Good Idea, Bad Idea

[JustJack]

O.k, here's my current situation..and it's a doozy....

See, my girlfriend & I are in a 'really good place' right now. Meanwhile, my arch-nemisis(Adam..little[beep] :p ), is trying really hard to make me look bad, so she will break up with me, & go to him. She has already stated many times that he needs to cut it out, & its not working. I've told him.."I'm gonna kill you" several times. He wont quit. Anyway, my gf & her best friend developed a plan to get back at him. Flirt with him for a couple days, make him think that she's in love with him, then basically rip out his heart.

O.k, I like the ripping out the heart part...but....It's the flirting part that bothers me. Everyone, but my gf, thinks I have the right to be at least a little upset. I think I have a good reason to be upset. Anyway, I told her, that in the end, as long as she forces him into a pit of complete depression and hopelessness...then I'm o.k with it. On one hand it's easier than having me kick his butt....and on the other hand, the whole flirting thing is going to rip me up inside to a point of no end....

so.....

Good Idea? Bad Idea?
comments, please? :D

[Bird Boy]

it's a Gnood Idea...

Good because he'll finally leave you alone..bad because of the flirting.

I say let her flirt with him...since it's only for a few days....

then again I never had a GF...lol.. :o

-BB

[Clayface]

Bad idea.

#1. Its not considerate of your feelings. If it upsets you that she's flirting with him, even if its fake flirting, she shouldn't do it.

#2. This will only make matters worse. She's going to play into his fantasy, and make his feelings stronger. Once she "tears his heart out", he's either going to be really upset, and maybe do something stupid to you or her, or he's going to live in the delusion that he can have her, and that she really did like him at some point and that maybe he can win her back again.

I repeat, bad idea.

[Failure]

In theory, not a bad idea. You break his heart, embarass him, and generally make a fool of him and his feelings. It's cruel, it's clever, it's arguably effective.

In reality, probably not such a good idea. Like Clayface said, if she gets his hopes up and then breaks it, you don't know how he's going to react. He's already proven he's no class guy. And when people get desperate, they do desperate things ranging from disturbing to dangerous.

I'd listen to Clayface and try to figure some other way out.

[The Guard]

You do that, and you're just as bad as him. And they're right, you DON'T know how he's going to react. It COULD be dangerous. I mean, if he gets hurt enough, and decides on revenge...

(Incidentally no more talk about this. You've stolen my plot)

:)

[Terminatah]

Don't do it. There are too many variables. Just throw dog crap at his house.

-Terminatah

[Psycho Fox]

This guys sounds like a jerk but don't do it, it is hitting below the belt. Just get get her to tell him in a public place I Don't like you it is kinda hard for even the most thick headed jerk to misinterpret that.

[Chris Sanders MSX]

I say it's a good idea and to go ahead and do it. I mean the flirting will only hurt you if you think theirs a chance that she'd hook up with this guy. I have jelousy issues and I hate a girl i date even talks to another guy but i'd allow this. I mean your in on it and in the end it's going to help you both.

The guy will get the picture as wella s learn a lesson and he'll be out of your hair.

But still I'm not counting out what Clayface said. I'm just saying what I'd do.

[Sumi_Masen]

It's good because, well, you're getting back at the guy. It's bad because what Clayface said is true. :)

[Carnage]

it might work, but that's stooping pretty low, and as messed up as it is to try to get somebody to break up with their boyfriend, it's still pretty jacked up to mess with somebody's emotions.

[Chris Sanders MSX]

I think that he's justified, He's already stated that the guys been told to back off.. it's his own fault and he gets what he deserves.

It's not like the guy is pulling a cartman's chilli * on us.

*For those who missed this episode cartman went psychotic at worse and i'm not sure If I should be the one to explain what happened in this particular episode of South park.

[Clayface]

Originally posted by Chris Sanders MSX
I think that he's justified, He's already stated that the guys been told to back off.. it's his own fault and he gets what he deserves.


Well, in my opinion, nothing ever warrents purposefully screwing with someone's emotions. And there are much more effective and mature ways to handle the situation.

Take it from someone with a lot of relationship experience, JustJack - this is a bad idea.

[Nightflower]

BAD IDEA.

Says another someone in a relationship.

The ethics with screwing with someone aside, there's no guarentee she'll rip his heart out afterwards. He may be THAT dumb. What flirting with him WILL guarantee is encouraging him, casting doubt in your relationship (that may not be settled even if she DOES rip his heart out, if he convinces himself that he "saw something there"), and raising his hopes.

How do I know this? I'm in your exact situation right now. Damn boyfriend of mine is too "polite" of mine to tell this girl off who shamelessly wants him.

OR, as Clayface pointed out, he'll react badly and unpredictably to being messed with.

The third point is the deontological view- it's wrong and dishonorable.

[Chris Sanders MSX]

Originally posted by Clayface


Well, in my opinion, nothing ever warrents purposefully screwing with someone's emotions. And there are much more effective and mature ways to handle the situation.

Take it from someone with a lot of relationship experience, JustJack - this is a bad idea.



Trust me. I've had A LOT of relationship experience and what he's proposing doesn't have anything to do with how many relationships you've been in. I think we ALL know that there are more mature ways to handle this (and they are few) but he needs something that will get this guy to back off once and for all. Lot's of people don't respond to talking... it looks like he's already proved this.

This is a matter of opinion really. I don't think it's a bad idea if the guy is trying to ruin your relationships all for his own wants and desires. Besides I think that anything she does will screw with his head, because he seems to resist rejection. This is just the worst way to do it, which depending on how much you dislike the guy may be what you want.

I honestly would like to hear one of the "more effective and mature" ways of doing this. In my opinion it's a good idea and it has nothing to do with relationship experience. He already ahs said they've told him to lay off..and he won't do it. That means he won't listen to either of them..

Jack if your naturally a jeleous or insecure guy I advise follow what ever Clay face can come up with. But if you know that this flirting won't amount to any thing other than getting this guy out of your relationship I say go for it.

If only we knew more about the guy. Our advice would have more merit.

[Chris Sanders MSX]

The point I'm trying to push is, what kind of doubt could exsist ? They both know about the plan and his girl obviously doesn't want this other guy.


The third point is the deontological view- it's wrong and dishonorable.

Yeah and trying to make Jack look bad and trying to steal his girl is just and true. The guy has it coming, you can't just Take it with a grain of salt. Does any one have any thing that Jack COULD do instead ? Besides talking as that's already FAILED .

[Clayface]

Originally posted by Chris Sanders MSX

Trust me. I've had A LOT of relationship experience and what he's proposing doesn't have anything to do with how many relationships you've been in.



Ok, well, two things here. First, not to sound stuck up here, but you're only 18. While I'm sure you've got plenty of relationship experience, there's a lot you'll learn over the next few years. I thought I knew plenty about relationships and how to handle them at 18. I've learned over the years that very few people, if any, really know a lot about relationships at that age. And, frankly, there are probably many, many people out there that are older than me that laugh when I say I know I lot. There's a lot to be gained for extra years of experience, and a lot of new perspective. I've seen this sort of thing done a hundred times before, and it never works.




Besides I think that anything she does will screw with his head, because he seems to resist rejection.



Ah, but that's the key right there. We don't know all the details here. It sounds to me like there are several things pointing to the idea that the g/f in this relationship hasn't done all that she could to show him "rejection". For one thing, she's still talking to the guy. Does she tell him "no" seriously, or does she say it jokingly? What sort of signals is she sending the guy?

There are several steps to take in a situation like this. First, is simply talking - which sounds like its been done here. She needs to tell the guy that she is not at all interested, and wants nothing to do with him. Sounds ike this has happened, and that's good.

Now, if the guy persists, the next step is to cut off all communication. If the guy calls her house, she doesn't take the call. If she's the one to pick up the phone, she doesn't say a word - she just hangs it up. If he attempts to talk to her in person, she doesn't say a word. Not even a "leave me alone". She keeps completely quiet, doesn't look at him, doesn't acknowledge him. If he tries to give her a note, she doesn't take it, doesn't even hold it in her hand. If she takes it and walks away, even if she throws it away later, he thinks he's had success - that he's gotten her to read the note. Sometimes, guys like this will take every little thing they can get. If the girl keeps talking to them, even if its a "drop dead", he thinks he still has a chance to get into her head, to talk his way in. As long as she acknowledges him in any way, with any words at all, he'll persist.


If it continues beyond that point, it is officially stalking - go to the police. If he's just a guy that's persistent, he'll be scared off and stop. If not, he's a nutcase, and going to the cops is the best bet anyway.

[Chris Sanders MSX]

What your suggesting isn't entirely realistic with how most teens would deal with this. It may work, but I just don't see it working.



Ok, well, two things here. First, not to sound stuck up here, but you're only 18.

I'm 17 until October 30th...Heh :p ANd you don't sound stuck up. I have to agree with you honestly.

[Clayface]

Originally posted by Chris Sanders MSX
What your suggesting isn't entirely realistic with how most teens would deal with this.



Exactly my point. Most teens wouldn't deal with it that way, but most adults would (well, at least those that grow up at some point in their lives! ;)). Thus my "more mature ways to handle it" comment.




I'm 17 until October 30th...Heh :p



Well, see, I was giving you the benefit of the doubt! :D




ANd you don't sound stuck up. I have to agree with you honestly.


Well, thank you - I was afraid I was going to offend someone there. Glad you didn't take it as a personal insult or attack, because that's certainly not how I mean it.

[Nightflower]

Well...what I'd WANT to do in your position is to get your girlfriend to slap the guy, insult him, scream at him, make it VERY clear that she's NOT interested. Hopefully, THAT will get the message, and not only that, get him to hate you both equally. :p

[hello_lola]

Don't do this: It's bad karma, things could spiral out of control, and it demeans you and your girlfriend. I've had to deal with the stalker-loser type before (from your position), and the best thing is for your girl to keep being consistently firm, and for you not to let your temper fuel this guy's psycho delusions. If you and your girl are solid, this annoying twerp will eventually back-off. Good luck, and keep us posted :) .

[Crazy8s]

Playing games never does anyone any good. Be an adult and ignore the guy. Eventually he'll get the message and move on.

[Evil Dr. Reef]

Clayface's advice is about the best I've heard here so far. Not to say that anyone elses' are bad, but his just sounds the sanest & least dangerous.

[Lucky Bob]

(Ben Stein Voice:)

Good Idea: Telling a geek to get a life

Bad idea: Telling your girlfriend to get a life.

[JustJack]

Hey everyone! And thanks for all the feedback.

First of all, this guy, Adam...he was my best friend for a little while. I was already ticked off at him before I started going out with my gf. Quite frankly, Adam is a womanizer, and he does not take 'no' for an answer. He's entirely greedy & lustful, & just wants to get..'in'. Know what I mean? I know this, because when we were friends, he told me. I've told my GF this, and now she's freaking out about it.

Today, she just gave him a note. She didn't tell me about the note untill after I told her what Adam had told me. Now she REALLY doesn't want to go through with this. Beside's, there are way to many down sides. First off, this is a REALLY DUMB GUY. She has told him countless times to back off, & that she just wants to be friends. But, he's persistant. One time she told him that if he didn't back off, she would let me beat him up...in the end, he was left with a couple bruses, but he still persist's.

We're looking into other options right now.

Well, we could just ignor him...but I do kinda get a little jealous, and my gf is afraid if he persist's, he will find a way to break us up.
Another, which is my idea ;) , She needs to ignor his advances, and any flirting needs to be returned with negative feedback. She can still hang out with him, be his friend, but right now it just seems like the best course of action is tell him to either "cut it out or get out of our lives". She doesn't want to just kick her friend out of her life...but, I guess we both know we don't have many options right now.

Also, our 'last' option(which, honestly, I noticed very quickly she wasn't bothered with in the least, & she has been talking about it for awhile), we have a baby. I'm sure that if we had a kid, outside of marriage...I know Adam will back off. Heh...Actually, it would solve a lot of problems...but, it'd create a whole lot more. :p

Anyway, thanks for all of you listening in on my personal life! Thanks! hahaha...

[Nightflower]

No problem :)

Well, if he is a REALLY DUMB GUY, and a womanizer, all the more reason for your girlfriend not to flirt with him. If he persists despite neutral reactions, he's definitely going to get out of line if he gets a POSITIVE reaction.

Ignoring someone is always the mature way to do it... but personally, I like something that's more secure. Parents are always telling their kids to "ignore the bully at school" when you're young, and he'll go away when he sees he's not getting a response. That's the mature way to go. Guess what? Bullies aren't mature, and they're actually delighted when their victims stop fighting back. I don't think Adam is very mature either.

But I'll warrant that Clayface and Crazy8's probably had more "experience" than me (Geezers! ;)) so you might want to take my advise with a grain of salt.

This is what I'd do... if Adam is dirt stupid, I think you're going to have to send a VERY CLEAR message. Your girlfriend isn't going to like this, but I think the best way to go is that not only does your girlfriend tell him clearly to cut it out, but I think she has to stop being his friend too. If he's that bad, all communication has to cease. I think Clayface already said this before. If your girlfriend feels the same way as you (I'm assuming she does), get her to tell him that SHE doesn't want his attention and SHE wants him to go away. Because saying that you'll beat him up just makes it look like you're jealous and that he has a chance at all. But really... I don't think "I just want to be friends" is strong enough. To a dumb person, continuing to be friendly (platonically..) sends a mixed message.

A baby? :eek: Umm....eerrr.... uhh.... well...it's your life. You can screw it up however you want. ;)[

[DR. BELCH]

This guy sounds like a class-A psycho. Having your girlfriend either seduce him or slap him in a loud public conversation sounds like a good way to get her raped and/or killed. This may be a matter for the police, though if he's a paranoid type, that may exacerbate matters further.
My fourth ex had a similar problem with a psycho ex-lover (her second one, in fact--poor girl had no luck with men). She had a restraining order put on him, which wasn't easy since they both worked in the same office.
Other than hoping he either goes away on his own or, God forbid, dies in a sudden and hopefully unable-to-be-connected-to-you manner, there's no clean way to handle a guy like this....