TMNT: Back to the Sewer Talkback: Episode 7.02: "Karate Schooled" (Spoilers)

[veemonjosh]

They're finally back...


http://library.toonzone.net/talkbacks/cw4kids.jpghttp://library.toonzone.net/talkbacks/tmntbtts.jpg



Episode 7.02 Karate Schooled
Original air date: September 20, 2008

Previously, on Back to the Sewer: With Cody's Time Window repaired, the turtles and their sensei got ready to go home. However, the trip was quickly complicated by the interence of a not-quite-deleted Viral, who sent them, and Serling, across time in an attempt to end things once and for all. However, thanks to some quick thinking from Don, her plans were foiled, but not before she vaporized Splinter into atoms! The turtles arrived in the present day, grieving, while Viral went into the internet and, finding the Foot computer, accidentally became...the Cyber Shredder!

This time: When the Turtles are reunited with Casey and April, it's smiles all around ... until it becomes clear that Casey's being brainwashed by his new martial arts instructor, Master Khan, a devoted Foot operative. The Turtles must save Casey (and themselves) from this deadly Foot fanatic!

Remember kids, today we get to properly meet April's Landlord! :D

Edit: Oh, wow, I forgot the Foot Mystics in the poll...Oh well, I guess they go under "other".

[TKnHappyNess]

I don't know if you'd be counting the classic Ninja Turtles characters in that poll, or just the newer ones. Anyway, this would've been the best time for the Foot's original martial arts master and teacher, Tatsu, to show up. Other than the first two movies, the last appearance he had was in the first TMNT game on the Genesis, Hyperstone Heist, although on Wikipedia, it says he was in the Next Mutation series, but I doubt it. On this list, he's between Tang Shen and Tattoo. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_Teenage_Mutant_Ninja_Turtles_character_appearances

[Majin_Megabyte]

Really good episode, this week with the return of both April and Casey back into the main cast of characters again. We also got the introduction to Khan the new Sherrder henchman who is rebuilding the foot again. I have a feeling this going lead into an Karai Vs. Khan confortion down the line this season or just somewhere down the line. The story is getting back into the dark stuff that was in the first 5 season of TMNT 2003 with Donny's depression of the events that happen in the first episode of the season.

[CyberCubed]

LOL, I was reminded of Tatsu as well.

When Khan said, "Master Shredder" didn't it sound just like Tatsu from the movies?

Anyway some good points of this ep:

- Reintroduction of Casey and April, their new designs look much better in motion than I thought they would.
- Don taking the loss of Splinter harder than everyone else
- New villain introduced, Cyber Shredder apparently can't leave cyberspace.


Poor Serling, Mikey still picks on him. I was disappointed with Mikey's lack of concern over Splinter, it seemed like he didn't even care.

[Roxas_Sora]

Can anybody send more spoilers about today's episode, please?.

[creativerealms]

Better then the first episode.

I mentioned this in another topic. Something with Khan having seperating himself from Karai's foot at some point, a refusal to see Karai as the Foots new leader maybe. Seems like that may be the way they are going with this character, to him the only leader is the Shredder.

Oh I like that it feels like mike has recovered from the poor characteration he was given in fast Forward. He feels much closer to his old self again. Maybe all that future stuff made him soft.

Don's obsession over saving Splinter makes sense, he blames himself. Also I would not say Mikey has a lack of concern for Splinter, more that humor is being used as a mask right now.

[thenewme93]

Yea..like the others..I say this eppy rock..which makes me wonder..how are the comics doing?

[veemonjosh]

I don't know if you'd be counting the classic Ninja Turtles characters in that poll, or just the newer ones.

Just the newer ones. If we were to get into all the foot-related villains from the old cartoon, we'd end up listing nearly every mutant that ever appeared.


Yea..like the others..I say this eppy rock..which makes me wonder..how are the comics doing?

From what I've heard, Mirage is just BARELY selling enough copies to continue, but the total number of copies sold is dropping every issue.

I blame it mainly on the fact that it's dang near impossible to find newer issues in comic book shops (when I went to one during the summer, the newest issue they had was, like, issue 5 of the current volume).

[CyberCubed]

Tales of the TMNT is continuing through 2009 at least, it just passed its milestone #50 issue.

Volume 4 is up to issue #29, and issue #30+ will be posted online on Wowio.com.

[Terror of Death]

Do you guys think Casey was brainwashed into killing someone or do you think that blood was from training?

[Roxas_Sora]

By the chance, when the turtles saw Master Khan for the first time in this episode, did they recognize him from the previous episode when they were in the battle of the three Shredders?.

[CyberCubed]

By the chance, when the turtles saw Master Khan for the first time in this episode, did they recognize him from the previous episode when they were in the battle of the three Shredders?.

They did recognize him, Leo even said he was the same guy they saw when they were sent to the future with the three Shredder's.

On that note, does anyone else think Viral really thinks she is Shredder now? It seems like Khan thinks that is the real Shredder too.

[creativerealms]

My guess is when Viral tried to take over the Utom data device she absorded memory files about the Utrom shredder and indeed thinks she is that Shredder. The data device was too advanced for her I figure.

[Shredder565]

OK, some notes:

- Mike gets a best improvement for character evolving. I LOVED his Family Truckster line, and I can't help but wonder if that's an ad lib by Wayne.

- I'm surprised they told Casey and April EVERYTHING about the future, even Cody's existence. You'd think Serling would have prevented that so the future doesn't get altered.

- We where lead to believe that Kahn killed the guy in the opening, but it looked like he returned to the rank of ninja later.

- Kahn sounds like a Foot Elite, has the Music of a Foot Elite, and can dissapear super fast like a Foot Elite. But is he one of the foot elite?

- We now know that Cyber Shredder is probably a virtual program. The REAL Utrom Shredder somehow returns from the ice asteroid prison later as shown in the future...Same goes for Demon Shredder. Interesting.....

- I personally think that April's design still sucks. I'm sorry, but I just don't care for it at all. Splinters design works, Casey's works...but April just looks ugly now.

So the turtles must have been back for a week before April and Casey found out...how else can you explain the fast building of the new hauler, and all the new gadgets?

[Bratbat]

"I didn't have corn."- Mikey after throwing up

:D

[TKnHappyNess]

So far that's 2 Back the the Future references they've had. The letter in "Timing is Everything", and the hover conversion in "Karate Schooled", similar to the way Doc Brown had the DeLorean hover converted in 2015. I was hoping Raph would say the line "Roads? Where we're going, we don't need roads.".

[Blackstar]

I personally think that April's design still sucks. I'm sorry, but I just don't care for it at all. Splinters design works, Casey's works...but April just looks ugly now.

Respectfully, I must disagree. I think April looks great in BttS. She looks even more "anime" heroine-esque than she did before but then, I though that she looked great in the original 2K3 series. It's only April's 1987 design with the yellow jumpsuit and the brown that I don't care for.

[creativerealms]

Well for April's design well I'm glad to see the "belly shirt" go. That really did not look right on her, especially not when she was Stockman's assistant.

[CyberCubed]

- I'm surprised they told Casey and April EVERYTHING about the future, even Cody's existence. You'd think Serling would have prevented that so the future doesn't get altered.


Isn't Cody their great grandson though?

Even if they know about him, it won't alter anything. Shadow would still be their daughter, and then her kids (which are Cody's parents), would die somehow, leaving Cody in custody of Serling.

[PC!]

Interesting to see Don pulling a S4 Leo and angsting it up. I can't wait to see 'em going into the cyber world next week.

[JEWCY]

"I didn't have corn."- Mikey after throwing up

:D

awesome line, was going to make a post about that if no one else did. had me laughing for a good 20 seconds :D

[gobo]

- Kahn sounds like a Foot Elite, has the Music of a Foot Elite, and can dissapear super fast like a Foot Elite. But is he one of the foot elite?
Do music cues ever lie? :P

My guess is when Viral tried to take over the Utom data device she absorded memory files about the Utrom shredder and indeed thinks she is that Shredder. The data device was too advanced for her I figure.
Too advanced?? O_o It's outdated by a century! I think it's more likely that this online backup of The Shredder was loaded with viruses and such for 'in case' someone like Viral ever happened by. Remember, the Utrom Shredder did see her when he briefly visited 2105, in "Timing is Everything".

So far that's 2 Back the the Future references they've had. The letter in "Timing is Everything", and the hover conversion in "Karate Schooled", similar to the way Doc Brown had the DeLorean hover converted in 2015. I was hoping Raph would say the line "Roads? Where we're going, we don't need roads.".
Does the phrase, "Back to the Sewer", not suggest another reference? :P

Isn't Cody their great grandson though?

Even if they know about him, it won't alter anything. Shadow would still be their daughter, and then her kids (which are Cody's parents), would die somehow, leaving Cody in custody of Serling.
Ignoring the fact that you said Shadow would have anything to do with it, by revealing to them that they were destined to do any of those things would put tremendous pressure on people to not 'mess up' or something more like what Splinter was getting at in "The Journal". But, remember that it's the surname of Jones that Cody has. That means that April and Casey's son is Cody's gramps.

[PC!]

Don't forget, guys, you can view character and location designs every week at the Back to the Sewers blog here. (http://www.4kids.tv/show/tmntsewer/blog)

[Ian]

But, remember that it's the surname of Jones that Cody has. That means that April and Casey's son is Cody's gramps.

That's far from being a given, though. Given that these days one is as likely to find an unmarried parent as not, the fact that the Jones surname survived a hundred years isn't really indicative of what kind of progeny April and Casey will spawn.

In any case, enjoyable episode. While the lower-quality animation is obvious--the action scenes have an unsatisfying amount of impact--the improved writing makes up for it.

Random thoughts:


So the "new" lair is the old lair. They just about get away with it, given that we never saw all that much of that particular lair. Still, it's nice to see that they won't be moving yet again. On a related note, does anyone find the passage of time between episodes confusing? They have time to completely overhaul the lair, but not enough time to visit April and Casey? Weird.
I really like the idea of Casey taking up martial arts while the turtles are gone; it really does make perfect sense. While it sort of dilutes what makes his character special--he's suppose to be the non-ninja fighter, I do hope don't forget this aspect of the character.
So far, the season seems to be unfolding as a mystery. Last episode we had three Shredders, two Foot armies, one Master Khan, and no idea of who worked for who. This episode we learn that the Foot has apparently dissolved, or else drastically dwindled in strengh. It's a bit that's surprising, yet not: the Demon Shredder had, after all, did hand the Foot its collective ass on a stick; plus, with the Purple Dragons as a rival on equal footing, it makes sense that a restoration wouldn't go unchallenged. And yet, those events wouldn't seem to answer everything. In any case, they've got my interest.
The turtle's ease at telling their nakama about the future seems to be yet another piece of evidence showing that the creators are working with Gargoyles'--"can't change the future"--time travel rules. I really hope its intentional. The whole three-Shredder teaser last episode sort of demands it, in order to be effective. And, yet, that would mean that the other two Shredders (seem to) return, and that the turtles are once again missing. I'm conflicted.
I was quite surprised to hear April mention blood in the context of violence, given its total abscence from battle scenes. I hope that sort of surprise continues.
Okay, they are totally reusing that shot of Manhattan from the first art style, and its totally jarring. This is starting to feel like the last few episodes of Evangelion.
A minor surprise: April and Casey still apparently live in different appartments. While I wasn't expecting an actual mention that they'd moved in together, I was hoping that the writers would drop hints to that effect. In any case, it's somewhat odd: given their stage in the relationship and their respective economic situations, it seems a bit illogical to have to care for two different places.

[Simpler Simon]

I was also surprised at the mention of blood - the last few seasons got away with things from time to time, but coming home with someone else's blood on you is a pretty mature tidbit to throw out. I forget, was this revamp produced with the move to CW in mind, or was it done before? Did they know if BS&P would be different?

Yeah the passage of time is suspect - Donny somehow designed a new vehicle with future tech before the Turtles sorted the lair out or went to find Casey and April? I suppose I'll get used to the garbage truck, but I wish the moving van got more use.

Overall a good episode, really wondering where Karai is now. While the animation's taken a hit, the fight scenes are much better than the bulk of Fast Forward. The tone seems right for this new show, hope the cyber world stuff can stay consistent.

[mumbo]

That's true, the action scenes in Fast Forward were really weak for the most part and I thought this was an improvement over that even if it's still well below 2K3's.

The storytelling here is great. I'm hanging on here. While we aren't getting multi-parters here the show seems to still be pretty serialized, which is just the way I like it. Obviously it's a bit early to tell after just two episodes though :sweat: I'm getting Season 4 vibes, though, and I love it.

Next week it looks like we get our first trip to the cyberworld. I await with wary anticipation.

[TKnHappyNess]

Does the phrase, "Back to the Sewer", not suggest another reference? :P

Not really because there was a similar TMNT title: The second game for the Game Boy, Back From the Sewers.

[creativerealms]

Too advanced?? O_o It's outdated by a century! I think it's more likely that this online backup of The Shredder was loaded with viruses and such for 'in case' someone like Viral ever happened by. Remember, the Utrom Shredder did see her when he briefly visited 2105, in "Timing is Everything".



Yes Viral is from 100 years in the future but that does not mean Utrom technology can't be more advanced then a 22th centery computer virus. I believe it was. I do not believe it was planned by Shredder. I think Viral just underestamated Utrom Technology thinking she was more advanced when that was not the case.

[CyberCubed]

I guess New York has been a rather quiet place since the Turtles left for a year. No alien invasions, no demons, no monsters, no major Foot Clan Activity.

It seems like the only thing that progressed is Hun and the Purple Dragons, but we'll have to wait for his first ep to see exactly what.

[Mandi-chan]

So far, I'm happy with Season 7...not overly impressed with it, but so far it's better than Season 6 was so that's good enough for me.

I think the guys look cute with eyes now, they're more expressive which I think is nice.

I like April and Casey's redesigns (athough April does look a lot younger now), but I did think April's voice acting was a little off at times (at first, I thought she had a new voice actress).

I like the robot, and thought his comment to April re: her having the same eyes as Cody was cute (he looked so sad when he said it).

Mikey has become more and more unlikeable to me over the last couple of seasons with his inappropriate comments and actions after something major or tragic happens to them (mainly regarding Splinter). First the burt fur comment back in the Season 4 premire (apparently he forgot that Splinter got that way saving HIS life!) and now the total childishness going into overdrive in this episode after Splinter takes a hit for them to save their lives.

All of the guys get character development, development that sticks...so why can't Mikey too? He keeps having to learn these lessons due to his immaturity...yet, he never really learns from them or grows as a character. It's just annoying to me...I want to see him finally grow up a little, and stick with it!

Don's development in this episode was great, I loved his angst and felt it was appropriate and handled well. Out of all the boys, he's the one who's gone through the most trauma and hardships over the course of this series. He's the most well-developed character if you ask me, and I think it's impressive that he hasn't totally snapped by now after all the junk he's gone through!

Nice to see Casey get some good development and grow up a little (something that the writers have been consistant with for him...unlike Mikey), and now he's on par with the boys and not in their shadows so much anymore.

Would have liked to see more of April, but I'm sure we will in time.

The new baddie (who I thought was going to be connected to the Purple Dragons at first due to his clothes and such) is interesting. It seems to me that the Foot must have disbanded in the year that the turtles have been gone (since they were still active under Karai's leadership at the end of Season 5...perhaps she disbanded it herself?).

I wonder when we'll be seeing Karai again (she's a favorite character of mine), or Bishop (another favorite)?

I think they found out Splinter was still alive a little too soon, might have worked better if it was revealed in next weeks ep instead. Oh well...

So far, not bad. I'll watch again next week, and hope that the writers keep it up!

[veemonjosh]

Not really because there was a similar TMNT title: The second game for the Game Boy, Back From the Sewers.

I think he was making a joke about how "Back to the Sewer" sounds like "Back to the Future".

[ABrown]

It's interesting. These episodes so far still really feel like Fast Forward episodes to me. I think it's the designs. I have to agree that the Casey and April designs just do not look right. I'm assuming that there will be explanations for all the questions that have come up over these first couple of episodes. I hoping they're going to provide some background info on the new foot bad guy. Also, I'd like more info on this new Cyber-Shredder. I wouldn't be surprised if the fight that was going on in the first episode is a result of events that will unfold through out this season.

[Shredder565]

I like April and Casey's redesigns (athough April does look a lot younger now), but I did think April's voice acting was a little off at times (at first, I thought she had a new voice actress).



Thank goodness! I thought I was the only one noticing that and that since no one else noticed, I must have imagined it. April DOES sound a little different at times..

[Ian]

I think it's just a momentary hiccup, while Taylor and Thompson reacquaint themselves with the characters. It's been quite a while since they've voiced the characters regularly, after all.

[CyberCubed]

I did notice Casey kinda sounded "more dumb," although that was during the mind control, lol.

[gobo]

That's far from being a given, though. Given that these days one is as likely to find an unmarried parent as not, the fact that the Jones surname survived a hundred years isn't really indicative of what kind of progeny April and Casey will spawn.
If we were discussing reality, we'd be on the same page. But, this cartoon is primarily '4kids'[/pun]. While it might be of a mature subject matter quite often, I can't imagine the writers wanting to overcomplicate a lineage as easily explainable as Cody's. Not saying it's impossible. I just wouldn't count on it.

Yes Viral is from 100 years in the future but that does not mean Utrom technology can't be more advanced then a 22th centery computer virus. I believe it was. I do not believe it was planned by Shredder. I think Viral just underestamated Utrom Technology thinking she was more advanced when that was not the case.
Good point. But, there were Utroms living on Earth in 2105. It seems rather convenient that she never encountered the power of their tech that has been further developed by a century... I guess we can say that she was just caught off guard, not expecting to find Utrom tech on a primitive Earthian internet. Still, that'd be an awful lot the writer's expect the audience to read into the scenario...

I think he was making a joke about how "Back to the Sewer" sounds like "Back to the Future".
Thanks, Josh. That's what I was getting at.

I wonder when we'll be seeing Karai again (she's a favorite character of mine), or Bishop (another favorite)?
We've seen a BttS design for Karai, but have we seen one for Bishop?

[creativerealms]

Yeah we got a Stockman design which hints bishop may show up but no Bishop design.

[veemonjosh]

Good point. But, there were Utroms living on Earth in 2105. It seems rather convenient that she never encountered the power of their tech that has been further developed by a century... I guess we can say that she was just caught off guard, not expecting to find Utrom tech on a primitive Earthian internet. Still, that'd be an awful lot the writer's expect the audience to read into the scenario...

Actually...I don't recall ever seeing any Utroms in Fast Forward (besides Ch'rell's guest appearance), so maybe Earth of 2105 still doesn't know of their existance?

[gobo]

Actually...I don't recall ever seeing any Utroms in Fast Forward (besides Ch'rell's guest appearance), so maybe Earth of 2105 still doesn't know of their existance?
I saw one on the little hover platters they used back in "Secret Origins" hovering at a street corner in Fast Forward. Not sure which ep, but it was a 'blink-and-you'll-miss-it' thing. I'll try to find it again.

[NightwingAngelo]

After seeing the first two episodes, I'll gladly say that there is still hope.

With that said, the animation took a HUGE hit from the 2K3 series, and Mikey's behaviour is kind of odd. I'm also still not a fan of the re-designs. Casey Jones can work for the most part, but I don't like what they did with April. She looks really... odd? Winx Club-ish? Well, one thing is for sure, the voise doesn't really match.

Nonetheless, the show does seem like it can get back on the path it was before, and it slowly seems ot be shifting back there.

And who is Master Khan? Obviously the arrival of Cyber Shredder at the end and Khan training some members of the Foot or something has peaked my interest.

[Ian]

If we were discussing reality, we'd be on the same page. But, this cartoon is primarily '4kids'[/pun]. While it might be of a mature subject matter quite often, I can't imagine the writers wanting to overcomplicate a lineage as easily explainable as Cody's. Not saying it's impossible. I just wouldn't count on it.I don't see why not. Unless there's some more time travelling or time skips, we'll never see an adult Shadow; there's no reason for the writers to have to explain why her son (or daughter!) kept the Jones name. Plus, it's not like non-traditional families are anything rare for the series--the turtles, Ananda, Yoshi, Nano, Cody... I don't think 4Kids would be as reluctant to show a single mother as you suppose.
Creating a new, male progeny for April and Casey simply to have a simple lineage that they may never really take advantage of seems to me, to be a solution in search of a problem.

Still, it's not really a matter of either/or. After all, there's nothing stopping April and Casey from pumping out two spawn; if 4Kids really did have a problem with implying that Shadow is a single mother, they could always create a new character in addition to the established one. Still, I wouldn't count on it.

[Poweranimals]

There's no new ep on the 11th? Lame.