Superman comics readers vote here to keep the black and red.

[MattL.]

Basically this is a thread to basically say in a few words why you like the red and black and why you think DC Comics should keep it even after this whole post OWAW thing is over.

I think the effect is extremely bold and brings out the red and blues in the classic costume. It makes him look at once both noble and tough which is how Superman should look. His costume was already the coolest of all time and this final tweak has perfected it.

[MattL.]

Blargh. In case the header came off as to vauge, I'm refering to the red and black S-sheild currently being used in the comics. Red S with a black background in place of the usual yellow.

[James Harvey]

I'm moving this thread over to the Batman, Superman, & Beyond Board.

I really like the "new version" of the costume. It is now 100% perfect. DC said they would keep it in effect for at least 1 year, but I really hope it is permenant. I reall ylike how the costume is tinted a bit dark. It just works. Even when, in an issue, Superman is upbeat the new look still works. The newest issue of Superman did a good job in explaining the costume and why it should stay.

[Karkull]

Ugh. I prefer the yellow in the shield. If they really want to improve his costume they should go with his look on the cartoon.

[James Harvey]

But his old looks was how it was like in the cartoon. I always thought the costume needed a tweak. I couldn't pin what needed to be changed, but it needed something. I think the current version is good.

I also think they should drop the sheild from his cape...but that's my opinion.

[Karkull]

Not really. In the cartoon the colors were all darker than in the comics.

I think that they should drop the "S" from the cape as well.

[Domino]

It's a stunt. A gimmick. It sells a few thousand more copies from word of mouth publicity, then alienates longtime readers who leave by the tens of thousands when they tire of the fad. I wish the editorial staff of DC Comics would learn this easy lesson in arithmetic and give us good stories on a regular basis.

Marvel learned this lesson with Spider-Man's black suit in what, 1984?

Dead Superman was short term. Long-haired Superman was short term. Superman Blue was short term. The black and red insignia will be short term. Start thinking long term, regain the readers' trust, and increase sales on a more permanent basis! I've been waiting for a reason to buy Superman again after about seven years, and believe me, this isn't it.

[James Harvey]

I don't think it's a gimmick. If it was a gimmick then DC would have slaped up hundred of advertisements sayng "LOOK AT SUPERMAN'S NEW COSTUME!". The only advertisement I saw for it was in the comic solicitation information in the issue write up. I don't think this is anything like "DEATH OF SUPERMAN". Just a natural progression in a character due to a horrible, horrible event.

[Mr. Obsession]

Well, correct me if I'm wrong here but didn't Superman's original costume from way back in the golden age have the red "S" on a black shield?

If you don't want to think of is as a response to events in the comics, think of it as Superman going retro. Kind of like Batman in JL.

[James Harvey]

Yup - the original costume design had Superman with a black sheild background. Plus his boots were straps as well.His original costume was very awesome, and now that I think of it, the new look is like an updated retro look for the Man of Steel.

[Russkafin]

Just thought I'd chime in and say I like the black and red logo, too... I don't really see how they could go back to the yellow, considering the reason he changed it to black (as far as the story goes) was in remembrance of his friends that died during Our Worlds At War. What's he going to do, one day just say, "You know, forget about those people that died, I miss my yellow!!"

Then again, DC will probably bring everyone back from the dead eventually anyway, and at that point, yeah, sure, he could change it back. ;)

But seriously, you also have the fact that the change came almost simultaniously with the real world attacks on the WTC and Pentagon, so in a way, it's also a way of memorializing that... I think they should keep the black.

[MattL.]

Dick Grayson brought up a very intresting point about it working even with Superman returning to more of his upbeat self. I think thats what sold me on it.

It allowed me to see the pure astetic value of it without the black having to mean he's depressed and brooding or otherwise "darkened". Not sure why people automatically equate darker aspects as intrinscally cooler anyway. Kinda of disturbing really.

The black seems to bring the whole suit to life. This combined with the art teams using the Bruce Timm black with red highlight on the trunks and even extending it to the boots.

Now if we can just finallt get passed all this whoa-is-me OWAW stuff, resolve some plotlines and tell us which Krypton is it (my vote is for either the cool retro version of beerslamming the two and making it a Ed McGuiness version of the TAS Krypton) and then we got something. :)

[The Mad Hatter]

I'll have to agree, it's starting to grow on me. And it wouldn't have to continue to indicate a brooding Superman... after all, Spidey in his black costume wasn't brooding!

[James Harvey]

Bingo! I've been an addicted Superman reader since the post-OWAW books hit. The writing has been amazing and the new creative teams have been good. While I still wish DC would streamline the Superman titles a bit, I am enjoying them right now. And when you get the right artist like Duncan Rouleau, Ian Chruchill, or Ed McGuiness drawing the costume - it just clicks, The nost recent issue of Superman was a great example on how this costume can be used in both an upbeat manner, and still show what it symbolizes.

And with current real world events - it seems proper.

[FLIPMODE]

Yeah and not only that, people loved Spidey in his Black Costume.

[MattL.]

See I never liked Spideys black costume because thats case of a total change versus a tweak or enhancment. Spidey, like Superman has one of the *the* classic costumes of all time. He doesn't need a totally different suit. But something that accents original elements or takes them a step further is cool.

Which is why even though I loathe Ben Reilly with every fiber of my being, I dug his suit when he assumed the role of Spider-Man (I wish Bagely had gotten to give that to Peter.)

and with the red and black it just adds that extra touch and makes the rest of the classic suit we know and love totally cool.

[Domino]

My point with Spider-Man's black costume is that it's a company trademark, and it wasn't as effective as the recognizable webs. I really don't see DC changing their stationery to include the black and red S. By the way, I still think the black Spider-Man costume was the coolest super-hero suit around back then.

The original costume actually was a yellow shield shape with a red S inside. It then shifted to a yellow triangle, then a black triangle, briefly. It became a pentagon around the time of the Fleischer cartoons, and it was black in the newspaper strip as well, probably to provide contrast in black and white, which it does very nicely. Then it was yellow surrounded by red for the duration.

It might not be a gimmick, but does anyone want to bet me that it won't be gone in a year? <g>