Any one with questions on the EARLY MGM toons, read on...

[Sogturtle]

Hey Gang~

Anybody with any interests or questions on the EARLY MGM cartoons, please submit some questions here!!!

Why??? I have a RARE opportunity to get some of them answered first hand by one of the few surviving early MGM animators!!! (NO don't try to guess who it is ). Just received emails from his family about it... I have some of my questions already but will be happy to consider whatever... Any takers???

P.S. This gentleman also worked at the early Columbia/Mintz Screen Gems studio... So questions on it would also be in order...

[Matthew Hunter]

If referring to the earliest ones:

1. Why was Bosko changed from inkspot to black boy?
2. Are there any cartoons that are mis-credited to the wrong director?
-Matthew

[Cyclops]

Did Tom's original owner ( the black woman) have a real name? :yakko: :wakko: :dot:

[Sogturtle]

Originally posted by Matthew Hunter
If referring to the earliest ones:

1. Why was Bosko changed from inkspot to black boy?
2. Are there any cartoons that are mis-credited to the wrong director?
-Matthew

The Turtle speaks...

Have never nailed down how early this gentleman joined the employ of MGM. He definitely worked for MGM from '37 to the early 40's so was under Hugh and Rudy and might know the story about Bosko...

[J Lee]

1937-40 eh? Tim, ask him if he remembers whether or not Friz started work on a few of those Harman cartoons from late 1939-40 that we've talked about in the past before he head back to the sanctuary of Leon's studio.

[Pietro]

Did he work on the Toby the Pup cartoons? I'd like to hear what scenes he animated if he animated that series. And did he work on Scrappy? Also, did he ever work at Fleischer, WB, or Ub Iwerks? What did he do after 1940? And most importantly, did he ever work on the Milt Gross cartoons when he was at MGM?

-Pietro:D

[David Gerstein]

:bosko: Hey Tim!

Questions about Columbia and early MGM? Here's a few:

1) As of right now, I'm under the belief that Columbia stopped using a Herriman-inspired Krazy Kat in roughly 1930 (the year that Krazy was redesigned as a male cat and first began to appear with a girl costar). Later, in 1936, one more Herriman-inspired Krazy was made: LI'L AINJIL.
The issue at hand: were any *more* done Herriman-inspired Krazys done during the sound era?

2) The Columbia Barney Google series was announced as consisting of ten cartoons. They were apparently successful, but the series prematurely ended at four or five films (I don't have a reference handy to quote the exact number offhand). Why?

3) Why didn't Harman and Ising make more Bosko cartoons (featuring either version of Bosko) at MGM? Bosko was a popular, merchandised character at the time. Why not take more advantage of that?

[Sogturtle]

J. Lee and Pietro et al~

I will do my best to ask this gentleman every question possible. He also worked at the Van Buren studio and at Harman-Ising (unsure yet if in the Warner or MGM era). His time for Mintz/Screen Gems was while Dick Huemer was still there though. (Huemer went on permanent strike in 1933).

I spoke with this gentleman's daughter late this afternoon. She told me that he has a superb long-term memory and loves to talk about the old days...!!! Just imagine guys... He worked for or with Friz Freleng, Art Davis, Bill Hanna, Rudy Ising, Joe Barbera, Sid Marcus, Hugh Harman, Dick Huemer, probably also earlier for Jim Tyer and then Burt Gillett!!!!

John, I recently uncovered evidence about ONE of our 'disputed authorship' MGM cartoons. As far as we've ever known the MGM animation units were pretty firmly set as far as animators (set by the return of Hugh and Rudy). Welllllll, it seems that "Mad Maestro" though credited to Hugh Harman, features animation by one of Rudy Ising's regular top animators !!! Keep in mind that "Mad Maestro" was released at the very same time as Harman's time-intensive masterpiece "Peace On Earth", and Hugh was VERRRRRRRY BAD at making cartoons back-to-back. Sooooo with this new little nugget of info, the notion of Hugh directing "Mad Maestro" weakens even more.

And by the way John, this particular animator was still at Metro for a while after Tex Avery came!!

And to David Gerstein... There were four Barney Google cartoons. These remain the single hardest Mintz/Columbia cartoons to track down in original (sound & color) versions. I've gotten 16mm silent b &w versions of most of them, though some were edited down to make more than four cartoons!! Art Davis and Sid Marcus immediately returned to directing regular Color Rhapsodies with the premature end of Barney Google (Van Buren similarly ended the "Amos And Andy" series abruptly and with no real explanation. I'm not sure precisely when this man was at Mintz and when he was at Van Buren. But I will seek answers...

And I know of only the one sound Herriman-derived Krazy Kat ("L'il Anjil"). Manny Gould would have been the one to have asked that question of though. But I will try to put the question to this gentleman...

[J Lee]

Almost forgot...

On the subject of disputed authorship, aske him if he remembers which unit(s) did the two color Captain and the Kids cartoons, particularly "Petunia Natural Park." The spot gags in that one have so much more of a lighter touch than anything else MGM was cranking out at the time (or would again until Avery started doing his spot gaggers in the late 40s), I always assumed it was from Freleng's unit, so I'd really be surprised if the Hanna or Allen units turned it out.

[Sogturtle]

Originally posted by J Lee
Almost forgot...

On the subject of disputed authorship, aske him if he remembers which unit(s) did the two color Captain and the Kids cartoons, particularly "Petunia Natural Park." The spot gags in that one have so much more of a lighter touch than anything else MGM was cranking out at the time (or would again until Avery started doing his spot gaggers in the late 40s), I always assumed it was from Freleng's unit, so I'd really be surprised if the Hanna or Allen units turned it out.

John~

The entire "Captain and the Kids" area is a major point for me to ask him about, ditto for the "Count Screwloose" cartoons, and those mystery MGM toons of 1939-43. The two color Captain cartoons though were (to my knowledge) made just after Charlie Thorsen torpedoed the directing careers of Bob Allen and Bill Hanna. Process of elimination leaves us with Friz or newly crowned director George Gordon (who had a LOT of directing experience at Terrytoons). I tend to agree with you though about "Petunia..." being a part of Freleng's oeuvre rather than George Gordon's.

[Matt Yorston]

Actually, Milt Gross (director of the 2 Count Screwloose cartoons) directed "Petunia Natural Park".

[Sogturtle]

Originally posted by Matt Yorston
Actually, Milt Gross (director of the 2 Count Screwloose cartoons) directed "Petunia Natural Park".

Matt Yorston~

That has been believed by some... Buuuuut Milt Gross was a strip-cartoonist, whose ONLY experience in animation had been twenty years before in silent cartoons. He had NO training or skill in sound cartoon Direction . His function at MGM was as studio-head (under Quimby)and head storyman. And this aspect held true for his sole cartoon at Columbia where again he was only a writer ("He Can't Make It Stick"). Charlie Thorsen submitted a letter to Fred Quimby effectively sabotaging Allen and Hanna, and recommended George Gordon (or even, Joe Barbera or Jack Zander) for the directorial jobs. Under Milt Gross the choice was made to make George Gordon the replacement director... When Hugh and Rudy returned, Gordon went back to the animation fold.

And Friz??? He went on receiving his very hefty full salary as director EVEN AFTER Harman and Ising returned. In fact his salary was only a few dollars less than that of "Producer-Directors" Ising and Harman.

Having said all this, nonetheless I will definitely ask about these cartoons in a specific manner to hopefully resolve the issue for all.