Kim Possible - a bad influence?

[MonkeyFunk]

http://www.beverlyrevelry.com/archives/000188.html

Another site, which I don't believe I can link to, remarked ""Kim Possible"-> Disney says:
hey little girls, it's never too early to want to be super-skinny and wear midriff tops!"

[tucsoncoyote]

http://www.geocities.com/abodyoflove/offenders.html

Another site, which I don't believe I can link to, remarked ""Kim Possible"-> Disney says:
hey little girls, it's never too early to want to be super-skinny and wear midriff tops!"
I checked that sight out Angry Turnip, and in fact my thoughts on this is that whoever really thinks that showing that much is offensive, then they really have been living what I call a cloistered life..(like a monk).

Let's all be truthful here and since this is a "Disney Group" all I can say is that sure enough Calvin Klein Ads sell (since I can't legally or Morally say anything deroguatory due to the terms of Toonzone's Contract.)

But let's face facts. If that's the case and they accuse Miss Posslble of Exposing her bare midrift, you haven't seen her other outfits...Case in point.. her Peasant shirt.

Yep you look at some of the season 2 episodes and sure enough you'll find Kim with a bit or a hint of a bare midrit, but take a look at Job Unfair. Take a GOOD HARD look. Do you see a bare midrift in that sequence where she's wearing the Peasant shirt? Nope.. sure don't..

Or how aobut either The Ron Factor or Car Trouble with her what i like to call "Goth" Green Top.. (Full length there no navel showing I can see?)

and what about Rufus in show? (Formal dress? Yeah like someone will ahve the nerve to ruin a good black formal just to show a Navel..)

Naked Genius, is another one.. See a Bare Midrift in the third act where she's wearing that Star T-shirt? I sure don't!...

and what about A Sitch in Time.. or Blush or even Queen Bebe? Nope not in certain scenes!

So what is this guy who says Kim Possible is offensive saying that a Bare midriff is bad? (I'm betting the creator of that site, has never picked up a teen magzine now has he? (after all take a look at Seventeen or some of the other ones).. Some of the teens there are running around with bare midrifts.. no questions asked..

Now as for your second comment, Angry Turnip, if that's what Disney is saying, they like I said, they just hypocritical..

(How do I know this?)

Well Let's take a look at some other shows that don't convey that message..(Lizzie McGuire for one) where Miranda tries to go on a Crash Diet, and nearly puts herself in the Hospital just for that?

Need more proof?

Just recently (This Previous Friday), on Braceface, the episode was called Skin Deep, they did the EXACT same thing to the Character Sharon..(She too went on a Crash diet and nearly ended in the hosptial).

if Disney is saying it's okay to be skinny, then they shouldn't be running those two afforementioned episodes now should they?

But they do.

So what is Disney doing? Sending mixed messages to our kids?

In fact I think when a lot of the fans of this show get on later today.. Get ready for a storm.. because I'm just saying that my logic here is that for the one site, that person needs a life, and as for The comment? It's just hypocritical of Disney to say that.. but then again.. that could be just Disney saying it.. or someone saying it's Disney saying it..*Shrug*

and that's all I'm going to say at this point

:coyote:

[loyalheart]

i wonder if that mother knows they have kp clothes that are different than what kp wears.

besides KP the character is a high schooler (assuming 16-17 because she has her license)not some 12 year old..

[Mistress of Fuz]

It only makes sense for KP to be as thin as she is. I mean, look at what she does. She's a cheerleader; which requires a lot of running and jumping, and she's a spy; which requires running, doing flips, martial arts and the likes. Of course she's going to be thin running around all day like that!

And this person not get out much to comment on KP's clothes. This is everywhere. Go out to the theater or whatever the junior high/high schooler hang out is on a Friday night and I you won't be able to go the evening without seeing at least ten exposed midriffs.

Granted I do think that seven is far too young for a girl to be dressed in such a manner but it is this person's responsibility as a parent to decide what is and isn't appropriate for their child to wear. Oh wait . . that would actually require responsibility on this person's part and we wouldn't want that, would we? No, certainly not when it's much easier to blame someone or something else for your parental tribulations.

[tucsoncoyote]

It only makes sense for KP to be as thin as she is. I mean, look at what she does. She's a cheerleader; which requires a lot of running and jumping, and she's a spy; which requires running, doing flips, martial arts and the likes. Of course she's going to be thin running around all day like that!

And this person not get out much to comment on KP's clothes. This is everywhere. Go out to the theater or whatever the junior high/high schooler hang out is on a Friday night and I you won't be able to go the evening without seeing at least ten exposed midriffs.

Granted I do think that seven is far too young for a girl to be dressed in such a manner but it is this person's responsibility as a parent to decide what is and isn't appropriate for their child to wear. Oh wait . . that would actually require responsibility on this person's part and we wouldn't want that, would we? No, certainly not when it's much easier to blame someone or something else for your parental tribulations.
Mistress of Fuz.. you just hit the nail SQUARE on the head on this one..dead on.. no questions asked..

Frankly you're right on all accounts.. and in fact the reason that Kim is think is that she's "Physically fit.." (I am betting kim does a lot of activities which really are strenous yet the skinny look isn't because she's anorexic, She's Fit..(Probably has a Fat to muscle ratio of 7-9% on KP, Most Healthy people should have 9% fat to muscle ratio..)

as for the clothes.. read my previous statement about the different styles kim wears and you got that spot on..

and yes absolutely correct on that parent taking a bit more resposibility..

so score one for you Mistress.

:coyote:

[MonkeyFunk]

But let's face facts. If that's the case and they accuse Miss Posslble of Exposing her bare midrift, you haven't seen her other outfits...Case in point.. her Peasant shirt.
But her three mai noutfits - her causual dress (green top and cargo pants), spy outfit and cheerleading outfit (although it's not realyl her fault if that's skimpy) all show her midriff. It hardly matters if there are a few exceptions.


Now as for your second comment, Angry Turnip, if that's what Disney is saying, they like I said, they just hypocritical..
Sorry, slip up on my part - that was on the site I linked to, but wasn't suppsoed to. No, Disney didn't say it outright, the site accused them of "saying" it by marketing Kim Possible to little girls.


besides KP the character is a high schooler (assuming 16-17 because she has her license)not some 12 year old..
In the first case (the disgruntled mother), it doesn't really matter what Kim's age is - her daughter is 7. In the secodn case (the quote from the site), the webmistress is complaining about Disney marketing these images to little girls. In both cases, it's the age of the show's target audience that's important, not Kim's.



It only makes sense for KP to be as thin as she is. I mean, look at what she does. She's a cheerleader; which requires a lot of running and jumping, and she's a spy; which requires running, doing flips, martial arts and the likes. Of course she's going to be thin running around all day like that!

Fair point. I should also probably point out that she's heavily stylised - it's difficult to judge her build when she's barely human.


And this person not get out much to comment on KP's clothes. This is everywhere. Go out to the theater or whatever the junior high/high schooler hang out is on a Friday night and I you won't be able to go the evening without seeing at least ten exposed midriffs.
So? Tehy probably object to that, too. The first person singled out Kim because her daughter was specifically imitating her, the second didn't dingel her out - Kim was one of several targets on her page.


Granted I do think that seven is far too young for a girl to be dressed in such a manner but it is this person's responsibility as a parent to decide what is and isn't appropriate for their child to wear.
And she obviously HAS decided that it's inapproprite for her daughter to dress liek that.



that would actually require responsibility on this person's part and we wouldn't want that, would we? No, certainly not when it's much easier to blame someone or something else for your parental tribulations.

ISn't that a bit judgmental? How cna you decide that this woman is an irresponsible parent solely because she's having a dispute with her daughter? Are you a parent?

[phonica]

Gawd people attack the media for no good reason...

As Johnny Knoxville, who is a parent, said: parents should monitor their kids more before lashing out and blaming everything else. Quite frankly if a frigging cartoon makes someone go anorexic, they're stupid enough to deserve it. If Kim was fat the show would be completely unbelievable (even though it is clearly fiction). And as for things that actually do encourage anorexia - the magazines that preach against it the most, have the thinnest models.

Like Disney would do anything un-pc these days anyway...

[Conan-san]

I'm freaking amazed, some people truely do NOT know when to quit. At all.

I'll be surpirzed if WITCH lasts 1 week when it's realeased with all this flaming going on to disney.

[Mistress of Fuz]

ISn't that a bit judgmental? How cna you decide that this woman is an irresponsible parent solely because she's having a dispute with her daughter? Are you a parent?

Now now, I never said she was an irresponsible parent. However she is blaming Disney for the dispute with her daughter. I do believe she said something to the effect of "Disney has brought riot into our tranquil home!"

All children have tantrums when they can't have what the want. That's what kids do. Instead of ranting on and on about how KP is to blame, she needs to take responsibility and stand firm, tell her child she will not be wearing the type of clothes KP wears, and not cave in. That's what parents have to do when they have their child's best interest in mind.

When I say that she's irresponsible I mean that rather than doing her duty as a parent she chooses to target something else. She obviously has her daughter's best interests in mind but she's going about it all wrong.

And no, I'm not a parent, but I do have enough sense to make a great one. ;)

And one more thing, Angry Turnip, I don't mean to sound rude but please, learn to spell. That is all, thank you.

[MonkeyFunk]

Those are typoes. I'm a fast typer and multitasker, and I don't see the point in proof-reading a message that'll probably be gathering dust in a few days.

'Sides, everyone in this topic besides you and Phnica has made some errors in their Englsih. Why am I being singled out?

[Mistress of Fuz]

Because the spelling in your posts are atrocious and I find them as a disregard for the english language.

I'm a fast typer as well but I guess it all comes with practice and as for proof-reading your posts, well, when the spelling is at a low grade level your credibility is to be questioned. I believe that anything worth posting is worth a quick brush over to make sure the spelling is at the very least tolerable.

I'm not trying to insult you as a person, AngryTurnip, and I'm sure you're an intelligent person but please understand that with such spelling it makes you sound like, to be blunt, an idiot. Perhaps it is my low tolerance for such web-speak that makes me a bit anal.

And if you have not noticed I am not perfect. I'm sure you will find grammatical errors in my posts if you read through them many times. When I proof read my posts I usually don't see them until the forth time through after it's been posted. So why am I making a fuss of your spelling when my grammar is far from perfect?

Because yours stands out much more, what with no one else seeming to notice my errors. It's because it stands out so blandly and painfully that you are being "single-out".

Once again, I apologize for my bluntness. Please understand I'm not trying to make you uncomfortable and I'm sure that you are a rather smart and sweet person, but spelling as such will belie such intelligence and I find that to be a shame.

Now back on topic.

You also said that she may not approve of the wearing of such clothes done by teenagers in the real world. Yes, this is true but the point that I was trying to make is that KP did not start this trend. While reading the article I got the feeling that she was blaming KP for this fashion trend. Granted I did only skim through what I felt were the less important parts, but it appeared to me that she had not realized that KP was only staying in touch with the reality of fashion in this day and age. They were simply following the trend; nothing more nothing less. I hope that makes sense.

[tucsoncoyote]

ISn't that a bit judgmental? How cna you decide that this woman is an irresponsible parent solely because she's having a dispute with her daughter? Are you a parent?

Now now, I never said she was an irresponsible parent. However she is blaming Disney for the dispute with her daughter. I do believe she said something to the effect of "Disney has brought riot into our tranquil home!"

All children have tantrums when they can't have what the want. That's what kids do. Instead of ranting on and on about how KP is to blame, she needs to take responsibility and stand firm, tell her child she will not be wearing the type of clothes KP wears, and not cave in. That's what parents have to do when they have their child's best interest in mind.

When I say that she's irresponsible I mean that rather than doing her duty as a parent she chooses to target something else. She obviously has her daughter's best interests in mind but she's going about it all wrong.

And no, I'm not a parent, but I do have enough sense to make a great one. ;)
Actually Mistress of Fuz, you are correct on this one assumption. that because the parent is targeting Disney, Does this mean she really is a bad parent? I'm thinking probably not, due to the fact that she has decided to target the Walt Disney Company, rather then just saying.. no, and sticking to her decision.

As for the 7 year old, yes at that age, children tend to be a bit immature, and just want to emulate something or someone,they watch or view. After all (and at this point I can watch Knux Five come in here and Defend this (or not)), look at Power Rangers. Why was this show a lot of times targeted by Parents? The answer is simple. because their children emulated the combat scene between the heros and the villains, and in some cases children were injuring each other. And yet, while parents turned the responsibility over to the Television company and didn't bother turning off the Television and perhaps enhancing the family unit, the parents within themselves blamed the company for the problem. and hence that is where the stigma lies.

Kim Possible (the Show or the Character) really isn't the problem here, it comes back to the responsibility of the parents to monitor what their kids watch. I too am not a parent, but I would like to be one. But I've been overly-responsible for most of my life, and haven't had time to really become a parent. but like you Mistress, I would probably be firm in my decision..

But take a look at what the parent is saying here. that "Thanks to Disney, my life is becoming a living heck." When in fact, all the parent has to do is just either turn off the TV, or change the channel. If they wanted to Turn off the TV, then by all means, spend time with your children, rather then ignoring them. (and if the child becomes obstinate, by all mean, you do have to discipline them. After all I see also in this writing by the parent, that she's bending to the will of her child here, and not being a responsible parent, in some ways.

but in others, she is, and yet just like most of society today, she is pointing fingers at others, rather then taking her share of the responsibility here..

and with that, that's really all I am going to say.

:coyote:

[BigKPFan76]

This woman needs a life, and needs to give her child up for adoption...because its obvious she doesnt know how to raise her correctly.

What person in their right mind would find Kim's bare mid offensive? I am just about as conservative as they come and KP's mid doesnt bother me in the least. When I am watching the show, I am watching the action, Kim, Ron, and what is going on. I dont think to myself.....gosh! Kim's shirt is shorter today than yesterday! CALL THE REVEREND SMITHY!! Or think to myself......MY GOSH! These kids today, have they no shame?

I mean thats just ridiculous! And as far as Kim's appearence goes.....I never thought anything about that either. Kim is FIT AND TRIM, not skinny and anorexic. She is a cheerleader, a crime fighter, and to top it all off.....SHE KNOWS 16 STYLES OF KUNG FU! If you know that many, you are certainly not gonna weigh 500 pounds! You are going to be FIT AND TRIM. And besides, if Kim did weigh 500 pounds, she would be sitting in front of the sofa watching TV all day....not much of an action/adventure show if you ask me! Unless you think going to the fridge for a Dr. Pepper is an adventure. (I suppose those dust bunnies could pose quite a challenge)

But all kidding aside, this is utter nonsense......this woman has obviously nother better to do with her time than to critisize a show she obviously knows nothing about. And besides, KP is not for 7 year olds! (10-16 I believe was the age range)

[shogunthethird]

Parent blames media for something her kid does when she should've dealt with the kid herself, where haven't I seen this before? oh yeah, the 2000 Gathering of the gargoyles convention, Greg Weisman was talking about some parent complaining to disney about the stuff her 7-year old saw watching Gargoyles on Toon Disney, and given the show runs at 11:30 on a school night what the heck was her kid doing watching TV that late? in short there's more problems there than what the kid was watching, in other words the last thing we need is this woman waging war on Canada

[tucsoncoyote]

It's funny that this parent is complaining about JUST Kim Possible and not other shows (both on and off the Disney Channel) .. and other stars on Disney..

(After all when you think about it. Be thankful she hasn't seen Raven in her "Supernatural" video, or even worse, seen some of the shows over on Cartoon Network. I'm not saying CN is bad mind you, but it's amazing someone hasn't complained about those shows in some way, shape, or form.).

Imagine if her 7 year old daughter wanted to be like Sam, Clover and Alex from Totally Spies! ? I mean anyone want to comment about this? No ? Okay then you can't complain about Kim's Midriff, without complaining about other shows now can you..

After all wasn't there a couple weeks or a month ago some people were complaining about W.i.t.c.h. and Winx Club?

okay i'm done..

:coyote:

[tucsoncoyote]

Parent blames media for something her kid does when she should've dealt with the kid herself, where haven't I seen this before? oh yeah, the 2000 Gathering of the gargoyles convention, Greg Weisman was talking about some parent complaining to disney about the stuff her 7-year old saw watching Gargoyles on Toon Disney, and given the show runs at 11:30 on a school night what the heck was her kid doing watching TV that late? in short there's more problems there than what the kid was watching, in other words the last thing we need is this woman waging war on Canada
Bingo, you also get the connection here shogun.. Why should this person be complaining about a bare midriff of a physically active person? Also what about that parent letting their kid sit up to 11:30 PM on a school night no less to watch Gargoyles? a very valid point indeed.

after all has Television degraded itself so that at any one time people who see something as small as a dustbunny out of place will complain?

I think that's the case... I mean it's funny that Gargoyles comes up, but yet there have been parents complaining about the episode Deadly Force, and yet this same episode wins a parents AWARD for teaching kids a valuable lesson here about gun safety.

Talk about hypocritical.. that's blatant hypocricsy in itself.. and frankly parents definitely need to take more responsibility then just shoving it off onto someone else..

Or maybe just like driving a car, they should have a parenting license that's mandated by each state. That would really go over good now wouldn't it?
I bet 90% of the so called parents would flunk..

oh well, that's their choice to be parents.. and with being a parent (and having great power) there comes a great responsibility (Stan lee hit that one home!)

:coyote:

[Dee]

She could look worse. She could look like the Olsen Twins.

[Uncle Beaglebub]

People will complain about anything they can I guess.

You can't fault Kim for being a bad daughter, since she loves and obeys her parents.

You can't call Kim uncaring because she saves the world from itself every week.

You can't call Kim immoral, since the furthest she goes on a date is a kiss. Doing the right thing is her prime directive.

You can't say Kim doesn't take care of her health, since she is trim and athletic.
She doesn't smoke, drink, or shoot drugs.

You can't call her mean, or petty since she holds malice toward no one, and is willing to be a friend to anyone.

So what is left to criticize her about? She wears the latest clothing styles and shows her belly button. Beleive me, I have seen much trashier things on a teen girl than a midriff baring shirt. Sometimes even in church.

I think Kim is an impossibly sweet, impossibly good person that kids & teens should use as a role model.

Personally to me she is the friend I always wished I had,
The daughter I would have been proud to call my own.

[MIRO]

this did got me there for a while ( laughing ) but now i must say that its simply wrong
NIFF SAID :)

[Rune]

Okay I am a parent so for what its worth here's my view.

For starters kids will always latch on to something that they find especially appealling, when I was this girl's age my friend and I were mad about Top Cat (yes, this was a very long time ago) to the point where we would act out our favourite scenes every day and our parents got a note home from school asking why we were constantly hanging around near the garbage cans.

My daughter is now 12, since she was 8 she's been into Redwall and all its medieval type weaponry, she's made her own cardboard shields, swords and what have yous and as long as she's been careful with them then she''s beeen allowed to enjoy them in her own home.

The point I'm making for both of these things is that's it childhood innocence just doing what it does best, enjoying something at face value and wanting to play along too. Yes kids have big imaginations but as a parent / teacher / guardian its your job to nurture them and also show them that a line must be drawn between the world you play in and the world you live in, to just crush something without any leeway at all (obviously depending on circumstance) is only showing kids how to be intolerant towards their kids in the future.

I agree that 7 is far too young to be wandering around the mall wearing crop-tops, I know I wouldn't be 100% happy with my daughter doing that even today but come on, in the privacy of your own home does it really do any harm? I'd be inclined to let that little girl have her fun and even polish up my evil laugh and plot to take over her favourite teddy in order to play along with her. Your children are only little children for so few precious years in a world that wants them to grow up so fast so yes, lay down the acceptable parameters but for goodness sake enjoy the fun of their childhood with them.

My daughter watches KP every day, she's 12 but it hasn't stopped her talking about wanting her own version of Rufus, however she knows where fantasy ends and reality starts and that that is just ... well impossible. Television, video games and so on are always going to be easy targets in the main - IMO anyway - because so often they are used as a 'nanny' to keep the kids occupied while mom or dad are busy elsewhere, whether that's wrong or right isn't the point in question, but the fact is if you leave kids to watch something without first watching it with them (or without them) then they'll likely form their own opinions and their own crazes that you'll be hard put to argue against.

As for KP's suitability as a role model as questioned by this ladywell the show itself is just another 'easy target' because its a well known and gets a lot of attention / marketing:
If we're talking fashion then I seem to remember Aladdin's Princess Jasmine having a bare midriff too and then of course there's bikini-top clad Ariel and the list no doubt goes on to include any number of animated girls.
If we're talking being super skinny then wasn't there an episode of Sabrina TAS where the girls weren't thin enough for their fashionable new jeans so endeavoured to slim down in order to be acceptable?
Finally if we're talking character then having watched KP myself I'd say that that she's actually a pretty consistent, reliable character and certainly more likeable, harder working, less selfish than many other teenage females both real or animated spotlit in the media that we could name.

This is of course just one of many similar accusations thrown at a kids' shows and it won't stop here, as TuconCoyote said, before it was Power Rangers, currently its KP in the firing line and before long it'll be something else. The shows themselves are always easy targets because of their success and its always easier to chuck out the blame wholesale rather than look closer to home to see what you can do to compensate or redress the balance.

[Conan-san]

This is of course just one of many similar accusations thrown at a kids' shows and it won't stop here, as TuconCoyote said, before it was Power Rangers, currently its KP in the firing line and before long it'll be something else. The shows themselves are always easy targets because of their success and its always easier to chuck out the blame wholesale rather than look closer to home to see what you can do to compensate or redress the balance.
No offence, but I blaeve pokemon was somewhere in the middle

and I predict that Witch will be next.

[tucsoncoyote]

This is of course just one of many similar accusations thrown at a kids' shows and it won't stop here, as TuconCoyote said, before it was Power Rangers, currently its KP in the firing line and before long it'll be something else. The shows themselves are always easy targets because of their success and its always easier to chuck out the blame wholesale rather than look closer to home to see what you can do to compensate or redress the balance.
I agree with you there on your comment about this Rune, and in fact I'm going to add in some stuff here that might make sense..

Yes what Rune said is true, if I had a daughter, I definitely wouldn't let her go out of the house the way KP dresses (not if she was 7 nor 12), but yes fantasy play inside the home is part of the thing here, and in fact Kids should be allowed to play, even if they can relate to a character.

Furthermore, I've heard a lot about television and radio standard (Fox News on Breaking Point last night pointed out something rather interesting, and it struck me as kind of curious.)

Why is it that if Radio stations get fined for indecency, why isn't there indecency laws for television as well? (The answer is because there is a double standard here. )

As one Radio show host said,

If I ran an audio clip from Oprah or Jerry Springer or one of these other TV Talk shows, I would get fired from my job, or heavily fined. Yet these TV shows allow this. That sounds to me like a double standard.
That comment got me to thinking.. and as the show last night went on they did talk about how the so called V-chip that was supposed to filter out stuff like language, innuendo, and yes even violence.

But then there also was someone in a group I frequent who says KP is too violent.. I countered with a statement that I actually sat down and counted the acts of violence on Kim Possible vs say Power Rangers or any other cartoon show. and the number of acts of violence, that are on Kim Possible are a Lot LOWER then most shows..(even a lot of the japanese anime is more violent then Kim Possible).

But as Uncle Beaglebub noted, Kim doesn't do anything really what I call immoral or unethical either. She in fact sets positive role models to a New standard, a standard most parents would approve of, though through lack of dicipline and control Parent's can't have unless they change their ways, and like you just stated Rune, that I had previously mentioned about how Power Rangers was first in the target of parental complaints, then Gargoyles (as shogun noted, then Kim Possible, and soon, W.i.t.c.h, but before that there were shows in the 1980's and early 1990's that had even more violence in them then even Kim Possible, or Power Rangers.

GI Joe is a good example. Thousands of rounds of ammunition expended, enough equipment to arm a third world country destroyed.. yet not one person died.. Yet you look at Robotech (a japanese anime brought over here), and you see the same destruction, the same type of battles, but in this case, people did die! (That's probably the first major outcry by parents that really shook up television).

Yet broadcasters rather then controlling the action, decided to let a piece of electronic hardware to control what was being watched..

So parents did have a choice, but a lot of parents really don't care what their kids watch (some do, but a lot don't).

Maybe it's because they don't want to sit there and edit out stuff (yet broadcasters haven't really cut back here in terms of violence, derogatory language, and the "other stuff" and in fact they keep increasing the amount.. at this rate.. you'll see either one act of violence, derogatory language, or "other" in under 2 minutes.Yet take a look at Kim Possible in one 22 minute episode, you could be looking at maybe 1 or 2 or even 3 fight scenes at most, and that's it!

So like I stated let them target Kim Possible, because they (the parents) aren't complaing about other shows kids watch. but they should, Even these so called "Reality Shows" are more then a bit too real.

So then who's at fault here? Parents? Broadcasters? Actually it's both, and I think it's high time parents tell the broadcasters what the problems are.. and broadcasters rather then ignoring the issues should address them.

(Edited Note: If a Parent did use a V-Chip and ordered ot filter out violence, then all violent or fight scenes would be most likely edited out, which in Kim's case, detracts from the actual plot, but getting back on track here, if the parent wanted to filter out something else, I highly doubt KP's midriff would be covered up with a "Modesty square". )

and that's really all I'm going to say about that.

:coyote:

[lostrune]

The solution here is simple. If the parent deems a show not suitable to his/her child, then just don't watch it anymore. Watch something else he/she approves of. Part of a parent's job is to filter what to let watch and what not to watch.

[Conan-san]

The solution here is simple. If the parent deems a show not suitable to his/her child, then just don't watch it anymore. Watch something else he/she approves of. Part of a parent's job is to filter what to let watch and what not to watch.Ah, but that would be the simple thing to do. Making an ass of ones self in a one "man" campain to rid the world of a popular franchies is much more fun.

And evil.

:evil:

[MonkeyFunk]

*applauds Rune*

Well thought-out response :)



The solution here is simple. If the parent deems a show not suitable to his/her child, then just don't watch it anymore. Watch something else he/she approves of. Part of a parent's job is to filter what to let watch and what not to watch.
Of course, if she said "I won't let my daighter watch Kim Possible - she has a bare midriff", a lot of people would complain about that too.


Ah, but that would be the simple thing to do. Making an ass of ones self in a one "man" campain to rid the world of a popular franchies is much more fun.

And evil.

:evil:
She's not going on a one-man campaign to rid the world of Kim Possible, though. She's commenting on it in her blog.

In fact, her animosity obviously doesn't run TOO deep - the next entry is the result of a "what Kim Possible character ar you?" personality test.

She's Wade, just so you know.

[tucsoncoyote]

*applauds Rune*

Well thought-out response :)



Of course, if she said "I won't let my daighter watch Kim Possible - she has a bare midriff", a lot of people would complain about that too.


She's not going on a one-man campaign to rid the world of Kim Possible, though. She's commenting on it in her blog.

In fact, her animosity obviously doesn't run TOO deep - the next entry is the result of a "what Kim Possible character ar you?" personality test.

She's Wade, just so you know.That's interesting.. because if she showed any animostiy it would be a lot worse.. (and I know for a fact I'm Dr. Drakken (Though I'm not as much a buffoon as Drakken is!:D )

But getting back here a bit....

Interesting that lostrune had the rhetorical answer here to that question. But in a lot of ways it comes back to a question I must ask, namely if it's the Paren't responsibility here, then why try to make it a campaign against what I deem is a "Qualtiy show" (I know I'm gonna get "Flacked" by someone here for saying this..) But if a Parent goes out and buys a 300 dollar TV and doesn't even know how to program the V-Chip, is it worth the cost of the TV?

Also what about the broadcasters? Or hasn't anyone noticed there are a lot of shows out there that are "Reality" based.. yet you take a look and you see things that while they do occur in the real world, they are a bit "Uncalled' for.. (Like the Language and the innuendo, and the "Other stuff") But yet I hear of stories of Parents letting their kids watch THAT then good quality programing (Like Kim Possible, The Proud Family, and yes even Braceface, (Though I prefer the non-edited version of the latter).

After all take a look at both Braceface (Unedited)and The Proud Family each show is different yet each can deal with a problem that a Parent of a child can relate with.

But sadly a lot Disney does for Braceface is water it down and doesn't go into a lot of real topical issues that ABC Family used to do, before the Disney Company pulled the Show off the air..(Me thinks, Disney is gun shy when it comes to "The facts of Teenage life!")

But like previously noted, The Kim Possible Midriff issue is such a minor problem compared to what parents today have to face with children and teens alike.

that's really all I'm going to say about that.

:coyote:

[Freedom Fighter]

:rolleyes: No matter what show, there always seems to be one of THESE!

Why do we live in a society where people are SO controlled by their TV instead of their own physical beings? Everyone has a brain! USE IT!

Sigh... I'm sorry. It's just everytime the whole 'this show is a bad influence for my child' topic comes up, it's always the same. And notice how this applies to only the most popular shows? Do you see anyone saying how immoral it was for Petrafina (Flint the Time Detective) to wear that red dress of hers all the time? Or noting that all of the villains on "Dave the Barbarian" inspire kids to call small little girls monkeys like Fang? Or complaining because their young ones are trying to beat up a bully... by eating them and sucking up their powers, a la Kirby? Because no one watches these shows, no one bothers to complain about them in the first place!

But Power Rangers, Pokémon, Sailor Moon, Kim Possible... these are just a few key shows... very, very POPULAR shows... that have been subjected to unnecessary scrutiny. Maybe people do it because they love that show(s). As the saying goes, if there's something controversial, everyone'll want to check it out. If it's a way to get more fans to watch a series... honestly, it's the wrong way to do it, because you anger the fans you already have.


To KP now...

I'm happy that you're seven year-old girl loves to watch KP. (And to the person who said the show skews towards teenagers... wrong! More like preteens [10-12] and young girls [5-9].) But you need to ask a friend to decide whether it's moral for your daughter to wear a shirt that shows off her midriff? The answer to that is, of course, no. No child that young should be showing anything off. But pointing a finger at a cartoon character, who is 15-16 years old, more than double your girls' age, isn't right. Dress standards are different for teenagers. Does that mean that wearing a midriff is wrong? That's subject to debate and varies from person-to-person. But know that their is an age difference and a difference of standards. And if you don't know what those are, then use your common sense.

Kim is still a positive role model for girls. But lady, Kim may influence your daughter, but she can't tell her what to do or wear. (Unless someone invents some kind of super virtual reality that makes that possible.) Until then, that's your job. So stop letting a TV show control the decisions in your house. That's your responsibility. Kim can save the world...

...but she can't save you from this situation.


Um, okay, that came out of left field. Sneaking back into sub-lurker-mode...

[shogunthethird]

this all boils down to one factor: parents who won't deal with their own dang kids, I don't know if it's either not being there to deal with their kids, not caring enough to actually spend time with their kids or just plain being ignorant and unable to deal with their kids something needs to be done and it's not the job of the studios making the shows or the stations airing the shows it's the parents job, these kids don't need lobbyists, these kids need parents but as we all know personal responsibility these days is a lost art it's like what Halcyon Renard said in "Outfoxed" 200 employees and you couldn't squeeze a drop of personal integrity out of any of them, no one was willing to take responsibility for their actions

[tucsoncoyote]

this all boils down to one factor: parents who won't deal with their own dang kids, I don't know if it's either not being there to deal with their kids, not caring enough to actually spend time with their kids or just plain being ignorant and unable to deal with their kids something needs to be done and it's not the job of the studios making the shows or the stations airing the shows it's the parents job, these kids don't need lobbyists, these kids need parents but as we all know personal responsibility these days is a lost art it's like what Halcyon Renard said in "Outfoxed" 200 employees and you couldn't squeeze a drop of personal integrity out of any of them, no one was willing to take responsibility for their actions
Agreed shogun, after all it's not the fault of the artist who deisgned kim really this way.. besides Kim is much like a model (no not a role model) but the idea is that you have a physically fit teen who fights crime and saves the world from problems.. It's not based on what clothes she wears but rather who the person is on the inside, (Kim is indeed perhaps the best role model to come down the pike in say.. 10-20 years (if not more)).

After all Like I stated take a look at season 2 there are a number of outfits that don't even show her midriff. so maybe that was on the decision of the art and storyboard editors and not just the directors. but all in all I like some of the styles KP has.. after all not all of them are revealing.. and really aren't a bad influence..(The Peasant shirt is a good exaple.. simple yet stylish and it doesn't show off anything..)

but yep shogun, you got that right.

:coyote:

[Ian]

You guys, overreact, much? The woman already did her job as a parent (restricting the use of a bare midriff) and is simply complaining that the show makes her job harder. She doesn't plan to call for any boycott Kim Possible or placing a call for decency; she's just venting in her blog about her daughter being smitten with her (not about Kim Possible itself) and wondering how she became so popular. That's. All.

[tucsoncoyote]

Jee-sus ferking Christ, you guys, overreact, much? The woman already did her job as a parent (restricting the use of a bare midriff) and is simply complaining that the show makes her job harder. She doesn't plan to call for any boycott Kim Possible or placing a call for decency; she's just venting in her blog about her daughter being smitten with her (not about Kim Possible itself) and wondering how she became so popular. That's. All.
Well if we're over-reacting like you suggest we are The Big Bad, how do you explain the christian fundementalists attacking Disney's W.i.t.c.h. before it's even released (it's not due out for over 6 months yet, and yet already this show is being called "The Devils work" by some folks saying it provokes satainism. and the occult.)

Frankly I think at this point I would like to notify the moderators that if they so wish and think that the thread has gone on far enough, a Closure is in order.

But I just was curious how anyone could explain the question I just posed? because when one person complains it's a minor complaint.. When 1000 people complain it's a governmental movement. But all it takes to get ot that point is for that 1 to tell the other 999 people about this.. and that is very easy to do. after all why post it up in her blog? (That's irresponsible in itself) A simple letter to Disney could have worked just as well. After all they do have a Complaint form on their Disney webiste.


and that's all I'm gonna say.

:coyote:

[Dee]

Jee-sus ferking Christ, you guys, overreact, much? The woman already did her job as a parent (restricting the use of a bare midriff) and is simply complaining that the show makes her job harder. She doesn't plan to call for any boycott Kim Possible or placing a call for decency; she's just venting in her blog about her daughter being smitten with her (not about Kim Possible itself) and wondering how she became so popular. That's. All.
How about you watch the language?

[disneyfan89]

I personally think that this person is overreacting. So Kim has a bare midriff in many episodes....but it's not like that in all of them (plus it's very typical of high school students to expose their navels..)! Plus, this person is overlooking the many positive traits that Kim has. For example, in Motor Ed, we gain an understanding that Kim is down-to-earth by her concern for Felix. Not to mention she gives up her valuable time to save the world from super-villains...she could easily devote her time to more self-absorbed activities. Also, in several episodes, a message is sent out that implies that she can do anything. It may sound braggy....until you realize that this doesn't just apply to Kim, it applies to everyone!

In short, I think this person needs to contemplate many of Kim's better qualities and shift their criticism to worse shows...which there are a lot of.

She can do anything....
disneyfan89

[Ian]

How about you watch the language?
Done!:)


Well if we're over-reacting like you suggest we are The Big Bad, how do you explain the christian fundementalists attacking Disney's W.i.t.c.h. before it's even released (it's not due out for over 6 months yet, and yet already this show is being called "The Devils work" by some folks saying it provokes satainism. and the occult.)
And that has to do what with this case? Apples and oranges. Woman venting because her daughter is trying to emulate Kim ≠ fundamentalists complaining about the W.i.t.c.h. the product itself.


I personally think that this person is overreacting. So Kim has a bare midriff in many episodes....but it's not like that in all of them (plus it's very typical of high school students to expose their navels..)! Plus, this person is overlooking the many positive traits that Kim has. For example, in Motor Ed, we gain an understanding that Kim is down-to-earth by her concern for Felix. Not to mention she gives up her valuable time to save the world from super-villains...she could easily devote her time to more self-absorbed activities. Also, in several episodes, a message is sent out that implies that she can do anything. It may sound braggy....until you realize that this doesn't just apply to Kim, it applies to everyone!

In short, I think this person needs to contemplate many of Kim's better qualities and shift their criticism to worse shows...which there are a lot of.

Ah, but she's not complaining about Kim. She doesn't complain about her having a midriff, only that her daughter is trying to emulate her, and she's seven. Her only complaint about Kim Possible ("To think I imagined she might be a positive role model when I first saw the show.")is a vague one, and has little to do with the rest of the essay (IMO, anyway).

[tucsoncoyote]

Well if we're over-reacting like you suggest we are The Big Bad, how do you explain the christian fundementalists attacking Disney's W.i.t.c.h. before it's even released (it's not due out for over 6 months yet, and yet already this show is being called "The Devils work" by some folks saying it provokes satainism. and the occult.)

And that has to do what with this case? Apples and oranges. Woman venting because her daughter is trying to emulate Kim ≠ fundamentalists complaining about the W.i.t.c.h. the product itself.
Well with that logic "Apples and Oranges" is such that they are still fruit are they not? (unless the government as welknow it has changed the rules recently and I wasn't aware that an apple or an orange is a vegetable, or that they have declared them as such.)

After all think about it still as a situation that both cases are very true. Here we have a Single parent complaining about a problem about her daughter emulating a character in a cartoon (and yes, it's just a cartoon, that's true), and children do want to emulate their favorite characters, As I stated way back on Page 1.) Children have done this and will continue doing this if this is either Power Rangers, or Kim Possible, or W.i.t.c.h. or any other show.. so that's not an issue here. It's moot. The difference between the Apple and the orange here is rather how many people are complaining.. if it's 1 person it's an apple, if it's a 1000 it's an orange, but a complaint is a complaint nonetheless no matter if it's one or the other.)

Also agreed the parent did their job responsibly in the first place by telling the daughter firmly (but in a sincere tone), hey, it's okay to emulate your favorite cartoon character, within reason, however I feel as your (mother/father/parental unit) that you don't have too look that way.Acting is the character is okay, Just please do not dress like the character. (So in a way she (the parent) did do her job responsibly..)

But in another way, she took an irresponsible way to choose to do it. Namely putting it on something any and everyone can view (namely a blog). Sure it's a complaint she has about the character, but Like I stated previously here, that's where she went from being a responsible parent by keeping this issue within her family, and that of irresponsibility, when she blatantly and openly and knowingly puts this issue which is without merit and in a public forum no less, and even though the parent was responsible and firm as a parent should be, might I pose a question here?

If you had a child and you had him/her wanting to do this what this parent initally and responsibly asked her child not to do, and yet you voiced your complain in an open manner as she did, would you put those reactions like she did onto an open fourm or an open diary or a discussion group and spread this around like we are it discussing now? (After all this was a family matter and a private one at that, and when she wrote that down for everyone and anyone to view, it no longer became "Just a Family matter" It's became a public one.)

That's really the issue here. After all family matters are private, and should be left to the family in a private matter and not to us the public to decide. (after all what part of no don't people understand?)

and now I relinquish the floor to hear a rebuttal of some sort.

:coyote:

[shogunthethird]

sometimes people just need to vent their frustrations and that's what blogs are for, and if that's her opinion, that's her opinion sure she may be overreacting but that's her call to make and if she wants to make an ass of herself by putting her parenting problems in her blog rather than discussing them with other parents or friends that's also her call, if there's one constant in this world is that parenting should be left to the parents I say if you don't complain about my show I won't complain about your inept parenting

[tucsoncoyote]

sometimes people just need to vent their frustrations and that's what blogs are for, and if that's her opinion, that's her opinion sure she may be overreacting but that's her call to make and if she wants to make an ass of herself by putting her parenting problems in her blog rather than discussing them with other parents or friends that's also her call, if there's one constant in this world is that parenting should be left to the parents I say if you don't complain about my show I won't complain about your inept parenting
That's very true there shogun, after all I (nor anyone else is really here to judge her skills as a parent, and hence this is going to be my second request to the moderators here to close this thread as I feel that this subject has been dragged through this fourm enough, and Like you said, it was her choice to post it to her blog, not ours, nor is it ours to judge herfor doing so. Like you stated just there, she didn't need to bring it into a public light.. a simple phonecall to a friend or a family member is perhaps the key here. Not putting it out there for all the world to see.

:coyote:

[BigKPFan76]

Well my take on this is very simple........If the woman were REALLY responsible she would have taught her daugter NOT to imitate everything she sees on TV. She needs to teach her daughter that its a TV show, not real life. Very simple really. TV is for entertainment.......NOT for people to copy, unless its something totally harmless.

Just like those idiots that were copy-catting the stunts on Jackass.......if they got hurt, they deserved every painful minute they had to spend in the ER. Just for being STUPID!

But beyond that........KP is, in many ways, a reflection of how most young women dress, so it is simply reflecting the fashion of today. Nothing wrong with that. But I dont find any offense in it whatsoever..........I pay attention to what Kim is doing, not how short her shirt comes up. This "mother" needs to get a life!

[krazymed]

A much better example to use for this thread would be X-Men: Evolution. Every girl under the age of 20 there has a midriff of some kind.

[Uncle Beaglebub]

I think we ALL overreacted here in this situation. Myself included.
If you check Beverly's blog post of 6/30 you see she clarified her position.
She actually does believe Kim is a positive influence on kids, despite the fact that Lydia has trouble understanding that not all the things Kim does can be imitated at the age of 7.
I wish I would have given the woman a chance to discuss her position further in her blog before I reacted to her first entry.

But my earlier post on this thread still applies to you, Angry Turnip. The idea that Kim is a bad influence on kids is wrong, with a capital W.

[abodyoflove]

I am the creator and webmaster of A Body of Love at www.geocities.com/abodyoflove (http://www.geocities.com/abodyoflove). I obviously disagree with the posts that were made in response to my statement about kim possible, and have posted a reply to them on my website. Here it is: http://www.geocities.com/abodyoflove/toonzone.html

[BigKPFan76]

Well, I have to say that:

1. KP is a cartoon, most cartoons are not drawn anatomicly correct. They are stylized representations of human beings. Therefore......they neednt be 100% percent accurate.
2. KP is about a girl who saves the world and is average, I dont think the animators had it in mind that they were making a "fashion statement" or "influencing" young girls to be skinny. (Kim is NOT skinny! she is athletic.....she looks "thin" simply because that is the way the animators wish to potray her, once again it goes back to the above statement, see #1.....it could be more accurately called an "animation style")
3. And lastly, let me ask you this? What should Kim look like........Weigh 400 pounds? If she weighed that much, she wouldnt be able to save the world. (then people would be complaining she was making girls too FAT and unhealthy!)

Let me just sum it up this way............cartoons dont influence people, people influence themselves. We have all these crazy people running around saying "Hollywood is too violent! Ban violent movies!" Thinking that if we get rid of violent movies, people will suddenly be more kind to each other. Haha, dont think so! If someone is watching a TV show and is allowing it to influence them.........they need to seek the help of a psychiatrist. Those who want to take a great show like Kim Possible away from us, simply because they think its a "bad influence" needs a life!! I'm not going to stop watching KP just because somebody who obviously needs a life says stop watching it!

If kids are being "influenced" then they need psychiatric help.......not the elimination of all TV shows, books and movies.

[g_UnIt_GaNsTa]

So wait, if we don't agree with you, we have given things little thought?

Brilliant!

[LightShadow1890]

http://www.beverlyrevelry.com/archives/000188.html

Another site, which I don't believe I can link to, remarked ""Kim Possible"-> Disney says:
hey little girls, it's never too early to want to be super-skinny and wear midriff tops!"
:confused: :confused: :confused:

WHAT?!

Okay, okay, the kid the author said about is just copying her. Big deal, she'll get over it! It's just a part of her imagination. When Sailor Moon first came out, me and my twin sister made fanart, dreamed of having that much hair to make those odango atama hairstyles, and even pretended to be heroines just like her (yes, just LIKE her), and we even had our own starting words!

The girl's going through a phase. Kids go through that. I went through that when I was small. It's just saying she adores her, like a model. SHE'LL GET OVER IT. Jeez, parents these days. Besides, the midriff thing is getting out of style. I heard that from a website (good thing it wasn't a blog), the Netscape website (its a server, like AOL, but needs internet connection).

Well, Kim Possible's a good show. Besides, there's also midriff stuff in Cartoon Network stuff. And maybe Nick too (I've got no idea).

[LightShadow1890]

I am the creator and webmaster of A Body of Love at www.geocities.com/abodyoflove (http://www.geocities.com/abodyoflove). I obviously disagree with the posts that were made in response to my statement about kim possible, and have posted a reply to them on my website. Here it is: http://www.geocities.com/abodyoflove/toonzone.html

Yeah, okay, I see what you mean. But...yeah, some girls in my school have the same body, except for the stomach area.

Okay, so I see what you mean, but I don't feel anything wrong with Kim Possible. The kid's going through something....like a phase. And, there's more stuff than just Kim Pissible you know. You need a better example. And also, some people who do work out and do extracuricullar activities do get a body something like that. 2/3's of the girls at my school have a body like KP's, and they do sports. See what I'm saying?? ;)

[BigKPFan76]

So wait, if we don't agree with you, we have given things little thought?

Brilliant!
Who are you talking to?

[Uncle Beaglebub]

I am the creator and webmaster of A Body of Love at www.geocities.com/abodyoflove (http://www.geocities.com/abodyoflove). I obviously disagree with the posts that were made in response to my statement about kim possible, and have posted a reply to them on my website. Here it is: http://www.geocities.com/abodyoflove/toonzone.htmlOh, so you have changed your position one more time? I assume that since you complain again that Kim wears short tops and that she is too thin, that once again you are saying Kim Possible is a bad role model.

About Kim's clothes- have you noticed that female clothing styles have been expressive ever since the 1960's? Yes, it's true: once upon a time forty years or so ago it was taboo to show more than a woman's lower calf in public! Like it or not, society now allows women to wear whatever clothing they want to. You must simply face it, that women and teens are going to wear a tank top once in a while, and Kim will too. The majority of females don't wear navel baring clothes to be sluts, by the way. No one is putting a gun to their heads and making them dress that way either.

About Kim's body structure: She is drawn in a stylized manner to reflect the physique of an active teenager. You can't expect complete realism in a cartoon! Do you really think that the oftentimes bizarre world of animation is reflective of the natural world? I also wonder, are you saying that it is wrong to be fit and trim? Are you saying that it is wrong for a teenager to be ahtletic and strong? You have to face it, there are a lot of trim, athletic people out there walking around. I agree that our society idolizes trim athletic people at this time, but that is beside the point. Kim Possible just happens to be an active, healthy person and her appearance reflects that.

If you truly have actively engaged in watching this program, you would understand something about this character. Kim is a healthy, confident young woman. She wears a short top occasionally because she wants to, not because she is pressured. She participates in athletic activities and stays trim because she wants to. If anything, the show is promoting that young children (girls especially) should think for themselves, and do what they want with their lives.

Could I at least ask you this? Who would be a good role model for your daughter? And in what respect would this role model be better than Kim? Aside from her wearing modern clothing, and being athletic, what is bad about her?

By the way, I do not appreciate being told that my opinions show "an exceedingly small amount of thought" and are "rather obvious and vacuous".

[Harlan_Phoenix]

This "attack" against Kim Possible has made me lose faith in humanity. I swear...as soon as I am able to, I am leaving America (To like...Spain or...something...) just so I don't have to hear/read/learn about these BS reasonings about whatever being a bad influence on whatever (technically...humanity is wherever I move...is stuff like this in other countries guys?)

Further more, let's blame every other toon for something. Totally Spies encourages our teen girls to wear skin tight outfits (I hope no one has already said this), Let's blame Megas XLR encouraging kids to hotwire cars, or something to that extent. See where I'm going? Want more?

I think I've put enough thought into this (But this pales in comparison to others logic) :moon: :moon2:

[tucsoncoyote]

This "attack" against Kim Possible has made me lose faith in humanity. I swear...as soon as I am able to, I am leaving America (To like...Spain or...something...) just so I don't have to hear/read/learn about these BS reasonings about whatever being a bad influence on whatever (technically...humanity is wherever I move...is stuff like this in other countries guys?)

Further more, let's blame every other toon for something. Totally Spies encourages our teen girls to wear skin tight outfits (I hope no one has already said this), Let's blame Megas XLR encouraging kids to hotwire cars, or something to that extent. See where I'm going? Want more?

I think I've put enough thought into this (But this pales in comparison to others logic) :moon: :moon2:Actually Gerbil Power, Your simplistic logic is perhaps the best.. and in fact It's my turn to comment here..

Another good anology would be blaming McDonad's for someone being fat.. yet it's funny. I eat at all fast food resturants but Does that mean I blame McDonalds for making me fat even though I'm not? Nope it's not that Im being forced to eat anywhere.. I pick and choose. Also adding to Uncle Beaglebub's comment.. I have to agree, what Role model do you consider a decent role model? for myself when I was a Kid, it was Chuck Yeager, a test Pilot, It was Neil Atrmstrong an Astronaut..It was Walt Disney, a Humanitarian, and a Dreamer.

but frankly let's get away from KP for just a second and put this out there.. who would be a GOOD REAL World Role Model out there?. and if you can't think of any.. just try.. because believe me it's hard nowadays..you can hardly find REAL world role models..

Sure some people can relate to role models in sports.. but they too are corruptable.. what about Politicians? Same thing.. any real world role model you find.. it's easy to tear this apart and show that they are like the rest of us--human..

and that's where the line gets blurred.. cause some people think KP Is superhuman.. she isn't...

She has her flaws, her imperfections, yet she's just that.. average, ordinary, yet she fights for what is right.. She's poliete for a teen (you show me any AMERICAN teen who is poliete and says please and thank you.. I hear more teens today swearing then drunken sailors.. and that's putting it mildly!

Frankly having a role model of anysort is very good, it sets an example but perhaps the best example of a rolemodel should be a parent.. after all Kids a lot of times emulate their parents all to well. and that says a lot in itself. If you become indecisive, then sure enough, they will too.

Parents are just as human as the next person granted.. I even have flaws.. but I accept them for being human.. and that's how we should all view this.. but sometimes setting an example is a good thing.. and Kim does that.. not because of a Baremidriff but because she's out there.. fighting evil and keeping the world safe from itself..

if that says nothing.. then maybe Gerbil Power is right.. Humanity does need to die.

because we disgrace ourselves.. and that's really all I am going to say about this..

:coyote:

[Harlan_Phoenix]

Looks like I'm making a good name for myself already! *Does something called the happy dance*

You've got a valid point..I can't name one good real world role model currently. We like fiction for a reason, ya know?

P.S. Is any other country like this? I was seriously asking...

[Uncle Beaglebub]

This "attack" against Kim Possible has made me lose faith in humanity. I swear...as soon as I am able to, I am leaving America (To like...Spain or...something...) just so I don't have to hear/read/learn about these BS reasonings about whatever being a bad influence on whatever (technically...humanity is wherever I move...is stuff like this in other countries guys?)

Further more, let's blame every other toon for something. Totally Spies encourages our teen girls to wear skin tight outfits (I hope no one has already said this), Let's blame Megas XLR encouraging kids to hotwire cars, or something to that extent. See where I'm going? Want more?

I think I've put enough thought into this (But this pales in comparison to others logic) :moon: :moon2:I agree, we all have our own free will.
The "Age Of Victimhood" never suited me at all.
However, I will never lose faith in the human race as a whole.

[Harlan_Phoenix]

Maybe I might of went to far there, but it still rests firmly. If they don't like it, why do they try to edit it for everyone? Is it too different? Are they intolerent of things that are not what they want it to be?!

I dispise intolerence with EVERY bone in my body, and crap like this is close enough and it makes me angry!

:moon: : Yes very angry. You must face our god, who is a god of vengence.

[shogunthethird]

I agree with some of the things this woman made points on but on other stuff I think she's stark raving buggo, yes society spends too much time idealizing women with no body fat, yes I can see how this would lead to problems and yes something needs to be done...but NO I don't think attacking a cartoon is the best way to do it, and this is coming from a guy who looks like Alfred Molina's stunt double, society puts a lot of pressure on women to look that way, and to a certain extent men as well (Queer eye guys, I'm looking in your direction) I'm not saying banning a show will solve this problem but neither will standing by and doing nothing, if there's any fault at all here it's attacking without thought or reason, you attack us assuming we gave no thought whatsoever but how is our thoughtless lashing out at your Blog any different from your own lashing out at Kim Possible, there is a solution here but knee-jerk shouting matches aren't the way to get it, zero tolerance equals zero thought as the old adage goes "an eye for an eye will just make you blind"

[tucsoncoyote]

I agree with some of the things this woman made points on but on other stuff I think she's stark raving buggo, yes society spends too much time idealizing women with no body fat, yes I can see how this would lead to problems and yes something needs to be done...but NO I don't think attacking a cartoon is the best way to do it, and this is coming from a guy who looks like Alfred Molina's stunt double, society puts a lot of pressure on women to look that way, and to a certain extent men as well (Queer eye guys, I'm looking in your direction) I'm not saying banning a show will solve this problem but neither will standing by and doing nothing, if there's any fault at all here it's attacking without thought or reason, you attack us assuming we gave no thought whatsoever but how is our thoughtless lashing out at your Blog any different from your own lashing out at Kim Possible, there is a solution here but knee-jerk shouting matches aren't the way to get it, zero tolerance equals zero thought as the old adage goes "an eye for an eye will just make you blind"I hear what you are saying there shogun, but then of course I have to say that it seems that while some people tend to go around lashing out at things blindly, others have straight fact.. and I think then if you look at all of what the mother is saying she's saying just Kim Possible is the problem here and nothing else..

But then I have to fire back this question to the person who is saying that Kim is Just the only one who's giving this bad influence..(notice I say Just kim, yet you look at the show itself, and in case the mother hasn't noticed other characters are just ask Skinny.. (Bonnie Rockwaller, Monique, all of the Cheerleading squad, and even Kim's Mom (Yes Kim's MOTHER..) portray this same thinness..)

which then comes back to the original question.. if you are going to say that Kim's too skinny, then you might as well clump all the women in this show, even She-Go (who I would say is rather buxom and fit) into this category..

and this comes back to shogun's point.. you don't just going around executing one character without really examining the show.. and saying that Kim is too thin, is making it sound like all cartoons where there are physically fit women, are deemed skinny by this parent's stnadard.. which isn't true..

Also you have to take a look at the artist who Drew kim, and the rest of the characters of the show. in fact I know aobut this artist and in fact he draws for a number of shows (including Nick's Danny Phantom, and the upcoming Crash Nebula, also on Nick). Now Kim Possible could have been drawn any number of ways, as each artist has variations of the same character look, and in fact if you had Da Vinci, De Goya, Picasso, Gaugann, and Michaelangello, all paint say the Mona Lisa, then you would have a number of variations of the same thing.. (and artists have different styles). It's like what if you took Stan Lee's Spiderman, and had it done by say Kim Possible's Creator? how would Spidey look? Probably just as thin...

So to the woman who is bashing Kim possible just step back and ask yourself this question then.. if the Mona Lisa was painted by all these artists how would each painting (or animation) look.. I bet each artists would say his is the original yet in the end only Da Vinci's is the best known...

but there's a thought no one has thought of yet.. What would Kim Possible look like if Kim Possible was drawn anatomically correct? (according to the usual drawing methods of anatomical correctness by means of the "Gray's Anatomy Books?" ) but then again what's one man's art is another man's scrawl I guess. But the point is this and this is perhaps what I'm trying to convey..

1. Don't just a show by just one character.. Look at the show as a whole.. if you say that a character is a certain way, just remember, you're reflecting this back as all those characters within the show as bineg as shuch..

and

2. Artists draw in Many styles, and have many moods, and no two artists like snowflakes, draw exactly alike!

and that's really all I am going to say about this.

:coyote:

[shogunthethird]

but there's a thought no one has thought of yet.. What would Kim Possible look like if Kim Possible was drawn anatomically correct? :coyote:It would look like a MAJOR spike in ratings for KP, and Shego would surpass Demona for the title of "Sexiest female villainess" (although personally I think they both look pretty hot as-is, but then again you're talking to someone who's tastes in animated women include a homicidal immortal gargess, a leather-clad european terrorist spy with a thing for metalheads, a female spider-bot, a videogame sprite, a Monican agent, three thieves, two of which have cat motifs, a mutant cycloptic spaceship pilot, a pirate navigator and a demented cosplayer)

[MonkeyFunk]

I think there are plenty of knee-jerk reactions to go round.

I mean, she's the one making a website taking a stand against over-idealised images of women in the media.

We're the ones talking about fleeing our countries to escape her, losing faith in humanity because of her and advocating mass genocide.

[Harlan_Phoenix]

I think there are plenty of knee-jerk reactions to go round.

I mean, she's the one making a website taking a stand against over-idealised images of women in the media.

We're the ones talking about fleeing our countries to escape her, losing faith in humanity because of her and advocating mass genocide.
I think I was the only one wanting to leave the country...

[abodyoflove]

Okay, some of you people still seem a bit confused. I'm not "attacking" Kim Possible (if you read my initial response you would already know that), I am simply using the show as ONE EXAMPLE of the point that I am trying to make regarding the general state of mass media in our society.
I do not believe that it is wrong or "slutty" or anything of that nature to wear an outfit that shows your stomach but I do believe that often times in todays society, outfits like these represent sexual degradation of women more than they represent self-advocacy and confidence. Of course this is not true in all cases but I believe that in the context of our society it is, for the most part, true. A scantily clad woman in the media is usually not looked upon by most as a strong, confident, intelligent woman but rather seen as an a sexual object. I'm not saying this is right or good, but I believe that it simply is the truth and therefore must be taken into consideration.
Nevertheless, I certainly do NOT feel that anything, regardless of how haenous it is, should be banned. I never said that I felt that Kim Possible should be banned.
I also do not feel that the creators of Kim Possible purposely decided to make her really skinny so that they could evily destroy the body images of young women. Lol jeez..i just think that it may have been a subsonscious decision,,a predispositon to choose extreme thinness since it is considered most attractive to many in our society and is the most portrayed body shape in the media.
Finally, i do no object to the portrayal of "athletic" or thin people in the media. It only becomes a problem when its the ONLY body type portrayed and its the ONLY body type said the be attractive & acceptable by the mass media.
Also, to the person who suggested that I meant for Kim Possible to weigh 400 pounds,,you've totally missed my point. Theres a huge difference between being a healthy, average weight and being morbidly obese.
I think that there should be all different kinds of bodies and people represented in the media, not just one or the other.
And to AngryT, thanks for the wonderful message on my guestbook. That is the reason I made the site. Thanks for giving it a chance and helping to make a difference ; )

[tucsoncoyote]

I think there are plenty of knee-jerk reactions to go round.

I mean, she's the one making a website taking a stand against over-idealised images of women in the media.

We're the ones talking about fleeing our countries to escape her, losing faith in humanity because of her and advocating mass genocide.Plus Angry Turnip you forgot one thing... The Destruction of the Livelyhood of Artists who draw or animmate..and any artform in general, not to mention the culture of humanity itself.

But then again who is the one who started this? Don't forget that please and thank you.. After all these are what the facts are. and when you thiink about it, the Loss of anything as art, or even quality television is perhaps the greatest crime of all, and then you forget one other thing as well, namely that what is being advocated by her is complete and total censorship or free speech or thought, or at least an extreme form of it, by not letting the show in itself show the positive sides of this role model.

After all she's also preventing the creation of a Positive role model for children (True, this issue started over two things, namely a bare midfiff, and the way was the character's look was portrayed, but again I must reinterate if Kim's character and looks are scrutinized, then she's just tarking only one character of the show, yet she forgets to look at what the other characters are portrying here or even looking like in terms of a physical form, namely that same thinness, or maybe I'm being too over simplified here in this.

But Like I stated, She's attacking the artist who drew kim as well, and possibly not only the show itself. while a number of us are trying to point out the true virtues of what this portrays to children as a role model for Manners, and for morals, and for what is just, and for thinking out their decisions, and to teach our kids the morals of thought..if that's the case I then again for a third time call to the moderators to close this thread and do give the reasons as this has now turned into a social issue that is no longer Disney related.

That's all I am going to say on this.

:coyote:

[Harlan_Phoenix]

Okay, some of you people still seem a bit confused. I'm not "attacking" Kim Possible (if you read my initial response you would already know that), I am simply using the show as ONE EXAMPLE of the point that I am trying to make regarding the general state of mass media in our society.
I do not believe that it is wrong or "slutty" or anything of that nature to wear an outfit that shows your stomach but I do believe that often times in todays society, outfits like these represent sexual degradation of women more than they represent self-advocacy and confidence. Of course this is not true in all cases but I believe that in the context of our society it is, for the most part, true. A scantily clad woman in the media is usually not looked upon by most as a strong, confident, intelligent woman but rather seen as an a sexual object. I'm not saying this is right or good, but I believe that it simply is the truth and therefore must be taken into consideration.
Nevertheless, I certainly do NOT feel that anything, regardless of how haenous it is, should be banned. I never said that I felt that Kim Possible should be banned.
I also do not feel that the creators of Kim Possible purposely decided to make her really skinny so that they could evily destroy the body images of young women. Lol jeez..i just think that it may have been a subsonscious decision,,a predispositon to choose extreme thinness since it is considered most attractive to many in our society and is the most portrayed body shape in the media.
Finally, i do no object to the portrayal of "athletic" or thin people in the media. It only becomes a problem when its the ONLY body type portrayed and its the ONLY body type said the be attractive & acceptable by the mass media.
Also, to the person who suggested that I meant for Kim Possible to weigh 400 pounds,,you've totally missed my point. Theres a huge difference between being a healthy, average weight and being morbidly obese.
I think that there should be all different kinds of bodies and people represented in the media, not just one or the other.
And to AngryT, thanks for the wonderful message on my guestbook. That is the reason I made the site. Thanks for giving it a chance and helping to make a difference ; )
But dontcha think your making just a little too big a deal over it? Honestly, why you try to do this is beyond me...Your intentions are good an I respect that. But maybe you should just let things be and if something REALLY bad happens, then we'll shut up and let you tell us off.

[shogunthethird]

I second closing this thread..or starting a debate on the cafe about this topic because it isn't appropriate for this board

[tucsoncoyote]

But dontcha think your making just a little too big a deal over it? Honestly, why you try to do this is beyond me...Your intentions are good an I respect that. But maybe you should just let things be and if something REALLY bad happens, then we'll shut up and let you tell us off.I agree here with Gerbil_Power, but I must first point out to abodyoflove, a couple of things.

First off the proper spelling of the word heinous.

and second I sense a waffling here subconiously between Kim Possible being a good role model and Kim Possible being a bad role model, and I think that Gerbil_Power just pointed this out in a his simplistic quote. We'll be quiet when this is no longer brought to the forefront or something bad happens, and if something really bad happens, you can expect seeing poorer quality TV shows,and we will be sure to let you watch then and enjoy them. That's really my final word on this.. After all don't come crying to the Television companies when there are nothing on but poorly written shows, or even worse Reality programs that are so boring, that you'll wish that shows like Kim Posible were on, and then.. you'll appreciate the thoughs we have given .

and that's MY final say . period.

:coyote:

[Harlan_Phoenix]

I agree here with Gerbil_Power, but I must first point out to abodyoflove, a couple of things.

First off the proper spelling of the word heinous.

and second I sense a waffling here subconiously between Kim Possible being a good role model and Kim Possible being a bad role model, and I think that Gerbil_Power just pointed this out in a his simplistic quote. We'll be quiet when this is no longer brought to the forefront or something bad happens, and if something really bad happens, you can expect seeing poorer quality TV shows,and we will be sure to let you watch then and enjoy them. That's really my final word on this.. After all don't come crying to the Television companies when there are nothing on but poorly written shows, or even worse Reality programs that are so boring, that you'll wish that shows like Kim Posible were on, and then.. you'll appreciate the thoughs we have given .

and that's MY final say . period.

:coyote:
Yeah I find that the logical course of action. Btw, just call me Gerbil.

[phonica]

Just like those idiots that were copy-catting the stunts on Jackass.......if they got hurt, they deserved every painful minute they had to spend in the ER. Just for being STUPID!
It got me so annoyed when Jackass was slated because of those foo's... It's natural selection... I mean if with warnings before, after and during a programme you still can't work out it's not a good idea to set yourself on fire, you really do deserve it.

And regarding the woman who's blog we think is daft, yes it would be nice to see women who aren't stupidly thin, but it aint going to happen and I think there are far worse programmes that influence this that children watch, other than kp. I realise you were pointing out that it was sad that it has happened in a cartoon, but what the hell other cartoons are there that don't have thin leading ladies? How much muscle can a 16 yr old have anyway? Once the puppy fat is gone majority of teenagers go a bit gangly.

I also dont think the character designers of kp thought "hey lets show a bit of cartoon flesh to make her hot" ... I don't see it being their intention, conscious or subconscious. Also, the character more blokes seem to fancy more (Shego) is curvy *and* is covered neck to toe. But again, it wasn't the intention to have a cast that looks like the cast of Buffy.

Ever thought that despite you thinking revealing clothes are degrading for women and only for a man-driven world, some women might like them and feel comfortable with their bodies? Kim Possible (as a show) seems to show a variety clothes style, each character happy with what they wear and how much flesh is shown.

[Uncle Beaglebub]

Beverly, if people truly want to change the way society sees the female figure, they must learn to follow the guidelines they wish to see adopted. You don't want everyone to look thin in the media, fine. You don't want people making judgements of others because of their bodies, fine again! I agree on these ideas! But, don't do yourself and everyone else a disservice by being hypocritical. Admit it, Beverly, as soon as you laid eyes on Kim Possible what did you think about her? You thought, "She's too thin." Do you see how easily one can fall into the trap of prejudging others?

You may not believe me, but it is true: I THINK FOR MYSELF. I don't blindly subscribe to the idea that thinness is equal to goodness. I feel as you do, that society places way too much emphasis on this. I like Kim for who she is, not how she looks.

[abodyoflove]

ok just to clarify, my name is not Beverly...some of you have confused me, the webmaster of A Body of Love with another woman who I have no connection to at all who also happened to have an opinion on Kim Possible. I do not have a daughter,,in fact I am a 20 year old college student (to reiterate what I already wrote).

[Junkman23]

first off...Raven Simone, she's a full body lady and she's a disney girl.

second i don't hear you complaining about Ron Stoppables obvious eating disorder. And the fact he eats so much bad food and never gains a pound. He's too skinny. What's he telling boys? Eat lots of bad food and you'll stay witty and skinny? Please.

And he feeds human food to his naked mole rat, what if I fed human food to a naked mole rat, I sure hope it wouldn't die. What is he teaching kids?

And I swear I get sick inside every time I see Ron's unmentionables. How many times does his pants have to go off before the censors do something? I swear if I wanted to see underwear I'd read something adult like the sunday sears cataloge.

And what's up with Wade he sits in a chair all day and does nothing. What's that trying to show? You know if you sit in a chair for 3 days straight it can cause a heart attack? I bet there's a kid right now who wants to be like Wade who's close to dying because of this.

And why are most of Kim Possible's villans men? What all men are evil? Speaking of which have you seen Dr. Drakons waist? Please i couldn't be that skinny if i barfed up my food for a week.

so to sum it up never watch kim possible its the devil, just like jazz music.

love,

Junkman, August 25, 1820

[Tay the Cat]

first off...Raven Simone, she's a full body lady and she's a disney girl.

second i don't hear you complaining about Ron Stoppables obvious eating disorder. And the fact he eats so much bad food and never gains a pound. He's too skinny. What's he telling boys? Eat lots of bad food and you'll stay witty and skinny? Please.

And he feeds human food to his naked mole rat, what if I fed human food to a naked mole rat, I sure hope it wouldn't die. What is he teaching kids?

And I swear I get sick inside every time I see Ron's unmentionables. How many times does his pants have to go off before the censors do something? I swear if I wanted to see underwear I'd read something adult like the sunday sears cataloge.

And what's up with Wade he sits in a chair all day and does nothing. What's that trying to show? You know if you sit in a chair for 3 days straight it can cause a heart attack? I bet there's a kid right now who wants to be like Wade who's close to dying because of this.

And why are most of Kim Possible's villans men? What all men are evil? Speaking of which have you seen Dr. Drakons waist? Please i couldn't be that skinny if i barfed up my food for a week.

so to sum it up never watch kim possible its the devil, just like jazz music.

love,

Junkman, August 25, 1820

Thanks for resurrecting a dead thread with useless crap.

[Junkman23]

Thanks for resurrecting a dead thread with useless crap.

and thank you for replying to a thread with useless crap

[Dee]

C'mon guys. If you see a dead thread raised, then use the report feature. Don't flame who raised it from beyond the grave. That's not constructive.

And because this thread is more than a year dead, I'm going to close it--- however, because it's been a year, I'll allow a similar topic to be started if some new discussion can be brought to the table.