Ra's in TNBA

[The Game]

I was just thinking... Ra's Al Ghul never actually appeared in TNBA, right?

But at the TNBA website, Ra's, Talia, and Ube are all featured, and there are screenshots of them in their TNBA style...

What's going on? Were there ever plans to bring them in? What happened?

[The Penguin]

Ra's appeared in an episode of STAS although I can't remember the title off hand. Certainly if TNBA had lasted longer, he probably would have appeared there too.

I'm sure you could find some info on the episode on the World's Finest page.

[Joe Tully]

There was the appearance by Ra's and Talia in The Demon Reborn, which was a Superman episode that guest-starred Batman. I'm guessing that's where the designs are from.

[Bird Boy]

Originally posted by The Penguin
Ra's appeared in an episode of STAS although I can't remember the title off hand. Certainly if TNBA had lasted longer, he probably would have appeared there too.

I'm sure you could find some info on the episode on the World's Finest page.

"The Demon Reborn" was Batman/Superman crossover episode..one of which was held back just like "Unmasked" was.

Here are some screens of Talia and Ra's:

http://www.toonzone.net/worldsfinest/morewfepisodes/dr1.jpg
http://www.toonzone.net/worldsfinest/morewfepisodes/dr5.jpg
http://www.toonzone.net/worldsfinest/morewfepisodes/dr8.jpg

For the full Review on The Worlds Finest..click here (http://www.toonzone.net/worldsfinest/morewfepisodes/sup_demonreborn.htm)

-BB

[Karkull]

Did anyone like that episode? I thought that it was terrible.

[James Harvey]

The episode was mediocre at best. The animation was consistenly off with Batman constantly changing shape. The episode definatly needed to be a two parte rlike it was originally supposed to be.

[Trent Lane]

I thought it was a good episode, it did need to be a little longer tho. I thought the animation was pretty awesome, especially the scene in the hanger... that was some great stuff. It would've been intresting to see Ra's in a strictly TNBA episode, just get the original Talia back... that new voice was grating on my nerves...

[Joe Tully]

For me, it was a huge letdown. World's Finest was an excellent example of a Batman/Superman team-up, and then we got Demon Reborn. It has Batman and Ra's--the makings of a really great story--and instead it was just junk.

[James Harvey]

The voice of Talia was another letdown. The original Talia voice was excellent. Perfect, actually. This new ones seemed to lack all emotion whatsoever. And this was a dissapointign Ra's story. His stories alwyas manage to be very enjoyable and well done. This one was considerably rushed.

[The Game]

Thanks for all the info.

I was going by the episode guide so I was confused.

So it wasn't any good? Ah, too bad.

[DisneyBoy]

"The Demon Reborn" was a very well done episode. To pick on small things like the size of Batman's ears is to miss what the episode really had to offer. It finally addressed Ra's seemingly unending immortality, brought a little more closure to the rather quickly resolved Bruce/Lois romance from World's Finest and it also provided us with a look into Ra's past. As for the uneven animation, I found World's Finest to be much less asthetically pleasing than this episode. The art in that first team up reminded me alot of Joe Staton's chubby characters from the comics, which was a serious disappointment considering how great the storyline was. Oh, and the new Talia voice is different, but it works in it's own way. True, the whole "staff" thing was a little unrealistic, but this episode had so many golden moments that I found myself rewatching it over and over...

I really hope you see this episode for yourself and tell us what you think. When I first saw it I was very much blown away by the action and revelations in "The Demon Reborn", but then again, I went into it not knowing what the episode was about. Perhaps going into anything with expectations is what will ultimately let viewers down, so I hope you see it without thinking about too many of the things you've heard. I don't think you will be disappointed.

Athough DG did make a good point - that episode came off a little rushed - I don't think I could picture it as a two-parter. There was just enough to fill the 22 minutes, but I couldn't see it being much longer than that without simply dragging out the story. Oh, in my opinion, the worst Ra's Al Ghul story, besides those in the comics (the final UFO issue of The Batman and Robin Adventures and that terrible story Peterson whipped together some twenty issues ago in Gotham Adventures), was "Showdown". The animation was abhorent and the story uninteresting. "The Demon Reborn is much, much better!

[Golden Age Flash]

I also liked the episode. It was cool seeing superman getting taken out or Ras and company.

[Tim Drake]

It was ok. But definitely rushed.

[Cyclops]

I liked this episode myself. :yakko: :wakko: :dot:

[thanos28542]

To this day I have never seen" night of the demon","Legacy", "Fish story" "In brightest light", "absolute power", & the one with Supergirl helping Superman against some alien invaders.Oh the agonyyyyyyyyy! :(

[Cassandra]

Hmm, this seems to be one of the few TNBA episodes I missed. I thought the only Superman/ Batman crossovers were Worlds Finest and Knight Time. There aren't any more of them, are there?

[Toddman]

Originally posted by Cassandra
Hmm, this seems to be one of the few TNBA episodes I missed. I thought the only Superman/ Batman crossovers were Worlds Finest and Knight Time. There aren't any more of them, are there?

That's it, unless you count "Girl's Night Out," with Batgirl and Supergirl.

Toddman

[The Mad Hatter]

I thought the episode was just mediocre. Not only was it rushed, but it didn't really have that feeling a team-up whose potential is fully maximized and manipulated expertly like in World's Finest and Knight Time... here it just felt like two guys in tights who get together. Maybe it would have worked a lot better as a two-parter...

[Heehaw]

The animation was bad...very bad, the voice acting seemed off, and Talia's voice left a sour taste in my mouth. The Batmobile's appearance on the railroad track, which was probably a few dozen feet above the ground, was just brilliant. The story was just plain ridiculous, as well. I could have done without the whole staff storyline...meaning the entire episode. Al Ghul doing a cheap Bane was the last straw. Gotta love Bats growing ears, though. It was a precursor to JL.

It's definitely the worst of the 3 crossover stories. Knight Time wasn't much better, though it had it's moments.

[Clayface]

I'd say DisneyBoy summed it up best for me. I enjoyed the episode very much, but found it a bit rushed. Well worth seeing though, in my opinion.

[DisneyBoy]

On that note, heehaw, I must disagree too! :p


I found Knight Time to be a very interesting episode with tonnes of great moments and a wonderful, well-explained plot.

Just wondering here, but I seem to be getting the impression that most of you guys don't enjoy Batman Superman team-ups unless they directly interact during the course of the story. Am I right?

What has lead me to this conclusion:

- You all enjoyed World's Finest, which pretty much focused on Supes and Batman meeting each other, fighting alongside on another, and arguing with each other. Basically, a lot of interaction....


But you didn't enjoy "The Demon Reborn" or "Knight Time", two stories both involving minimal Superman/Clark Batman/Bruce interaction since the plot revolves around one hero rescuing the other.

Thoughts.....?

[James Harvey]

The episode is worth seeing, yes, it's just not one of the better episodes. I thought Knight Time was good becuase it was basically Superman spoofing Batman - and it was done good. This is exactly how Superman probably sees Batman. Plus the interaction between Robin and Superman was great. The Demon Reborn, though, was a follow-by-numbers plot with some ridiculous things thrown in for good measure. Some of the stuff didn't make sense (the whole rig they had set up for the staff) and the interaction between the two seemed forced. Granted, Ra's did show his age, which was a good touch, but it just lacked the magic the first two had. If it was the two parter is was supposed to be - it would have been better. There was a lot of information that could have been provided. The short "the staff is rumored to possess mystical powers" just doesn't do it for me as an explaination. And the animation...? Ugh....

[DisneyBoy]

The staff thing was totally wacked out!




(grumbles) but i liked the animation..so there! ;)

[Maxie Zeus]

I thought (http://www.scrye.com/~jallman/anbat/tnba/ind/demonreborn.html) it was basically a STAS episode, with Bats and Ras thrown in. Now, I like STAS, but a lot of them are (like DG said about this one) paint-by-numbers action stories. Me, I'm more disappointed by "Demon Reborn" than I am dismissive of it, because with these three great characters there is a lot of potential for good juicy character interaction. And there wasn't.

[The Mad Hatter]

Exactly, the contrast between the two heroes' styles was what was missing. World's Finest had it in spades, of course, and in Knight Time, Superman had to learn how to be as dark an analytical as Batman. I don't expect Batman and Superman to butt heads each time they come together, but I didn't feel like their characters were used well at all.

[Heehaw]

Another plus, a HUGE one, for World's Finest popularity is the fact that it is just beautifully animated. Those 3 episodes are some of the best out of all of the Timm series. The story, acting, and editing were all well done, and there were some great funny lines thrown in as well. None of it seemed forced, and when you get right down to it, the whole thing almost felt like a feature.

As for Knight Time, I enjoyed the mimicry aspects and everything with Robin, but I didn't like the first couple of minutes because I hate Roxy Rocket and the third act ruined it for me, though I can't put my finger on why. Maybe it was the animation and the way Supes was drawn. He just looked strange in that episode.

[optimal321]

One thing i didn't like about Knight Time was that a lot of the times, while in costume, Superman looked too much like Batman. His chin was just too angular and blocky sometimes.

And Demon Reborn was okay. I don't really remember it standing out as really good or really bad, so it was just a decent ep.

[dc_gothamite]

World's Finest & Knight Time were kewl for me... but Demon Reborn was a too rushed... what I really enjoyed was Lois and Batman's meeting and Batman & Superman's little chat at the end...

n/e way, pairing up Batman and Superman is just like pairing Mel Gibson & Danny Glover in "Leathal Weapon," and pairing Jackie Chan & Chris Tucker in "Rush Hour" (awesome movie IMO. part 2 as well). The interaction between the two big guns is your basic "buddy" plot. I think what really appealed to me about "World's Finest" and a little bit of "Knight Time," was how the two "buddies" played off each other. One guy want his own way, and the other wants his own way. In "Knight Time," the situation was kind of tooled with, since Superman, humorously, got to see what kind of evil Batman finds, and how he works around his methods. "World's Finest" is slightly different from "Lethal Weapon" and "Rush Hour," because Batman and Superman's chemistry on screen (and in the comics) all come from a more serious manner, wheras Riggs & Murtoch, and Lee & Carter come from more comedic manners.

IMO, when you see a pairing of completely different characters, the biggest appeal probably comes from the chemistry that the two characters have when they appear together. Even with action flicks like the "Lethal Weapon" and "Rush Hour" series, most of the time, it's not COMPELETELY focused on the action, but more on the interactions with their main characters.

Batman and Superman are both crime-fighters, and try to uphold justice in their own special way, so of course you need action there as well. "World's Finest" had its share of nice, soothing action. But I like the episode/movie because of their chemistry on screen. The two, obviously, aren't that fond of each other, but they do trust each other. I think THAT is what most people want to see in a "buddy" situation. Especially with icons such as Batman and Superman in the center of it all. In their case, the producers should balance top-notch action, a decent, believable plot, and of course, CHEMISTRY between the two characters. "World's Finest" did that, and so did "Knight Time" sort of. But "Demon Reborn" didn't do that much. Just because they know each other already, doesn't mean the sparks should stop flying. They should continue throughout each and every adventure.

I'm done...

[Golden Age Flash]

Originally posted by dc_gothamite
what I really enjoyed was Lois and Batman's meeting and Batman & Superman's little chat at the end...

I totally agree. It seems like the best scenes are always the non-action scenes where Batman and Superman just talk. They always seem to really be well thought out with clever dialog.

[James Harvey]

The best part, though it could have been longer, is the Batamn/Lois part. I really liked the interaction between the two. She knows his secret and it's just a great sub plot that they should have addressed in Superman Adventures or even Gotham Adventures. I would like to see this explored more, for sure.

[Golden Age Flash]

Originally posted by Dick Grayson
The best part, though it could have been longer, is the Batamn/Lois part. I really liked the interaction between the two. She knows his secret and it's just a great sub plot that they should have addressed in Superman Adventures or even Gotham Adventures. I would like to see this explored more, for sure.


It was a pretty cool twist on the typical Lois/Clark relationship thing. I'm gonna have to go rewatch the episode now!