If Atlantis flops

[Calhoun07]

If Atlantis fails to do any better in the box office, and I doubt it will, I don't see that as a bad thing. Thankfully, the summer for animation was saved by Shrek, and us fans of more mature animation can rejoice that Atlantis's failure won't spell the end to more mature animation in the future. If anything, it might mean that Dreamworks and others will start to do more mature animated movies since they see that money can be made without the Disney stamp!

[I.R Joey]

That's true, but I see one problem with your argument.

Shrek is an animated comedy. I don't think anyone is doubting the potential sales figures of an animated comedy, i'm worried about is animated action/drama. That could be in danger if Atlantis bombs.

[Calhoun07]

Then let Dreamworks get their hand in on making an animated drama. I really think if they used an existing property presently unknown to animation, such as a popular drama comic (my choice would be Sin City, of course, but there are several great dramatic comics that could make great movies) and if they gave credit where credit is due (and not just steal the material like Disney does), I think they might have a hit on their hands. Not only would animation fans see it, but comic book fans would flock to the theater. It might wind up doing very good, especially if Dreamworks pushed it as well as they have Shrek, and if the comic book company who also was involved got into the promotion of the project.

I don't think the animated drama is dead if Atlantis flops. I think movie companies just need to re-examine how to do it. Iron Giant flopped because of poor marketing (and that was the biggie) and because outsiders thought of it as kiddie fare and for those fans of Disneyized toons, it looked to mature for their tastes, or uninteresting, or whatever. Titan AE failed to perform, I think, because they kept on pushing the "Star Wars meets Heavy Metal" tag line. Comparing it to two great franchises would inevitably raise expectations to levels that were hard to reach, and thus I think people were disappointed, but the movie does get better with repeat viewings. I might be wrong on both of those, but that's what I think killed them in the box office.

And Disney...well, they will have a hard time finding support among the serious anime fans in this country, with their blantant plagarism. If they only gave credit where credit is due, perhaps this movie wouldn't have been met with the disdain it has been met with. Also, and I hate to say this, but people expect cute singing animals and side kicks in these movies, and if they don't deliver, people will be less likely to go. What I would hate to see is for Disney to return to that musical format and abandon the new direction they have been trying to take.

An animated drama that takes a property that many people are already familar with and gives proper nods to the original creators of that property and honest marketing and goog marketing of the film could be the key to box office success that these other films failed to materialize. Or people could just as well be totally turned off by a Sin City (or fill in your own blank) animated movie and the genre could truly be dead.

[Maxie Zeus]

Originally posted by calhoun07
Then let Dreamworks get their hand in on making an animated drama.

Didn't they already try this with "Prince of Egypt"? Granted, it had songs, but it was not the typical musical comedy with funny animals. 'Course, it also wasn't very good (IMO), but that's another matter.

And because it has to be said: I have NEVER understood why Warners hasn't put serious money behind a Timm-produced Batman feature. MOTP and ROTJ show that the Timm-Burnett-Dini-Murakami team can more than handle a feature-length story; if only Warners invested Disney-sized bucks behind something like those . . . .

[The Mad Hatter]

Oh yes, Maxie. WB has been fools to not give the B:TAS team the full theatrical treatment, be it on a DC property or something else entirely.

As for what Calhoun said... I can certainly see Shrek possibly opening up the avenues for more mature, non-Disneyesque animation. And quite frankly, we need that. My fear is that, instead of innovating more mature stuff, other studios will equate a mature touch with fart jokes and create stuff that has about as much soul as Tom Green.

But the real question is what will happen if Atlantis flops... I don't think it will be the death knell of a commercially viable animated drama, but it probably will make it more difficult/less likely that a major studio would want to pull one off. I'd love to see a studio try animating a comic book (for example), but remember, the American prejudice that "animation should be for kids, if it's not it's an abhorration of nature" is still strong indeed. Shrek managed to subvert that nicely by still being within a fairy tale frame and thus not deviating too far from what people expect.

My worry, as stated before, isn't about the future of animated dramas. I just fret that if Shrek does better than Atlantis, every studio will figure "hey, CGI is inherently cool," and flood the market with crap CGI movies while cel animation languishes.

[Calhoun07]

Originally posted by Maxie Zeus


Didn't they already try this with "Prince of Egypt"? Granted, it had songs, but it was not the typical musical comedy with funny animals. 'Course, it also wasn't very good (IMO), but that's another matter.\

I thought Prince of Egypt was a great movie.

[JustJack]

My worry, as stated before, isn't about the future of animated dramas. I just fret that if Shrek does better than Atlantis, every studio will figure "hey, CGI is inherently cool," and flood the market with crap CGI movies while cel animation languishes.

This is already going on. While on TV, CGI shows do well. Action Man is somewhere in fox Kids top 3. Max Steel(despite how dreadfully awful it is) is still doing really well. It's just that WB is full of morons, & that's why it's going 2D. But even so, CN has bought NEW episodes of the CGI Max Steel.

CGI movies do well. Antz even did well, then Bug Life did well. The Toy Story movies did well. Shrek did well. Star Wars Episode 1 did well(Oh please, name one scene that wasn't CGI!!!!)

While most of these movies do well because they have a great story(you know you liked Toy Story), it still has plenty of eye candy, and most movie companies think that it's purely the eye candy that sells the movie. Maybe the CGI is what gets them in the theater, but it's the story that makes it a good movie. such companies like WB don't understand that.

And with all this CGI, anything frame animated is considered "kiddy" while shrek is concidered by most "mature". HA! Have you seen Atlantis? I just fear th day when CGI is concidered Kiddy. Then everything may be over with....stupid modernization.

[Nightwing]

Originally posted by calhoun07
If Atlantis fails to do any better in the box office, and I doubt it will, I don't see that as a bad thing.

Agreed. But I still worry, on one point because what we want are animated dramas to wake the general public up to how animation is more than they see it as. And another point because Disney is the only animation that narrow minded general public considers (and only in the happy singing animals genre, unfortunately). And so if a try at an animated action drama flops, it'll unconsciously drive them further away from our goal of their realization.

I'm not normally the negative nelly, but knowing our luck, producers will end up taking the WRONG lessons from Shrek's performance, as someone stated. And we'll get crap CGI movies for quite a while yet.

We sure have a long way to go....dog gonit...

But on a lighter note, (finaly! lol) I thought Prince Of Egypt was excellent. I liked it a lot. I just saw it the other day on HBO as a matter of fact.

[I.R Joey]

Yeah that's the thing that concerns me. Disney does have the name brand thing. The narrow minded public will automatically block out alot of the animation coming from other studios (like Fox and WB stuff.) As of this moment I think the only ones that can give them competition is Dreamworks.