Gough and Millar Exit Smallville

[Jacob T. Paschal]

Well...son of a gun (http://www.superherohype.com/news/topnews.php?id=7018).

[Darklordavaitor]

Wait, there's going to be an 8th season? Thought that adding Supergirl to the cast was the sign of the end.

[Jacob T. Paschal]

Wait, there's going to be an 8th season? Thought that adding Supergirl to the cast was the sign of the end.

Well, who knows! There's probably just a few 'loose ends' they want to tie up or something but at this point nobody knows, really.

[bigddan11]

This could be good news or bad news. Perhaps it means we will actually see Clark develop the last few of his powers- such as his ice breath, and end it with him flying towards Metropolis to save the day and become Superman. On the other hand, it could cause a radical remake which would lead a lot of fans to stop watching and cause the series to die without a proper conclusion. I personally hope it's the first of the two.

Gough and Millar- congratulations on the great job you've done with Smallville. You will be missed, but hopefully the show can now get out of that cycle it's been stuck in for the past couple of years that you didn't feel should end, and I'm not just talking about Clana either folks.

[Nightwing]

Wait, there's going to be an 8th season? Thought that adding Supergirl to the cast was the sign of the end.

Sure. As long as you may feel the show has gone on, Smallville's 8th season was actually announced a bit EARLIER than normal.

I would have thought the show would be put to rest, but this big turn could be interesting.

[Mikintosh]

I thought they had already moved on in every way but name a couple years ago, so this doesn't change much for me (tho I'm mystified why they wouldn't stay on for what would probably be the last season).

[Jacob T. Paschal]

It's weird as Gough had seemed to be the show's public face for the past two or three years, constantly being the one quoted on future plotlines and the such.

[The Penguin]

It's almost never a good sign when a long-time show runner leaves like this (I can't recall a time it's worked out for the better). We'll see if that holds true for Smallville.

[Jacob T. Paschal]

All I can surmise is that there's a stronger force behind the scenes that trying to push the show in a direction those two do not want to follow.

Lately I've been thinking that if not one of the actors then somebody on the crew is either going to make a big fuss or say something later this season or throughout the next. A show like this seems to be bound with displeasure behind the scenes.

[Azrael24]

well maybe now the show will get some smarter producers :shrug:

[PowerZord]

Maybe Gough and Millar wanted something diferent than DC? or they defied their mighty power? If we base all of this, on this lil quote:


DC is very, very crafty when it comes to their contracts and trademarks. This was discussed by Gough and Millar on the Season 3 DVD set. DC has a clause in the contract for the series that they have the right to veto any decision made by the series writers if they don't agree with it. If the producers/writers push the issue, DC can pull out of the contract as its considered void thus terminating the series or terminate the contracts of others involved in the show.

For example: Adam Knight in season three WAS Bruce Wayne up until the 11th hour when DC Comics pulled the authorization. They had initially given the idea their approval until they saw how it was turning out. They can, in short, cancel any decision made. If they didn't like how Season 8 was going to progress it was well in their rights to veto the entire season idea and have them start from scratch. Rather than risk a multimillion dollar industry (billion if you include the film series) the network would go with DC.


Thanks to Gold Samurai from Rangerboard for the informative quote

[The Penguin]

Well it seems the change may not be very dramatic as the show's other producers are taking over. From TVGuide.com (http://community.tvguide.com/blog-entry/TVGuide-News-Blog/Todays-News/Smallville-Shocker-Series/800036775)...


"Al Gough and Miles Millar have been great partners and instrumental in the development and success of Smallville. While we are sad to see them go, we are very excited to announce that executive producers Darren Swimmer, Todd Slavkin, Kelly Souders and Brian Peterson will helm the show next season. [They] have been writing for the show for the past six seasons, and as producers for the last four years, they have played an integral role in the ongoing creative evolution of the series. As showrunners, they will continue to deliver the compelling storytelling that Smallville fans have come to expect and love."

Aside from Smallville, their resumes are light or nonexistent. IMDb...
Swimmer (http://imdb.com/name/nm0842661/)
Slavkin (http://imdb.com/name/nm0805611/)
Souders (http://imdb.com/name/nm1313038/)
Peterson (http://imdb.com/name/nm0677048/)

[Peter Paltridge]

Pooh, I wanted Amy Sherman-Palladino's name to appear at the end now.

[The Clown Prince]

Well it seems the change may not be very dramatic as the show's other producers are taking over. From TVGuide.com (http://community.tvguide.com/blog-entry/TVGuide-News-Blog/Todays-News/Smallville-Shocker-Series/800036775)...

I just got done reading that article before coming over here. :) A poster there pointed out this....


Hmmm, in pure speculation mode:

The loss of one creator/exec producer would signal a restlessness, need to move on, try other things. The loss of both signals that this has something to do with their dissastisfaction with The CW.

One striking element of Smallville this past season has been the relentless product placement and the focus on Stride gum and certain cars (Toyota) and whatnot. I can easily see this kind direction being difficult for creators to handle, especially when they are trying to tell their own story without increasingly having to shoehorn in shots of characters using Verizon VCast or Sprint multimedia features.

There might also be economic, budgetary and other pressures involved with bringing the show back for an 8th season without two of its signature stars on full-time, Rosenbaum & Kreuk.

I would not be surprised if a combination of these factors are what led to their leaving the show. I hesitate to use the word "resigned".....

That Stride Gum commercial episode for me was THE SINGLE WORST EPISODE of Smallville that was ever produced. Worse too is that is the episode they choose to bring Pete back in. Just disgusting. The product placement has gotten really bad and for me has been a major distraction. That close in shot of the Dell mouse was so blatant I literally moaned in my chair with my wife going "what?" Expect more of this crap next season.

CW execs too may not have been fans of Clark not flying, but really at this stage and developement of not only the Clark character but the show itself, it makes absolutely no sense that Clark can't fly. "No tights," sure, I agree. But not being able to fly is just stupid at this point. And after that lame 30 second scene of an unwillingly Clark not wanting to try and fly, it looks like they're leaning towards finally having him do it next season.

And to go back to the poster from TVGuide, the loss of BOTH of these guys at the same time means that something behind the scenes happened with them and CW execs.

[Nightwing]

LOL! STRIDE GUM! I do NOT understand how I forgot about that. Aaah funny. Well! I don't like to be a Rumor Roy, because I just made that up and frankly it's a very stupid name/expression, but maybe Gough and Millar didn't want to deal with more Stride Gum.

I remember the people behind the writing and directing and producing and music of Buffy The Vampire Slayer saying how they liked to use UNSIGNED bands for scenes at the city's club "The Bronze" because that's the kind of band you'd see there performing. It just sounds more humble, don't ya think? I mean, all that craziness with using details and working hard for the sake of the craft and its material.


Look at this! This quote allows me to quote The Clown Prince's post within MY post, but instead I'm going to squeeeze in the fact that this lovely feature is brought to you by vBulletin from Jelsoft Enterprises, Toon Zone, Viewers Like You, and Stride gum!

I still think the show has nothing to lose so why not just go for it next year and see what happens.

[Jacob T. Paschal]

Kind of a bleak outlook on if you ask me. :sweat:

I for one can't say I cared about the Stride as it's really the only noticable product placement and it was used creativly.

[DisneyBoy]

It's almost never a good sign when a long-time show runner leaves like this (I can't recall a time it's worked out for the better).

Point taken. In fact, I'm immediately reminded of the departure of...

Pooh, I wanted Amy Sherman-Palladino's name to appear at the end now.

Ah, MM beat me to it :anime:

There might also be economic, budgetary and other pressures involved with bringing the show back for an 8th season without two of its signature stars on full-time, Rosenbaum & Kreuk.

For the record, they will be back next season in diminished roles. But yes, the departure of the those four (along with the previous departures of Annette O'Toole and presumed upcoming departure of John Glover) certainly seems like a sign. Still...

I still think the show has nothing to lose so why not just go for it next year and see what happens.

...I couldn't agree more. Smallville has been mired down in some hokey stuff these last five or six years, and I'd really like to think that Miles and Al leaving would give other writers the opportunity to change the balance for the better. However, since they've basically promoted from within, I'm thinking next season will feel like imitation Miles and Al...much like how Rosenthal came off feeling like imitation Palladino in the last season of Gilmore Girls.

This quote from their farewell letter make me roll my eyes:

"Even in its seventh year it is still the #1 scripted show on the network."

Isn't America's Next Top Model the #1 show on the CW? Besides, this is the CW we're talking about. You're a big fish in a small pond guys!

Now that I think about it, their entire letter really feels like a "Thank You/To Heck With You" note to the uppity ups, what with them extolling how much work they put in, and ending with a reminder that they always fought for the series:

"Finally, to the fans who have stuck with us through the highs and the lows: know this - we never stopped fighting to make this show great. Thanks for watching."

You're welcome...I think.

[Darklordavaitor]

"Even in its seventh year it is still the #1 scripted show on the network."

Isn't America's Next Top Model the #1 show on the CW?
Zing!

But, in all seriousness, I thought Gossip Girl recently took the #1 rank on the CW.

[dmxx116]

Smallville should end after the 2008,2009 season IMO.

[bigddan11]

"Even in its seventh year it is still the #1 scripted show on the network."

The quote clearly says that it is the #1 scripted show. America's Next Top Model and Gossip Girls are both reality shows. They don't use scripts. For the record though, the most watched show on the network, in terms of viewers, is WWE SmackDown! America's Next Top Model gets higher ratings solely because more people watch TV on Wednesday night than Friday night.

[GuardianKid13]

America's Next Top Model and Gossip Girls are both reality shows.Um..Gossip Girl ain't reality tv.:sweat:


Zing!

But, in all seriousness, I thought Gossip Girl recently took the #1 rank on the CW.

Nah, well even though The CW is in love with Gossip Girl it isn't the highest in ratings if that's what you mean.

[GuardianKid13]

Sorry for the double post but here's more info on this situation, according to a tv.com member (believe it or not it sounds true) said someone at kryptonsite wrote this:

"Supes4Ever wrote:

I didn't comment on this post until now, mostly because of two reasons- 1) I have a close family member who works for Warner Bros. Television, and I was hesitant to mention this because I often see people say "Well I know somebody who works in so-and-so", and everyone goes "your lying." With the Internet the way it is, I can understand that, but I wouldn't say it if it wasn't true (especially because Al and Miles mentioned my family member by name in their letter). 2) I was waiting for confirmation from said family member about the validity of this announcement, as I personally thought it was quite fake. Now that I have it, I wanted to post what I have learned. I want to state that I was told only the bare minimum, as NO ONE in the WB wants to comment right now about this, as they are trying to figure out the legal issues that would surrond the release of any "insider" information about Al and Miles departure. He assured me that what has transpired WILL be released in full to the public, as soon as it is expident, but anything that you hear from then and now is basically conjecture.

As some people may know, when the WB and UPN combined to become the CW (along with some other entertainment entities in CBS), the WB was given a 50% controlling share of the network. What my Uncle has state is that when it came to Smallville, however, the CW execs. basically gave the WB, and DC comics oversight over Smallville. The current President of the CW has tried to inject her way into the show in recent months, but only in regards to oversight on production costs and the overall budget. The CW has claimed it is cash-strapped when it comes to special effects and the actors contractual obligations, while the WB has offered to pump more money in that direction if it is true. According to my Uncle, the execs. at the CW and the ones at the WB that have controlling say over Smallville have butted heads in recent months over small issues like this- basically if the CW needs money, the WB will give it to them, the biggest one being the direction of the final year of the show. Originally, the WB tried to convince the CW to order Seasons 8 and 9 of Smallville, as the show is still a strong money maker for their television department, and the CW stated they were so cash-strapped that the network would only offer Season 8, because they couldn't gurantee the CW would survive to a Season 9. The WB agreed to this, because if the CW falls apart after 2008, they don't want to risk losing Smallville to Fox (which bidded heavily for the show's pilot episode in 2000), which has offered to pick-up any additional seasons of the show and any designed spin-offs, in return for complete control of the franchise.
Since Peter Roth, Al and Miles were the ones to really bring about Smallville's creation, the WB execs have had a very "hands-off" approach when it came to the creative direction of the show. Promotion, budgetary needs, contracted actors (they are keen on keeping Welling and Rosenbaum as long as they can), and shooting costs have fallen mostly under the WB's oversight- ie. their area of greatest input. DC comics however, has been a rather strong presence since Day One, specifically because Al and Miles have admitted they don't know the story of Superman (Al is Batman fanatic, Miles a Ironman fanatic). With the final season about to approach, according to my Uncle, DC comics took a hard look at where Smallville was headed towards its conclusion. The DC execs. talked to the WB and CW execs., and were granted approval to ask Al and Miles for their creative storyboard for the final season. Al and Miles handed in their rough approach for the 22 episodes for next season (the amount that they expect will be given to the show to finish its run, but which has not been confirmed yet- it may be 24), as well as their pre-planned "final 10." DC comics shot down their entire approach for Season 8. The DC execs. went to the WB execs. to express their concern, especially now because the WB and DC are concerned about the future of the Superman movie franchise (the writer's strike set them back, and now the lawsuit decision may set them back even farther), but the WB decided to pass the final decision to the CW.
After that is what he will not tell me. All he will say is that a decision was made that the WB supported after heavy lobbying by the CW after they made their decision (the only man upset was Peter Roth), and DC comics was satisfied with. He will not say if the WB expected this, or if they were surprised by it, and he also wouldn't answer my question as to if this will mean more DC connected writers will be either returning to the show (Jeph Loeb has a contract with DC comics, and is only a "consultant" to Heroes (despite being listed as a "Co-Executive Producer), so he can break his contract at anytime) or new ones will be added. He did, however, go on to say that this is not that un-common with television shows, it just isn't as widely publicized. He pointed to the fact that two WB controlled shows- West Wing and Gilmore Girls- both lost their creators towards the end of their respective runs, and older shows like Angel, Sabrina the Teenage Witch, Charmed, and Everwood almost lost their creators at one point or another. That is all I really have, so I guess the rest is just a waiting game to see what information surfaces, if ever, from the four main parties- WB, CW, DC comics, and Al and Miles.

Post #2

New e-mail from my Uncle (just got a chance to check my e-mail and it is from an hour ago. Thank God I don't have college classes on Thursday, or I would have missed this.) Here is what he is saying (and yes, I told him that I posted what he wrote me back this morning for some friends (ok, a LITTLE tiny fib on my part towards his end), and he is a bit mad at me):

"Some of my colleagues that have a better placement within the hiearchy of the show have told me for over a year that tensions between the cast and Al Gough have been high with some claiming Tom Welling had threatened to quit on more than one occasion over his character portrayal. One of these colleagues stated that "WB, CW, and DC comics execs., after several months of talks, gave Gough the option to leave on his own terms or be replaced. Apparently, Millar decided to follow his friend out the door when DC shot down their storyboard plans for Season 8."
No mention of discussions with Allison Mack, for the poster that asked before, so I don't know if I will get an answer on that."


Hmmm so maybe since Tom doesn't want to be typecast as Superman, he's the one that's stopped his character from flying??Thoughts..?

[Jacob T. Paschal]

I'd like to think he has more integrity then that. I think he's frustrated with the way the character is dragging his feet.


Or rather, I pray to God that's how he feels.

[DisneyBoy]

This really isn't about flying or wearing tights.

If Tom has any sense at all, and I think he has enough, he'll look back on his 7 years of work on this series and ask himself "Is this character really relatable/interesting/moving forward?"

Maybe he's just upset because he wants to direct more, or for some other unknown reasons. We can only speculate. But if he's disappointed in who Clark has turned out to be, he can join the rest of us here in the real world and let Al and Miles remain in their happy bubble of denial.

The information just posted really doesn't surprise me much. Negociations are a constant part of any series. The recent troubles the CW is facing would only naturally make things difficult, coupled with DC/WB's concerns over where their big character would find himself in the end.

I'm sure Al and Miles weren't suggesting something radical for the end of the series. Thus far they've shown a willingness to defer to the comics in terms of new characters and ideas, so why would they try something drastic for their series finale?

I think this whole thing is just another bit of evidence that Smallville would have been better served by ending this year, or last year. Now, who know how it will end, or how long people will be speculating over how it could have/should have ended.

[Jacob T. Paschal]

Now, I know this would not ever happen but I'd like to see the eighth year condensed into fewer episodes so as to focus on moving the story forward more quickly because if anything was proven by this year the series works better when condensed into fewer episodes, i.e. less filler.

[Mikintosh]

I have a feeling they suggested for the finale something continuity-breaking; the show's been very happy to either toy with or in actuality kill their characters and I wouldn't be surprised if they pushed the last episode in that direction and DC chafed. That's a complete guess, but that's usually the kind of thing holders of intellectual property are concerned about.

And I'm glad they haven't had Clark fly; it looked a bit cheesy even in the mega-budget Returns, and on Smallville to have it done regularly would not look good.

[Jacob T. Paschal]

I thought the flying actually work well in Crusade (Episode 4.1) and if it was kept to wide shots CGI could be used ala with Brainiac in episode 7.15 Veritas.