Webcomics For A Living: The 2 or 3 or 3.5 People Who Do It

[shoujoaifan]

I know, I know, the majority of the HUNDREDS of webcomics, the majority of which are drawn with an elementary school level of skill with no background in formal arts training, are poorly written, and are more derivitive amongst themselves than mainstream comics are with themselves-

-and that of the few dozens of comics that are generically decent, and the fewer that are good enough that a internet nerd won't feel embarrased to tell fellow internet nerds on a message board that he or she likes them, and FINALLY, out of the few that are actually good, only a few lucky bastards can actually make a living off them, or at the very least not have to work a crappy minimum wage job as they go to college like most of them apparentally do.



So my For-The-Sake-Of-Curiosity (Copyrighted Never) questions are these:

1. Who are these lucky devils? (If they're not lying through their fingers on the keyboard.)

2. HOW!?! What, ads? The one-in-a-million chance of getting published on dead tree? Are their online shops' sales enough to meet minimum wage levels?

I've only read a few webcomics for the last few years, so that's why I'm a newb to the complex workings of the madmen in the webcomic community. (I mainly read "El Goonish Shive", "Venus Envy", and occasionally I check "Vigilante, Ho!", since the creators either find the time or remember about it and update with a new page or two, and then its dead for a few months again.)

I know "MegaToyko" 's 1/2 of the remaining creative team is living off it. I can see how some, if they're either really unique or creative and well drawn, might get it, but also I'm betting its just being some of the earliest also helps. I'm betting MegaToyko is the first American otaku comic, and has ANY sprite comic BESIDES 8-Bit Theater become popular? Since its the first sprite comic, the novelty wore off real fast when everyone did it, and its based off Final Fantasy, which is some law nerds have to like it?

[Chad Bonin]

PVP has managed to take all the right turns when it comes to publication and stuff. Megatokyo does well on ads and book sales and all.

[Ed Liu]

Howdy,

I know of at least one guy who had a web comic which faced cancellation due to his job pressures. He put up a tip jar on his website and said, "I make $20,000 a year, which I can live on. If I can get a tip jar amount of that much from you guys in X months, I'll quit my job and do the web comic full time." His audience was loyal enough, fanatic enough, and generous enough to pony up, he quit his job, and is now doing his web comic full time.

Unfortunately, I can't remember who the comic was, other than that Scott McCloud mentioned it on his weblog (http://www.scottmccloud.com/comics/mi/mi.html).

I also believe that Questionable Content (http://www.questionablecontent.net/) and Dinosaur Comics (http://www.qwantz.com/) make decent money, if not a full-sized living wage, from sales of T-shirts and such. Both have sizeable audiences as well.

I think PvP and Penny Arcade achieved success by eventually getting the attention of video game companies, who recognized the value of positive (or even humorously negative) press from the on-line nerd contingent.

So, as with self-published comic books, it seems that the three step process to Fame and Fortune (or at least a passable living) from a web-comic is 1) make a web comic that lots and lots and lots of people will like, 2) tell lots and lots and lots of people about it so they will find it and like it, and 3) find a way to separate a subset of these people from a little bit of their cash on a semi-regular basis.

Easy as pie. Except for steps 1, 2, and 3. :)

-- Ed/Ace

[Anthonynotes]

I've thought about doing an online comic strip (political cartoons, a recurring series, or something), though between not being sure if I'm funny or entertaining enough to keep it up regularly and my so-so-drawing skills (Dilbert level, I suppose) might be a reason not to do it...

[Shnay]

I know of at least one guy who had a web comic which faced cancellation due to his job pressures. He put up a tip jar on his website and said, "I make $20,000 a year, which I can live on. If I can get a tip jar amount of that much from you guys in X months, I'll quit my job and do the web comic full time." His audience was loyal enough, fanatic enough, and generous enough to pony up, he quit his job, and is now doing his web comic full time.

Unfortunately, I can't remember who the comic was, other than that Scott McCloud mentioned it on his weblog (http://www.scottmccloud.com/comics/mi/mi.html).That would be R.K. Milholland of Something Positive (http://www.somethingpositive.net/). Right now, there's a message on the site saying that today's comic will be late, which is pretty funny considering the quoted text above.

[Peter Paltridge]

I don't want webcomics to replace newspaper comics because there's no money or fame or even respect in it. Have you ever heard of the general population having knowledge of a webcomic, or someone referencing a webcomic on a TV show? I'm kinda scared that webcomics are going to end up making cartooning completely and totally unprofitable, and throw it into the basement forever, and I'll never get a large audience, which is IMPORTANT TO ME!!!

And then I'll die miserable...

[Aquadementia]

I've been thinking about something from a recent online chat with a well know animator who's name I won't mention because I really don't want to hear what people think about him personally.
Anyhow, he mentioned cell phones as a market for his flash cartoons.

Does anyone think that cell phone delivery could provide a revenue stream for independent web comic artists?

I'm thinking people are still looking for uses for their phones and may be willing to pay a small fee for some of better comics.

It would probably require separating text from the art, seeing as most word bubbles are impossible to read on the small screen.

Of course, it wouldn't surprise me at all if I was way behind the times bringing this up.

[shoujoaifan]

Thanks for all the responses so far everyone! Some crazy stuff going on here. A guy telling his fans to "support" him, in more ways than one, and them actually doing it? Wow. Talk about a mix of both some serious positive and negative loyalty. Wouldn't count on it happening a second time with someone else though, fans can't give to everyone and eventually will get to the point where's everyone is paying more than just a few bucks. WELL, that, and the fact it would get old too.

HMMM, Homestar Runner HAS to be bringing in some money, definately one of the most famous internet cartoons. ( The first? :confused: )
I've been thinking about something from a recent online chat with a well know animator who's name I won't mention because I really don't want to hear what people think about him personally.
Anyhow, he mentioned cell phones as a market for his flash cartoons.

Does anyone think that cell phone delivery could provide a revenue stream for independent web comic artists?

I'm thinking people are still looking for uses for their phones and may be willing to pay a small fee for some of better comics.

It would probably require separating text from the art, seeing as most word bubbles are impossible to read on the small screen.

Of course, it wouldn't surprise me at all if I was way behind the times bringing this up.Haven't heard of anything similiar either, but obviously I'm not up to speed on alot of things. Would NOT surprise me. I know there's been cell phone virtual pets at least in Japan ( Opens your e-mail and can visit other pets on other cells! ), and I don't know how MANY times I've seen commercials on Comedy Central, asking you to pay a pay-per-view phone number to listen to music-

-oh SNAP! I just remembered one of those commercials where you can purchase some sort of cartoon girl for your cell. That's just one small step from being a flash cartoon show.

HMMMMMM, but would people pay for such a service?( Realizing what I wrote up above about the commercials, as well as all the useless services people already buy for other things. ) Yeah, yeah, it could work. But how powerful are the internet services for a cell? Could they handle normal websites, and just go there for free? ( I don't have a cell, so I don't know :p )

[Eddie G.]

That would be R.K. Milholland of Something Positive (http://www.somethingpositive.net/). Right now, there's a message on the site saying that today's comic will be late, which is pretty funny considering the quoted text above.To be fair I think Milholland still does a lot of work in theater and he attends a pretty big amount of conventions. He also does original work on a daily basis, Kurtz doesn't even post on a daily basis anymore.

[Shnay]

Another option to consider would be auctioning off original work. Chris Onstad of Achewood (http://www.achewood.com/) has autctioned a number of original paintings (http://www.achewood.com/gallery.php), all of which have sold for a few hunrded dollars each. It's not enough to live off of, but I'm sure it helps.


A guy telling his fans to "support" him, in more ways than one, and them actually doing it? Wow. Talk about a mix of both some serious positive and negative loyalty. Wouldn't count on it happening a second time with someone else though, fans can't give to everyone and eventually will get to the point where's everyone is paying more than just a few bucks. Penny Arcade (http://www.penny-arcade.com/) recently posted the story of an odd business situation (http://www.penny-arcade.com/news.php3?date=2005-05-09) (bottom) they were in. Basically, they were making comics for a website called efront that contained contributions from many people, and were receiving a paycheck from that site. When the site crumbled, they had to make some decisions regarding the future of their comic:
We were on the verge of loosing Penny Arcade and everything we had built. I remember when efront went bankrupt and Sam fled the country after being charged with tax evasion Tycho and I considered quitting PA. We had both quit our jobs during the few months we were receiving checks from efront. Now the money had dried up and we were unemployed. We figured we had to quit PA and try and get our old jobs back.

Right at the same time Amazon started their Honor System that allowed readers to donate money to websites they liked. At the time only about a dozen sites were using it and none of them were making any money. We figured we'd give it a shot and if it failed we'd close down the site and go back to our old jobs. We never told you guys that was the situation because we didn't want to worry you and we didn't want that to be the reason you donated. Obviously you guys stepped up and gave us the income that we needed to keep the site going. We ran Penny Arcade off of your generosity for a few years before finally returning to an advertising model.So while the "There's the tip jar, match my salary or quit complaining" model might not be matched again, people will probably give some money to a site they like to keep it going, even when they don't know just how close it is to shutting down. I know there are a few comics out there that I would donate to if the author asked. I wouldn't give a huge chunk of change, but I would definitely chip in.


To be fair I think Milholland still does a lot of work in theater and he attends a pretty big amount of conventions. He also does original work on a daily basis, Kurtz doesn't even post on a daily basis anymore.And even in a "real job," there are many times when things aren't always finished right on schedule. There's always stuff you didn't plan for that gets in the way. I just thought it was funny that the example of a guy doing comics full time didn't have the comic up at the time I was linking him.

[Ed Liu]

Howdy,


I don't want webcomics to replace newspaper comics because there's no money or fame or even respect in it. Have you ever heard of the general population having knowledge of a webcomic, or someone referencing a webcomic on a TV show? I'm kinda scared that webcomics are going to end up making cartooning completely and totally unprofitable, and throw it into the basement forever, and I'll never get a large audience, which is IMPORTANT TO ME!!!
Well, the question is really why is a large audience, money, or fame important to comics, whether on the web or not. Beyond the ego trip of knowing you have a mass audience, the size of your audience is what determines whether you'll be able to make a decent living off your comic work. In the past, the distribution of physical product was the obstacle that made things like Diamond Distribution necessary, and the massive number of individual newspapers to deal with made the efficiencies of a United King Features Syndicate the Faustian bargain of choice.

The benefit to webcomics is that it gives creators access to the biggest distribution system of information ever without imposing the same restrictions that you have to go to the newspaper syndicates or Diamond for. Since The Man isn't coming in to take his cut of the merchandising, reprint rights, etc, you can make a living off a webcomic on a much smaller audience than you would through newspaper strips. The same can be said for music and, maybe some time in the very near future, movies.

The Something Positive fellow (thanks, Shnay!) probably had, at most, a few thousand people sending him maybe $20 at a time. A newspaper strip with only a few thousand in readership would get axed by the syndicate in a heartbeat, netting a readership of exactly zero.

None of this helps with the ego trip part, of course ;). However, I think the satisfaction of knowing you don't have to kowtow to The Man to produce your work and have it seen as you intend it can outweigh a lot of the loss of audience. Terry Moore and Frank Cho certainly think so.

-- Ed/Ace