The Simpsons- which way does it lean?

[HellCat]

Yet another Simpsons thread, but this time with a bit more depth.
Looking over the show's entry at Jump The Shark, I noticed alot of votes for G.I. D'oh. The reasoning listed was that the show was now helmed by 'insulting bleeding heart liberals'. This got me to wondering where the writers stood. In the early days, the show felt specifically left. The show had pride in it's national roots but more so on the whole 'American dream' idea (freedom and democracy for all, etc). During the decline it seemed to go more to the right. I don't want to make this thread too taboo but I never cared for that "You might say I'm Iraqi" "Get off my property!!" joke for instance. Right now though it's definetly on a heavy handed left side. The Day The Earth Stood Stupid and Homer's rant about military quagmires prove that.

[ElBarto]

I think Greoning is pretty religious (god has 5 fingers in the show saying that he is real) so it is probably more republican. I dunno.

[The Myst]

I think Greoning is pretty religious (god has 5 fingers in the show saying that he is real) so it is probably more republican. I dunno.
Groening has had little to do with the show in years. He probably didn't even see the script for "GI D'oh".

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Groening has had little to do with the show in years. He probably didn't even see the script for "GI D'oh".

True.

Matt Groening by the way is DEFINITELY NO Republican. At the very least, he has always been VEHEMENTLY against the Bush administration. How do I know? Almost half his "Life in Hell" strips the past 5 years have been bashing the Bush administration.

[SirLemming]

I don't want to make this thread too taboo but I never cared for that "You might say I'm Iraqi" "Get off my property!!" joke for instance.
Why? It's just Homer being stupid.

This thread is EXTREMELY dangerous, so I assume it'll have to be closed some time soon, but for now it's just a discussion of what we think the show's creators believe and not what we believe, so... I think the show has always been "on the left side" of things. That's not to say it's been a total leftie love-fest like some other shows. But the way it satirizes religion and tradition and stuff, and doesn't really condemn stuff like alcohol and extramarital sex (inherently), and generally seems to value characters who promote diversity and all that, strikes me as being left, even if it's just the tiniest bit left of the midpoint.

The show has had some good things to say about religion (especially in early episodes like "Bart Gets An F"), and about other traditional ideas. But it always seems to be coming from the position that assumes something could be wrong with all that. It's still moderate, but I see it as usually coming from the left side to make its compromises.

Lately it has definitely taken on a more leftward slant, as I'm sure I don't have to bother explaining. Most of you have been keeping up with that in the talkbacks. But we also have to remember episodes like "Sideshow Bob Roberts", which was pretty hard on conservative talk shows hosts and Republican candidates. Then again, we should also remember "Black Widower", where Sideshow Bob yelled "You can't keep the Democrats out of the White House forever! And then I'll be back on the streets, with all my criminal buddies!" And of course there was that Jockey episode that ended with a not-too-subtle criticism of Bill Clinton. You don't have to be conservative to criticize Bill Clinton, but it still shows signs of moderateness.

So I think it's fairly safe to say that the writers of the show are probably on the left side of things, although clearly some of them are more left than others.


It's also fairly safe to say that nobody, in the world, is all the way on one side or the other.

[HellCat]

Why? It's just Homer being stupid.


For me, Homer's personal decline is marked towards him becoming more of a stupid hick, the kind of ignorant American those of us on the net are constantly rolling our eyes and shaking our heads at. I already said I don't want to take this thread too far but a comment like that in current political times doesn't sit well with me for what it says about where they've taken him.

[FinnMacCool]

I think that, while the Simpsons usually leans to the liberal side, whatever they promote usually has a counterpoint within the episode. For example, in "Fraudcast News," while it was basically a whole episode comdemning big media conglomerates and praising the independent press, it did have a couple moments that swung the other way. First there's when Mr. Burns and Lisa are stuck together waiting for Lisa's ride to come, and Lisa's liberal activism gets a slam when Mr. Burns asks, "So, what do you think of today's popular music scene." Lisa responds, "I think it distracts people from more important social issues." Mr. Burns: "My God, are you always on?" Then, at the end of the episode when everyone in Springfield starts printing their own newspapers, thus breaking Burns's media stranglehold, most of the papers are shown to cover very stupid topics, and Homer says, "See, honey? Instead of one big shot controlling all the media, now there are a thousand freaks out there xeroxing their worthless opinions." To which Lisa replies, "I couldn't be prouder."

That's just one episode, granted, but I think the point stands that, however preachy the Simpsons may get about an issue, they are usually smart enough to recognize and lampoon the flaws in their own argument.

[MGFanJay]

On DVD commentaries, Matt has acted as if he's an athiest, so I doubt he's all that reilgious.

[Don_East]

Personally, I always thought in "Fraudcast News" that Lisa is suppose to represent the "small" Liberal media and Mr. Burn's empire represents the big bad "Republican Noise Machine". Albeit that Liberal media is comprised of 3 news channel, 3 nightly network broadcast news programs, most major newspapers, and most comedy shows since the mid-90s. While the Republicans are comprised of the Fox Newschannel, & most of talk radio. They make potshots at FNC, like the beginning of "She Use To Be My Girl" has a FNC truck that has a giant Bush '04 sign and "We Are The Champions" by Queen is playing. And of course there's the infamous scene in "Mr. Spritz Goes To Washington" when they did a depicted as the cliche right-wing propaganda.

In short, anyshow that shows the Republican Party Headquarters as Dracula's castle cannot even be moderate.



[Don_East]

[Peter Paltridge]

In short, anyshow that shows the Republican Party Headquarters as Dracula's castle cannot even be moderate.
Nail hit, topic won, the end.

[Juu-kuchi]

Why? It's just Homer being stupid.
... and so on and so forth. Don't forget Stampy's little stampede through both Republican and Democratic conventions in "Bart Gets an Elephant". It's notable if it has these lines on its banners:

Republican:
- We want what's worst for everyone
- We're just plain evil

Democrat:
- We hate life and ourselves
- We can't govern

I've always thought that the show had a lean to the left side (although it's more pronounced than ever), but not enough that we wouldn't get such statements like the ones above for both parties.

[Scythemantis]

I'm a hardcore leftist, darwinist, and environmentalist. I can say that the Simpsons is distinctly biased towards my world view...but I can also say that it hasn't handled any of it with any semblance of intelligence for at least three seasons. I can't even sit through the evolution/creationism episode...it was pathetic.



I think Greoning is pretty religious (god has 5 fingers in the show saying that he is real) so it is probably more republican. I dunno.
Groening is completely nonreligious, only wrote a fraction of the episodes anyway, and God having five fingers was nothing but a cute sight-gag. It's not supposed to mean he's real, just that an all-powerful supreme being would have an extra finger (like when lisa showed bart that man would eventually evolve a five-fingered hand. Bart: "Five fingers? Freakshow!")

[FinnMacCool]

Yes, Republicans are portrayed as villainous masterminds, but the Democrats are portrayed as drunk, stupid, and corrupt womanizers (Mayor Quimby, who is by far the most frequently appearing politician on the show, is a big Kennedy and Clinton parody). I'm not saying that the Simpsons doesn't lean left, but they do have stretches of moderation. In the same "Sideshow Bob Roberts" episode where the Republicans were shown meeting in Dracula's castle, the Democratic Mayor Quimby was portrayed as a bumbling fool who easily caves into public demands, and, when Lisa is campaigning for Quimby, the best argument she can make is, "This time he's the lesser of two evils!"

[USSManhattan]

I think Greoning is pretty religious (god has 5 fingers in the show saying that he is real) so it is probably more republican. I dunno.

Matt's agnostic.

[Lutochris]

"In Marge we Trust" has Marge restoring Reverend Lovejoy's faith in his church.

"Lisa the Skeptic" ends with Lisa being brought down a peg by Marge after Marge admits she believes in angels.

"The Father, the Son, and the Holy Guest Star" ends with Bart talking about how Christians shouldn't get caught up in the petty differences between denominations.

And of course who could forget "Homer the Heretic", which ended with Rev. Lovejoy saying that God was working in the hearts of Homer's friends and neighbors.

So basically, while they might be overall leaning slightly to the left, they are by no means ignorant or arrogant towards the other side, and in fact are very respectful most of the time. And honestly it doesn't even come up often enough for me to really take notice. The only time I thought they went a little overboard with it was in "Bart-Mangled Banner", which just layed it on way too thick. But the episode was so funny I forgave it.

[SirLemming]

But the "left" can be religious too. I should know. I go to Messiah College. Affirming god/religion isn't necessarily a lean to the right, although it somewhat proves that they're not 100% leftist. Like, communists.

[Zorak Masaki]

Exactly, its almost like Mad Magazine/SNL where they basically satirize whoevers currently in power, no matter whose side theyre on.

[Classic Speedy]

Whoever's writing the episode.

[Scythemantis]

"In Marge we Trust" has Marge restoring Reverend Lovejoy's faith in his church.

"Lisa the Skeptic" ends with Lisa being brought down a peg by Marge after Marge admits she believes in angels.

"The Father, the Son, and the Holy Guest Star" ends with Bart talking about how Christians shouldn't get caught up in the petty differences between denominations.

And of course who could forget "Homer the Heretic", which ended with Rev. Lovejoy saying that God was working in the hearts of Homer's friends and neighbors.

So basically, while they might be overall leaning slightly to the left, they are by no means ignorant or arrogant towards the other side, and in fact are very respectful most of the time.

Eh? Those are all either completely neutral examples or still pretty liberal. Respect for religion has nothing to do with the right or the left in particular, and conservatives are only slightly more likely to believe in God.

[stephane dumas]

I wondered if the presence of South Park laughing mainly laughing of Hollywood stars, might had an influence on the path then the Simpsons taked recently?

[Lutochris]

Eh? Those are all either completely neutral examples or still pretty liberal. Respect for religion has nothing to do with the right or the left in particular, and conservatives are only slightly more likely to believe in God.

I was trying to make the point that, while they're overall liberal, they don't overdo it, and they're not self-righteous about it. Like how Lisa was self-righteous when she was berating everyone for believing in angels, and she couldn't believe that her mother, a person she respected, would also believe in angels. Then Marge called her out for squeezing her hand when the angel started to speak.