Animated Romance

[The Huntsman]

There was a decent amount of conversation on this subject within another thread that I made, so I thought I’d get this thread created in order to further delve into the murky depths of animated romance. I hope that this thread becomes more than a list thread; even though I encourage people to share their favorite couples, whether canon or non-canon, I hope that people will take the time to explain why they feel the way that they do. I will also provide a few questions for the sake of generating some discussion, which I hope people will answer.

Personally, I only support canon relationships. I believe that the people who work on a series are in the best position to know the personal thoughts and desires of the characters. However, with that said, I do like some of the unofficial pairings that are out there. I don’t support them, as I wouldn’t request that they be canonized, but I think some of them are rather clever. Unfortunately, a lot of people attempt to pair characters that would never like one another, and even though people like to say that “opposites attract”, they seldom actually do when it comes to romance. I also dislike some of the bizarre relationships, but to be fair, there are some bizarre canon relationships as well. An episode of 101 Dalmatians: The Series (http://www.tvrage.com/101_Dalmatians-The_Series/episodes/73/01x02) had Lucky (http://www.tvrage.com/101_Dalmatians-The_Series/character_guide/?character=2599) and Two-Tone (http://www.tvrage.com/101_Dalmatians-The_Series/character_guide/?character=2649) fall in love and go to a dance together, despite the fact that they’re biologically related: brother and sister. I do believe that was the first and only time incest has been used in a children’s animated program. You can’t get much more bizarre than that.

I don’t usually enjoy animated programs that rely too much on romance, but I usually enjoy the occasional romantic plot. Unfortunately, romantic plots can be hard to handle and it’s easy for them to pass the point of subtlety; typically, once a romantic plot becomes too blatant, it loses quality and causes some fans to denounce it.

That’s really all I can say at the moment, though I’m sure I’ll add more to this discussion in due time. I’m going to ask a few questions now.

Do you like seeing romance in an animated program? What has been the best canon relationship in an animated program? What has been the worst canon relationship in an animated program? Are there any non-canon relationships that you like and/or support?

Please take the time to answer these questions, and if possible, explain why you chose the answer that you did.

[Tobias]

Romance can work, as long as it doesn't overshadow the show itself. Some of the relationships I've enjoyed:

- Flint/Lady J - G.I. Joe
They always had a fun, playful relationship. Sure, they never did anything even remotely romantic (onscreen) but their bantering during the fight scenes against Cobra were always fun.

- Skinner/Krabappel - The Simpsons
Kill me, I LIKED them together, until the writers ruined them.

- Elisa/Goliath - Gargoyles
Beasitality element aside, they had that fun 'Beauty & The Beast' thing going.

- Fred/Daphne - Scooby Doo
Especially when later parodies/shows made it OBVIOUS what they were doing when they the gang split up to find clues.

- Egon/Janine - The Real Ghostbusters
It was fun the way they built these two up through the first movie and every season. Unfortunately Extreme Ghostbusters and Ghostbusters II made this pairing null and void.

Pariings I didn't like

- Jem/Rio/Jerrica - Jem
I know what you're thinking. This was the CORE relationship of the series, but Jem/Jerrica constantly strung Rio along, constantly making him have to choose between the two, keeping the poor guy in the dark the whole time, when she could have EASILY told him the truth after the Battle of the Bands at the end of the first episode.

I'll post more when I can think of them.

[tb4000]

Most romances in animated shows consist of the main character's attempts to get noticed by someone who is oblivous to their advances, avoiding the person they have no interest in, or if they are in a relationship, their misadventures dealing with that person in hoping they don't find out about something, or some Three's Company-like misunderstanding that takes place.

[cyde]

The way I see it, romances suck.

[Lavenderpaw]

Romance can also be the show's driving force.Look at American Dragon,Jake and Rose's enemy/lover sort of romance has given away to some great plotlines.While it has overshadowed some aspects of the show,the forbidden complication of their blossoming relationship over the course of two seasons plays into the Huntslcan's (probably the best villians on the show) evil plans excellently.

Also,their romance provides humor.For example in one episode of season 1 Jake and Rose ( unknowing of one another as Dragon and Dragon Slayer at this point) are trying to reherese lines for a Shakespearean play and kiss while comically stumbling around to retrieve a life-giving beatle in their alter egos.

The main idea I'm giving is that while it isn't always a good thing for a romantic aspect to divert away from a show's other potentional plotpoints,there are occasions (like Amdrag for instance) where it becomes the greatest and most well-received focal point of a show.Not all shows need to have this,but I think romance can play very important roles in shows and even become the favored plotline.

[Hordesman]

It depends on how it's written. Jem/Rio/Jerrica was clearly one of the worse- just look up "Glitter and Gold". Kinda reminds me of the spoof musical "Drowsy Chaperone", actually. But what do you expect? Jem was made by the same people who did GI Joe with its secret Cobra theme park bases and those lawyer twins who actually fought the Joes themselves- pure Silver Age stuff.

[Blackstar]

Few things in life are more annoying than fan forced romances, especially when fans decide to "ship" 2 characters from a TV show for some purely superficial reason. Someone once suggested that Raven and Robin (from Teen Titans) be a couple just because they're both named after birds. Someone else suggested that Raven hook up with Herald just because they both wear cloaks. Or people who put Cyborg and Bumblebee together just because they're both black, which is dumb. Just because 2 characters have the same color skin tone, that doesn't automatically mean that they're made for one another.

I only support canon couples. Fan generated romances I support not at all.

[kid rabbit]

i agree with you on fan -supported couples Buffy and Angel mite not have been animated but the spike/Buffy and the Angel/Cordeliea thing is the best example of "having a love intrest for the sake of having a love intrest" :mad:

[bethhigdon]

I’ll admit it! I’m a romantic at heart and love to watch well written romance. As long as develops and doesn’t stay stagnant. I love it when characters personalities are developed through their relationship of others. Right now the ones I can think of are Beauty and the Beast (though mostly Beast) and Kim/Ron. I’m sure there’s more, but mostly in movies.

[Hordesman]

i agree with you on fan -supported couples Buffy and Angel mite not have been animated but the spike/Buffy and the Angel/Cordeliea thing is the best example of "having a love intrest for the sake of having a love intrest" :mad:

Fan-created couples are one thing. Honestly, there are canon pairings out there which are "love interest for sake of love interest" or "so he's not gay" or simply OOC. So I'm not going to discount a pairing just for being fan-created, especially in the realm of AU fic or slash. AU has different rules, and homosexuality is just barely appearing in fantasy canons for the first time with Dumbledore and Lexington and possibly the current toon version of Brainiac 5.

That said, I can't stand L/Light fic. Even if you shut off just how much they basically hate each other in canon and are angling to bring the other down, the fact is that Light's not fit to be with anyone except maybe his little Skank Trio or Nancy Grace.

[Kagetsu]

You'd never guess it, but I'm a hopeless romantic. I love shows that flirt around with crushes, unacquainted love, and love that is obvious to us but fails to reach the characters. Like the ending of Danny Phantom, a final resolve of their caring is just sO great.

My favorites.

Yumi and Urich
Kim and Ron
Sam and Danny
Etc etc

[I.R Joey]

. Or people who put Cyborg and Bumblebee together just because they're both black, which is dumb. Just because 2 characters have the same color skin tone, that doesn't automatically mean that they're made for one another.

I only support canon couples. Fan generated romances I support not at all.

Oh that's so annoying. I've had people in real life try to set me up based on the fact that I and the girl in question were both black. Ah, I love the fresh smell of ignorance in the morning. :cool:

Sam and Danny from DP were a great pairing. I think that some of the moments between them in Reign Storm and especially Phantom Planet were among the most memorable moments I've ever seen in a Nick cartoon. Dave Kaufman and Grey Delisle really did some great work together during that finale.

The growing bond between Katara and Aang is great. Can't wait to see where it ends up by season 3's end.

I was in no way a fan of the show, but As Told By Ginger had some nice development with Ginger and Darrin.

There are many others from other cartoons I could name.

[Gokou Ruri]

Romances like Jake and Rose in AmDrag really improve the show. As did Helga crushing on Arnold (and doing various nice things for him such as helping him find Mr. Hyunh daughter) Any romance that has a good basis and execution is fine in my book.

The ones I abhor are the typical "normal/geeky boy crushes on hot/popular girl from school", such as Timmy/Trixie, Arnold/Ruth, Danny/Paulina, Jimmy/Betty, Yes, they're realistic on how kids/teens usually only care about beauty/popularity, but I detest shallow relationships and they tend to be even more shallow in those cartoons (though granted, Arnold did eventually realize Ruth was shallower than a kiddy pool.

[Kagetsu]

Or people who put Cyborg and Bumblebee together just because they're both black, which is dumb. Just because 2 characters have the same color skin tone, that doesn't automatically mean that they're made for one another. I'm a person that needs a reason for characters to cross race. I know how people think "beauty". and race is a factor. But my thought's of Bumblebee and Cyborg was always based on strength and smarts. The tow of them together were always complementary. I'm not sure, but wasn't their race decided long ago in the comics?

[Lutochris]

Without a doubt the most real and believable romance I've seen in a kids' cartoon is in Code Lyoko. The couples not only made sense from the beginning, but were real and not forced like you'll often see in cartoons. And they actually managed to write the couples in a respectable way, without having the characters act dumb just for the sake of romantic comedy/drama. Immature, yes, but appropriate to their ages, and never out of character. Not dumb for dumb's sake though.

[Tobias]

An episode of 101 Dalmatians: The Series (http://www.tvrage.com/101_Dalmatians-The_Series/episodes/73/01x02) had Lucky (http://www.tvrage.com/101_Dalmatians-The_Series/character_guide/?character=2599) and Two-Tone (http://www.tvrage.com/101_Dalmatians-The_Series/character_guide/?character=2649) fall in love and go to a dance together, despite the fact that they?re biologically related: brother and sister. I do believe that was the first and only time incest has been used in a children?s animated program. You can?t get much more bizarre than that.
.

I haven't seen the movie in ages, so answer me this: I know Lucky was Pongo and Perdita's, but was Two Tone in the original 15 puppy liter, or one of the pups later rescued and adopted? Because 84 of the pups aren't blood related to Lucky.

[Lavenderpaw]

Romances like Jake and Rose in AmDrag really improve the show.

Bo-yeah! :anime:

[Blackstar]

I'm a person that needs a reason for characters to cross race. I know how people think "beauty". and race is a factor. But my thought's of Bumblebee and Cyborg was always based on strength and smarts. The tow of them together were always complementary. I'm not sure, but wasn't their race decided long ago in the comics?

You see, I never saw Bumblebee and Cyborg's relationship as being anything romantic. I felt that originally there was a rivalry between the 2 of them and eventually there was a grudging respect, but I never personally saw any signs of Bee or Cy having any romantic feelings for one another. Often the 2 of them bickered the way a brother and sister would. Anyway, in the Teen Titans comics, Bumblebee eventually married Herald. To my knowledge, she and Cy never even dated.

And I personally enjoy seeing cross racial pairings, although I never believed in pairing 2 characters up just for the sake of pairing them up. I especially don't like it when the only 2 African-Americans on the show/group/team are coupled together solely for that one reason. If genuine chemistry exists between the 2 parties involved, then that's different, but pairing off 2 characters of the same race just because they're the same race is shallow and superficial. Pairing off 2 characters of the same race and background is predictable and boring. After all, just because someone is a dragonslayer, that doesn't mean that he/she would automatically and only be attracted to another drangonslayer. To me, it's more fun to mix them up.

[The Huntsman]

I haven't seen the movie in ages, so answer me this: I know Lucky was Pongo and Perdita's, but was Two Tone in the original 15 puppy liter, or one of the pups later rescued and adopted? Because 84 of the pups aren't blood related to Lucky.
I’ve never read the book or watched the movie, but the series had shown her as one of the original fifteen puppies. That would mean that they’re biologically related.

[Starlioness]

in the 1996 Live action film .Two-Tone was one of the original 15 puppies.. ;)
..

at least people don't freak out on that possible pairing.. though I remember Lucky falling for a Dalmatian named Rebecca (I believe).. in one of the later episodes .. though that only happened in that one episode... but then Cadpig temporarily has a crush on Mooch.. Rolly with Dumpling (who's a pig) .. ahhh amore.. *sigh*..

but then when it comes to Lion King II:Simba's pride.. it's like..OMG!! Kovu is Scar's son!! he and Kiara are together!! incest!! *dies*.. :shrug: ..

yes, I know they say in the movie a couple times that Scar wasn't his father.. but in the early stages of S.P. Kovu WAS Scar's son.. but the soccer mom's freaked at this.sheesh.. it would've made things less confuzzling if you ask me.. oh, well..

[Lavenderpaw]

but then when it comes to Lion King II:Simba's pride.. it's like..OMG!! Kovu is Scar's son!! he and Kiara are together!! incest!! *dies*.. :shrug: ..

yes, I know they say in the movie a couple times that Scar wasn't his father.. but in the early stages of S.P. Kovu WAS Scar's son.. but the soccer mom's freaked at this.sheesh.. it would've made things less confuzzling if you ask me.. oh, well..

Young children generally wouldn't care either way.I,myself,wouldn't be totally freaked out either.Because if they had gone with the original plot Kiara and Kovu would be second cousins and in most states you can marry a first cousin without it being a big deal.And truly,it would've made the plot more grappling if Kovu was Scar's son or if may Kovu's father had shown up in the movie somewhere.Also,I never quite got if Zira's kids were Kovu's real brother and sister or not. *sigh* Family...

[Elven Moon]

Do you like seeing romance in an animated program?

Yes. I admit I'm a hopeless romantic, so any series that doesn't have a little bit of it disappoints me, sorry to say.

However - this is as long as they don't make it the main focus, as long as it doesn't take over and become the "A and B Love Love Show."

What has been the best canon relationship in an animated program?

Lina and Gourry (Slayers) Lina and Gourry go through a lot together, so there is a strong, loving bond there, though nothing too affectionate is displayed openly or publically. It's really cute and fuels a lot of the series.

Helga and Arnold (Hey Arnold) I like how they interact with each other, what they think about and try to figure out about each other (at least on Arnold's end), and how Helga secretly helps him out when he needs it most (like the neighborhood issue in the movie, or the Christmas present dilemma).

What has been the worst canon relationship in an animated program?

I guess if I had to pick, since I can't think of anything else - the Future Doofus/Webby (Ducktales) pairing? I don't know, it seemed really random to me and rubbed me the wrong way. I can't see it.

Additionally, I hate it when one of the main characters is too busy focusing on/drooling at the popular bimbo to be open to a relationship with someone else, as someone else said. Or when a character claims they truely love someone, but keep jumping around into other relationships, sometimes physical (like Fry in Futurama - sure, I know it makes for good TV, and it's funny, and he's immature, but if that boy loves Leela as much as he says, you'd think he'd try to settle down a little bit and prove he could be faithful if they started dating).

Are there any non-canon relationships that you like and/or support?

Ash/Misty (Pokemon) I've been "shipping" them for about 10 years now. It's rather nostalgic. I don't know, I think they'd make an adorable pair :)

Jessie/James (Pokemon) Same as above. It's canon in the manga but we've yet to know if anything will happen in the show.

Velma/Shaggy (Scooby Doo) So help me, I don't know why. I got that idea into my head when I was little, and it's hard to shake off.

I don't subscribe to the illogical/stupid pairings if I can help it. You know, the "they looked at each other funny in that one episode, it must be love!" or "they're the same age/race/hair color, it's perfect!" kind of fans. No, just no.

[Racattack!Force]

Velma/Shaggy (Scooby Doo) So help me, I don't know why. I got that idea into my head when I was little, and it's hard to shake off.


I know, it's just weird. I just got the idea after seeing them dance in an episode. :sweat:

[Darklordavaitor]

Now I'm up for a good relationship in a show, but it seems as if the writers don't know how to add one into a series well. Nearly all of the potential couples in today's animated series transcend from "I like him/her, but I'm not ready to tell him/her yet", and rarely ever get to expand upon this.

The few couples I support include:

JakexRose(American Dragon: Jake Long): Ever since the first episode, we all knew that Jake liked Rose, but we never knew if the feeling was mutual, but we did, however know, that both were on opposing sides. One of the biggest fears of the show included that if Jake found out that Rose was out to destroy him, and vice versa, how would each react to their destinys?

Would Jake lose all interest in her? Would Rose slay him? What if they went together despite their paths? And worse of all, what if the Huntsclan found out about them?

All of which were answered throughout the show, and the quality, of all things, improved.

JimmyxCindy(Jimmy Neutron): If anything, for "Stranded". A bigger step towards a potential relationship in one episode than DannyxSam went through from that show's entire run.

Uh, that's it. Hmm.

[Baltofan]

I've enjoyed those romances mostly:

Sally Acorn and Tails (Sonic the Hedgehog Sat AM)
Fox and Vixen (Animals of Farthing Wood)
Miss Blue and Scarface (Animals of Farthing Wood)
Gadget, Chip and Dale (Rescue Rangers)

[Darklordavaitor]

I hope that this thread becomes more than a list thread; even though I encourage people to share their favorite couples, whether canon or non-canon, I hope that people will take the time to explain why they feel the way that they do. I will also provide a few questions for the sake of generating some discussion, which I hope people will answer.



I've enjoyed those romances mostly:

Fox and Vixen (Animals of Farthing Wood)
Miss Blue and Scarface (Animals of Farthing Wood)
Gadget, Chip and Dale (Rescue Rangers)
Uh, read above.

You support a threesome-incest-pact?

[kid rabbit]

I'm surprize no one's mention the many unrequited loves of charie brown

[BrendaBat]

Couples I liked:

Rebecca and Baloo (Talespin): The episodes featuring them were so sweet. They had great chemistry, too. He helped her mellow out and have fun. And she was the only person who could motivate (or scare) him to get off his butt and do some work once in a while. :p

Lina and Gourry (Slayers): Their relationship progresses really naturally as the series goes on and never feels forced. Its a pairing that's just a lot of fun to root for.

Gadget and Dale (Chip and Dale's Rescue Rangers): Everyone seems to like pairing her up with Chip, but I always thought she clicked more with Dale. I dunno why. Maybe I just like to root for the underdog. :p

Couples I didn't like:

Starfire and Robin (Teen Titans): Their relationship didn't really develop, one day they just had the hots for each other. And the "OMG will they or won't they kiss!!" thing really ruined the Trouble in Tokyo movie for me. :sad:


Originally posted by Tobias
- Jem/Rio/Jerrica - Jem
I know what you're thinking. This was the CORE relationship of the series, but Jem/Jerrica constantly strung Rio along, constantly making him have to choose between the two, keeping the poor guy in the dark the whole time, when she could have EASILY told him the truth after the Battle of the Bands at the end of the first episode.
Jerrica was a manipulative lunatic and Rio was an unapologetic, two-timing slut. The way I see it, they deserved each other! :D

[Antiyonder]

Gadget and Dale (Chip and Dale's Rescue Rangers): Everyone seems to like pairing her up with Chip, but I always thought she clicked more with Dale. I dunno why. Maybe I just like to root for the underdog. :p

I use to be a Dale/Gadget fan myself, but upon viewing it seems like Chip's feelings run more deeper (like in the episode with Foxglove), whereas with Dale it's a schoolboy/munk crush


Starfire and Robin (Teen Titans): Their relationship didn't really develop, one day they just had the hots for each other. And the "OMG will they or won't they kiss!!" thing really ruined the Trouble in Tokyo movie for me. :sad:

If you mean that it came out of nowhere, then I'd have to disagree as Sisters had moments where you could see a relationship in the works.

Besides, one thing I like about the pairing is how unlike most relationships in animation, they don't go into the bickering couple routine. Sure, there are moments where Robin blew it as a potential boyfriend (Such as the movie), he demonstrates a fair amount of sensitivity towards Starfire.

[Mandi-chan]

My favorite canon couple would have to be Aang and Katara (Avatar: The Last Airbender).

Their relationship has been well built up, believable, and likeable. It started off as a one-sided crush on Aang's part, then after a while a few hints throughout seasons 2 and 3 (that we've seen) Katara's hidden feelings for him started surfacing, until we finally had the moment of truth in the invasion episodes.

It's been a lot of fun for me to see this relationship grow deeper and deeper, I can't wait to see what the writers do next!

I also enjoyed the funny, and slightly one-sided (since we never got to see his point of view on the matter) romance of Helga and Arnold (Hey Arnold). I'm sure I wasn't the only one screaming at the screen at Helga at the end of the Hey Arnold Movie for trying to cover up her impulsive kiss.

Dr. Hutch (sp?) and Filbert (Rocko's Modern Life) was a cute suprise as well, I loved the episode where they got married!

[Luna]

I'm a romantic at heart,but I'm more into canon relationships than fanmade ones....

Pairings I like....

Elisa/Goliath (Gargoyles)...I love how their relationship develops over the course of the series,and I also disagree about it being beastiality (they're both humanoid,so in my mind it's more like they're different races than anything else)

Fry/Leela (Futurama)....this is a borderline one (Fry loves Leela,and she likes him,but feels he's too immature to have a relationship with),but I think they'd make a cute couple,and the movie (Bender's Big Score) sort of implies that they're meant to be together...

Homer/Marge(The Simpsons)...Yeah,they're already together,I just like them as a couple,they both make me laugh...I also wish they'd kept Skinner and Krabbapel as a couple on the show...

Inuyasha/Kikyo....Lately,it seems I have a thing for tragic romance...I kinda feel sorry for both of them....though I also like the Inuyasha/Kagome pairing (well technically,Kikyo and Kagome are the same person...so...)

Rukia/Renji (Bleach)....Alot of fans seem to be in favor of Rukia/Ichigo,which actually doesn't bother me,but I just like the relationship between Rukia and Renji better (another kind of couple I like is childhood friends who end up together)...

Sora/Kairi (Kingdom Hearts video games)....I love the scene between the two in Hollow Bastion in the original game (Sora ends up becoming a heartless,and Kairi manages to turn him back to normal by hugging him)...I also like Roxas and Namine as a couple....

...and pretty much any other Disney couple (I'm a pretty big Disney fanatic)

Pairings I don't like...

I can't think of any canon couples I dislike off the top of my head...

but I do dislike most fanmade parings where...

the two characters have never met in canon

will never meet in canon (usually crossover pairings involving two or more different series)

most yaoi and yuri pairings....now,don't get me wrong,I don't have a problem with characters being gay or lesbian if they actually are in canon (I like Sailor Moon's Uranus and Neptune as a couple for example)...my problem with it is that people tend to pair up characters who are straight in canon (anyone who thinks Miroku from Inuyasha is gay isn't watching the show),or they add yaoi or yuri into a series where it's very unlikely to occur (Kingdom Hearts is half owned by Disney,so I really doubt anyone's gay)...

[Silverstar]

Starfire and Robin (Teen Titans): Their relationship didn't really develop, one day they just had the hots for each other. And the "OMG will they or won't they kiss!!" thing really ruined the Trouble in Tokyo movie for me. :sad:

The Robin/Starfire pairing didn't come out of nowhere; it originated from the 80's New Teen Titans comics. And IMO, it did develop on the show; it's just that the series' characters were so watered-down that we didn't get to see any serious character development of anyone.

Anyway, I'll gladly take Robin/Starfire over the totally fake, utterly groundless, completely implausible and outright nonexistent Robin/Raven pairing that so many message board fans were so fond of while the show was running. (But it's worth mentioning that I only support, nee acknowledge canon couplings, not fan-made ones.)

[Antiyonder]

The Robin/Starfire pairing didn't come out of nowhere; it originated from the 80's New Teen Titans comics. And IMO, it did develop on the show; it's just that the series' characters were so watered-down that we didn't get to see any serious character development of anyone.

Anyway, I'll gladly take Robin/Starfire over the totally fake, utterly groundless, completely implausible and outright nonexistent Robin/Raven pairing that so many message board fans were so fond of while the show was running. (But it's worth mentioning that I only support, nee acknowledge canon couplings, not fan-made ones.)

What's your stance on the Jinx/Kid Flash relationship? Yes, the show didn't have more than two episodes with them, but the pairing is touched upon in Teen Titans Go (which unlike most tv tie ins keep the characters consistent with the show).

If you can find a copy, I'd recommend Teen Titans Go #39 as it does a friendly jab towards the shipping bit.

[Silverstar]

What's your stance on the Jinx/Kid Flash relationship? Yes, the show didn't have more than two episodes with them, but the pairing is touched upon in Teen Titans Go (which unlike most tv tie ins keep the characters consistent with the show).

If you can find a copy, I'd recommend Teen Titans Go #39 as it does a friendly jab towards the shipping bit.

My stance is that the 2 of them didn't have a "relationship", but merely a friendship, though I know A LOT of people began shipping them after "Lightspeed".

I've never read a single issue of TTGO!, as I've never been able to find a copy in any of my local stores.

[Antiyonder]

My stance is that the 2 of them didn't have a "relationship", but merely a friendship, though I know A LOT of people began shipping them after "Lightspeed".

Which isn't entirely unwarranted, because again, J Torres has been developing them into a couple in the comic. For one, TTG #34 has Kid Flash racing Mas Y Menos, and flirting with some girls during the race. All of which was broadcasted, which resulted in a very Poed Jinx:sweat: .

[Blackstar]

Jynx/Kid Flash would never last, what with Wally's ever roving eye and all.

[Silverstar]

TTG #34 has Kid Flash racing Mas Y Menos, and flirting with some girls during the race. All of which was broadcasted, which resulted in a very Poed Jinx:sweat: .

Ah, I see. As I said, I've never been able to get my hands on a TTGO! comic, so it's not for me to comment, though I tend to agree with Blackstar's above comment.

But oy vey, don't get me started on Mas Y Menos. A pair of Spanish speaking midget twins who dress like dry cell batteries whose one power has a very obvious flaw which could be easily exploited by even the dumbest of supervillains. They're like cheesy fanfic characters come to life!

[Ian]

I like my romances low-key and drama-free; I've lost patience with unrequited love and interminable will they/won't they scenarios. Unfortunately, given that most romances on television are of this nature--writers for the most part seem incapable of writing for two people actually in a relationship--I have little interest in actual official couples.

Exceptions:

Casey Jones and April O’Neil-TMNT (2003): Yes, it started out as a will they/won't they scenario, and a not too well-written one, at that, but that was dispensed with when they officially get together in early season 3. Why do I like it? Well, it makes sense, for one: both have a good combination of things in common (shared interest in mechanics/machinery and certain movies, their status as the turtles' nakama) while still being distinct individuals—plus, they clearly dig each other. Also, the relationship did not diminish their status as individual—so far, they’ve remained Casey and April, instead of being defined by the relationship. All in all, it’s a very healthy relationship—which is a far rarer thing in TV than it should be.

David and Fox Xanatos—Gargoyles: The same things said about the Casey/April relationship apply here. They dig each other, they’re good for each other, they share interests, and they don’t lose their individuality to the relationship. All this from so-called villains. Too bad Fox is underused.

Misato Katsuragi and Ryoji Kaji—Neon Genesis Evangelion: Most cartoon romances start at the beginning; this one picks up after it’s already ended. While the previous two relationships work because they lack angst, this one I like for the opposite reason: these two are emotionally immature, and their chemistry is equal parts toxic and complementary. The same rules apply, however: they still dig each other, despite it all, and both are equally interesting together or apart. Ironically, despite the characters’ immaturity—or perhaps because of it—I find it to be one of the most maturely handled relationships in animation.

[Antiyonder]

Ah, I see. As I said, I've never been able to get my hands on a TTGO! comic, so it's not for me to comment, though I tend to agree with Blackstar's above comment.

On that note, TTG #53 leaves no doubt on KF and J's relationship:

They share a kiss at the end of the issue.

[Cartman]

Stan Marsh and Wendy Testaburger - In the early years of that relationship, Stan would always throw up in front of Wendy. Although it seems like in later years he doesn't do that.

[Daxdiv]

Here are some pairing that i liked

JimmyxCindy- There was something in me that always had me thinking about the times that Cindy always tried to one up Neutron so much that screamed, "I want Jimmy to notice me for my smarts, and who I am. So in return I must pretend to hate him, be smart, and have some sort of other advantage against him." Yeah sorry if that comes out as a black and white painting of the situation, but that how I always saw it, even in the film.

FryxLeela- We all by now they do have feeling for each other, but due to Fry being the man-child he is, sort of prevents him from Leela taking him seriously, thus rejecting any dates that Fry offers. During Bender's Big Score, I had some sort of feeling that Lars was somesort of a "mature" version of Fry, and we all saw how happy she was around him compared to Fry.

JakexRose- Already has been said a thousand times over that their star-crossed love was a major plot point of the show, and a fine example of how it supposed to work. Also the fact that Jake was mature in "Homecoming" about giving her a second chance at life for not being a member of the Huntsclan showed how deeply he cared for her, and not some blind love. (The fact that he was happy that her new life was making her happy, comes to mind. Despite having no memory of what happen, or who he was.)

Paring I'm not fond of:

InuyashaxKagome- Seriously you two, either you like each other or you don't. your love triange with Kikyo was interesting when I was a fan of the series, but now after so many episodes, can't you admit it already after letting Naraku abandon you for the umpteenth time? That was one of the reasons why I quit watching Inuyasha.

Fan Pairing that I like:

AshxDawn AKA Pearlshipping- I think it more obvious on Dawn side than it is on Ash. Getting dressed up as a cheerleader during the gym fights, (something Misty or May never did.)

JamesxJessie- Even though it has been stated it canon to the manga, the anime does have it few hints

Fan Pairing that I don't like, this one is tough, basically anything that goes against character, are in different series, and a very unreasonable age difference that screams "Jailbait", aka something that would wind someone up in jail for pedophila.

[Racattack!Force]

AshxDawn AKA Pearlshipping- I think it more obvious on Dawn side than it is on Ash. Getting dressed up as a cheerleader during the gym fights, (something Misty or May never did.)


Well, she likes dressing up more than them. :shrug:

[Lavenderpaw]

Well, she likes dressing up more than them. :shrug:

Mmph,I was always an Ash and Misty fan.

[thenewme93]

Mmph,I was always an Ash and Misty fan.

Me too!

[Antiyonder]

Here are some pairing that i liked

JimmyxCindy- There was something in me that always had me thinking about the times that Cindy always tried to one up Neutron so much that screamed, "I want Jimmy to notice me for my smarts, and who I am. So in return I must pretend to hate him, be smart, and have some sort of other advantage against him." Yeah sorry if that comes out as a black and white painting of the situation, but that how I always saw it, even in the film.

I'll admit that the first season didn't make me clamour for Jimmy and Cindy since it relyed too much on the bickering couple that you see in anime and Hey Arnold. Second Season, however, made the eventuallity of their relationship more appealing, due to the toning down of said bickering.


AshxDawn AKA Pearlshipping- I think it more obvious on Dawn side than it is on Ash. Getting dressed up as a cheerleader during the gym fights, (something Misty or May never did.)

At first I saw plausibility of him either with Misty or May when they were still on the show. But given that each region brings a new girl to the cast, I frankly see Ash living the Tenchi lifestyle (with Misty, May, Dawn so far).

[Racattack!Force]

Me too!
Me three! It was somehow reinforced when I saw an Evil AshxMisty picture on DeviantArt. :D

[DarthGonzo]

Stan Marsh and Wendy Testaburger - In the early years of that relationship, Stan would always throw up in front of Wendy. Although it seems like in later years he doesn't do that.

Stan and Wendy broke up a very long time ago.

[Daxdiv]

Mmph,I was always an Ash and Misty fan.

Well I was at one point, until Misty left amd some think it because of Togepi, and that was only because she was the only female in the party. When May appeared, I gave her time, and I more support her being with Drew than anyone else. Ash and Dawn, they are similar in terms of starting out, Ash and Dawn also seem to have a special friendship which is something he doesn't do with Brock. Stuff I can go into hasn't reach stateside yet.


I'll admit that the first season didn't make me clamour for Jimmy and Cindy since it relyed too much on the bickering couple that you see in anime and Hey Arnold. Second Season, however, made the eventuallity of their relationship more appealing, due to the toning down of said bickering.

Yeah, but I saw through that stuff, since they were like 10 or something in that range, that how most kids try to get someone to notice them, by being better than someone else, getting into stupid arguments. For the all the episode afterwards, yeah the writers did enforce it. But so far I prefer Dawn over Misty, then May. Yeah I never thought of anything good about May for some reason. That shipping for me was kind of forced for me during Movie 9 when they swam underwater and the school of Luvdisc came out.



At first I saw plausibility of him either with Misty or May when they were still on the show. But given that each region brings a new girl to the cast, I frankly see Ash living the Tenchi lifestyle (with Misty, May, Dawn so far).

I admit I might be in that same boat. Now because of that I want a Tenchi Muyo style Pokemon, with Brock as the maid, and everyone else living together.

[Alph]

I don't like it in real life when people get over dramatic about relationships, and I don't like in TV shows as well.

I prefer a relationship where the two either just click and get together, or don't click and no issue is made about it at all. Some shows like Dragonball Z and Yu Yu Hakusho did this well enough I think.

I don't have a problem with a little tension, though.

[TheVileOne]

Stan and Wendy DID break up a long time ago. Stan NEVER got over his vomiting in front of her. For a while Wendy dated Token, and it made Stan go emo/Goth. Later on, Stan and Wendy worked together in a recent episode, but they didn't become a couple again. Though at the end of the episode where they are having a "moment" Stan does indeed throw up on her with a vengeance once again.

One show that does a good job with romance is . . . AVATAR! A kids' cartoon on Nickelodeon rife with OPEN MOUTH KISSING! I mean you have Sokka/Suki, Zuko/Mai, and Katarra/Aang, plus the whole Zuko/Katarra/Aang love triangle. Aang recently kissed Katarra for the whole time, but Katarra looked a little ambiguous about it. Aang recently confessed his love for Katarra, so who knows. The series seems to favor Katarra and Aang as its OTP.

What else?:

-X-men (1990's): The show did a tremendous job with the Wolverine/Jean/Cyclops dynamic. And hey just like in the comics, Wolverine even got a little side tail here and there. Also Rogue/Gambit had another strong supporting romance. And more open mouth kissing.

-Spider-man (1990's): Show did a great job because it introduced a few potential women early on in the first season, but ultimately it pointed more toward Peter/Mary Jane in season 2. Unfortunately it got f'd up in season 3 and 4 and it was never properly resolved save for a throwaway line in the epilogue of the final season. It wasn't enough though. I think the show's head writer had a great mind and grasp of Spider-man and the characters and he did a great job with the show's overall serial story. Just a shame it had to end on such a weird note.

-Superman (1990's): The ending to this show was simply perfect. And what was great about it was that it didn't try to wrap everything up. At the end of the series, Superman is still in a very uncertain place. He betrayed the trust of the people of earth. He was brainwashed by Darkseid who he failed to ultimately defeat once again after he gave him to the people of Apokolips who didn't have the heart to let of the idea of Darkseid as their ruler since they knew of no other life and had no desire for anything else. In many ways it's a bleak ending save for the fact that you have Superman and his true love Lois Lane together with him atop the Daily Planet, not sure of what will happen in the future, but Lois shows that she still loves and trusts him and they kiss for the FIRST TIME EVER over the course of the series. Perfect ending to this show that IMHO was at times a little uneven. Great way to execute the romance of Superman/Lois Lane as well, and a much better job than the overdone Superman/Doomsday. Sometimes subtlety is good. You don't need to see Lois in nothing but a towel in the Fortress of Solitude.

[cyde]

Cartoon crushes and romances suck, especially round superheroes and heroines; it hinders their jobs.

[judyindisguise]

Hmmm, good topic, this. Let's see:

FAVES

Inuyasha and Kagome - I love the snottiness between them. The moments of tenderness are handled well too. Inuyasha's bad-boy behavior and Kagome's occasional brattiness are a good match. They make each other happy, they make each other miserable -a perfect couple.

Miroku and Sango - mild-mannered lecherous monk and fierce woman warrior - talk about sparks flying. They're both reticent, most of the time, about showing their feelings, unlike the what-you-see-is-what-you-get interaction between Inuyasha and Kagome, and that's what keeps the dual romance in the show from getting repetitive and boring. Both pairings are intriguing and often funny. In fact, Inuyasha probably handles male-female relationships better than most regular toons and IMO, better than most anime.

Kim and Ron - sometimes she's too perfect, sometimes he's too flawed, but they do click and are appealing in their way. Their parents are cool too - how nice to see toon parents that aren't bumbling idiots.

Homer and Marge Simpson - they're the glue that holds the show together, despite some fan gripes that their marital ups and downs have been overused as a plot device. Their affection for each other just makes them funnier, and proves that a couple doesn't have to bicker nonstop in order to generate laughs.

Vintage Cosmo and Wanda - their flirtation with each other in the show's very beginnings made them very different and very funny, not to mention memorable. Oh, how far they have fallen...

Robin and Starfire - mostly because of Starfire. She is the best super heroine ever, hands down, IMO. She's sweet and funny yet powerful and fearless. She has personality. She screws up sometimes. She's very human. If only Robin had magnetism to match hers. Still, they were cool together.



NONFAVES

Timmy Turner and anybody else - He's a self-centered, shallow, bucktoothed little brat who's clearly been hanging around his fairy godfather too long. There's always been this debate as to who he should wind up with - Trixie or Tootie - but IMO he should wind up a bitter old loner with only an idiot goldfish for company (the other goldfish wised up and hooked up with a Spanish-speaking purple ferret, don't you know ;) ).

Peter and Lois Griffin - egad. If you've watched the show, I needn't elaborate. I know the show's not The Simpsons, and is basically about a so-called family that abuse and pretty much hate each other, but still. The gimmicky cutaways are the only thing that's occasionally funny IMO. And sometimes the baby and the dog.

Pucca and Garu - yeah, the chase is the thing, and I like the toon a lot but the chase gets on my nerves now. I prefer the rare eps that focus on other storylines.

Danny Fenton and Sam Manson - yeah, I know, they do seem like a perfect match. But they had zero chemistry IMO.

And that is all.

[Tea]

I'm a person that needs a reason for characters to cross race. I know how people think "beauty". and race is a factor. But my thought's of Bumblebee and Cyborg was always based on strength and smarts. The tow of them together were always complementary. I'm not sure, but wasn't their race decided long ago in the comics?
Yeah. But the controversial thing about the fan-created Cyborg/Bumblebee pairing is that the writers said in an interview that they made the two hate each other because they didn't want to have the cliche "Oh, they're both black so they must like each other." That, however, didn't stop the fans.

Favorite canon ship: BB/Terra (Teen Titans)
They're so cute together and they complement each other well. At the same time, it's tragic how they seem doomed never to be together.

Nonfavorite canon ship: Aang/Katara (Avatar)
Aang acts so childish and Katara's so maternal and protective. So them together is like... yeah... I can't ship them because it creeps me out. No offense to the fans.

[Rolling Cloud]

Pairings I like:

NarutoXHinata: There's enough proof and it makes more sense to me then pairing him with Sakura.

IchigoXOrihime: Makes more sense then putting him with Rukia and she does care for him.

TaiXSora (From Digimon): If only they didn't try to make it seem like Sora liked Matt, this would've worked. :sad:

Yugi X Tea in Yugioh: Can't really think of a reason, but it seems to click in my opinion.

Jaden X Alexis in Yugioh GX: Alexis has shown enough hinting that she liked Jaden during the series. And, that final letter...XD

Can't think of any I don't like..at the moment.

[kid rabbit]

spider-man and the black cat had better were the better couple in my opinion
also Charlie brown/Marcy
Fry/Leela
Ron/Kim
Jake/Rose
are what brought their shows together

[Mad Mod 49]

NarutoXHinata: There's enough proof and it makes more sense to me then pairing him with Sakura


Much of the "proof" is anime filler though. I'm sorry, but I just can't see Naruto falling in love with any girl anytime soon, he's too much of an idiot to grasp what true love is (much like his master Jiraya.) :sweat:

[peterg14]

Parings I like:

DannyxSam:Yeah, their relationship really developed nicely. I loved all the teasing moments throughout the show, the Wes ring, Tucker basically being the Wingman.

JakexRose: I can't say it any better than someone has before.

SasukexSakura: Call me fickle, but I've wanted these 2 to get together since the start. Even though in the manga, she's getting farther away from "Sasuke-kun" and getting closer to Naruto, part of me hopes she still loves him.

There was also the TommyxKimmy paring from All Grown Up!. I don't know why I like it, I just find that dynamic interesting.

Parings I don't like:

KimxRon: I know that it was fated from the beginning, and I did like the movie ending. But some of the relationship seemed tacked on. I mean Ron suddenly becoming a football star to date Kim? Not that he didn't deserve it, but I would have liked it more if he stayed the "outcast" he was and still went out with Kim. It seemed like the writers were saying "If you want to date a hot cheerleader, be a jock.", which shouldn't be a message that's sent to kids. There's no rule that says that you have to be a star QB to get the girls, yet they followed this. That was really my only beef with KR.

Fan-Parings I like:

DawnxPaul, Pokemon: Though these 2 have little to no interaction, I really liked that gym scene where she blew up when he didn't know her name. Normally, girls don't get that pissed when someone doesn't know their name, unless they want to get to know that person, as a lover or friend. I also like his gloomy persona interacting with her cheeriness.

[WolfieKiwi]

For me, the absolute best example of an animated romance is Hatori and Kana from Fruits Basket. I would add other couples in but because the anime didn't go as far as the manga... *grumbles*

Anyway, another good example of animated romance is Yukari and George from Paradise Kiss. It really kicks you in the face with the reality of love.


IchigoXOrihime: Makes more sense then putting him with Rukia and she does care for him.I'm kinda disappointed in this pairing. I mean, liked it, I really did at one point, but with all that Ichigo Rukia business in the early volumes...and then to suddenly switch the focus on Orihime with her new discovered powers... It felt awkward and rushed at the same time.

EDIT (Just thought of some more)

Hollandx Talho: Though the show didn't focus on them as much as RentonxEureka or DomonixAnemone, you got the idea that the two of them cared deeply for one another despite the many struggles. I honestly liked the implied romance in the flashbacks and pictures rather than an overexposure on their relationship.

[tb4000]

Eek! and Annabelle. You know it to be true. The show was very well done in its own right, the first two seasons anyway, and Eek! was basically the object of affection for many a hotter, and usually human female admirer, but always had eyes for Annabelle, who was actually a pretty likeable character.

[Hordesman]

most yaoi and yuri pairings....now,don't get me wrong,I don't have a problem with characters being gay or lesbian if they actually are in canon (I like Sailor Moon's Uranus and Neptune as a couple for example)...my problem with it is that people tend to pair up characters who are straight in canon (anyone who thinks Miroku from Inuyasha is gay isn't watching the show),or they add yaoi or yuri into a series where it's very unlikely to occur (Kingdom Hearts is half owned by Disney,so I really doubt anyone's gay)...

Gargoyles creator Greg Weisman on a character he outed 5 years ago:
"What I said, I believe, is that in my opinion Lex is gay -- though he may not yet realize it. And that we would be consistent with that knowledge... as I believe we have been up to this point. But that in the current world climate we would not be addressing it on the show at all. Not explicitly or implicitly. It's a d@mn shame, and since we're talking about episodes that don't exist it would be easy for me to be brave now and pretend that we'd be open about it, but that would be a lie of expectation, and I try to be more honest than that with the fans. All I promised was consistency. It may sound like a subtle distinction, but believe me it is not. It may also sound like a cop-out, and believe me, IT IS. But it's a cop-out that comes out of the fact that if I even attempted an implicit portrayal, it flat out would not get on the air. And I could stand my ground. And I would get fired. And then there'd be no consistency either. Someday, I hope to live in a braver more understanding world... but we ain't there yet. And I think what we're doing is at least a step in the right direction."

Just because it doesn't exist in canon isn't much of an argument in the kid-aimed fandoms. Japan may be a little freer on this, but canon yaoi/yuri is primarily about fan service. Did you know Hasbro's contract for the live action GI Joe movie included a "no gay character" clause? But the whole Dumbledore revelation does give me hope.

[Antiyonder]

Gargoyles creator Greg Weisman on a character he outed 5 years ago:
"What I said, I believe, is that in my opinion Lex is gay -- though he may not yet realize it. And that we would be consistent with that knowledge... as I believe we have been up to this point. But that in the current world climate we would not be addressing it on the show at all. Not explicitly or implicitly. It's a d@mn shame, and since we're talking about episodes that don't exist it would be easy for me to be brave now and pretend that we'd be open about it, but that would be a lie of expectation, and I try to be more honest than that with the fans. All I promised was consistency. It may sound like a subtle distinction, but believe me it is not. It may also sound like a cop-out, and believe me, IT IS. But it's a cop-out that comes out of the fact that if I even attempted an implicit portrayal, it flat out would not get on the air. And I could stand my ground. And I would get fired. And then there'd be no consistency either. Someday, I hope to live in a braver more understanding world... but we ain't there yet. And I think what we're doing is at least a step in the right direction."

Actually, Gargoyles #8 has already alluded towards his sexuality. I suggest you look for the issue to see if it works.

[judyindisguise]

Just because it doesn't exist in canon isn't much of an argument in the kid-aimed fandoms..

Should this even be an issue in kid-aimed fandoms, however? That's what bugs me most about that stuff - stories and especially art are posted on the net where any kid can see it. If the people involved would invent their own characters, fine, but using someone else's like that is pretty low IMO.

[Mad Mod 49]

Just because it doesn't exist in canon isn't much of an argument in the kid-aimed fandoms.


How so? If the characters are not gay in canon, I see no reason to make them gay in fanon. My main problem of course is that fanon yaoi/yuri is not about gay tolerance or any such matter, it's there because guys and girls get off on that kind of thing. As Raven would say, it's just pointless. :raven:

[BrendaBat]

Originally posted by Silverstar
The Robin/Starfire pairing didn't come out of nowhere; it originated from the 80's New Teen Titans comics. And IMO, it did develop on the show; it's just that the series' characters were so watered-down that we didn't get to see any serious character development of anyone.
I don't care how awesome their romance was in the comicbook. The cartoon should be able to stand on its own two feet.



Just because [homosexuality] doesn't exist in canon isn't much of an argument in the kid-aimed fandoms.


Originally posted by judyindisguise
Should this even be an issue in kid-aimed fandoms, however? That's what bugs me most about that stuff - stories and especially art are posted on the net where any kid can see it. If the people involved would invent their own characters, fine, but using someone else's like that is pretty low IMO.
I understand what you mean. It bothers me when weirdo fans turn obviously straight characters gay just because thats their kink (anime fangirls are the worst offenders here). However, I still don't see anything wrong with fanartists indulging their offbeat ship for a kids' show like Kim Possible as long as they don't make anything too explicit.

[Luna]

Gargoyles creator Greg Weisman on a character he outed 5 years ago:
"What I said, I believe, is that in my opinion Lex is gay -- though he may not yet realize it. And that we would be consistent with that knowledge... as I believe we have been up to this point. But that in the current world climate we would not be addressing it on the show at all. Not explicitly or implicitly. It's a d@mn shame, and since we're talking about episodes that don't exist it would be easy for me to be brave now and pretend that we'd be open about it, but that would be a lie of expectation, and I try to be more honest than that with the fans. All I promised was consistency. It may sound like a subtle distinction, but believe me it is not. It may also sound like a cop-out, and believe me, IT IS. But it's a cop-out that comes out of the fact that if I even attempted an implicit portrayal, it flat out would not get on the air. And I could stand my ground. And I would get fired. And then there'd be no consistency either. Someday, I hope to live in a braver more understanding world... but we ain't there yet. And I think what we're doing is at least a step in the right direction."

....:sweat: ...I'd actually forgotten that about Gargoyles,that Lexington was intended to be gay...Still,despite the fact they're both aimed at children,Gargoyles just doesn't seem as "Kiddy"(for lack of a better word,and not meant in a bad way) as Kingdom Hearts and most other Disney properties...

[Hordesman]

Actually, Gargoyles #8 has already alluded towards his sexuality. I suggest you look for the issue to see if it works.

Yeah, I read it. It's cute so far, and I'm curious how it plays out. The quote I posted earlier was in reference to the tv show but I'm inclined to think the comic will work within the current bounds of kids tv. Disney still looks over the books before they go to press.


Should this even be an issue in kid-aimed fandoms, however? That's what bugs me most about that stuff - stories and especially art are posted on the net where any kid can see it. If the people involved would invent their own characters, fine, but using someone else's like that is pretty low IMO.

My stance, to borrow the Gargoyles once more... If Goliath and Elisa can do it, so can Lexington and whoever he's with. I don't like explicit relationship stuff either. And I don't think a pairing being same gender makes it any more adult than an opposite one is. I was maybe 7 when totally out of the blue, it ocurred to me that sometimes people of the same sex just get married.


How so? If the characters are not gay in canon, I see no reason to make them gay in fanon. My main problem of course is that fanon yaoi/yuri is not about gay tolerance or any such matter, it's there because guys and girls get off on that kind of thing. As
Raven would say, it's just pointless. :raven:

The issue is that most canons don't allow the possibility yet. Do I have issues with most fandom slash? Yes, yes, and yes. I wrote a Bobobo fic that totally skewered yaoi cliches, but I still want the canon. The genre stuff. Brokeback Mountain as a real Western with gay leads, not a pathetic Larry Craig emo-fest. And I'm writing my own comic with that in mind, but I reserve the right to explore some ships that canon won't allow yet.


How so? If the characters are not gay in canon, I see no reason to make them gay in fanon. My main problem of course is that fanon yaoi/yuri is not about gay tolerance or any such matter, it's there because guys and girls get off on that kind of thing. As Raven would say, it's just pointless. :raven:

That's it for the most part, but I can't be the only person out there who'd rather see Shuichi and Yuki deal with the PTA rather than rut. Slashcast actually includes GLBT news for example.

[BrendaBat]

origionally posted by Hordesman
My stance, to borrow the Gargoyles once more... If Goliath and Elisa can do it, so can Lexington and whoever he's with. I don't like explicit relationship stuff either. And I don't think a pairing being same gender makes it any more adult than an opposite one is.
Thats a good point (can't believe I didn't think of it :sweat:).
The Goliath/Elisa pairing has always grossed me out a little. Even as a kid, I was surprised that Disney censors let that stuff go on the Disney Afternoon!
Also, it would seem really unfair if Disney allowed Goliath and Elisa to violate the laws of nature with their unholy union and then didn't let poor Lexington have a Gargoyle boyfriend. :p

And before any Gargoyles fan jumps down my throat, I already know that Elisa and Goliath's relationship was well developed, romantic, totally meant-to-be, and all that good stuff. Doesn't make it any less gross. :p

[Mad Mod 49]

Still,despite the fact they're both aimed at children,Gargoyles just doesn't seem as "Kiddy"(for lack of a better word,and not meant in a bad way) as Kingdom Hearts and most other Disney properties...

True for the most part, especially with Kingdom Hearts (I took one look at the slash in that fandom and now stay the hell away.) but some Disney properties can actually have subtle hints at gay relationships, the most obvious being Lilo & Sitch (Jumba and Pleakley anyone? :p )



My stance, to borrow the Gargoyles once more... If Goliath and Elisa can do it, so can Lexington and whoever he's with.


Agreed on that for the comics; I could understand why the show wouldn't allow it but I don't think the comics are really read much by kids anyway so I don't see what's stopping 'em...:sad:



but I still want the canon. The genre stuff. Brokeback Mountain as a real Western with gay leads, not a pathetic Larry Craig emo-fest. And I'm writing my own comic with that in mind, but I reserve the right to explore some ships that canon won't allow yet.


Lol, exactly. That's another issue I have with fanon slash...it's not even that much gay as much as it is fey; just a bunch of stereotyping. :yawn:

[judyindisguise]

Thats a good point (can't believe I didn't think of it :sweat:).
The Goliath/Elisa pairing has always grossed me out a little. Even as a kid, I was surprised that Disney censors let that stuff go on the Disney Afternoon!
Also, it would seem really unfair if Disney allowed Goliath and Elisa to violate the laws of nature with their unholy union and then didn't let poor Lexington have a Gargoyle boyfriend. :p

And before any Gargoyles fan jumps down my throat, I already know that Elisa and Goliath's relationship was well developed, romantic, totally meant-to-be, and all that good stuff. Doesn't make it any less gross. :p

I think there's a difference, though, between Goliath and Elisa being an "item" and any kind of boy/boy relationship with Lexington. With Goliath and Elisa, we're still talking male and female, and Goliath is very humanoid; because of that fact, the pairing is IMO far less disturbing than Roger and Jessica Rabbit, for instance. But any kind of depiction of a gay couple on a kids' show is still considered controversial and IMO, is not likely to happen anytime soon. There are many parents - if not the majority of parents - who would object to such a depiction. I'm not certain it's the business of cartoon producers to introduce that depiction to children anyway. Any more than I thought it was J.K. Rowling's business to introduce it to children via her revelation about Dumbledore. That came off as a stunt IMO - if she truly wanted to be inclusive, to preach tolerance, than Dumbledore's sexuality should have been mentioned in the books IMO. The fact that she waited until all the books were finished and sold before she dropped her bombshell didn't impress me at all. And I daresay at least some parents felt betrayed. But it's all water under the bridge now...

[Movie06]

Romance can work as long as it isn't overdone and annoying. And personally, I' am getting tired of the countless romance fanfics. I mean as much as I like characters Rogue, Raven, etc. but couples like ROMY or the Beast Boy & Raven are getting annoying and tiring.

[Jave]

I think there's a difference, though, between Goliath and Elisa being an "item" and any kind of boy/boy relationship with Lexington. With Goliath and Elisa, we're still talking male and female, and Goliath is very humanoid; because of that fact, the pairing is IMO far less disturbing than Roger and Jessica Rabbit, for instance. But any kind of depiction of a gay couple on a kids' show is still considered controversial and IMO, is not likely to happen anytime soon. There are many parents - if not the majority of parents - who would object to such a depiction. I'm not certain it's the business of cartoon producers to introduce that depiction to children anyway. Any more than I thought it was J.K. Rowling's business to introduce it to children via her revelation about Dumbledore. That came off as a stunt IMO - if she truly wanted to be inclusive, to preach tolerance, than Dumbledore's sexuality should have been mentioned in the books IMO. The fact that she waited until all the books were finished and sold before she dropped her bombshell didn't impress me at all. And I daresay at least some parents felt betrayed. But it's all water under the bridge now...Well, there are a few occasions like in the first Pepe LePew cartoon. In that one, Pepe chased after a male cat. Heck, there were lot of male-kissing moments in Looney Tunes overall, and while they were definitely done for comedy purposes, they were still there.

On a more serious approach, there was also Card Captor Sakura which had every controversial pairing in the book. Males, cousins, females, adults and minors... Sure it was all taken out in the American dub, but the original was also considered a kids' show.

I agree with you on the Potter books though. It seems to me that Rowling didn't include the whole "Dumbledore is Gay" stuff in the books because she was afraid her editor will force her to take it out. If she didn't include it in the books, she should have never revealed it, it's pointless.

Off-topic corner: 4 IMOs in a single post are 3 IMOs too many. :D

[Kryten]

Stan and Wendy broke up a very long time ago.

And that's really the "jump the shark" moment for me. The show lost its heart and became pretty much non-stop "Matt & Trey vs. the straw man of the week".

[Lavenderpaw]

I agree with you on the Potter books though. It seems to me that Rowling didn't include the whole "Dumbledore is Gay" stuff in the books because she was afraid her editor will force her to take it out. If she didn't include it in the books, she should have never revealed it, it's pointless.


HP isn't animation though...

[TheVileOne]

Wait a minute . . . Goliath and Elisa had sex?

Also, screw Kagome and Inuyasha and screw that whole God forsaken show that never did a damn thing. A dumbass couple that forgets any progress they make one episode later doesn't deserve to exist.

Also Jiraiya knows what true love is. Jiraiya deeply loves someone. Whether that person returns that love well . . . figure it out.

[Mandi-chan]

plus the whole Zuko/Katarra/Aang love triangle.

*groans* There is NO triangle in the cannon of the show. That's purely FAN created, and there have been NO indications whatsoever that Katara or Zuko find each other attractive or have crushes on one another.

Just because she decided to give him the benifet of the doubt at the end of season 2 and offered to heal his scar, does not make suddenly make the two undying lovers! And even in that scene, there was nothing there that implied a romantic connection between the two.

I don't mean to rant, but I find it very irritating when people act like the fan-made Katara/Zuko is real in the show.



Aang recently kissed Katarra for the whole time, but Katarra looked a little ambiguous about it.

She didn't break away from the kiss, and didn't seem to mind it to me...she looked a little upset because Aang leaves her right after kissing her to face the Firelord, and just before kissing her Aang gave her his doubts that he would survive the battle.



Aang recently confessed his love for Katarra, so who knows. The series seems to favor Katarra and Aang as its OTP.

They've been building up this relationship since the very first episode of the show, and have had hints (obvious on Aang's part, subtle on Katara's) littered throughout all three seasons that indicate that the two have romantic feelings for one another.

Plus, Aang has matured a great deal (most of it occured in season 1) and is no longer a "goofy kid" in Katara's eyes...making the relationship much more appealing.

[ROBOTRON]

:sweat: - I don't particularly care for animated romance....there are exceptions however:

Batman and the mask of the phantasm lady

John Stewart Green Lantern & Hawkgirl

John Stewart & Vixen

The above relationships contributed to the story enough not bore me to death. The worse thing a movie or show can do is bore me. A good example of relationships I hated due to boredom was Peter Parker's romances in the Spiderman movies. UGH.:raven:

I know Spiderman wasn't animated, but it still took away from the show instead of adding depth.

[judyindisguise]

Well, there are a few occasions like in the first Pepe LePew cartoon. In that one, Pepe chased after a male cat. Heck, there were lot of male-kissing moments in Looney Tunes overall, and while they were definitely done for comedy purposes, they were still there.

On a more serious approach, there was also Card Captor Sakura which had every controversial pairing in the book. Males, cousins, females, adults and minors... Sure it was all taken out in the American dub, but the original was also considered a kids' show.

I agree with you on the Potter books though. It seems to me that Rowling didn't include the whole "Dumbledore is Gay" stuff in the books because she was afraid her editor will force her to take it out. If she didn't include it in the books, she should have never revealed it, it's pointless.

Off-topic corner: 4 IMOs in a single post are 3 IMOs too many. :D

Yeah, I do kinda overdo that. Like Wilt's "I'm sorry, is that okay?" from Foster's Home for Imaginary Friends. Afraid of being too forthright, I suppose.

[TheVileOne]

*groans* There is NO triangle in the cannon of the show. That's purely FAN created, and there have been NO indications whatsoever that Katara or Zuko find each other attractive or have crushes on one another.

Just because she decided to give him the benifet of the doubt at the end of season 2 and offered to heal his scar, does not make suddenly make the two undying lovers! And even in that scene, there was nothing there that implied a romantic connection between the two.

I don't mean to rant, but I find it very irritating when people act like the fan-made Katara/Zuko is real in the show.

She didn't break away from the kiss, and didn't seem to mind it to me...she looked a little upset because Aang leaves her right after kissing her to face the Firelord, and just before kissing her Aang gave her his doubts that he would survive the battle.

You really should watch the DVD and listen to the audio commentary of the creators of the show. My comments are based off what came out of their own mouths as well.

The way I see it when Katarra confronts Zuko after he joins them, you can read it either as Katarra telling Zuko, "Hurt my man and I will kill you!" or "I'm yelling at you and being angry because of all this sexual tension!" Lol.

I lost a lot of respect for Rowling after she pulled out the gay thing on Dumbeldore so conveniently after the book came out. Not saying Dumbledore can't be gay, just saying that Rowling has no testicular fortitude, bleh :p .

[Luna]

True for the most part, especially with Kingdom Hearts (I took one look at the slash in that fandom and now stay the hell away.) but some Disney properties can actually have subtle hints at gay relationships, the most obvious being Lilo & Sitch (Jumba and Pleakley anyone? :p )



I love Jumba and Pleakley,though I've never really seen them as a couple,though they do pose as Lilo's aunt and uncle while they're staying at her house......Can't say it'd bother me if they were...

I HATE yaoi involving Kingdom Hearts,though....just because two guys are best friends,it doesn't mean they're romanticly interested in one another (esp. since both Sora and Roxas have a female love interest in the story,in Kairi and Namine,respectively)...

[Hordesman]

Quickly on Goliath and Elisa: Being that gargoyles are a race and the series is fantasy, I don't consider it an interspecies relationship any more than I would Superman and Lois Lane. That said, imo I truly believe Lex's relationship shouldn't get any less emphasis than any of the straight characters'. But that's probably what will happen. Disney does vet the comic, after all.


The way I see it when Katarra confronts Zuko after he joins them, you can read it either as Katarra telling Zuko, "Hurt my man and I will kill you!" or "I'm yelling at you and being angry because of all this sexual tension!" Lol.

Or "He's my man, *****!" :anime:


I lost a lot of respect for Rowling after she pulled out the gay thing on Dumbeldore so conveniently after the book came out. Not saying Dumbledore can't be gay, just saying that Rowling has no testicular fortitude, bleh :p .

First off, she was asked about Dumbledore's love life by an audience member in a Q&A. She did not hold a press conference to announce it. Second, I think the position of the book in pop culture was connected with the enormity of this revelation. Dumbledore is a household name. I always figured she'd reveal something like this 20 years down the road about a minor character who didn't survive the series. So I have to say I'm impressed. Ideally, there's more I would have liked but given the world today, given the market being so cautious on this sort of thing... It's a turning point. In its wake is the continued building of a Potter theme park, an extra movie added to WB's series, and who knows what's next?

[Mandi-chan]

You really should watch the DVD and listen to the audio commentary of the creators of the show. My comments are based off what came out of their own mouths as well.

I have both the season boxsets, and have tried to listen to all of the audio commentary.

I honestly can't tell you I have listened to all of them, because I don't remember, but I can tell you that I don't recall there being any comments made regarding Katara and Zuko having the hots for each other or possibly becoming love interests in the future.

So could you tell me which eps have commentary from the creators that imply this hidden romance for Zuko and Katara? Aside from anything that's clearly a joking comment from them?I'm not trying to be a jerk, I honestly want to know which commentaries imply that so I can hear it for myself.


The way I see it when Katarra confronts Zuko after he joins them, you can read it either as Katarra telling Zuko,"Hurt my man and I will kill you!" or "I'm yelling at you and being angry because of all this sexual tension!"Lol.

You got to see one of the new eps already?!

Lucky!

I don't think it's going to air again (new eps) in the states until later this month...next Friday maybe? (from what I've been hearing on other message boards).

Again, I didn't mean to be a jerk....the Katara/Zuko thing just irritates me a little.If the creators DO decided to throw in some sexual tension (like they did for Katara/Jet) and hints that they may like each other romantically in future eps, then I could deal with that no problem.

I admit, they would LOOK good together.But without any sort of hintage or buildup to it...then I'm just not buying it over the real deal development between Katara and Aang.

[TheVileOne]

I have both the season boxsets, and have tried to listen to all of the audio commentary. I honestly can't tell you I have listened to all of them, because I don't remember, but I can tell you that I don't recall there being any comments made regarding Katara and Zuko having the hots for each other or possibly becoming love interests in the future. So could you tell me which eps have commentary from the creators that imply this hidden romance for Zuko and Katara? Aside from anything that's clearly a joking comment from them? I'm not trying to be a jerk, I honestly want to know which commentaries imply that so I can hear it for myself.

I am referring to their comments on the Season 3 Volume 2 individual DVD release. They do have commentary tracks on this release. They specifically do a commentary on the first part of Day of Black Sun, and they do talk about the Katarra/Aang kiss. Basically they are nowhere near as absolute about it as you are ;) .


You got to see one of the new eps already?! Lucky! I don't think it's going to air again (new eps) in the states until later this month...next Friday maybe? (from what I've been hearing on other message boards). Again, I didn't mean to be a jerk....the Katara/Zuko thing just irritates me a little. If the creators DO decided to throw in some sexual tension (like they did for Katara/Jet) and hints that they may like each other romantically in future eps, then I could deal with that no problem. I admit, they would LOOK good together. But without any sort of hintage or buildup to it...then I'm just not buying it over the real deal development between Katara and Aang.

I'm not saying I support the Zuko/Katarra pairing. But I am saying they have teased it before, not necessarily overtly, but it was there. I'm also not saying this is the direction it will go definitively, but you know there a ton of people on deviantart that would disagree with you.


Quickly on Goliath and Elisa: Being that gargoyles are a race and the series is fantasy, I don't consider it an interspecies relationship any more than I would Superman and Lois Lane. That said, imo I truly believe Lex's relationship shouldn't get any less emphasis than any of the straight characters'. But that's probably what will happen. Disney does vet the comic, after all.

Yeah but did they you know . . . ?


First off, she was asked about Dumbledore's love life by an audience member in a Q&A. She did not hold a press conference to announce it. Second, I think the position of the book in pop culture was connected with the enormity of this revelation. Dumbledore is a household name. I always figured she'd reveal something like this 20 years down the road about a minor character who didn't survive the series. So I have to say I'm impressed. Ideally, there's more I would have liked but given the world today, given the market being so cautious on this sort of thing... It's a turning point. In its wake is the continued building of a Potter theme park, an extra movie added to WB's series, and who knows what's next?

I would've been impressed if she did it before the book came out to rave reviews and sales. I think kind of like Greg Weisman about Lexington, that doing such is a COP OUT.

I also believe WB forcing the last book into two movies is cheap, poorly conceived cash in attempt. Sometimes milking a franchise works out really bad.

[Mandi-chan]

I am referring to their comments on the Season 3 Volume 2 individual DVD release. They do have commentary tracks on this release. They specifically do a commentary on the first part of Day of Black Sun, and they do talk about the Katarra/Aang kiss. Basically they are nowhere near as absolute about it as you are ;) .

Well, I don't have any of the season 3 dvds since I wait for the boxsets to come out. So you can't blame me for being confused about what you had been talking about. :sweat:

So, the writers imply that they won't be a couple at all? Or did they just say that they'll need to come to terms with their feelings and possible ackwardness?


I'm not saying I support the Zuko/Katarra pairing. But I am saying they have teased it before, not necessarily overtly, but it was there.

Aside from Katara touching Zuko's scar and telling him she may be able to heal it (in her moment of giving him the benift of the doubt...the only nice moment the two have shared so far that we've seen)...which to me is reaaalllly stretching it as a shippy moment...I've seen no other "hintage" that implies they like each other or find each other attractive.

I don't mean to be argumentive, I'm just stating it as I see it.

If the writers do decide to dump the Katara/Aang romance that they've been building up since epsiode one in favor of doing Katara/Zuko, then that's fine (I'll be a little disappointed since I liked the idea of Aang getting the girl)...

But I wanna see build up, I want to see sexual tension, I want to see something from one of the characters that implies they've got a thing for each other.


I'm also not saying this is the direction it will go definitively, but you know there a ton of people on deviantart that would disagree with you.

There are fans that support Aang/Toph and Sokka/Zuko too...

[TheVileOne]

So...the commentary on that disk imply that the relationship might not work out? Do they say anything that lean towards Zuko/Katara?

You only asked about which episodes have the creator commentary and mention Zuko/Katarra ;) .


There are people on deviantart that ship Sokka/Zuko and Aang/Toph as well...

Erroneous.

[Antiyonder]

Again, I didn't mean to be a jerk....the Katara/Zuko thing just irritates me a little.If the creators DO decided to throw in some sexual tension (like they did for Katara/Jet) and hints that they may like each other romantically in future eps, then I could deal with that no problem. I admit, they would LOOK good together.But without any sort of hintage or buildup to it...then I'm just not buying it over the real deal development between Katara and Aang.

That's actually the problem with many Zutara shippers. They tend to look at relationships in a very Ken/Barbie type way. To them, it's more about glamour rather than emotion.

[TheVileOne]

I personally like Zuko/Mai getting married and making broody emo goth kids that listen to AFI.

[Mandi-chan]

You only asked about which episodes have the creator commentary and mention Zuko/Katarra ;) .

So they DO imply they're gonna do Zuko/Katara?!

Well then writers, start throwing in hintage and sexual tension!! (they're cutting it kind of close though for a new romance, huh? Unless we're getting more seasons after this?)



Erroneous.

I've seen the pictures! There's Zuko/Aang support too (my friend likes that one in a pure fanship way)


I personally like Zuko/Mai getting married and making broody emo goth kids

LOL

I LOVE Zuko/Mai (which did have a couple of hints in season 2 that foreshadowed their romance in season 4...plus the official comics in the Avatar magazine...)!

[Lutochris]

There are fans that support Aang/Toph and Sokka/Zuko too...


I've seen the pictures! There's Zuko/Aang support too (my friend likes that one in a pure fanship way)

Don't forget Katara/Sokka.

[Silverstar]

^Incest shipping? Now that's just wrong. I once saw a Class of 3000 fanfic that shipped Kim and Kam, who are fraternal twins. Tsk tsk, people.

Is it any wonder why I try avoid fan fiction whenever possible? :(

[Daxdiv]

^Incest shipping? Now that's just wrong. I once saw a Class of 3000 fanfic that shipped Kim and Kam, who are fraternal twins. Tsk tsk, people.

Is it any wonder why I try avoid fan fiction whenever possible? :(


Incest is where I draw the line for most fanshipping as well. It might not be as bad as shipping someone who consider an adult with someone who a minor, but it still wrong. Like take the fanshipping InuyashaxSeshomaru, they came from different women, but they have the same father, but what the hell shippers, why, being half brothers still means that you're brothers related by blood?

[TheVileOne]

You guys hear of a show called Tenchi Muyo? Pretty much every woman on that show trying to bed Tenchi is either his aunt, sister, or grandmother.

[Lavenderpaw]

^Finally,off of Avatar pairings.But seriously,why do people insist on Zutara?Why can't they be satisfied with a cannon shipping of Aang and Katara,Zuko and Mai? :confused:

[Mandi-chan]

^Finally,off of Avatar pairings.But seriously,why do people insist on Zutara?Why can't they be satisfied with a cannon shipping of Aang and Katara,Zuko and Mai? :confused:

I don't mind when fans support none cannon couples like Katara/Zuko, or Aang and Toph...it's when they act like they're cannon that irritates me (which is what 90% of the Zutara supporters do).

It's fun to do fan shipping, and I do it all the time myself...I just don't pretend my fanship is real in the shows I watch. (my fan ship on Avatar is Zuko/Tai Lee)

[Starlioness]

[Yeah but did they you know . . . ?}


Gargoyles and Humans are physically incompatible.. which means no kiddies for G and E.. but I gues there's always adoption..

[TheVileOne]

I'm not saying having kids, but you know the act of . . . first second third or homerun.

[judyindisguise]

II would've been impressed if she did it before the book came out to rave reviews and sales. I think kind of like Greg Weisman about Lexington, that doing such is a COP OUT.

I also believe WB forcing the last book into two movies is cheap, poorly conceived cash in attempt. Sometimes milking a franchise works out really bad.

For my part, I agree with you completely. :)

[RonDrakenfan17]

Are there any on here who support Edd/Nazz? Ed/Edd n Eddy isn't big on romance. Its not the main plot at all, its normally just on the Ed's adventures. But there is sligtht hints between the characters. One ship that is very popular on that show is Edd/Nazz I myself is a fan of that ship. The tiny hints between them is cute.

Other ships on animated shows I support

Leela/Fry-Furturama. A lot of the work the people do for there romance is amazing a lot of the times. I mean I am seriously amazed by some of the stuff they add into for them.

Kim/Ron-Kim Possible.

Rose/Jake-American Dragon.

Spot/Rolly-101 Dalmations the animated series.

Sokka/Ty-Lee-Avatar the Last Airbender. What the flirtings cuteXD

Sokka/Toph-Avatar the Last Airbender.


There are way more...

[Starlioness]

^ I don't think Goliath and Elisa as of #8 of the comic (which of course takes place after the series)will talk about that for a loooong time..

Spot and Rolly: well, Rolly and Dumpling seemed to get along at least in one epsiode..

[TheVileOne]

^ I don't think Goliath and Elisa as of #8 of the comic (which of course takes place after the series)will talk about that for a loooong time..

What happened?


Also there is no TOKKA!!!!

[Starlioness]

what is TOKKA? :confused: ...

well, I don't think Elisa would jump into bed with the first Gargoyle she's met ;);)

[Mandi-chan]

what is TOKKA?

I think that's Toph and Sokka (ship nicknames are fun, huh?)

[TheVileOne]

what is TOKKA? :confused: ...

well, I don't think Elisa would jump into bed with the first Gargoyle she's met ;);)

I'm just curious from the comments that have been made earlier, if Elisa and Goliath have consummated their relationship in any way at all.

TOKKA = Toph and Sokka which is a total myth and apparition. Sokka loves Suki.

Also, if you don't approve of incest pairings, do NOT watch Tenchi Muyo ever.

[The Huntsman]

Spot/Rolly-101 Dalmations the animated series.
101 Dalmatians: The Series is my all-time favorite animated program. I respect your opinion, but I don’t believe the two of them would work in a romantic relationship. In fact, in Spot’s debut episode, “Full Metal Pullet”, Rolly sided with Lucky in an attempt to prevent Spot from joining their group. While they were on friendly terms in other episodes of the series, I don’t believe there was ever a hint of romance. “De Vil-Age Elder” also emphasized that, as when Spot kissed Rolly in order to wake him up from his hypnosis, he wasn’t too happy.

Spot and Rolly: well, Rolly and Dumpling seemed to get along at least in one epsiode..
That much is true, though at first, his love for Dumpling was fabricated. Cadpig metaphorically described how he would one day experience the bliss of falling in love, and a series of coincidences caused her description to literally come true. When he told his friends that he was in love, he said: “It all happened just like Cadpig said, so it must be love.” Towards the end of the episode, the two got together due to their mutual love of food. It was never really explored in future episodes, but it was canonical; Spot referred to Rolly’s crush in a later episode.

TOKKA = Toph and Sokka which is a total myth and apparition. Sokka loves Suki.

If she’s even still alive; Sokka has bad luck with the ladies. I’m personally a fan of the pairing between Sokka and Toph; it’s somewhat justified, due to certain scenes, though I concede that it’s nothing official. If anything, Toph may have some feelings for him, though the feelings aren’t mutual.

[Lavenderpaw]

Rose/Jake-American Dragon.



Much applause,here,have some applesauce!

[Mandi-chan]

I’m personally a fan of the pairing between Sokka and Toph; it’s somewhat justified, due to certain scenes, though I concede that it’s nothing official. If anything, Toph may have some feelings for him, though the feelings aren’t mutual.</p>
That's how I see it as well.Toph and Sokka don't have a chance unless two things happen:A.) Suki is dead after all....B.) It'll be at least three years for Sokka to start seeing Toph as something more than a friend, her body needs to mature and fill out first. (Just like Aang had to mentally mature a little for Kataang to be acceptable, which he had by the end of season 1...plus, he's gotten a little taller too.)

[Lutochris]

^Incest shipping? Now that's just wrong. I once saw a Class of 3000 fanfic that shipped Kim and Kam, who are fraternal twins. Tsk tsk, people.


Incest is where I draw the line for most fanshipping as well. It might not be as bad as shipping someone who consider an adult with someone who a minor, but it still wrong. Like take the fanshipping InuyashaxSeshomaru, they came from different women, but they have the same father, but what the hell shippers, why, being half brothers still means that you're brothers related by blood?

That's precisely the reason people do like it, because it's "wrong".

And like it or not, it exists and not just in some small dark corner of the Internet. It's pretty prevalent in a lot of fandoms - there's May/Max, Phil/Lil, Ben/Gwen, you already mentioned Inuyasha/Sessomaru and Tenchi, just to name a few.

As for Toph/Sokka, while I don't mind it, people seem to think there's been some hints in the show, though I can't for the life of me see where.

[tb4000]

That's precisely the reason people do like it, because it's "wrong".

And like it or not, it exists and not just in some small dark corner of the Internet. It's pretty prevalent in a lot of fandoms - there's May/Max, Phil/Lil, Ben/Gwen, you already mentioned Inuyasha/Sessomaru and Tenchi, just to name a few.

As for Toph/Sokka, while I don't mind it, people seem to think there's been some hints in the show, though I can't for the life of me see where.

And therein lie the reasons a lot of people find animation fans weird. :yawn:

[Blackstar]

That's precisely the reason people do like it, because it's "wrong".

And like it or not, it exists and not just in some small dark corner of the Internet. It's pretty prevalent in a lot of fandoms - there's May/Max, Phil/Lil, Ben/Gwen, you already mentioned Inuyasha/Sessomaru and Tenchi, just to name a few.

..and that, folks, is why I almost never read fan fiction; there are a lot of sick puppies out there who write "love" stories promoting incest and pedophilia just because they can.

I can deal with slash (same sex) pairings to a point (provided that they're artistically valid and not done solely for shock value), but pairing up blood relatives or pairing up an adult with a child is sick and wrong, fictional cartoon characters or not. It's a mentality that I just don't understand; if you like these characters, why do you want to see them get murdered, raped or indulging in perverse sexual practices? Shock =/= drama, character and plot development.

[Hordesman]

Yeah but did they you know . . . ?
Most media depictions of couples are romantic as opposed to sexual. Especially in toons.


I would've been impressed if she did it before the book came out to rave reviews and sales. I think kind of like Greg Weisman about Lexington, that doing such is a COP OUT.

I'm not so sure Potter would have gone so far and Disney would have put its foot down. It's a paradox, I tell you. We live in a world where a gay couple in a soap opera hug each other. I have no qualms about showing same-sex kissing in my comic, but I don't expect it to pitch it as an action toon for 20 years or so. (Kinda hoping to be the go-to person to relaunch existing properties with gay characters one day)


I also believe WB forcing the last book into two movies is cheap, poorly conceived cash in attempt. Sometimes milking a franchise works out really bad.

It's probably more strike-related, given that the work stoppage wiped out a couple release dates, but I digress.


That's actually the problem with many Zutara shippers. They tend to look at relationships in a very Ken/Barbie type way. To them, it's more about glamour rather than emotion.

Anyone else consider Zutara the bastard adopted stepchild of Jake Long/Rose?


I've seen the pictures! There's Zuko/Aang support too (my friend likes that one in a pure fanship way)

Keep watching. I don't ship it myself, but I think there's more to that particular one than Zutara. If you've caught up with Canada, check this out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lD9bmED2Atc


I'm just curious from the comments that have been made earlier, if Elisa and Goliath have consummated their relationship in any way at all.

It's about as revelant and likely to be shown as them using the bathroom.


TOKKA = Toph and Sokka which is a total myth and apparition. Sokka loves Suki.

And Suki may be dead. But I think the biggest argument against Tokka is the simple fact that Toph was originally going to be a guy. Sure they tweaked it with a canon one-sided crush when they changed Toph into a girl but I think it'll stop there.


..and that, folks, is why I almost never read fan fiction; there are a lot of sick puppies out there who write "love" stories promoting incest and pedophilia just because they can.

I can deal with slash (same sex) pairings to a point (provided that they're artistically valid and not done solely for shock value), but pairing up blood relatives or pairing up an adult with a child is sick and wrong, fictional cartoon characters or not. It's a mentality that I just don't understand; if you like these characters, why do you want to see them get murdered, raped or indulging in perverse sexual practices? Shock =/= drama, character and plot development.

Yeah, there's alot of wank out there. I hate incest. That's why I read warnings and use my back button in the rare case that someone hasn't warned properly and the more common case that it's just bad (beware the joey wheeler rescue fic). But it's not a bishonen/bishojo thing for me. I write things that are mainly comedy or outright parody which is why if I ever get Avatarslash out there it'd be something like Katara discovering Zuko's into Aang (he's so dead) or Zuko finding out that Bumi's going to be his step-uncle. :anime: But always with my sense that being gay's just another variation, no better or worse but woefully scarce in canon.

[RonDrakenfan17]

Hey I never said some of my ships I liked were possible, I just like them. Tokka Aka Toph/Sokka do have plenty of hints between them. I find them cute. I mean I like Ty-Lee/Sokka too but I know that isn't possible, I just find the flirting part fun LOL. Rose/Jake and Km/Ron are the only canon ships that I like.

[judyindisguise]

I don't remember that Golden Dragon dance episode...:confused:

[Lutochris]

Where the hell are the Toph/Sokka hints? I've yet to see anything.

[Tea]

Where the hell are the Toph/Sokka hints? I've yet to see anything.
Seriously? I thought it was pretty obvious Toph has a thing for Sokka.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teypasmbw6s
(warning: unaired episode spoilers)

[Racattack!Force]

Where the hell are the Toph/Sokka hints? I've yet to see anything.

Well, in that serpent pass episodes, when Suki saved Toph, Toph kissed her on the cheek, thinking she was Sokka. It shows that the pairing is (in canon) one-sided. Have yet to see evidence of Sokka possibly liking her back though. :shrug: And I don't think Aang/Katara is fully cemented yet. Yes Aang loves Katara, but does Katara really love him back? One kiss doesn't make an official relationship. :shrug:

[Hordesman]

I don't remember that Golden Dragon dance episode...:confused:

It's from one of the chibi-style Avatar shorts, School-Time Shipping. Pretty funny riff on het shipping. I think it's on the season 2 boxset.

As for Tokka, supposedly the Sokka line "What would we do without you?" in DOBS is evidence he might like her back. :sweat:

[TheVileOne]

Sokka is not into Toph though. Which is good considering she's like 10.

[Racattack!Force]

Sokka is not into Toph though. Which is good considering she's like 10.
Well, at least it's canon that Toph likes Sokka. Tokka is my favorite pairing.

[GregX]

Goliath and Elisa did not appear in #8. We last saw them in #7.

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/3851/garg71pw4.jpg

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/8404/garg72vm0.jpg

[Hordesman]

Sokka is not into Toph though. Which is good considering she's like 10.

Yep. Shipping evidence can include all of the following: being friendly, compliments, fighting, ignoring, rescues, death threats, and given the fact that a certain Death Note pairing is so popular: killing the other person in cold blood with no trace of remorse won't end the fan output for the pairing. :anime:

[judyindisguise]

It's from one of the chibi-style Avatar shorts, School-Time Shipping. Pretty funny riff on het shipping. I think it's on the season 2 boxset. :sweat:

Ohhh, YEAH!! Now I remember. Yeah that rocked. Funny as hell and so beautifully done. I gotta go rent that box set...thanks.

[Racattack!Force]

Yep. Shipping evidence can include all of the following: being friendly, compliments, fighting, ignoring, rescues, death threats, and given the fact that a certain Death Note pairing is so popular: killing the other person in cold blood with no trace of remorse won't end the fan output for the pairing. :anime:

Yeah...that's pretty much all there is to it. :sweat:

[TheVileOne]

Alright so it looks like Goliath and Elisa don't do anything beyond kissing and that's it.

[Rolling Cloud]

Much of the "proof" is anime filler though. I'm sorry, but I just can't see Naruto falling in love with any girl anytime soon, he's too much of an idiot to grasp what true love is (much like his master Jiraya.) :sweat:

Filler? The only liable proof is in the manga. I dunno if I can link to it under the rules, but (chap. 98 pages 7-13. =P...Yes, I checked. >.>)

[Racattack!Force]

Much of the "proof" is anime filler though. I'm sorry, but I just can't see Naruto falling in love with any girl anytime soon, he's too much of an idiot to grasp what true love is (much like his master Jiraya.) :sweat:
I don't really understand what you are saying here. :sweat:

[vanidad]

Is very nice that special of Avatar style chibi the three episodes I like a lot.:anime:

But really what Aang was desperate for inviting to Katara.:sweat:

[Mad Mod 49]

I dunno, I'm iffy on Tokka myself. It just seems far too contrived that out of the main four (Aang, Katara, Sokka, and Toph), both sets of male and female characters would hook up. Sokka being with someone outside of the main group's more interesting IMO.

[hobbyfan]

Time for me to jump in.

Old school:

Popeye/Olive Oyl: One of the longest running relationships in fiction. Peter David married them off in a 1-shot comic a few years back.

Mickey & Minnie Mouse, Donald & Daisy Duck: Disney's original couples who've never married. Do they really need to?

And, then, there is the friendship between Casper and Wendy. If a ghost and a witch could actually be a compatible couple, this would be a great test case.

Modern times:

Flint/Lady Jaye (GI Joe): I remember seeing them kiss in at least one or two episodes. I didn't follow the comics, so I don't know where their relationship went after the toon ended.

Egon Spengler/Janine Melnitz (Extreme Ghostbusters): On Real Ghostbusters, Janine did carry a torch for Egon, but in "Ghostbusters 2", she was flirting with Louis Tully (remember when Annie Potts (Janine) draped a leg on Louis' (Rick Moranis) lap?) as well. I didn't follow XG all that much, so I don't know how Egon & Janine finally hooked up (and perhaps married, based on what I did see?).

Goliath/Eliza (Gargoyles): To me, it was Disney's response to the live-action Beauty & the Beast which was around at the same time. My feeling was, if Goliath eventually slept with Eliza, would she be subject to turning to stone alongside Goliath come sunrise? I'm not sure.

Robin/Starfire (Teen Titans): The cartoon deaged the 80's Titans, especially Starfire, who became more of an innocent novice new to Earth. Having read the comics back in the day, I recall that Starfire fell hard--literally--for Robin virtually from day 1. She learned English just from kissing him! It took a while for them to finally hook up in the cartoon, but it was inevitable.

Kim Possible/Ron Stoppable: You know how opposites attract? Perfect example. Ron's a klutz, Kim excels at just about everything. You knew they'd eventually become a couple.

Then, there was the implication on JLU of Batman & Wonder Woman as a couple. GL John Stewart was torn between Vixen & Hawkgirl. Too bad CN & WB decided to end the series before things really heated up.

My Life as a Teenage Robot: Was it just me, or did Brad have a crush on Jenny, and vice versa?

[GregX]

Goliath/Eliza (Gargoyles): To me, it was Disney's response to the live-action Beauty & the Beast which was around at the same time. My feeling was, if Goliath eventually slept with Eliza, would she be subject to turning to stone alongside Goliath come sunrise? I'm not sure.

She would not turn to stone.

[TheVileOne]

OK, but could they even sleep together?

Also, Jiraiya knows plenty about love. There's a reason the Icha Icha series is so popular.

And there is one woman Jiraiya loves. So the idea that he knows nothing about true love is wrong.

[Movie06]

Would Goliath and Elisa in love count as beastiality?

[Kagetsu]

I dunno, I'm iffy on Tokka myself. It just seems far too contrived that out of the main four (Aang, Katara, Sokka, and Toph), both sets of male and female characters would hook up. Sokka being with someone outside of the main group's more interesting IMO.I really agree. Toph is far too young for Sokka to really notice. But she seems to have a bit of a crush on him, and that is cute.

[TheVileOne]

Would Goliath and Elisa in love count as beastiality?

Well yeah. She's a human and he's a gargoyle. And he's got wings and talons and stuff. Just like Bev and Howard the Duck.

[Hordesman]

Well yeah. She's a human and he's a gargoyle. And he's got wings and talons and stuff. Just like Bev and Howard the Duck.

I'd say the issue of sentience keeps it from really being bestiality. Gargoyle minds clearly have the same capacities as human ones. I don't really see how Goliath/Elisa is much different than the regular interplanetary relationships in the DCU- reproduction aside. (The implication from Elseworlds and future-set stories being that interplanetary couples can have kids) I mean, you wouldn't consider Robin and Starfire bestiality, would you?

[Lavenderpaw]

I guess a dragon (even if assuming a human appearance) and a human dating counts as 'beastilty'?

[Darklordavaitor]

I guess a dragon (even if assuming a human appearance) and a human dating counts as 'beastilty'?
Not unless Jake gets freaky with Rose in his dragon form.:p

You know, I never got why Katara has to be with anyone. Just because Aang likes her more than a friend doesn't mean the feeling has to be mutual. The creators even admitted that you should notice that Katara's reaction wasn't totally excited in the "Day of Black Sun" commentary. And I seriously doubt Katara will warm up to Zuko enough to fall in love with him after nearly killing Aang in "Crossroads of Destiny".

[TheVileOne]

I'd say the issue of sentience keeps it from really being bestiality. Gargoyle minds clearly have the same capacities as human ones. I don't really see how Goliath/Elisa is much different than the regular interplanetary relationships in the DCU- reproduction aside. (The implication from Elseworlds and future-set stories being that interplanetary couples can have kids) I mean, you wouldn't consider Robin and Starfire bestiality, would you?

:sad: Sorry, it's not that simple. She's a human, and he's a totally different species. Beastiality.

Also, Jake is still part human and can take a full-blooded, human form. So there you go.

[Hordesman]

Not unless Jake gets freaky with Rose in his dragon form.:p

Well, I sure hope he wouldn't. But it goes to the mental aspect. Jake is human. He was raised human. He retains his human brain in dragon form. The magic seems to make a pretty simple transformation back and worth, compared to something like Dino Squad. That's just messy and I think those kids' genes are completely wrecked by now.

[Racattack!Force]

Just because Aang likes her more than a friend doesn't mean the feeling has to be mutual. The creators even admitted that you should notice that Katara's reaction wasn't totally excited in the "Day of Black Sun" commentary.
Whoa, someone other than me actually sees it. Her look seemed to be more like a mix of suprise and confusion.

[Antiyonder]

:sad: Sorry, it's not that simple. She's a human, and he's a totally different species. Beastiality.

You're right, it's not that simple. Gargoyles of the flesh and blood variety aren't even real, so applying real world logic to a Gargoyle/Human relationship is a bit futile. Plus, as mentioned, they have the same awareness and sentient capabilities of a human.

[Hordesman]

You're right, it's not that simple. Gargoyles of the flesh and blood variety aren't even real, so applying real world logic to a Gargoyle/Human relationship is a bit futile. Plus, as mentioned, they have the same awareness and sentient capabilities of a human.

Ever read this scientific speculation on the pre-Crisis Superman? http://www.rawbw.com/~svw/superman.html

[Mandi-chan]

Whoa, someone other than me actually sees it. Her look seemed to be more like a mix of suprise and confusion.

Plus, the fact that he was just telling her his doubts that he'd live through the fight before kissing her may play a role in her reaction to the kiss...

I never thought she looked thrilled (I always felt she was suprised, a little confused, and upset because Aang took off to his potential death), that's a lot to process...especially in the middle of a war.

But they have shown throughout seasons 2 and 3 (moreso in season 3) hints that she was starting to see him in a more romantic light as well...you can't pretend that there isn't something more than friendship between them now.

Whether or not it becomes a full-blown romance is something we'll just have to wait and see about.

As for the Goliath/Elisa romance, I don't see a thing wrong with it. I see nothing wrong with romances between humans and non-human creatures that have human traits...it's on the inside that counts.

I always thought it was funny that people have no problem with human/alien pairings when the alien is nearly all human looking except for different color skin and perhaps an antenna or two...but when it comes to something like Goliath/Elisa, Beauty and the Beast (either Disney's version or the hit 1980's show), mutants (like the ninja turtles with humans), it's not as warmly welcomed.

Oh well, to each their own.

[Lavenderpaw]

Well, I sure hope he wouldn't. But it goes to the mental aspect. Jake is human. He was raised human. He retains his human brain in dragon form. The magic seems to make a pretty simple transformation back and worth, compared to something like Dino Squad. That's just messy and I think those kids' genes are completely wrecked by now.

What's so bad about that show?I saw preview for it some time ago.

[Antiyonder]

Ever read this scientific speculation on the pre-Crisis Superman? http://www.rawbw.com/~svw/superman.html

A: It's been mentioned that Goliath and Elisa can't even have a birth child without socery/science aiding them. They're most likely to adopt anyway, so a Gargchild killing Elisa isn't going to happen. Even so,

B: The Gargoyles, are tough, but not bullet proof. They can be cut with a simple well sharpened sword, so they wouldn't be of the same physical might of even the Post-Crisis Superman.

[TheVileOne]

You're right, it's not that simple. Gargoyles of the flesh and blood variety aren't even real, so applying real world logic to a Gargoyle/Human relationship is a bit futile. Plus, as mentioned, they have the same awareness and sentient capabilities of a human.

Does that mean if a dog is just as sentient as Elisa its ok?

Also the Gargoyles aren't really almost 100&#37; humanoid looking aliens either.

[FightingDreamer]

Regarding the Goliath/Elisa relationship: It is incredibly problematic (and I have no doubt that Sir Weisman delighted in confronting the issue). In terms of emotions and morality, I would think that they would be fine. Goliath is clearly a highly intelligent, sentient, feeling being; one can almost call him human. Once one looks at the more physical aspects of their relationship (oh, how proud I am to be a geek right now:)), things get trickier. How would they have children, for one thing? Could Elisa truly handle a half-day relationship for years on end? And gargoyles age very slowly, if my memory serves me correctly (and it should for this matter); how would that feel to Goliath as Elisa aged and died like a human? Very thorny stuff here.

[TheVileOne]

They could have that vacation in that town from 30 Days of Night where the sun doesn't rise for 30 days.

[Movie06]

They could have that vacation in that town from 30 Days of Night where the sun doesn't rise for 30 days.

Are you sure that would apply? Not only they would have to fight the vampires, but there's also this


Finally, we made clear in this episode that the Gargoyles transformation to and from stone was really driven by an internal clock, not the sun itself, as Broadway turns to stone while underground. This was done, at least in part, to try and make it clearer that the gargs were not magical creatures but a mortal, biological species.

[TheVileOne]

Are you sure that would apply? Not only they would have to fight the vampires, but there's also this

OK, well the vampires are gone then, and if they came back, Goliath wouldn't have a problem with that.

As far as the other thing, just learn how to alter their biological clock :p .

[Movie06]

OK, well the vampires are gone then, and if they came back, Goliath wouldn't have a problem with that.

As far as the other thing, just learn how to alter their biological clock :p .

How? And I mean to both on how would Goliath beat the vampires and to alter their boilogical clock.

[The Huntsman]

I’m glad that this thread is so full of discussion, though it’s a shame that I have little experience with “Gargoyles” and am unable to contribute much to that conversation. However…


Does that mean if a dog is just as sentient as Elisa its ok?

Also the Gargoyles aren't really almost 100&#37; humanoid looking aliens either.
You’re over analyzing it, dude. Does it really matter if it’s considered bestiality? It’s a work of fiction, canonical fiction, and you can’t apply real world logic to a fictional world.

On another note, even though it’s completely one-sided, I have to say that I’m a fan of a Chowder + Panini pairing, from “Chowder”, obviously. Chowder may be too young to be interested in Panini, but the two are absolutely adorable together.

[Antiyonder]

Does that mean if a dog is just as sentient as Elisa its ok?

Also the Gargoyles aren't really almost 100&#37; humanoid looking aliens either.

But they're 100% fictional (Unless you've seen a real live Gargoyle that is), so whether or not it would be bestiallity would be obsoulete.

[GregX]

Would Green Lantern and Hawkgirl count as beastiality?

[W.C.Reaf]

Ok so Gargoyles are a spearet speices, and anything alive that isn't human is a seperate speices to us. While it may be over simplifiing it to say that a talking dog/human would be the same as a Gargoyle/human they both are interspeices relationships.

The same goes for Robin/Starfire, Green Lantern/Hawkgirl, J'onn J'onzz/that human woman he was with at the end, Batman/Wonder Woman because she's made out of clay, etc.

Ok the last part is just a bit of fun and not really "beastiality" and deserves a whole 'nother discussion for it.

My point is that Goliath/Elisa is the same as any human/alien relationship.

[Movie06]

Would Green Lantern and Hawkgirl count as beastiality?

Hawkgirl's different. She's a Human-Alien looking person. Gargoyles aren't that.

[W.C.Reaf]

Hawkgirl's different. She's a Human-Alien looking person. Gargoyles aren't that.

"Human's an animal too, bub."

[Movie06]

"Human's an animal too, bub."

Okay, that's true but still, Elisa & Goliath is beastiliaty.

[The Huntsman]

Okay, that's true but still, Elisa & Goliath is beastiliaty.
And your point is...?

[Racattack!Force]

And your point is...?
...I'm still trying to figure out how this whole debate started...:confused:

[Blackstar]

I honestly didn't expect the bestiality issue to go on this long. Anyway, here's my 2 cents:

I'll admit that I know next to zip about Gargoyles, as I've barely seen that show ever, but my take on the Gargoyles as a species is that while the Gargoyles aren't technically human, they're at least sentient and therefore are humanoid enough to intermingle with humans and it not be considered bestiality. They're no more animal-like than say humanoid aliens like Superman or Martian Manhunter or super freaks like the Savage Dragon. Fantasy creatures like fairies, witches and (sentient) space aliens all count as humanoid, and therefore, relationships between themselves and humans is not bestiality.

Just my opinion, which doesn't carry the weight of oxygen.

[Antiyonder]

I'll admit that I know next to zip about Gargoyles, as I've barely seen that show ever, but my take on the Gargoyles as a species is that while the Gargoyles aren't technically human, they're at least sentient and therefore are humanoid enough to intermingle with humans and it not be considered bestiality. They're no more animal-like than say humanoid aliens like Superman or Martian Manhunter or super freaks like the Savage Dragon. Fantasy creatures like fairies, witches and (sentient) space aliens all count as humanoid, and therefore, relationships between themselves and humans is not bestiality.

Sums it up just fine. As realistic as the show gets, it is still a cartoon and shouldn't be examined with realisim.

[TheVileOne]

Why not? In some ways Greg Weisman, the creator does this. In the world of the show they are meant to be a true biological species.

[Silverstar]

Why not? In some ways Greg Weisman, the creator does this. In the world of the show they are meant to be a true biological species.


But said world is a fictional world, hence the laws of the real world do not necessarily apply.

[W.C.Reaf]

Ok seriously if alien/human relationships aren't classed the same as gargoyle/human ones (and that's all we're talking about here what to call this type of relationship), then what are they? What do you call Superman/Lois, or Green Lantern/Hawkgirl?

More so what would you call Batman/the clay woman that is Wonder Woman? ;)

[Jave]

Here's a different way of seeing it. What would you call romance between two different pokemon species? It's happened plenty of times on the series, and it's canon in the games as well.

[Starlioness]

it's funny how people argue Goliath and Elisa.. and no one's mentioned Jessica and Roger Rabbit.. or interspecies romances like Donkey and Dragon.. Pepe le Pew and Penelope and so forth.. Miss piggy and Kermit are another example..:sad: :shrug:

[Hordesman]

What's so bad about that show? [Dino Squad] I saw preview for it some time ago.

It's E/I nonsense, particularly fun if you're a dino freak but still, those transformation sequences with all the DNA changes being shown look painful. I can't imagine it's healthy to keep changing like that. Their DNA is fried!


Does that mean if a dog is just as sentient as Elisa its ok?
Fantasy setting, number 1. The utter lack of humanoid traits in a dog and vice versa, number 2. Number 3, it's weird enough on Family Guy.


Here's a different way of seeing it. What would you call romance between two different pokemon species? It's happened plenty of times on the series, and it's canon in the games as well.

Given the lack of other animals in Pokeworld, I'd say it probably follows the same process as RL animals. Only Pokemon with a known gender can breed, and it's only within a species of a similiar type. But I wonder if more combinations are possible. I've heard lions and tigers are similiar enough to interbreed but it just doesn't ever happen in nature.

But I wouldn't say breeding is the only justification for pairings, peeps.

[Lutochris]

Seriously? I thought it was pretty obvious Toph has a thing for Sokka.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teypasmbw6s
(warning: unaired episode spoilers)

Well, that proved absolutely nothing. So they saved each other a bunch of times, and Toph has slightly blushed in a couple of awkward situations. I guess when Aang saves Sokka, it's proof for them as a couple as well? The only thing that even comes close is when she kissed Suki thinking it was Sokka, but she thought she was about to drown and was probably overwhelmed by the whole situation, and when nothing of interest has happened since that I'd hardly say it's significant.


Here's a different way of seeing it. What would you call romance between two different pokemon species? It's happened plenty of times on the series, and it's canon in the games as well.

Don't forget about the times that Pokemon have had crushes on humans.

[cyde]

How bout that stupid crush Batmite had on Batgirl? The idea of an Ergoian with a green yellow face pining for a human woman is STUU--------PID!!!!:eek:

[Antiyonder]

Since I've came across some Raccoons episodes recently, I have a question regarding this potential pairing.

Exactly how old is Bert? I figure somewhere in his adult years since he went to school with Ralph and Melissa. So I figure he's quite a bit older than Lisa who herself is I believe a teenager, and still had a crush on her. Are the age difference laws different in Canada (where I believe the show was produced)?

[Tea]

Well, that proved absolutely nothing. So they saved each other a bunch of times, and Toph has slightly blushed in a couple of awkward situations. I guess when Aang saves Sokka, it's proof for them as a couple as well? The only thing that even comes close is when she kissed Suki thinking it was Sokka, but she thought she was about to drown and was probably overwhelmed by the whole situation, and when nothing of interest has happened since that I'd hardly say it's significant.

Hey, you asked for hints. Not "it's canon they're totally gonna get married" proof. But as far as I'm concerned, the video shows Toph has a crush on Sokka.

[Lavenderpaw]

Hey, you asked for hints. Not "it's canon they're totally gonna get married" proof. But as far as I'm concerned, the video shows Toph has a crush on Sokka.

That's been obvious for a while now,especially in that one episode where they re-meet Suki again.

[Hordesman]

Don't forget about the times that Pokemon have had crushes on humans.

Honestly, most non-wild Pokemon are pets. I wouldn't say a clingy or protective pet has a crush on its owner. But it is curious how some can achieve sentience, like Meowth. That's a real grey area, as is the phenomeona of sentient battle partners.

Doesn't Zatch Bell have a canon or near-canon pairing of one of the mamodo and his cute Chinese book keeper? And the whole thing about Faust VIII from Shaman King and his dead wife that turns into this giant satanic nurse thing is sweet but really weird.

[Antiyonder]

Honestly, most non-wild Pokemon are pets. I wouldn't say a clingy or protective pet has a crush on its owner. But it is curious how some can achieve sentience, like Meowth. That's a real grey area, as is the phenomeona of sentient battle partners.

I'm pretty sure Chikorita had something of a crush on Ash.

[Lavenderpaw]

You know how in American Dragon (well,some of you know)it's a crime to the Huntsclan for Dragons and Dragonslayers to be in love?I think to them it's almost as horrible and taboo as incest.

[Racattack!Force]

Well, that proved absolutely nothing. So they saved each other a bunch of times, and Toph has slightly blushed in a couple of awkward situations. I guess when Aang saves Sokka, it's proof for them as a couple as well? The only thing that even comes close is when she kissed Suki thinking it was Sokka, but she thought she was about to drown and was probably overwhelmed by the whole situation, and when nothing of interest has happened since that I'd hardly say it's significant.


Actually, I'm pretty sure they stated on a commentary that Toph does in fact have a crush of Sokka. :shrug: And that drowning thing was an indication of it.

[Darklordavaitor]

You know how in American Dragon (well,some of you know)it's a crime to the Huntsclan for Dragons and Dragonslayers to be in love?I think to them it's almost as horrible and taboo as incest.
Wow, you really mention the show in ever post you make.

[Hordesman]

I'm pretty sure Chikorita had something of a crush on Ash.

Which just adds to the dodgy nature of the Pokeworld, but it's a crush to nowhere. I mean, it's possible that Toph just has to wait a few years before Sokka notices her (think Ginny and Harry) but Leaf pokemon don"t fill out the same way.


You know how in American Dragon (well,some of you know)it's a crime to the Huntsclan for Dragons and Dragonslayers to be in love?I think to them it's almost as horrible and taboo as incest.

Isn't it just a complication within one organization full of people in masks? I mean, incest is a taboo because it produces the likes of this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_II_of_Spain
I don't think you can compare Rose and Jake's relationship with that.

[Racattack!Force]

I'm pretty sure Chikorita had something of a crush on Ash.

No, it was just clingy.

[Daxdiv]

No, it was just clingy.

Does the same apply for his Aipom? Since that one did sneak off to Sinnoh without him knowing.

[Lavenderpaw]

Isn't it just a complication within one organization full of people in masks? I mean, incest is a taboo because it produces the likes of this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_II_of_Spain
I don't think you can compare Rose and Jake's relationship with that.

I mean,to them it's as taboo as incest or probably more.Punishable by death.
Not to us obviously.


Wow, you really mention the show in ever post you make.

And when the topic begs for it,yes,I do. ;)

[Racattack!Force]

Does the same apply for his Aipom? Since that one did sneak off to Sinnoh without him knowing.
He just enjoys hanging out with Ash. :sweat:

[Daxdiv]

He just enjoys hanging out with Ash. :sweat:

You mean she, Aipom is a girl, that was confirmed in both the Japanese and English.

[Racattack!Force]

You mean she, Aipom is a girl, that was confirmed in both the Japanese and English.
Dang, I need to pay more attention. XP

[Hordesman]

You mean she, Aipom is a girl, that was confirmed in both the Japanese and English.

And it's still someone Ash wouldn't date. Ash is just a good owner- one of the best.

I did think it was interesting, back when I lurked on a Shi-shi mailing list some years back, how that group supported Ash/Gary and tended to think that Pikachu was female. In a way, I think slash gets most interesting in its handling of the opposite sex.

[RonDrakenfan17]

Are we allowed to mention anime couples too?

IF soo.

Pokemon-Ash/Dawn I just find chemistry between them that I never found from him and any other main girl character.

Pokemon-Ash/Anabel. This is another Pokemon ship I liked, thought it was cute.

Naruto-Naruto/Hinata. I loved all the little hints they had. Wonder who Naruto will end up with in the end Sakura or Hinata?

Yuusei/Aki-Yugioh 5D. Yes even though they haven't meet yet they still look cute together. I can't wait for Aki first appearnce :D

Those are the main ones I support from anime series. I do like some from the anime movies too, but I can't think of there names at the moment. Thre is also this other ship I like from Trigun the girl with the blue hair who followed Trigun every where and gave him attitude. I always thought her and Trigun were nice together.

[The Huntsman]

NECROMANTIC RESURRECTION!

I was thinking about creating a new thread to discuss this, but then I decided that it would be better off in this thread. What are your thoughts on animated programs that contain one-sided relationships that involve a character who is borderline psychotic and / or a stalker? I understand that it’s for humor purposes, but one would think that more BS&P’s would be concerned about that sort of thing, considering the fact that it’s no laughing matter in real life. I’ve also noticed that it’s more common for female characters to be used in the psychotic stalker role than male characters, though male characters have had that role as well.

I thought that this might be worth discussing. I apologize if it isn’t.

[Lavenderpaw]

NECROMANTIC RESURRECTION!

I was thinking about creating a new thread to discuss this, but then I decided that it would be better off in this thread. What are your thoughts on animated programs that contain one-sided relationships that involve a character who is borderline psychotic and / or a stalker? I understand that it’s for humor purposes, but one would think that more BS&P’s would be concerned about that sort of thing, considering the fact that it’s no laughing matter in real life. I’ve also noticed that it’s more common for female characters to be used in the psychotic stalker role than male characters, though male characters have had that role as well.

I thought that this might be worth discussing. I apologize if it isn’t.

Like psychotically in love with someone?

[The Huntsman]

Like psychotically in love with someone?
I mean, like Panini from “Chowder”.

[Silverstar]

Or Pucca. That girl's a total stalker, even by fangirl standards.


I’ve noticed that it’s more common for female characters to be used in the psychotic stalker role than male characters, though male characters have had that role as well.

It all breaks down to sexual attitudes; generally speaking, females are regarded as the "fairer" sex: smaller, weaker and more passive (I'm not saying this is true, ladies, just that that's the prevailing attitude.) So to see a girl madly chasing after and imposing her romantic wiles on a boy is, in a way, like them stepping up a notch on the societal scale, becoming empowered and going against their stereotyped role of submissiveness.

By contrast, if a 'bigger, stronger' guy went after a girl the way Pucca or Panini went after Garu or Chowder, they'd regarded as wolves, stalkers, fiends or even potential rapists, which wouldn't be funny at all. It only works for guys when the fellas are total jerks who regularly get shot down by the ladies and their advances are rejected, like Johnny Bravo.

[Blackstar]

NECROMANTIC RESURRECTION!

I was thinking about creating a new thread to discuss this, but then I decided that it would be better off in this thread. What are your thoughts on animated programs that contain one-sided relationships that involve a character who is borderline psychotic and / or a stalker? I understand that it’s for humor purposes, but one would think that more BS&P’s would be concerned about that sort of thing, considering the fact that it’s no laughing matter in real life. I’ve also noticed that it’s more common for female characters to be used in the psychotic stalker role than male characters, though male characters have had that role as well.

Well, one thing to keep in mind is that the majority of cartoons are written and produced by men, so many of them end up having a male outlook by default. Perhaps the male writers are basing these female stalker characters on their own girlfriends who are constantly begging for them to commit or to marry them or whatever, so to them it appears that this is the only thing on their minds, so these female characters who are obsessed with love are perhaps a humorous exaggeration of this. Just a thought.

[DarthGonzo]

Well, one thing to keep in mind is that the majority of cartoons are written and produced by men, so many of them end up having a male outlook by default. Perhaps the male writers are basing these female stalker characters on their own girlfriends who are constantly begging for them to commit or to marry them or whatever, so to them it appears that this is the only thing on their minds, so these female characters who are obsessed with love are perhaps a humorous exaggeration of this. Just a thought.

But lets not forgot character like Timmy Turner or Sheen from Jimmy Neutron. These characters are clueless and borderline delusional when it comes to the opposite sex (Trixie and Libby) so it does work both ways.

[The Huntsman]

I never saw much of the series, but Sheldon from “My Life As A Teenage Robot” seemed pretty darn creepy in a couple of the episodes that I did see. Did he ever stop being so creepy, or would it be safe to say that he fits the psychotic stalker role as well?

[Silverstar]

I never saw much of the series, but Sheldon from “My Life As A Teenage Robot” seemed pretty darn creepy in a couple of the episodes that I did see. Did he ever stop being so creepy, or would it be safe to say that he fits the psychotic stalker role as well?

Well, Sheldon did mellow a bit in some of his later appearances, though his feelings for Jenny never faded. His obsession was such that he even built a robot persona for himself called 'The Silver Shell' that he rode around in and controlled to act like a jerk so Jenny would reject 'him' and turn to Sheldon instead. Needless to say, his plan backfired.

[Antiyonder]

Well, Sheldon did mellow a bit in some of his later appearances, though his feelings for Jenny never faded. His obsession was such that he even built a robot persona for himself called 'The Silver Shell' that he rode around in and controlled to act like a jerk so Jenny would reject 'him' and turn to Sheldon instead. Needless to say, his plan backfired.

Plus he gets credibility for being the only person to not give up on her when it seem like she was purposely ruining Christmas.

[The Huntsman]

I might as well try to keep a good thread going rather than create bad threads. I believe that some interesting discussion can still come from this thread.

What are your thoughts on episodes of animated programs that devote most of their plot to the subject of romance?

I have usually enjoyed episodes that focus on the subject of romance. I understand that such episodes can have terrible consequences, as some fans tend to take things too literally, but I believe such episodes are usually entertaining and I like to see which sorts of relationships will be pursued by the writers. “Brandy & Mr. Whiskers” was a series that I had liked as of late and one of the things that I found interesting about it was that it had a decent amount of episodes that involved the subject of romance. There was A Bunny On My Back (http://www.tv.com/brandy-and-mr.-whiskers/skin-of-eeeeeeeevil%21%21%21---a-bunny-on-my-back/episode/359498/summary.html), A Really Crushing Crush (http://www.tv.com/brandy-and-mr.-whiskers/a-really-crushing-crush---pickled-tink/episode/698337/summary.html), Bad Hare Day (http://www.tv.com/brandy-and-mr.-whiskers/bad-hare-day---paw-and-order/episode/395311/summary.html), Brandy’s Best-Ever Boyfriend (http://www.tv.com/brandy-and-mr.-whiskers/itty-bitty-kitty---brandys-best-ever-boyfriend/episode/687459/summary.html), Cryanosaurus Rex (http://www.tv.com/brandy-and-mr.-whiskers/cyranosaurus-rex---to-the-moon-whiskers/episode/352537/summary.html), Funky Bunny (http://www.tv.com/brandy-and-mr.-whiskers/funky-bunny---the-going-bananas-republic/episode/355535/summary.html), Loathe Triangle (http://www.tv.com/brandy-and-mr.-whiskers/better-off-wet---loathe-triangle/episode/650321/summary.html) Rain Delay (http://www.tv.com/brandy-and-mr.-whiskers/con-hare---rain-delay/episode/676550/summary.html), Time For Waffles (http://www.tv.com/brandy-and-mr.-whiskers/the-tell-tale-shoes---time-for-waffles/episode/622973/summary.html), What Price Dignity?! (Cheap!) (http://www.tv.com/brandy-and-mr.-whiskers/pet-peeves---what-price-dignity%21-cheap%21/episode/650326/summary.html) and Wolfie: Prince Of The Jungle (http://www.tv.com/brandy-and-mr.-whiskers/pop-goes-the-jungle---wolfie-prince-of-the-jungle/episode/616954/summary.html). That’s quite a lot of episodes; I believe “Brandy & Mr. Whiskers” may actually hold the record for the amount of romance themed episodes in a children’s animated program. However, I fervently believe that they were typically better than the episodes that weren’t focused on romance.

As I said, some people can take the implied romances too seriously. It’s shocking how many people actually support the pairing of Mac and Frankie, from “Foster’s Home For Imaginary Friends”. Now, I like the crush that Mac has on Frankie, as I think it’s adorable and it permits some funny scenes to take place, but it’s absurd that people honestly believe that there was substance behind the pairing.

Do you believe that more animated programs should have characters be open about their feelings instead of keeping their crushes a secret?

I believe that characters should be open about their feelings. It’s far too common for characters to keep their feelings to themselves, but such can also result in the character appearing unsympathetic. Helga, from “Hey Arnold!”, is a great example of this; most people actually hated her by the time the series was over with, as even though they tried to show that she was only mean to Arnold in order to hide her true feelings, she made his life a living hell and a lot of people never forgave her. There are still plenty of characters in contemporary animation who hide their true feelings; I have recently been trying to watch “Skunk Fu!” on Cartoon Network, in order to give the series a fair chance, and Rabbit’s crush on Fox is a good example of this, though I’ve heard that she has a secret crush on him as well.

Shouldn’t more animated programs have the characters be open with their feelings, if only to encourage children to do the same? It’s never healthy to suppress your emotions.

Feel free to add to this discussion. Answer the questions, reply to my answers, or do nothing at all; the choice is yours.

[judyindisguise]

Well, one thing to keep in mind is that the majority of cartoons are written and produced by men, so many of them end up having a male outlook by default. Perhaps the male writers are basing these female stalker characters on their own girlfriends who are constantly begging for them to commit or to marry them or whatever

Or maybe it's delusion on the writers' part...or just plain wishful thinking. ;):D

[The Nameless]

I never saw much of the series, but Sheldon from “My Life As A Teenage Robot” seemed pretty darn creepy in a couple of the episodes that I did see. Did he ever stop being so creepy, or would it be safe to say that he fits the psychotic stalker role as well?

I think the fact that he had a crush on a robot was creepy enough.

[The Huntsman]

I think the fact that he had a crush on a robot was creepy enough.
Touché.

[Mad Mod 49]

Pokemon-Ash/Anabel. This is another Pokemon ship I liked, thought it was cute


What?! That couple was the prime example of why Ash ships don't work. Not only is he completely romantically dead, but Anabel had no real reason to love him, and her characteristics and position from the game had to be altered in order to make it "work". It was completely pointless, just like the vast majority of stuff this show has done. :yawn:

[judyindisguise]

I think the crush Panini has on Chowder is pretty funny, if only because of Chowder's constant refrain "I'm not your boyfriend!" It was especially effective in a recent ep when Chowder actually hugged Panini, then ran like hell yelling that little catch-phrase. Cute. But there is always a danger in one-sided romances in fictional media: it builds up audience anticipation, and Lord help the creator who lets his audience down. Plus it can damage characters - the one being pursued eventually looks like a cold-hearted jerk if he/she never responds, and the pursuer will eventually look like a deranged stalker. In the case of Panini and Chowder, I think I'm going to lose interest if she continues to act like a complete mental case whenever her Chosen One is around. It'd be nice if something like a friendship develops between them, and every now and then she could start flirting, or whatever passes for flirting in kids her age. And there's the fact that Chowder has no playmates to speak of. It'd be interesting if he got involved with other characters besides Mung, his wife and the big gray dude.

[The Huntsman]

I think the crush Panini has on Chowder is pretty funny, if only because of Chowder's constant refrain "I'm not your boyfriend!" It was especially effective in a recent ep when Chowder actually hugged Panini, then ran like hell yelling that little catch-phrase. Cute. But there is always a danger in one-sided romances in fictional media: it builds up audience anticipation, and Lord help the creator who lets his audience down. Plus it can damage characters - the one being pursued eventually looks like a cold-hearted jerk if he/she never responds, and the pursuer will eventually look like a deranged stalker. In the case of Panini and Chowder, I think I'm going to lose interest if she continues to act like a complete mental case whenever her Chosen One is around. It'd be nice if something like a friendship develops between them, and every now and then she could start flirting, or whatever passes for flirting in kids her age. And there's the fact that Chowder has no playmates to speak of. It'd be interesting if he got involved with other characters besides Mung, his wife and the big gray dude.
Well, Mr. Greenblatt mentioned that Ceviché (http://bp2.blogger.com/_iwBWZ-bApq8/SIkbQ1AMtuI/AAAAAAAAAPc/juNsbB07Lpc/s1600-h/ceviche.jpg) is going to be a recurring character in the second season, and that he will develop a huge crush on Panini. He mentioned that this crush will result in some friction between him and Chowder, which seems to imply that Chowder may actually like Panini more than he lets on. Whether or not Panini will gradually fall for Ceviché remains to be seen, but if she does, it could be a rather interesting love triangle.

[Blackstar]

^Just as long as the romance between the kids doesn't take over the show. I'd personally hate that.

[The Huntsman]

^Just as long as the romance between the kids doesn't take over the show. I'd personally hate that.
I doubt it will, but there will likely be a couple of episodes about it. Just as there were a couple of episodes in season one about it.

[The Nameless]

^Just as long as the romance between the kids doesn't take over the show. I'd personally hate that.

Don't worry, it won't. Kids think romance is gross (and since that's Chowder's target audience, that's not happening).

And I'm not a fan of Ceviche's design. I'll probably grow more accustomed to it.

[The Huntsman]

...Kids think romance is gross...
I suppose that is true, but to what degree? I may not remember everything that took place during my youth, but I do recall watching the episodes of “Sonic The Hedgehog” where Sonic and Sally were flirting with and kissing another and it didn’t bother me. Even my favorite animated program, “101 Dalmatians: The Series”, ended with a three-part finale that was romance driven and contained a mushy wedding scene. Children may not like romance, but that hasn’t stopped animated programs from making use of it in their plots.

[Antiyonder]

I suppose that is true, but to what degree? I may not remember everything that took place during my youth, but I do recall watching the episodes of “Sonic The Hedgehog” where Sonic and Sally were flirting with and kissing another and it didn’t bother me. Even my favorite animated program, “101 Dalmatians: The Series”, ended with a three-part finale that was romance driven and contained a mushy wedding scene. Children may not like romance, but that hasn’t stopped animated programs from making use of it in their plots.

Even as a boy, I've been partial to romance myself. Even asked some of the neighborhood girls if I could marry them. Of course I didn't understand every detail of marriage.

Heck, I'd even anticipate the kiss scenes as much as I do the action.

[Super_Staff]

Helga, from “Hey Arnold!”, is a great example of this; most people actually hated her by the time the series was over with, as even though they tried to show that she was only mean to Arnold in order to hide her true feelings, she made his life a living hell and a lot of people never forgave her.

Doesn't Helga have a decent-sized fanbase, though? I kind of thought she did since a lot of people mention her fondly when reminscing about the series.

[hobbyfan]

She would not turn to stone.

Hmmmmmkay. Thanks.

[The Huntsman]

Doesn't Helga have a decent-sized fanbase, though? I kind of thought she did since a lot of people mention her fondly when reminscing about the series.
Yeah. I shouldn’t have said “most”, but there are a lot of people who do dislike Helga. I’ve seen numerous discussions and reviews where people found the character to be unsympathetic.

[Jave]

Yeah. I shouldn’t have said “most”, but there are a lot of people who do dislike Helga. I’ve seen numerous discussions and reviews where people found the character to be unsympathetic.Same can be said for almost any character on Hey Arnold. Sid and Rhonda are disliked by a significant portion of the fandom. Same can be said for some of the adults, specially Big Bob.

There's also an interview (which sadly is no longer online) where Craig Bartlett stated that he's aware that Lila is incredibly hated. It seems that if you're someone that likes Helga, there's a high chance that you hate Lila (although I find a lot of the Lila hate to be unjustified).

Even Arnold himself is a victim of this. A lot of people find him "too nice".

[Lavenderpaw]

Same can be said for almost any character on Hey Arnold. Sid and Rhonda are disliked by a significant portion of the fandom. Same can be said for some of the adults, specially Big Bob.

There's also an interview (which sadly is no longer online) where Craig Bartlett stated that he's aware that Lila is incredibly hated. It seems that if you're someone that likes Helga, there's a high chance that you hate Lila (although I find a lot of the Lila hate to be unjustified).

Even Arnold himself is a victim of this. A lot of people find him "too nice".


And for good reason.Rhonda hated Sid. :anime:

[judyindisguise]

Well, Mr. Greenblatt mentioned that Ceviché (http://bp2.blogger.com/_iwBWZ-bApq8/SIkbQ1AMtuI/AAAAAAAAAPc/juNsbB07Lpc/s1600-h/ceviche.jpg) is going to be a recurring character in the second season, and that he will develop a huge crush on Panini. He mentioned that this crush will result in some friction between him and Chowder, which seems to imply that Chowder may actually like Panini more than he lets on. Whether or not Panini will gradually fall for Ceviché remains to be seen, but if she does, it could be a rather interesting love triangle.

Thanks for the info. Does sound interesting. BTW - does a kid voice Chowder? If not, whoever does has the most authentic-sounding kid voice in the business.

[Ed Liu]

BTW - does a kid voice Chowder? If not, whoever does has the most authentic-sounding kid voice in the business.

Yes, the voice actor for Chowder is 11-year old Nicky Jones (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&ct=res&cd=2&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.animationmagazine.net%2Farticle%2F7563&ei=JaKhSJDiKZSUepPTpSk&usg=AFQjCNGZeU9PyKuDV_shwcR_HKExWslfYQ&sig2=gzpBO4Jb7ZFHHIA2ynTt9A) (although by now, he may be 12 already). He's easily one of my favorite things about the show.

-- Ed

[D Dubbs]

Wonder what they're going to do when he hits puberty. That's probably just around the corner for him.

[thenewme93]

^Probably just replace him..

[macattack]

^Probably just replace him..

They'll digitally pitch his voice up, I think, like they did for Zack Tyler Eisen for Avatar and whoever voices Mac on Foster's.

[Taco Wiz]

RenxStimpy from Ren and Stimpy
How can you NOT ship it? If you don't, you need to go watch Son of Stimpy. Ren falls apart without his cat buddy, in more of a sad way than Stimpy's Big Day. It seems as though Ren is partly sad because of Stimpy's misery. Plus, we see them almost kiss. Emotional AND physical proof.

ChowderxPanini from Chowder
It could happen someday, when Chowder grows out of his "girls are icky" phase.

RyaxPhil from Bonus Stage
Rya became more emotional as time went on.

RyaxCraig from Bonus Stage
They were married temporarily, for Pete's sake! Wait, who's Pete?

Salad FingersxHubert Cumberdale from Salad Fingers
Imaginary puppet romance. Spooky, yes?

[Blackstar]

They'll digitally pitch his voice up, I think, like they did for Zack Tyler Eisen for Avatar and whoever voices Mac on Foster's.

That would be Sean Marquette.

[gabfab]

Hi I am forever been a fan of Ghostfighters & Scoobydoo so i really love to see the "Fred/Daphne" & "Egon/Janine" team up.I am a romantic at heart so maybe thats the reason.:)New here so hoping to see you guys more often,I am at a film school now in Asia. (http://www.filmschool.ph)

[Antiyonder]

They'll digitally pitch his voice up, I think, like they did for Zack Tyler Eisen for Avatar and whoever voices Mac on Foster's.

Actually, I believe they allowed for Aang's voice to sound a little older to compliment his maturity in the later episodes.

[The Huntsman]

ChowderxPanini from Chowder
It could happen someday, when Chowder grows out of his "girls are icky" phase.
I really like that relationship as well, but I have to believe that Panini would gradually lose interest if Chowder weren’t so hard to get. If you recall her debut episode, she initially broke up with him because she thought that he was becoming too clingy. In that sense, I suppose it’s rather ironic; Chowder could easily get rid of her if he gave into her demands and returned her affections.

[EJLD4Ever]

They'll digitally pitch his voice up, I think, like they did for Zack Tyler Eisen for Avatar and whoever voices Mac on Foster's.

They did the same for Mel Blanc on Daffy, Porky, Tweety, and Speedy, although in an "analogue" sense. They sped up his voice by about 20% on a machine called a Thiatron (I don't know how it's properly spelt). If CN studios has the equipment for this, I don't see why not...

Anyways, back on topic, regarding "unrequited" romance, I'd say EdsxKankers for Ed Edd and Eddy are quite comedic. It is without a doubt that the Kankers' methods for "bagging men" were inspired by Grandma of Red Hot Riding Hood or Lena Hyena from Who Framed Roger Rabbit (the "Toon Hag"--as she is listed in the credits--who persues Bob Hoskins in Toontown).

It was firmly established at the beginning of the series that the typical EdsxKankers relationship pattern went as follows: EdxMay, EddxMary (sp?), EddyxLee.

And especially on the "lost" episode that only recently aired, I like the sort of "chain reaction" that occurs as a result of jealousy: 1. Edd dances with Nazz, 2. Mary gets jealous of EddxNazz and dances with Eddy. 3. Lee gets jealous of MaryxEddy, and dances with Ed, 4. May gets jealous of LeexEd.

[Silverstar]

It was firmly established at the beginning of the series that the typical EdsxKankers relationship pattern went as follows: EdxMay, EddxMary (sp?), EddyxLee.

And especially on the "lost" episode that only recently aired, I like the sort of "chain reaction" that occurs as a result of jealousy: 1. Edd dances with Nazz, 2. Mary gets jealous of EddxNazz and dances with Eddy. 3. Lee gets jealous of MaryxEddy, and dances with Ed, 4. May gets jealous of LeexEd.

It's Marie, not Mary. Just sayin'.



I really like that relationship as well, but I have to believe that Panini would gradually lose interest if Chowder weren’t so hard to get. If you recall her debut episode, she initially broke up with him because she thought that he was becoming too clingy. In that sense, I suppose it’s rather ironic; Chowder could easily get rid of her if he gave into her demands and returned her affections.

Normally I'd agree, but Chowder doesn't seem to be all that big on continuity; I mean, "The Cinamini Monster" ended with Chowder, Mung, Truffles and Shnitzel apparently spending the rest of their lives in the monster's lair, yet by next episode everything's back to normal. This doesn't seem to be one of those shows where the events of one episode are necessarily carried over to the next one.

Also, this is just my opinion, but if Chowder ever started returning Panini's affections, then it would get boring. The way that they repel each other like magnets with the same charge is part of what makes it funny.

[EJLD4Ever]

It's Marie, not Mary. Just sayin'.

Sorry for the spelling mistake...after not watching a show for a while, I have the tendency to spell characters' names incorrectly (or even get them COMPLETELY wrong!), note the "(sp?)" in my original statement. Thanks!

(WARNING: Drifting OT): A similar stiuation occured a while back when I spelt the name of Lu (of Mike, Lu and Og fame) as "Lou," which is quite common among others, as it turns out...

[judyindisguise]

It's Marie, not Mary. Just sayin'.




Normally I'd agree, but Chowder doesn't seem to be all that big on continuity; I mean, "The Cinamini Monster" ended with Chowder, Mung, Truffles and Shnitzel apparently spending the rest of their lives in the monster's lair, yet by next episode everything's back to normal. This doesn't seem to be one of those shows where the events of one episode are necessarily carried over to the next one.

Also, this is just my opinion, but if Chowder ever started returning Panini's affections, then it would get boring. The way that they repel each other like magnets with the same charge is part of what makes it funny.

Plus they're just kids. I can see a friendship developing between them, bordering on attraction, but it'd be natural for Chowder to backpedal when Panini gets too eager. Attracted yet repelled would be a good way of putting it. I think that's a nice compromise between rejection vs. affection. IMO, it's the out-and-out cold shoulder response to a pursuer that can damage characters and turn off viewers if the gag goes on too long. For instance, on FOP, I think it's clear that the Timmy Turner/Trixie/Tootie triangle is dead. Anything amusing that might have developed from it was destroyed when all of the characters involved became too one-dimensional and, frankly, too deranged.

[The Huntsman]

I’ve noticed that several animated programs, such as “Brandy & Mr. Whiskers” and “The Replacements”, have had an episode where a character becomes somebody’s boyfriend / girlfriend in order to be given an item of their desire. I understand that this isn’t sexual in nature, but wouldn’t this technically count as prostitution? After all, the term can be applied to things other than intercourse, and the characters are technically selling their body for material possessions. I apologize if this is a stupid thing to mention, but it crossed my mind the other night and I wanted to see what other people thought about it.

[EJLD4Ever]

I’ve noticed that several animated programs, such as “Brandy & Mr. Whiskers” and “The Replacements”, have had an episode where a character becomes somebody’s boyfriend / girlfriend in order to be given an item of their desire. I understand that this isn’t sexual in nature, but wouldn’t this technically count as prostitution? After all, the term can be applied to things other than intercourse, and the characters are technically selling their body for material possessions. I apologize if this is a stupid thing to mention, but it crossed my mind the other night and I wanted to see what other people thought about it.

Oh, I see...like the time Miss Harrington (did I spell it correctly?) posed as Gaspar's girlfriend? And describe which Replacements episode you're taking about. Because I do not think of it being uh, unethical.

[The Huntsman]

Oh, I see...like the time Miss Harrington (did I spell it correctly?) posed as Gaspar's girlfriend? And describe which Replacements episode you're taking about. Because I do not think of it being uh, unethical.
I understand that there’s nothing really wrong with it, but it just seemed like an odd sort of thing to include in a children’s animated program. Regardless, yes, that was the episode of “Brandy & Mr. Whiskers” that I was referring to. Brandy Harrington more-or-less sold herself for a dress, though she did make sure to slap Gaspar each time he kissed her. As for “The Replacements”, there was an episode not too long ago where Abbey’s sister fell in love with Todd, but Todd only became her boyfriend so that she would use her massive wealth to buy him a video game system. I thought both episodes were similar, as both of the characters got into an unwanted relationship for the sake of gaining material possessions.

[John Pannozzi]

Stan and Wendy broke up a very long time ago.
They got back together in "The List". Yeah, Stan vomited on Wendy at the end, but in this alternate ending (http://www.southparkstudios.com/downloads/preview/?id=7607), Wendy smiled after Stan puked on her.

[The Huntsman]

I’m really grasping at straws in order to keep this discussion alive; I could ask all of the questions in the world, but it doesn’t do much good if nobody answers them. Perhaps the problem is my fault, as my recent questions haven’t really been that interesting, but I fervently believe that a lot of discussion can still take place on this subject. Remember, this thread can still be used to merely discuss your favorite couples in an animated program, but once again, I’m going to ask some more questions in hopes of keeping the ball rolling.

Do you personally feel that marriage has been portrayed positively or negatively in animated programs? Which married couple from an animated program is your favorite? Why are they your favorite? Do you believe that their relationship is realistic when compared to married couples in real life? Do you believe that married couples should be allowed to show more affection for one another in children’s animation?

With that out of the way, I suppose that I can go back to this thread’s original purpose. As I have probably said one too many times, I have recently been watching “Skunk Fu!”. I have to say that I really like the relationship that Fox and Rabbit have; they both have a crush on one another, but refuse to make their feelings known for various reasons. They have had a lot of great scenes in the episodes that I have seen so far, and even though Rabbit’s machismo nature prevents their relationship from taking root, I think that they would be rather cute together.

http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n147/The_Huntsman/Cartoons/FoxRabbit.gif

[Blackstar]

Huntsman, I'm going to try to field each question that you asked here individually:



Do you personally feel that marriage has been portrayed positively or negatively in animated programs?Overall, I'd say that the depiction of marriage in animation has been pretty positive, for the most part. I haven't seen too many unhappily married couples on TV as regulars, except for certain comics strips such as The Lockhorns, to name only 1 example. Overall, I prefer to see functional married parents on TV than the boring single/widowed fathers.

Which married couple from an animated program is your favorite?That's hard to say, as there aren't many of them on Kid Vid TV. Sure, you have animated prime time couples such as Homer and Marge Simpson, Hank and Peggy Hill or Peter and Lois Griffin, but honestly, I'm starting to find the formula of the wacky husband/patient but boring wife to be tiresome. I actually prefer it when the wife has some quirks of her own. I'm not suggesting the wife be just as crazy as her husband, after all, there should be some contrast, merely that I prefer it when the wife isn't portrayed as being a paragon of perfection who can do no wrong and is completely boring without her spouse, which is why I like Stan and Francine Smith from American Dad! more than Peter and Lois currently (although I don't much care for Stan). If forced to pick right now, I'd probably say Hugh and Lila Test (From Johnny Test). While I do feel that the 2 of them should show more physical affection for one another, there seems to be an unspoken love each other that they share. Honorable mention would go to Goku and Chi-Chi from DBZ (you don't see them getting "lovey-dovey" very often, but when they do, it's downright sweet to see), and also Mung Dahl and Truffles from Chowder. I just wish that Truffles would get a little more screentime.

Why are they your favorite?See above.
Do you believe that their relationship is realistic when compared to married couples in real life?It's animation, so realism is irrelevant. I only care if it's entertaining and if it leaves me with a warm, fuzzy feeling inside.
Do you believe that married couples should be allowed to show more affection for one another in children’s animation?Indeed I do. I understand that on kid-friendly animated programs that the producers feel that most kids don't want to see a lot of kissy stuff, but I wouldn't change the world to show married couples kissing on the lips or holding hands or whatever more than occasionally. As long as their not making out on the kitchen table, I don't see the harm in it.

[The Huntsman]

That's hard to say, as there aren't many of them on Kid Vid TV. Sure, you have animated prime time couples such as Homer and Marge Simpson, Hank and Peggy Hill or Peter and Lois Griffin, but honestly, I'm starting to find the formula of the wacky husband/patient but boring wife to be tiresome. I actually prefer it when the wife has some quirks of her own. I'm not suggesting the wife be just as crazy as her husband, after all, there should be some contrast, merely that I prefer it when the wife isn't portrayed as being a paragon of perfection who can do no wrong and is completely boring without her spouse, which is why I like Stan and Francine Smith from American Dad! more than Peter and Lois currently (although I don't much care for Stan).
Yeah. I think that some of the people who work on these animated programs are reluctant to take risks with their female characters, whether for the sake of political correctness or for some other reason. I mean, even when animated wives do take risks, it’s usually nothing in comparison to the crazy things that their husbands have done at one time or another. On that note, has there ever been an animated married couple that was the inverse of what you’ve said, with the wife being the wacky one while the husband was the patient one who was rather dull?


Hugh and Lila Test (From Johnny Test). While I do feel that the 2 of them should show more physical affection for one another, there seems to be an unspoken love each other that they share.
I’ve never really watched that series; perhaps I should check it out.


...and also Mung Dahl and Truffles from Chowder. I just wish that Truffles would get a little more screentime.
I agree with you on that one. The two of them may not get along as well as they once did, but despite their arguments, they still love one another. I fully believe that scene towards the end of “Mung On The Rocks” was one of the better romantic scenes that I’ve ever seen.

[radioflyer]

I’m really grasping at straws in order to keep this discussion alive; I could ask all of the questions in the world, but it doesn’t do much good if nobody answers them. Perhaps the problem is my fault, as my recent questions haven’t really been that interesting, but I fervently believe that a lot of discussion can still take place on this subject. Remember, this thread can still be used to merely discuss your favorite couples in an animated program, but once again, I’m going to ask some more questions in hopes of keeping the ball rolling.

Do you personally feel that marriage has been portrayed positively or negatively in animated programs? Which married couple from an animated program is your favorite? Why are they your favorite? Do you believe that their relationship is realistic when compared to married couples in real life? Do you believe that married couples should be allowed to show more affection for one another in children’s animation?

With that out of the way, I suppose that I can go back to this thread’s original purpose. As I have probably said one too many times, I have recently been watching “Skunk Fu!”. I have to say that I really like the relationship that Fox and Rabbit have; they both have a crush on one another, but refuse to make their feelings known for various reasons. They have had a lot of great scenes in the episodes that I have seen so far, and even though Rabbit’s machismo nature prevents their relationship from taking root, I think that they would be rather cute together.

http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n147/The_Huntsman/Cartoons/FoxRabbit.gif

I'm digressing a bit here, but there's an online comic strip called "Mynarski Forest" which stars a fox/rabbit couple. The fox is especially cool; she's a bloodthirsty predator who's pretty fierce and also kind of whacko, while the rabbit is logical and patient. So I guess they're unconventional in more than one way - they're an interspecies couple, and it's the female who's whacky instead of the male, a direct opposite to the usual dippy male/smart female couples you usually see in cartoons. BTW, I e-mailed the creator of the strip about his work, and he told me that fox/rabbit couples aren't really all that unusual in online animal strips. FWIW.

[thenewme93]

The couple that I ship right now is NaruHina just because..it's a couple that kinda makes sense.....

[Mad Mod 49]

The couple that I ship right now is NaruHina just because..it's a couple that kinda makes sense.....


Not to me. Sadly, Naruto seems like many a Shonen hero before him...forever oblivious to any girl's feelings toward him. :yawn:

[Baltofan]

I love the fox and rabbit relationship in Skunk Fu too.