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http://www.superherohype.com/news.php?id=3472



Joss Whedon on Wonder Woman
Source: Superhero Hype!
September 12, 2005


Australia's ABC Radio National talked to "Buffy the Vampire Slayer (http://www.superherohype.com/news.php?id=3472#)," "Angel" and "Firefly" creator Joss Whedon about his upcoming film (http://www.superherohype.com/news.php?id=3472#) version of the latter, "Serenity". He also talked about his next project, the Wonder Woman movie (http://www.superherohype.com/news.php?id=3472#).

"We'll meet a Wonder Woman who is similar to the one from the original comics and from the TV series to an extent," said Whedon. "Neither of them are really a template. I've never loved the comics and I didn't watch the television series, but I loved the character very much."

He added that "she doesn't really understand this world, she's very strong but she's also very naive. She's not quite as little as the girls I'm used to writing, but she's definitely one of them in the sense of she'll undergo that kind of baptism of fire that used to be relegated to the male gender. She'll have to come into the world and see how corrupt it is and learn to deal with it and with her own powers. She is kind of, in a way, the grandma of everything I've been writing my whole life, so it makes sense that we should meet."

Wonder Woman will be produced by Joel Silver and Leonard Goldberg, and is based on the DC Comics character created by William Moulton Marston. The film will be released worldwide by Warner Bros. Pictures.



Oh no! :eek: Start worrying when a movie creator says "I've never loved the comics and I didn't watch the television series." Makes me wonder exactly why he "loves the character very much." :confused:

[langden alger]

i think it's gonna be hard to ruin it now if joss is involved...he's obviously a great creative mind. he comes up with some really human, naturally funny and interesting dialouge/characters. he should bring some good elements to the movie even if he isn't too attached to the subject...under normal circumstances i hate that, but with a track record like his we could be on the verge of another spiderman quality movie.

[ManicWebb]

[b]http://www.superherohype.com/news.php?id=3472




Oh no! :eek: Start worrying when a movie creator says "I've never loved the comics and I didn't watch the television series." Makes me wonder exactly why he "loves the character very much." :confused:
Didn't Joss used to read JLA?

Here's what I say: The X-Men movies were good, and I honestly think that, in addition to never having heard of the comic prior to directing, Bryan Singer didn't like most of the characters.

At least Whedon started picking up some Wonder Woman comics prior to writing the script, and has always liked the character. And let be honest-- Wonder Woman is the most inconsistantly written character in comic book history. Even I can't read her comic.

[sKorpia]

Wonder Woman is, I think, in a different category than the major superheroes due to the fact that she's hard to wrap your head around as a personable character with a compelling, transcendent story. Superman, Batman, Spider-Man all had certain elements, personality traits and plot points that had been satisfactorily laid out in one form or another before their respective (re-)defining movies. I can't say for sure with WW (having never seen the Lynda Carter TV series) but she seems to have stood more as a symbol than as a fleshed out character. If the animated series Justice League and Justice League Unlimited show anything, they demonstrate just how difficult it is to craft interesting stories for WW without compromising her. Both JL and JLU failed to do her justice in part because the writers didn't appear to have a very clear grasp of her personality or her value system. The result was shoddy characterization that had a tendency to swing wildly over the psychic map. And this is coming from people who obviously do have a background in comics.

On a personal note, I'd be really happy to have a Wonder Woman with whom I could actually connect as a person instead of a personified symbol.

[Fone Bone]

[b]http://www.superherohype.com/news.php?id=3472




Oh no! :eek: Start worrying when a movie creator says "I've never loved the comics and I didn't watch the television series." Makes me wonder exactly why he "loves the character very much." :confused:
Do not worry. This is Joss Whedon. The creater of Buffy The Vampire Slayer definately has the ability to write characterization for strong women. This movie will rock.

[Crow]

The hardest thing they have to deal with is making her different from the other recent strong female characters - surprise surprise one of Whedon's past works is a prime example.

Otherwise this will just be pigeonholed as another gung-ho heroine movie.

[RayChuang]

...It appears that he will use George Peréz's storyline as a template to write the screenplay. Which is actually a great idea given how well Peréz created that new continuity for Wonder Woman in issues 1-61 of the current series. :cool:

[DisneyBoy]

I definately agree that Perez nailed the perfect introduction for Wonder Woman in his run from issues one to sixty-two...

...however, I didn't exactly get the impression that Whedon intends to follow Perez's work in any way. Every version of Wonder Woman begins with her leaving her island and finding her way. The 70s series. The comics. Justice League. Beyond that is where the differences between the depictions come into play. I'm happy to hear Joss admit that Diana is older than the typical young girl characters he writers, since it's certainly true. I don't want the movie to open with some 17-year old pretty face taking on the mantle of a warrior woman. She's at her prime, and ready to face the world, although completely unprepared for what she's going to face.

Without rambling, this is going to be a hard sell. Too many are hoping it will be fun and light like the admittably enjoyable Charlie's Angels movies. I really want this movie to be hard hitting, serious and resonant. I don't want people come out of the theatre saying it was exactly what they expected, or forgettable. Wonder Woman, once you get to know her, is far from that.

I wish this production luck and intend to follow it closely.

[Azrael24]

i agree, but im not gonna say anything till i watch the movie

[Patrick Bateman]

I'm a huge Whedon fan (see avatar), but even I am shaken by his recent comments on Wonder Woman. I'm not sure exactly what he's trying to do. I also saw him mention the Invisible Jet, which is all kinds of wrong for a film.

[Discloner]

Do not worry. This is Joss Whedon. The creater of Buffy The Vampire Slayer definately has the ability to write characterization for strong women. This movie will rock.::cough::AlienResurrection ::cough:: :p

Not that I don't doubt his ability to make a good Wonder Woman movie, I mean a space/horror flick is a different beast then a superhero one (barring the strong women characterization in both movies)....I just needed to ground all the Whedon praise a tad. ;)

[Style]

I'm a huge Whedon fan (see avatar), but even I am shaken by his recent comments on Wonder Woman. I'm not sure exactly what he's trying to do. I also saw him mention the Invisible Jet, which is all kinds of wrong for a film.Isn't saying the invisible jet is wrong for a wonderwoman film like saying the Batmobile is wrong for a Batman film?

[The Penguin]

Isn't saying the invisible jet is wrong for a wonderwoman film like saying the Batmobile is wrong for a Batman film?I think there is a definate difference between Batman driving through the streets in a souped-up car and Wonder Woman flying through the sky in a seated position.

[Ruffian]

Oh no! :eek: Start worrying when a movie creator says "I've never loved the comics and I didn't watch the television series." Makes me wonder exactly why he "loves the character very much." :confused:
I can understand Whedon there. I love Wonder Woman because I tend to gravitate towards She-Ra-like characters, but even She-Ra was characterized much better than Wonder Woman ever was. I'm fairly new to the comics, but I'm collecting the WW monthly by Rucka and also getting the Perez TPB's. While good, it still doesn't feel like the writers have gotten what should make her click with the audience. Whedon's very into characterization and seeing what makes them interesting, so I'm very much anticpating his WW movie.

[DisneyBoy]

The invisible jet is enjoyed for it's kisch-factor, and really has nothing to do with the character. People know it because it's been splattered over lunch boxes for years now...that doesn't make it good for the movie. Heck, just cause Carter did the spinneroo into her WW outfit on the show doesn't mean it should be in the movie either.

And now that folks are mentionning Alien Ressurection, I'm getting really, really worried. Didn't that film feature a Ryder/Weaver kiss for the sake of it?

There's also the fact that Buffy was rail-thin on her show, and able to kick butt. I don't want Wonder Woman looking like she comes from a concentration camp instead of Themyscrira, you know?

[randomguy]

And now that folks are mentionning Alien Ressurection, I'm getting really, really worried. Didn't that film feature a Ryder/Weaver kiss for the sake of it?It also featured Ripley doing the nasty with an alien. But that was a while ago and given the high quality of Whedon's recent output, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt on this one.

[Stu]

There's also the fact that Buffy was rail-thin on her show, and able to kick butt. I don't want Wonder Woman looking like she comes from a concentration camp instead of Themyscrira, you know?
That's because Buffy was born with her ass kicking abilities, not trained as a warrior like Wonder Woman. I don't know if I care enough to see a Wonder Woman movie, especially given the gluten of sheer drivel that occupies female action heroines lately.

[Storm]

Wonder Woman has never interested me as a character. I give her total props for starting the female hero trend but nowadays there are better well written and interesting heroines out there. Plus with such flicks like Elektra and Catwoman... why even bother. Right now the only place where people can find an intelligent and strong, kick ass woman is on television. I have read WW comics and I know the character pretty well and I'm sure Joss Whedon could handle Diana and her world. He handled the X-Men wonderfully but I'm going to reserve all my opinions until I see the Serenity movie. I'm still not sure if the average movie goer will accept Joss as a writer and director. I'm still on the fence if he can handle a Buffy big screen movie.

- Storm

[James]

::cough::AlienResurrection ::cough:: :p

Not that I don't doubt his ability to make a good Wonder Woman movie, I mean a space/horror flick is a different beast then a superhero one (barring the strong women characterization in both movies)....I just needed to ground all the Whedon praise a tad. ;)
Well you've failed then. ;) As I recall, Alien Ressurection suffered massive rewrites, much of which he was not happy with but unable to do anything about.

One has to be careful when taking a film and then judging the skills of the creative crew - especially when it comes to franchises....

I found this little bit of Joss encusted opinion (http://www.slayage.com/articles/000093.html) on the net:


It's a weird thing though. Movies are just different, I guess. I mean Joss has also had his name attached to Waterworld ("I was there basically taking notes from Costner, who was very nice, fine to work with, but he was not a writer") and even the sci-fi atrocity that was Alien Resurrection ("I asked the director, "Can you just explain to me why he's doing this? Why is he going for this gun?" And the editor, who was French, turned to me and said, with a little leer on his face, [adopts gravelly, smarmy, French-accented voice] "Because eets een the screept." And I actually went and dented the bathroom stall with my puddly little fist. I have never been angrier. But it's the classic, "When something goes wrong, you assume the writers a dork. And that's painful." Maybe there's just more freedom on television. You don't have to LIKE a concept to be able to write it. That's the difference between a professional and an amateur writer. He doesn't like how the character was handled in the comics or TV series, but loves the very nature of the character. Even if he didn't love the character, it wouldn't stop him writing a good piece of story because that's what pros do: They write for a variety of concepts, often through hire in which they don't always have a say in whether they "like" the idea or not, they are hired to make it work.

Joss is a fine writer and I see no problem here. As for the plane, I have no issue with that. A good writer can do anything. He's a good writer, I have faith he'll do a good job... IF the studio let him.

[Discloner]

Well you've failed then. ;) Well...when you're right, you're right, and in this case...you're definetly right.

[Azbatz]

I don’t want to sound sexists. But they need to make Wonder Woman for a male audience otherwise we get crap like Supergirl, Catwoman and that Daredevil spin-off. It needs to be similar to Kill Bill how approach the female protagonist. Another words as long as it’s not a soap than it has the potential of being as good as Sin City, Batman Begins, or the first 2 Superman’s. Or at least I hope. The only Wonder Woman I’m familiar with is from the cartoon, Kingdom Come, and DKSA. I do watch the unfaithful TV show because to me it’s like a spin-off from Adam West Batman. So it won't bug me if it's not true to it's source. I hope they choose someone tall and not a baby face Buffy or Katie Holmes.

[Silly McGooses]

It also featured Ripley doing the nasty with an alien. But that was a while ago and given the high quality of Whedon's recent output, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt on this one.
wow, that must have been changed for TV or something, cuz that scene was definitely not in the version I watched...
about the invisible plane, I think it would be wrong for a movie, unless they want to make a Schumacher-esque self-parody. And isn't WW supposed to be able to fly anyway? or is that just JL?

[James]

about the invisible plane, I think it would be wrong for a movie, unless they want to make a Schumacher-esque self-parody.
Look at the batmobile in the 60s Batman to the one, say in Batman Begins. Same idea, some role, utterly different deployment of the icon. I would say not to dismiss the idea of the plane as being utterly stupid yet.

[DisneyBoy]

I think I dislike it mainly because it's not something that works with what Perez established. If Diana and the Amazons are Greek and on the island, they wouldn't have an invisible jet. If you're going to argue that she gets it from a secret military base, I find myself wondering what she's doing at that base to begin with.

More to the point, if you're going to argue that it works for Batman, he's an icon. From what I saw in the inexpensive Infinite Crisis one shot, Blue Beetle had his "bug" mobile, and it looked plain silly. I prefer it when heroes are whittled down to what makes them unique. What makes Wonder Woman unique is her heritage, ideals and behavior. Yes, she can fly, yes she's strong, but whenever I feel like the character is truly being done justice, it means the writer is placing some importance on what seperates her from the other people in bright costumes.

All this to say, how or why the jet has remained just a memorable piece of her history is beyond me. I guess people find it funny-looking. Wonder Woman is a funny heroine to most people because she's a warrior who dresses like a bathing-suit model, and flies an invisible aircraft.

I expect Whedon will put his own flourishes on the character as he sees fit, but hopefully dorky things like the jet will be thrown to the side, where they belong. And I definately disagree on the idea that this film should cater to male audiences. Soon I'll be hearing "it should cater to teen audiences" and "it should cater to the action film genre". To heck with Elektra, Sin City and the rest. I don't care if this becomes a franchise. I don't even care if some big name star gets the role. I just want this movie to be done right, and not pressured into fitting into a whole lot of categories that honestly have nothing to do with the premise of a woman getting a job she didn't ask for, but wants to excel at, while living in a strange world, away from her loved ones.

It was easier for Batman Begins to get things right because everyone knows what's likeable about Batman. It's all been tested. We've seen what happens when you emphasize the camp, the glamor, the psychology and the action. Any person on the street can come up with a fairly decent idea for a Batman story that could work. Wonder Woman has not been so tested. She was a pleasant diversion in the 70s, but taught people nothing. She isn't associated with an idea or an experience. She's thought of as being like Batgirl, Supergirl or She-Ra. What I want to see is a movie that's not afraid to stick up it's thumb at the audience who comes in wanting the movie to be something it's not, and instead rewards those who are ready to have their perceptions altered.

That's how I felt when I read Wonder Woman comics. It was a fresh take on old concepts, and it stuck very much to the style of Greek tragedies and myths, adding a contemporary twist to it. There are many sides to Wonder Woman. Whichever are featured in this, her first big movie, will be remembered.

[James]

I think I dislike it mainly because it's not something that works with what Perez established. If Diana and the Amazons are Greek and on the island, they wouldn't have an invisible jet.
You could make that argument for JLU. She has a jet, she's an amazon, she can fly. She still has the jet.

I think my point is - and it's one I'm disturbed to make - is that the beauty of imagination is that anything is possible. Anything can work, as long as you know how to paint the picture.

To ignore an icon on the grounds it would look silly I think demerits the power of fiction and the lack of creativity. Part of the beauty of remaking a legend is to challenge what you can do and not just stick to what people will probably believe. You don't think people will believe a man dressed up as a Bat running around the city? Make them! That was very much the drive behind "Batman" in 89. Until images leaked, people didn't believe anyone could visualise such a character seriously and have the audience believe it. They managed it.

If they had believed as the masses did that Batman only worked with live actors in a farce, we'd never seen the evolution of the Superhero movie.

Just because it seems like it can't be done, doesn't mean it can't be done. As I said with Batman Begins, prior to Spider-Man, I would have put money that a red and blue spidey suit in daylight New York would look utterly stupid and impossible to pull off without looking cheap or rubbery. Wrong.. because the fought against that problem.

Now I'm not going to say I WANT the plane. I don't care either way providing it doesn't ruin the movie.

Joss isn't just a character writer, he's very sharp. He took the horror genre and very much turned it on it's head. He knows when to mock and when to, erm, shock. That's his talent. He'll know the issues with the invisible plane: He's a writer. Writers immediately sniff out stumbling blocks and look at how to accomplish them. People here are talking as if it won't have occured to him that the plane will be an issue. He'll know it's a problem and if he uses it, I bet your bottom dollar he'll use that issue in his solution.

Don't underestimate good writers and never underestimate the power of fiction in the hands of a pro. ;)

[Stu]

To ignore an icon on the grounds it would look silly I think demerits the power of fiction and the lack of creativity. Part of the beauty of remaking a legend is to challenge what you can do and not just stick to what people will probably believe. You don't think people will believe a man dressed up as a Bat running around the city? Make them! That was very much the drive behind "Batman" in 89. Until images leaked, people didn't believe anyone could visualise such a character seriously and have the audience believe it. They managed it.

I agree, I actually find a lot of the superhero movie "announced" threads to be very amusing, as people are complaining before anything solid is set.

Whilst I think a lot of the superhero movies could've done a lot better than they actually did (the suit in Batman Begins could've been a lot better, with a little more imagination, for example).

Joss is a smart enough writer, when he's writing interesting characters. Wonder Woman arguably needs a lot more work to make her interesting to the modern masses than Batman or Superman does, as the TV show was nearly 30 years ago, a long, long time ago to today's younger crowd (hell, I've never seen an episode of it!)

[James]

Joss is a smart enough writer, when he's writing interesting characters. Wonder Woman arguably needs a lot more work to make her interesting to the modern masses than Batman or Superman does, as the TV show was nearly 30 years ago, a long, long time ago to today's younger crowd (hell, I've never seen an episode of it!)
That's true. People may HATE Dukes Of Hazzard, but the issue was to find a way to appeal to a new audience - and that audience makes up a large proportion of cinema goers. The old Dukes may be more unique, but unlikely to find a niche with younger audiences.

So the question is, how do you recreate a show/icon without dumbing it down TOO much (allegedly a la Dukes). I think Joss is perfect find that balance between retaining the old while offering something that will grab the new generation.

[Style]

I don't understand why you all think the invisible jet is inherantly a hokey concept, considering JLU is using it just fine.

[ManicWebb]

If you're going to argue that she gets it from a secret military base, I find myself wondering what she's doing at that base to begin with.
You say that like it'd be oh-so hard to include Steve Trevor in the story...

[Azbatz]

I think Wonder Woman should be approached like Sky Captain and The World of Tomorrow. Taking place in the 1940’s and shot with the same technology as Sky Captain or even Sin City. The problem is the studio would never go for a period version of Wonder Woman. Originally they were going to set the Fantastic Four movie in the 60’s, which is when that comic book debuted, but the studio got rid of that idea pretty fast and then switched directors to a second rate one. Period comic book movies like Batman, Batman Returns, The Rocketeer, Dick Tracy, or The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen don’t do as well as well as non-period comic book movies, kids are less interested in them unfortunately. Batman Begins should have been set in the 1980’s when Year One came out.

[RayChuang]

I think Wonder Woman should be approached like Sky Captain and The World of Tomorrow. Taking place in the 1940’s and shot with the same technology as Sky Captain or even Sin City. The problem is the studio would never go for a period version of Wonder Woman.Well, thanks to George Peréz's awesome retelling of the origins of Wonder Woman in the modern world in the comics, there's really no need to do the movie based in the early 1940's. :)

[DisneyBoy]

Exactly. Wonder Woman was well integrated into the 80s, and will easily fit into today's modern world. I don't really care for her war era debut, so hopefully that won't be too prominent in the film. Justice League was able to handle the whole Steve Trevor/WWII issue when the League went back in time, but they likely won't be able to do that in the movie while still keeping the audience intested. Besides, Wonder Woman isn't about time-travel.

I'm assuming aspects of her history, like Steve Trevor and potentially event the jet will make it to the screen, but I'm not a big fan of either of those simply because they provide the writer with two easy, cheesy additions to the story - a love interest, and a silly mode of transportation. And yes, even on JLU the jet is silly. Sure the visual looks nice, but since the explanation is nonexistant (but written into an as-of-yet unproduced DTV), it becomes a big question mark.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I don't want Wonder Woman reduced to what she was when she first appeared. Batman and Superman had effective origins, but Diana's were dated and definately less riveting. She's grown into a much more unique persona over the years, and I don't want to see that all thrown out the window simply for the sake of honoring her roots. And sadly, that's just where things lie. If Joss is reading the original Wonder Woman comics, I'm worried. If he's reading the post-Perez stuff, I'm interested.

[Azbatz]

provide the writer with two easy, cheesy additions to the story - a love interest.
Every superhero movie has a love interest. Otherwise the audience will think he or she hasn’t come out of the closet. Another words they’ll think Wonder Woman’s a lesbian. But yeah it’s overused in superhero movies and really only works for a select few. I really hate how in every Batman movie the love interest finds out his secret. That BUGS me. I hope it’s not overused in Wonder Woman franchise. She can have a lover but maybe he only makes a cameo at the end? Or dies in the beginning? In Batman Begins Rachel seemed out of place mainly because she was made up but it would have been braver if they just went with Harvey Dent and just had Bruce sleeping with European woman in cameo roles to insure us he’s straight. But at the same time Wonder Woman is a goddess and why would a goddess have affairs with puny men? It will be interesting how he approaches this. Hopefully it’s not a rehash of Batman Begins method page for page, because that’s his inspiration. Batman Begins is good but it has those old flaws that those superhero movies before suffered with. I really wish Superman could be the love interest but that’d never happen and I don't mean Superman Returns Superman. That’s not Superman. Someone similar to Christopher Reeves how Christian Bale is similar as his Batman to Michael Keaton. Not his Bruce Wayne.

[ManicWebb]

She's grown into a much more unique persona over the years, and I don't want to see that all thrown out the window simply for the sake of honoring her roots. And sadly, that's just where things lie. If Joss is reading the original Wonder Woman comics, I'm worried.
Right, so you don't want Wonder Woman's roots honored. Gotcha.

[DisneyBoy]

I want the Perez-roots respected. Not the pseudo-feminist WWII roots. Those are outdated and would over-simplify the entire shebang.

I see your point Azbaz about the inserted lover in hero movies. Personally, I don't care if people wonder if she's a lesbian. They've left us to our own assumptions about the Amazons in the comics, and even with Hippolyta and Phillipus. Wonder Woman is a sex-object in a sense, and therefore really shouldn't be bogged down by a certain someone...especially not in her first film. Steve was never seen as a worthy mate back in the day anyways. He sucked as a Ken to her Barbie, and was rightfully rewritten as more of a brother figure in Perez's revamp.

Much as I love what Perez did, not everything can make it to the screen in that way. Steve is a big part of Diana's history, but I don't want him turning into a boyfriend unless it can be done better than ever before...which is an awful lot of pressure. I want this film to go against the grain in as many ways as it possibly can.

[ManicWebb]

It wouldn't take a hell of a lot more imagination to make a Steve/Diana relationship work better in the new movie than it did back in the day. If I were in charge of this movie (which I am, of course, not), I'd write Steve Trevor as Wonder Woman's ally and friend, but I'd make sure there was a lot of chemistry between them. You don't have to spell it out in big, bold letters like Spider-Man did; the occasional look of admiration between them while working together is all we need for the first movie.

Wonder Woman's pre-Crisis image isn't as bad as you seem to think it is. A lot of its elements could easily mix with some of the post-Crisis stuff. The Invisible Jet doesn't have to be a glass tube, and Steve Trevor doesn't have to be a Ken doll to be in love with Diana. If anything, I'd say it's far far too easy to twist the pre-Perez stuff to work in a modern movie. You just have to use a little imagination.

[Azrael24]

But at the same time Wonder Woman is a goddess and why would a goddess have affairs with puny men?
well, she there was something going on between her and Ares in the comics, and hes a god (of war) but i think he went good and started hanging with diana

[ManicWebb]

But at the same time Wonder Woman is a goddess and why would a goddess have affairs with puny men?
Duh! She's a Greek goddess. Greek gods had affairs with puny mortals all the time.

Besides, Diana is just a demi-goddess. Many demi-gods walked among (and married) mortals all the time. Hercules/Heracles, Perseus, Helen of Troy, ect.