Toon Zone Talkback - Vancouver Animator Paul Boyd Shot and Killed by Police

[Nexonius]

This is the talkback thread for Vancouver Animator Paul Boyd Shot and Killed by Police (http://news.toonzone.net/article.php?ID=18523).

Oh God, again with the deaths? Rest In Peace.

[Draft]

Oh My God!

That's terrible. RIP

[Dark Fact]

So they shot him because he was armed with a chain? Why didn't they just jump him and disarm him? Isn't shooting at a guy who doesn't have a gun himself going too far?

[Wonderwall]

I live in Vancouver so I read about this story last week( i believe thats when it happened ). I think the cops were well within their right to do what they did, the man had already injured two cops, one was actually knocked out. Yea jump at a guy spinning a chain around and try to disarm him, even if its 3 on 1, someones gonna get injured, maybe even seriously. It's not an easy decision to shoot someone, but these guys saw 2 of their own go down, also they were not armed with tasers, they had a choice of going fist against chain or shooting him. Its a sad thing yea, but the cops werent at fault here.

[Dark Fact]

How many cops were even standing off against this guy? I don't see how a few could go back to HQ and get some tasers to stun Boyd with while the rest keep him company.

How was Boyd even spinning the chain? Overhead? In front? From side to side? Any way you look at it, the man's gonna leave himself open to some form of disarming tactic. I think the police just overreacted. If Boyd was armed with a firearm, that would've been a different story.

[cyde]

i fear there's going to be a flock of questions--all that they don't want answered. And then there'll be hell to pay.

[Wonderwall]

i fear there's going to be a flock of questions--and that they don't want answered. And then there'll be hell to pay.

What the hell are you talking about?...Anyway, I dont know how he was spinning the chain, does it matter its a weapon, one he used to injure 2 cops, the other 3 saw him with 2 cops already down, theres no sense in going "heres a dangerous guy who already took down two of our own as soon as we got on the scene, lets go back to base to get tasers and then hopefully he'll still be here and our guys wont be harmed anymore and he wont harm anyone else either." It was a terrible situation, but I don't think the cop who shot him should be to blame( i believe only one shot him ), he has a guy whos not in the right frame of mind coming after him( and he was apperently quite a big guy too from what Ive read in the newspapers ), he can see two of his collegues down, one might've been dead for all he knew as one of the cops was unconscious. Its sad because the guy had a condition, and it was acting up at the wrong time and from his family's accounts, he was a very nice and gentle guy too.

[Dark Fact]

If the cops had to shoot him, wouldn't shooting him in the shoulder in order to make him drop his weapon sufficed better? And I'm not saying that the entire force had to go back to HQ to get tasers, but a couple of cops who could deliver tasers to the rest of the force to use.

[Wonderwall]

If the cops had to shoot him, wouldn't shooting him in the shoulder in order to make him drop his weapon sufficed better? And I'm not saying that the entire force had to go back to HQ to get tasers, but a couple of cops who could deliver tasers to the rest of the force to use.

Cops are trained to shoot the body, this isnt a video game, hitting the shoulder is more difficult than shooting the chest. And thats still going against logic, how are they supposed to wait for another cop to come deliver a taser while a guy's attacking them, its not feesible, the police station is too far from Granville St.( which is where he was shot ) for that to happen, and the guy isnt going to wait there for them to get a taser.

[not blond]

Cops are trained to shoot the body, this isnt a video game, hitting the shoulder is more difficult than shooting the chest. And thats still going against logic, how are they supposed to wait for another cop to come deliver a taser while a guy's attacking them, its not feesible, the police station is too far from Granville St.( which is where he was shot ) for that to happen, and the guy isnt going to wait there for them to get a taser.

This talented animator / artist was killed by 9 bullets - count them 9. Eyewitnesses - one has very publically spoken out about what he saw - clearly saw Paul Boyd wounded, kneeling in the street while he was still be shot over and over and over again by the cops. NINE TIMES. He was killed because he was mentally ill. A chain? That is reason to shoot someone nine times?

In the US, in some inner cities, mentally ill people who were having episodes were over-represented in the fatally wounded-by-cop tallies. One communuty said enough is enough and demanded that the police have trained officers who can respond to people who are more dangerous to themselves. This is not the first time, and sadly won't the last, where Vancouver cops have killed an innocent, albeit sick person.

At since when are cops such scaredy cats that a man with a bike chain is cause for shooting? These cops were nowhere near Boyd when they shot him. Search out Jonathan Menzies eyewitness report of this killing. Wonderwall doesn't know what he is talking about.

Many animators are prone to bouts of depression and even other mental health issues. Heaven forbid you get in the way of Vancouver's finest.

[Kagetsu]

If the cops had to shoot him, wouldn't shooting him in the shoulder in order to make him drop his weapon sufficed better? And I'm not saying that the entire force had to go back to HQ to get tasers, but a couple of cops who could deliver tasers to the rest of the force to use.All police need is "the belief of a dangerous weapon" and they can shoot to kill. They carry hollow points, even a shoulder wound will never heal properly. And the basic truth is, a story of "necessary force" is always easier to shove through when the other witness is dead.


This talented animator / artist was killed by 9 bullets - count them 9. Eyewitnesses - one has very publically spoken out about what he saw - clearly saw Paul Boyd wounded, kneeling in the street while he was still be shot over and over and over again by the cops. NINE TIMES. He was killed because he was mentally ill. A chain? That is reason to shoot someone nine times? Most cases of officer firearm discharge, they empty the clip, that's 13 to 15 rounds from a single gun.(it's the way they practice on the shooting range) once one cop fires, the others around him take that as a que. It's adrenalin, and once the line, "suspect refuses commands, and has a weapon of any kind" has been crossed, they shoot legally until the perp stops moving. They are overzealous and it's their job to put their lives on the line. But they intend to go home, and the laws support that idea. You can be shot by police for having a cell phone in your hand, because of the simple fact that there guns disguised as cell phones. The basic truth, if you don't do as commanded, they have all the right they need to kill you without prejudice.

(besides, all cops are taught that civis have a machinegun in their right hand and a triggerswitch to a nuke in their left.)
if your pulled over for speeding, make sure your hands are on the steeringwheel, and you don't do squat until they've had a chance to look around inside through the window. Your life will last longer.

[Wonderwall]

How do I not know what Im talking about? Im just trying to state some possiblilities on why the cops did what they did. Were you there? No, was I? No, yet my word is less than yours? Screw off man. Eyewitness can lie, I bet anyone who was there will have drastically different accounts about what happened, but wait, someone posted their account online, so his must be true, everyone else is lying. Scardy cats? What are you 6? Lets see what happens when a guy's swinging a chain at you, see if you dont cower in fear, you know because a chain can't kill someone right, its only metal, that's never hurt anyone:shrug: . Its easy today to point the blame on the police, despite what I've said Im not the biggest fan of the cops, I don't care enough, but its unfair to say "theyre at fault because they have guns and badges! BE ALL END ALL!" And did I ever talk badly about the man who was shot, HELL NO! I said he was dangerous because the fact is..he was, sickness or no sickness. Animators are prone to depression and mental health issues? I'd like to see your study, I hang with a bunch of animators or animators in training, and 90% of them seem alright emotionally, the other 10% most likely quit. Yea I don't know what Im talking about guys because some guy online read an "Eyewitness account" online. Bugger off man.

Edit: Im referring to not blond, not you Kagetsu

[Dark Soul]

Eyewitnesses have different accounts unless you were there you don't know what exactly happened. Cops had the right to shoot him.

He incapasitated(spelt wrong i know) 2 cops its enough to shoot someone. If you harm a cop in anyway you are prone to be shot. So don't give me "oh it was inhumane" excuse.

Its sad to see him go but if he didn't get into a fight with the cops in the first place this all could of been avoided.

[Simpler Simon]

This talented animator / artist was killed by 9 bullets - count them 9. Eyewitnesses - one has very publically spoken out about what he saw - clearly saw Paul Boyd wounded, kneeling in the street while he was still be shot over and over and over again by the cops. NINE TIMES. He was killed because he was mentally ill. A chain? That is reason to shoot someone nine times?

Police have a right, legally at least, to shoot to kill when the suspect in question is dangerous and has ignored multiple warnings and orders to stand down. And like Wonderwall said, this isn't a video game or a movie - there's no miraculous one-hit kill or single clean shot. Once the decision is made, you shoot until you're sure the suspect isn't a threat anymore. Nine bullets sounds like a lot, but not so when you compare to reports of what other criminals, especially those armed with guns, have taken in stand-offs. And a chain definitely counts as a dangerous weapon, at least as much as a knife.

It's a very tragic and unfortunate story, definitely. I'm sure if the police knew Mr. Boyd had a history of mental illness they would've found another way to subdue him. But all they probably knew, unless someone can find a source to correct me, was that he was swinging a chain and endangering public safety. And they had to make a decision based on that. I'm sure its not something they're proud of.

[BCVM22]

Just to put this out there, that the man was an animator does not somehow automatically mean that the police shot him out of brutality. It doesn't. Does not. That the man worked on some animated shows you liked does not mean that there is a conspiracy afoot. Wonderwall and Simpler Simon are absolutely right: none of us were present at the scene and none of us are officers of the law. We who sit hundreds or thousands of miles away and read about this on the Internet have absolutely no basis or right to automatically assume excessive use of force on the part of the police officers involved in the incident.

I recommend everyone take a step back and breathe in some reality before this inane shouting of "I READ THIS ONLINE AND IT SOUNDS LIKE EXCESSIVE FORCE" continues.

[Dark Soul]

Just to put this out there, that the man was an animator does not somehow automatically mean that the police shot him out of brutality. It doesn't. Does not. That the man worked on some animated shows you liked does not mean that there is a conspiracy afoot. Wonderwall is absolutely right: none of us were present at the scene and none of us are officers of the law. We who sit hundreds or thousands of miles away and read about this on the Internet have absolutely no basis or right to automatically assume excessive use of force on the part of the police officers involved in the incident.

I recommend everyone take a step back and breathe in some reality before this inane shouting of "I READ THIS ONLINE AND IT SOUNDS LIKE EXCESSIVE FORCE" continues.

I totally agree. Just because you like the animator doesn't mean you have to give a biased post about it. You have to look at both sides of the story and analyze it correctly then you choose what to support.

[not blond]

Eww scary. A man is dead - so if the cops killed him it has to be okay because they are cops and they are always right. Where am I? Stalinist Russia? Frankly I'm shocked at the lack of even concern for the killing of an obviously sick person. Where's the compassion man.

The point is that cops can and do use excessive force, have few checks and balances and in Vancouver, the cops get to investigate themselves (something you usually only see in dictatorships). Mental illness is no reason to kill someone. The police are there to protect us and to protect those who could due harm to themselves - say get them to a hospital. And there has been a number of killings by police that are clouded in controversy in BC - from the young drunk man shot in the back of the head by a RCMP to other killings of unarmed mentally ill people.

read this and weep, by an eyewitness - Jonathan Menzies

facebook.c*m/group.php?gid=5360540372

and by a journalism student. 6ohfour.wordpress.c*m/2007/08/18/hiding-behind-the-badge/

[Dark Soul]

I really don't care about eyewitness reports and I'm not going to fight this either . It doesn't matter if he's "mentally ill" if he is a danger to society and to other people the police have the right to use force even if that means killing him.

Again don't give excuses I hate that. And your relying on a report as your evidence by some witness be real for once

[BCVM22]

Eww scary. A man is dead - so if the cops killed him it has to be okay because they are cops and they are always right. Where am I? Stalinist Russia? Frankly I'm shocked at the lack of even concern for the killing of an obviously sick person. Where's the compassion man.

The point is that cops can and do use excessive force, have few checks and balances and in Vancouver, the cops get to investigate themselves (something you usually only see in dictatorships). Mental illness is no reason to kill someone. The police are there to protect us and to protect those who could due harm to themselves - say get them to a hospital. And there has been a number of killings by police that are clouded in controversy in BC - from the young drunk man shot in the back of the head by a RCMP to other killings of unarmed mentally ill people.

read this and weep, by an eyewitness - Jonathan Menzies

facebook.c*m/group.php?gid=5360540372

and by a journalism student. 6ohfour.wordpress.c*m/2007/08/18/hiding-behind-the-badge/

You have absolutely zero proof as to the excessiveness of the force used officers of the law involved. None. Zero. You're talking completely out of your own bias to the situation. That you live in Vancouver means you get local news involving the police that we don't. Fine. It does not mean that you are automatically privy to some sort of conspiracy involving officers of the law or that merely because you think so, excessive use of deadly force was involved on the part of the officers. As you'll find to be the case here (since you appear to have registered for the sole purpose of attempting to convince us of your view on this, something I find odd), no one's interested in reading opinions or speculation with nothing to back them up. Usually that comes up in back-and-forth discussions about which cartoons are better than others, but the principle is still similar. I recommend that you stop these baseless accusations until you have something a little more convincing than "I DON'T LIKE POLICE."

None of us are expressing lack of compassion for the suspect. Clearly the man had some medical issues that contributed to his death, and the death of anyone who was heretofor a law-abiding citizen and a good man by all accounts is unfortunate, to say the least. That does not mean that there's some sort of police conspiracy involved. Is it possible? Certainly. Where there are people, of authority or not, involved, there's always the possibility of misconduct on some level. Again, however, you have no proof of any such misconduct, just as we have no proof against any misconduct aside from the fact that on the surface, the police officers appear to have been, as Simpler Simon said, acting within their duty as officers of the law.

Also, the first link you provided is a Facebook link, accessible only to those are registered with the site and signed in at present (and I know I don't feel like signing in right now). Really not the best evidence in a legitimate argument.

[Dark Soul]

Lol nuff said BCVM. Not blond don't shove your biased idealistic point of view up our alley because the truth is we are not amused nor we are not buying it.

[not blond]

At approximately 9:30 on Monday night at Granville and 16th in Vancouver British Columbia, I was on the 601 to South Delta, (Tsawwassen and Ladner), and we pulled up to a bus stop and traffic light and were stopped for what seemed like quite a while. There were several police cars next to us (I was sitting on the left-hand side). A man was about to be handcuffed, but broke away and a minor fight broke out. The suspect pulled out a small chain which one of the witnesses on the bus said was "a wallet chain." I assumed one of the officers was hit and the situation had become out of hand because one went to unholster his sidearm. I made a mental note of this because I have never seen an officer pull his gun out in Canada before, and I knew it to be rare. The fight moved around to the back of the bus and I turned back to face the front. Then I heard a shot, then another several seconds later. I turned around in my seat, and saw clearly a struggling suspect unable to stand straight. An officer stood 25 feet away from him with his gun aimed at him. He shot several times with the shots fairly evenly spaced. It was clear that every shot he fired was coming from his gun, since I saw the recoil and flinch. As the suspect stumbled on his feet and writhed on the ground several more shots were fired. Since gunshots do not neccessarily hurt and immobilize, everybody was confused as to the type of weapon (ie. lethal or non-lethal), a man on board claimed that they were "rubber bullets", so most of the youngsters were not too perturbed, indeed many thought he had been shot with a TASER.

I turned back in my seat to face the front, disgusted at the scene, while the other passengers crowded in the aisle and leaned into the left hand seats to look out of the window. Then another shot. I turned around again. The next scene will live in our minds forever. The completely subdued and now dying man was sitting up on his knees, helpless and somehow strangely pathetic as he gently felt the area around his hips and abdomen as if confused as to what was happening. Several on the bus felt a pang of pity for this unknown, but plainly completely defenseless suspect, and several of the kids commented on the use of excessive force. The officer standing with the gun then shot him repeatedly and methodically. Only several of us knew the possibility of what was happening. It was a public execution, done brutally and inhumanely in front of many witnesses, many of whom were were young teenagers.

It is vital that if you were on this bus that your parents contact your local media and the RCMP, as this information is needed for an inquiry. Those on the bus may have a completely different take of the events, as the relative quiet would have allowed for a more accurate recollection of events. Ignore anyone that tells you that you should fear police reprisal. They are here to help you and make the city that you live in safer. If nobody does anything now, this will surely happen again and again. How can you change the world if you fear it? Only when we know the truth can we forgive this man who acted in anger that so many of us have towards each other. by J. Menzie - a brave person indeed

[BCVM22]

Neeeever mind. Usually when I make posts with lots of big words and commas people read them. Okay, sometimes when I make posts people read them. You appear to have neglected to do so in any case. I suppose I'll just inquire as to why you're posting all of this conspiracy nonsense here? You seem to have very little interest in the suspect, the only element of this story making it relevant to an animation board, and more interest in discrediting the Vancouver police without any actual proof to support your efforts.

[Dark Soul]

One more thing a man is dead so be it but where is the compassion for the many others who die everyday all over the world and are not even mentioned in the news or anywhere.

How about those souls who die everyday of starvation or being homless. These people are the people that don't count they are invisible. Just because your emotionally attached to this animator does not mean his death was a conspiracy to kill him.

Wheres the emotion for those other people who died on the same day as him who are not mentioned. People are going to die and sometimes its hard for us to understand and let go but we have to move on, all our lives will end some day we have to face that fact.

Im not degrading his existance but you treat him more than what he is.

[not blond]

I guess the death of a fellow animator/cartoonist means nothing to you lot. I never met the man, but I believe in the truth and in a better world. This forum was started to discuss his death and the tragic circumstances. Oh well have fun with your cartoons children.

[BCVM22]

I guess the death of a fellow animator/cartoonist means nothing to you lot. I never met the man, but I believe in the truth and in a better world. This forum was started to discuss his death and the tragic circumstances. Oh well have fun with your cartoons children.

That we disagree with you and have come up with logical counterparts to every one of your arguments doesn't make us fascists, Communists or anything of the sort. You'll find yourself positively alone in that notion. It also certainly doesn't make us children. I have a small hunch I'm older than you, personally. If you prefer discussions where everyone assumes authority is automatically out to suppress the truth and repress the innocent, I'm sure there's a Facebook group out there somewhere where you'll find hordes of anti-establishment individuals to concur with you.

Also, none of us are animators or cartoonists and therefore the suspect wouldn't be "fellow" to any of us.

[Tay the Cat]

The police killed an innocent man who was obviously not himself. That's not self-defense, that's murder.

The cops are lucky they're in Vancouver and not my city, that's all I have to say about this.

[Wonderwall]

The police killed an innocent man who was obviously not himself. That's not self-defense, that's murder.

The cops are lucky they're in Vancouver and not my city, that's all I have to say about this.

Actually it was self defense, read the article, he had a weapon, had assaulted 2 officers already, one of them seriously injured, he was coming towards them in a manner that seemed he was going to attack, the cops did not have weapons such as tasers at their disposal, and they could not have known that he had an illness. In Vancouver you'll see quite a number of people like that, usually they're drug addicts, maybe that had a hand to play in this, I don't know, Im not a cop and I wasn't there. What I do know is those actions seem to indicate that the man was dangerous, and the officers had to make a call. Is it murder, yea, was it in cold blood, absolutely not.

[Dark Soul]

Yup please read the article before you post lol.

And why would there be a conspiracy to kill a cartoonist, he has no political power or control over anything. Hes an innocent person trying to make a living. But the cops did have the right it was self defence after all.

[Tay the Cat]

Yup please read the article before you post lol.

1. I read the article clearly.

2. Why the heck are you going "lol" for? I'm being dead freaking serious.

[Draft]

I've read most of this topic and the article. I think the cops did have a right to shoot him, assuming they gave multiple warnings. If they knew he had the disorder, they should've tried to contain him(assuming they didn't try that) and if that didn't work, and he ttacked them(Whch he did), the cops can shoot on self-defense..

Heh, i tohught i would put the police at fault here, but i guess not..

[Simpler Simon]

Eyewitness account

Read through it. The account is skewed, but understandably so. I mean if I was there in the moment, watching Mr. Boyd being shot (and I have never, ever seen anyone shot), I'd probably describe events the same way.

The point being missed (and this is for everyone who reads the account) is that in shooting the way the eyewitness described, the cops did their job exactly the way they've been trained to and are supposed to. Once the final decision was made, the cops brought the suspect down with the first few shots, then went in and fired the next few to make sure he stayed down. This isn't about brutality or public executions, it's about making sure a dangerous suspect does not get up and harm other people. Because it's been known to happen. And again, until we know otherwise, the police did not know who Mr. Boyd was or his condition.

I'm sure if theres anything to uncover the police reports and investigation will do so (because incidents of police brutality have been noted and investigated in the past). But even from the tone of the initial article, there doesn't seem to be a public outcry so much as public mourning for unfortunate circumstances.

[Dark Fact]

Cops are trained to shoot the body, this isnt a video game, hitting the shoulder is more difficult than shooting the chest. And thats still going against logic, how are they supposed to wait for another cop to come deliver a taser while a guy's attacking them, its not feesible, the police station is too far from Granville St.( which is where he was shot ) for that to happen, and the guy isnt going to wait there for them to get a taser.
This isn't a video game, but cops have to work with training simulators and the firing range all the time. It's important that they have to hit all areas of interest that can immobilize the suspect before they deem it necessary to hit his vitals. You also said that he was a big man too. Wouldn't it been easier for the cops to shoot him in areas of interest that could've immobilized him?

All police need is "the belief of a dangerous weapon" and they can shoot to kill. They carry hollow points, even a shoulder wound will never heal properly. And the basic truth is, a story of "necessary force" is always easier to shove through when the other witness is dead.
I have a story to tell you here concerning something like this. Last year, in Winnipeg, an aboriginal man named Matthew Dumas was involved in a standoff with police. When he refused to comply with police orders, he pulled out a screwdriver and tried to attack the arresting officer. As a result, police considered the screwdriver as a "dangerous weapon" and shot him dead on the spot. The family of Dumas believed the officer's acted in aggression and not in self-defence as they claimed and have been seeking justice ever since, making the argument that he should've been restrained instead of killed.

The point is what truly defines the belief of a dangerous weapon? Could it be anything from a chain to a screwdriver? I'll be shocked when the day comes that a cop had to shoot a man dead because he was threatened with a potato peeler.

[not blond]

it is a sad sad day when a good person loses their life for no good reason. These police weren't under threat. Where were the mental health experts? That anyone thinks the police's actions were justified tells me how completely people have allowed themselves to be subsumed into a nanny state - let the cops take care of everything, trust authority and never question the official account. Hmmmm - so much for a free state.

but in the end, one can only feel grief.

[Dark Fact]

Just another question: How many officers were at the scene of the standoff at the time?

[Ed Liu]

I really hate to have to bring this up in the wake of this tragedy, but...


This isn't a video game, but cops have to work with training simulators and the firing range all the time. It's important that they have to hit all areas of interest that can immobilize the suspect before they deem it necessary to hit his vitals. You also said that he was a big man too. Wouldn't it been easier for the cops to shoot him in areas of interest that could've immobilized him?

Police officers don't shoot to incapacitate. Ever. There is simply no good way to do it (and, despite what their detractors may think, it is not because police forces haven't spent any time trying to figure it out). Either the shot may not incapacitate as well as you might think, or the shot can turn out to be lethal anyway. Any discussion that's predicated on "why didn't they shoot to wound?" is a non-starter because it's just not possible in any kind of practical way.

This is also why lots of cops (but, apparently, not the Vancouver PD) carry nightsticks, tasers, and pepper spray. None of them are 100% effective, either, but they're more than a fist and less than a gun.

-- Ed

[Dee]

Okay.

This is a very tough discussion topic, as something very serious has happened. When posting, we need to keep in mind that this is a serious discussion-- not a place for political rants or bickering. It's a current event and more information will surface concerning this incident.

If this turns into a political mess with fighting back and forth, I will issue warnings and if need be, close this thread. I don't want to close it, so please stick to discussing this topic in a respectful manner.

[Wonderwall]

Just another question: How many officers were at the scene of the standoff at the time?

2 initially, cops were called when someone reported that there was a suspicious looking individual with what looked to be a weapon. They arrived, told the man to put down whatever he had, he did, but as they got closer he took out the chain and hit both of them, knocking one of them out. Shortly 3 more came onto the scene, shortly after that he was shot after approaching them in a violent manner.

[Dee]

I can only imagine how harrowing the scene was, but I can understand how it quickly escalated from being a simple call about a suspicious individual, from whats being described.

[Tay the Cat]

Police officers don't shoot to incapacitate. Ever.
Tell that to the Phoenix Police Department, and you'll get laughed at.

Our cops use rubber bullets as a first step, which, if fired effectively (and our cops are VERY effective at using them), can knock even a very strong man down with one shot without doing harm.

In the rare case that rubber bullets don't work, then the taser comes in. 99 percent of all cases don't get past this point, thank goodness.

The Vancouver PD could've used rubber bullets on him and they would've worked. That's all I'm saying, really.

[BCVM22]

And if the Vancouver PD doesn't employ rubber bullets for whatever reason? Would you suggest they perhaps run to the police superstore and buy a few boxes whilst a suspect is wielding a weapon and at large? No one here has any proof that the VPD had other measures on the scene and readily available and chose not to employ them. No proof. None whatsoever. People continue to say "Well, if I were a police officer, I'd have..." and "Well, if I were on the scene, I would have..." while neglecting the fact that they aren't and they weren't.

[Tay the Cat]

People continue to say "Well, if I were a police officer, I'd have..." and "Well, if I were on the scene, I would have..." while neglecting the fact that they aren't and they weren't.

I'M NOT NEGLECTING ANYTHING!

I'm just saying what goes on down here and that if it was employed in that situation, a life would be saved.

[Dark Soul]

I'M NOT NEGLECTING ANYTHING!

I'm just saying what goes on down here and that if it was employed in that situation, a life would be saved.
How can you be so sure of yourself. Look if a man is a danger and a threat to the people around it was every right for the police to take him down. He had already injured 2 police officers seriously. And there were repeated warnings to put the weapon down and he did not. Police officers are trained to shoot to kill nothing less.

If you go in everytime thinking you can save a life you only put your fellow colleagues in danger. I do not mean to be harsh but what you are saying is hard to go by. :shrug:

[not blond]

The police weren't injured seriously. Again - I guess in the new world order never question authority, accept the official story and assume anyone who is harmed or killed by authorities deserved it. What a sad state of society. I guess the nanny state has completely taken over. Whatever you do, don't think for yourself.

Police are required to protect themselves - but there is no reason to believe that there were under the degree of threat to provoke the killing of Boyd. I watched an A&E program where a 120 lb police woman disarmed a mentally unstable man with a knife. If what happened to Paul Boyd is okay with you all, then I pray that none of your family ever suffer a mental illness or have a bout of depression.

rest in peace Paul Boyd and perhaps your death will finally lead to some major changes with the VPD - not the least of all that the police no longer get to investigate themselves (sort of like in North Korea or China or some other communist or dictatorship). Or that there is a policy of intervention before killing a mentally unstable man armed with bike chain.

[Dark Soul]

Again with your political conspiracys that we dont want to hear. Stop dissing us because we dont agree with you. Look I'm kind of tired of going through the same nonsence over and over. I'm not being mean I'm just telling the truth. :shrug:

Edit: Again how would the police know he was mentally they aren't psychic you know.

[Tay the Cat]

Again with your political conspiracys that we dont want to hear. Stop dissing us because we dont agree with you. Look I'm kind of tired of going through the same nonsence over and over. I'm not being mean I'm just telling the truth. :shrug:

I personally don't see any political conspiracy being implied, but that's just me.

[BCVM22]

I personally don't see any political conspiracy being implied, but that's just me.

Perhaps "conspiracy" is the wrong term, but I imagine it's in reference to the deluge of posts proclaiming beyond a shadow of a doubt that the officers involved made wanton use of excessive, deadly force despite the lack of evidence for such, and furthermore labeling those of us who don't buy into such baseless accusations as Communists and the like. Certainly you can see all that, yes?

[Dee]

Come on--- it's headed back in the direction I asked everyone to stay away from and it needs to stop.

[maczero]

This is the talkback thread for Vancouver Animator Paul Boyd Shot and Killed by Police (http://news.toonzone.net/article.php?ID=18523).

Oh God, again with the deaths? Rest In Peace.Has there been a rash of animation related deaths recently?

As for this story, it's really sad. I don't feel comfortable judging the actions of the police, but hopefully there will be something they can learn from this to avoid similar situations in the future.