague Betty Cooper, Veronica Lodge and Cheryl Blossom. And that could be a huge for Archie, who may be finally realizing that occasional jealousy between Betty and Veronica is a turn-off of sorts and Archie might be turned off by Cheryl's "I want it all!" attitude, in my humble opinion! :)

[dth1971]

Uh-oh, here comes intermixed love in Archie comics!

[aalong64]

Uh-oh, here comes intermixed love in Archie comics!
Uh ... And you think it's a bad thing?

[Anthonynotes]

One oddity to me: They're citing "Robot Chicken" and Adult Swim as a selling point for Archie? Doesn't seem particularly kid-friendly (given most of AS' lineup feels like it's aimed at drunk/drugged college students :-p ); then again, neither does the sound of "Archie meets the Punisher"... ;-)

[Peter Paltridge]

That's not limited to Hartley and the Spire comics, though. Harry Lucey did it too. In the 60s/70s period, every now and then Archie would do a serious story, and Lucey would almost always draw the non-regulars in a "rotoscoped" style.

One story (by Frank Doyle and Harry Lucey) had Archie complaining that taking Spanish courses at school is a big waste of time, but later he runs into the scene of an accident where a little kid got run over. The problem is that the kid needs blood and the father doesn't speak English, so the paramedics can't determine the type of blood the kid needs. So Archie, being the only one around who can speak Spanish, acts as an interpreter so they can attend the kid, and thanks to Archie, the kid's life is saved. In that story, all the regulars are drawn normally, but the father, the kid, the medics and the cops are all drawn "rotoscoped".


I saw a story with a plotline more or less similar penned by John D'Agostino. Archie taked some Spanish courses, one difference, he said it was useful for him but Betty & Veronica taught it was a waste of time until a kid got injured.
Wow, they did that twice. Or maybe three times.

I've seen that story with my own eyes, but it looked like Goldberg or DeCarlo drew it. In the version I've seen the kid just scraped his knee -- but he was hemophilic, and the only one who knew was Archie who had studied his Spanish. Learn Spanish, kids, just in case you run into a hemophilic child who has hurt himself. The More You Know.

There's one that holds the record. In the 50's they drew the same story about eleven times: Mr. Lodge hires Archie as his golf caddy, and Archie thinks he can please Lodge by rigging the game so his opponents' balls mysteriously land in the rough. But Lodge and his opponent are actually betting on the game: specifically, the winner has to take ownership of the underperforming companies of the loser. (Must happen all the time in corporate America.) So Lodge is angry at Archie, and he either gets his butt kicked or the situation somehow twists around to be a good thing, depending on which version.

I saw that happen in so many digests. Lazy bums.


There's one of these comics where, and I am not making this up, the Archie's decide to interact with black kids, besides Chuck, for some reason. So they go to a room where apparently all the black kids in Riverdale High, besides Chuck, have been hanging out all along. All the black kids in the room are drawn in a more realistic style and are 70s-stylin' and sporting afros and stuff. The story is clearly sincerely well-intended as a protolerance message and there seems to be no awareness of the silliness and slight offensiveness of the context or the implications of the Archies stumbling upon the hidden lair of black kids for just this one story.
Is that from "Archie's Something Else"? There were white kids in that room too. And it WAS drawn in the 70's.

[Shawn Hopkins]

Is that from "Archie's Something Else"? There were white kids in that room too. And it WAS drawn in the 70's.

Yes, that issue. It's inside the Riverdale High Bible Club room and in the splash panel there are three white kids and six black kids, all realistically drawn non-regular characters. Archie takes a smug TV crew there to prove to them that Riverdale High doesn't have racial problems because all the students believe in Christ and there's an officially sanctioned by Mister Weatherbee Bible Club at the school. The fact the evidence of this tolerance is a room where black characters we've never seen before in the series seem to be sequestered is the part that I find hilarious. And the odd dimensional realism of the black characters.

Can't find the page I'm talking about online but here are some pics of some of the black kids:

http://news.lavenderliberal.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/xian-archie.jpg

[stephane dumas]

Wow, they did that twice. Or maybe three times.

I've seen that story with my own eyes, but it looked like Goldberg or DeCarlo drew it. In the version I've seen the kid just scraped his knee -- but he was hemophilic, and the only one who knew was Archie who had studied his Spanish. Learn Spanish, kids, just in case you run into a hemophilic child who has hurt himself. The More You Know.

Maybe Goldberg or DeCarlo pencil it and D'Agostino inked it. D'Agostino inked often Goldberg stories in the late 1970s-early 1980s as well as some Joe Edwards' Archie-Mr.Wheaterbee stories and stories penned by Bob Bolling, Dick Malgren. The DeCarlo, Harry Lucey and Samm Schwartz stories who was inked by D'Agostino seems to be rare.



There's one that holds the record. In the 50's they drew the same story about eleven times: Mr. Lodge hires Archie as his golf caddy, and Archie thinks he can please Lodge by rigging the game so his opponents' balls mysteriously land in the rough. But Lodge and his opponent are actually betting on the game: specifically, the winner has to take ownership of the underperforming companies of the loser. (Must happen all the time in corporate America.) So Lodge is angry at Archie, and he either gets his butt kicked or the situation somehow twists around to be a good thing, depending on which version.

I saw that happen in so many digests. Lazy bums.


I wonder if they did some variations of the golf caddy one, like for example: Archie is the caddy of Mr.Weatherbee instead or Mr. Lodge hired someone else like Jughead, Reggie or Moose?

[Lord Pumpkin]

What will Archie fans think of the upcoming Archie/Valerie kiss in the newest issue of Archie? What will you readers think of an interracial romance?