Infamous WB cartoons

[laugh4me]

http://www.deadbeat.dk/film/features/warner/images/fudd.gif

For your reading pleasure? :p

Just because it's been so much fun hearing everyone call Bugs Bunny racist as of late ;) I offer the following link I stumbled across in which someone talks about what they call THE FIVE MOST RACIST WARNER BROTHERS CARTOONS OF ALL TIME. (http://www.deadbeat.dk/film/features/warner/)

Here's a few quotes from it:
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Notice that in this Top Five, ... 3 were ... Friz Freleng cartoons. Closet John Birch Society member? Only Friz knows for sure, and he’s dead now.
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One wonders if the brilliant Avery wasn’t at one point the Grand Dragon of the Ku Klux Klan.
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It’s all you can do to stagger away from the TV, drink a case of beer and keep reminding yourself, It’s OK—these same guys made Tweety Bird cartoons…
:rolleyes:
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Less than 9 hours until June Bugs 2001.... but then who's counting?

[J Lee]

Ah yes, we're all so much more superior human beings now than the dregs that walked the earth a half century ago....

[Matthew Hunter]

You have to admit, he has a point. "Tokio Jokio" goes beyond bad taste. I can see "Nips the Nips" and think it's funny, in fact it's gut-bustingly un-PC, but "Tokio Jokio' just plain crosses the line. I HATE that cartoon. The others I can't really judge, I have only seen a few of them. Personally, I say they can be aired on television with disclaimers, but then I'm not a black person or a Japanese person. I imagine if I were I would be offended that my race and culture were portrayed like that.
There is a difference, though, between those and the Indian cartoons. Come on, they're just cartoons! As compared to the black-stereotyped cartoons, I've never heard of the Native American shorts as being touchy to anyone. Those really are a part of our culture. What, now wild west stories are bad, too? Will my being from Texas be considered a slam in a few years because of how horribly my ancestors treated the Indians? As I've said before, WB cartoonists did not hate the Indians, it was just an entertaining, funny situation to place a character in, and it was also commonplace in film and TV westerns for years.
And those shorts that guy lists it makes Speedy look like a saint...which he is, really. I mean, Speedy Gonzales is a hero for Mexicans, perhaps the most un-racist character you can get. Compare him to "Little Pancho Vanilla" or those guys in front of the bar in "Timid Toreador". There are bad stereotypes, guilty-pleasure funny stereotypes, and harmless ones. Saying a cartoon is racist is one thing, trying to hide its existence and censor the blazes out of it is another.
-Matthew

[Patrick McCart]

Gee, those pictures look really familiar!

I wonder which website they came from and this article gave to credit to?

I find this artcle to be very negative on cartoon directors. Friz Freleng may have directed some racail/racist cartoons, but that doesn't make him some evil monster! Obviously, this moron doesn't realize that these cartoons were made in the 30's and 40's when this stuff wasn't regulated like it is now. Here, he's trashing Freleng for making 3 "bad" cartoons out of the hundreds he made in his lifetime. The insult guided to Beck and Frieldwald is really mean-spirited, too. "Gee, anyone who likes these cartoons must be in the KKK!"

I guess this guy didn't notice that they agreed about some gags in "meetin' time" went a little too far.

"One wonders if the brilliant Avery wasn’t at one point the Grand Dragon of the Ku Klux Klan."

". In fact, a concentration camp gag makes me wonder if McCabe remembered at all that there would be innocent, impressionable kiddies watching this cartoon after its release. THE MAN WAS A MONSTER. "

Um, last time I looked, Jokio was made during WWII. I can't imagine why a cartoon would be made like this during that time!

I'm interested in seeing what this guy had on his list before #5.

It's one thing to call the cartoons racist, but it's just wrong to go out and insult the artists and historians!

[Gossamer]

Look carefully at the website, at the original "source" of "publication" for this thing. While the author makes some serious points, I'm not sure this isn't jabbing a stick at both sides in this argument. The one point he makes is that Tokio Jokio just flat isn't that funny. It probably wasn't funny when it was made. But I refuse to waste my outrage on a piffling piece of celluloid when, at the same time, there existed a location called Mazanar, whose "residents" were American Nationals who were there solely because their birthplace was Japan or their parents were born there. Stacked up next to that, a cartoon is nothing.

[happyheathen]

Originally posted by Gossamer
Look carefully at the website, at the original "source" of "publication" for this thing. While the author makes some serious points, I'm not sure this isn't jabbing a stick at both sides in this argument. The one point he makes is that Tokio Jokio just flat isn't that funny. It probably wasn't funny when it was made. But I refuse to waste my outrage on a piffling piece of celluloid when, at the same time, there existed a location called Mazanar, whose "residents" were American Nationals who were there solely because their birthplace was Japan or their parents were born there. Stacked up next to that, a cartoon is nothing.

For those who may not be familiar with this bit of American history:

Following the attack on Pearl Harbor, all americans of Japanese descent were locked up in concentration camps for the duration of the war. There was little or no opposition to this imprisonment. In fact, in 1942, the San Francisco Examiner (another ugly story in itself) proudly proclaimed that SF was 'free' of all but 'seven sick Japs'.

Lesson: It can, and has, happened here.

[PorkyandDaffy]

I haven't seen TOKIO JOKIO yet, but is it really that bad?

[Matthew Hunter]

Well, yes, in two ways. Number one, it's not all that funny, and number two, the stereotypes are really bad...think "Nips the Nips" only 3 times as bad.
-Matthew

[happyheathen]

Originally posted by Matthew Hunter
Well, yes, in two ways. Number one, it's not all that funny, and number two, the stereotypes are really bad...think "Nips the Nips" only 3 times as bad.
-Matthew

Tokio (note the spelling - it was wrong then, too) Jokio was not a cartoon - it was wartime propaganda, designed to increase contempt/hatred of the enemy - this it did.

[Jack]

Tokio Jokio is Good Night Elmer x15, but at least I actually smile a little through Good Night Elmer, Tokio Jokio is just a generally unfunny creation, the worst thing to ever come from McCabe.

Nips the Nips on the other hand is quite funny.


Jack:D

[PorkyandDaffy]

I'll wait until I see the cartoon, but I never really liked McCabe that much anyway, judging from some of the cartoons I've seen from him. He co-directed PORKY'S SNOOZE REEL with Clampett, and I can already tell which parts McCabe came up with - the cartoon is very unstable as the gags are either extremely funny, or extremely unfunny.

[Dave Mackey]

Yes, I have seen "Tokio Jokio". Yes, it is one of McCabe's low points of an otherwise long and distinguished career. Yes, it is that cruel.

I don't know if any of the historians out there have been able to snag McCabe for an interview, but I'd love to hear his thoughts on why he made that cartoon... and why he didn't earn screen credit again on a theatrical cartoon until 1964....

[Sogturtle]

Y'all~

Just a couple (okay five or six) notes here...

1. The asinine self-righteousness of the "Political Correctness" shown by writers towards these cartoons is even more insulting than anything contained in these films. (Ub Iwerks' grand-daughter similarly slams Ub's weird and wacky films in her biography of him... Talk about biting the hand that feeds you!!).

2. Tokio Jokio's extreme caricaturing may be related to two things that you all are overlooking... It happened to be the VERY LAST cartoon ever made by Norman McCabe, who in fact is credited as Cpl. Norman McCabe. The man was going into the service as the film was made... Would we expect an even-handed view of the "back-stabbing enemy" by a soldier at the highpoint of WWII??? The credited writer (Don Christensen) went into the service likewise after the very next film (Tashlin's "Scrap Happy Daffy"). Which of these two is more to credit here???

3. The Japanese internment camps... Yep, darn unpleasant history... Buuuuuut unlike other countries we dealt with what we believed to be a major threat (unknown loyalties of Japanese-Americans) in an unpleasant but non-lethal manner. Other countries (some) in other times took much more hideous steps, namely total expulsion of the enemy people, or complete annihilation.

4. It has been alleged that our pal :) FDR seriously considered the creation of GERMAN internment camps... The only snag was in differentiating who was and who wasn't of German descent/loyalty. It shouldn't be forgotten that American sentiment against the Germans during World War I had been so strong that the KKK became active against Americans of German descent (my grandparents home was chosen for the attention of the KKK).

5. Friz Freleng a racist?!?!?! Boy there's one for the books! Friz Freleng was a Jewish American for crying out loud!! The last thing the man ever was racist. A product of his times? Yeah. A comedic genius? Of course. A racist?? NO WAY!

6. As Matthew said above, censoring cartoons accomplishes NOTHING!!!

[Jack]

I don't like how they throw about the word racist so much, these writers jump to conclusions too quickly, as if you can judge the entire character and thoughts of a person by watching an old cartoon they made at a time when those sorts of things were commonplace.

These people go about labeling others, and unfortunately, a label like "RACIST" can stick with a person, whether they happen to be one or not.


Jack:D

[Gossamer]

Originally posted by Sogturtle
Y'all~

Just a couple (okay five or six) notes here...

1. The asinine self-righteousness of the "Political Correctness" shown by writers towards these cartoons is even more insulting than anything contained in these films. (Ub Iwerks' grand-daughter similarly slams Ub's weird and wacky films in her biography of him... Talk about biting the hand that feeds you!!).

2. Tokio Jokio's extreme caricaturing may be related to two things that you all are overlooking... It happened to be the VERY LAST cartoon ever made by Norman McCabe, who in fact is credited as Cpl. Norman McCabe. The man was going into the service as the film was made... Would we expect an even-handed view of the "back-stabbing enemy" by a soldier at the highpoint of WWII??? The credited writer (Don Christensen) went into the service likewise after the very next film (Tashlin's "Scrap Happy Daffy"). Which of these two is more to credit here???

3. The Japanese internment camps... Yep, darn unpleasant history... Buuuuuut unlike other countries we dealt with what we believed to be a major threat (unknown loyalties of Japanese-Americans) in an unpleasant but non-lethal manner. Other countries (some) in other times took much more hideous steps, namely total expulsion of the enemy people, or complete annihilation.

4. It has been alleged that our pal :) FDR seriously considered the creation of GERMAN internment camps... The only snag was in differentiating who was and who wasn't of German descent/loyalty. It shouldn't be forgotten that American sentiment against the Germans during World War I had been so strong that the KKK became active against Americans of German descent (my grandparents home was chosen for the attention of the KKK).

5. Friz Freleng a racist?!?!?! Boy there's one for the books! Friz Freleng was a Jewish American for crying out loud!! The last thing the man ever was racist. A product of his times? Yeah. A comedic genius? Of course. A racist?? NO WAY!

6. As Matthew said above, censoring cartoons accomplishes NOTHING!!!





Sogturtle, I understand the context of Tokio Jokio. As far as that goes, I don't view it as racist-nationalistic, yes. It targets Japanese specifically, not Asians as a group. The reason I brougt up internment camps was to point out that cartoons are a minor cultural blip on the radar when placed in opposition to other points. No matter how you try to justify it, the internment stunk on ice! But calling cartoons racist and/or offensive and banning them is like aiming a howitzer at a gnat!

[Sogturtle]

Gossamer~

I agree with you on all points!! McCabe's "Tokio Jokio" is NOT a racist cartoon, nor should it be viewed that way. (Racism would have included Chinese and Chinese-Americans).

I did not in ANY way, shape or form mean to make it sound like I was trying to justify the internment of Japanese-Americans in WWII. To justify something means to make it RIGHTEOUS, and seizing and locking up innocent Japanese-American families behind barbed-wire fences with gun-toting guards was UN-righteous (and unjustifiable) in the extreme. The internment did indeed stink to high-heaven, and was the action of a totally PARANOID GOVERNMENT (FDR and crew). And was totally unneccessary and flat-out wrong.... It caused emotional scarring, loss of property and a multitude of problems for the poor individuals. What's more, it was patently illegal, as it was a hostile act by the U.S. government against innocent U.S. CITIZENS. BUUUUUUT it thankfully did not involve Nazi-style extermination camps, or hideous brutalities!

[cabe624]

The only way Tokio Jokio is racist is when it is not viewed in its proper historical context. I can imagine what americans felt about Japaniese...they atacked our country, and they were viewed as bad as Osama is today. I'm sure McCabe is probally ashamed for making that cartoon, but he was pissed at the enemy, and showed that he was

[Pietro]

This thread started in 2001? I don't remember seeing it before! I guess I musta missed it.

Anyway, back to the thread, "Tokyo Jokio" is a pretty bad cartoon next to "Hobby Horse Laffs" (which isn't even half as bad as "Tokyo"). In the LT&MM Guide it says that "Jokio" was considered a real laugh riot in 1943 because of the Japanese sterotypes. But it is, by far the most cruel and inhumane demonstration of ethnic sterotypes after Jack King's "Buddy's Circus."

-Pietro:D

[Matthew Hunter]

Umm.....why? Look, those of you new here may not understand, but...if a topic is that old, we encourage you to just make it a new post, and don't revive the ancient thread. I don't mind you browsing our endless archives, that's why they are there. But as I have told several folks in the past, it's confusing and cluttering to have threads from 2001 on the board now. Make it a new post. Copy it word -for- word for all I care, many of those topics would be fun to revive. Just...let dead threads rest in peace:bosko:
-Matthew

[Cartman]

I have seen "Tokio Jokio" and found VERY FEW scenes to be SLIGHTLY humorous (e.g. Italy's ancient ruins with Mussolini as the number one ruin :D) In the case of making fun of individuals such as Mussolini and Hitler, I find that funny because those people were terribly cruel, but to make fun of an entire nation is overdoing it. The majority of the Japanese were good, decent humans. The same thing goes for today with the average Afghan citizens, who are merely caught in the middle. If any cartoons were to be made focusing on our current war with the Taliban, it is them that should be made fun of. However, I agree that these films should never be banned. They should be shown with disclaimers (like the PIC cartoons on the Disney Treasures DVDs).

[laugh4me]

FWIW, the article links in this thread had moved so I fixed them in my initial post... :bosko:

[Pietro]

I just noticed something. Those pics look like they were stolen from Jon's Censored Cartoon page.

-Pietro:D

[Daniel P]

I don't like it where he says... "Despite the fact that all the old Warner directors like Tex Avery and Chuck Jones are looked upon as Gods and have books written about them, few people know—or care—who Norm McCabe was."

So nobody cares who Norm McCabe was.

Also, the insults to Freiwald and Beck are uncalled for. The author is looking for ways to make the cartoons worse than they actually are.

[rodney]

Reading about how the author doesn't like the substitute 'r' for 'l' reminds me of a sign outside of a chinese restaurant in this area (of whom I'm friends with the owner's daughter). It's not one of those cheap chinese buffets, it's a really nice restaurant, that's pretty classy. The sign out front last Christmas read "Deck the halls...fa ra ra ra ra"

Clearly these first generation immigrants don't have any problems with playful stereotyping. No, Tokio Jokio isn't very playful, but it does prove an interesting point. Of course, I'd expect no less from someone who's personalized license plate reads "EGG ROLL".

[Davesnothere]

Unfortunately, absolute hatred for your country's enemy is what is needed to maintain a determination to win. Fifty to sixty years later, it's easy to forget that nobody knew for certain the outcome of the war, or it's length, or even if the enemy would ever strike or even invade the lower forty-eight. Here in 2003, you might look back and think "You silly people, didn't you realize?" Our grandkids might one day think "Well, gosh, didn't they realize in the summer of 2001 what was going to happen in September?" No. I remember reading a story in July 2001 where bin Laden warned that America would be struck soon and just laffed it off. We can look back thousands of years with 20/20 vision and pass judgments on people who made bad decisions or didn't prevent catastrophes, but in reality we can't see anything but fog beyond the tips of our noses when we look forward! Must be human nature. I'm guilty of it myself. All told, "Tokio Jokio" isn't really funny, but neither was the war. We shouldn't be so smug when we talk about events that happened before most of us were even born. At best, we'll learn from old mistakes and then make a whole new set of mistakes for ourselves.

[Banned Bunny]

Watching Tokio Jokio sounds a lot more fun than being a POW in Bataan....

[mobo85]

Originally posted by rodney
Reading about how the author doesn't like the substitute 'r' for 'l' reminds me of a sign outside of a chinese restaurant in this area (of whom I'm friends with the owner's daughter). It's not one of those cheap chinese buffets, it's a really nice restaurant, that's pretty classy. The sign out front last Christmas read "Deck the halls...fa ra ra ra ra"

Clearly these first generation immigrants don't have any problems with playful stereotyping.

This is probably inspired by a scene in A Christmas Story, which I also see as a playful stereotype. The waiters at a Chinese restaurant are trying to sing Deck the Halls, but the head of the restaurant stops them, pointing out, "It's 'fa la la la la,' not 'fa ra ra ra ra!'" They then try to sing Jingle Bells, which goes well until they get to the word "sleigh."

[Brandon Pierce]

Originally posted by Matthew Hunter
Well, yes, in two ways. Number one, it's not all that funny, and number two, the stereotypes are really bad...think "Nips the Nips" only 3 times as bad.
-Matthew
I am gonna get blown away by a Japanese soldier for saying this, but, I thought the cartoon was kinda funny. Some scenes anyway. Like the skunk-in-the-log bit. That was comical.

































I am so dead...