Grodd is an odd arch nemesis for The Flash

[Squall]

Every superhero has to have an arch-villian. THE villian among supervillians that gives our superhero more trouble than any other supervillian they face.

Batman has Joker, Superman has Lex Luthor, Wonder Woman has Ares, Green Lantern has Sinestro, Flash has... Grodd?!?

Is it just me, or is Grodd a real odd choice for the "arch-villian" of The Flash???

Isn't The Shade supposed to also be a Flash supervillian? HE seems more like an arch-villian to me than Grodd does. In fact, Grodd doesn't seem to be anyone's supervillian in particular... he's just a supervillian in general, and not an arch-villian of anyone in particular.

Flash is young, witty, and brash. The Shade is antisocial, cranky, and irritable. Flash is fast, but The Shade uses shadows to his advantage, which is a good way to counteract someone who's fast, if you think about it.

So why isn't The Shade Flash's arch-villian? Everyone on the Justice League Message Board keeps saying that Grodd is Flash's arch-villian. What's up with that? :confused:

[Clark J. Kent]

Originally posted by Squall
Every superhero has to have an arch-villian. THE villian among supervillians that gives our superhero more trouble than any other supervillian they face.

Batman has Joker, Superman has Lex Luthor, Wonder Woman has Ares, Green Lantern has Sinestro, Flash has... Grodd?!?

Is it just me, or is Grodd a real odd choice for the "arch-villian" of The Flash???

Isn't The Shade supposed to also be a Flash supervillian? HE seems more like an arch-villian to me than Grodd does. In fact, Grodd doesn't seem to be anyone's supervillian in particular... he's just a supervillian in general, and not an arch-villian of anyone in particular.

Flash is young, witty, and brash. The Shade is antisocial, cranky, and irritable. Flash is fast, but The Shade uses shadows to his advantage, which is a good way to counteract someone who's fast, if you think about it.

So why isn't The Shade Flash's arch-villian? Everyone on the Justice League Message Board keeps saying that Grodd is Flash's arch-villian. What's up with that? :confused: Just so you know, Grodd is not Flash's definitive supervillain. Grodd is to Flash what Livewire was to Superman. A supervillain yes, but she's no Lex Luthor. You say that people on the message board get the impression that Grodd was Flash's definitive villain, but they are 100% dead wrong. Don't listen to a word they say. Grodd is not Flash's #1 villain and never has been for a single day of his existence.

Captain Cold, Captain Boomerang, Weather Wizard, Mirror Master, the Trickster, Abra Kadabra, and (arguably THE single most important Flash villain,) the Reverse-Flash. THOSE are definitive Flash villains.

Grodd was up there. Even guys like Sonar and Heat Wave are up there. But to rank him with Joker or Luthor is just flat-out, 100% no-doubt-about-it, wrong.

As far as your assertion that the Shade should be Flash's villain:
The Shade was originally one of the villains of Jay Garrick, the Flash of the Justice Society. He soon became better tied in with Starman, and his character had a new spin taken on him in James Robinson's STARMAN series. Shade is no longer an out-and-out villain. Perhaps that is why he's not Shade's arch-villain. Nevertheless, I am not sure why you'd be asserting Shade as Flash's most notable rogue when the list of historical rogues far exceeds only Shade, who was not even a major villain of Barry or Wally but of a Flash that's not even alluded to on this show.

[Apache Chief]

Well, it makes as much sense as a guy with a cold gun dressed like an Eskimo. And let's all hope and pray that Captain Boomerang never shows up on JL.

[Clark J. Kent]

It may, Apache Chief, but that doesn't make it right. In fact, wouldn't you think that Metallo, a villain with a heart of Kryptonite, would be more an adversary to Superman than a corporate CEO?

Grodd is just NOT Flash's #1 villain, and Captain Cold ranks infinitely above him.

[The Green Hornet]

id think that the reverse flash might be numero uno

[MattL.]

Ideas like Gorilla Grodd are just plain fun. To me, being a bit over the top is part of the point. Yeah sure its nice to see the Flash rapid punch a bunch of gangbangers or terrorists, but put him up against something as bizzare as a super-intelligent ape with mind control, then ya got something! :D

Don't know if any of you have read the Justice League: Incarnations, but theres a issue that series where Grodd with a done of various cimmians storms Washington DC. Its a great over the top superhero story type scenario and whats really cool is how scary they manage to make Grodd in the process.

[Clark J. Kent]

Matt, I am not discounting Grodd's place as a rogue or even as a fun Rogue. But he's not Flash's #1 enemy. That's all I'm saying. I have no problem saying he's a Flash Rogue, but saying that he's Flash's equivalent of a Joker or Luthor is just misinformed. I don't know how that sentiment started, but it's NOT TRUE. AT ALL. Ok everyone? Grodd IS NOT Flash's Joker or Luthor. He never has been. EVER. Nowhere. Am I being clear enough?

[Supernovametalstar]

Originally posted by Clark J. Kent

James Robinson's STARMAN series.

Wow, someone with my name wrote a comic book series. I feel just a little bit special today :D .

[MattL.]

Originally posted by Clark J. Kent
Matt, I am not discounting Grodd's place as a rogue or even as a fun Rogue. But he's not Flash's #1 enemy. That's all I'm saying. I have no problem saying he's a Flash Rogue, but saying that he's Flash's equivalent of a Joker or Luthor is just misinformed. I don't know how that sentiment started, but it's NOT TRUE. AT ALL. Ok everyone? Grodd IS NOT Flash's Joker or Luthor. He never has been. EVER. Nowhere. Am I being clear enough?

I'm sorry what were you trying to say again? Kidding. :p


Actually I wasn't defending the view of Grodd as a number one foe, I was just defending the idea of him in general. ;)

[Batman 80]

Who is Flash's Joker type villain?

[Clark J. Kent]

Barry's was definitely the Reverse Flash. I think most Flash fans would accept that without question.

As for Wally, I'm not really sure. I don't think that any ONE villain was more important or more threatening than the next.

All I know is that it's not Grodd. Not by a long shot. Any other Flash experts out there?

[Karkull]

Okay, first let's all take a deep, relaxing breath.


Originally posted by Clark J. Kent
All I know is that it's not Grodd. Not by a long shot. Any other Flash experts out there?

I'll give it a shot.

Truth be told, the Flash doesn't have one arch-villain, he has several--known collectively as the Rogues. They're in league with each other and each have friendly rivalry going with the others. The membership varies, but ongoing members include Captain Cold, Heat Wave, the Trickster, the Weather Wizard, Captain Boomerang, Mirror Master, and Professor Zoom the Reverse Flash (I know that I'm missing some). The common theme was that they were all regular crooks with a gimmick.

Gorilla Grodd was at the opposite end of the spectrum. He's not a Rogue and doesn't particularly like them, so he works solo. He's a major villain in his own right, but, like Clark J. Kent said, he isn't the Flash's arch-enemy. He is on equal footing with the Rogues, however.

[JusticeLeagueLegion]

I think Trickster is Barry's #1 foe, but Wally's is probably Savitar.

[Batman 80]

Does Grodd fill the role that Darkseid does for Superman as a villain?

[Green Lantern]

Why does anyone have to fill any role?

[GL2k2]

I kinda liked this old Jay Garrick villian named the Fiddler. But, as for the modern Flash's villians, I vote for Rainbow Raider to show up, Reverse Flash, Captain Cold, Capt. Boomerang, and Mirror Master. The rest, aside from Grodd are kinda dumb. If I had to guess what villian will show up next for Flash, it will most likely be Capt. Cold on the Injustice Gang.

And I must say it was a fine choice to pick the guy who once played Jim Jones to do the voice of Grodd. Vedy Inderesding.

=P

[Mr. Obsession]

Originally posted by GL2k2
If I had to guess what villian will show up next for Flash, it will most likely be Capt. Cold on the Injustice Gang.Capt. Cold is a second rate Mr. Freeze. Put Freeze on the Injustice Gang instead! :p


EDIT: I just had a cool thought, they should have a JL ep where the Injustice Gang is filled with various villains that are just redundant (Mr. Freeze/Capt. Cold, The Joker/The Trickster, etc). Of course the episode will require the Flash to poke constant fun at the situation. :D

[knightraven2]

Actually, folks, Kadabra is Wally's number one foe. He erased Linda from the world on her wedding day to get at 'em. He used Iris' knowledge of the future to try to get rid of him. Kadabra hates Wally and is a truly earth shaking villain with his magic.
That's my two cents worth.
Either that or Reverse Flash. There was that whole great run where Reverse Flash thought he was Barry. the final fight was fabulous.
Randy

[Green Lantern]

Originally posted by knightraven2
Actually, folks, Kadabra is Wally's number one foe. He erased Linda from the world on her wedding day to get at 'em. He used Iris' knowledge of the future to try to get rid of him. Kadabra hates Wally and is a truly earth shaking villain with his magic.Not a very bad point at all. I could go for that. And Kadabra even has a history with Wally... it's not like he just appeared to kidnap Linda.

Knightraven, I think I'm sold. :) Excellent point.

[knightraven2]

Thanks, GL.
See, what's so nasty is that Kadabra ALMOST wins, and, when he loses, he normally gets messed over pretty bad. In his losses to Wally, he's become scarred, amnesiac, destitute, and unable to return to his own time.
I also like the ambiguity. They have never truly established whether his powers are magic or just super-super high tech.
I really love the way, personality wise, Flash is being used. Did Barry and Hal ever have any villains they fought as a team in the comics?
<Reverse Flash would also be a good choice. Which name does everyone prefer? Reverse Flash, or Professor Zoom?>
Professor Zoom for me. I can just picture him getting misdelivered mail.
"This Ultimate Nullifier was suppossed to go to DOCTOR Doom!"
<At the castle in Latveria..>
"Now just what am I suppossed to do with this treadmill? Is someone saying I'm fat?"

[Green Lantern]

I agree. Prof. Zoom, not "Reverse Flash," although I wouldn't mind a crack being made by Flash kind'a making fun of the fact that he was, in fact, once "Reverse Flash" a la "What? Like a bunch of Superfriends?"

[Frank White]

From what the website was saying it seems Cobalt Blue is Flash's archenemy.

[Green Lantern]

Cobalt Blue might have been a very notable adversary, but doesn't have nearly the same historical, lasting value.