What's "Silver Age" and "Golden Age" in DC Comics?

[Squall]

OK, everyone's going to laugh at me for asking this question, but for reference, I've NEVER read comic books. My entire DC Universe is Batman: The Animated Series, The Batman/Superman Adventures, Batman Beyond, and Justice League on TV. :D

So, here's my stupid question: everyone in the Justice League Message Board keeps talking about "Silver Age" and "Golden Age" DC Comics. What the heck are those? What's the difference? How do they go together in the DC Universe? Or, are they completely different continuities that have nothing to do with each other? (For example, the TV shows mentioned above and the live-action Batman and Superman movies are all three completely different continuities.)

Another stupid question: Why do comic book writers have several different versions of comic books, and cascade their storylines through all of them? Why have "X-Men", "Amazing X-Men", and "Uncanny X-Men" when you can just have one comic book called "X-Men"??? Why not go with the simplest solution? Comic book lines today are all disorganized like that, and keeps non-readers like me from getting into it because I'd have no clue where to start reading.

Yet another stupid question, while I'm thinking about it: Do comic book lines reinvent themselves from time to time? (For example, "Superfriends" does NOT count as part of the storyline from "Justice League". They have NOTHING to do with each other, although, technically speaking, "Justice League" is a reinvention of "Superfriends." Do the Batman comics from the 1960's count as part of the "official" current Batman storyline, or did Batman reinvent himself and the story "start over" at some point???

Thanks for answering my questions. I've been DYING to understand how comic books work for years!!!

[The Guard]

Ok squall...

The Golden Age was wayyy back in the forties. The heroes back then were Batman, Superman, Green Lantern (Alan Scott), The Flash (Jay Garrick), Hawkman, The Spectre, Dr. Midnite, Sandman, and others. The Golden Age heroes all fought Nazis. There was a JSA instead of a JLA.

The Silver age was marked with the coming of new heroes, The Flash (Barry Allen), Green Lantern (Hal Jordan), Oliver Queen, and Black Canary. There were more villains introduced such as Sinestro, Starro, Darkseid, Cheetah, Amazo, etc. etc. The Silver age had it's own Supergirl, Batgirl, Batwoman, Bat-Mite, Bat-Hound.

The Modern Age, which we are in now, has contained people like Azrael, Huntress, Spoiler, and the new Superman origin, Batman origin, ZERO HOUR, KNIGHTFALL...and all the other crossovers.

Basically, the Golden Age encompasses from when Superman was created to about 1960.

The Silver Age is 1960 to CRISIS.

And the Modern Age is CRISIS to PRESENT.

Comics do indeed reinvent themselves. It's called conitinuity. For instance, in the 80's, Superman's origin was changed, and he was made less strong, and more human. The CRISIS changed a TON of stuff, and ZERO HOUR changed some stuff. You'll have to
ask specific questions about characters to get those answers.

And there a ton of X-MEN comics because people will buy them. Same reason there are 11 or 12 Batman-related titles.

The comics from the 60's are not considered part of today's DC history. Something called CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS wiped it out. It's hard to explain.

[The Guard]

http://www.io.com/~woodward/chroma/crisis.html

Hope that helps.

[Tracer]

SQUALL, you don't ask easy questions do you??? :eek:

OK let me see if I can answer this in under 20 pages...

Golden, Silver, and Bronze (Yes there is a Bronze too, but most readers don't remember them first hand) are basically breakdowns of era's the comic book industry went through. Typically (my years may be off slightly) the Silver Age of comics is usually around the 30's up until the early 80's.

It is the time when Batman and Superman were created and the comic industry went from Western, War and true Detective {Dick Track like} comic books to using "superheroes". During this time there was a HUGH turn in the type of comic that were created and most of the long running titles we see today came out of that era. The biggest plus and minus that came out of that time is "Crossover comics" where batman would appear in a superman comic, superman in a flash and so on. When this occurred two thing had to happen. Heroes from other cities and states now had to hint at their relative locations on a map and anything that happened in that cross over comic the characters (and writers) had to remember the events that took place.

Now after over 30 years of crossovers, guest writes and new writers coming along who did not know the “Full History” of the character they were writing for the “continuity” became jumbled. Meaning you would have one writer who said that Batman was afraid of cheese and 6 years later he would be seen eating a cheese sandwich (stupid example but I am sure you get the point). To help explain away the inconsistencies of the stories First the writers simple said that an event didn’t happen yet and when that excuse failed to work a brand new bad idea was created. “Multiple Universes”. The biggest question out in the 60’s and 70 was how could a character from the 40’s (Batman, green lantern, etc…) still be 35 in the 70’s Why don’t they age?? Also As sales dropped on some titles they were cancelled. And 10 years later a new write would recreate the character with a completely different person. Like the Flash from the Justice Society of America (JSA) was created in the 40’s he fought in WW2 and then vanished off the comic shelves. In the 70’s a new flash was made but it was a different character with no reference to the old one other than similar powers. NOW with multiple universes batman in the 40’s wasn’t the same batman of the 70’s The flash of the 70’s has never met the flash of the 40’s, etc…

Well this failed to cause if there was a problem that could not be logically explained it was just thrown in the it happened in another universe bucket and never brought up again. Then in the mid 80’s DC decided to clean up this problem once and for all by creating the Mother of all Crossovers – Crisis on Infinite Earths a 12 issue, all titles crossover that streamlined the DC Universe. In the end there was one universe, several Major Characters were killed off and timelines merged and remade. So now Batman never existed in the 40’s only in the 70’s, so characters never met or never existed at all. The comic universe was remade and started off with a clean slate for them to screw up again.

So to sum up you question.
The Silver Age (late 1930’s – The Crisis)
Golden Age (anything after the Crisis series.)

Why are there 5 X-men Titles, 4 Batman, 4 Superman, Etc…? Mostly greed, sometimes they break off to focus on another character. Example 1 – if your selling 10 million superman books a year with One title, greed says you can sell 20 million with 2 titles, 30 mill with 3 etc… until they remember that the writers and artist make the book and forcing them to write of more than one book on the same character often burns out the writers. Or the new writer or artist isn’t as good as the first books guy. Example 2 - there are three supeman books, they want one to focus on Steel, but don’t want to try to give him his own book yet (or again for that matter) Focus on him on “The Man of Steel” book. You will still have Superman but you can focus on Steel. Now, as I mentioned before, you cross the books over you have to remember what everyone else is doing and has done in the past.

I think I answered your reinvention question, Yes. But is usually follows some “Earth shattering event” that will justify hitting the reset button on a comic.

OK, I hope that is everything, I am tired now, so I am going to take a nap.

Yeesh

[Tracer]

Originally posted by The Guard


Basically, the Golden Age encompasses from when Superman was created to about 1960.

The Silver Age is 1960 to CRISIS.

And the Modern Age is CRISIS to PRESENT.



You might be correct but I am sure there is also a bronze age which is basically everything before Batman and Superman. I forget but he should get the idea.

[Ed Liu]

Howdy all,

I believe the Guard's dates are closer, Tracer. I always thought the Golden Age was from the 30's (starting with the introduction of Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman) to the 50's (I think), and the Silver Age being from the 50's (when the new Flash, Green Lantern, and Hawkman were introduced) to the 70's or 80's (but pre-Crisis).

Also, I've usually heard the Bronze Age used to refer to the post-Crisis period, not the pre-Golden Age. As far as I know, the term "Bronze Age" isn't as commonly used as the Golden and Silver Ages (some folks call it the Modern Age).

Another minor correction is that Batwoman, the original Batgirl (not Barb Gordon, the other one), and Ace the Bathound were products of the Golden Age, not the Silver Age. If I remember correctly, SA introduced Bat-mite and Batgirl-as-Barbara-Gordon (who was introduced as a direct result of the Batman TV show).

Squall: I highly, highly recommend you go to your local comic book store or bigger bookstore and grab The Dark Knight Returns and Batman: Year One, both by Frank Miller. In addition to kicking off the definitive Modern Age Batman, it formed the foundation from which the Batman movies and BTAS came from. They're also insanely great comics, back when Miller put out such things =8^).

-- Ed/Ace

[Ed Liu]

Howdy again,

One other quick note. If you want to get a better picture of the current DC Comics history, you can pick up the newly reissued History of the DC Universe, with new wraparound cover by Alex Ross. It covers post-Crisis DC history, and also serves as a decent intro to the different heroes throughout the DCU.

The book was originally written back in the early 90's, so some info is almost certainly out of date by now, but it covers stuff in a big, broad swaths kind of way.

-- Ed/Ace

[Squall]

OK, I think I get it now... so that's how it works, eh? The Gold, Silver, and Bronze (or Modern) ages are all seperate continuities where the DC Universe reinvented itself and "started over", but they kept the older medal ages going as alternate realities to please the fans that liked them? Then, in "Crisis", they elinimated all the alternate realities except the Modern one, which is now the only DC Universe. Interesting!

Does Marvel comics work the same way? Have they had their own ages, then in a BIG crossover they cleaned house and now have only one???

Still, though, maybe it's the Engineering side of me (I am an Engineer, after all :D), but I prefer simplicity. I'd think they'd make more money if they'd only have ONE Superman comic book series, that simply went from issue #1 -- this month's issue. Then you could subscribe to "Superman", like you would subscribe to a magazine, and be guaranteed to get "Superman" every month in the mail for a year. Same for "Batman", "Wonder Woman", etc. Having cascading storylines across several comic books with almost the same titile is a huge "Stay away!" sign from non-readers like myself who'd start reading comic books regularly if the way they do it wasn't so darned complicated...

But, I'm glad DC Universe cleaned house and got rid of old universes and continuities. But they STILL do the cascading stoyilnes thing! :(

And what about "What if?" storylines, "DC vs. Marvel", and "Batman meets Witchblade" comic books? Are those considered "Just for the heck of it" comic books, that are fun to read, but have no impact on the official storylines for Superman, Batman, etc.?

[Sugar Daddy]

I have a question to. If possible, can somene explain how Batman's origin was explained and changed? I'd appreciate it. Thanks

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

The current Marvel as you see it now officially began in the Silver Age. There was no Golden Age Marvel, other than a handful of heroes such as Captain America, Sub-Mariner and the first Human Torch. But it was nowhere near as expansive as DC's Golden Age.

Pre 60s Marvel was mostly made up on Westerns and Romance comics, but the company was named "Timely Comics" at the time. At least I think it was called "Timely."

Marvel hasn't had any major continuity shakeups like DC. Since Marvel's Golden Age was so simplistic, it was very easy to incorporate the older heroes into the official continuity.

However, Marvel may decide to do something funny with the Ultimate universe and the "official" Marvel universe someday.

[The Guard]

Another minor correction is that Batwoman, the original Batgirl (not Barb Gordon, the other one), and Ace the Bathound were products of the Golden Age, not the Silver Age.

I can't lump them into the Golden Age for some reason. I see the Golden Age as a simpler time, just Batman and Robin.

I have a question to. If possible, can somene explain how Batman's origin was explained and changed? I'd appreciate it. Thanks

Originally, Batman caught his killer, a man named Joe Chill. When Chill ran, and his friends found out he was the reason Batman existed, they shot him. There was something called ZERO HOUR, where a power-mad PARALLAX (Green Lantern) tried to re-invent hostory, that made it so Batman never caught his parent's killer.


Squall OK, I think I get it now... so that's how it works, eh? The Gold, Silver, and Bronze (or Modern) ages are all seperate continuities where the DC Universe reinvented itself and "started over", but they kept the older medal ages going as alternate realities to please the fans that liked them? Then, in "Crisis", they elinimated all the alternate realities except the Modern one, which is now the only DC Universe. Interesting!

They didn't keep the older ages. Those events occurred on other Earths. Read that link I gave you. It explains a lot.

Does Marvel comics work the same way? Have they had their own ages, then in a BIG crossover they cleaned house and now have only one???

Marvel hasn't been around that long. And no, there has been no "CRISIS" type event for Marvel. As a result, continuity over there is messed up a LOT.

The reason there are more than one book, is also to give writers and artists a shot. If there was just one Batbook, we'd onlyget to see Rucka, and the best Bat-Artist. We'd never get to READ Devin Grayson and Ed Brubaker, or guys like Chuck Dixon. Unless there was a revolving cast of writers and artists, but...

And what about "What if?" storylines, "DC vs. Marvel", and "Batman meets Witchblade" comic books? Are those considered "Just for the heck of it" comic books, that are fun to read, but have no impact on the official storylines for Superman, Batman, etc.?

Purely fantasy.

[Anthonynotes]

My stab at explaining all of this:
The Golden Age: the late 30's through the early 50's. The era that Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, and the Justice Society came about.

The Silver Age: comics from the late 50's through the early 70's. The Justice League of America was introduced in this time.

The Bronze Age: usually refers to comics from the 70's through mid-80's; however, it encompasses the same set of continuity as the Silver Age....

Modern Age: usually the mid-80's (after CRISIS ) to the present

Re: continuity: Back in the 60's, DC decided to explain away its earliest continuity aspects (from the Golden Age/40's) via the device of declaring all of its Golden Age comics as having taken place on a parallel Earth (dubbed "Earth-2", seperate from the "real"/"current continuity" world of "Earth-1"). Thus, various stories where Earth-2's Justice Society would meet Earth-1's Justice League were published.

Eventually, DC decided that they needed to boost sales/it was too convoluted/wanted to adapt a more Marvel-esque one-universe-only, erm, universe, and published "Crisis On Infinite Earths" in 1985-86, which basically pulled a "Back to the Future" and retroactively rewrote continuity, declaring various previously published comics as "null and void", and with the characters acting/proceeding as if there'd only ever been one universe (where both the JLA and JSA live). This miniseries (and the comics that followed) also allowed DC to do various things like rewrite Superman's origin, etc...

As for Batman:
>>>Another minor correction is that Batwoman, the original Batgirl (not Barb Gordon, the other one), and Ace the Bathound were products of the Golden Age, not the Silver Age. If I remember correctly, SA introduced Bat-mite and Batgirl-as-Barbara-Gordon (who was introduced as a direct result of the Batman TV show).
<<<

Ace the Bat-hound and the original Bat-Girl (note spelling) were products of the late 50's (IIRC) Bat-books (an ill-fated attempt apparently to keep up with the Superman line's books, w/Krypto, etc., that was all ditched in 1964 in favor of a "serious" approach when Julius Schwartz came along as editor), thus putting them firmly as Silver Age (or "Earth-1"; there was no Earth-2 Ace or Bat-Girl). As for Bat-Woman, I guess I'd put her as a Silver Age character IMO (though 70's Batman comics had an Earth-2 version of Bat-Woman)...

Re: which Bat-books are in current continuity: I asked this question awhile ago elsewhere online, and the answer I got was my main presumption: that unless it's been explicitly retconned/contradicted by modern material, I could keep my assumption that any Bat-book from the late 60's or so onward could "count" (thus keeping some of the Dick Grayson-as-Robin stories in canon)...

[Sugar Daddy]

Thanks everybody. But whats SA?

[The Guard]

SA: SILVER AGE

Is there a reason this needs to be explained 8 times? :)

[Sugar Daddy]

Oooooooooh, lol, i kept thinking that was in reference to a comic book. Oops

[MattL.]

Squal: In my opinion by having the bulk of your exposure to the DC characters being the animated series you are getting the best version their is anywhere so you aren't missing that much.

But if you get a chance to get some of the collections of material from the various eras because its fun to see where alot of the ideas in the series came from and what the creators kept, tossed out, or did an entirely different twist on.

Over in Marvel, I'd recommend Ultimate Spider-Man. Its something that has its own continuity with Peter Parker beign 15 years old in our world today. The pacing of it is basically alot like seeing a really really good live-action tv show of Spider-Man only on paper with really cool art. The realism and fantasy elements are balanced better than in most comics. You dont have one forsaken for the other.

I also recommend getting the work of Jack Kirby. Kirby is to superheros and comics in general what Shakespeare was to plays or Elvis to rock n' roll. In the sense that he was extremely prolific, versatile, and his influence effected so much and so many people. Not least of which being Bruce Timm himself whos a *major* Kirby fan. Kirby was the co-creator of Captain America and most of the Marvel Universe with Stan Lee and he created the New Gods characters for DC (Darkseid, Orion and all those other wild characters you saw in STAS.)

As you probably know by watching Apokalips Now, Kirby is no longer with us. But his influence still reigns.

Just thought I'd pitch in and help to. :)

[metaphysician]

Add to that anything produced by Neil Gaiman, Alan Moore, Kurt Busiek.

[Squall]

MattL. said, "Squall: In my opinion by having the bulk of your exposure to the DC characters being the animated series you are getting the best version there is anywhere so you aren't missing that much."

I think that's true too. I think that Dini, Timm & Co. "cleaned up" and "organized" the otherwise chaotic DC Universe and made it nice, neat and tidy... just the way us Engineers like it! :D

I've read stuff about the Gold, Silver, Bronze Ages of DC, the Crisis of Infinite Earths, Zero Hour, etc. -- and some of it is just plain corny and confusing! (In my opinon.)

I think that the animated series are the best version of the DC Universe too. :)

But, if I ever get the chance, I WILL pick up some comic books written by Jack Kirby. :)

[Supreme]

And let's not forget DC's "Hyper Time", introduced in "Kingdom Come". It is a portal to all the worlds/time periods where EVERYTHING happened, be it the Elseworlds stories, down to the nixed continuity threads, like Superboy (who grew up to be the omnipotent Superman, not the clone)

[Matt Hazuda]

Well since we're going into DC history hear, can someone explain to me what the heck happened in Zero Hour? Also, if anyone's up to it, how about Terror(Panic?) in the Skies?

[Supreme]

Zero Hour (http://omega.animefringe.com/dcevents/zerohourfaq.txt)

Panic in the Sky (http://omega.animefringe.com/dcevents/Event_Panic.html)

[MattL.]

Squall: Do indeed check out some Jack Kirby stuff. You might think it corny at first, but I prefer to think of it as bold and spirited. Theres alot of power, epicness and charm to his stuff.

His art and stories both written by himself and with Stan Lee make no apologies for being bombastic and over the top while at the same time usually having a strong underlying theme, which I admire greatly.

[Sugar Daddy]

Who came up with the names Silver Age and Bronze Age, etc.?

[metaphysician]

Originally posted by Supreme
And let's not forget DC's "Hyper Time", introduced in "Kingdom Come". It is a portal to all the worlds/time periods where EVERYTHING happened, be it the Elseworlds stories, down to the nixed continuity threads, like Superboy (who grew up to be the omnipotent Superman, not the clone)

"The Kingdom", not "Kingdom Come"

[Sugar Daddy]

Originally posted by metaphysician


"The Kingdom", not "Kingdom Come"

Was this storyline put in a tpb?

[Supreme]

Originally posted by metaphysician


"The Kingdom", not "Kingdom Come"

Toe-MAY-toe, Tuh-MAH-toe.

It stems from Kingdom Come (the "world", not the story)